Norrath is getting lazy

[Kordaem]

<p>Greetings fellow Norrathians. This is just my ramblings and opinion on the games 'Look and Feel' from what I've seen since EQ2 came out. </p><p>I've been an EQ'er for many years, Im just not harcore. I have a main who just hit 70, and i've been playing him for almost 2 years. I enjoy these online games for the Game aspect of it, not the exp grinding and trying to beat every other player to be first.</p><p>Since EQ2 came out and has been up and running, it seems to me like alot of what people ever do is whine and complain about how 'slow' or 'complicated' the whole of the game is.</p><p>Take Tradeskilling for example... anybody remember how Tradeskilling was when EQ2 first came out? It was tedious and slow, but REALISTIC! What was included for making a Sword? Collect the raw, forge the raw into a usable metal sheet/rod, sharpen the metal into a blade, mold the cross-guard, work pelts for the handle grip, ect. </p><p>Now, its just collect the raw and *POOF* Sword is magically created! People complained that this was 'slow' and time consuming when I think its just Detailed! Detail is what makes RPG's great, and when you take away the detail, all you have left is the 'necessary'! Leave your complaints at your Keyboard, dont drag them into the game. If you dont like the game, dont play! Just dont ruin it for the rest of us who ENJOY detail and extended gameplay.</p><p>Same goes with the Sub-class quest for becoming your class. I thought those were Awesome! Adds gameplay, storyline, character development, game interactivity! So what if you had to do a 1 hour quest?! Its was part of the game! And now they're gone.</p><p>If you want a faster paced game with less detail that allows you to zip through whatever you're doing... go to WoW!</p><p>Another thing is the lack of Roleplaying on the 'Roleplaying Server'. Is it just me, or does only about 10% of the people on the roleplaying server actually Roleplay? Its ridiculous! EQ has sooo many servers, why do you pick the Roleplay Server to go on if you Don't roleplay!? Minded, some people do enjoy RP but just dont do it often cause it can be draining, and cudose to those who do RP, but I see about 2 people a day who has their RP option on, and actually roleplays their character. I know alot of people dont roleplay cause they find it dumb... but why do they play EQ anyway? Get away from stresses of work/life, to relax? To enjoy the graphically pleasing environment of a digital world? I do all that, plus I enjoy RP'ing as it brings "life" to the game.</p><p>An example of a sudden (pointless) change to game play would be the Erudite racial ability to summon a Wisp. I had an Erudite Mage character not long ago, and I RP'ed him with his racial ability to summon a Wisp, which I thought was real cool.... but now that wisp is gone, and why?! It was just a fun "fluff" racial ability. Why take it out of the game?! Every Erudite character I knew was outraged that they just took it out. What was the reason? Were people jealous that only 'Erudites' could get a floating ball of light to follow them at level 10? Hmmm? So why didnt you just start playing an Erudite then!? Its that easy! Were people complaining that their race couldn't get it? Wisps are part of the Erudite race Lore from the EQ universe, and I know! I played an Erudite as a main in EQ1.</p><p>I know I may be rambling on, but its just the small little 'extras' in the game that bring it to life. It gives detail, adds unexpected surprises, brings choice and difference to each area/race/item/mob. Its what makes the game fun... And a little genecide isnt so bad either... **Glares at the Halflings in Rivervale** <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/908627bbe5e9f6a080977db8c365caff.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>Well, thanks for reading. It's just my two "copper pieces" on the matter. Feel free to reply or bash me however you see fit. I look forward to your BOLD text directed at me <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />. </p><p>Peace</p>

[Deathringer2]

I <b>STRONGLY</b> agree to every single one of these points.

[Valentina]

I disagree with everything (except the erudite wisp thing, which I have no feelings on). One of the reason my wife and I tradeskill now is because it's not so godawful as it was at the beginning. And it's wonderful to be able to try out a 'class' without having to get to level 20 to do so. Any argument that includes 'if you want... go to WoW' is flawed from the beginning.

[Shebara]

I agree with you, Kordaem, on Venekor, us RPers get shunned every time we publicly RP, and RPers make up about 1% of the total server population. But for those of us that belong to the 1%, we're proud to be there <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I keep saying that Venekor is too focused around pvp than actual gameplay and such. *shakes fist at the non-believers* It's sad, really. Has today's generation really lost all sense of imaginability and creativity? (though technically I belong to that generation, I act nothing like them)

[Kordaem]

<cite>xsikal wrote:</cite><blockquote>One of the reason my wife and I tradeskill now is because it's not so godawful as it was at the beginning. And it's wonderful to be able to try out a 'class' without having to get to level 20 to do so.</blockquote><p>Good point Xsikal. Tradeskilling is much... much much much much easier now, as you can harvest as much as 10 raws per click, instead of one (if you were lucky, lol), but this cuts back on craftmenship, how common an item is, and the skill needed to craft said item. </p><p>As for "trying out a class without having to get to level 20 to do so", nobody is actually 'playing' the class untill level 30! You get mediocre skills and afew AA... thats about it. If you want to try and play how the class is ACTUALLY played, get to 30. You'll be experiencing mid level raids and heroic instances that push your limited skills to stay alive... and most people dont survive their first heroic group as a class they are relatively new with anyhow. <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>We all need to learn how to use the skills we are given, not depend on how 'MasterCrafted' our equipment is. I've seen so many tanks, scouts and mages that just roll their heads across the keyboard, depending on their superb armor and just unleesh attack and magic, one after the other, without ACTUALLY learning to play the class correctly... and those are the people that dont get invited to the raids. They're better off going to WoW and playing a Warlock... "Sorry guys, people just dont invite the idiot to the Kegger" <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[dm]

The consumer sets the standard for the game.A lot of people outside the game would definitely disagree. Although it is a very understandable argument. If it took so much effort to level a tradeskill, many people would find it grueling, boring, and a tedious chore. That's exactly the kind of thing that would sway someone away from the game, not join it. SOE wants the game to be appealing, fun, and more enjoyable to attract new gamers or converts.That being said, it's rather understandable as to why it has been changed. Much to the delight of many.

[Jal]

The tradeskiling changes were an absolute godsend, i love the new system as it allows me to just do something i can enjoy for a while rather than hunt for the right components and tables and then build the thing taking 4 times as long.  If the tradeskill system actually produced end products that were of varying quality dependant on the resources used and the skill in crafting the parts (like SWG's craft system) then you can understand the more complex system but since the components had no bearing on the end product which ended up exactly the same as anyone elses then its just not necessary.There is really no such thing as a 'skilled' crafter in this game its just collecting items and combining them.  So its better to be fun for many than the reserve of the few who have time to do it the old long winded way.

[Rook818]

<p>This really boils down to 2 types of players. </p><ul><li>Those that want to play to be challenged and/or immersed in wonderful detail</li><li>Those who treat the game as a recreation. Something to do for fun, that is light and in todays busy world, can be pciked up and put down easily. </li></ul><p>The latter camp is by far, er by faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar the majority.</p><p>Why not have it both ways? IMO, there is no reason someone can't take the time to craft the hilt, then take the time to craft the blade then take the time to sharpen and then imbue it...those who do spend that time should be rewarded, not with a better item (because that wouldnt be fair, and would defacto require everyone to do it) but with more xp and or npc resale value.</p><p>In short, there 3 types of adventure content:</p><ul><li>Solo</li><li>Heroic</li><li>Epic</li></ul><p>Why not something similiar for crafting? Perhaps not group or epic in the sense they require multiple players (although that would be interesting) but heroic and epic in the sense they require more time and attention.</p>

[Cadori Seraphim]

Why do people play a game if they want it more realistic? It's a game and it should be fun, not boring and tedious.If you want cooking, for example, to take hours to do.. by all means you have a kitchen - go to the store and buy you some materials for a full blown feast and cook away. Game != RLI would like to add also, a page from your book, if you want things to be alot harder and slower to do - Go back to EQ1.

[ChodeNode1]

I'm sorry that there is no epic content for hardcore tradeskillers to feel really distinguished over the casual, but part of being hardcore like that means you make more money than us at it.My wife tradeskills about 80% of her play time. She's made almost as much money as I have adventuring through RoK content and its just sick. But I recognize thats because she's hardcore with tradeskilling and thats why she has the advantage over this casual woodworker (46) and sage (70). She's a 67 tailor and 46 carpenter who knows her markets and makes bank.

[Moralpanic]

And this isn't a whine because...

[Dreadpatch]

Oh my god, tradeskilling is so incredibly boring now. It was boring before, now it's beyond boring. Spam three buttons repeat, spam three buttons repeat, Spam three buttons repeat, spam three buttons repeat, spam three buttons repeat. The OP is right on, I hate tradeskilling and it's my right not to do it. I've tried it the old way and the new way (don't like either) and for completely different reasons. Old way was too much, new way is too little. I think they need to find an in between, maybe have to do the old school method to do pristine or imbued items, and do it the new way for all of the run of the mill stuff none of us want anyways. To remove all the challenge out of tradeskilling and make something repetition, well that doesn't exactly = a game to me either. Game requires some thought.

[Kordaem]

<p>Everybody here has very good points.</p><p>SOE bases the game on what the 'majority' wants, and most people want a "quick in, quick out" game style and I can understand that. </p><p>To get a decent group going either for exp or an instance, it takes (at minimum) 30 minutes to do so. You need to find people for a group, run to the location, buff up, make a game plan, ect. Some days I dont have alot of time to play myself.</p><p>The idea for Solo-Heroic-Epic contect was a good thing. They are adding more Solo content due to the fact that the number of EQ players is shrinking. I'm just waiting for people from other games to get tired with them, and discover how incredible EQ realy is. </p><p>One good idea I think would work good, is make the RP server worlds how they used to be... Bring back the Class quests! Bring back the 'tedious' tradeskilling, that actually takes time to Harvest and Craft each piece before creating the actual Item. And you ask 'Why' bring them back...? That would ACTUALLY be roleplaying that tradeskill class! Not just add some raw harvestables and Bang! Instant combines! Granted this may take more Server space, for leaving all other servers as are, and converting the RP servers back to the FUN type of gameplay. But how would this effect server space? Would more RP'ers join the RP servers to experience the actual RP aspect of the game, and all the other people who like to Zoom Zoom could go to any other server... There are only 3 RP servers! "If you dont Roleplay, Go away!" </p><p>That way, people who dont want to ROLEPLAY their character and tradeskill class... Don't join the Roleplay server! Ta-da! This would grant alot of peoples wishes while keeping the whiners at bay with 15 other servers that they can choose from.</p><p>I understand many people play the game for the character development and digital character interaction, its nice. Roleplaying is the same, except you act as your character would act 'if they were real'. This could also be done with reading a book, but you cannot control characters in a novel. With online Roleplaying, we enjoying creating a virtual story full of characters, adventures and plots! EQ's does state itself, "Where Adventure Comes Alive!"</p>

[Drewx]

<p>EDIT: Posted in wrong thread! So my original post is gone...</p><p>I agree that the subclass quests were fun. </p><p>But the old tradeskill system was TOO much...I still have scars from choosing Alchemist.</p><p>But RP servers forcing Class quests, and bringing up the difficulty would be nice. It'd definately push out the non-RPers who have the nerve to join the RP server but then turn around and spit and [Removed for Content] on every person who DOES RP.</p>