Crit vs. CA dmg vs. DA

[Laereneth]

<p>Now that we're starting to see items with +CA damage and DA as well as more Crit gear, how do the three stack up against each other?  For us Swash, which yields more bang for the buck when evaluating gear?</p><p>Thanks!</p>

[Rippitt]

+DA% is only effective on one mob at a time, and only boosts auto attack damage. +Crit% affects both single target and AoE damage equally, and is probably the most beneficial of the three, since it affects both auto attack and combat arts together. +CA DMG can be extremely beneficial for a rogue, as alot of our combat arts are on such a short reuse timer, but only enhances a small aspect of our total damage output. I'd focus on boosting crit chance, while placing equal importance on the other two. If you are fencing, less importance can be placed on double attack items because it becomes very easy to reach 100% with the itemization in RoK.

[Kael Grace]

<p>that makes sense of course.    on a micro level though, is the +35 combat arts damage item going to yield a better result than a plus 2 melee crit solo, in a group, or in a raid?   how about +2 melee crit cloak vs the +15 dps you get from the Marr cloak proc?    Or how about an item that doesn't have these bonuses but yields +25 or +30 more str than the others?   </p><p>I haven't yet set up an adequate test to gather information on the relative values of each of these items in each relevant context.    if anyone does have anecdotal observations or any actual parse tests, that would be great.</p>

[Rippitt]

There really isn't a definitive answer to these questions other than to go out, find a zone that cons to you, and start killing. Going from 0 to 15 DPS may be more beneficial than 2% crit, but going from 110 to 125 DPS doesn't bring much to the table. Alot of this is situational - as a fencing swashbuckler I place very little importance on DA because having a dirge in my group and engaging a mob gives me an extra 20% on top of the AA increase, leaving only 12% to go before hitting the point of no returns (which is pretty easily had with gear). Here's an example. I tested three earrings: Droag Talon Plugs (2% crit + skill mod ), Sarnshak Earring of Jade (2% DA), and Planar Orb of the Wanderer (skill mod + proc damage) In a solo setting, I seemed to benefit alot more with the crit/da setup, since the proc earring has very poor stats and no other qualities to speak of. In a raid setting, the crit/proc combo absolutely blew it away. Getting proc% buffs makes a huge difference, and the lack of stats is basically negated by group buffs and this crazy thing called 'diminishing returns.'

[Kael Grace]

<p>I guess I'll have to create a macro to test the different options.    I have so much quest jewelry and other quest items (belts galore) that I can probably create dramatically different options  -- a crit option (which is my normal raid suit anyways), a DA option, a + to combat arts option and a STR max option (where you truly would get diminishing returns in a good group or raid.)</p>

[RaunII]

<cite>Rippitt@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote>+DA% is only effective on one mob at a time, and only boosts auto attack damage.</blockquote><p>I beg to differ...I have a skill called Hurricane...its also at master 1...and I also decided to spend AA points to enhance it. So apperantly unlike you, I have a 55% chance to attack everything in front and to the sides of me. meaning...I hit more than one mob....more than half the time...and enhancing double attack boosts my AOE damage by way more than bumping my CA damage would...</p><p>this is just my first impression, but I would say that best as i can tell, getting DA up first would give you the biggest bang for the buck, simply because swashy DPS is so auto attack dependant. </p><p>i havent done any math on anything yet, but just watching parses so far leads me to belive DA is still king to a certain point...after that i would have to do some math on how much of a crit % on a piece of gear you would need to overcome the dps gain of X amount of +CA damage, so i spose its number crunch time.</p>

[Rippitt]

Since when can you double attack on a hurricane hit?

[Deaudlus]

<cite>Rippitt@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote>Since when can you double attack on a hurricane hit?</blockquote>Since hurricane only procs of the primary weapons, double attacks give you a chance to proc it twice where as dual wield does not.  I think that is what he is talking about. 

[Rippitt]

Hurricane doesn't work in that fashion. It gives you one chance to AoE the group, and I think it can trigger even if you miss the target you're engaging. Unfortunately though, it doesn't offer you a chance to double attack on those hits, but it does proc anything that could normally go off on a main-hand swing such as Interrupt, Daring Attack, Blade Chime, Glory of Battle, etc. As of GU36, double attacks don't trigger anything but extra melee damage. That being said, it's certainly the most effective of the three on a solo mob.

[Deaudlus]

<cite>Rippitt@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hurricane doesn't work in that fashion. It gives you one chance to AoE the group, and I think it can trigger even if you miss the target you're engaging. Unfortunately though, it doesn't offer you a chance to double attack on those hits, but it does proc anything that could normally go off on a main-hand swing such as Interrupt, Daring Attack, Blade Chime, Glory of Battle, etc. As of GU36, double attacks don't trigger anything but extra melee damage. That being said, it's certainly the most effective of the three on a solo mob.</blockquote>So it used to proc off double attack and they changed it in gu36?

[RaunII]

<p>wow....i should be reading my patch notes more carefully...it was to my understanding that double attack was a extra AOE melee proc that was triggered off the primary weapon a certain percentage of the time (55% in my case). so, I was understanding that a double attack had the same chance of triggering a hurricane proc...hrm....ima have to read up on this cause i obviously had my head in the sand.</p><p>EDIT: was this a ninja nerf? this was the only thing listed in GU36 comments...</p><li>Spells or items with 100% proc rates will no longer trigger on both attacks when using double attack. </li><p>cause hurricane is a 55% proc rate...at master 1...after buffing AA...maybe i am just misreading this....</p><p>did they nerf it to all percentages of procs? are they lying to us?</p>

[AegisCrown]

they changed it farther back when they nerfed wurmslayer with wis line etc.  you havent had your DAs proccing hurricane for over a year

[RaunII]

ahhhh....thats why....my swashy is only a few months old...since i never read anything regarding it, i figured it would work how the game description stated. heh...well....forget i said anything,lol.