Of Wurms and Wyverns [Archive] - EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

Ama

02-20-2008, 10:00 PM

I'm a bit of draconic lore enthusiast so I have to ask how these things fit into everything. The Wurms seem to be part dragon and yet are very misshapen. As for the Wyverns i'm not too sure as to how these guys fit into everything. Are wurms another species within the draconic tree breed for war? Also what exactly are Wyverns and how do they fit into the Draconic tree?

troodon

02-21-2008, 12:39 AM

We don't have specifics but both are closely affiliated with Dragons, working for both the Ring of Scale and the Claws of Veeshan. In EQ1 both races had members which gave quests, meaning at least some (if not all) are sentient and reasonable enough to make deals with non-Draconic races.Also, EQ1 Wyverns looked rather more Draconic than their EQ2 counterparts (IMO)<img src="http://common.allakhazam.com/images/i/d/id4596.png" alt="" width="239" height="202" border="0" /><img src="http://common.allakhazam.com/images/i/d/id4473.png" border="0" alt="" width="483" height="457" />

Cusashorn

02-21-2008, 01:57 AM

Wurms are, and have always been simply: Dragons without wings. Thier intellegence among the Dragonic creatures is put into question since they seem to act more on instinct than sentient thought, though there are many cases of wurms who are just as intellegent as a dragon.

Ama

02-21-2008, 01:03 PM

This deffinately calls into question the draconic tree since it would be hard to figure out a place to put Wyverns. The wurms we are encountering in the Skyfire Mountains seems to be of the same genius as the Wurms on the Breeding grounds. However their species maybe a different variety. If this is true there is no telling how many species of wurms there could be. Dragons |Drakota / Droag Drakes/ Wurms WyvernsThat's what i'm assuming everything goes like. It could possibly be more like this however: Dragons | Drakota | Droag / | Drakes Wurms Wyverns Dragons are the highest beings there are and then there are the drakota which seem to pocess as much magical power as dragons, but in a deminished form. There is also the power of the harness to control the drakota. Droags have intelligence about them at times much more so than Drakota, but on the power scale they seem low ranked as servants. After that you get to the lower rung where you have Drakes, Wurms, and Wyverns which are breed mearly for battle. We saw the Drake and Wurm breeding grounds both in Lavastorm and in Tenebrous Tangle. However Wyverns are a bit unclear and don't seem to have a breeding ground per say that we have seen.

Cusashorn

02-21-2008, 03:06 PM

<cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote>This deffinately calls into question the draconic tree since it would be hard to figure out a place to put Wyverns. The wurms we are encountering in the Skyfire Mountains seems to be of the same genius as the Wurms on the Breeding grounds. However their species maybe a different variety. If this is true there is no telling how many species of wurms there could be. Dragons |Drakota / Droag Drakes/ Wurms WyvernsThat's what i'm assuming everything goes like. It could possibly be more like this however: Dragons | Drakota | Droag / | Drakes Wurms Wyverns Dragons are the highest beings there are and then there are the drakota which seem to pocess as much magical power as dragons, but in a deminished form. There is also the power of the harness to control the drakota. Droags have intelligence about them at times much more so than Drakota, but on the power scale they seem low ranked as servants. After that you get to the lower rung where you have Drakes, Wurms, and Wyverns which are breed mearly for battle. We saw the Drake and Wurm breeding grounds both in Lavastorm and in Tenebrous Tangle. However Wyverns are a bit unclear and don't seem to have a breeding ground per say that we have seen. </blockquote>I'd place the droag above the Drakota, personally, but no objection to the rest of those trees. However, like I said, there have been cases of numerous Wurms being as intellegent as a dragon in the past.

teddyboy4

02-21-2008, 03:56 PM

<cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote>This deffinately calls into question the draconic tree since it would be hard to figure out a place to put Wyverns. The wurms we are encountering in the Skyfire Mountains seems to be of the same genius as the Wurms on the Breeding grounds. However their species maybe a different variety. If this is true there is no telling how many species of wurms there could be. Dragons |Drakota / Droag Drakes/ Wurms WyvernsThat's what i'm assuming everything goes like. It could possibly be more like this however: Dragons | Drakota | Droag / | Drakes Wurms Wyverns Dragons are the highest beings there are and then there are the drakota which seem to pocess as much magical power as dragons, but in a deminished form. There is also the power of the harness to control the drakota. Droags have intelligence about them at times much more so than Drakota, but on the power scale they seem low ranked as servants. After that you get to the lower rung where you have Drakes, Wurms, and Wyverns which are breed mearly for battle. We saw the Drake and Wurm breeding grounds both in Lavastorm and in Tenebrous Tangle. However Wyverns are a bit unclear and don't seem to have a breeding ground per say that we have seen. </blockquote>Personally, I would think drakes should be on the bottom rung below Wurms and Wyverns. Even though Drakes look, for the most part, like miniature Dragons they generally don't seem to possess greater intelligence, IMO they are the dogs of the Dragon social structure. They seem to be used mainly for guarding places, important dragons, I can't think of any specific instance of drakes being used for anything outside of that. I also don't agree w/ placing Droag above the Drakota, I think they fall below Drakota but above Wurms and Wyverns. Here's how my chart would look: Dragons | Drakota | Droag | / | Wurms | Wyvern Drakes

Ama

02-21-2008, 09:22 PM

<cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>Here's how my chart would look: Dragons | Drakota | Droag | / | Wurms | Wyvern Drakes</blockquote>I'm not so sure about that tree Eandiil. The reason I would probably rate drakes at or above Wurms/Wyverns is the fact they have magical abilities. So far the Wurms i've seen arn't too bright as the drakes that have been seen. Big problem imho is identifying a drake and a Drakota. If you put a drake hatchling next to a drakota hatchling how can you tell the difference? Wurms are interesting creatures though since there seems to be many varieties of them. There's the ones in the skyfire mountains which seem to be almost dragon like. We see the ones in The Overrealm like we do in the rest of Norrath. However in Lavastorm the Wurms on the beach there are almost elemental in nature unless they are not wurms at all. As for Wyverns all I can do is shrug since I have never seen them till my encounters with them in the Skyfire mountains.

Vendolyn

02-21-2008, 10:00 PM

Their eggs were both deposited when Our Queen first laid eyes on these lands.To me, as She has placed several species of Her kind on the lands when she raked Her claws across them, I wouldn't see a tree stemming from only 1 or 2 places. Sure, some have been created through need, torment or magical malfunctions over the courses of history, but isn't it possible there were many rather than just one (or two)?

Ama

02-22-2008, 12:01 PM

<cite>Vendolyn@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote>Their eggs were both deposited when Our Queen first laid eyes on these lands.To me, as She has placed several species of Her kind on the lands when she raked Her claws across them, I wouldn't see a tree stemming from only 1 or 2 places. Sure, some have been created through need, torment or magical malfunctions over the courses of history, but isn't it possible there were many rather than just one (or two)?</blockquote>personally that's hard to say since dieties are complex entities. It's possible Veeshan dropped dragon kind then drakota kind onto Norrath then raked the land with her claws. Dragons viewed Drakota as lesser beings and enslaved them with the power of the harness. Droags probably came about through dragon wants of servants and were more easily controlled. Droags have intelligence and i'm betting dragons didn't recognize this which has lead to the split we see today. You have the Droags worshiping Harla dar, those worshiping Lord Vyemm, and you have the droags following the leaders within Veeshan's peak.

troodon

02-22-2008, 01:08 PM

<cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>Personally, I would think drakes should be on the bottom rung below Wurms and Wyverns. Even though Drakes look, for the most part, like miniature Dragons they generally don't seem to possess greater intelligence, IMO they are the dogs of the Dragon social structure. </blockquote>They seemed every bit as intelligent in EQ1. There was a Drake locked up in the Plane of Justice... I've never heard of putting a dog on trial for his crimes.

teddyboy4

02-22-2008, 05:51 PM

<cite>troodon wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>Personally, I would think drakes should be on the bottom rung below Wurms and Wyverns. Even though Drakes look, for the most part, like miniature Dragons they generally don't seem to possess greater intelligence, IMO they are the dogs of the Dragon social structure. </blockquote>They seemed every bit as intelligent in EQ1. There was a Drake locked up in the Plane of Justice... I've never heard of putting a dog on trial for his crimes.</blockquote>The drakes in EQ2 are the same as they were in EQ, which by and large, is unintelligent. There are exceptions to every rule, I'm sure the drakes have their Benji's and Lassie's just like dogs do. But, for the most part, drakes are not intelligent, just as, for the most part, Wurms and Wyverns are not that intelligent but there are specimens among them that possess greater intelligence. Oh, hey troodon, go check out the EQoA thread....

Ama

02-23-2008, 12:02 AM

<cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>troodon wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>Personally, I would think drakes should be on the bottom rung below Wurms and Wyverns. Even though Drakes look, for the most part, like miniature Dragons they generally don't seem to possess greater intelligence, IMO they are the dogs of the Dragon social structure. </blockquote>They seemed every bit as intelligent in EQ1. There was a Drake locked up in the Plane of Justice... I've never heard of putting a dog on trial for his crimes.</blockquote>The drakes in EQ2 are the same as they were in EQ, which by and large, is unintelligent. There are exceptions to every rule, I'm sure the drakes have their Benji's and Lassie's just like dogs do. But, for the most part, drakes are not intelligent, just as, for the most part, Wurms and Wyverns are not that intelligent but there are specimens among them that possess greater intelligence. Oh, hey troodon, go check out the EQoA thread....</blockquote>Well to me the question becomes is this intelligence because of some rare "Exception" or are the droags systematically breeding out the smart drakes. Kinda sucks to have an attack army that is smarter than you and one day may turn on you.

KniteShayd

02-25-2008, 06:28 AM

If memeory serves, Drakes are lesser forms of drakota. Drakes being more animilistic than the semisentient drakota.Droag, I thought, were a completely different branch off of dragon kind. And I thought that they have no direct lineage from drakota.As far as wyrm, wurms and are concerned, I thought that they were either lesser forms of dragons. And Wyverns were lesser, or altered, forms of drakota.

KniteShayd

02-25-2008, 06:29 AM

<cite>troodon wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>Personally, I would think drakes should be on the bottom rung below Wurms and Wyverns. Even though Drakes look, for the most part, like miniature Dragons they generally don't seem to possess greater intelligence, IMO they are the dogs of the Dragon social structure. </blockquote>They seemed every bit as intelligent in EQ1. There was a Drake locked up in the Plane of Justice... I've never heard of putting a dog on trial for his crimes.</blockquote>No, but if you have a bad or uncontrollable doggy, they are put to sleep after a hearing if they had an owner...

troodon

02-25-2008, 07:54 PM

<cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>on trial for his crimes.The drakes in EQ2 are the same as they were in EQ, which by and large, is unintelligent. There are exceptions to every rule, I'm sure the drakes have their Benji's and Lassie's just like dogs do. But, for the most part, drakes are not intelligent, just as, for the most part, Wurms and Wyverns are not that intelligent but there are specimens among them that possess greater intelligence. </blockquote>I'll grant you that I never watched much Lassie, but I sincerely doubt there was ever a time where she sat Timmy down and told him about her crimes against her people.<blockquote>Oh, hey troodon, go check out the EQoA thread....</blockquote>I'm up to speed on it, what about it?

teddyboy4

02-25-2008, 09:56 PM

<cite>troodon wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>on trial for his crimes.The drakes in EQ2 are the same as they were in EQ, which by and large, is unintelligent. There are exceptions to every rule, I'm sure the drakes have their Benji's and Lassie's just like dogs do. But, for the most part, drakes are not intelligent, just as, for the most part, Wurms and Wyverns are not that intelligent but there are specimens among them that possess greater intelligence. </blockquote>I'll grant you that I never watched much Lassie, but I sincerely doubt there was ever a time where she sat Timmy down and told him about her crimes against her people.<blockquote>Oh, hey troodon, go check out the EQoA thread....</blockquote>I'm up to speed on it, what about it?</blockquote><a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=60&topic_id=405621#4544472" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...=405621#4544472</a>

Ama

02-26-2008, 12:59 PM

Sadly I don't remember seeing many draconic entities within EQOA. The only thing that was in there for sure was the primary draconic bosses. Lord Nagafen and Lady Vox were sealed up in their respective prisons then you had the 2 other dragons.

troodon

02-26-2008, 03:06 PM

<cite>Eandiil@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote><a rel="nofollow" href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=60&topic_id=405621#4544472" target="_blank">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...=405621#4544472</a></blockquote>Vhalen gave an official response, there wasn't much point in continuing the argument. You were correct though, they did evidently advertise the game as a prequel