exile faction is making factioned players leave game [Archive]

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Buttcliffe

06-16-2008, 09:16 PM

simple as stated.

ulleulle

06-16-2008, 10:03 PM

No!! the lowbi twinks was getting ppl to leave the game remember ??back when the srv was always in red and with more then one zone with multiple copys open =)Serious here for a sec.Not too sure that exiles are the sole cause of this,even tho it just seems like a [I cannot control my vocabulary] joke to have a faction with all classes in a game where the major bulk of the players are limited to only one faction to group with .I mean why would this even be an option when we all know that this game is all about putting the right classes together to succed..[I cannot control my vocabulary] this is one of the cornerstones in this game..I couldent care less if exiled maintained raid dominace for the rest of eq2 pvp. What i care about is playing the game under basic equal rules..1)Remove exile as a faction. ( Dosent seem like a good idea on the surface)2)Make all classes open for all factions. (Hmm,cant really decide about this.But i guess it does make the most sense upfront)3)Dont allow evil exiled to group/raid with good exiled and vice verca. (Again not to sure,will punish ppl in exiled upfront,but will also put them on the same playing ground as the rest of us) want a silly signet? then go freeport or qeynos,just dont say that the signets we get makes up for not having sanctuary in a freeport pvp group =)Neutral classes will count as what faction they came from.e.a exiled from qeynos to haven then you cant group with evil players in haven.P.s About sanctuary,almost every single t8 group pvp movie i have seen and alot of the fights i have been involved in has the templar popping sancturary at the beginning of every single fight.I guess you have to be on the recieving end of sanctary combined with good taunts and heavy CC to understand how silly it is .Immune immune immune dead.There hasent been a decent freeport pvp group since the reinvention of the templar as main healer in any decent pvp group. .Just a fluke or is it a sign./ramble offCheers

Shadow_Viper

06-16-2008, 10:06 PM

Here are my two simple suggestions to "address" the issue.1) Restrict exiled players from entering raid zones.2) Remove creature comforts from haven; broker, banker, merchants, crafting stations, etc.

ulleulle

06-16-2008, 10:11 PM

<cite>Shadow_Viper wrote:</cite><blockquote>Here are my two simple suggestions to "address" the issue.1) Restrict exiled players from entering raid zones.2) Remove creature comforts from haven; broker, banker, merchants, crafting stations, etc.</blockquote>Nr 1 looks nasty =)Without pvp gear it will truly be hard mode as exiled should be =)Nr 2 .Will kill the faction completly and that would be sad overall imho.i like the flavour that faction brings,i just dont like it when they get diffrent rules on cornerstone concepts of the game.Cheers

Greggthegrmreapr

06-17-2008, 04:53 AM

Or you can stop complaining about the exiles having better stuff, raid 5 nights a week for hours at a time, learn the strats, and kill the same mobs. Being exile doesn not make you instant win. Case in point resurrection and Nexus have both been in exile for awhile and resurrection even with their illbegotten mythicals have just now killed Drushk and have yet to kill Nexona. I have yet to see a city guild put the effort into raiding that Kraken and Onyx did and now that VV does, and yet you all complain about the rewards we get for it instead of getting them yourselves.Take that x4 off the KP docks 5 nights a week and in a few months you may be through VP with some effort.

KatrinaDeath

06-17-2008, 06:12 AM

/agree with DennaDedication...

Szerian

06-17-2008, 07:21 AM

I think city players need to stop complaining, after all, what is the main reason most t8 "hardcore" city players don't want to leave the city?I'll bet my "52%-speed-horse-that-I-can't-buy-since-I'm-exiled" horse, that the main reason is pvp gear. What strikes me in particular is that a lot of city folk also say "boohoo exile is easy mode, open all the classes to cities". Does the irony strike anyone else? By staying in the city for pvp gear and demanding all classes they are just asking for "easier mode" (not that exile is easy mode in the first place...try Nexona -.-).Simply having a particular class in a raid does not make it effective, most of the time players in exile are some of the best players on the server who have spent a great deal of time and effort hand-picking gear for every slot and camping it faithfully, and thusly have also developed a great deal of skill in their class; therefore, it is not simply the fact that exiles have all classes, it is the fact that exiles in raid guilds know what they are doing and know how to raid effectively.This does not go without saying that city guilds cannot effectively raid. On Venekor Leibgarde des Hochfuersten, a Euro-based raid guild, did a great deal of raiding successfully, and I have high respect for them. Maybe all the whiners should take their example...Point being...suck it up city factions, surely you have some talent within your walls, unfortunately most of it is used writing bitter lamentations about how other people are better...

Paikis

06-17-2008, 07:31 AM

<cite>Szerian@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Surely you have some talent within your walls, unfortunately most of it is used writing bitter lamentations about how other people are better...</blockquote>We're not better than them Szerian, its just because we have all classes. The fact that we raid 4-5 nights a week with almost exactly the same people every night is IMATERIAL!! Oh, and Nexona is going down. 6% last time. We got that dragon's number. INC mythical spam! (Yes, all one update message!)

Szerian

06-17-2008, 07:39 AM

Oh yeah your right...All the 87 people online will tremble as I wield my mythical baby rattle!

Sightless

06-17-2008, 07:43 AM

Funny, VA couldn't get into VP until they exiled. You were honest about it until you got your first Mythicals. Now all of a sudden, everyone else sucks, and don't know their characters, and you guys are gods. /sigh

Wytie

06-17-2008, 09:55 AM

<cite>Sightless wrote:</cite><blockquote>you guys are gods. </blockquote>QFE <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

Faenril

06-17-2008, 10:11 AM

Just to refresh your memory a bit, you VA guys, here is what Peldaar posted some time ago in this thread, right after exiling Greywolves: <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?topic_id=408146" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=408146</a> " Every other guild that exiled did it for the PvP... at least as best as my bad memory holds. They all failed in the end I think because of that. They probably thought being in exile would give them non stop targets and it doesn't. Yes there is alot more but you have the same issues that you do in a city. People evac, run or stay immune most of the time. In Qeynos we were a raiding guild. We had alot of successful raids as a city guild but EoF definitely showed how tough it is on a city only raid guild. The biggest issue is keeping a consistant raid force and not having to try to reequip everyone, train them, etc. Thats what we experienced the most. We had over 100 unique accounts in GW but on any given day would only have a handful of extras. This meant we rotated alot of people so it was making our progression very slow. Most people couldn't make it to raids consistantly no matter what we tried. We had a good core group but that just isn't enough. You need a good raid all around especially in a city raid. Doing raids in RoK as Qeynos really showed the lack of character abilities that these encounters are designed for. It really showed that having the consistant raid force is still going to make it very painful to progress just because you don't have all the class abilities that the encounters are made for. Yes a city guild can and will complete most if not all the zones eventually but the difference that we have seen since exiling has been incredible to me. Mobs we couldn't touch or come close to as GW we killed in our first attempt as exile. The same mobs we barely did 30k dps on we broke 52k dps. With 42 unique accounts in VA and all the classes available it has made raiding alot more fun to me and I believe everyone else that exiled with us. After what we have experienced here so far I'd never go back to a city unless they opened all classes to the cities. I play the game for the end game but like the added bonus of PvP so I don't really care to go to a blue server. Being in exile is perfect for what I like out of the game. " I think it sums it up pretty well... 1) Yes you need a stable raid force and dedication to succeed. 2) Yes it makes it much easier with all classes. So in the end eveybody is right ? Anyway if the cities suck so bad and are not able to setup a decent raid, I don't see what's your problem with opening the classes... If they fail to raid because they plain suck or don't put the effort, as some of you suggest, they will still fail with all classes, right ? Or are you just afraid of giving up your advantage ?

Ashr

06-17-2008, 10:22 AM

<cite>Sightless wrote:</cite><blockquote>Funny, VA couldn't get into VP until they exiled. You were honest about it until you got your first Mythicals. Now all of a sudden, everyone else sucks, and don't know their characters, and you guys are gods. /sigh</blockquote>You are right we couldn't get to VP until we exiled. Until we exiled we couldn't get a constant raid force that didn't contain 50% slackers. Once we exiled that changed and it showed in our progression.As GW it would have taken us months to down overking - our raiders wouldn't have stood for the back to back pulls. It was expensive, it was frustrating, and it took alot of dedication to down overking. In the city our raiders would have just not logged in. That changed when we exiled - we recruited more like minded raiders, raiders that wouldn't slack and spent the time to make their character better.Having access to all classes did make a difference, but the majority of our freeport classes actually came from GW - they betrayed the day we exiled, so they had to learn a whole new class.Everytime we would put exiling on the table I would remind everyone that Exiling would not change a thing unless the culture of our raid force changed. You will not progress quickly if you raid casually. Most raid forces will not put up with progression, because they want gear. When you are learning a new mob, that is all you do. You don't take a break and say oh lets go clear SoH for loots.

Ashr

06-17-2008, 10:25 AM

<cite>Faerie@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote> I think it sums it up pretty well... 1) Yes you need a stable raid force and dedication to succeed. 2) Yes it makes it much easier with all classes. So in the end eveybody is right ? Anyway if the cities suck so bad and are not able to setup a decent raid, I don't see what's your problem with opening the classes... If they fail to raid because they plain suck or don't put the effort, as some of you suggest, they will still fail with all classes, right ? Or are you just afraid of giving up your advantage ?</blockquote>I think every exile is 100% for allowing the factions access to all classes. We never say otherwise. In fact, I'd be willing to say that we are some of the biggest proponents of it.Its the city folk who make threads like this one, with subjects: "Exile faction is making factioned players leave game.". City folk who attack us for minding our own business.

Izzypop

06-17-2008, 10:35 AM

<cite>Exile faction is causing the players to leave cities not the game.Denna@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Or you can stop complaining about the exiles having better stuff, raid 5 nights a week for hours at a time, learn the strats, and kill the same mobs. Being exile doesn not make you instant win. Case in point resurrection and Nexus have both been in exile for awhile and resurrection even with their illbegotten mythicals have just now killed Drushk and have yet to kill Nexona. I have yet to see a city guild put the effort into raiding that Kraken and Onyx did and now that VV does, and yet you all complain about the rewards we get for it instead of getting them yourselves.Take that x4 off the KP docks 5 nights a week and in a few months you may be through VP with some effort.</blockquote>What Denna just said goes to prove my point.Ressssurrection and Nexus are exile to raid because it is more difficult for a city faction guild to beat VP. The only city faction guild to ever do it already beat VP in exile, had the mobs down on farm status, and ended up going back to exile within a month of leaving. Guilds like Nexus and Ressssurrection are only in exile because they want to raid end game. Given that they can't yet beat VP in exile how much more difficult would it be on them to try to do it in a city? Exiles from successful raid guilds like VV are the 1st to point out that it takes a lot of time and hard work to beat VP and that you have to give 100% to succeed, but the sad truth is a guilds 100% is greater if they are exiled than if they are in a city.What would happen if the X4 leaves the KP docks and city factions start raiding like VV does? The answer is they would progress, but slower than they would if the guild was exiled. Every single member of the guild would realize that they are doing things the hard way and moral would crumble. Those most serious and dedicated to beating VP for their mythical would press forward with the idea of moving the guild to exile, and either the guild takes their idea and Haven becomes more crowded or their idea is crushed they will eye exile guilds for an open spot to apply for. The guilds progression would then slow down or go backwords as key members of their raidforce desert their city guild for an exile guild. A guild only survive stagnant or backwords progression for so long before the guild it's self collapses or they just give up and they all go back to the KP docks with their x4 to farm pvp tokens.

Gimet

06-17-2008, 10:45 AM

Exile= Successful RaidingCity People= Find that appealingCity people leave for exile.City people bring friends with them.Good raiders and gone from city.Exiles say it's not their fault.Exiles say exile, or raid better in city.City factions don't have the people to do that.City factions move whole guilds to exile.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders.It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored.Exile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.

Wytie

06-17-2008, 11:11 AM

<cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huhCity People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileCity people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadExiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or anotherCity factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it?It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...</blockquote>

Ashr

06-17-2008, 11:19 AM

Hypothetical here for you.Say a Qeynos guild clears VP and gets their Mythicals. The next thread would be about how Qeynos faction is making players leave the game and that all of freeport is moving to qeynos to raid in easymode (I.E Mythicals + PvP gear) and how now Freeport is a dieing faction.On the flip side, say it was a Freeport guild that cleared VP.

Izzypop

06-17-2008, 11:31 AM

<cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huh# of city guilds that earned their mythicals=0City People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileI know exiled players that would like to successfully raid in a city, but not city players that wish they were exiled but don't do it.City people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadThus every city guild looses their best raiders to exile because it's better for raiding. City guilds will never be able to progress while loosing their best raiders.Exiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or another.Raid better in a city isn't an option as city guilds will just loose their best raiders to exile. Only option left is go exile.City factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?The problem is city factions are pretty much forced to exile in order to compete.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it? It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...This just goes to prove my point. If you want to raid worth a [Removed for Content] in the end game you must go exile. City factions need access to critical classes to be fixed.</blockquote></blockquote>

Wytie

06-17-2008, 11:41 AM

<cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huh# of city guilds that earned their mythicals=0number of exiles with pvp gear 0City People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileI know exiled players that would like to successfully raid in a city, but not city players that wish they were exiled but don't do it.Sure who wouldnt want raid and pvp gear?City people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadThus every city guild looses their best raiders to exile because it's better for raiding. City guilds will never be able to progress while loosing their best raiders.Exactly the reason I satated above, the good raiders get tired of failing because the rest of the raid isnt doing what they should during raid and when there not raiding to maximixe their potentialExiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or another.Raid better in a city isn't an option as city guilds will just loose their best raiders to exile. Only option left is go exile.At this point Id say yesCity factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?The problem is city factions are pretty much forced to exile in order to compete.Compete with what? PVP gear serves it purpose and you get to pick which peices you want to buy. Raiding is really a bonus for citys as pvp is a bonus for exiles.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it? It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...This just goes to prove my point. If you want to raid worth a [I cannot control my vocabulary] in the end game you must go exile. City factions need access to critical classes to be fixed.At this point I still have to agree, even in exile raiding is still very hard, it is theres just no way around it.</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>

Izzypop

06-17-2008, 11:48 AM

<cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huh# of city guilds that earned their mythicals=0number of exiles with pvp gear 0City People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileI know exiled players that would like to successfully raid in a city, but not city players that wish they were exiled but don't do it.Sure who wouldnt want raid and pvp gear?City people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadThus every city guild looses their best raiders to exile because it's better for raiding. City guilds will never be able to progress while loosing their best raiders.Exactly the reason I satated above, the good raiders get tired of failing because the rest of the raid isnt doing what they should during raid and when there not raiding to maximixe their potentialExiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or another.Raid better in a city isn't an option as city guilds will just loose their best raiders to exile. Only option left is go exile.At this point Id say yesCity factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?The problem is city factions are pretty much forced to exile in order to compete.Compete with what? PVP gear serves it purpose and you get to pick which peices you want to buy. Raiding is really a bonus for citys as pvp is a bonus for exiles.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it? It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...This just goes to prove my point. If you want to raid worth a [I cannot control my vocabulary] in the end game you must go exile. City factions need access to critical classes to be fixed.At this point I still have to agree, even in exile raiding is still very hard, it is theres just no way around it.</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>Yep so what do we do now?Support the status quo and keep city factions as a newbie yard until toons hit level 80 and are ready to go exile to raid.Or support giving city factions access to critical classes so they can compete with exiles in raiding.

Ashr

06-17-2008, 11:50 AM

We keep saying it, give the cities all classes.

Ashr

06-17-2008, 11:55 AM

<cite>Synter@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Say a Qeynos guild clears VP and gets their Mythicals. The next thread would be about how Qeynos faction is making players leave the game and that all of freeport is moving to qeynos to raid in easymode (I.E Mythicals + PvP gear) and how now Freeport is a dieing faction.On the flip side, say it was a Freeport guild that cleared VP.</blockquote>QFE Because no one seems to have seen it.... Oh thats right, this makes peoples head break right?

ulleulle

06-17-2008, 12:07 PM

I cant understand how you exiled got your big head thru the forum doors,cause d a m n i have never seen so much hot air in a a long time.How dare you tell people that exiled is not easy and city folk should just step up when NOBODY as of yet has proven that it actually can be done,.And dont say kraken did okay,they came with full strats and way way way better gear then what city folks are trying to clear t8 raid with..Its called logic btw...Also you know how sad it looks to outside people reading this.Here you have one group of people with special rules telling other people that dont play under the same rules .that they are essentially bad players and they all should just step up.I guess you have to be one of the "cool" kids to not see that how silly it is..And besides PPLTake your stupid raid and go pork a duck.its nothing but a [I cannot control my vocabulary] script made up by a developer so you guys can get a totally inflated sense of self esteem,Go out and pvp vs other players that have a brain, that can make up new move,s and dont do the same over and over and over and over and over and over and over..Who cares if you got more classes to kill pixel dragoons ,,seriously check yourself and start think about the diffrence it makes in open pvp??i said else where on this forum i couldent care less if exiles maintained raid dominance for the rest of eq2.But dont tell people that they dont need what you allrdy got given to you by the makers of the game okay !!You dont understand that this could just aswell be a race and your car has 4 of the best tires,and we have only 2 wheels with the best set of tires out there to compete with you on the same track and for the same prize money..seems fair ?? Hehe gotta love irl comparrisons =)We all pay the exact same amount of money here..Its a game where the end goal is to make ppl have fun so they dont leave for another game..And besides think about the bragging rights you guys could have if all people played under exact same rules as you and still couldent succed by a long shot..Oh man then you ego´s would actually mean something =)Cheers

Wytie

06-17-2008, 12:07 PM

<cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huh# of city guilds that earned their mythicals=0number of exiles with pvp gear 0City People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileI know exiled players that would like to successfully raid in a city, but not city players that wish they were exiled but don't do it.Sure who wouldnt want raid and pvp gear?City people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadThus every city guild looses their best raiders to exile because it's better for raiding. City guilds will never be able to progress while loosing their best raiders.Exactly the reason I satated above, the good raiders get tired of failing because the rest of the raid isnt doing what they should during raid and when there not raiding to maximixe their potentialExiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or another.Raid better in a city isn't an option as city guilds will just loose their best raiders to exile. Only option left is go exile.At this point Id say yesCity factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?The problem is city factions are pretty much forced to exile in order to compete.Compete with what? PVP gear serves it purpose and you get to pick which peices you want to buy. Raiding is really a bonus for citys as pvp is a bonus for exiles.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it? It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...This just goes to prove my point. If you want to raid worth a [I cannot control my vocabulary] in the end game you must go exile. City factions need access to critical classes to be fixed.At this point I still have to agree, even in exile raiding is still very hard, it is theres just no way around it.</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>Yep so what do we do now?Support the status quo and keep city factions as a newbie yard until toons hit level 80 and are ready to go exile to raid.Or support giving city factions access to critical classes so they can compete with exiles in raiding.</blockquote>Its simple, you just have to choose one or the other just like everyone else, till SOE changes otherwise.If you want a challenge pvp gear and city rewards you stay in the city.If you want to have a CHANCE to raid end game content successfuly you find an exile guild that gives you the best chance to do so, and hope you can put forth the effort required to do so.Its that simple really, well until it changes, right now everyone has a choice and that have to pick one or the other.TBH even if they did allow key classes on all sides you would only see a very small change in city progress, because in the end the citys would find it takes a hell of alot MORE than key classes to progress. Then the exiles would most likely LOL in the citys face because most of them couldnt make it with key classes, and pvp gear.So then the citys would blame SOE for not allowing ALL classes to all side since the exiles get it, and would be a constant cycle of excuses for failing....

Wytie

06-17-2008, 12:12 PM

<cite>ulleulle wrote:</cite><blockquote>I cant understand how you exiled got your big head thru the forum doors,cause d a m n i have never seen so much hot air in a a long time.How dare you tell people that exiled is not easy and city folk should just step up when NOBODY as of yet has proven that it actually can be done,.And dont say kraken did okay,they came with full strats and way way way better gear then what city folks are trying to clear t8 raid with..Its called logic btw...Also you know how sad it looks to outside people reading this.Here you have one group of people with special rules telling other people that dont play under the same rules .that they are essentially bad players and they all should just step up.I guess you have to be one of the "cool" kids to not see that how silly it is..And besides PPLTake your stupid raid and go pork a duck.its nothing but a [I cannot control my vocabulary] script made up by a developer so you guys can get a totally inflated sense of self esteem,Go out and pvp vs other players that have a brain, that can make up new move,s and dont do the same over and over and over and over and over and over and over..Who cares if you got more classes to kill pixel dragoons ,,seriously check yourself and start think about the diffrence it makes in open pvp??i said else where on this forum i couldent care less if exiles maintained raid dominance for the rest of eq2.But dont tell people that they dont need what you allrdy got given to you by the makers of the game okay !!You dont understand that this could just aswell be a race and your car has 4 of the best tires,and we have only to wheels with the best tires out there to compete with you on the same tracka and for the same prize money..seems fair ?? Hehe gotta love irl comparrisons =)We all pay the exact same amount of money here..Its a game where the end goal is to make ppl have fun so they dont leave for another game..And besides think about the bragging rights you guys could have if all people played under exact same rules as you and still couldent succed by a long shot..Oh man then you ego´s would actually mean something =)Cheers</blockquote>You dont seem to understand that everyone in exile made sacrifices to do so, all those nice fast mounts, pvp gear thats a hell of alot more effective in pvp, pumis stones signats ect...If you want what we got then we want what you got too, fair is fair right. I could deal with that, could you?

ulleulle

06-17-2008, 12:14 PM

<cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huh# of city guilds that earned their mythicals=0number of exiles with pvp gear 0City People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileI know exiled players that would like to successfully raid in a city, but not city players that wish they were exiled but don't do it.Sure who wouldnt want raid and pvp gear?City people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadThus every city guild looses their best raiders to exile because it's better for raiding. City guilds will never be able to progress while loosing their best raiders.Exactly the reason I satated above, the good raiders get tired of failing because the rest of the raid isnt doing what they should during raid and when there not raiding to maximixe their potentialExiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or another.Raid better in a city isn't an option as city guilds will just loose their best raiders to exile. Only option left is go exile.At this point Id say yesCity factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?The problem is city factions are pretty much forced to exile in order to compete.Compete with what? PVP gear serves it purpose and you get to pick which peices you want to buy. Raiding is really a bonus for citys as pvp is a bonus for exiles.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it? It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...This just goes to prove my point. If you want to raid worth a [I cannot control my vocabulary] in the end game you must go exile. City factions need access to critical classes to be fixed.At this point I still have to agree, even in exile raiding is still very hard, it is theres just no way around it.</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>Yep so what do we do now?Support the status quo and keep city factions as a newbie yard until toons hit level 80 and are ready to go exile to raid.Or support giving city factions access to critical classes so they can compete with exiles in raiding.</blockquote>Its simple, you just have to choose one or the other just like everyone else, till SOE changes otherwise.If you want a challenge pvp gear and city rewards you stay in the city.If you want to have a CHANCE to raid end game content successfuly you find an exile guild that gives you the best chance to do so, and hope you can put forth the effort required to do so.Its that simple really, well until it changes, right now everyone has a choice and that have to pick one or the other.TBH even if they did allow key classes on all sides you would only see a very small change in city progress, because in the end the citys would find it takes a hell of alot MORE than key classes to progress. Then the exiles would most likely LOL in the citys face because most of them couldnt make it with key classes, and pvp gear.So then the citys would blame SOE for not allowing ALL classes to all side since the exiles get it, and would be a constant cycle of excuses for failing....</blockquote>Bingo,Imagine that =)Solid ground for telling people that they seriously need to focus on other things then having all classes to be a succesfull raid force in a game that is build up around having said classes at your disposal.

Cloakentuna

06-17-2008, 12:15 PM

Pohodari = Q guild in VP. Dunno what all they've done in there or if they still raid anymore after AoC, but they made it there so /shrug. Fortitude is claiming they will get there, though I have my doubts. BTW, went out PvPing last night with an all FP group minus the Paladin tanking. No Templar. We still flattened any group that tryed us and flattened the docks. I WISH we could get writs and PvP gear but that isn't going to happen, so I will just continue killing people and get no reward for it at all, I mean, that's better than going back to a faction and sitting on the docks for hours on end waiting to gank someone.

Izzypop

06-17-2008, 12:20 PM

<cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gimet@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exile= Successful Raiding= mythical forgot that too since raiding exile automaticly gives you that huh# of city guilds that earned their mythicals=0number of exiles with pvp gear 0City People= Find that appealing Some do some dont, Id say most dont or there would be more in exileI know exiled players that would like to successfully raid in a city, but not city players that wish they were exiled but don't do it.Sure who wouldnt want raid and pvp gear?City people leave for exile. How else do you get to exile, not like you can just start or walk there...City people bring friends with them. Imagin that taking your friend with you, go figureGood raiders and gone from city. yep they get tired of 20% of the raid force doing 80% of the work of course there gona head to where people pull there loadThus every city guild looses their best raiders to exile because it's better for raiding. City guilds will never be able to progress while loosing their best raiders.Exactly the reason I satated above, the good raiders get tired of failing because the rest of the raid isnt doing what they should during raid and when there not raiding to maximixe their potentialExiles say it's not their fault. Citys say its not their faultExiles say exile, or raid better in city. You have the freedom and choice to do whatever you choose, some cant handle that and would rather be forced one way or another.Raid better in a city isn't an option as city guilds will just loose their best raiders to exile. Only option left is go exile.At this point Id say yesCity factions don't have the people to do that. They use to but it didnt change a thing.City factions move whole guilds to exile. Shame on SOE for allowing that to be possiable blame them right?The problem is city factions are pretty much forced to exile in order to compete.Compete with what? PVP gear serves it purpose and you get to pick which peices you want to buy. Raiding is really a bonus for citys as pvp is a bonus for exiles.City factions take more blows to raiding while Exile prospers from MORE raiders. Exiles progress with 30 fulltime raiders while the citys fail with 100 part time radiers hmmm makes ya wonder doesnt it? It's a huge brain drain and loss of skill in the cities. What do you al suggest, we all move to Exile? OHH, that's a great idea. Everyone moves to exile then leads attacks on the Gnoll boy in QH, or pick on that epic 25 guard in EFP. But, what about PvP? To hell with it, make guilds fight other guilds when you're bored. PVP would actually be better that way. NO FAME, NO TOKENS just pure fights till someone moved on or gave up, hmm sounds like fun to meExile is too appealing. Good and Evil are balanced, and Exile is too appealing. At this point, I don't care how you fix it. But i find it funny when exiles tell city factions to do this and that and learn strats for 5 hours...when the peopl who are willing to do that have long left for Exile. HMMMMMMM. I won't suggest how to fix it...but don't call city people Lazy or Hypocrites when you exiles are being hypocritical too.TBH its too late for the citys, jump ship now while you can...This just goes to prove my point. If you want to raid worth a [I cannot control my vocabulary] in the end game you must go exile. City factions need access to critical classes to be fixed.At this point I still have to agree, even in exile raiding is still very hard, it is theres just no way around it.</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>Yep so what do we do now?Support the status quo and keep city factions as a newbie yard until toons hit level 80 and are ready to go exile to raid.Or support giving city factions access to critical classes so they can compete with exiles in raiding.</blockquote>Its simple, you just have to choose one or the other just like everyone else, till SOE changes otherwise.If you want a challenge pvp gear and city rewards you stay in the city.If you want to have a CHANCE to raid end game content successfuly you find an exile guild that gives you the best chance to do so, and hope you can put forth the effort required to do so.Its that simple really, well until it changes, right now everyone has a choice and that have to pick one or the other.TBH even if they did allow key classes on all sides you would only see a very small change in city progress, because in the end the citys would find it takes a hell of alot MORE than key classes to progress. Then the exiles would most likely LOL in the citys face because most of them couldnt make it with key classes, and pvp gear.People are greedy and human nature is predictable. If city factions no longer become handicapped most exile players will want to return to a city. After the exiled raiding guilds return to a city to raid and have pvp gear the only people left in exile will be those who only stayed for hardcore pvp action.So then the citys would blame SOE for not allowing ALL classes to all side since the exiles get it, and would be a constant cycle of excuses for failing....Once class restrictions go away there will be no excuse for factions failing so the trolling will just have to go back to class balance issues. Nerf Brigands......</blockquote>

ulleulle

06-17-2008, 12:24 PM

<cite>Wytie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ulleulle wrote:</cite><blockquote>I cant understand how you exiled got your big head thru the forum doors,cause d a m n i have never seen so much hot air in a a long time.How dare you tell people that exiled is not easy and city folk should just step up when NOBODY as of yet has proven that it actually can be done,.And dont say kraken did okay,they came with full strats and way way way better gear then what city folks are trying to clear t8 raid with..Its called logic btw...Also you know how sad it looks to outside people reading this.Here you have one group of people with special rules telling other people that dont play under the same rules .that they are essentially bad players and they all should just step up.I guess you have to be one of the "cool" kids to not see that how silly it is..And besides PPLTake your stupid raid and go pork a duck.its nothing but a [I cannot control my vocabulary] script made up by a developer so you guys can get a totally inflated sense of self esteem,Go out and pvp vs other players that have a brain, that can make up new move,s and dont do the same over and over and over and over and over and over and over..Who cares if you got more classes to kill pixel dragoons ,,seriously check yourself and start think about the diffrence it makes in open pvp??i said else where on this forum i couldent care less if exiles maintained raid dominance for the rest of eq2.But dont tell people that they dont need what you allrdy got given to you by the makers of the game okay !!You dont understand that this could just aswell be a race and your car has 4 of the best tires,and we have only to wheels with the best tires out there to compete with you on the same tracka and for the same prize money..seems fair ?? Hehe gotta love irl comparrisons =)We all pay the exact same amount of money here..Its a game where the end goal is to make ppl have fun so they dont leave for another game..And besides think about the bragging rights you guys could have if all people played under exact same rules as you and still couldent succed by a long shot..Oh man then you ego´s would actually mean something =)Cheers</blockquote>You dont seem to understand that everyone in exile made sacrifices to do so, all those nice fast mounts, pvp gear thats a hell of alot more effective in pvp, pumis stones signats ect...If you want what we got then we want what you got too, fair is fair right. I could deal with that, could you?</blockquote>Personally i couldent care less if u get mounts/signets.All i care about is that we all play under 90-95% same rules with only some minor details that seperates us when we all meet in pvp.That is the only way we can be serious about this game,Maybe it is just me,i am afterall only here to pvp and i dont set foot in raid zones anyways,but i do pvp and i know for a fact that having acces to all classes in pvp DOES make a diffrence ..CheersThis is

Gimet

06-17-2008, 12:24 PM

<cite>Izzypop wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>People are greedy and human nature is predictable. If city factions no longer become handicapped most exile players will want to return to a city. After the exiled raiding guilds return to a city to raid and have pvp gear the only people left in exile will be those who only stayed for hardcore pvp action.So then the citys would blame SOE for not allowing ALL classes to all side since the exiles get it, and would be a constant cycle of excuses for failing....Once class restrictions go away there will be no excuse for factions failing so the trolling will just have to go back to class balance issues. Nerf Brigands......</blockquote></blockquote>QFE. "People are greedy and human nature is predictable. If city factions no longer become handicapped most exile players will want to return to a city. After the exiled raiding guilds return to a city to raid and have pvp gear the only people left in exile will be those who only stayed for hardcore pvp action."Whenever peopls say they're going exile, it's no longer "More PvP" or any reason to do with it. It seems everything revolves around raiding for exile now.Now, try to tell me exile isn't too apealing for raiding. You guys argue it's a 3rd faction, so why don't we even things up a bit. I don't care about the method at this point, but you guys say you make sacrifices...well...it' snot like you have to slay 1,000 puppies or anything because everyone seems more than willing.

ulleulle

06-17-2008, 12:30 PM

<cite>Cloakentuna wrote:</cite><blockquote>Pohodari = Q guild in VP. Dunno what all they've done in there or if they still raid anymore after AoC, but they made it there so /shrug. Fortitude is claiming they will get there, though I have my doubts. BTW, went out PvPing last night with an all FP group minus the Paladin tanking. No Templar. We still flattened any group that tryed us and flattened the docks. I WISH we could get writs and PvP gear but that isn't going to happen, so I will just continue killing people and get no reward for it at all, I mean, that's better than going back to a faction and sitting on the docks for hours on end waiting to gank someone.</blockquote>You know that is not the case cloak.lots of us are out there actively trying to pvp and avoid immunities.But i guess its the same when we say that all you exiled do is sit in raid zones =)Hehe dont get me wrong,we have handed out lots of aswhopping in our own freeport group,but when you come up against the perfekt match "temp/ward/guard/illy and some random dps classes" you dont stand a chance in hell to succed if they know how to string their attack together.Ofcource freeport can do good in pvp vs all the avg or just above avg pvp groups out there..but when it comes to end pvping there is no contest.Cheers

Ashr

06-17-2008, 12:44 PM

<cite>ulleulle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cloakentuna wrote:</cite><blockquote>Pohodari = Q guild in VP. Dunno what all they've done in there or if they still raid anymore after AoC, but they made it there so /shrug. Fortitude is claiming they will get there, though I have my doubts. BTW, went out PvPing last night with an all FP group minus the Paladin tanking. No Templar. We still flattened any group that tryed us and flattened the docks. I WISH we could get writs and PvP gear but that isn't going to happen, so I will just continue killing people and get no reward for it at all, I mean, that's better than going back to a faction and sitting on the docks for hours on end waiting to gank someone.</blockquote>You know that is not the case cloak.lots of us are out there actively trying to pvp and avoid immunities.But i guess its the same when we say that all you exiled do is sit in raid zones =)Hehe dont get me wrong,we have handed out lots of aswhopping in our own freeport group,but when you come up against the perfekt match "temp/ward/guard/illy and some random dps classes" you dont stand a chance in hell to succed if they know how to string their attack together.Ofcource freeport can do good in pvp vs all the avg or just above avg pvp groups out there..but when it comes to end pvping there is no contest.Cheers</blockquote>Which has nothing to do with exiles, that is a qeynos group.

Cloakentuna

06-17-2008, 12:45 PM

<cite>Synter@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ulleulle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cloakentuna wrote:</cite><blockquote>Pohodari = Q guild in VP. Dunno what all they've done in there or if they still raid anymore after AoC, but they made it there so /shrug. Fortitude is claiming they will get there, though I have my doubts. BTW, went out PvPing last night with an all FP group minus the Paladin tanking. No Templar. We still flattened any group that tryed us and flattened the docks. I WISH we could get writs and PvP gear but that isn't going to happen, so I will just continue killing people and get no reward for it at all, I mean, that's better than going back to a faction and sitting on the docks for hours on end waiting to gank someone.</blockquote>You know that is not the case cloak.lots of us are out there actively trying to pvp and avoid immunities.But i guess its the same when we say that all you exiled do is sit in raid zones =)Hehe dont get me wrong,we have handed out lots of aswhopping in our own freeport group,but when you come up against the perfekt match "temp/ward/guard/illy and some random dps classes" you dont stand a chance in hell to succed if they know how to string their attack together.Ofcource freeport can do good in pvp vs all the avg or just above avg pvp groups out there..but when it comes to end pvping there is no contest.Cheers</blockquote>Which has nothing to do with exiles, that is a qeynos group.</blockquote>Nerf Qeynos in '08!