[Death's Grip] Mythical

[Araxes]

Not mine.Just posting the stats ... cuz they badass shizz.Proc damage will vary, obviously.<b>Cutoff stats at bottom are:</b>"Planar Infestation: Allows double Netherbeast or double broodlings to be summoned."<img src="http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/7673/eq2000002as1.jpg" border="0" alt="" />

[TuinalOfTheNexus]

<p>If I was a Warlock main I'd be feeling shortchanged right now.</p><p>It's not inherently a bad epic, but when you stand it next to the Wizard one:</p><p>- 30% more damage to 3 spells (of which only 2 are in a normal DPS rotation), at the price of those 3 spells becoming single target, is a joke compared to the Wizard epic giving around 30% to <i>every</i> spell without penalty (that's the 10% base +10% double attacks +bonus damage proc).</p><p>- Netherbeast can't touch a mob over level 85 so is completely useless. Broodlings have similar issues; and since most RoK epics AE them down within seconds they're situational.</p><p>- Aggro management effects aren't much use to a raid Warlock since either you're fighting single targets (in which case you don't have enough DPS to pull aggro even if you try), or are in a spawned adds group with amends. For the again extremely situational cases when you need the deaggro, you have to put it in the hands of a proc chance, which isn't good.</p><p>Then couple this with a propagation nerf, which has seen a fantastic group buff that almost justified bringing a Warlock to a raid full of single target fights made into a slight Synergism boost. In short, I'm probably gonna betray my Warlock alt to Wizard on the way to level 80, since even though I love the class, the devs consistently seem to engineer a situation where a Wizard is better on 99% of content, and a Warlock is only useful on 2-3 named epics per expansion. It's a real shame.</p>

[Jeger_Wulf]

Aye - I am thinking of betraying my warlock also. We have become marginalized IMO.

[hammerfil]

ours is [Removed for Content] compared to the wiz epic...real [Removed for Content]...i wont betray but seriously devs, as a raid lock (and this is obviously raid lock content) i have no use for a deaggro...id rather have this proc say "casters can wear chain" than have a deaggro...at raid level a one level deaggro wont make a [Removed for Content] bit of difference cuz ill get it back in a few seconds anyway.. if that proc is stayin at least make it a 20%-25% proc chance...make broodlings scale one level higher than the monster we are fighting if you want to keep that and give the broodlings extended time...acid rain is a <i>decent </i>proc..why the hell would i want to change my ae spells into single target?? i play this class cuz its ae...im not a wizzy, even the 30% increase isnt enough for me to use that proc cuz i can prolly pump out more damage using an <i>AE</i>..its completely situational..use on singles is wat that proc says..im not a singles caster....i would much rather have 10% spell double attack, 10% increase to hostile spells than any of those procs..completely unimpressed by that...but alas doesnt really matter cuz better weaps dont make you a better player <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> nice work devs<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[Araxes]

AE only becomes single when you <i>Activate </i>it.You can still choose.

[TuinalOfTheNexus]

<cite>Araxes@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>AE only becomes single when you <i>Activate </i>it.You can still choose.</blockquote><p>Yeah, which is still a joke compared to the Wiz epic unfortunately.</p>

[Windowlicker]

It looks interesting, I'd give it a whirl.  I can't say for sure until I see some parses.The hate effect on the regular epic alone has made my life better.

[Nere]

<p>This weapon proves without a doubt that they are <b>COMPLETELY</b> out of touch with the Warlock class.</p><p>Tell me .. when is the last time a raiding warlock worth anything cast Netherbeast?</p><p>This needs to be changed to Acid Storm or something else that's actually worth casting.</p><p>I was pretty happy with the group version of the epic and was really looking forward to the Mythical .. but after seeing this .. and also seeing the wizard mythical .. I'm just sad that I didn't betray when RoK came out.</p>

[Hellswrath]

I'll give them credit that it's creative.  And if the hit rate on netherbeast and broodlings was 100% and they were immune to AE's then it might be useful as well as creative.  But right now it is just horribly disappointing.  Especially if I look at it next to the wizzy one.  They used our epic to try and address warlock class problems that <i>they</i> created.<ul><li>Hmm, warlocks have aggro problems because hate management was more effectively designed around single target than encounter.  Good proc for the epic.....Yes, it is for multiple mob encounters.  Too bad there are precious few of those this expansion.  The large majority of content is single target.  While I love this proc for grouping (really, big <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  ), it is situational in raiding.  I'm not enough of a raider to know <i>how </i>situational.  I'll have to rely on the hardcore raiding locks to report on that.</li><li>The large majority of content is single target and warlocks are pushed further from the T1 dps that they were supposed to be.  Attempted fix added to the epic.  Now warlocks can turn on a buff and (damage and casting time taken into account) have Armageddon do more damage for them on single target mobs and also have the absolution line be worth casting on those mobs (haven't fully checked the numbers to see if this is accurate, but my mental math says it should be).  Not a bad idea, but two problems with it.  First, I don't know about others, but with all the spell recovery haste we can get, I don't really run out of spells terribly often.  So this boost is marginal at best and will remain situational.  Second, lets compare it to the wizzy bonuses on their epic.  Actually, I won't because I'm still to bitter about how shafted we got in comparison.</li></ul>All in all, I'm truly happy for all the wizards, since their epic will help put them more firmly back into the T1 dps that they should also be.I just wish our epic designers knew enough about the warlock class to have done the same for us.For the first time since launch, including the LU13 debacle, I am seriously considering rolling a new character to be my main since I'm truly tiring of seeing us get left behind as a class.

[hammerfil]

<cite>Araxes@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>AE only becomes single when you <i>Activate </i>it.You can still choose.</blockquote>your point being? my point was we are warlocks not wizzies. no one wants a clickie effect on a class defining weapon that alters the meaning of our class...ae=lock, single=wiz...so we have a completely pointless proc on an end game weapon..doesnt make much sense imo..

[Formerly Bbert]

[Removed for Content], is there absolutely no one in the warlock community that has any input with Sony?  Why do we keep getting this crap done to us.  Why don't Sony developers read the official forums for that matter.  If I recall, the broodlings fix wasn't mentioned on this board, but was posted by a developer on eq2flames first.

[Hellswrath]

That is typical of several devs on the official forums lately. I did some number crunching as well. If armageddon were to become single target and do 30% more damage, it would make it very slightly more powerful than bolt of ice. However, this is before you add in the 10% base damage wizzies get on their mythical epic. Plus the spell double attack. And this buff only affects three of our spells. Not impressed.

[notyou]

And of course don't forget that wizzies max their reuse on bolt of ice very easily.

[Supp]

<p>Hmm, that's kinda disappointing. </p><p>I had taken some away from raiding, but my guildies asked me to come back because they needed a lock on the Overking run. They asked if I wouldnt mind making my warlock my main over my necro, but I know underneath the cool lock exterior, Sony has never had a "real" place for locks in the game. That is not to say that I don't still like playing my lock. I very much do. But a lot of that has to do with my RP atomic explosion radiation dmg motif that I have going. Course RP doesnt affect your dps, but it's a big part of why I like the warlock. But man, these little jabs that SOE throws at the warlock are pretty annoying. </p><p>The more time goes by, the more I think that maybe it would have been better if SOE hadn't tried to diversify so much. Of each of the classes, there never-endingly seems to be a favored subclass. I don't think it's because some subclass dev hates the opposing subclass, it's just that they feel that the initial subclass (wizard in this case) was what the game mechanics intended. And so they either don't have the bandwidth or are too lazy to mold the oddball subclasses in magic, combat art and equipment concerns to fit a game they weren't really intended for. This is in part why I've been pushing for class consolidation. There should just be sorcerers and crusaders and such. Initially, it would tick off a lot of folks, but the later game cohesion I think would make it up for it pretty quickly.</p>

[TheLastB]

<p>although I dont have the mythical yet (just the fabled version) I consider it a big steaming pile of XXXX. AFAIK no other mythical is neutured by a single aoe (which 90% of raid mobs do)</p><p> I have parsed wocp and the fabled version and the wocp >>> atm........ I wouldnt be at all surprised if the wocp is superior to the mythical in dps terms in most t8 raid zones either which is just whack. (mobs simply aoe too much)</p><p> warlock mythical needs a tweak..no question......even if it had JUST the 10% increase it would be better than wocp but it doesnt......it has 30% to 3 aoe (1 of which isnt used) and an encounter nuke which doesnt switch to single target when in wizlock mode <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" /></p><p> wouldnt go as far as to say that its the worst mythical weapon out there - but its def the worst t1 dps weapon.......and by quite a way.</p><p> t7 legendary item better than mythical? GG SoE.</p><p>oh and if a dev ever reads this (which I highly doubt) you should make the double netherbeast cost 2nill crystals cos warlocks love to farm for nill crystals you know! >.<</p>

[Xedex]

<cite>TheLastBoy wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>although I dont have the mythical yet (just the fabled version) I consider it a big steaming pile of XXXX. AFAIK no other mythical is neutured by a single aoe (which 90% of raid mobs do)</p><p> I have parsed wocp and the fabled version and the wocp >>> atm........ I wouldnt be at all surprised if the wocp is superior to the mythical in dps terms in most t8 raid zones either which is just whack. (mobs simply aoe too much)</p><p> warlock mythical needs a tweak..no question......even if it had JUST the 10% increase it would be better than wocp but it doesnt......it has 30% to 3 aoe (1 of which isnt used) and an encounter nuke which doesnt switch to single target when in wizlock mode <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15"></p><p> wouldnt go as far as to say that its the worst mythical weapon out there - but its def the worst t1 dps weapon.......and by quite a way.</p><p> t7 legendary item better than mythical? GG SoE.</p><p>oh and if a dev ever reads this (which I highly doubt) you should make the double netherbeast cost 2nill crystals cos warlocks love to farm for nill crystals you know! >.<</p></blockquote>actually just the extra broodlings and netherbeasts alone add up alot of DPS. It is now actually worth casting the netherbeasts on raids. Just learn to time when you cast your swarms. Usually I cast them right after an AE goes off to get maximum DPS. Also just gonna add that most people that will get the mythical should or at least be attempting to get the Dark orb of the Mind off of contested mayong.

[TheLastB]

<p>not possible to use the old 'dark orb of the mind' trick ..........it helps all caster not just warlock.</p><p>wizard with dark orb/mythical/bloodthirsty = 30% increase to ALL spells just not 3 (1 of which isnt used) - and they have 10% spell double attack on top of that (not to mention the fact they arent hampered to single target when they click their mythical!!)......its a no brainer which one anyone with any sense would take given the choice of wizard or warlock one.</p>

[Xedex]

<p>i'd rather have the deaggro than the double cast. Why? because i see our wizard dying alot more than me because of it which equals less DPS. Yah i die too but not nearly as much. this mythical actually gives us the ability to survive and do our biggest potential. Even during AE fights because of it.</p><p>and how are you hampered by the clicky the mythical gives? Yah 1/3 of the spells people dont use, but if you can get your cast/reuse down enough Absolution(add bertox miracle/blessing it will do way more) is just another Distortion, Armageddon i cast on every single target mob anyways so that was just a bonus for me.</p><p> If you are so envious of the wizard one then just betray to a wizard. Personally I think our mythical is just fine the way it is.</p>

[Virulence]

Seriously, I wish people would quit the [Removed for Content] about how we got OMGPWND Vs Wiz mythical....If you can't keep up with Wiz in parses then roll another toon. And as Xede said, the broodlings + NB alone add a substantial amount of DPS, providing you know when yo cast it.As for the 30% damage increase on the AEs, with Armageddon average of 24k in 6 secs isnt bad, neither is Absolution.Most people who talk about the Mythical and prejudge it dont even have it, and most probably wont for a long time.

[Araxes]

There are yet some warlocks who see reason and logic. All hope is not lost. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[satyr-icon]

<p>I think the mythical epic holds "hidden secrets" that might nob be obvious to the average player. However, the weapon can not be obtained by the average player, so it does not matter. The Fabled epic can be obtained by anyone and is therefore easier to understand and see the benefit of. </p><p>To produce good dps numbers in a raid setting as a warlock, even on single mobs, you have to use your encounter spells. If you can produce 5k dps on single raidmobs without the mythical, then you would like to think that you can at least produce 6-7k by the 30% dps boost effect alone, adding the doubling of broods etc on top of that, the epic is extremely powerfull indeed. And to top it off, the deagro bit is extremely powerfull, it actually grants you extra dps from not having to worry AS MUCH about your agro in most cases.</p>

[Grue]

Hmm. I'm sorry if this question is already answered somewhere, but i couldn't find it.So when the encounter spells become single target, are their casting timers reduced at all? Or the recast for that matter, although it's not as important.

[CelebornXI]

only the base damage of the spells are increased by 30%, all 3 of our in encounter damaging spells..and for those warlocks who don't think we got screwed in comparison to the wizard epicROFL...I'd take 10% base damage for everything (since it also affects the procs on your gear) over a 30% increase to three, yes THREE, of our spells, one of which isn't worth casting even when with a 30% increase. Not to mention they also receive a chance to double spell attack.Is the proc on our mythical nice?yesDoes our mythical compare to the wizard epic (whom our class is supposed to be in "balance" tm with)?noIs our class still capable?yesDo I feel neglected as a class?yesCan I still destroy the parse?when I choose to <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Araxes]

So why are you complaining if you can destroy the parse anytime you choose to?Do you want us to be like Assassins, where we are sure to be nerfed in this upcoming wave of unspeakable class changes?I mean, all in all, we are in a pretty good way at the moment.  We still have unfair aggro mechanics, but THAT aside ...You would disagree?As a fellow AB lock, you know there aren't that many of us in T8 ... we got to represent!  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" />

[CelebornXI]

complaining about people who don't think we got screwed on our epicand how people think our epic is useful, while nice, it isn't great /shrug