If you could change 3 Paladin Spells/AA....

[Eifer]

....which and how?First on my list would be Divine Aura, it's been said a thousand times but Divine Aura just doesn't fully do what it is supposed to while raiding, its only useful for heroic instances the way it stands.I don't think removing the 50% limit would make it massively overpowered. I would make an awesome spell to use when you need to take over tanking or just need that quick save in a pinch.  If removing the limit would be considered overpowered then maybe if it was a 40% or so damage reduction for 10-15s?Aura of Leadership - The WIS line has its uses however I think a small boost wouldn't hurt. Aura of Leadership would benefit greatly if there was some DA on there, its something that is fairly lacking for crusaders in general (the VP set changes was a great step forward on that), 5 DA per rank would be awesome but tbh I would happily take a little less just to help boost DA in someway other than relying solely on gear. Fearless Morale - This is a decent AA just a little situational, 2 tiny things to improve this would be to add an intterupt immunity (for those long cast heals we can never get off while tanking). Also the damage/ward improvement could be boosted to 5-10% or so but make it a proc instead of permanent, a proc on any succesful attack and possibly on casting a heal maybe.Most of these have all been said before a thousand times, so I'm not claiming anything original here, these are just the things that I think would be simple to implement without massive imbalance. Would also be nice to have some meaningful debuffs on one or two CA's/Spells.

[Cyrdemac]

Fearless Morale is a good ability. I would improve it to have a chance for groupmembers to share that fearlessness due to the fact of a symbolic withstanding knight thats is immune to Fear at all.That way we would givs something better of that ability to the group without overpowering it.Trample: would change this to something like DA, as we hit enough with spells..cant speak for SKs though.Divine Aura - either remove that 50% twitch for a longer timer oder leave it, but make it instant cast..died too often during casting..

[Caetrel]

<p>1. Turn back the clock to Divine Favor,  useless since DoF (2005).  Remove the penalty, make it a toggle buff with an immunity but no duration, kind of like the Hand of Death from SoH.  If we are not going to have a reliable stoneskin, give us our own personal death-save that actually works.  </p><p>2.  Divine Aura...remove the 50%, nuff said.</p><p>3.  Not AA or spell related- but improve itemization.  Poor set bonuses, lacking Epic.  </p>

[sliderhouserules]

Yes, Divine Aura needs to be changed. There is no valid explanation for the disparity between Guardian abilities and Pally abilities. This one is the glaring example.We absolutely need some more double attack. I don't know why we need a hate gain increaser in our STR line when we have the aggro control we have. Change that one to be DA and I'd be giddy.Our heals/wards need some love. Shorter cast timers, and how about making our WIS affect the heal/ward amount, so we have more motivation to increase it than simply building our power pool?

[OrcSlayer96]

<cite>Fidelus@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>1. Turn back the clock to Divine Favor, useless since DoF (2005). Remove the penalty, make it a toggle buff with an immunity but no duration, kind of like the Hand of Death from SoH. If we are not going to have a reliable stoneskin, give us our own personal death-save that actually works. </p><p>2. Divine Aura...remove the 50%, nuff said.</p><p>3. Not AA or spell related- but improve itemization. Poor set bonuses, lacking Epic. </p></blockquote>Been a while since i quoted a Fidelus post, but i would mostly agree with him on the above stuff, with some alterations and options:Divine Favor has never had a upgrade to it like Sigil of Heriosm, change the heal from ~1400 M1 to at least 25% heal if you plan not to have any temp mit buff or damage reduction to it.  Like Fidelus said, make it toggleable with a 30 min recast after it procs.  With how SOE likes a penalty to us, remove the 12 sec stifle/daze and replace with a root.  We don't plan on running away and this would allow us to use our protective abilities/taunt/damage.  With it as a percentage of max health, it would properly scale instead of losing its use as you go past the useable level.Divine Aura:  Either remove the 50% damage max of max health or halve the recast time on it.  So it would either be 100 % protection for 10 seconds every 10 minutes or 50% protection for 10 seconds on a base time of 5 mins.  I would prefer the 100% coverage with 10 min reuse but i am flexable to the recast reduction.Aura of Leadership:  People complaining about Fearless Morale really should complain about this AA, Fearless Morale in itself is okay for a end ability, grants immunity to fear for us against more and more mobs in game, gives a 2% groupwide buff to all heals/wards/spells/melee damage.  On the other hand, not even berserkers like health regen, and the amount on this group ability is at best subpar, even factoring in the additional health regen bonus you can pus your group mates up with.  Replace this with a self ability with a reduced ability to group that increases double attack percentages.  for the self portion it increases 7.5% DA per point for a total of 60% at 8 points.  For the group buff it increases others DA by 1.25% per point for a max 10% DA for the group.  Crusaders will be interested to go this line and the extra 2 points to get fearless morale wont feel expensive when you are already spending points to get your double attack.

[Arkinon]

<cite>OrcSlayer96 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Fidelus@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>1. Turn back the clock to Divine Favor, useless since DoF (2005). Remove the penalty, make it a toggle buff with an immunity but no duration, kind of like the Hand of Death from SoH. If we are not going to have a reliable stoneskin, give us our own personal death-save that actually works. </p><p>2. Divine Aura...remove the 50%, nuff said.</p><p>3. Not AA or spell related- but improve itemization. Poor set bonuses, lacking Epic. </p></blockquote>Been a while since i quoted a Fidelus post, but i would mostly agree with him on the above stuff, with some alterations and options:Divine Favor has never had a upgrade to it like Sigil of Heriosm, change the heal from ~1400 M1 to at least 25% heal if you plan not to have any temp mit buff or damage reduction to it. Like Fidelus said, make it toggleable with a 30 min recast after it procs. With how SOE likes a penalty to us, remove the 12 sec stifle/daze and replace with a root. We don't plan on running away and this would allow us to use our protective abilities/taunt/damage. With it as a percentage of max health, it would properly scale instead of losing its use as you go past the useable level.Divine Aura: Either remove the 50% damage max of max health or halve the recast time on it. So it would either be 100 % protection for 10 seconds every 10 minutes or 50% protection for 10 seconds on a base time of 5 mins. I would prefer the 100% coverage with 10 min reuse but i am flexable to the recast reduction.Aura of Leadership: People complaining about Fearless Morale really should complain about this AA, Fearless Morale in itself is okay for a end ability, grants immunity to fear for us against more and more mobs in game, gives a 2% groupwide buff to all heals/wards/spells/melee damage. On the other hand, not even berserkers like health regen, and the amount on this group ability is at best subpar, even factoring in the additional health regen bonus you can pus your group mates up with. Replace this with a self ability with a reduced ability to group that increases double attack percentages. for the self portion it increases 7.5% DA per point for a total of 60% at 8 points. For the group buff it increases others DA by 1.25% per point for a max 10% DA for the group. Crusaders will be interested to go this line and the extra 2 points to get fearless morale wont feel expensive when you are already spending points to get your double attack.</blockquote>/agreeThat is all.

[Caetrel]

<p>Hey Steel.  Think the last time we talked we were swinging Vrak clubs, it's been awhile.</p><p>I would highly favor a small amount of group double attack over a large amount of personal DA.   This would give us more group usefulness, which we lack.  </p><p>Our current state of double attack is not that bad if you raid.  I have 18 from armor and jewelry.  Jewel of Animosity procs 25, this is a must have even when tanking.  Add in bard DA, Mythical Illy, and 4 piece VP set bonus you can get into the 70s.  With a DA weapon like Doombringer 80s is possible.   If you know who Onra is, he posted a screenie of everything capped except spell crit on flames.  It is possible.  We just don't have the huge AA double attack that others get.</p>

[Maveric_LOL]

<p>1. Divine Aura - Think enough has already been said on that. The 50% limitation is a real pain it needs to be modified either with the 50% limit removed, or increased or have it act like dmg reduction (reduces the incomming dmg by up to 50% of the paladins HP for example) etc. Timer of course would depend on its new form as obvously an ability that gives 10 seconds full immunity would be on a 10 min timer for arguments sake vs a version thats not quiet so powerfull.</p><p>2. Divine favor - the penalty can stay you can just click it off anyway, however i think everyone agrees it needs to be updated it needs to at the least heal more and i have always said that the 30 min recast is a bit rediculous. If its gonna be 30 mins it should be a spell that stays up untill it triggers with the timer starting at cast time, not trigger time and it should stack properly with priest death saves, pointless to have DF and priest death save all proc at the same time.</p><p>3. Aura of leadership & Battle Leadership- That HP regen needs to be changed to power regen, then it might be usefull the HP regen while a good idea makes no difference at all when raid mobs are hitting you for as much as they do. </p><p>As it stands i only have the WIZ line saved on mirror for tanking  a few mobs like sathir. I think though that if for example you added double attack & parry to battle leadership (either in the same quantity as the other skills or at a slightly lower quantity) or added 1 or 2 shield block per point in battle leadership every crusader in game would be specing wiz, 10 shield block and 38 double attack (if you put 8 pts in battle leadership for example) would be a must have.</p>

[OrcSlayer96]

<cite>Fidelus@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Hey Steel. Think the last time we talked we were swinging Vrak clubs, it's been awhile.</p><p>I would highly favor a small amount of group double attack over a large amount of personal DA. This would give us more group usefulness, which we lack. </p><p>Our current state of double attack is not that bad if you raid. I have 18 from armor and jewelry. Jewel of Animosity procs 25, this is a must have even when tanking. Add in bard DA, Mythical Illy, and 4 piece VP set bonus you can get into the 70s. With a DA weapon like Doombringer 80s is possible. If you know who Onra is, he posted a screenie of everything capped except spell crit on flames. It is possible. We just don't have the huge AA double attack that others get.</p></blockquote>I still keep Vraksakin Club, and various other expansion weapons in my vault, the work involved in getting them make it almost sacrilage to transmute them or offer to the altar.  Maybe i didnt state it right, but on the double attack replacing the health regen on the wisdom line i meant having both the group DA and self DA, the paladin would be immune to the group version, That way we have a utility bonus and a way to increase our damage personally.  I am against changing the aura to power regen, as that could spawn a ton of flak from the 4 classes that normally provide this, plus SOE may decide that is so powerful that they dont want to address some of our requested tweaks to our class for the next expansion.  Onra is a extreme example on what we can do as a paladin, and the proposed change on double attack, could mean that he exchanges double attack heavy gear with better procs on other gear.I guess the way i look at it is, the warrior side can pretty much obtain similar results on their people by using the same gear pretty much Onra has obtained and have close to if not better than 100 DA.  If it is allowed in their AA lines, why not allow that as a option in ours?  If Onra is already close to max on double attack, he might decide to go in AGI line or other ares to max out stuff he may not be close to capping, but as i said earlier, he is in the 1% range of the total paladins on what they can push out due to gear.  I think all of us agree that the health regen aura is next to worthless aa...<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I am going to cheat some and add a few other wishes on our list, either change the native rez spell to have at least 5 meter range or allow it on the our aa line versus the quicker restored power option/quicker recast.  If they want to keep the range to 1 meter, please make it rez sickess effect free and i guarantee our utulity would be increased on this.  If you make a poll asking how many paladins like our 1 meter range rez, you will find that they wish it was reverted back to the 10 meter range, especially with the more vertical axis issues of EOF and ROK.Change our former 2 handeed strike only line of combat arts to either do double damage on undead or have a mit debuff component on it.  As it stands now, unless you spec as a couple races, you only can debuff divine mitigation and a physical mit debuff would be nice.  When they removed requires 2 handed  attack only, the over nerfed the damage on it and the power cost versus damage done makes it pretty weak combat art of ours.The asking for divine favor to not conflict with a cleric or brawler death prevent is a tricky request, as it is now the fact that any death prevent consumes all others cast on the target when one of them triggers.  This would require a gamewide change in their coding to make them be exclusive(could be done i am sure but what are the odds in a timely manner).  Sure we can currently cancel the harmful effect of stifle, but there is no guarantee that a dev wont tweaked that from being prohibited in the future.  I would rather have it hit is with a detrimental effect that doesnt nullify our casting capability to play it safe for the future.

[Vain]

Divine Aura (as above) Divine Favour (as above) Bayle's Leadership (Can a raid-wide buff be any more useless than this? Give us something crusader-like... perhaps a fear/control-resist bonus along with the +heals, although I'm not a big fan of the +heals, but it is better than the Wis buff) Oh, and maybe make it so Holy Ground can be cast on the run.

[Meirril]

<p>3 changes to paladin spells? Sure.</p><p>1) Change all spells to Combat Arts. Adjust recast timers as appropriate.</p><p>2) Change all class spell bonuses to CA bonuses, optionally have CA bonuses add to healing amounts since they are now CAs too.</p><p>3) add a +10% heal/damage modifier to all Combat Arts when we have a 2 handed weapon equipped.</p><p> I think that's a good start. Changes paladins from needing 5 stats to 4 stats (replaces int with str for bonus damage on current spells). Eliminates the desire for both +CA damage and +spell damage items.</p>

[Maveric_LOL]

<p>After giving it some thought i have come up with a revised list which excludes Divine Favor and the wiz aa line for several reasons. DF has been useless for so long its not even on 95% of paladins hotbars anymore and to change that they would have to make a huge change to it and i just dont see that happening and even then its one of those things where....if your counting on DF to save you all the time you probably have other issues you need to fix first. As for the wizdom line i think everyone knows that its only usefull for 1 AA in that line (end aa) on certain mobs and it has been so for so long that either the dev's know about it and they think the trade off of the other sucky AA's is a fair trade for full time fear immunity, or they just plain dont care. I am sadly inclined to think the latter because we haven not even seen a dev respond to our concerns in ages, who ever they have overseeing paladins is clearly asleep at the helm.</p><p>I like many see nerfs that affect such as SoGD that affect paladins to a greater degree than warriors and see nothing at all being done to mitigate the impact to us and I am left thinking that our representative stoped paying attention and or arguing our class balance case long ago and i cant help but wondering if the same nerf had affected guardians more than paladins what would have been the outcome.</p><p>If however, the dev gods care to grace us with their presence here is my revised list:</p><p>1. DA : See previous post.</p><p>2. Defensive stance: Guards get the same amount of defense as we get AND they get parry. Either give us the same amount of parry they have, or give us an equivalant amount of shield block (if you determine +15 block = 35 parry or what ever, so be it). TBH i would more go for the shield block. Give us that and it would effectivly end 90% of the cries for more avoidance. If you equal us out in that reguard our Hero AA will make up the rest of the difference and put us back roughly on par with the guardians avoidance wise. It makes me mad when you compare for example a paladin and a guardian (solo) in <u>identical</u> raid gear and avoid food, shield etc side by side and the guardian has easily 7% more avoid. Some differene is one thing, but 7% come on thats huge. What are we given to make up for this avoid difference cause im not seeing anything to make up for that.</p><p> 3. Make our wards un interuptable and turn them into dmg reduction instead of true ward, hell if you want to be kind you could make it so the self compoent is a dmg reduction and then there is a grp wide 'regular ward' component. If our wards are supposed to be our equivalant to the guards mitigation temp buffs then you owe us some love in that department because it dosent even come close to being equivalant. </p>