DEVS: Why are rangers so OP and not being looked at?

[ChaoticVisions]

I'm sure I'm not the only person who has made a post like this, but I really can't help but wonder what Sony is doing that they just allow this overpowered class to run rampant in the game. If I have to, I will provide video on what I am talking about.I play a level 80 Assassin so I know some might say I was a hypocrite for screaming OP (although I don't feel an assassin is OP, particularly in the case of rangers). Here's the deal .. I can kill someone fast sure. REALLY fast when my 10 minute timer Execute is up, I'm right on my opponent and in stealth. MEANWHILE, a ranger can kill someone just as quickly from max range, UNSTEALTHED. Shouldn't this class HAVE to be a kiting class? How is it that they can deal Assassin damage WITHOUT even using EXECUTE or their equivalent, completely unstealthed and away from harm. In T8, when a ranger gets equipped with the PvP bow which procs a root ... they cast their skill that gives them 100% proc chance, and you are effectively rooted, stifled, and snared in one shot. Fine. THEN, as you scramble to cure the root, etc (if you even can while being stifled), you have about a 2-3 second window before you're completely dead.Now I know what you would say .. learn new strategies, etc etc etc. Funny thing is, I DO have the Inpenetrable move and guess what?? It doesn't even WORK all the time. I'm sure many assassins and rangers alike can atest to the fact that it doesn't even always work. Why is that? Is this being looked into or is it just another one of those things that will always remain broken? It's not about strategies. The strategy I would really suggest is to avoid them altogether.I do understand, though. I can only imagine how bad the rangers would whine if Sony did actually take a moment to LOOK at the class and see that is far too powerful in PvP. Their damage should be nerfed across the board with a few big stealth attacks. I have to WORK for my damage, and I only get it if everything goes in my favor. I have to be right on them, and in stealth. If a move gets parried, concealment chain gets broken and suddenly I have a fight on my hands. That's fine. I don't want the assassin to get boosted. I want the ranger to be looked at. I'm sure 90% of all non ranger playing players would agree, and while you can call me a n00b or tell me that I need to learn to play. I CAN play, and I have beaten every class in the game under the right circumstances, but ranger PvP damage needs to go. They should HAVE to kite you and widdle away at your health while you try to chase them. But nah, they're just assassins with bows. Only difference is they get to do it from 40m and without stealth.The worst part is, I know this post will be overlooked and rangers will continue on being exactly what they are. PvP gods. Some might say "well make a ranger", but I don't play a class because it's overpowered. I play a class that suits my style. But with all that said, I really don't have much respect for any ranger player out there. They might be the greatest PvPer in the world, but playing a class like that deserves no props or respects. "I get a gun in a swords and shields game!"And on a final note, Brigand's Safehouse move also needs to be looked at as it is being exploited all the time. But that is a topic for another time.PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE SONY .. don't give up on EQ2 PvP. You have such a great system in place. Can't you focus a little more effort on it? Perhaps the monetary benefits will become more apparent with a balanced system that more players can enjoy.

[Odawnus Haste]

Make you don't spam impenetrabe because you will just cancel it and you will still be dazed for the 13 seconds.

[Jacquotte]

<p>rangers are fun, you should make one and show us just how easy they are to play</p><p> rangers has been battered over and over with the nerf-bat, imo they are pretty balanced endgame, especially after they made most of their procs cureable (im talking specifically about the one that blurs your vision and slows you by a crazy amount)</p><p> btw you too can get the pvp-bow</p><p>imo the pirates, clerics and brawlers are in much more need to be looked upon</p><p>and conj and necros, poor guys in a 1v1 environment</p>

[Bozidar]

<cite>Corvena@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>imo the pirates, clerics and brawlers are in much more need to be looked upon</p></blockquote>leave the pirates alone or we'll stab a belaying pin in your ear!

[seahawk]

<p>I really am getting tired of nerf threads... /sigh</p><p>Rangers are probably the one scout class on the pvp servers that have gotten the nerf bat the most.  Now you want them nerfed again?  And to boot, you are an Assassian ... how ironic.</p><p>Yes rangers are good, really good, but they are no more OP's then Swashi's or Brigands.  In fact, I would say of the three they would be third.  That is just my opinion though.</p><p>If it makes you feel better, their conservation line is getting nerfed in the next update.  ( nerfed in the sense, that it doesn't work as intended now.  It will work as it was supposed to. )</p><p>Instead of coming to the boards to say this class is OP, or that class is OP.. how about giving some love to the classes that really need it?  Bring their classes on par with the rest ...</p><p>And finally, I would just like to add, like many before me have added, this game is not about 1v1.  Some classes do better then others in 1 v 1, some shine in groups.  You gotta look at the big picture.  Rangers bring absolutely nothing to the group but dps.  That is it.  Nerf that, and you might as well bring along another class.</p>

[ChaoticVisions]

Plain and simple, a ranger shouldn't have assassin damage UNSTEALTHED and from 40m away. It just makes no sense. I have, literally, a handful of nonstealthed CAs that do MODERATE damage. Everything that really hits hard requires stealth and also requires that I'm right up on my opponent.  You talk about how your things are cureable, but is someone really going to cure those things AND sprint to you within the 3 second window of opportunity? I'm not saying it can't happen, but give me a break. So, in order to beat a ranger, it's required that you are an amazing PvPer. No wonder people quit this game all the time and Sony has given up on it for the most part. That's just ridiculous.

[Efrath]

I'm not T8 but pre-T8, Ragers aren't that OP I think. I DO THINk that their [Removed for Content] AA tree should be redone!

[Armironhead]

<cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I really am getting tired of nerf threads... /sigh</p><p>Rangers are probably the one scout class on the pvp servers that have gotten the nerf bat the most.  Now you want them nerfed again?  And to boot, you are an Assassian ... how ironic.</p><p>Yes rangers are good, really good, but they are no more OP's then Swashi's or Brigands.  In fact, I would say of the three they would be third.  That is just my opinion though.</p><p>If it makes you feel better, their conservation line is getting nerfed in the next update.  ( nerfed in the sense, that it doesn't work as intended now.  It will work as it was supposed to. )</p><p>Instead of coming to the boards to say this class is OP, or that class is OP.. how about giving some love to the classes that really need it?  Bring their classes on par with the rest ...</p><p>And finally, I would just like to add, like many before me have added, this game is not about 1v1.  Some classes do better then others in 1 v 1, some shine in groups.  You gotta look at the big picture.  Rangers bring absolutely nothing to the group but dps.  That is it.  Nerf that, and you might as well bring along another class.</p></blockquote>No toon should ever be nerfed, period.  Its bad for the game.  If soe wants to help a class of toons, then fine -- improve their spells/ca's -- dont nerf the competition.  And for my money wardens are the most op toon in the game rt now.

[seahawk]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Plain and simple, a ranger shouldn't have assassin damage UNSTEALTHED and from 40m away. It just makes no sense. I have, literally, a handful of nonstealthed CAs that do MODERATE damage. <b><span style="color: #993300;">Everything that really hits hard requires stealth and also requires that I'm right up on my opponent</span></b>.  You talk about how your things are cureable, but is someone really going to cure those things AND sprint to you within the 3 second window of opportunity? I'm not saying it can't happen, but give me a break. So, in order to beat a ranger, it's required that you are an amazing PvPer. No wonder people quit this game all the time and Sony has given up on it for the most part. That's just ridiculous.</blockquote><p>I got a nice chuckle from this line.. you do realize that is what assassains do don't you?  ( it's a rhetorical question <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  )</p><p>Give me a break man, Rangers go Pew - Pew .. and you sneak up on people.. it is what they do.  Sounds like you should betray if playing a ranger is that easy.</p>

[Bozidar]

<p>i'll agree with the op that rangers are easier because their only real problem is getting around the "cast on the run" problem that assassins dont really have for delivering their best stuff.</p><p>but getting into melee, remaining in stealth and getting position.. that's a lot harder, imo.</p><p>either way.. rangers aren't so ridiculously op anymore, i think i like them where they're at.  then again if i played a clothy i might think differently <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Magius789]

<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[ChaoticVisions]

<cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Plain and simple, a ranger shouldn't have assassin damage UNSTEALTHED and from 40m away. It just makes no sense. I have, literally, a handful of nonstealthed CAs that do MODERATE damage. <b><span style="color: #993300;">Everything that really hits hard requires stealth and also requires that I'm right up on my opponent</span></b>.  You talk about how your things are cureable, but is someone really going to cure those things AND sprint to you within the 3 second window of opportunity? I'm not saying it can't happen, but give me a break. So, in order to beat a ranger, it's required that you are an amazing PvPer. No wonder people quit this game all the time and Sony has given up on it for the most part. That's just ridiculous.</blockquote><p>I got a nice chuckle from this line.. you do realize that is what assassains do don't you?  ( it's a rhetorical question <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  )</p><p>Give me a break man, Rangers go Pew - Pew .. and you sneak up on people.. it is what they do.  Sounds like you should betray if playing a ranger is that easy.</p></blockquote>Yes, I understand that's what assassins are about. I'm not complaining on how my class is played. I love the assassin. I'm simply saying assassins work a lot harder for the damage they put out in comparison to a ranger. So laugh it up, bro. You're not even seeing the point. I'm happy with my class. I'm talking about getting rooted, stifled, and snared in 1 shot and then being killed in a couple more shots. And I will not betray to a ranger, as I am and always be an assassin. I don't need a "immobilizing" gun to win fights. The only thing I am saying is that rangers can put out damage just as fast as I can and they can do it from the range that they can without even using stealth. Is this not supposed to be the sister class to the assassin? Make their biggest hits require stealth, just like ours. (And please spare me from telling me that it already is that way. A ranger doesn't even need the handful of stealth CAs they have to kill you as fast as I can with EXECUTE up) And anything that's not should not deal extreme damage. It's just a little much, in my opinion.And, tbh, I'd LOVE to see a class like a Guardian or a Zerker take on a ranger. They can pretty much forget about it. With their "procced" root (guard) and snare (zerk), they'd never even be able to make to the ranger to pull it off on them. And if you play a Guard or Zerk and you can own rangers np, I'd love to hear about it. I really would. So PLEASE, enlighten me.

[ChaoticVisions]

<cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>And finally, I would just like to add, like many before me have added, this game is not about 1v1.  Some classes do better then others in 1 v 1, some shine in groups.  You gotta look at the big picture.  Rangers bring absolutely nothing to the group but dps.  That is it.  Nerf that, and you might as well bring along another class.</p></blockquote>Well, here's the deal, man. Your DPS doesn't have to go down in a group because you have a few stealth based CAs that you normally would otherwise never use, but in a group it gives you that opportunity because you're not the sole target. You can dip in and out of stealth almost just as fast as I can (save concealment) and honestly, with your Archer endline ability in our predator chart, you can actually stealth FASTER than I can. So you still have your big hits and big damage while grouped, and when alone you will STILL have those big hits, though your opportunities to use them will obviously be limited. All I am saying is that rangers should have to rely a lot more on kiting and their snares than they currently do. First shot: BAM. Rooted (if you have a root proc), Stifled, AND snared. 2 more seconds and dead. That's ridiculous. And if you think it's "balanced" I really suggest you try fighting against that as a pure melee class. You'll die just about everytime.

[yohann koldheart]

<p>this is funny comming from a assasan, with all the pots to cure our roots and snares if you still loose solo to a ranger after all the nerfing we already took you SUCK at playing a assasan.</p><p>our sniper shot is on a long  timer just like execute, and even if i hit you with m1 sniper its nerfed to below 40% of its normal damage for pvp.  and heres a news flash for you     ranger is suposed to do his damage from omg get this    "RANGE" .  </p><p>if a ranger sneaks up on you its your own fault with all the see stealth invis totems. </p><p>you have just as many stuns roots snares as we do. you also do more pvp damage then we do since ranger have already been nerfed as about as hard as a class can be nerfed, and your class hasent had that  YET   but dont worry it will come.</p><p>also by looking at your post count this a another knee jerk omg i got pownd by a  "incert random class name here " post  nerf them right away !!!!</p>

[Raidyen]

<p>Are you sure your in the right forums?  LoL an assasin calling a ranger over powered.  Thats funny.  Its almost as rediculous as a brigand calling a swash OP... wait a minute....</p>

[Magius789]

<p>I think you need to do a bit more research before you come to the forums and make an emotionally filled post about being killed by a certain class.  Assassins parse much higher than rangers and this is pretty much common knowledge(helps to have a dev that plays one I hear <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />&nbsp<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.  One example of this is to look at how many active rangers the top end raid guilds have and use on raids.  Also dealing out dmg at range is what a ranger is....what would you prefer them to do, run up and go head to head, then they'd be an assassin, brigand, or swashy.  Rangers can't do the dmg an assassin can while non stealthed.  Sure with the mythical bow the auto attacks can be pretty high but an assassin with his mythical will do more dmg do to the fact that he is duel wielding and attacks much faster.  You're Execute attack can't be compared to any attack a ranger has.  The only two you could try to compare it to is Sniper Arrow which does less dmg and has a MUCH longer casting time while not being able to move and be stealthed or Volley of Arrows ( I think thats the lvl 80 version of Rain of arrows) and it does med. dmg but is an encounter based attack.</p><p>You seem to really hate the PvP bow, because most of your posts keep referencing it, however a lot of other classess can get that bow including you.  The PvP bow has a root proc, I'm assuming the snare you are talking about is fettering poison, and other than items rangers don't have a stifle attack.  So  you're assassin can get the same bow, with the same root proc, use the same fettering poisons, and wear the same stifle gear but you are here complaining about rangers dps?  If these classess were to be "balanced" with each other that would require a LARGE boost to a rangers melee abilities to be brought on par to an assassins ranged capabilites.  I've had an assassin take 7.5K of my hitpoints in about 3 seconds all from his ranged attacks and there is no way a ranger can do that with his melee abilities.  Sure some people find it harder than others to cure effects and keep attacking but rangers are far from being OP.  </p><p>If you are fighting a ranger the first thing you should be doing is popping a freedom of action potion, that will negate the snares he puts on you.  Then if you get rooted from the PvP bow simply click the cure and keep sprinting.  Once the ranger realizes you are closing the distance he'll stop attacking you, since he can't attack and move at the same time like every other scout, and he'll start running to try and keep that distance.  When he does that he shows you his back side and you can do your bow attack that snares and now he has to either keep running while snared or stop to cure the snare in which time you will most likely be caught up to him and can root/stifle/stun him.  After that he is dead after a few seconds.  The only problem I can see is if he has his mythical and then his auto attacks will hit you pretty hard but you don't have to worry about the root proc since he isn't using that bow.  So once again if you pop a freedom of action potion you negate his snares which means you close the distance and thats game over.</p>

[seahawk]

<p>I don't even know how to respond.  YOu are an assassain complaining that rangers kill too quickly or too easily.  That boggles my mind.  You can attack while running.  Rangers can't.  Their melee ability is comparatively weak sauce compared to their ranged attacks.  As mentioned above, there are plenty of pots that cure snares, roots and the like.  </p><p>And finally, yes they are the sister class to assassians, so as an assassain you know the dps they are capable of.  So while you think it is too much dps from such a distance, consider that I think Assassian do way too much damage in a matter of one or two clicks of the mouse.</p><p>Sorry bro, but rangers don't need the nerf bat for the umpteenth time.  </p>

[-Arctura-]

<cite>Adriana@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>if a ranger sneaks up on you its your own fault with all the see stealth invis totems.</p></blockquote>(( 50m bow + boomerang = good luck seeing them before they kill you <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I dont really think rangers are too OP atm... I guess because I haven't been pvping much lately, and havent run into any that are outrageously 'omg-he-one-shotted-me'... But as is, it's not very hard to sneak up on people these days. If i could deliver my lethal damage from 50+ m away,... well... yeah that would be paradise <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> (but, Id rather have a cowl thanks! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />)

[Cigam]

<p>I think <strike>wizards</strike> err i mean <strike>warlocks</strike>  err <strike>wardens</strike> err  Brigands  well i mean  .... you know what i mean!</p><p>I do like getting attacked by a Ranger and him not being able to finish me off and I kill him with a fission.  Love my dispersion/displacement.</p>

[Bloodfa]

Sorry, but an Assassin crying about a Ranger?  I think the word I'm looking for is .... bwaahahahahahaaaa.

[ChaoticVisions]

Fine. I will make some videos of exactly what I am talking about and then you can tell me HOW would you would cure all of these things within the few seconds it takes for a ranger to kill you.I am amazed that you lost 7.5k to an assassin in ranged in a matter of what did you say? 3 seconds? We have 4 ranged CAs, two which require your back to be turned and neither of which deal over roughly 1.5k. A double bow shot that, gasp, we have to be standing still to use that does a total of like ... 600 dmg BEFORE mitigation, and a ranged melee attack that does roughly the same as the double shot. And then suppose the autoattack DOUBLE ATTACKED on a CRIT for, oh say .. 1k. So that's 1.5k+1.5k+600+600+2k, which is rougly 6k damage and all of our ranged CAs have longer casting times, gasp, just like yours. You got hit for 7.5k in how many seconds? You sure you weren't getting attacked my more than one? Cuz that's statistically impossible. Even with all our poisons proccing on FRONTLOAD you wouldn't take 7.5 in 3 seconds. And never EVER have I dealt that much damage with ranged alone, especially at such a great rate of speed.And also, someone mentioned that rangers had been nerfed enough or too much and, to be honest, that's probably because a class like a ranger is hard to balance in PvP. It needs constant attention and there have been other PvP based games with overpowered rangers all the same.The funny thing is you literally have to be a MADMAN to beat a ranger if you are a pure meleer. Honestly, I'd love to hear about you "hardcore" players owning "hardcore" rangers. (And I said HARDCORE rangers, not someone without much skill) Let's see some parses or even better post a video or two. I'd love to see your strategies because I have nothing but problems with rangers. Call me a n00b, call me what you will, but I've put in my time. I know what I've seen. I've been in PvP AS AN ASSASSIN since PvP began 2-3 years ago. I took a lengthy break, but I've always been assassin.And btw, the "rooting" bow can be gotten by any one, sure. But with a 100% chance to proc all your stuff (and trust me dude .. any good ranger wears a stifle piece. Thx), the root, the stifle (drink some potions now .. since you seem so good at doing this), and the snare make it nearly impossible to beat. Drink the freedom pot beforehand, then? Yeah, okay .. and any GOOD ranger will recognize this instantly and just wait to attack you. Don't think for a minute I am a n00b or someone who has no idea what I am doing. I carry all the pots, I even use the signets from the city merchant. That one is a bit more effective, but are you going to call back everytime after you use it? (As it is lore and you can only carry one at a time). Nah, dude. You aren't. Oh, and I never realized someone had to have a "big post" count to be able to start a discussion on this forum. I guess I have no real credibility in your mind, but I think my points are legitimate. Your post count is huge. Your wisdom and insight must far surpass mine because you spend time on the forums. Grats! <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Perhaps the ranger is the assassin's weakness, but I find it to be absolutely ridiculous. Honestly, I would love to see some videos of some of you players who consider yourself "good" in PvP owning "good" rangers. I don't doubt it can happen, but I'd love to see some strats. Particularly from other scout classes or strictly melee based classes.

[seahawk]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Fine. I will make some videos of exactly what I am talking about and then you can tell me HOW would you would cure all of these things within the few seconds it takes for a ranger to kill you.</blockquote><p>Tell me how, as a clothie, I am supposed to get Manashield off when I get jumped by an Assassin with their decap line, stifles and stuns?  I am dead before I can blink.</p><p> I say nerf assassins... <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[ChaoticVisions]

<cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>Give me a break man, Rangers go Pew - Pew .. and you sneak up on people.. it is what they do.  Sounds like you should betray if playing a ranger is that easy.</p></blockquote>Honestly, bro, I'm surprised you haven't been hired as a dev yet. Sheer brillance.

[ChaoticVisions]

<cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Fine. I will make some videos of exactly what I am talking about and then you can tell me HOW would you would cure all of these things within the few seconds it takes for a ranger to kill you.</blockquote><p>Tell me how, as a clothie, I am supposed to get Manashield off when I get jumped by an Assassin with their decap line, stifles and stuns?  I am dead before I can blink.</p><p> I say nerf assassins... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Wow. But it was made so clear that with all the "see stealth/invis" totems and pots, you should honestly never get caught in any of those traps. It takes 2 or 3 seconds for an assassin to do that to you. It's plenty of time to cure it all, right? Or maybe you could get some of the dispersion gear to completely absorb some of those blows. Yes, an assassin may get you if he gets the drop on you, but if you see him coming any wizard or warlock is definitely a match for most assassins. Trust me, I've been killed by plenty of sorcerer classes. Your damage is just as lethal as mine, particularly in the case of the wizard who's nuke almost DOUBLES the amount of my Execute damage and it's on a 3 minute timer.

[Bloodfa]

The thing is ... Assassins are just as lethal as a Ranger.  I've been killed by Rangers in 1 second.  Yep.  And by a Wizard.  And by Assassins.  You died while playing a top damage output class.  So what happens when you get the drop on a Conjuror and he dies in a second?  How much sympathy does one OP killer have for another?  Not too much.  Do you see my point?

[seahawk]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Fine. I will make some videos of exactly what I am talking about and then you can tell me HOW would you would cure all of these things within the few seconds it takes for a ranger to kill you.</blockquote><p>Tell me how, as a clothie, I am supposed to get Manashield off when I get jumped by an Assassin with their decap line, stifles and stuns?  I am dead before I can blink.</p><p> I say nerf assassins... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Wow. But it was made so clear that with all the "see stealth/invis" totems and pots, you should honestly never get caught in any of those traps. It takes 2 or 3 seconds for an assassin to do that to you. It's plenty of time to cure it all, right? Or maybe you could get some of the dispersion gear to completely absorb some of those blows. Yes, an assassin may get you if he gets the drop on you, but if you see him coming any wizard or warlock is definitely a match for most assassins. Trust me, I've been killed by plenty of sorcerer classes. Your damage is just as lethal as mine, particularly in the case of the wizard who's nuke almost DOUBLES the amount of my Execute damage and it's on a 3 minute timer.</blockquote><p>I always have totems up, and carry cure pots, and have my dispersion gear ( it doesn't always proc btw )... but, sometimes they still get the drop.  When they do.  I die fast.. with the stuns and stifles and their OP'd big hits (  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />   ) I can't even cast anything.  It is what it is.  The difference between you and I though, I don't come on these boards and say "Assassins are so OP and not being looked at".</p><p>I have no issue or qualms with the state of Assassin class or any class for that matter.  I play the game SoE gives me.  You on the other hand got your feelings hurt when another class just owned you apparently and then ran to the forums asking a DEV if rangers are being looked at because their little arrows that they shoot from so far away hurt really really bad.</p>

[seahawk]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>Give me a break man, Rangers go Pew - Pew .. and you sneak up on people.. it is what they do.  Sounds like you should betray if playing a ranger is that easy.</p></blockquote><p>Honestly, bro, I'm surprised you haven't been hired as a dev yet. Sheer brillance.</p></blockquote><p>This might be the first thing we agree on! <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Sightless]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>And btw, the "rooting" bow can be gotten by any one, sure. <b><span style="font-size: small;">But with a 100% chance to proc all your stuff</span></b> (and trust me dude .. any good ranger wears a stifle piece. Thx), the root, the stifle (drink some potions now .. since you seem so good at doing this), and the snare make it nearly impossible to beat. Drink the freedom pot beforehand, then? Yeah, okay .. and any GOOD ranger will recognize this instantly and just wait to attack you. Don't think for a minute I am a n00b or someone who has no idea what I am doing. I carry all the pots, I even use the signets from the city merchant. That one is a bit more effective, but are you going to call back everytime after you use it? (As it is lore and you can only carry one at a time). Nah, dude. You aren't.</blockquote><p>For the love of god, Rangers do not have a 100% proc chance. When they allow all classes in all factions, my Ranger will be the first to become an Assassin. Hell, I play a Gaurdian now, and fighting level 80s at 75, I have to say, I don't understand how with your tools, you can't kill a Ranger as an Assassin. Give my Gaurdian your snares and such, and boy.....</p><p>If you snare a Ranger, you can stay in his face, if he cures it, you can stifle him, a stifle that will last long enough for you to reapply your snare.</p>

[ChaoticVisions]

<cite>Sightless wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>For the love of god, Rangers do not have a 100% proc chance. When they allow all classes in all factions, my Ranger will be the first to become an Assassin. Hell, I play a Gaurdian now, and fighting level 80s at 75, I have to say, I don't understand how with your tools, you can't kill a Ranger as an Assassin. Give my Gaurdian your snares and such, and boy.....<p>If you snare a Ranger, you can stay in his face, if he cures it, you can stifle him, a stifle that will last long enough for you to reapply your snare.</p></blockquote>Lol. You show me a drawn out Assassin vs Ranger fight that lasts longer than 4-5 seconds and I'll be pretty surprised. We're not platers, man. Even with 9k life (mine), I drop pretty dang fast. I didn't say I couldn't kill rangers. I said I didn't understand HOW they are doing damage as quickly as myself from the range they can do it at. In fact, I just saw a post of a PvP with exactly what I'm talking about: (Props to Arivath on Naga) <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAhVpRlmR8Q." target="_blank"></a><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAhVpRlmR8Q" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAhVpRlmR8Q</a> Check at approximately 2:00 into the video. THIS is exactly what I am talking about. Yeah, that's not OP damage at all. Oh, and take special note on exactly how far away from the assassin he is. Pay real close attention. That fight took a whole, oh .. 3 seconds.

[ChaoticVisions]

And, alright, the 100% proc rate was an exageration .. but BARELY. With such long delays procs come very, very often. And trust me, I almost ALWAYS get snared/rooted on the first shot. So let's say 90%, I don't care.

[Norrsken]

<cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>seahawk91 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Fine. I will make some videos of exactly what I am talking about and then you can tell me HOW would you would cure all of these things within the few seconds it takes for a ranger to kill you.</blockquote><p>Tell me how, as a clothie, I am supposed to get Manashield off when I get jumped by an Assassin with their decap line, stifles and stuns?  I am dead before I can blink.</p><p> I say nerf assassins... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Wow. But it was made so clear that with all the "see stealth/invis" totems and pots, you should honestly never get caught in any of those traps. It takes 2 or 3 seconds for an assassin to do that to you. It's plenty of time to cure it all, right? Or maybe you could get some of the dispersion gear to completely absorb some of those blows. Yes, an assassin may get you if he gets the drop on you, but if you see him coming any wizard or warlock is definitely a match for most assassins. Trust me, I've been killed by plenty of sorcerer classes. Your damage is just as lethal as mine, particularly in the case of the wizard who's nuke almost DOUBLES the amount of my Execute damage and it's on a 3 minute timer.</blockquote><p>I always have totems up, and carry cure pots, and have my dispersion gear ( it doesn't always proc btw )... but, sometimes they still get the drop.  When they do.  I die fast.. with the stuns and stifles and their OP'd big hits (  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />   ) I can't even cast anything.  It is what it is.  The difference between you and I though, I don't come on these boards and say "Assassins are so OP and not being looked at".</p><p>I have no issue or qualms with the state of Assassin class or any class for that matter.  I play the game SoE gives me.  You on the other hand got your feelings hurt when another class just owned you apparently and then ran to the forums asking a DEV if rangers are being looked at because their little arrows that they shoot from so far away hurt really really bad.</p></blockquote>Indeed, that is the nasty bit of assassins. I play one, and if I get the drop on someone, they will be dead before my root and stifle runs out. Unless they are a brawler or a plate class. Or have them silly items that break CC. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> If I dont get the jump, its a lot harder. Getting the jump despite see whatever is a bit tricky. you have to stay back and hide behind rocks and stuff. I mean, really sneak. Most scouts cant do that it seems.that being said, I feel rangers are about where they should be compared to other classes.IMHO, most classes could use a damage nerf in t8 since it went nuts in that tier. Again. But not specifically just scouts.

[dr4gonUK]

<p>Hmmm arivath... Isnt he a ranger from nexus using the mythical. Im not 100% on that, but fairly sure.</p><p>Bad example imo. Really hard trying to justify nerfing rangers when the number of rangers with mythicals in game i can probably count on one hand, and rangers in the same raid gear as arivath i can count on two hands. Hardly fair trying to nerf a class based on that is it?</p><p>PvP bow root? You mean the 1sec root? Hardly a fight winner beleive me, my 80 ranger has the pvp bow. </p><p>Now please stop your pvp attempts against the ranger class on the forums, go back to the game and learn to play. You are just taking the path of least resistance to making your gameing experience easier on you without giving a thought for every person that plays a ranger.  How so very selfish of you.</p><p>And btw, to beat a ranger just get into melee range and own his face(or back). Simplest strat out there and its free advice given earnestly.</p>

[ulleulle]

Rangers are massively easy to play..The good thing is that alot of people are really dumb at playing their toon..So just settle for what we have now and be happy with that..If the ranger community as a hole took their toon and used it exactly the way it should be played,then we all would be very very sad pandas =)Aslong as rangers still play us as if we are pve mobs then i i have no problem at all with rangers..The only rangers tht give me trouble are the good one..And that is balanced enough for me..My vote for nerfing rangers is non existing atm..Unless they step up with their toons ..then i might reconsider =)Cheers

[Ahlana]

<cite>Tanx@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>And btw, to beat a ranger just get into melee range and own his face(or back). Simplest strat out there and its free advice given earnestly.</p></blockquote>Esspecially now that fettering is cureable.

[ChaoticVisions]

Lol. Did my feelings get hurt? Nah, bro. I don't get that attached to the game. You see, I don't spend my entire day/week/month in the game and perhaps this is why I don't have a great strat against rangers. Apparently I'm dealing with some self proclaimed veterans.HOWEVER, Arivath is NOT using the epic and he is also an Assassin now on the Freeport side. Would you get your epic bow and then betray over to FP? Doubt it. So that video stills stands. And that's "balanced" to you guys. That's fine. You guys can be content with being owned from 40m in 2 seconds. I just think it's messed up. But, whatever, you win. I'll stop complaining. I can't wait until the next time a ranger drops you in a matter of a second or two and then maybe you'll think back and be like hm. Maybe that dude was onto something.It's not the n00b rangers that I'm talking about. It's the ones that use the class very well. I guess that's just the nature of the beast, though.The worst part is, imo, that you guys all talk about "cureable" stuff. DUDE, LOOK AT THAT VIDEO AND TELL ME WHERE IN THE HECK THIS DUDE WAS GOING TO "CURE" ANYTHING. Give me a break.

[Norrsken]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Lol. Did my feelings get hurt? Nah, bro. I don't get that attached to the game. You see, I don't spend my entire day/week/month in the game and perhaps this is why I don't have a great strat against rangers. Apparently I'm dealing with some self proclaimed veterans.HOWEVER, Arivath is NOT using the epic and he is also an Assassin now on the Freeport side. Would you get your epic bow and then betray over to FP? Doubt it. So that video stills stands. And that's "balanced" to you guys. That's fine. You guys can be content with being owned from 40m in 2 seconds. I just think it's messed up. But, whatever, you win. I'll stop complaining. I can't wait until the next time a ranger drops you in a matter of a second or two and then maybe you'll think back and be like hm. Maybe that dude was onto something.It's not the n00b rangers that I'm talking about. It's the ones that use the class very well. I guess that's just the nature of the beast, though.The worst part is, imo, that you guys all talk about "cureable" stuff. DUDE, LOOK AT THAT VIDEO AND TELL ME WHERE IN THE HECK THIS DUDE WAS GOING TO "CURE" ANYTHING. Give me a break.</blockquote>I have never died to a ranger in 2 seconds.

[Dh]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>And, alright, the 100% proc rate was an exageration .. but BARELY. With such long delays procs come very, very often. And trust me, I almost ALWAYS get snared/rooted on the first shot. So let's say 90%, I don't care.</blockquote><p>Too late! You lost all credibility with this statement. </p><p>/weapon says I have 27% proc chance with 9sec delay bow.  You were WAY off. </p><p>Hint: lose line of sight before trying to cure anything. happy hunting </p><p>-80 ranger PEW PEW!</p>

[Magius789]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>Lol. Did my feelings get hurt? Nah, bro. I don't get that attached to the game. You see, I don't spend my entire day/week/month in the game and perhaps this is why I don't have a great strat against rangers. Apparently I'm dealing with some self proclaimed veterans.HOWEVER, Arivath is NOT using the epic and he is also an Assassin now on the Freeport side. Would you get your epic bow and then betray over to FP? Doubt it. So that video stills stands. And that's "balanced" to you guys. That's fine. You guys can be content with being owned from 40m in 2 seconds. I just think it's messed up. But, whatever, you win. I'll stop complaining. I can't wait until the next time a ranger drops you in a matter of a second or two and then maybe you'll think back and be like hm. Maybe that dude was onto something.It's not the n00b rangers that I'm talking about. It's the ones that use the class very well. I guess that's just the nature of the beast, though.The worst part is, imo, that you guys all talk about "cureable" stuff. DUDE, LOOK AT THAT VIDEO AND TELL ME WHERE IN THE HECK THIS DUDE WAS GOING TO "CURE" ANYTHING. Give me a break.</blockquote><p>So let me get this straight....you made this post because you died really fast to, according to you, a very good well played ranger?  You know how many people die to assassins real fast or brigs or swashys for that matter?  And if the ranger was such an OP class why on this green earth would that guy betray to an assassin?  I know of atleast five rangers that are changing to assassins if open classess are added.  Whats funny is you say people are going to come here and start agreeing with you when they die to a ranger in a matter of seconds.  Well most people have died to a ranger in a matter of seconds, same as with the assassin but they didn't come here and start "please nerf this class because I died to it post."  They just learned from it and moved on.</p><p>And I have a feeling your exageration on our proc % isn't the only place you are exagerating. </p>

[Rhodan]

I honestly think you need to learn how to play your class a little more. Rangers aren't that overpowered against other melee classes in my honest opinion. Sure they have a kiting ability, but it won't work all the time, because the snares don't hold well because of the procs and double attacks rangers get that may break them. All you need to do is just go up and hug them, then they can't do anything. Rangers already got the nerf bat, and I'm still waiting on that bat to hit your assassin and some other freeport classes.As a side note,  I agree with you on the safehouse. IT should be removed from pvp servers. Too much exploiting of it and a .25 second cast time (ya, thats interuptable.) I think that should be one of sony's top priorities right now as of pvp.

[Izzypop]

Input from the 80 class balance threadSubjective opinions of 18 players averaged into a number<span class="postbody"><span class="postbody"><span class="postbody"><span class="postbody"><span style="color: #ff0000;">Red=Grossly overpowered 5 points</span><span style="color: #ffff00;">Yellow=Overpowered 4 points</span>White=Balanced 3 points<span style="color: #00ffff;">Blue=Underpowered 2 points</span><span style="color: #00ff00;">Green=Grossly underpowered</span></span> 1 point<span style="color: #00ff00;">Green</span><1.5<span style="color: #00ffff;">Blue </span><2.5 White <3.5 <span style="color: #ffff00;">Yellow</span> <4.5 <span style="color: #ff0000;">Red</span><span style="color: #ff0000;">4.83 Brigand 4.72 Swashbuckler</span><span style="color: #ffff00;">4.0 Ranger3.78 Assassin, Warden </span></span><span class="postbody"><span style="color: #ffff00;">3.66 Bruiser, Monk</span></span><span class="postbody"><span style="color: #ffff00;">3.5 Berseker</span>3.39 Warlock3.28 Templar, Inquisitor, Wizard3.17 Coercer3.11 Troubadour3.0 Shadowknight, Illusionist2.89 Fury, Paladin, Guardian2.5 Dirge<span style="color: #00ffff;">2.17 Mystic2.11 Defiler</span><span style="color: #00ff00;">1.28 Conjurer, Necromancer</span></span></span></span>I think the thread is doing well at saying what we all know

[Efrath]

WEll, as I EARLIER said in this thread, my personal thought about rangers isn't that they are OP but rather that their AA tree gives them a huge upper hand due to their superior speed which enables them (If they are that kind of person who likes to do that) completly choose which fights to be in or not with their 47% speed (Plus the extra speed from another buff they got). They can easily get to 100% and even if they are in PVP, they can sprint in 65% for twice as long as any other character! See my point here? They can attack anyone and unless they get slowed alot or rooted (Not that root matters at all in PVP since EVERYONE has potions. Oh us poor sorcerers ): ), they can easily outsprint everyone. Their damage isn't a problem, in that aspect, they seem to be balanced to me Pre T8, least to my t7 warlock. I haven't had the unfortune to encounter any T8 rangers yet tho.I do believe sprint AA should be changed for both Assasins and rangers really. It's quite enough being about to run around at 50+% out of combat guys, you dont need to be able to actually spring FASTER than you do out of combat in PVP]:<

[Odawnus Haste]

<cite>Efrath@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>WEll, as I EARLIER said in this thread, my personal thought about rangers isn't that they are OP but rather that their AA tree gives them a huge upper hand due to their superior speed which enables them (If they are that kind of person who likes to do that) completly choose which fights to be in or not with their 47% speed (Plus the extra speed from another buff they got). They can easily get to 100% and even if they are in PVP, they can sprint in 65% for twice as long as any other character! See my point here? They can attack anyone and unless they get slowed alot or rooted (Not that root matters at all in PVP since EVERYONE has potions. Oh us poor sorcerers ): ), they can easily outsprint everyone. Their damage isn't a problem, in that aspect, they seem to be balanced to me Pre T8, least to my t7 warlock. I haven't had the unfortune to encounter any T8 rangers yet tho.I do believe sprint AA should be changed for both Assasins and rangers really. It's quite enough being about to run around at 50+% out of combat guys, you dont need to be able to actually spring FASTER than you do out of combat in PVP]:<</blockquote>We do not have 65% incombat run speed/sprint.

[Efrath]

<cite>Odawnus Haste wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Efrath@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>WEll, as I EARLIER said in this thread, my personal thought about rangers isn't that they are OP but rather that their AA tree gives them a huge upper hand due to their superior speed which enables them (If they are that kind of person who likes to do that) completly choose which fights to be in or not with their 47% speed (Plus the extra speed from another buff they got). They can easily get to 100% and even if they are in PVP, they can sprint in 65% for twice as long as any other character! See my point here? They can attack anyone and unless they get slowed alot or rooted (Not that root matters at all in PVP since EVERYONE has potions. Oh us poor sorcerers ): ), they can easily outsprint everyone. Their damage isn't a problem, in that aspect, they seem to be balanced to me Pre T8, least to my t7 warlock. I haven't had the unfortune to encounter any T8 rangers yet tho.I do believe sprint AA should be changed for both Assasins and rangers really. It's quite enough being about to run around at 50+% out of combat guys, you dont need to be able to actually spring FASTER than you do out of combat in PVP]:<</blockquote>We do not have 65% incombat run speed/sprint. </blockquote>I do know it's ery common for Rangers to have aconstant out oc combat speed of over 60% if they have Journeyman boots Furies are the worst when it comes to Out of combat speed tho I hear. I rarely encounter any tho on the PVP servers but I hear that they can get like, a .100% constant speed? (Pretty sure this isn't true tho)  My bad about the Enhance: Sprint tho >: Missed the "If not engaged in PVP".  Sorry  >: Stupid me.

[Jacquotte]

<p>anyone can get 100% ooc runspeed, with the use of tinkered items, useable by anyone over lvl65</p><p>this is easily countered with root, snare, stifle, stuns</p>

[gfx]

You win some, you lose some. Ranger's aren't more OP than swashies, brigands, some wardens, warlocks, wizards, illusionists/coercers in some cases, mythical assassin, etc etc etc. List goes on. You have a long stifle, long root, snares, etc, we don't have a long stifle or a long root. Maybe they should remove the root from The Marksman, I don't know. I decided not to waste tokens on it.

[Valdar]

<p>The problem isn't really rangers, it's the insane autoattack damage that is RoK. They nerfed ranger's kiting ability when they nerfed in game runspeed boost, they completely removed Focus Aim in pvp and they nerfed Sniper Shot down by so much it's of little use in pvp.</p><p>At the same time you can get 2.5k autoattacks off about every 5s or so with enough haste, and a lot will double attack too. So my casters 7k health will be gone in 2 autoattacks, assuming the person gets 1 doubleattack off which is not too unlikely. And this is the pvp bow. The Mythical bow has killed me with a 3.5k autoattack + a doubleattack, a poison proc and an offensive stance proc in an opening shot.</p><p>The nice thing about autoattacks, they have no cast time, can be used on the move and require no power. They also require 0 skill.</p>

[gfx]

Every class except mages has big auto attacks in RoK. Not just rangers. Sure, rangers can do ALOT with mythical, but ... Swashies and Brigs can do almost as much. Swashies usually hit for 1,5k if they have a mythical + another good weapon. One of the 2 auto attacks will probably double attack. That's 4,5k for you, + procs = 5k easily. Zerkers and Guardians can do the same.

[Valdar]

<p>Yeah, it's autoattack damage in general, not just for rangers. Didn't mean to imply it was just them <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> It's a disturbing development though that after Focus Aim they also disabled Reach in pvp. If this trend continues then all we will have left in 5-6 GU's will be people charging eachother with autoattacks, where the winner is automatically the one with the best gear.</p>

[liveja]

<cite>ChaoticVisions wrote:</cite><blockquote>I said I didn't understand HOW they are doing damage as quickly as myself from the range they can do it at..</blockquote><p>Um ... well, I think it's because that's what they're actually designed to do, sort of the same way you're designed to do tons of damage very quickly from short range. Honestly, what I don't understand here is why you have any trouble at all understanding this yourself.</p><p>I have to agree with others: an Assassin complaining that Rangers are OP is irony defined <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>BTW, my PvP toon is a 20 Dirge.</p>

[Blistery]

<p>It's people like you who keep making the game worse and worse, like some other people were just whining about Reach for Swashbuckler and it was removed??!? They've already nerfed swashy to the max and they do that, rangers are nowhere near op'ed theyre like glass all of my characters i have i 1v1 rangers and i kill them. I play a level 67 ranger Cant and the only reason hes good is because i know how to play him!</p><p>(Talking about the guy who created the post)</p>

[Blistery]

<cite>Phaust@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The problem isn't really rangers, it's the insane autoattack damage that is RoK. They nerfed ranger's kiting ability when they nerfed in game runspeed boost, they completely removed Focus Aim in pvp and they nerfed Sniper Shot down by so much it's of little use in pvp.</p><p>At the same time you can get 2.5k autoattacks off about every 5s or so with enough haste, and a lot will double attack too. So my casters 7k health will be gone in 2 autoattacks, assuming the person gets 1 doubleattack off which is not too unlikely. And this is the pvp bow. The Mythical bow has killed me with a 3.5k autoattack + a doubleattack, a poison proc and an offensive stance proc in an opening shot.</p><p>The nice thing about autoattacks, they have no cast time, can be used on the move and require no power. They also require 0 skill.</p></blockquote><p>My rangers auto attack is 300-900 in Pvp at level 67, and my swashy level 57 can easily take out a 70 mage.. I've done it a few times already. </p><p>Just be prepared for the insane skill and strategy's some people use, like on my ranger i sometimes sniper shot it stuns them than i hidden fire storm of arrows and theyre dead... talking about a fighter class of course otherwise id just hidden fire a mage and their health would be red</p>

[Palleon]

Rangers arent overpowered lol. Are they?I just thought it was normal for a level 75 ranger to be able to root my level 80 Fury, snare it, stifle it, then shoot me dead in 3 hits from afar whilst all I can do is stand and watch.But hah, of course I can always hunt them down in that moment when they arent looking at their radar, root them myself and watch them evac to the zone line where they laugh at me and make comments via their pet name.Theres nothing wrong with that, afterall, us who choose to play on Freeport enjoy just being nothing more than farmable coin banks and having no chance to ever have a fair fight!Dont we?Anyone?/listens to the wind whistle past

[liveja]

<cite>Cant@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>my swashy level 57 can easily take out a 70 mage</blockquote>Yet, people wonder why Swashy is considered overpowered.

[liveja]

<cite>Palleon wrote:</cite><blockquote>Rangers arent overpowered lol.</blockquote><p>The last time I logged into Naggy, my 17 title-free Dirge was jumped by an 18 Hunter Ranger coming out of stealth. I kited the lil bugger around & killed him, a split second before his DOT poison killed me <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>A couple minutes later, a 16 Ranger tried to jump me, also coming out of stealth. Seconds later, he was fleeing for his life. Keep in mind that I've long thought of myself as one of the world's <b>worst</b> PvPers.</p><p>At 70+ level, Rangers *might* be overpowered ... or, it might just be that by that time, a Ranger player has gotten really good at playing the character. At levels below 20, however, it's not the class that's overpowered; it's the player driving the toon. Personally, I happen to think that player skilll (however it's defined) is the single most important aspect at any level, but since I'm nowhere near T8, I can't really say.</p>

[Niou]

<cite>Phaust@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>They nerfed ranger's kiting ability when they nerfed in game runspeed boost, they completely removed Focus Aim in pvp and they nerfed Sniper Shot down by so much it's of little use in pvp.</p></blockquote>Exactly...they've done enough to Rangers. Hell, I don't even play a ranger and I can see that they've done enough to them. As a Paladin I have little to no trouble with Rangers at all, while a Brig and Swash are capable of killing me semi easily if I screw up once or twice. Every class can't fight every class evenly, and if the day ever comes when they can, this is going to be a pretty boring game. Every class has weaknesses and strength's.

[sokil]

<p>Stop nerfing classes. Fix them instead. Review autoattack and put skill back into the game. </p><p>And it sucks to be stun/mezed etc and forced to stand there and watch while your character dies.. without any chance.. but wait.. I have potions, god powers, most have aa to prevent that. yea, now I remember. It still sucks even more because I completely forgot how to kill him with skill. </p><p>Not all classes should be able to kill all others every time! </p><p>PS. I am the first to toss my keyboard and scream in vent when I am stuned/mezed/slowed until I am dead without a single hit to my enemy and it happens often .. but hey, I am the first to admit I lack skill and thankfully I have luck and others lack skill too or I would never complete a writ.</p><p>Personally do what I do. run in a group. It is so much more fun. </p>

[Efrath]

<cite>Sochi@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Stop nerfing classes. Fix them instead. Review autoattack and put skill back into the game. </p><p>And it sucks to be stun/mezed etc and forced to stand there and watch while your character dies.. without any chance.. but wait.. I have potions, god powers, most have aa to prevent that. yea, now I remember. It still sucks even more because I completely forgot how to kill him with skill. </p><p>Not all classes should be able to kill all others every time! </p><p>PS. I am the first to toss my keyboard and scream in vent when I am stuned/mezed/slowed until I am dead without a single hit to my enemy and it happens often .. but hey, I am the first to admit I lack skill and thankfully I have luck and others lack skill too or I would never complete a writ.</p><p>Personally do what I do. run in a group. It is so much more fun. </p></blockquote>Personally I think that potions were meant to be used for emergencies, hence a semi-long recast time and so on. This is what Ipersonally believe SOE had in mind with these potions, both in PVE and PVP, otherwise the recast time would have been shorter and you would've been able to use different potions at the same time.If you have to rely on potions to be able to win at all, it's not that you lack skill but rather that there's something wrong with the PVP system. This is what I believe personally and I am fairly sure I'm right.Edit: Also, damagewise, they've done enough on the ranger. All that needs to be fixed really is the Autoattack damage in melee in T8 as well as  their silly 60%+ speed (Usually 70%+ with Journey boots) which, combined with their improved spring, means that they can choose just exactly which fight they're going to be in.

[Winter12345]

<p>ok NO MORE nerfs to the q side plz! Seriously I'm getting frustrated with all these new changes that have mainly been directed to q side classes, like reach being taken out, and now I've even heard they're nerfing Illiys' mezzes as well =(.</p><p>Plz plz open your eyes and look at your side, coercers are op right now and I dont see anything being changed about their mez/root timers. In fact one time I attacked a white-con coercer who was beating up a groupie of mine and he mezzes/roots me then runs away and kills my friend. By the time I find him again he is already at the other side of the map! Nope always just qeynos that pisses everyone off for some reason since freeps will get owned by us and then complain to GM's who most likely play freeps.</p><p>I know many people will argue about what I've posted but still, stop being so biased agaisnt us =(</p>

[Magius789]

<cite>Lorekaisen@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>ok NO MORE nerfs to the q side plz! Seriously I'm getting frustrated with all these new changes that have mainly been directed to q side classes, like reach being taken out, and now I've even heard they're nerfing Illiys' mezzes as well =(.</p><p>Plz plz open your eyes and look at your side, coercers are op right now and I dont see anything being changed about their mez/root timers. In fact one time I attacked a white-con coercer who was beating up a groupie of mine and he mezzes/roots me then runs away and kills my friend. By the time I find him again he is already at the other side of the map! Nope always just qeynos that pisses everyone off for some reason since freeps will get owned by us and then complain to GM's who most likely play freeps.</p><p>I know many people will argue about what I've posted but still, stop being so biased agaisnt us =(</p></blockquote>Indeed, if you want proof of bias just look at the changes Aerlik made to the brigand mythical and how much stronger he just made it.  Pretty soon everyone will be freeps because all the SOE peeps do is boost the classess they play......freakin cowards.  WAR

[KniteShayd]

<p>As it stands, like a few have already said, that's why he was able to kill you.  He was at a distance. If he was up close, you would have killed him and then emoted til ghe revived...</p><p>Rangers are like casters.  To win you have to be away from your opponent.</p><p>If a Conj got the jump on you, and killed you in a few shots, all while snaring and rooting and nuking, would you be crying for a nerf for them?</p><p>It pisses anyone off when they die, because no one likes to die if you have an "I like to be uber, and win all the time attitude". And most that do have those attitudes, are the pubescent WoW converts who have to play the easy mode classes for [Removed for Content] strokage.  Otherwise, they'd still be playing a game with crappy graphics...</p><p>I'm not saying this applies to the OP.  But we all know from experience, alot of these posts appear cuz Jr lost his title/killstreak and wants to vent about it.  Give it a day or two, and they go back to pwn'ing the green con mages whilst running from the oranges trying to pwn them and/or evac'ing from a weak sauce player that happened to get the jump...</p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/e78feac27fa924c4d0ad6cf5819f3554.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Trojamonkee]

Rangers like all scout classes are fine UNTIL they get a mythical.Then the balance in this game is fooked.They can one shot any really good player in PVP.Sniper 4-5kDoubleattack 5kRandom procs couple of k on topAnyone in the game is dead.Same goes for all scouts with myth. Heals don't scale with the doubleattack and insane DR ratings. These mythicals weren't ever tested in pvp methinks.It's just more annoying dying to a ranger who only uses one combart art. Even if I don't let him get the jump and sniper they still can win using only one CA. It's just skilless pvp really.