Considering a Logitech G15? Read On. [Archive]

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G15_user

07-08-2008, 09:01 PM

So many forums out there, so little time.Some say it's OK. Some say it's not. Some call people names. Some people call other people names. When I searched for information on the G15 in the *SOE* forums, what I found was, to say the least, lacking.Therefore, I thought I would share my own personal experience with two different SOE GMS.This is not a rant.This is not a "I'm taking my ball and going home" post. I've been here close to 3 years I'm not leaving any time soon.This is simply informational. Thank you.The names have been changed to protect the innocent.The players:GM #1GM #2and Me.Me:I currently four box four accounts, two accounts on two different computers. I pay 4 subscription fees a month. I am thinking about upgrading to 6 accounts. My question is the issue of (program name hereby deleted). Currently, I push a button, alt tab, push a button, switch to computer #2, push a button, alt tab, push a button. (Said Program) would allow me to set up to where (really cool idea deleted by the editor!) Some forums say legal. Some forums say illegal. I need it from SOE, Please! I am NOT looking to have some sort of program where I fight and go make a sandwich. I would like to streamline my casting, however. Thanks so much for your response.-------------------------------------------------------------GM#1I like to inform you that boxing the characters in the game manually is allowed and not considered illegal but running all the characters on some sort of software is an exploit and violates the play nice policy of EverQuest II. If found exploiting the game by using these sorts of unfair means, account disciplinary action can be taken that can lead to permanent revocation of the accounts. I hope this information will help you in resolving any query you may have had.--------------------------------------------------------------Me ResponseWhat about the use of a G15 Logitech Keyboard for recording macros? From your clarification, it looks like the use of hardware to have a macro, then alt tab, and then macro and alt tab is still legal? Although I would have to record a macro in the G15 software. Can you understand my predicament? lol just wanna stay legal!-------------------------------------------------------------GM#1 sends petition RE: G15 to GM#2-------------------------------------------------------------GM#2 slightly misreads question, but here's the response:I am not able to make an official ruling on whether or not (The program that GM#1 said NO to) is legal or not, however, if you are able to do so with the existing macro system in game, everything should be fine.--------------------------------------------------------------MeGM #1 already gave me information on the use of (program name deliberately removed. see a pattern here botters?). I'm going to err on the side of caution and forget that I ever saw that program. My question is now in regards to the use of a Logitech G15 Keyboard which allows me to create macros to streamline my casting. To give an example, I have heard it is possible to make a macro (does something way cool) Keep in mind, both of you, that I am *not* attempting to bot, run scripts, make level 80 in 3 days, or violate any policies or anything. If I am awake, I'm pretty much in front of my computer on one toon or another doing SOMETHING. Personally, I think SOE should be much more aggressive with attempting to catch these people that use these programs such as (did you think I'd forget the program name here? nahhhhhhh). Taking a bit from GM #2, can I assume the G15 is ILLEGAL, since, it would be using hardware/programming outside of the realm of the EQ2 macro system? Thanks again, both of you for being... so blunt AND timely with your responses.-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------GM #2You are correct, anything that creates a macro outside of the game is considered 3rd party and is not allowed. Hope this answers you latest question.-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------So there you have it. I hope that you, the reader, perhaps googled information about the G15 and came upon this post. I wish I had. I have $70 piece of hardware that displays how bad my parse sucks in raid on a tiny [Removed for Content] screen that you need programmer glasses to see, functions as a keyboard, and does nothing else (legally). If this wasn't bought with a gift certificate thru amazon.com I'd probably try to return it. Don't know if it would be worth the hassle, though.

Zarador

07-08-2008, 09:46 PM

Don't really know what to tell you other than I think the mix of third party software + a gaming keyboard = NO, but the use of a gaming keyboard after the conversation about the NO software entered a gray area where they sided to the side of caution. Frankly, I have never heard of anyone using a G-15 by itself with the recordable macros getting in any trouble, but then again, I'm not sure about the complexity or purpose of the Macro's your describing. Most the people I know with G-15 will use it for a pull (starter chain, something to the effect of snare, dot, dot, nuke) or simply to do three pulls off a node with one stroke. All of which of course is run attended by the user. EDIT: I would add that they (SoE) developed G-15 Support for Vanguard and Everquest II, so it would seem odd that the use of such keyboards in the normal fashion would be against Eula. I mean, why would they program a feature usable only on the Logitech Gaming Keyboards if they were not permitted to be used in the Eula? I almost feel like your question was interpreted as "If I use Nitrous Oxide in my stock corvette to do 150 mph down the local highway would that be illegal?" which they replied to as "Yes" so you determined that it's clearly illegal to own and operate a corvette.

G15_user

07-08-2008, 10:58 PM

An excellent analogy about the corvette! Allow me to clarify:Not that the keyboard *itself* is illegal, but use of the third party software. I can buy a keyboard for 10 bucks at the store, or I can buy a fancy G15 for 70 bucks. I'm just trying to save someone the 70 bucks if they are getting a G15 for the abilities the software allows you to do.I have never heard of any one being banned for any software, illegal included. I don't intend on being the first, though!

TSR-DanielH

07-08-2008, 11:06 PM

Greetings,The rules when it comes to this sort of thing are intentionally vague to allow interpretation. Basically, if it violates the spirit of fair play then you probably shouldn't be doing it. If you're doing something like that you probably know what you're doing is wrong. Personally, I see the line at whether or not you are actually playing the game. Anything that automates the game to the point where you don't need to be there is a violation. I wouldn't see a G15 as a violation assuming you don't set out to use it as a way to violate policy. By this interpretation, things like putting your summoner pet on autoattack and walking away would also be considered a violation.To be completely technical about the whole thing, here's the rules word for word:You may not use any software to modify the Software to change Game play. You may not create, facilitate, host, link to or provide any other means through which the Game may be played by others, such as through server emulators. You may not decrypt or modify any data transmitted between client and server and you may not use, post, host or distribute macros, “bots” or other programs which would allow unattended game play or which otherwise impact game play. You may not take any action which imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on our infrastructure. Except in connection with Station Exchange and subject to all of the provisions of the Station Exchange Service Agreement, you may not buy, sell or auction (or host or facilitate the ability to allow others to buy, sell or auction) any Game account, characters, items, coin or copyrighted material or any other intellectual property owned or controlled by us or our licensors without first obtaining our express written permission. Hope this helps