DIVINE AURA

[NANEEJE]

<p>I am a new player to this game, and I see Paladins, and all classes complain daily about things they would like to change, what do I know? Not enough to judge anyone. </p><p>I am  a Paladin, a Crusader, a fighter, and therefore, by nature, I tank groups into instances, and need to be competitive with the top tanks in the game if I want to be picked up. </p><p>Divine Aura is extremely useful on the pull to take some initial spike damage, I use it all the time on the harder mobs of Voes, Coa, and I have yet to finish Maidens with a group. I am not geared enough for one healer to heal me in Maidens, or I don't know how to keep myself alive.</p><p>I would like to see some fairness with this spell. While I haven't played the Guardian, it would seem that to go with the 'off tank' role that developers have obviously tried to place Paladins into for raids, our group tank role could use a little support. </p><p>I want to see a change in divine aura. While I have found a way to make it effective as much as I can. It obviously was used as a oh crap spell. So with this in mind, please, please....</p><p>1. Recast timer on this needs to be cut in half. ( 3 minutes seems appropriate to me for the amount of damage a level 80 plus mob does, but I would be happy with 5)</p><p>2. Casting time of 4 years? Doesn't seem right, this should be an instant cast if timer is 10 minutes, that way, it is truly a oh crap spell.</p><p>3. My choice, make Divine Aura absorb the next 10 attacks. Leave the 50% on there, if you must, but I feel at 10 minutes, to help us be better tanks for groups in regular instances, every 10 minutes, we should be able to absorb the next 10 attacks. And please, let us know your changing it, so that way we can all try it out and give you our feedback. </p><p>I don't think this is out of line, I think holy ground is nice at 3 minutes, we have rescue, we can build hate quite well, we use amends, and groups love us for our ability to actually hold aggro, but our survivability can be more solidified if people knew we could actually use divine aura for the purpose it was intended.. </p><p>standing by for feedback.</p>

[Kahling]

<p>Hi,</p><p>To be honest Divine Aura is broken right now, all the time since we have had this spell it has stopped attacks from raid mobs.  Now if u get in to T2 ROK raids then they hit u for more than 50% and therefore it doesnt absorb a single hit.  Ive run with this since it came out and now Im just about to drop it.</p><p>To be honest to make this spell fair it needs to be on the same recast as the guards tower shield spell, needs to absorb as many attacks and needs to have the 50% penalty removed completely and needs to have the same cast time as the guards tower shield spell (its effectively one of their ooh [Removed for Content] abilities that they get as standard and dont have to spend 24 aa's to get)</p><p> I dont think a change to how I said above is asking for the earth here, just a bit more tankability on a spell that was a nice idea when it came out but is outdated today.</p><p>Regards</p><p>Kahling</p>

[Meirril]

<cite>NANEEJE wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>1. Recast timer on this needs to be cut in half. ( 3 minutes seems appropriate to me for the amount of damage a level 80 plus mob does, but I would be happy with 5)</p><p>2. Casting time of 4 years? Doesn't seem right, this should be an instant cast if timer is 10 minutes, that way, it is truly a oh crap spell.</p><p>3. My choice, make Divine Aura absorb the next 10 attacks. Leave the 50% on there, if you must, but I feel at 10 minutes, to help us be better tanks for groups in regular instances, every 10 minutes, we should be able to absorb the next 10 attacks. And please, let us know your changing it, so that way we can all try it out and give you our feedback. </p><p>I don't think this is out of line, I think holy ground is nice at 3 minutes, we have rescue, we can build hate quite well, we use amends, and groups love us for our ability to actually hold aggro, but our survivability can be more solidified if people knew we could actually use divine aura for the purpose it was intended.. </p></blockquote><p>1. Reducing the re-cast timer would be a welcome change if the spell was going to be left alone otherwise. Honestly I'd rather have one of the other changes below it. Though there is some sound reasoning for a recast timer change if you compair this ability with the Guardian's ability that is similar. To be effective in raids we'd need to have this ability ready for pulling mobs as it looses effectiveness when we take damage. So you'd be looking at a recasting time of between 1 min and 3 min. This seems a bit rediculous to me so I would really perfer a different change to make the ability more effective.</p><p>2. The casting timer isn't so bad, though it is far too easy to interupt. Making the ability non-interruptable would be good enough. </p><p>3. In my opinion, your asking for a neft here. Right now the way DA works it is effective against not only single targets but also groups of mobs. With your proposed change, if you pulled a group of 3 mobs (like the 3 sisters in VoES) you'd get about 3 seconds before your DA went down. DA fixed at 10 seconds is very fair. Unfortunately, as far as raiding goes if we need DA it won't work. DA is based on our current hit points. If we get into trouble during a raid, the mob hits so hard DA won't protect us. If the 50% was removed from DA then it would do what it seems the spell was origionally intended to do. If you really felt the need to put some kind of limiter on this spell, then change it from absorbing all attacks to absorbing all melee attacks. This is primaraly what DA saved us from in previous tiers, is being chewed up with a bunch of melee attacks for 10 seconds. After all, if we needed DA it was because we were in a healing lull. Lulls were usually created by the mob hitting with a big ability. The main thing that would kill us AFTER DA was another follow up ability before we were healed. DA saved us from the smaller but much more frequent melee attacks. </p>

[Arkinon]

Im really not sure why it would need to be changed. If raiding I can see it but other wise I think it is fine. First off I dont use it in an OH CRAP kind of way . I generally use it on boss mobs when I see that the healer is starting to lag behind at about 50-60% heath. It allows them to gain back the loss in healing to 100%. I have maybe only used it in the other fashion a hand full of times. If a mob in say CoA is hitting a tank for 50% of their life then they need to really take a look at their gear, AA, and racial spec.. Im running around self buffed with around 11k and almost 53% mitigation (with nearly 13-14k group buffed depending on makeup). so I usually see hits for around 1-3k on boss mobs. As far as the timer 10 min between bosses in most cases is fine. If im using it on trash mobs its because we got an add or I pull more than 1 in which case i might use it to help the healer keep up. Most groups im in will have a trash mob down in more then enough time to make this an effective way to use it.<div></div><div>If your not a follower of Marr as a pally then you miss out on a great buff (Marr's Barrier) that is 10 hits for 20 sec. ona single boss mob this is amazing and  in conjunction with aura your LoH ability and the the unglued neck item from the vaults quest will make this really a mute point.. HOWEVER I wouldnt complain if they made it better <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Madbiker]

<p>Divine Aura is nearly fluff. If you are waiting for DA to be up before named pulls in RoK instances I am betting people are avoiding grouping with you, as it must take 2 hours to get thru most zones, and Chelsith must be a 5-6 hours.</p><p>The best thing you can do on pulls is ward yourself, if you fnd that you are unable to survive you are lacking in gear and adornments.  Try to make sure most of your armor is level 75 or higher, Mastercrafted may not be enough unless it is the new stuff in game im seeing.  Consider the zones as progression, CoA should be hit often as Vault and Chardok, grabs some pick up raids maybe you will see some plate drops in Protectors realm and finally finish off as many quest lines as you can, the rewards are better then most t7 fabled items. </p><p>When RoK launched, pressure was on in the guild that im in to reach level 80 so that we could raid within a week. I found that the legendary armor and quest rewards were enough to do instances as well as tank encounters in VP with some level of success, although I will admit there was a 3 tank rotation eating 1 shots.</p><p> This all being said I think Divine Aura is "ok" in it's current state, sure I would like to see a reduce on the recast and casting timer. Im gonna assume you dont know this, but crusaders have been the step-children of tanks in EQ2, dont look for a lot that is going to put you on par with guardians or the eaze of playstyle of zerkers. lol you are gonna have to work hard for DPS and survival, but it can happen and when you get there, people will remember you as one of the few paladins to be able tank well.</p><p>My advice is to sort your AA's out,  Crusader tree: consider maxing the defense in AGI line, Sta, and 4-4-8INT. Paladin tree: blocking mastery, wraths, anything that increases DPS and fast cast heals</p>

[Boethius_Permafrost]

If it blocks up to 50% of the paladin's max health, that's fine, as long as it actually does it.  I think blocking all damage is a bit much, but that would be more fair than blocking none.  The cast time is too long, yes.  That's my opinion. And the cleric version probably should block all damage.

[Arkinon]

And you sir would be poor. Im not sure why the personal attack. I didnt say I was Waiting for it to be up. And I was only using COA as an example. maybe you should read my post again. What i was getting at is that I think thats an acceptable timer. Not all boss mobs will need it. and it can be used as a valuable tool. Now CoA isnt a good example because of how close the mobs are together and the short duration but the point is still valid. I was saying I use it when its needed and gave examples of how it can be used in a planned fashion and not just as an OH SH*T king of way, and it HAS come in handy on numerous occasions for me. The only thing I do agree needs to be changed is the casting timer.<div></div><div>NOW To imply im a poor tank because i have an opinion that isnt the same as yours is rude and nearsighted and maybe you should check your holier then thou ego at the door.</div>

[Meirril]

<cite>Enrico@Permafrost wrote:</cite><blockquote>If it blocks up to 50% of the paladin's max health, that's fine, as long as it actually does it.  I think blocking all damage is a bit much, but that would be more fair than blocking none.  The cast time is too long, yes.  That's my opinion.And the cleric version probably should block all damage.</blockquote><p>If it was based on 50% of <b>max health</b> then it wouldn't be as much of an issue. What is currently works on is your current health. If you currently have 12k hit points, and a mob double attacks you for 4k each, your DA will won't stop anything that does more than 2k damage until your healed. </p><p>I've used DA to assist with difficult pulls, or to give me a chance to establish agro without healing. This is based on how DA works, not on how we would like to use it. Up until t8, it was a reliable ability. With the increases in melee damage the mobs have gotten, it isn't nearly as useful as it use to be.</p>

[g0thiC_iCe_cReaM]

<p>It <b>IS </b>based on 50% of max health.</p><p>If it's not working that way then it should be /bugged. I haven't noticed it not working the way it's supposed to. Granted we're still working on tier 1 T8 raids, but both me and our other pally raid MT have used it to keep ourselves up in PR. Our SK MT has been MTing Thuuga, so couldn't tell you about that one. It would be interesting to see what is happening on some of the higher tier raid mobs. If yeah the auto attack of the higher tier raid mobs is hitting for more than half your health and you're decently geared up then maybe a slight change to the mobs is in order.</p><p>Anyone have logs of it failing to block attacks that are less than 50% <u>max</u> health?</p><p>The casting time on it is fine. It's 1.5 seconds, it's almost instant for the most part.</p><p>edit:</p><p>and yeah I would love to see the recast lowered on it, but I don't think the developers will see it as a good idea honestly.</p>

[Kahling]

<p>It keeps me up in PR as well, all the time, as long as i have time to cast it (Its a good for pulling and positioning in there).  But go to the later stages of Kor Sha in T2 and you will feel differently about it, when your one shotted right through it with decent health left then tbh you will feel like me that it is a broken spell for T8.</p>

[g0thiC_iCe_cReaM]

<p>Does it not work regardless of wards (not just pally wards) or other stuff?</p><p>I remember when they change our ward to absorb after mitigation. Maybe DA is occuring before mitigation like our ward used to?</p><p>But yah, if it's basically useless there, then something should get adjusted.</p>

[Boethius_Permafrost]

<span class="postbody">"Anyone have logs of it failing to block attacks that are less than 50% <u>max</u> health?"I was pointing out that it's silly for it to block an entire attack for 49% of your health, but do nothing for an attack of 51% of your health.  My opinion is that it should (but does not) block up to 50% of your max health, regardless of how big the hit is.  </span><span class="postbody">I hope this post is less confusing.</span>ps: Arkinon, you got a cold reception for implying newbs just don't have enough health.  You might want to re-read the thread.  Divine Aura remains a good tool for group instances.

[g0thiC_iCe_cReaM]

Maybe a curve downwards to the amount it blocks past 50%? Like 10% down to 1% past 50% of max health?

[NANEEJE]

TO clarify/ I tank well, I am now well geared, and i use marrs barrier yes... I just want to offer as much to my group as i can. So why not ask if this particular spell is worth an upgrade, and yes, after seeing all your responses, i do. I think the recast timer should be 5 minutes, not 10. , leave the spell the way it is, just shorter recast. It is the best for pulling a group and setting a mob in all 6 of the top instances we do. Crypt of Agony (COA) Vault of Eternal Sleep (VOES) Court of Korocust (COK) Maidens Chelsith City of Mist (COM) (outdoor area in jungle) Divine Aura works great in all this area. But [Removed for Content] it, we are in ROK now, and we are doing T8 raids. And anyone who knows what its like to take on spiderlings in Tomb of Thugga, with our current spell casting timers and damage, KNOWS, that this can help if either it has a 5 MINUTE RECAST, or NEXT TEN ATTACKS. If you think its just fine, I'm guessing you don't off tank T8 raids. If you do.. then enlighten me to how you strip aggro from the raid when the main tank goes down. That is one of my jobs, when the tank goes down, dont let the mob turn to the raid force, and holy ground works great, i just want to back up holy ground with a faster cast , or shorter recast. One more thing Mad BIker, you are the first person i know who uses the entire agility line? how is that working for you... I dont see the benefits over others, but want some clarification, thanks.

[g0thiC_iCe_cReaM]

<p>Yeah, I've been a bit curious about the AGI line myself, been considering having an alternate spec for the AGI line for some raids after reading some stuff about max survivabiliy AA setups.</p><p>I wouldn't complain about the recast on DA being shortened...I'm kinda OK with how it is now, but I wouldn't complain about it <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>And yeah, grabbing the encounter when the MT goes down in AND surviving in Thuuga, or PR is a pita.</p>

[Arkinon]

<cite>NANEEJE wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I am a new player to this game, and I see Paladins, and all classes complain daily about things they would like to change, what do I know? Not enough to judge anyone. </p><p>I am  a Paladin, a Crusader, a fighter, and therefore, by nature, I tank groups into instances, and need to be competitive with the top tanks in the game if I want to be picked up. </p><p>Divine Aura is extremely useful on the pull to take some initial spike damage, I use it all the time on the harder mobs of Voes, Coa, and I have yet to finish Maidens with a group. I am not geared enough for one healer to heal me in Maidens, or I don't know how to keep myself alive.</p><p>I would like to see some fairness with this spell. While I haven't played the Guardian, it would seem that to go with the 'off tank' role that developers have obviously tried to place Paladins into for raids, our group tank role could use a little support. </p><p>I want to see a change in divine aura. While I have found a way to make it effective as much as I can. It obviously was used as a oh crap spell. So with this in mind, please, please....</p></blockquote><span style="font-size: 16px;font-family: Times;" class="Apple-style-span"><div><p>For raids I can see where it would be broken. As per his original post “I am not geared enough for one healer to heal me in Maidens, or I don’t know how to keep myself alive.”. (has been since changed) It was more of an open observation in general (in my opinion) & suggestions that may make this more useful for OTHER pallys reading this that might not consider it for casual use (as opposed to raiding) because they are getting hit so hard it negates the effect thus me giving examples of why a mob doesnt seem to hit me as hard to make this actually work. And no I dont raid much and im not “Raid Geared”. I have been down that road and really dont want to go back. As far as raids like I said no I dont think it will work well in its current form. THIS WAS NEVER to imply that Naneeje is a n00b. I have every respect for his opinion (even where we may disagree) on this forum as he has been of decent help to me in the past. For the most part the Pally forum has been of great help with open discussion without the stigma of ego. yet every now and then it rears its ugly head.</p><p>Sorry for the larger font my formatting isnt working.</p><div><span style="font-size: 12px;" class="Apple-style-span"></span></div> </div> </span>