Enable EVAC in PVP?

[Elephanton]

<p>Should SOE change EVAC to be enabled in PVP in this case:</p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">1. You are solo2. You are being hated by more than one PVP enemy</span></p><p>What do you think?This would really help people who prefer to solo to escape unfair deaths from gank squads.</p><p>Just thinking out loud...</p>

[Amphibia]

No thanks.Nobody should be able to evac after they have engaged in PvP combat. Didn't see that other person approaching? Too bad. What do you think classes <i>without</i> evac have been dealing with since launch? It's already <b>way</b> to easy to for a lot of classes to evac away from PvP, would really hate to see it made it even easier. I'm sorry, but I think your suggestion will make classes with evac overpowered, lead more evac'ing in general, and people yelling at their own faction for helping out with kills.PS: Before you accuse me of wanting to roll soloers with my gank squad, I'm solo myself 90% of the time. And I'm getting mighty tired of everyone evac'ing every time they don't get the jump. I have to actually LET them hit me now to make sure they won't just evac away after I engage, something which is pretty risky business for an illusionist with no defense at all. Jesus Christ, how tired I am of that ability...../rant offTake the death like everyone else, rebuff and go back out again. Or blame the devs for not fixing the title system, if this is about fame.

[Spyderbite]

<cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote>Nobody should be able to evac after they have engaged in PvP combat. Didn't see that other person approaching? Too bad.</blockquote>I agree. When I see a group of yellows zone in on tracking I usually evac then to say hello and watch their funny little "Anger Dance" after a few futile pokes at me. XDNow, correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't evac only disabled if you are the aggressor? I could have swore I'd escaped a couple of gank attempts by evacing in the past. If so, doesn't that mute the OP's point that evac is unfair to Solos that are setup on by a group "unfairly"?I smell two different motivations for this post..1. Solo is upset because people are evacing before he/she can engage2. Issue with losing fame gain opportunities (see #1)

[Acolos]

removing evac while in pvp combat was the best thing soe did to pvp imo

[Roald]

Enabling evac in PvP would be a step in completely the wrong direction.

[Elephanton]

<p>OK, than help me with some ideas here.</p><p>Basically, I am trying to somehow address the following scenario:</p><p>1) I have long 1 on 1 fight.2) Someone else comes and makes it 2 vs 1 fight, and steals my win.</p><p>P.S. I am no scout, so I don't have radar and could not see them coming.</p>

[Acolos]

i know what u mean...I can't kill smoeone fast enough so it happens to me a lot too.. even tho i am a scout, and can see them coming..I suppose it depends what class u r?If you are a healer, you prob have the advantage in a one v one anywaysOptions?Fight in safer placesDon't soloKill them bothAccept the deathRoll a scout (but the same thing hapens, jsut that u get a 10 sec ish warning you're going to die)Duo with a scoutor.. maybe soe could "Lock encounters" in pvp too.. i duno.. will make it a bit restrictedi know what u mean tho

[MaCloud1032]

<cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>OK, than help me with some ideas here.</p><p>Basically, I am trying to somehow address the following scenario:</p><p>1) I have long 1 on 1 fight.2) Someone else comes and makes it 2 vs 1 fight, and steals my win.</p><p>P.S. I am no scout, so I don't have radar and could not see them coming.</p></blockquote><p>Buck up and take it.  Quit conplaining that you cant have it your way.  This is everquest 2 not burger king!</p>

[Acolos]

another option is a pve server with /duel tho

[Mighty Melvor]

<cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>OK, than help me with some ideas here.</p><p>Basically, I am trying to somehow address the following scenario:</p><p>1) I have long 1 on 1 fight.2) Someone else comes and makes it 2 vs 1 fight, and steals my win.</p><p>P.S. I am no scout, so I don't have radar and could not see them coming.</p></blockquote><p>I had this happen to me just last week - My freep Warden vs. Q Warden.  I had the Q Warden down to 5% power and I had ~25%.  Then a Conjuror Q came by and joined in the fight.  I was toast.</p><p>As bugged as I was, I chalked it up to just being in the wrong place at the wrong time.  This wasn't a /duel afterall.</p><p>Move on...</p>

[Elephanton]

<p>How about lock encounters in PVP, what's do you guys think?I've been also thinking about this lately.</p><p>If the fight lasts more than 10sec - it gets autolocked.10sec means it is not a one-shot scenario, supposedly it would be interesting fight for both parties, why not let them fight and enjoy the fight?</p><p>10 sec is plenty of time for everyone to engage (in case if you roll with a group / or out-of-group party).</p>

[Tamar]

To your first suggestion, evac; No.  Its removal was one of the best things to happen to PvP.To your second suggestion, locking PvP encounters; No.  No one should need to tell you how easily this would be to exploit.Please people, before you make a suggestion for a change, think about how easily it could be exploited and to what extent.  Please realize also that if another change (to reduce the exploitability) is needed to make your suggestion viable, then its probably not that good of a suggestion as now you have 2 changes required by the Devs.Just remove infamy as that is most likely what this thread is truly about.  No insult intended by saying that, I just don't think you would make this suggestion because you missed adding 1 to your kill count.

[Elephanton]

<cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>To your second suggestion, locking PvP encounters; No.  No one should need to tell you how easily this would be to exploit.</blockquote><p>Well, then it must be very easy for you to give me just one example of how it can be easily exploited, so please - give eme such example.How one can exploit automatic 1 on 1 encounter lock.</p>

[Elephanton]

<cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>Just remove infamy as that is most likely what this thread is truly about.  No insult intended by saying that, I just don't think you would make this suggestion because you missed adding 1 to your kill count.</blockquote>Of course not kill count, just well deserved victory stolen from me by some nub.As well, I hate when someone comes to "help" me killing my enemy in one on one.

[MaCloud1032]

<cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>To your second suggestion, locking PvP encounters; No.  No one should need to tell you how easily this would be to exploit.</blockquote><p>Well, then it must be very easy for you to give me just one example of how it can be easily exploited, so please - give eme such example.How one can exploit automatic 1 on 1 encounter lock.</p></blockquote>Almost all the fights i have go longer than 10 sec  And the exploit is this you keep your self perma locked no one can hit you.  So said person/'s are locked now that persone/'s engages who they want and cant be hit themselfs. People would dual box and perma lock them selfs having full immunity.  And you cant say well then after a x time the lock breaks because ive had figths last an hour and the whole time the 2 of us were fighting.There is your exploit

[Hinosh]

<cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Should SOE change EVAC to be enabled in PVP in this case:</p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">1. You are solo2. You are being hated by more than one PVP enemy</span></p><p>What do you think?This would really help people who prefer to solo to escape unfair deaths from gank squads.</p><p>Just thinking out loud...</p></blockquote><p>I think (just my opinion) if Evac was overpowered in PvP, then it was overpowered in PvE, although you must be pretty bad at the game to have to evac from a bunch of NPCs...</p><p>Isn't it funny how <i>no one</i> was calling any other class overpowered <i>before </i>PvP came out?</p>

[Harbringer Doom]

<cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>Isn't it funny how <i>no one</i> was calling any other class overpowered <i>before </i>PvP came out?</p></blockquote>What?No its not "funny."  It makes complete and perfect sense.Aside from the rare duel, no one had to truly go up against a PC class in order to play the game.No one really cared if a swashy could take down some random NPC quicker than a brigand could.  No one cared whether Wardens could out-heal damage being done to them by mobs better than the other healing classes.   On PvE, 99% of the time, if you're a healer, scout or mage and you're taking damage... you're doing it wrong.   The only one's worrying about being hit were tanks.  Again, aside from the random duel going on.And even when you duel someone, its not like you're decked out with dueling in mind on a PvE server.  Its an aside.  Whimiscal.  It means nothing.  Your specced to deal with mob mentality, not the PC mentality. On pvp, fighting other players is the focus of the game.  PvE a means to an end on a PvP server, for the most part its only done to advance your toons PvP abilities, whether it be gear or AA or Master drops.People weren't saying other players were overpowered... but there is always discussion about whether mobs are overpowered... because that's who your opponent is! 

[Roald]

<p>Woah, this thread is going from bad to worse.</p><p>Sorry, but this is open PvP, if you want duels, please go to a blue server or use the arena. I personnally LOVE a fair 1v1, but part of the reason it's exciting is because of the Open aspect of PvP.</p><p>With perma-immunites, evac etc in the game, EQ2 is carebear enough already, please don't make it more so.</p>

[Hinosh]

<cite>Horknut@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite> <blockquote><cite></cite><p>Isn't it funny how <i>no one</i> was calling any other class overpowered <i>before </i>PvP came out?</p></blockquote>What?No its not "funny."  It makes complete and perfect sense.Aside from the rare duel, no one had to truly go up against a PC class in order to play the game.No one really cared if a swashy could take down some random NPC quicker than a brigand could.  No one cared whether Wardens could out-heal damage being done to them by mobs better than the other healing classes.   On PvE, 99% of the time, if you're a healer, scout or mage and you're taking damage... you're doing it wrong.   The only one's worrying about being hit were tanks.  Again, aside from the random duel going on.And even when you duel someone, its not like you're decked out with dueling in mind on a PvE server.  Its an aside.  Whimiscal.  It means nothing.  Your specced to deal with mob mentality, not the PC mentality. On pvp, fighting other players is the focus of the game.  PvE a means to an end on a PvP server, for the most part its only done to advance your toons PvP abilities, whether it be gear or AA or Master drops.People weren't saying other players were overpowered... but there is always discussion about whether mobs are overpowered... because that's who your opponent is!  </blockquote><p>So no matter how many changes are made to PvP, certain classes will always be "overpowered." Why should people who play on PvE servers be able to escape a fight easily when PvPeople might as well be rooted in place the moment they engage another player?</p><p>And other thing, no class is overpowered in PvP. It might look like it, but it's not. If there's a class you can't beat no matter what you try...</p><p>... try grouping with other players.</p><p>If a game has PvP and the option to group, then it is a group oriented game. Don't worry about how you can't kill anything solo.</p><p>Groups > Solo. Wardens are overpowered in PvP? You haven't seen a warden vs. a ranger, a templar, a berserker & a wizard, have you? Scouts kill you in two seconds whenever you play your "squishie" warlock? Maybe true, but they won't kill a warlock AND a guardian, now, will they? Maybe then, too, but how about a warlock, guardian, templar AND fury, hmm?</p>

[Tamar]

<cite>Darksavanna@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>To your second suggestion, locking PvP encounters; No.  No one should need to tell you how easily this would be to exploit.</blockquote><p>Well, then it must be very easy for you to give me just one example of how it can be easily exploited, so please - give eme such example.How one can exploit automatic 1 on 1 encounter lock.</p></blockquote>Almost all the fights i have go longer than 10 sec  And the exploit is this you keep your self perma locked no one can hit you.  So said person/'s are locked now that persone/'s engages who they want and cant be hit themselfs. People would dual box and perma lock them selfs having full immunity.  And you cant say well then after a x time the lock breaks because ive had figths last an hour and the whole time the 2 of us were fighting.There is your exploit</blockquote>Thanks Dark.  I wasn't going to even offer an example as it was blindingly obvious.Farming named in FG on your Q and having problems with Freeps running you out?  np, just duel box a level 10 who tags you and forms a locked encounter whenever the enemy is near.  Same for questing in DLW, camping HQ mobs, etc.  So now I have my encounter locker bot with me I can go anywhere I want and peeps can't attack me, yet I can attack them.  A level 70 with his encounter lock bot could walk right into the middle of a contested pull on an Avatar and and get first shot at who ever he wants.  And if you change the code so that if I am locked that I can't attack someone else other than the first one I am locked with?  Easily exploited as well.I'm not trying to be overly critical or come across as rude in any way, but these are blatantly obvious exploits that should have kept the idea from even being mentioned.Its understandable to want to have and finish glorious 1 vs 1's.  But to enforce that a 1 vs 1 gets to happen in an open zone on a PvP server is something that I don't believe should ever happen.Before anything like that happens, they just need to code the Arena to work with PvP rules.  That would give all the /duel'ers a place to go.

[Hinosh]

<cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>Before anything like that happens, they just need to code the Arena to work with PvP rules.  That would give all the /duel'ers a place to go.</blockquote>The arena does work with PvP rules.

[Tamar]

<cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>Before anything like that happens, they just need to code the Arena to work with PvP rules.  That would give all the /duel'ers a place to go.</blockquote>The arena does work with PvP rules.</blockquote>Are you sure?When did that change?

[Valdar]

If anything evac should be removed or put on a very, very long recast timer.You want an escape? Fine, but make it one with some risk like running away and not a teleport to safety.

[Darkor]

<p>No no no!!!!</p><p>Sigh, why do people play on a pvp server when they want a duell server?</p><p>Ofcourse you will have someone else jump you while you are having a fair fight, you are in a hostile envirement.</p><p>And please no LOCK ENCOUNTER. Let me repeat, this is PLAYER VS PLAYER, evil vs. good!</p><p>If one of my buddys fight im going to help him</p><p>PS: even tho i have a general scout i will be the first to quit if sony enables evac in combat.</p>

[Darkor]

<cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>Before anything like that happens, they just need to code the Arena to work with PvP rules.  That would give all the /duel'ers a place to go.</blockquote>The arena does work with PvP rules.</blockquote>The Arena still does NOT follow pvp rules. Ive duelled my guildmate 3 days ago.

[Roald]

<cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>Before anything like that happens, they just need to code the Arena to work with PvP rules.  That would give all the /duel'ers a place to go.</blockquote>The arena does work with PvP rules.</blockquote>Incorrect, it still uses PvE rules sadly. No one knows why.

[Diern]

<p>Only for Shadowknights, and definately only in the situation you illustrated... why?</p><p>1. Shadowknight evac recast is alot longer than the other classes that can evac</p><p>2. Shadowknights cannot track. Most of the time we are ambushed by groups when soloing.</p><p>3. and most importantly the fact that Sk's cannot defend themselves without getting into combat. the Caress line Sk's would have this on constantly. This means it only takes one melee hit from the stealthed scout and we are tecnically in combat even though the poor sk has not fought back or is even aware of his attackers.</p><p>Same goes for the Blessing line, basically there is nothing an sk can do defensively in this situation which would not also place him in combat.</p>

[Eybietie]

<cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>I think (just my opinion) if Evac was overpowered in PvP, then it was overpowered in PvE, although you must be pretty bad at the game to have to evac from a bunch of NPCs...<span style="color: #ff6600;"><i>at the beginning of pvp server - you were invincible with evac up. you could engageeverything and everyone and if something goes wrong - zing - you are gone.</i></span><p>Isn't it funny how <i>no one</i> was calling any other class overpowered <i>before </i>PvP came out?</p><p><span style="color: #ff9900;"><i>oh that is wrong. it was just spread all over the eq2 forum and notconcentrated into this one section</i></span> <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>

[Amphibia]

<cite>Diernes wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Only for Shadowknights, and definately only in the situation you illustrated... why?</p><p>1. Shadowknight evac recast is alot longer than the other classes that can evac</p><p>2. Shadowknights cannot track. Most of the time we are ambushed by groups when soloing.</p><p>3. and most importantly the fact that Sk's cannot defend themselves without getting into combat. the Caress line Sk's would have this on constantly. This means it only takes one melee hit from the stealthed scout and we are tecnically in combat even though the poor sk has not fought back or is even aware of his attackers.</p><p>Same goes for the Blessing line, basically there is nothing an sk can do defensively in this situation which would not also place him in combat.</p></blockquote>If you need evac for your SK, then I need it for my monk and illusionist too. Same goes for all other classes out there. Would have been better if they just removed it.

[convict]

<cite>Diernes wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Only for Shadowknights, and definately only in the situation you illustrated... why?</p><p>1. Shadowknight evac recast is alot longer than the other classes that can evac</p><p>2. Shadowknights cannot track. Most of the time we are ambushed by groups when soloing.</p><p>3. and most importantly the fact that Sk's cannot defend themselves without getting into combat. the Caress line Sk's would have this on constantly. This means it only takes one melee hit from the stealthed scout and we are tecnically in combat even though the poor sk has not fought back or is even aware of his attackers.</p><p>Same goes for the Blessing line, basically there is nothing an sk can do defensively in this situation which would not also place him in combat.</p></blockquote>SK's are already the best plate tank for pvp. You have an I win button, get someones health down a little, then press HT, easy fame. You already have attacks that HEAL, a ward that HEALS, DOES DAME, AND WARDS DAMAGE. Anything else you want? How bout Wizard nukes (like furies have with heals), how bout some bow attacks a ranger has? We wouldnt want it to be too hard for the SK, now would we?Why is this thread even started? Fame, someone got killed, lost some fame, and came here looking for easy mode. Scouts already have it way to easy. Evac AND tracking should have been removed BEFORE pvp went live.Evac is nothing more than an easy out for anyone who has it, mainly scouts. We dont need anymore easy outs, we need pvp instead.

[zorros]

<cite>Hinosh wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Tamarah wrote:</cite><blockquote>Before anything like that happens, they just need to code the Arena to work with PvP rules.  That would give all the /duel'ers a place to go.</blockquote>The arena does work with PvP rules.</blockquote>It doesnt work with pvp rules