Moors of Ykesha platform

[Quinntus]

<p>So, what wizard platform in Moors of Ykesha is that from eq1? It looks like the pyramid type, but its been SO long since I played Eq1, I dont' recall if the Wizard port in South Ro was that type or not.</p><p>Any thoughts?</p>

[troodon]

<p>Got a screenshot?  I haven't played much since TSO release for fear of a rollback due to the merchant exploit.</p><p>My screenshot collection doesn't have one of the Sro spires but they were the short kind with a pyramid in the middle.</p>

[Apocroph]

<p>They look somewhat like the ones that were in South Ro, yes.  I'd assume that's where they came from if it wasn't for their reasonably close proximity to the Obelisk of Ahkzul, which is located in a section of the Rathe Mountains.</p><p>In short: a wizard did it.</p>

[Cusashorn]

<p>Doesn't look anything like the old South Ro portal. The spires are curved in-ward like a rib cage. (compaired to Out-ward like every other spire in the game.)</p>

[Apocroph]

<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Doesn't look anything like the old South Ro portal. The spires are curved in-ward like a rib cage. (compaired to Out-ward like every other spire in the game.)</p></blockquote><p>It's a small set of spires arranged around a small central platform.  It is reminiscient of the South Ro spires.</p><p>What it doesn't look anything like, Cusa, is the Gfay/DL/NK/[Removed for Content]/Toxx spires.</p><p>Let's try to keep in mind that not everything looks exactly like it did in EQlive, huh?</p>

[troodon]

<p>Does it look like the Warpfront spires in Darklight?  If so then it's physically impossible for it to be the old South Ro spires, reimagined or otherwise.</p>

[Apocroph]

<p><cite>troodon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Does it look like the Warpfront spires in Darklight?  If so then it's physically impossible for it to be the old South Ro spires, reimagined or otherwise.</p></blockquote><p>You're really not gonna like this then...</p><p><a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/the_axiom/eq/moorsmap.jpg" target="_blank">Click for map</a></p><p>Edit: Updated the map to include the location of the South Ro druid ring.</p>

[troodon]

<p><cite>kuraan wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>troodon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Does it look like the Warpfront spires in Darklight?  If so then it's physically impossible for it to be the old South Ro spires, reimagined or otherwise.</p></blockquote><p>You're really not gonna like this then...</p><p><a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/the_axiom/eq/moorsmap.jpg" target="_blank">Click for map</a></p></blockquote><p>Why wouldn't I like that?  Excellent job, by the way.  I guess we have another magically-rotated continent on our hands.</p><p>For anyone who hasn't been to MoY, the spires do look identical to the Warpfront quadrolith in Darklight, which leaves us with one of two possibilities:</p><p>a) they're not the old South Ro spires</p><p>b) the EverQuest 2 developers are incompetent and don't know anything about the world that has been entrusted to them</p><p>As I said in a thread a while ago, the Warpfront quadrolith cannot be the wizard spires from EQ1.  According to Al Kabor in the <a href="http://home.comcast.net/~bigdragon7/faydwersbrethren/stories/luclore.htm" target="_blank">Luclin pre-release lore</a> these smaller quadroliths were constructed in two parts: first the actual spires were constructed by an unknown race (presumably the Shissar) and then, later on, the pyramid in the center was constructed by the Combine Empire.</p><p>These Warpfront style quadroliths have their spires constructed <em>on top of</em> their pyramid, ergo the pyramid of this structure was constructed before the spires - which contradicts previous lore.</p><p>So it begs the question, how much of this stuff is the EQ2 staff ignorant of?  Are the people in charge under the false impression that the Combine Empire <em>did </em>construct these spires?</p>

[Apocroph]

<p><cite>troodon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Why wouldn't I like that?  Excellent job, by the way.  I guess we have another magically-rotated continent on our hands.</p></blockquote><p>Mostly because they turned out to be the old South Ro spires, despite their appearance.  Also, I don't think it was a magic rotation.  Being smashed by hunks of the moon may well have caused the rotation as that area of Antonica was split off, or the storms we've been told ravaged the oceans could have played a role.  It's a stretch, I know, but it's a common theme in post-Rending/Shattering Norrath.</p><p>As much as I hate to say it, maybe this is just a new look for the lesser spires that have cropped up around Norrath.  I don't know that it has so much to do with ignorance of the lore, but rather, that this is just an update to their stodgy old image.  It's uncomfortable, I know, but like I said a few lines back, stretches are a common thing these days.</p>

[troodon]

<p><cite>kuraan wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>Also, I don't think it was a magic rotation.  Being smashed by hunks of the moon may well have caused the rotation as that area of Antonica was split off, or the storms we've been told ravaged the oceans could have played a role. </blockquote><p>Continents don't behave like that, and the amount of energy that would be required to do anything like that are far beyond anything a meteorite originating from the moon could ever accomplish.</p><blockquote><p>As much as I hate to say it, maybe this is just a new look for the lesser spires that have cropped up around Norrath.  I don't know that it has so much to do with ignorance of the lore, but rather, that this is just an update to their stodgy old image.  It's uncomfortable, I know, but like I said a few lines back, stretches are a common thing these days.</p></blockquote><p>It's either ignorance of lore or just an unwillingness to accept it.  It's possible to update the image of the quadroliths without creating something that cannot physically be created using the timeline given in established EverQuest lore.It makes one wonder why the original builders of the spires would use such drastically different styles between their huge ones (see GFay spires and Teren's Grasp) and their smaller ones (Warpfront and Ykesha).</p>

[Cusashorn]

<p>Nice job on the map, but how the heck does that Obelisk fall in place? That part of the map you pointed it to was Oggok.</p><p>We still have no evidence to prove that Grobb is still the same Grobb as it was in EQlive. We don't know if they reclaimed it from Gukta, or rebuilt it. The structured buildings lead me to believe the latter.</p><p>3rd, Moors of Ykesha is WEST of The Feerrott by a great margin.<a href="http://www.deter.com/eq/maps/antonica.jpg" target="_blank"> If the map was accurate to how it was in EQlive, then Moors would be to the east.</a> (... of course, there's always the possibility that it was an oversight by the map designers in this game.)</p><p>Finally, if that used to be South Ro, then dang... the last 500 years has shifted the entire desert up by about 3-4000 feet in elevation. That landing outpost in smack dab in the Rathe Mountains.</p>

[Apocroph]

<p>One incredibly frustrating thing we always have to remember is that this is a video game.  Continents don't behave like that on Earth, but anything can happen in a video game.</p><p>I did kinda labor over where to draw the line for Obelisk on that map.  The bit of information I went on was from the Bogstrutter's quest there in Moors, where it tells you to visit a shadow monument in Rathe Mountains.  The old map of Norrath has the Rathe Mountains ending a good way before Innothule, as the Feerrott was once between those regions.  Mostly the reasoning for where I marked the Obelisk on the old map is just looking at the relative locations of the other markers on my map, and sorta eyeballing it.</p><p>As for the placement of Rathe Mountains, the Feerrott and Innothule...  I suppose one could make the case that the zone wall of the Feerrott could be part of the Rathe Mountains.  I've always imagined the Feerrott as walled in by the mountains until you hit the swampland to the east.  I think that mountain ranges --the Rathe Mountains in particular-- extend much further into other regions than EQlive might've indicated.  RM probably did extend through some of the area we'd consider the Feerrott, but obviously not in a major way.</p><p>I'd be inclined to believe, though, that Grobb is still in its original location.  It may not be the original Grobb/Gukta/whatever, but I'm going to guess that it's the same location.  The area it's in is naturally defensible, which strikes me as something the Trolls would value.  The positioning of other key landmarks tends to support that; most notable is the close proximity to Guk, their ancestral home.</p><p>I do think that's what's left of South Ro that we're landing at in Moors.  Something to consider is the possibility that the elevation hasn't changed, but your perception has due to environmental clues.  I think the violence of the Rending and Shattering just might've changed the landscape enough to seem much higher than it is.  The obvious way to check that would be to note the Z-axis position in the landing area, near Obelisk, and a few other assorted spots around the zone.</p><p>I'm going to see if I can't fit the Moors map over the old Antonica map.  Maybe we can figure out more definitively what it covers.</p>

[Cusashorn]

<p>The thing that bugs me the most about Grobb is that I haven't done any quests yet that reveal some backstory about how or why the city is back.</p>

[Apocroph]

<p>[<a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/the_axiom/eq/moors2.jpg" target="_blank">Image Link</a>]</p><p>The new Moors map doesn't translate well to the old world map.  Even adjusting for rotation, Broken Skull Rock ends up much further west than previously indicated, and the territory would encompass much of the Feerrott and even the Rathe Mountains.  Oggok would certainly fall somewhere within its bounds, which seems sorta right to me.  I remember Oggok being a sort of cave city in the mountains.</p><p>This whole thing is a mess.  I can't even process how screwed the proportions are.  If Moors is the correct size, then the older landmasses are much too small.  Taking into consideration the areas that Moors covers, plus the area of the Feerrott we have rediscovered, there should be some evidence of Oggok in the western region of the Moors.</p><p>Edit: Oggok should be right near where Tupta is.</p>

[Meirril]

<p><cite>Radical@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>So, what wizard platform in Moors of Ykesha is that from eq1? It looks like the pyramid type, but its been SO long since I played Eq1, I dont' recall if the Wizard port in South Ro was that type or not.</p><p>Any thoughts?</p></blockquote><p>I'm actually thinking that the spire is a Quellthullian design, not one of the old spires at all. The presence of a large Quellthullian contingent lends a bit of creedence to this idea.</p><p>Its also possible that the druid ring at this sight is new as well. Considering that tier 3 guild halls get druid rings, and the antonica druid ring is in the completely wrong direction to be the north karana druid ring, it seems that somebody in modern Norrath can construct them as well.</p>

[ke'la]

<p>IMO both the Druid Ring, and Wizzard Spire look like they have been moved to thier current location and are not from that spot origenally... It's a MAJOR coincidence that they both naturally ended up right next to each other more or less, right on the edge of the presipose, on the same outcroping that the Gnomes happened to land on, with enough room between them that the Gnomes could build thier outpost.</p><p>IMO, the Spire in Moores is accually New Contruction, while the Druid ring was moved from somewhere... Remember there are "Mysterious" Euriodites in DSLZ too. And correct me if I am wrong but they have knowage of how to build Teleport spires.</p>

[ke'la]

<p><cite>kuraan wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>[<a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/the_axiom/eq/moors2.jpg" target="_blank">Image Link</a>]</p><p>The new Moors map doesn't translate well to the old world map.  Even adjusting for rotation, Broken Skull Rock ends up much further west than previously indicated, and the territory would encompass much of the Feerrott and even the Rathe Mountains.  Oggok would certainly fall somewhere within its bounds, which seems sorta right to me.  I remember Oggok being a sort of cave city in the mountains.</p><p>This whole thing is a mess.  I can't even process how screwed the proportions are.  If Moors is the correct size, then the older landmasses are much too small.  Taking into consideration the areas that Moors covers, plus the area of the Feerrott we have rediscovered, there should be some evidence of Oggok in the western region of the Moors.</p><p>Edit: Oggok should be right near where Tupta is.</p></blockquote><p>This is map I made using the old system guessing about where Moore's would be... befor TSO launched... and I think it accually is fairly accurate.</p><p><img src="http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n65/kela_012/CombinedMap-InnithulSwap.jpg" /></p><p>The white map came from this image.</p><p><img src="http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n65/kela_012/new_overlay.jpg" /></p><p>someone else made.</p><p>In otherwords I don't think Moores is as big as you repersent it in your image.</p><p>If you look at the map in game Moores is about the same size as the Isle of Ro... if you count the area we can't goto.</p><p>::EDIT::I tried doing my own version of that map(the white one) using the new ingame world map and it looks to me that most of the land masses have rotated atleast 90Deg some less, though I have only got so far as Karen, Feer, and Moores.</p>

[Apocroph]

<p><cite>kela wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><span ><p>In otherwords I don't think Moores is as big as you repersent it in your image.</p><p>If you look at the map in game Moores is about the same size as the Isle of Ro... if you count the area we can't goto.</p></span></blockquote><p>I was going from the in-game map, which had Moors being much larger than Ro.  Whether or not it's THAT much bigger is debatable, yes, but I do believe it's larger than Ro by an appreciable amount.  The main reason for my logic there is the fact that the "continent" extends from the shores above Guk all the way west to the Rathe Mountains.  It has to be a fairly large landmass to cover that much ground, considering that's over half the latitude that Antonica covered.</p><p>As to the suggestion that the spires and rings were moved...  Possible?  Yes.  Likely?  I don't think so.  The only reason I can see for these new structures ending up in the same place you'd expect the old ones to be is if they purposely put them in those spots to take advantage of ley lines or whatever the natural powering for them was.  I have trouble believing that new spires and rings would pop up right where we'd expect the old ones coincidentally.</p><p>Is it uncomfortable for some people?  Sure, but you have to take into consideration the possibility that they didn't want to make a unique model for one set of lesser spires.  I don't like what that suggests any more than anyone else, but it is certainly possible that they just used the current lesser spire model for an old set of lesser spires.</p>

[TheKons]

<p>I'm looking at the in game world map right now and Desert of Ro is slightly bigger than Moors</p>

[ke'la]

<p>This is the World map of Ro, overlaying Moors, when you include the parts that we can't get to Ro is slightly bigger... As I am including the water between the islands and the mainland of Moors... as you can go there. If you don't include the water as part of Moors, Ro is alot larger.</p><p><img src="http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n65/kela_012/Ro_over_Moors.jpg" /></p>

[Apocroph]

<p>I guess I should've clarified that I was talking about the beta map.  I've deleted my beta folder since launch, but the screen I had of the world map showed Moors much larger.  Guess the art wasn't final.</p><p>Semantics aside though, Moors is still a very large chunk of land.  Like I said, it extends east to the original boundary of Antonica, and west into the Rathe Mountains.</p>

[ke'la]

<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2PZJM4uoL8" target="_blank">Here</a> is a video I took while in Beta... it shows the same world map that is live with Moors' landmass sugnificantly smaller then the total landmass of Ro(if you include the places we can not go.) Look at 32 secs to see the world map... I have other videos from BETA of the map that show the same thing. That said the accessable area of Ro is smaller(by a little bit) then Ro.</p><p>Also my understanding is that Moors was Seperated from the Desert of Ro by the tail end of the Rathe Mountains and what is left of them is what makes up Upper Moors, now. If that is the case it does not have to be that large an area... it does however have to rotate to line up correctly, but based on the map I am working on alot of Old Antonica Rotated sugnificantly.</p>

[Wilde_Night]

<p>We have to remember, that the EQ1 maps are not 100% accurate, as the game engine they had limited the size of the zones.  So, with EQ2's engine, they can make the zones the "correct" size and scale.  Being that Norrath doesn't exactly follow the physics of our universe, the rotation of whole land masses is not necessarily a strange thing.</p>

[Apocroph]

<p><cite>Aeviel@Venekor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>We have to remember, that the EQ1 maps are not 100% accurate, as the game engine they had limited the size of the zones.  So, with EQ2's engine, they can make the zones the "correct" size and scale.  Being that Norrath doesn't exactly follow the physics of our universe, the rotation of whole land masses is not necessarily a strange thing.</p></blockquote><p>We're not going off of zone maps here.  We're going off of the map of the world they drew, which is the most accurate source of info on the subject.</p><p>The technological progress this game has made is starting to wreak havoc on the world.  Moors is easily the size of the lower half of Antonica, if Ro is any indication of the scale used.  The whole thing is starting to get really messy.</p><p>Ke'la-</p><p>The map I saw was like the old system world map that you linked.  Moors was shown about the size of Kunark, which obviously can't be accurate.</p><p>It's possible that Rathe Mountains extended that far east, but from looking at the old EQlive map of Norrath, it looks like they end around Oggok.  It's not so much the east-west that's significant here, but rather the north-south.  The old map of Antonica has Lake Rathe as south of the Rathe Mountains, and Oggok south of Lake Rathe.</p><p>If Moors reaches far enough north to hit Rathe Mountains, you'd expect some indication of Oggok along the way, seeing as how Oggok was sandwiched between the Rathe Mountains to the north, Lake Rathe to the west, the Rujarkian Hills to the east, and bits of South Ro to the south.  What's interesting here though, is that the portion of the Rathe Mountains that we had in EQlive seperated the Feerrott from Lake Rathe along its western border, suggesting that they turn southward before reaching much further east than Oggok.  This is a substantial portion of souther Antonica we're looking at here.</p><p>The only things missing are the Dead Hills, which haven't been seen in over a thousand years, and Lake Rathe, which was likely swallowed up in the Rending of Antonica, since we now have a region known as the Straits of the Twelve.  It stands to reason that the fault line the Rathe Mountains would have sat atop was the split between Southern Karana and the Feerrott during the cataclysms, which might even account for Oggok's absence if the flooding reached that far inland.</p><p>If all this is accurate, we're missing a very substantial portion of South Ro, which would seem to fit with what we know of the areas we have available to us.  The South Ro spires and druid ring in Moors are right where I'd expect them to be in relation to other landmarks, and Sinking Sands doesn't reach much further south than the old spectre tower in the middle of Oasis.  The only trouble spot is the purported size of the Moors zone.  If it covers the territory we're told it covers, it should be larger than Ro, and we should probably have a bit more of South Ro than we do currently.</p>

[ke'la]

<p><cite>kuraan wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Aeviel@Venekor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>We have to remember, that the EQ1 maps are not 100% accurate, as the game engine they had limited the size of the zones.  So, with EQ2's engine, they can make the zones the "correct" size and scale.  Being that Norrath doesn't exactly follow the physics of our universe, the rotation of whole land masses is not necessarily a strange thing.</p></blockquote><p>We're not going off of zone maps here.  We're going off of the map of the world they drew, which is the most accurate source of info on the subject.</p><p>The technological progress this game has made is starting to wreak havoc on the world.  Moors is easily the size of the lower half of Antonica, if Ro is any indication of the scale used.  The whole thing is starting to get really messy.</p><p>Ke'la-</p><p>The map I saw was like the old system world map that you linked.  Moors was shown about the size of Kunark, which obviously can't be accurate.</p><p>It's possible that Rathe Mountains extended that far east, but from looking at the old EQlive map of Norrath, it looks like they end around Oggok.  It's not so much the east-west that's significant here, but rather the north-south.  The old map of Antonica has Lake Rathe as south of the Rathe Mountains, and Oggok south of Lake Rathe.</p><p>If Moors reaches far enough north to hit Rathe Mountains, you'd expect some indication of Oggok along the way, seeing as how Oggok was sandwiched between the Rathe Mountains to the north, Lake Rathe to the west, the Rujarkian Hills to the east, and bits of South Ro to the south.  What's interesting here though, is that the portion of the Rathe Mountains that we had in EQlive seperated the Feerrott from Lake Rathe along its western border, suggesting that they turn southward before reaching much further east than Oggok.  This is a substantial portion of souther Antonica we're looking at here.</p><p>The only things missing are the Dead Hills, which haven't been seen in over a thousand years, and Lake Rathe, which was likely swallowed up in the Rending of Antonica, since we now have a region known as the Straits of the Twelve.  It stands to reason that the fault line the Rathe Mountains would have sat atop was the split between Southern Karana and the Feerrott during the cataclysms, which might even account for Oggok's absence if the flooding reached that far inland.</p><p>If all this is accurate, we're missing a very substantial portion of South Ro, which would seem to fit with what we know of the areas we have available to us.  The South Ro spires and druid ring in Moors are right where I'd expect them to be in relation to other landmarks, and Sinking Sands doesn't reach much further south than the old spectre tower in the middle of Oasis.  The only trouble spot is the purported size of the Moors zone.  If it covers the territory we're told it covers, it should be larger than Ro, and we should probably have a bit more of South Ro than we do currently.</p></blockquote><p>South Ro is the inaccessable part of the Isle of Ro, and every map I saw, even in beta, if you include that inaccessable part of Isle of Ro, Ro was bigger then Moors. That said Moors is a good deal bigger then SS, PoF, and Maj'dul combined.</p><p>I have put together a map of where I think the veriouse parts of the shaddered lands come from. Currently, they are in thier EQ2 rotational allinement. I scaled them all down by the exsact same amount(they are 80% of the screen cap I made) in order to accually fit them on the map.</p><p><img src="http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n65/kela_012/Shatteredlandsoverlaynorotation.jpg" /></p><p>and if you look Moors you can see that it needs to be rotated as Lower Moors is Innothule Swamp, while Guk and Grobb are in the wrong spot in relation to each other.</p>