Patcher/Server versions

[bhndbluiz]

<p>Hi.</p><p>Been logged in basically all day, but afk. Come back to start to play and my computer crashed. Go and restart, load up patcher, starts to load up and then boom!</p><p> Get an error stating "Login Rejected. The Client's Version does not match the server. Please re-run patcher"</p><p>So I reload it, same thing, do it over and over about 6 times, nothing. </p><p>Logged onto vent, guildie suggested running the everquest2.exe file to bypass the patcher. I did that, same error pop up. </p><p>I deleted the scan cache so it would do a full scan again, same error. Deleted the everquest2.exe file, nothing.</p><p>Any suggestions??</p>

[Keikoku]

I'm having the same issue.

[Khiara]

Same here...someone fix this stupid thing..i NEED to lvl dangit ><

[leldari]

<p>Same issue here on Mistmoore. I logged out briefly, tried to log back in and got a small patch and now the version does not match message. I have run 3 full filescans and even tried forcing the download of a new everquest2.exe by renaming the old exe. Still can't log in.</p>

[Keikoku]

I was using the station launcher to try to run it, but I did a full file scan with the regular launchpad, and it works for me now.

[zathia]

I got a forced update about 7:30 tonight, when I logged in, then the version mismatch error message.  No support after 7PM.  Wonderful.  I cringe every time I see a forced update now.I find it odd that a hot patch can be released and then everyone goes home for the evening. Part of the error message said to 're-run the patcher'.  How do you do that?If the update server is overburdened the error message should say so, and not just skip over un-downloaded files and try to launch EQ2 when its known the launch will fail.Please post a SOE IT manager's "on call" phone number for after hour problems.

[Talis Hammerste]

Same problem here. After logging in .... notice that the EQ2 window has todays date indicating that it has been updated. It runs as EverQuest II(Jun 2 2008 ....etc). As previously mentioned - there is a client / server mismatch Friends are still logged on and running the previous EQ2 client successfully (dated May 2<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. Full file scan does nothing.

[Ciuden]

Same problem. Took a break, went to log back in and client / server do not match.

[leldari]

Launch from EQ2.exe. This starts the old launchpad instead of the station launcher. As soon as I did it the problem went away so it must be an issue with th3e Station Launcher download.

[Khiara]

tried that and still getting the same error

[AgingGamer]

<p>Exact same problem here (patch using Station Launch, get "Login Rejected. The Client's Version does not match the server.  Please re-run the patcher" ) .  Same bypass (use the "old" launchpad by double-clicking EQ2.exe; patches and runs normally).</p><p>If I re-run Station Launcher after successfully patching with the old Launchpad, Station Launcher "patches" again to the incorrect version and I once again get the "Login Rejected" message and launch of the game fails.</p><p>I've seen the exact same results on two machines.  Both of these machines were running perfectly before the June 2nd patch.  Both are running the Station Launcher Beta (will this thing ever be out of beta?)  Both are running Windows Vista Ultimate X64, but I doubt that has anything to do with it.</p><p>It looks like someone at the Sony side of things pushed out a new patch and forgot to update whatever control files are necessary for Station Launcher to work correctly.</p>

[warmknights]

Same Same Same.   Did the everquest.exe file.  Same problem.   Sigh.  The question is "Does anyone care?"

[Pathetica]

<p>O.K Have to say it:</p><p>Me too!!!!!</p>

[brokejaw]

[Shubalubd]

I had the same problem using station launcher. Patching with LaunchPad fixed the problem. If you're trying to do that, and still having issues, create this shortcut:"C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchPadLaunchPad.exe" /nopatch /multiple "/gamepatchpath:C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II" /env:main /lang:en_US /game:eq2If EQ2 isn't installed in C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II, replace "/gamepatchpath:... with your EQ2 directory.Hope this helps someone!

[zathia]

<span class="genmed"><b><span style="color: #3366ff;">Shubalubdub nailed it, thanks</span></b></span>

[zathia]

<span style="color: #330066;"><span style="font-size: x-small;"><b>dupe</b></span></span>

[observer]

<cite>Shubalubdub wrote:</cite><blockquote>I had the same problem using station launcher. Patching with LaunchPad fixed the problem. If you're trying to do that, and still having issues, create this shortcut:"C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchPadLaunchPad.exe" /nopatch /multiple "/gamepatchpath:C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II" /env:main /lang:en_US /game:eq2If EQ2 isn't installed in C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II, replace "/gamepatchpath:... with your EQ2 directory.Hope this helps someone!</blockquote><p>Still doesn't work.</p><p>My Launchpad dir is E:gamesSonyStationStation Launcher</p><p>My EQ2 dir is E:Program FilesSonyEverQuest II</p><p>If anyone can help, it's appreciated.</p>

[Miare]

Running Vista Home Premium x32. After patching, game wouldn't load. That shortcut allows me to play the game; however, there are a number of oddities:Character development screen is blank, save for the class emblem image in the background. Other tabs in that screen seem to work. Recipe lists are empty, and the filtering screen doesn't show any of the books you have or a few other of those selections. Skills tab is also empty. You have to mouseover someone o something in order to get its name to show up. Probably a few others, but those were first to be seen. Anyway, if you're just going to be in combat, it's probably alright, at least until they fix this issue (Is it just Vista related?).To observer:I assume you already used this, but just in case, the shortcut should be -  <span class="postbody">"</span><span class="postbody">E:gamesSonyStationStation Launcher</span><span class="postbody">LaunchPad.exe" /nopatch /multiple "/gamepatchpath:E:Program FilesSonyEverquest II" /env:main /lang:en_US /game:eq2</span>

[ClawHammr]

<p>Same problem here</p>

[observer]

<p>Still nothing.  I tried Test Server and could log in perfectly though.</p><p>Hope SOE fixes this quick, i just came from AoC because of all it's bugs and errors. <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Ciggasack]

Yeah, getting the same issue here.  Looks like I will head to bed for the night and see what kind of developments come about in the morning.

[ClawHammr]

No Tech Support ?

[ClawHammr]

<p>SOE why do you do this ?</p><p>You install new patches at 3am without any testing or tech support</p><p>Truly sad way to run a business imo tbh</p>

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Lindaria@Kithicor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Launch from EQ2.exe. This starts the old launchpad instead of the station launcher. As soon as I did it the problem went away so it must be an issue with th3e Station Launcher download.</blockquote><p>When I try this its brings up a different Launcher and EQ2 is not on the games list</p><p>Some strange games like "Cosmic Rift" show up  </p>

[Miare]

Went and did some other things for a while. Gained a level and did a few quests. Looked again and all my recipes, skills, etc, that were missing, are back and apparently like normal.

[ClawHammr]

Now it tells me <b>"GAME AUTHORIZATION FAILED"</b>

[ganjookie]

<cite>ClawHammr wrote:</cite><blockquote>No Tech Support ?</blockquote>[Removed for Content] Its 1am bro.When I load and patch I am running 4885L seems just dandy.  I can log into a couple  of servers myself.  I'm on unrest/permafrost/vox

[observer]

<p>I'm back in and it works.  Here's what i did step by step.</p><p>1. Download from this link:  <a href="http://download.station.sony.com/patch/download/eq2/eq2-us.zip" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://download.station.sony.com/pa.../eq2/eq2-us.zip</a></p><p>2. Once downloaded, open eq2-us.zip </p><p>3. It will ask you to Modify, Repair, Remove.</p><p>4. I chose Remove and let the uninstall finish.</p><p>5. Then opened eq2-us.zip again.</p><p>6. Install to default directory! It should be C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchPad</p><p>7. Logged in and it download a bunch of vpk files, took only 20 something minutes. I was able to log in afterwards.</p><p><b><u>Make sure it's not reinstalling the whole game!</u></b></p><p>I hope it helps others, because it's really frustrating not being able to play.</p>

[Inf213]

Unfortunately none of the suggestions worked for me. I installed from the new station launchpad and can't find a way to use the old launcher. Hopefully it gets fixed in the morning.<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />--------------------I was able to get the old launcher to download by removing /nopatch from:<span class="postbody">"C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchPadLaunchPad.exe" /nopatch /multiple "/gamepatchpath:C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II" /env:main /lang:en_US /game:eq2</span>

[Bithnar]

Add one more person to the list.  It seemed to have happened at about 10pm EST last night.  I logged in about 9:30 without a problem and then went to switch to a different account and got a small patch and then I started getting the mismatch login error.

[Garrian]

Add me to that list as well, can't login at all on the main account, tells me that it's not a valid account.  The second account gives me the server mismatch.  Add this to the daily hassle of zoning and using the broker on the bazaar.

[Reztarn]

<p>Same problem....first can't log in....patcher says server time out but web site has a </p><p>Error Code: error.authentication.retrieval.fail</p><p>error when using the right password...but normal invalid username or password if not.</p><p>Now both my accounts are saying the server version is not right.</p>

[Ciuden]

This is some major BS. Staff and support back online at SOE I'm sure, and still problems with client / server version mismatch? Completely unacceptable, SOE! How about some kind of response here?!? Even "We're sorry, we're aware of the problem and looking into a solution." Just let us know that the problem is being worked on!!

[bhndbluiz]

<p>Ok, this is where noob mode kicks in.</p><p>Where would I find the launchpad?</p><p>Running vista, and only SoE game on my computer at the current moment is EQ2.</p><p>Files saved in C:program filessonyeverquest2</p><p>No station folder or anything of that nature</p>

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Ciuden wrote:</cite><blockquote>This is some major BS. Staff and support back online at SOE I'm sure, and still problems with client / server version mismatch? Completely unacceptable, SOE! How about some kind of response here?!? Even "We're sorry, we're aware of the problem and looking into a solution." Just let us know that the problem is being worked on!!</blockquote><p>Exactly</p><p><b>This started at least 8 hours ago and no response or fix from SOE</b></p>

[Eaedail]

I'm getting this problem too. I try to play and it says my version differs from the server's.SOE has a bad rep about completely ruining games they get their hands on *Cough* Vanguard *Cough* and they apparently don't care and this is a great example of that. They haven't even said a single thing about it even though it risks [Removed for Content] people off to the point of quitting when stuff like this happens.

[ClawHammr]

lol they are here to Lock threads at least

[TSR-TrevorG]

I am locking threads that are the same as this one.  Once I get into work at 10am PST, I will look for some more information.  The sky has not fallen.

[Khiara]

<span style="color: #ffccff;">FFS sony can you PLEASE fix this stupid thing...or at LEAST let us know that you KNOW there's a problem and one of the trained monkeys is working on it?????????? kthnx</span>

[TSR-TrevorG]

OK lets keep these thoughts civil and lets ease up, tech support isn't even available for another hour.

[Khiara]

and THAT attitude right there is WHY people are jumping ship to AoC...because you have the attitude that WE'RE bothering YOU...WE pay YOU ...ie you have A JOB because we PLAY this game...but with this attitude i can SEE why people are leaving in droves and you'll be out of a job soon...but dont worry ..."the sky has not fallen"

[Dareaken]

Sony send me an email to come back to everquest and I downloaded it last night and same as everyone can log on to the sever today. Sony do you really want me back or where you just teasing me that you liked me?

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Kithap@Permafrost wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ClawHammr wrote:</cite><blockquote>No Tech Support ?</blockquote>[Removed for Content] Its 1am bro.When I load and patch I am running 4885L seems just dandy.  I can log into a couple  of servers myself.  I'm on unrest/permafrost/vox</blockquote><p>Bro its 11am now and no response or fix</p><p>Online Gold Sellers advertise online support 24/7 but a multi-million dollar company (SOE) cannot provide 24/7 Support ?</p><p>Yes makes  perfect sense to me <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Khiara]

SoE's answer to us?? Lock the thread and shut em up

[ClawHammr]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>OK lets keep these thoughts civil and lets ease up, tech support isn't even available for another hour. </blockquote><p>And why is that Trevor ? SOE is multi-million (or billion?) dollar corporation.</p><p>Why do we not have Support 24/7?</p><p>Its a fair question</p>

[DiZdain]

Phew, thought I was the only one with this problem; at least we know that they will be working on a solution.  I uninstalled/reinstalled twice over the past 12 hours and still got the login fail so I decided to check these forums before giving up, good thing I did that hehe.

[ClawHammr]

<cite>DiZdain wrote:</cite><blockquote>Phew, thought I was the only one with this problem; at least we know that they will be working on a solution.  I uninstalled/reinstalled twice over the past 12 hours and still got the login fail so I decided to check these forums before giving up, good thing I did that hehe.</blockquote><p>Yes they will be working on it once they all roll out of bed and have their coffee</p><p>Trevor is still at home and its 11 am <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p>

[Miladi]

<cite>ClawHammr wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>DiZdain wrote:</cite><blockquote>Phew, thought I was the only one with this problem; at least we know that they will be working on a solution.  I uninstalled/reinstalled twice over the past 12 hours and still got the login fail so I decided to check these forums before giving up, good thing I did that hehe.</blockquote><p>Yes they will be working on it once they all roll out of bed and have their coffee</p><p>Trevor is still at home and its 11 am <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" /> </p></blockquote>It was 9AM their time, so they weren't even in yet. SOE is on PDT right now.

[Kwibble]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>I am locking threads that are the same as this one.  Once I get into work at 10am PST, I will look for some more information.  The sky has not fallen.</blockquote><p>Please add another affected customer to your list.  And I have to agree with others here that this did come across as "we are bothering you", whether intended (doubtful) or not.  However, with this many paying subscribers dead in the water, it makes me wonder why there isn't more of a sense of urgency being communicated about this.  I don't know what it takes for you or anyone of your colleagues to get to this sooner, but in the "real world", telling my customers that "I know you're dead in the water, and I'll get to it when I get to work" would just simply not fly at all.  I understand that 24/7 support really isn't achievable - there just isn't enough revenue coming in to justify that kind of expense (and I don't think we want our subscription costs doubled to make it so!), but there should at least be a provision for someone to be on "emergency call", and I would think that this event should qualify.  I would also have thought that the Community reps should have had time to get their coffee and get an update out by now, even if it were to the effect of "we know about it, we're looking into it, don't have a cause or eta yet".  At least that would be something.  I mean no disrespect, and I'm pulling for you guys to come through with some good communication to those of us that can't play our favorite game right now.</p><p>    Kwibble</p>

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Miladian wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ClawHammr wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>DiZdain wrote:</cite><blockquote>Phew, thought I was the only one with this problem; at least we know that they will be working on a solution.  I uninstalled/reinstalled twice over the past 12 hours and still got the login fail so I decided to check these forums before giving up, good thing I did that hehe.</blockquote><p>Yes they will be working on it once they all roll out of bed and have their coffee</p><p>Trevor is still at home and its 11 am <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15"> </p></blockquote>It was 9AM their time, so they weren't even in yet. SOE is on PDT right now.</blockquote><p>EQ2 operates 24/7 online....so why doesnt a multi-million dollar company (SOE) provide 24/7 Support ?</p><p>This is 2008, not 1988</p>

[ClawHammr]

<p>When I try to use the non-Beta LaunchPad its wants to install the full game </p><p>Any way around this ?</p><p>StationLauncher still rejecting Login</p>

[Pathetica]

<cite>Shubalubdub wrote:</cite><blockquote>I had the same problem using station launcher. Patching with LaunchPad fixed the problem. If you're trying to do that, and still having issues, create this shortcut:"C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchPadLaunchPad.exe" /nopatch /multiple "/gamepatchpath:C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II" /env:main /lang:en_US /game:eq2If EQ2 isn't installed in C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II, replace "/gamepatchpath:... with your EQ2 directory.Hope this helps someone!</blockquote><p>This actually worked for me, too.  Had a bit of a download wait and  then game popped right up.</p><p> Pathetica</p>

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Pathetica@Nektulos wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Shubalubdub wrote:</cite><blockquote>I had the same problem using station launcher. Patching with LaunchPad fixed the problem. If you're trying to do that, and still having issues, create this shortcut:"C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchPadLaunchPad.exe" /nopatch /multiple "/gamepatchpath:C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II" /env:main /lang:en_US /game:eq2If EQ2 isn't installed in C:Program FilesSonyEverquest II, replace "/gamepatchpath:... with your EQ2 directory.Hope this helps someone!</blockquote><p>This actually worked for me, too.  Had a bit of a download wait and  then game popped right up.</p><p> Pathetica</p></blockquote><p>How exactly do you create that shortcut ?</p><p>Edit: Nvm figured it out but having trouble finding correct file location</p><p>Error says "The file cannot be found"</p><p>I have Vista64 so I have program files (x86) but when I type in the "(x86)" it doesnt help</p><p>Also the LaunchPad.exe does not list EQ2  , only games like "Tanarus" and "Cosmic Rift"</p>

[Kwibble]

<p>Although I'm not familiar with reviewing update logs, I *might* have found a relevant clue, and I might not have.  I tried deleting my scan cache, and then shut down and restarted the Station Launcher.  Here is an excerpt of my update log:</p><p>2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  BundleUpdater - Servicing a stage update request for eq2-live-en_US 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  StageUpdater - Performing staging for eq2-live-en_US 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] WARN  StageUpdater - Initial download manifest is empty for eq2-live-en_US->C:GamesSonyEverQuest IIlp_stage (that's odd) 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  BackgroundUpdater - Request to cancel the BITS job eq2-live-en_US->C:GamesSonyEverQuest IIlp_temp 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] WARN  BitsJobManager - job not found : SOE [eq2-live-en_US->C:GamesSonyEverQuest IIlp_temp]:admin 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  BackgroundUpdater - Succeeded cancelling the BITS job eq2-live-en_US->C:GamesSonyEverQuest IIlp_temp 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  BackgroundUpdater - background updater has been stopped, bits job eq2-live-en_US->C:GamesSonyEverQuest IIlp_temp could still be running) 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  BundleUpdater - Servicing a foreground request for eq2-live-en_US 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - 20 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - INITIALIZING 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - CHECKING_FOR_CHANGES 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  LocalSystem - eq2-live-en_US: No matching local cache found. 2008-06-03 16:32:19 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - LOADING_REMOTE_MANIFEST 2008-06-03 16:32:20 [1044] INFO  PatchMonitor - 0,0,0 2008-06-03 16:32:20 [1044] DEBUG UpdateRequestDispatcher - eq2-live-en_US 0 LOADING_REMOTE_MANIFEST 20 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [1044] INFO  PatchMonitor - 0,0,0 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [1044] DEBUG UpdateRequestDispatcher - eq2-live-en_US 0 LOADING_REMOTE_MANIFEST 20 <b>2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] ERROR PitcherProcessor - Parse error in fileset xml. :1567:118 error: An exception occurred! Type:UnexpectedEOFException, Message:The end of input was not expected </b>2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - 1 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] WARN  lp2::updater::ForegroundUpdater - Caught : instance document parsing failed processing request. 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - WAITING_FOR_REQUEST 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] INFO  BundleUpdater - BundleUpdater received completion event: C:GamesSonyEverQuest II(1) 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] INFO  PatchMonitor - 0,0,0 2008-06-03 16:32:22 [2388] DEBUG UpdateRequestDispatcher - eq2-live-en_US 0 WAITING_FOR_REQUEST 1 2008-06-03 16:32:37 [2748] DEBUG lp2::gui::Screen - initialized lp2::gui::GeneralPreferencesScreen's widget in 0 2008-06-03 16:32:37 [2748] DEBUG lp2::gui::Screen - initialized lp2::gui::StartupPreferencesScreen's widget in 0 2008-06-03 16:32:37 [2748] DEBUG lp2::gui::Screen - initialized lp2::gui::LoginPreferencesScreen's widget in 0 2008-06-03 16:32:37 [2748] DEBUG BundleSelector - Cannot find install location for: pls-live-en_US. 2008-06-03 16:32:37 [2748] DEBUG BundleSelector - Cannot find install location for: [app]pls-live-ru_RU. 2008-06-03 16:32:37 [2748] DEBUG BundleSelector - Cannot find install location for: pls-trial-en_US. </p><p>What follows are more and more "cannot find install location" messages.  Am I reading this correctly that the launcher is trying to download and parse a file referred to as the "fileset xml", otherwise known as the "remote manifest", and that it is encountering a parse error on the XML?   Perhaps this file is corrupted on the server?   If that's the case, is ANYONE getting in successfully via the launcher?</p>

[Khiara]

They should...they should also sit down with their tech support staff and have a good ole fashioned come to Jesus meeting about CUSTOMER SERVICE and how it can and WILL send a company out of business...even one as large as SOE.  I get the fact that usually with tech and c/s it's either or...NOT USUALLY both...BUT...you can use common sense before you post something to people who are ALREADY ticked off.  Just think about it for a sec, "Hmm..if _I_ called in about something and got this response...what would MY reaction be?"  While we're on the matter...stop locking threads that give people a chance to convey EXACTLY what is WRONG with this game.  That IS what the forums are for right?? Letting YOU know what's going on so you can FIX IT??? Giving away 2 free months is NOT gonna work if you can't get past this customer service issue.  YOU need US ...not the other way around.

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Khiara@Kithicor wrote:</cite><blockquote>They should...they should also sit down with their tech support staff and have a good ole fashioned come to Jesus meeting about CUSTOMER SERVICE and how it can and WILL send a company out of business...even one as large as SOE.  I get the fact that usually with tech and c/s it's either or...NOT USUALLY both...BUT...you can use common sense before you post something to people who are ALREADY ticked off.  Just think about it for a sec, "Hmm..if _I_ called in about something and got this response...what would MY reaction be?"  While we're on the matter...stop locking threads that give people a chance to convey EXACTLY what is WRONG with this game.  That IS what the forums are for right?? Letting YOU know what's going on so you can FIX IT??? Giving away 2 free months is NOT gonna work if you can't get past this customer service issue.  YOU need US ...not the other way around.</blockquote>I dont think there is much accountablity/supervision going on in the Tech Support department unfortunately

[Kwibble]

<cite>Khiara@Kithicor wrote:</cite><blockquote>While we're on the matter...stop locking threads that give people a chance to convey EXACTLY what is WRONG with this game.  That IS what the forums are for right?? Letting YOU know what's going on so you can FIX IT??? </blockquote>Just playing Devil's Advocate (and people that know me get driven nuts by this tendency of mine <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />), I don't think Trevor was locking threads to cut off communication - after all, he left this one open.  I think he just wanted to get everything consolidated into one thread so that it would be easier to piece all the info together when going through it.  If there are three or four threads, all being appended to, it's quite a bit more difficult to get the "complete picture".  Now if this thread get's locked, I get to play Devil's Advocate of my Devil's Advocate.  lol

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Kwibble wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Khiara@Kithicor wrote:</cite><blockquote>While we're on the matter...stop locking threads that give people a chance to convey EXACTLY what is WRONG with this game.  That IS what the forums are for right?? Letting YOU know what's going on so you can FIX IT??? </blockquote>Just playing Devil's Advocate (and people that know me get driven nuts by this tendency of mine <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />), I don't think Trevor was locking threads to cut off communication - after all, he left this one open.  I think he just wanted to get everything consolidated into one thread so that it would be easier to piece all the info together when going through it.  If there are three or four threads, all being appended to, it's quite a bit more difficult to get the "complete picture".  Now if this thread get's locked, I get to play Devil's Advocate of my Devil's Advocate.  lol</blockquote><p>Its not very encouraging when the first response we get is from someone who is still waking up at home and not even at work yet , and its 12PM noon.</p>

[Kwibble]

<cite>ClawHammr wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kwibble wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Khiara@Kithicor wrote:</cite><blockquote>While we're on the matter...stop locking threads that give people a chance to convey EXACTLY what is WRONG with this game.  That IS what the forums are for right?? Letting YOU know what's going on so you can FIX IT??? </blockquote>Just playing Devil's Advocate (and people that know me get driven nuts by this tendency of mine <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />), I don't think Trevor was locking threads to cut off communication - after all, he left this one open.  I think he just wanted to get everything consolidated into one thread so that it would be easier to piece all the info together when going through it.  If there are three or four threads, all being appended to, it's quite a bit more difficult to get the "complete picture".  Now if this thread get's locked, I get to play Devil's Advocate of my Devil's Advocate.  lol</blockquote><p>Its not very encouraging when the first response we get is from someone who is still waking up at home and not even at work yet , and its 12PM noon.</p></blockquote>No Devil's Advocate reply on that one... even if there IS a sense of urgency behind the curtain, it sure doesn't look like it out here.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[ClawHammr]

<cite>Kwibble wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ClawHammr wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kwibble wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Khiara@Kithicor wrote:</cite><blockquote>While we're on the matter...stop locking threads that give people a chance to convey EXACTLY what is WRONG with this game.  That IS what the forums are for right?? Letting YOU know what's going on so you can FIX IT??? </blockquote>Just playing Devil's Advocate (and people that know me get driven nuts by this tendency of mine <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />), I don't think Trevor was locking threads to cut off communication - after all, he left this one open.  I think he just wanted to get everything consolidated into one thread so that it would be easier to piece all the info together when going through it.  If there are three or four threads, all being appended to, it's quite a bit more difficult to get the "complete picture".  Now if this thread get's locked, I get to play Devil's Advocate of my Devil's Advocate.  lol</blockquote><p>Its not very encouraging when the first response we get is from someone who is still waking up at home and not even at work yet , and its 12PM noon.</p></blockquote>No Devil's Advocate reply on that one... even if there IS a sense of urgency behind the curtain, it sure doesn't look like it out here.  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15"></blockquote>I think we can safely say our $15/month is not going to Tech Support <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" /> 

[TSR-TrevorG]

Thanks for being patient.  I'm sorry if you felt I was abrasive and being bothered at home.  I was not, I can assure you. I check the forums before I leave to work to get an idea of what I will be working with.I was hoping posting would let you know that somebody was looking at this and would have answers soon for you.  Apparently your darned if you do, or darned if you don't.  Here is how I have been able to log in here from work after getting the error.I downloaded the patcher from <a rel="nofollow" href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a>.  Re-ran that and then did a full file scan.  I did have to place the patcher in my current EQ2 directory, which may be different for you but should generally be C:Program FilesSonyEverQuest II.  This way it will not try to reinstall the entire game.If you are still having issues after trying either of these the fix on the first page is still valid.As this is a technical support forum lets keep questions technical.  I cannot really comment on your 24/7 support question besides what I have answered you already in PMs.[edit] Added in location for patcher.  Apologies, no coffee yet, jumped right in here as soon as I walked into the office.

[Fobok]

Having the same problem, and since I installed from the Station Launcher after seeing the new promotion, I don't have the old launcher installed.

[ClawHammr]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thanks for being patient.  I'm sorry if you felt I was abrasive and being bothered at home.  I was not, I can assure you. I check the forums before I leave to work to get an idea of what I will be working with.I was hoping posting would let you know that somebody was looking at this and would have answers soon for you.  Apparently your darned if you do, or darned if you don't.  Here is how I have been able to log in here from work after getting the error.I downloaded the patcher from <a rel="nofollow" href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a>.  <b>Re-ran that and then did a full file scan</b>.  Others have been able to use the BETA launcher as well <a rel="nofollow" href="http://launcher.station.sony.com/" target="_blank">http://launcher.station.sony.com/</a> fropm here to update and fix it.If you are still having issues after trying either of these the fix on the first page is still valid.As this is a technical support forum lets keep questions technical.  I cannot really comment on your 24/7 support question besides what I have answered you already in PMs.</blockquote>How do I do the "FULL FILE SCAN" ?

[TSR-TrevorG]

click on Preferences in the old launcher, then on Full File Scan

[Kwibble]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thanks for being patient.  I'm sorry if you felt I was abrasive and being bothered at home.  I was not, I can assure you. I check the forums before I leave to work to get an idea of what I will be working with.I was hoping posting would let you know that somebody was looking at this and would have answers soon for you.  Apparently your darned if you do, or darned if you don't.  Here is how I have been able to log in here from work after getting the error.I downloaded the patcher from <a rel="nofollow" href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a>.  Re-ran that and then did a full file scan.  Others have been able to use the BETA launcher as well <a rel="nofollow" href="http://launcher.station.sony.com/" target="_blank">http://launcher.station.sony.com/</a> fropm here to update and fix it.If you are still having issues after trying either of these the fix on the first page is still valid.As this is a technical support forum lets keep questions technical.  I cannot really comment on your 24/7 support question besides what I have answered you already in PMs.</blockquote><p>Thanks for the reply Trevor, and I'll give it a try.  And even though we grilled you a bit on your initial posts, I for one do appreciate that you posted something.  If not for that, we would have still been COMPLETELY in the dark.  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>Also, I understand and agree with your comment that this is a tech support forum and to keep the discussion to the technical issues.  However, as several have voiced here, it would be nice if there were SOMEWHERE that we could post our opinions about how things are, shall we say, "managed"?, without those posts being rather gruffly locked.  If there *is* some kind of official "suggestion box" in which we can freely comment, I would appreciate a quick off-topic note or PM with that info.   Thanks for listening and thanks again for your help!</p><p>Kwibble</p>

[griffarin]

so i take it that there is no update or even acknowledgment that there is a problem....or is it the ol its not us its all you guys with system problems or something ?

[Kwibble]

<p>For what it's worth, I noticed this thread on the Station Launcher forums.  Looks like same problem being reported.  No reply on that thread yet as to the cause or resolution.</p><p> <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/station/posts/list.m?topic_id=11500009825" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://forums.station.sony.com/stat..._id=11500009825</a></p>

[ClawHammr]

<p>Tried Trevors suggestion,  now I cannot even get to the Login section </p><p>All I see is a Station Launcher screen  that is "scanning" and then it disappears</p><p>Edit: When trying to use the non-beta launchpad , still want to install the entire game again</p>

[DiZdain]

I used the old launcher to scan the files I downloaded with the beta launcher and it found the files it was missing after doing the full scan (probably 20 seconds of patching after about 3 minutes of scanning).  I'm in the game now so the suggestion to use the old launcher worked for me.

[TSR-TrevorG]

Now just to be clear when you download the patcher from the link above, you want to place it in the folder where EQ2 currently is.  That way it wont try to reinstall the entire game.  I will edit my post above.

[ClawHammr]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>Now just to be clear when you download the patcher from the link above, you want to place it in the folder where EQ2 currently is.  That way it wont try to reinstall the entire game.  I will edit my post above.</blockquote>Reinstalled StationLauncher , updated all files,  same problem

[Kwibble]

<p>Ok, a bit more troubleshooting and trying things, and I'm now convinced the problem is with the Station Launcher.  My guess is that the game was updated to a new "version", and the old Launchpad client was updated to sync to it, but Station Launcher was not.   Here's what I did:</p><p> 1) I shut down Station Launcher (rmb click on task tray icon and select Exit Station Launcher).  I re-downloaded the Station Launcher beta client from the link Trevor provided and ran it.  I chose the Repair option and let it do it's thing.  Then I restarted Station Launcher.</p><p>2) I went into Options -> Preferences, selected Everquest II, and selected Delete Scan Cache.  Then I shut down Station Launcher again and restarted it once more.</p><p>3) This time it did a full scan and appeared to complete normally.  Tried to launch EQ2, and after the splash window, got the aforementioned client/server mismatch error.</p><p>4) Launched the old LaunchPad.  I noticed that the Launchpad application itself was patched.  Wondering if that might have had any effect, I hit Decline on the EULA and went back through the Station Launcher tests.  Still failed.</p><p>5) Ran LaunchPad again and let it patch.  Started up EQ2.  Works fine.</p><p>6) Shutdown EQ2 and went back to Station Launcher.  Repeated tests.  Still get client/server mismatch error.</p><p> So, it appears that no amount of patching, reinstalling, and scanning files with the Station Launcher exe will work.  I believe it is likely that the Station Launcher itself needs a patch to bump it's client version to match the back end.</p><p>Kwib</p>

[Dareaken]

<p> I installed this <a rel="nofollow" href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a> with no problem but when I run eq2 and it starts to update lauchpad and goes past the graphics part I get </p><p> Window: "Everquest II LauchPad" Image could not be loaded.</p><p> Then it dumps to windows like it does love me anymore. Any ideas?</p>

[TSR-TrevorG]

After testing with a few other accounts here, it seems that the BETA Launcher is having difficulty patching.  Please stick with the older launcher from <a href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a>

[TSR-TrevorG]

<cite>Dareaken wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> I installed this <a rel="nofollow" href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a> with no problem but when I run eq2 and it starts to update lauchpad and goes past the graphics part I get </p><p> Window: "Everquest II LauchPad" Image could not be loaded.</p><p> Then it dumps to windows like it does love me anymore. Any ideas?</p></blockquote>You may have tried, already but if you could try this or let me know you've already tried.reboot PCpower-cycle modem/router (unplug power for 20 secs)

[ClawHammr]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>Now just to be clear when you download the patcher from the link above, you want to place it in the folder where EQ2 currently is.  That way it wont try to reinstall the entire game.  I will edit my post above.</blockquote><p>Trevor I have the "eq2-us" folder (LaunchPad, NOT BETA)saved to my Desktop</p><p>Now what do I do from here ?</p>

[TSR-TrevorG]

Clawtake the EQ2.exe file and put it in your everquest 2 directory. Then run it.

[ClawHammr]

<p>Nothing I do with the StaionLauncher works</p><p>-Reinstalled</p><p>-Full Scan</p><p>Same problem</p><p>Need help with ORIGINAL LAUNCHPAD</p>

[TSR-TrevorG]

I am speaking of the older launcher. Are you able to extract the EQ2.exe file from the zip you downloaded?  Can you drag/drop it into the Everquest 2 directory?

[ClawHammr]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>I am speaking of the older launcher. Are you able to extract the EQ2.exe file from the zip you downloaded?  Can you drag/drop it into the Everquest 2 directory?</blockquote><p>I am not 100% sure where to drag/drop it , and everywhere I try it just wants to install the full game</p><p>I have 2 different Sony files</p><p>Program Files</p><p>Program Files (x86)</p>

[TSR-TrevorG]

Which one of those is the one that you run the game from?You can find out by right clicking on the EQ2 shortcut on your desktop and see where the START IN leads you.

[Ciggasack]

I'm getting the same thing...I download the old patcher, throw it in my eqII directory and then when I go to run it it acts like it is going to install a fresh copy of eqII...I haven't clicked continue yet as I don't want it to being reinstalling the entire thing.<span class="postbody"><span class="postbody"></span></span>

[ClawHammr]

<p>Not sure exactly what happ but I got in game somehow</p><p>Now Im scared to ever log out <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p><p>Please fix StationLauncher</p>

[Ciggasack]

So should I let the old updater continue with its course of action?  It is asking me to choose the directory in which I would like EQ2 installed.

[TSR-TrevorG]

For those of you still having issues.Are you using the BETA LAUNCHPAD?Have you tried to run EQ2.exe from the Everquest 2 directory?

[TSR-TrevorG]

<cite>Ciggasack wrote:</cite><blockquote>So should I let the old updater continue with its course of action?  It is asking me to choose the directory in which I would like EQ2 installed.</blockquote>Yes, select the current directory where it is installed.

[bhndbluiz]

<p>I am at work right now so I won't be able to test these theories till I get home in a few hours. </p><p>A few questions before I go at trying to get it to work....</p><p>1. Eq2 is sorta/kinda installed in 2 folders. The regular Program Files folder (which is where the beta launcher is set to) and then the Program Files (x86) folder, which the old station launcher is set to. I ran the launcher and it would want to re-download the files. Is this going to screw around with the new file your telling us to download? (Only ask cause I don't want to have to reinstall, cause for whatever reasons the DVD install doesn't like to work and I had to download the game full off the launcher/beta)</p><p>2. Will there be a patch to the beta-launcher to fix this issue? Incase the file your telling us to download doesn't work, and I'd have to reinstall the game.</p><p>(the x86 folder didn't want to run eq2 hence why it was downloaded to the regular program folders)</p>

[TSR-TrevorG]

<cite>bhndbluiz wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I am at work right now so I won't be able to test these theories till I get home in a few hours. </p><p>A few questions before I go at trying to get it to work....</p><p>1. Eq2 is sorta/kinda installed in 2 folders. The regular Program Files folder (which is where the beta launcher is set to) and then the Program Files (x86) folder, which the old station launcher is set to. I ran the launcher and it would want to re-download the files. Is this going to screw around with the new file your telling us to download? (Only ask cause I don't want to have to reinstall, cause for whatever reasons the DVD install doesn't like to work and I had to download the game full off the launcher/beta)</p><p><span style="color: #cc0000;"> The file I am looking to have you download is just the patcher (eq2.exe) if you just run this, it will patch normally, or should.  Of course you will want to check any firewalls and other security to make sure that it is on the allowed lists.  If you just try and run EQ2.exe,  the patcher and game should update, and then you can use the beta launcher again.  </span></p><p><span style="color: #cc0000;">So far I have tested this on 10 PCs here.</span></p><p>2. Will there be a patch to the beta-launcher to fix this issue? Incase the file your telling us to download doesn't work, and I'd have to reinstall the game.</p><p><span style="color: #cc0000;"> Not that I have heard of, but something I have been asking about myself.</span></p><p>(the x86 folder didn't want to run eq2 hence why it was downloaded to the regular program folders)</p></blockquote>

[bhndbluiz]

<p>I'll give that a shot again, I'll probably have to re-list where the files are downloading to, isntead of having it want to reinstall the game, like it had been wanting to. (In which case, (not sitting infront of my PC at home) is that just under the setttings menu? or would I need to go thru a few places to reset it?</p><p>Thanks for the help.</p>

[TSR-TrevorG]

Best of luck to you later :p

[Pathetica]

O.K. I tried the fix by the Shub guy and it worked until I zoned then I poofed out of game. Tried again same. Then it wouldn't load at all. Oh so many things gone wrong I can't keep count. I finally downloaded the exe file and now and sitting at some 4 plus hour download. This is beyond frustrating as I don't see why I should be spending hours and hours fiddling around with stuff that worked perfectly until this latest "update" or whatever the heck it was. Pathetica

[toby0]

I'd just like to point out that i can log onto the US servers (via my trial play the fae exe file) but can't login to the euro servers via sony station, I'm based in the UK...

[TSR-DanielH]

<cite>Pathetica@Nektulos wrote:</cite><blockquote>O.K. I tried the fix by the Shub guy and it worked until I zoned then I poofed out of game. Tried again same. Then it wouldn't load at all. Oh so many things gone wrong I can't keep count. I finally downloaded the exe file and now and sitting at some 4 plus hour download. This is beyond frustrating as I don't see why I should be spending hours and hours fiddling around with stuff that worked perfectly until this latest "update" or whatever the heck it was. Pathetica </blockquote>The Station Launcher is currently in beta and can have these types of problems around patch days.  By the time it is updated to a release version that should be ironed out.In regards to the long download, it shouldn't take that long.  Did you make sure to select the same directory that you already had the game in when prompted to install?  If you picked a different directory then it will have to download the whole game again.  Otherwise it should only need to download the launchpad and the most recent update.  Assuming you aren't on dial-up or something, I bet that it is being installed into the wrong directory.

[Pathetica]

<p>Of course it is in t he wrong directory if not two wrong directories. My problem is I have 3 directories. I have QEverquest II and EverQuestII and EverQuest II </p><p> I am sure I have messed about enough that even trying to help me will drive you to an even bigger sig.</p><p>I have been contemplating a break from EQII and this seems like a sign to me.</p><p>Pathetica</p>

[Pathetica]

<p>Oops it is Dan not Trevor.</p><p>O.K Dealing with me will instill so much tension you will decimate Trevor in the parking lot, big sig or no.</p><p>Pathetica</p>

[toby0]

Hello, the everquest installer to which you referred earlier, isn't this US only and won't work for a poor Englishman like me? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[toby0]

*Cough* Can anyone answer my question please?

[TSR-TrevorG]

You can use it fine sir.

[toby0]

Why thank you kind sir. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[Reiella]

<cite>TSR-TrevorG wrote:</cite><blockquote>After testing with a few other accounts here, it seems that the BETA Launcher is having difficulty patching.  Please stick with the older launcher from <a rel="nofollow" href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install" target="_blank">http://everquest2.station.sony.com/install</a> </blockquote>StationLauncher appears to be working now.  At least, it worked for me [after settling on old launcher last night heh].

[TSR-TrevorG]

Here is another way of getting the old patcher/launcher to work for you if you currently do not have an EQ2.exe icon.This is an alternative means of downloading Everquest 2that accomplishes the same thing: 1. Download the Launchpad if you don't have it already, <a rel="nofollow" href="http://patch.station.sony.com:7000/patch/launchpad/Install_LaunchPad.exe" target="_blank">http://patch.station.sony.com:7000/...l_LaunchPad.exe</a>. 2. Go to your Launchpad folder, C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchpad. Right click on launchpad.exe and choose send to --> desktop. 3. Next, create a folder in C:Program Files called Sony. 4. Double-click the Sony folder, and create a folder named Everquest 2. 5.. Go to your desktop, right click on the Launchpad icon and choose properties. 6. In the target box, enter this exactly with quotes and all: "C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchpadLaunchpad.exe" /game:eq2 7. In the Start in box, put this in, quotes and all: "C:Program FilesSonyEverquest2" 8. Click on Apply and the Close. 9. Double-click the icon and the game will download. Go ahead and replace the following file paths with your file path ONLY if you have the game installed to a different directory.C:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchpadC:Program FilesSonyStationLaunchpadLaunchpad.exeC:Program FilesSonyEverquest2

[akaria]

<p>I'm getting an error when I try to log in that says "Login Rejected. The Client's Version does not match the server. Please re-run patcher". I scanned through this forum and didn't see any fix... I did notice that if it is happening to one person, it's apparently happening to alot of people.</p>

[Meter Fullnote]

<p><cite>akaria wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm getting an error when I try to log in that says "Login Rejected. The Client's Version does not match the server. Please re-run patcher". I scanned through this forum and didn't see any fix... I did notice that if it is happening to one person, it's apparently happening to alot of people.</p></blockquote><p>Same thing happening to me on two computers ... hopefully they will get on fixing this issue ASAP.</p>

[BroKenWingZ]

old thread is old...

[Threow]

<p>Hi! </p><p>I've encountered this problem for the first time this morning. Anyone know of any new (and hopefully easier) solutions, or do I need to go through all the file manipulation stuff described when others first encountered this problem back in June?</p><p>Thanks!</p>

[Gojubushido]

<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;"><strong>Problem</strong></span> Once I've pressed the play button in the Station Launcher I get to the intro splash screen then an error window appears saying: "Login rejected: The client's version does not match the server's. Please re-run the patcher."</p><p>I've had this issue since the last patch and have tried all everything suggested in these forums except for uninstalling and reinstalling from scratch again. Also I've sent a ticket to SOE tech support for them to come back to me with an answer, I'd suggest the rest of you give that a go..</p><p><em>Has anyone managed a way into EQ2 as yet?</em></p><p>Looking forward to seeing more on this topic!!</p><p>~Steve~</p>

[Patricius]

<p>I began having this problem about 6 hours ago. anyone who have suffered from this problem recently at found an easy way to fix it?</p><p>I use the downloadable launcher. and i tried scanning and relloging aswell as reinstalling the entire game.</p><p>I have also tried at bypass the launcher and use the .exe file directly, didnt work.</p><p>Plz help somebody :'(</p>

[TSR-JoshuaM]

<p>Splitpaw is still down and there are many recent threads on this subject still ongoing.  Locking this one from 2008 up.</p>