Just got owned by a green wizard..

[Bozidar]

Manashield is completely overpowered.. i had no shot (without pumice stone)

[Snowlywhite]

without ms, they're so underpowered it ain't even funny... with ms they're so op, it ain't funny either...

[Gagla]

What level was the wizard, because I'm sure the AA trees were designed with t2 and t3 in mind.

[Bozidar]

<cite>Gaglaak@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>What level was the wizard, because I'm sure the AA trees were designed with t2 and t3 in mind.</blockquote><p>24...  4 level zone.</p><p> I can take it, i'm not sore.. but really, i had no shot <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Bozidar]

<cite>Snowlywhite@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>without ms, they're so underpowered it ain't even funny... with ms they're so op, it ain't funny either...</blockquote>I agree with ya.

[ladyvengeance]

<cite>Gaglaak@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>What level was the wizard, because I'm sure the AA trees were designed with t2 and t3 in mind.</blockquote>I'm wondering that too. You need what, 22 points to get manashield? Any wizard worth his salt should go for magi shielding first, and that takes 8 points, another 2 in cold whirl, so minimum level for manashield is around 22 I guess.

[KannaWhoopass]

<p>wait to see it come up in buff window</p><p>poor pvp wizards use it early </p><p>snare and run out of range for 30 seconds come back own his face</p><p>better will save it ....</p><p>stun stun kill</p><p>when it goes up </p><p>run 30 seconds come back and own em</p>

[G1Joe]

<p>Wizzies are not overpowered ffs</p><p>Manashield makes them at least playable @ T7, now warlocks with nullmail+manashield + ward items make them imho very close to being OP and certainly one of the harder classes in EQ2 </p>

[Greenion]

<p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #99cc00;">ROFLZ</span><b>!</b></span></p><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #339900;">great thread</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">made me spill my cofee</span>.</span></p><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #339900;">pffftz</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">um ya</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">sorcerers can get manashield at lvl 22</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">we have been over all this</span>.</span></p>

[Tae]

I think manashield is very very powerful on a warlock. As said, Nullmail + manashield + focused casting makes for a character that is almost impossible to beat. A certain bot warlock on Venekor has been up at Dreadnaught rank because of this. On a wizard, it's absolutely needed. Don't you remember the days of attacking a wizard in a full group first and knowing for a fact he'd die before he could cast? And running away often doesn't work. They'll just use numbing cold on you or whatever, and there's only so many times you can pop potions in a fight before they're on timers. If there's something to hide behind it's fine, but otherwise it isn't going to work. Plus pumice stone is worthless. It removes all sorts of rubbish from people but never, ever the manashield. I think it's bizzare that my Vaunt (brigand taunt) removes about 6 things from a templar and it's free and something I can use every 14 seconds, but a pumice stone removes maybe 2 things and costs a fortune.

[Elephanton]

Manashield should be reduced to 10-15 sec in PVP, or its damage to power rating increased back to 1:1.

[Roald]

<cite>Greenion wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #99cc00;">ROFLZ</span><b>!</b></span></p><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #339900;">great thread</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">made me spill my cofee</span>.</span></p><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #339900;">pffftz</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">um ya</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">sorcerers can get manashield at lvl 22</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">we have been over all this</span>.</span></p></blockquote><p>They can get MS at level 17.</p><p>p.s. Raike, what happened to all your snares?!</p>

[Bozidar]

<cite>Milambers@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Greenion wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #99cc00;">ROFLZ</span><b>!</b></span></p><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #339900;">great thread</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">made me spill my cofee</span>.</span></p><p><span style="color: #00ff00;"><span style="color: #339900;">pffftz</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">um ya</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">sorcerers can get manashield at lvl 22</span>, <span style="color: #339900;">we have been over all this</span>.</span></p></blockquote><p>They can get MS at level 17.</p><p>p.s. Raike, what happened to all your snares?!</p></blockquote><p>Used them too late.  I got away, but his dot's ticked off on me.</p><p>Plus.. since my guildie buttwipes never pvp with me on that toon, i rarely take him out.. so i wasn't used to the placement of my healpotions and other assorted goodies. (Yeah, i made a mistake or two in the fight, but i'd have been able to kill a green druid, pally, SK, shaman, cleric, brawler, fighter, bard, rogue or predator even while making those mistakes. Let's not mention how low of a chance a chanter or conjuror has against an orange con'd rogue).</p><p>Then again.. i wasn't exactly prepared to have such a tough time with a green sorcerer.  Ah well, life goes on <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Now i have to go on a [Removed for Content]-murdering spree in order to get my K-D back up.</p>

[MaCloud1032]

<p>Iam sorry but Manashield is not OP in any way.  Learn to time your interupts and stuns.  To a scout a mage no matter how they are specked should be just a speed bump.  Hell as a tank i love it when they pop it makes me put soem strat into the fight instead of just beat the crap out of them.  Give them a 3:1 for all i care.  </p><p>Or run with a tank and have him taunt for the brunt of the beating just saying</p>

[Krakelkr]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think manashield is very very powerful on a warlock. As said, Nullmail + manashield + focused casting makes for a character that is almost impossible to beat. A certain bot warlock on Venekor has been up at Dreadnaught rank because of this.snip </blockquote>I take it you mean Umuzia? Why does ppl say he's a bot (I've heard it from several players)? He has a full set of token armour, is alwas pvping and I never saw him use botting macros. He's also fully pvp specced AFAICT and in a guild.What I wan't to say with this isn't that warlock-bots aren't powerful, only that loosing to Umuzia isn't something to be embarrased of :P

[Bozidar]

<cite>Darksavanna@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Iam sorry but Manashield is not OP in any way.  Learn to time your interupts and stuns.  To a scout a mage no matter how they are specked should be just a speed bump.  Hell as a tank i love it when they pop it makes me put soem strat into the fight instead of just beat the crap out of them.  Give them a 3:1 for all i care.  </p><p>Or run with a tank and have him taunt for the brunt of the beating just saying</p></blockquote><p>I know how to play my class, thanks <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I made mistakes, but it wasn't stuns/interrupts.</p><p>When a wizard can throw up a buff that (even when 4 levels lower than I) can virtually give them 2X my HP.. there's really little i can do about it with my 2 stuns (one on a long timer) and what, 2 interrupts?</p><p>Oh, and my resists are pretty [Removed for Content] good, FYI.  MS is op.. </p>

[MaCloud1032]

Iam sorry that response from the guy whos response to everyone else is L2P or invite is your friend is well priceless.

[Zapo]

scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Dh]

<p>Yeah Bozidar:</p><p>Stop Crying</p><p>I have no problem against that</p><p>L2P</p><p>/invite is your friend</p><p>Go back to bluebie server</p>

[max.power]

Bozidar, you already stated by yourself that you made mistakes, screwed the fight - and still you say "MS is OP"?! I don't get it....

[Magius789]

<cite>Krakelkrak wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think manashield is very very powerful on a warlock. As said, Nullmail + manashield + focused casting makes for a character that is almost impossible to beat. A certain bot warlock on Venekor has been up at Dreadnaught rank because of this.snip </blockquote>I take it you mean Umuzia? Why does ppl say he's a bot (I've heard it from several players)? He has a full set of token armour, is alwas pvping and I never saw him use botting macros. He's also fully pvp specced AFAICT and in a guild.What I wan't to say with this isn't that warlock-bots aren't powerful, only that loosing to Umuzia isn't something to be embarrased of <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote>I agree...why people think Umuzia is a bot is beyond me.  English just isn't his language so talking to him can be a bit interesting.  He's in BoD and does have full PvP gear plus all sorts of other good items.  The man is obsessed with PvP and is very good at it.  So keep calling him a bot if you want but I think super bot would be a more appropriate name.  I know I wouldn't want to meet him in the wild.

[Elephanton]

<cite>Anthur@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>Sorry, but mage with manashield owns <b>everyone</b>, not just scouts.Which is why manashield is clearly OP.

[Bozidar]

<cite>Brain@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Bozidar, you already stated by yourself that you made mistakes, screwed the fight - and still you say "MS is OP"?! I don't get it....</blockquote><p>Understood.  And I could have beaten him, maybe, if i hadnt' made those mistakes.. </p><p>But we're not talking about an orange con here.  We're talking about a guy that's 4 (significant) levels lower than me, who's not in pvp gear (not that mages get very much love from pvp gear anyway).</p><p>And i'm not crying "nerf MS".</p><p>I'm saying MS is OP.</p><p>Lots of things are OP...</p><p>I'm just sharing an experience i had in the game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  and thanks folks, I have learned to play better.. good advice <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Dh]

<cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Anthur@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15"></blockquote>Sorry, but mage with manashield owns <b>everyone</b>, not just scouts.Which is why manashield is clearly OP.</blockquote><p>So sorcerers only win because they have OP manashield and it wasn't because they were more skilled?  </p><p>I believe casters in general are better players as they have to be more careful in the way they play in both PVE and PVP. Brigs and Swash can run around and mash their attacks in any order and wtfpwn people and NPCS.  Most melee classes have DPS that can be casted on the move and can be casted many times faster than any mage. Mages have to pay more attention to what their attacks do and cast them in the correct order or die. Mages also have to rethink their strategy everytime someone resists one of their spells WAY more than any melee has to change due to a missed attack which happens about 80% less often. </p><p>Some mages get control spells for protection and sorcerers get manashield because they can't stop people from beating on them/interrupting their longer cast times compared to other mages. </p><p>Its hard to grasp but manashield is very well balanced at higher levels. Low levels yes it is OP just like most end line AA abilities. I guess that makes sense since AA was made to start at level 20 then changed to 10 later on.</p>

[liveja]

<cite>Bozidar wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>And i'm not crying "nerf MS".</p><p>I'm saying MS is OP.</p></blockquote><p>I'm confused. You're saying MS is "overpowered", yet you're not calling for a "nerf"?</p><p>What are you saying, then?</p>

[Bozidar]

<cite>Dhye@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Anthur@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15"></blockquote>Sorry, but mage with manashield owns <b>everyone</b>, not just scouts.Which is why manashield is clearly OP.</blockquote><p>So sorcerers only win because they have OP manashield and it wasn't because they were more skilled?  </p><p>I believe casters in general are better players as they have to be more careful in the way they play in both PVE and PVP. Brigs and Swash can run around and mash their attacks in any order and wtfpwn people and NPCS.  Most melee classes have DPS that can be casted on the move and can be casted many times faster than any mage. Mages have to pay more attention to what their attacks do and cast them in the correct order or die. Mages also have to rethink their strategy everytime someone resists one of their spells WAY more than any melee has to change due to a missed attack which happens about 80% less often. </p><p>Some mages get control spells for protection and sorcerers get manashield because they can't stop people from beating on them/interrupting their longer cast times compared to other mages. </p><p>Its hard to grasp but manashield is very well balanced at higher levels. Low levels yes it is OP just like most end line AA abilities. I guess that makes sense since AA was made to start at level 20 then changed to 10 later on.</p></blockquote><p>I can support that statement.  I think this is all pretty much true, on the upanup, and whatnot.</p><p>But there is no end-line that is as OP as MS. Not at low levels, not at high levels.</p><p>-- note : There sure is heck isn't one that I have or have seen.</p>

[Bozidar]

<cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I'm confused. You're saying MS is "overpowered", yet you're not calling for a "nerf"?</p><p>What are you saying, then?</p></blockquote><p>Some things in the game are overpowered.  That's life.. learn to deal with it.  And when you get embarassed by something, rather than getting all angry and mad about it.. relax <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Nerfs aren't always needed.. sometimes you just lose, and it's ok to show everyone the embarassing time when you got caught with your pants down.</p><p>I'm saying I got owned by a green wizard.  Manashield is ridiculous.</p><p>That's all <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Gagla]

<cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Anthur@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img mce_tsrc=" />" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>Sorry, but mage with manashield owns <b>everyone</b>, not just scouts.Which is why manashield is clearly OP.</blockquote>I don't get owned by sorcerors, so... clearly your statement is incorrect.

[zorros]

<cite>Gaglaak@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Anthur@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img mce_tsrc=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>Sorry, but mage with manashield owns <b>everyone</b>, not just scouts.Which is why manashield is clearly OP.</blockquote>I don't get owned by sorcerors, so... clearly your statement is incorrect.</blockquote>I have never been owned either by a mage using manashield.<span style="font-size: x-large;">EVER</span>.

[liveja]

<cite>Bozidar wrote:</cite><blockquote>Some things in the game are overpowered.  </blockquote><p>To me, calling something "overpowered" means you think it's "broken" or otherwise "wrong".</p><p>I can't understand why someone would call something "broken" or "wrong" & NOT want it "fixed".</p><p>While I definitely agree with the "relax & deal with it" part, I'm still confused, so perhaps a "yes" or "no" question will suffice:</p><p><b><span style="color: #00cc00;">Do you think Mana Shield is "broken" or otherwise "wrong" & in need of "fixing", or do you not?</span></b></p>

[Bozidar]

<cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><b><span style="color: #00cc00;">Do you think Mana Shield is "broken" or otherwise "wrong" & in need of "fixing", or do you not?</span></b></p></blockquote><p>Noppers.  It's just ridiculous <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>But that doesn't mean it's ruined my gameplay experience - quite the opposite.</p>

[Dekiri]

Ok for the record i have 23 AA at 24 and i have manashield and the rest on the improved shield thingyAs a troub you just lack the damage to do anything to a wizard with that setup at that level sorry. Thats life =)

[Bozidar]

<cite>Dekiri wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok for the record i have 23 AA at 24 and i have manashield and the rest on the improved shield thingyAs a troub you just lack the damage to do anything to a wizard with that setup at that level sorry. Thats life =)</blockquote><p>It wasn't my troub.. and what city/server are ya in?</p><p>The class it was (at 28, not 32 like my troubie) definately has the damage to take a wizard at that setup.</p><p>I just failed <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" />  </p><p>1) Because i made mistakes that vs any other class would still have been fine</p><p>2) Because MS is ridiculous</p>

[liveja]

<cite>Bozidar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><b><span style="color: #00cc00;">Do you think Mana Shield is "broken" or otherwise "wrong" & in need of "fixing", or do you not?</span></b></p></blockquote><p>Noppers.  It's just ridiculous <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OK, what do you mean by "ridiculous", & why do you not think that something you believe to be "ridiculous" should be fixed?</p><p>My apologies for remaining confused <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Zacarus]

<cite>Dekiri wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok for the record i have 23 AA at 24 and i have manashield and the rest on the improved shield thingyAs a troub you just lack the damage to do anything to a wizard with that setup at that level sorry. Thats life =)</blockquote>Are you sure you want to go on the record with this?+1 AA for KoS starter+22 AA for STA line+2 AA for MS= 25 AA for MSManashield required 25 AA's (for my wizzy anyways), not 23.<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Please explain how this is so?

[Norrsken]

<cite>Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gaglaak@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ElephantonRU wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Anthur@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>scout owns mage -> common reply to complaining mages on these forums: LTPmage owns scout -> common reply is <strike>LTP</strike> ... oh wait... no its "Nerf mages".Btw. I don't play a wizzi. But I am happy some clothies do well in PvP. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img mce_tsrc=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>Sorry, but mage with manashield owns <b>everyone</b>, not just scouts.Which is why manashield is clearly OP.</blockquote>I don't get owned by sorcerors, so... clearly your statement is incorrect.</blockquote>I have never been owned either by a mage using manashield.<span style="font-size: x-large;">EVER</span>.</blockquote>Well, I have died to them, a fair deal. But otoh, I tend to jump everything I see lately. But to be fair, if a sorc pops MS on me when Im on my inqy, I just smile and keep on hammering them until they die. 40% chance to interrupt ftw! (+ several CAs with interrupts). I usually get hit twice, sometimes 3 times by sorcs in a 1 on 1. First is before I get up to them, and the rest is when Im waiting for a CA to pop back up. So, if it isnt an orange sorc, I wont heal at all most fights.On my assassin, I am quite capable of killing sorcs using MS as well. Same goes for my sk.I wouldnt kill a sorc on a troubie though. But honestly, I suck really bad at troubies. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I dont feel its an OP skill, it makes sorcs into fun and challenging fights. Now, if only summoners got some luvin too so they werent freebies.