Fallen Gate vs. Neriak

[Gimet]

<p>I don't frequent this particular forum a lot. But Neriak vs Fallen Gate...</p><p>Umm...</p><p>One in the same right? Is there any clarification as to why both stand...in the same place....or at the same time at all?</p>

[Josgar]

Fallen Gate is the old foreign quarter that got sealed off from neriak proper.

[Gimet]

<cite>Josgar@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote>Fallen Gate is the old foreign quarter that got sealed off from neriak proper.</blockquote>So the actual City Neriak that we know now....The guards that are built up on that first gate as you enter....that's not the true First gate? Or is it extremely long and reaches Neriak form Fallen Gate?

[Shemyaza]

like many aspects of early eq2, fallen gate was sticky tape plastered over an unintentional [Removed for Content] by the original design team. just pretend it doesn't exist and that neriak is ALL of old neriak.

[Cusashorn]

I'm sticking with the theory that the blocked up old entrance to Fallen Gate was just simply built over with the new contruction of the new quarter.

[Daemona]

None of this, of course, explains why the entrance to Fallen Gate is located in the Commonlands and the actual  entrance Neriak is now located in Darklight Woods. At the far end at that, about as far from Nektulos Forest where the original EQ1 as you can get. Face it, where Neriak is concerned the dev team took 'continuity' tossed it in a burlap bag and then proceeded beat it into a fine mash.

[Gukkor2]

<p>Christanos (and presumably those dark elves that she deemed worth keeping alive) retreated deeper underground after the Foreign Quarter was destroyed.  It's entirely possible that they moved the city with them, abandoning the old quarters that remained standing.  This would make sense in light of the Rending, which could have caused the rest of Old Neriak to cave in.</p><p>As for why the entrance to Fallen Gate is located in the Commonlands, keep in mind that the entrance we use now isn't the original entrance to Neriak.  We had to find a new way in, and the new entrance just happens to be accessed from the Commonlands.</p>

[Zabjade]

<span style="color: #00cc00;">The fallen gate entrance is actually a tunnel that goes under Nek Forrest, that is what I read here somewhere, anyway. what they need to do next FG Revamp is add that tunnel.</span>

[Cusashorn]

<cite>Daemona wrote:</cite><blockquote>None of this, of course, explains why the entrance to Fallen Gate is located in the Commonlands and the actual  entrance Neriak is now located in Darklight Woods. At the far end at that, about as far from Nektulos Forest where the original EQ1 as you can get. Face it, where Neriak is concerned the dev team took 'continuity' tossed it in a burlap bag and then proceeded beat it into a fine mash.</blockquote>Or they just retconned it to include an entrance leading to the Foreign Quarter in Commonlands as well as in Nektulos forest...

[Shemyaza]

i wonder where fallen gate was originally planned to be before they put it where befallen should have gone.

[TheLopper]

<cite>Shemyaza wrote:</cite><blockquote>i wonder where fallen gate was originally planned to be before they put it where befallen should have gone.</blockquote>FG is the new Befallen tbh...they didn't want to do both zones, so they stuck in FG and called it Neriak...and then made Neriak.

[Shemyaza]

<cite>TheLopper wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Shemyaza wrote:</cite><blockquote>i wonder where fallen gate was originally planned to be before they put it where befallen should have gone.</blockquote>FG is the new Befallen tbh...they didn't want to do both zones, so they stuck in FG and called it Neriak...and then made Neriak.</blockquote><p>they did do both zones. in what seems to be eq2's only dev mythology, befallen became stormhold for reasons oft repeated on the forum. what i'd like to know is where fallen gate was going to be situated before it was moved to the befallen location it's in now. maybe it wasn't called fallen gate origianly and they had to retcon the whole thing in. i dunno, and i doubt we ever will.</p>

[ElnAckom]

Either way one comes down on the relationship between Fallen Gate and Neriak, the idea of a long, deep abandoned tunnel down from Fallen Gate into the depths that eventually leads to Neriak has some huge gameplay potentials. The idea of the Mines of Moria, Ravenholm from HL2... the idea of places no longer traversed... that has some potential.I think that the idea that more modern Thexian construction led to the effective abandonment of older quarters seems consistent with an expanding subterranean culture. As a larger, better cavern is discovered, the smaller, convoluted, and sometimes cramped spaces of the "Fallen Gate" area would fall into disuse. Seems sensible even though it requires a little dancing around the early design foibles.

[Shemyaza]

<cite>Sesketh@Everfrost wrote:</cite><blockquote>Either way one comes down on the relationship between Fallen Gate and Neriak, the idea of a long, deep abandoned tunnel down from Fallen Gate into the depths that eventually leads to Neriak has some huge gameplay potentials. The idea of the Mines of Moria, Ravenholm from HL2... the idea of places no longer traversed... that has some potential.I think that the idea that more modern Thexian construction led to the effective abandonment of older quarters seems consistent with an expanding subterranean culture. As a larger, better cavern is discovered, the smaller, convoluted, and sometimes cramped spaces of the "Fallen Gate" area would fall into disuse. Seems sensible even though it requires a little dancing around the early design foibles.</blockquote><p>i'm not so sure. with neriak back in the game, FG looks like the gaffa taped zone that it really is. i'm sure it fixed a problem during beta, but now it's entirely superflous and is just plain <i>wrong. </i>it doesn't require a little "dancing around", it requires the suspension of reason and logic.</p><p>i guess it wouldn't bother me so much if i hadn't spent almost my entire eq1 time playing DE's from neriak. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[cephastri]

Here's my rather uneducated theory (which makes things fit for me anyway):Fallen Gate is in fact part of the original Neriak... the entrance is where it is because we needed a new way in (also, the distance between Neriak and CL I really don't remember as being that far when compared to what else was crammed into the zone - so it could still be some sort of emergency tunnel or something we didn't know about at the time of eq1).The current Neriak is an exact replica of the old Neriak, however in their arrogance, the dark elves have convinced themselves to believe that this is in fact still the original Neriak... conveniently ignoring the existence of Fallen Gate.How well does something like that stand?

[Xanzibar]

Is there anything that dictates that the current Neriak cannot be a different city from the original Neriak?  The Rending (or even the Shattering, depending on where the chunks o' moon landed) could have caused catastrophic damage to the entire city.  It's not unreasonable to think that the dark elves moved to a different location to rebuild after such a cataclysm (especially if caverns collapsed/flooded, etc).  Likewise, if they rebuilt, it's likely they would keep the same architectural styles they had beforehand.The only thing to really bork that explanation would be EQ2 Neriak having the exact same layout as it did in EQ1 (I never played, so I don't know).  It would be just a little too convenient to find another series of caverns in the same layout, I suppose... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[Coniaric]

Eh, they have magic, or at least, tools ... they can just carved out the space they deemed suitable. Then set up the layout that mimic the previous one, if they had to abandon the entire city for new one.

[Shemyaza]

<p>there nothing to indicate that neriak is not the neriak of old.</p><p>here's what has to have happened to put FG where it is today.</p><p>1. luclin go b00m!</p><p>2. a chunk hits neriak and cleanly clips the foreing quarter from the rest of the city. </p><p>3. this little islet sails around freeport.</p><p>4. somehow manages to either walk across dry land or row itself up the river.</p><p>5. finds a nice little spot on the exact location befallen would have been in pre-shattering.</p><p>6. finds a big foreing quarter hole where befallen has disappeared.</p><p>7. lines itself up perfectly with befallens doors and comes to rest.</p><p>marvel comics would be proud of retconning on that scale.</p>