Bruising cry, an honest look at our raid buff.

[evilgamer]

<p>To be completely honest its really not that bad, in fact I am beginning to think it makes an ok <u>group buff.</u></p><p>The problem is that given the context of dirge, coercer, swash and other aggro transfers and buffs, it just isnt necessary for raids.</p><p>The fact that guardians are no longer a low dps class either also makes it less important.  Guardian dps is above paladin, sk dps and just below zerkers.</p><p>Now if they nerfed dirge and coercer hate buffs from stacking, it might be more useful, but guardian dps is so good now, taunts are just not what they used to be.</p><p>I think it would be useful on a raid with less then optimal set up, maybee a pick up raid, but other then that its just not very useful.  </p><p>Honestly the toons that probably get the most out this buff are lower level bruisers that do not have the best gear, helping their taunts to be a bit more effective when tanking for groups.  Also most groups rarely have an "ideal" make up, alot of times I run groups with no aggro buffing/threat transfering classes, this does help in that context.</p><p>Another problem is that EQ 2 is a dps happy game, it seems the parse is the judge of raid/group performance these days and even tanks are expected to put out good numbers.  </p><p>Due to this mentality, many tanks now spec for dps, and bacially ignore their tuants.  This works but it does generally lowers ones survivability, the trade off being a few more group wipes here and there for a few more faster runs through dungeons and instances.</p><p>Overall I think this is a marginally useful buff for pick up groups and not much else really.  Given the make up of most raids, given todays current mechanics, its just not that useful.</p>

[Aull]

<p>I am glad that we have it cause it beats not having nothing at all. However, what I am finding out is that as bruisers obtain more and more +damage to combat arts it could be possible to cap this +damage and then it makes the +112 to combat arts worthless. In the last expansion the master version I think it was rabid cry gave 20% effectiveness to taunt/detaunts and 89.6 to combat arts. Now in ROK the only value that changed is the +89.6 to 112 and the percentage has remained the same at 20%.</p><p>Not that this would make a huge difference but if the 20% became 25% for the ROK expansion version bruising cry that would be a slight improvement, but again I don't think it will make or break the raid either.</p><p>I think that with all the + to combat damage items any fighters can reach +112 very easy. Now if this was to be changed back to a dps modifier like 25% effectiveness to taunt/detaunts and +35 to dps mod this would better. I am sure other ideas are better than what I have just given.</p><p>I am glad we at least have this for now. If we didn't what would we have?</p>

[evilgamer]

<cite>Aull wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I am glad that we have it cause it beats not having nothing at all. However, what I am finding out is that as bruisers obtain more and more +damage to combat arts it could be possible to cap this +damage and then it makes the +112 to combat arts worthless. In the last expansion the master version I think it was rabid cry gave 20% effectiveness to taunt/detaunts and 89.6 to combat arts. Now in ROK the only value that changed is the +89.6 to 112 and the percentage has remained the same at 20%.</p><p>Not that this would make a huge difference but if the 20% became 25% for the ROK expansion version bruising cry that would be a slight improvement, but again I don't think it will make or break the raid either.</p><p>I think that with all the + to combat damage items any fighters can reach +112 very easy. Now if this was to be changed back to a dps modifier like 25% effectiveness to taunt/detaunts and +35 to dps mod this would better. I am sure other ideas are better than what I have just given.</p><p>I am glad we at least have this for now. If we didn't what would we have?</p></blockquote><p>Yeah I think if it matched  monks haste that would be fair.</p><p>If monks can buff attack haste  and spell haste by 24% and 15% I think we should be able to buff dps by 24% and reuse timers by 15%.</p><p>That would be completely fair imo and make our raid desirablity better then what it is.</p><p>Think about it, illusionist buff haste, coercer dps, dirge does dps, troub does haste, monk does  haste and bruiser can do dps.</p>

[Quicksilver74]

<p>the CA mod is broken, and is kinda worthless as it is.  It does not show up in your dynamicdata under meleemod, and does not apply properly to some CA's.  Plus there is so much +CA gear, it is very easy to cap your CA mod and have this buff go to complete waste.  </p><p>  Word on the street (Temple street, to be precise), is that we are getting the taunt mod to change to be ability re-use mod, but we can only speculate to the percentage.  I'd say something like 10-12% would be about right.  I would much rather see the CA damage mod changed back to DPS also, even if it's a small amount of DPS, like 10%.  </p>

[Tanino]

What is the current cap on the plus to Combat Arts and Spell Damage?  I don't have a huge problem with the raid wide buff as a whole just brawlers are one of the few classes that don't offer a group buff.  I use taunts and detaunts like crazy when I am doing instances, but for a raid it probably has minimal impact. 

[Junaru]

<cite>Tanino wrote:</cite><blockquote>What is the current cap on the plus to Combat Arts and Spell Damage? I don't have a huge problem with the raid wide buff as a whole just brawlers are one of the few classes that don't offer a group buff. I use taunts and detaunts like crazy when I am doing instances, but for a raid it probably has minimal impact. </blockquote> I believe the cap is 1/2 the max damage of a CA. So if you have a CA that has a damage range of 650 - 1000 the max your +CA for that CA is 500. In DPS gear I sit at 345 +CA. I can get 370 +CA but I lose crit and DA making it not worth it. The worse part of the Bruiser buff is it helps Monks out more then Bruisers since we cast more CA per fight then a Bruiser. Oddly enough that +112 really does boost my DPS enough to notice. Sadly most classes don't get the same results making it feel more worthless then it is. As for the reuse timer. I hope you get it but my personal feeling is 12% might be a bit much. 8% to 10% would be more inline. I'd love for it to be 12% cause it would help my DPS out a ton but you never want something that might get nerfed later. Also change it back to DPS isn't all that great. Realise the reason it was changed in the first place was cause DPS only helps melee. When they changed the Monk version from just haste to haste + spell haste it helped all classes. Bruisers need something to do the same.

[Aull]

<p>I agree with you Junaru. If this ever really happens I think 12% would be great maybe at the master lvl but 10% would be more appropriate. 8% for the adept III version. Not to sound negative but where did all this talk of a +reuse timers for bruiser bruising cry originate? I cannot find a single official post about such wonderful idea for bruisers.</p><p>I wouldn't care if it only gave reuse to combat arts either. Shadowknights could give a +reuse to spells to help them have some viability as well. I feel that if bruisers had both +reuse to ca's and spells that would be leaving out a potential benefit to the sk class and they need some help on this as much as we do. I don't think anyone could deny that.</p><p>Not saying monks should get nerfed but I think in reality monks raid buff should have given only melee haste and the spell haste should have been given to the paladins, but it is to late for that now.</p><p>Just my opinions.</p>