AAs for group Templar (some soloing)

[Ilavatar]

<p>I'm returning to my Templar after a very long time - since before AAs existed. I've got 17 AAs a the moment.</p><p>I'm wondering what is a good AA path to follow for someone who will be primarily grouping with some soling. (I've got my necro if I want to seriously solo.)</p><p>Later I may respec for raids but that's a long way off.</p><p>People seem to talk mostly about the Cleric tree. What about the Templar tree?</p><p>Any suggestions about what lines to do first would be most appreciated.</p>

[da5idblacksun]

In the Templar tree you want the lotto heal branch (increased proc chance for Mark, Involuntary, etc).  I use these spells whenever I'm in a group or a raid.   At the end of this branch you can get Blessings which is 20% increase AE for equipped procs to go off.  This is a must skill for groups and raids.The rest of tree kind of sucks.  You can do the DPS branch which decreases cast times for your nukes and dots but I haven't found it to be worth it - even after filling them up, my DPS sucks.  It's worth putting points in the physical mitigation debuff as well.

[Kendricke]

I'd recommend taking the Scorn/Spurn line right off. Templars are second only to brigands when it comes to reducing physical mitigation. Whether soloing or in a group with a couple of solid melee classes, you'll find that this single boost can signficantly increase your group's overall DPS. The rest of the Templar tree can wait till you've invested into the Cleric tree, in my opinion. Remember, as a solo/group Templar, your already strong enough as a healer to handle probably 99% of all group content without putting a single Achievement point into any healing/defensive abilities. A typical Templar in a general group setting is simply not hitting content hard enough to really require anything like healing criticals or increased effect heals with any real significance. This is where you can shore up traditional Templar weaknesses and turn them around for you. Increases to melee DPS can give you the chance to contribute during combat passively even when you're spending all your casting time on heals. When healing isn't as necessary, boosting your spell casting criticals or damage can help you and/or your group to move through encounters even faster.If you do feel a desire for more defense, however, I'd recommend spell haste (Cleric INT line) to help you fire those heals and debuffs off even faster, or to invest in the Benediction line + Shield Ally for increased passive group tank assists.There's actually about 2 or 3 really solid solo/group Templar builds/pathways I could recommend, but it really depends on what type of solo/group play you're looking for. What's the result you want to end up with?

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote>There's actually about 2 or 3 really solid solo/group Templar builds/pathways I could recommend, but it really depends on what type of solo/group play you're looking for. What's the result you want to end up with?</blockquote><p>What are my 2-3 choices? <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>Thanks for the advice y'all!</p>

[Somniloquy]

I have been levelling  this class over the past few weeks and am now level 48 with 60 AA's, not stellar, but respectable.I messed abut a lot and burned 3 of my 5 free cleric respecs.  In the end by level 20 I had settled on INT line to Arbiter title for thewonderful Divine Recovery, a boss killing uber-buff.  I have also put 4/4/4/4 into Wis and will build this up even more later.  The undead nuke isvery satisfying, but the exorcsim AA is the key here, probably redundant at level cap but for now it keeps my casting skills 3+ levels higher than I amso a low yellow con resists like a high blue.  It makes a huge difference.  With the fast casting and the vastly reduced amount of resists, overalleffectiveness is up for group and solo giving me more time an more options.After 41 points I chucked 5 into scorm and then unlocked the blessings line up to involuntary an am building those to 5 each before moving on.I know a respec will be needed later for some stuff but for now my build works nicely all round.  My melee sucks bad but my casting is sweetand so soloing is routine and painless.  I hunt names, grind writs and quest extensively for AA and keep my LL up to date at all times, going outof the way for stuff like Aviaks and such.  LL helps traditionally low dps healers a lot, brings easy green heroics into solo range.Must emphasise, I am just levelling and learning the class, Im not recommending my build to anyone really, just trying to show that there are manypossibilites and theres lots of good stuff in the trees.  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'd recommend taking the Scorn/Spurn line right off. </blockquote><p>Do you mean putting just one AA point in Enhance<img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />isgrace? (The beginning of the "Scorn/Spurn" line)</p><p>Or follow the line down through Placate and Prostrate (Stun)?</p>

[Kendricke]

<cite>Ilavatar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'd recommend taking the Scorn/Spurn line right off. </blockquote><p>Do you mean putting just one AA point in Enhance<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" />isgrace? (The beginning of the "Scorn/Spurn" line)</p><p>Or follow the line down through Placate and Prostrate (Stun)?</p></blockquote><p>I'd drop 3-5 points in it right off, but generally speaking I'd stop there there and not move further into compliances unless you're specifically interested in it.</p>

[littleman17]

<p>If you solo any decent amount of time, the str line is a must have. I've had about 6 mobs wailing on me at once (which is almost an instant death for any healer) and because of the final str ability, I never got interupted once.</p><p>Edit: I was thinking of the sta line with the melee and healings crits... but the agi line does have the shield block chance + double attack which is good for solo'ing and putting out a bit of dps while healing in a group.</p>

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote>There's actually about 2 or 3 really solid solo/group Templar builds/pathways I could recommend, but it really depends on what type of solo/group play you're looking for. What's the result you want to end up with?</blockquote><p>Kendricke,  I'm afraid ye're expertise about the different builds outstrips my knowledge. </p><p> Which ones did ye have in mind? If had a quick idea, I could probably choose one.</p>

[Giallolas]

<p>I see these posts almost weekly and there are lots of people with vastly more knowledge than I have in the class.  However, I'm a 70 Temp with 100 AA that raids, solos, and groups and I've tried out most builds.  What I found works for me has been said before and has been said in these forums, but I'll take a moment to share.</p><p>I went down Str all the way to the last ability.  As was said in here previously, it really helps you solo very well.  Being immune to interrupts is incredible.  Our casting times are not the fastest, and mobs regularly interrupt you when you're trying to get those spells off.  Also, the additional damage proc for both spells and melee are quite helpful to offset our normally mediocre dps.  If you go all the way down the line, I'd only put very bare minimum points into the 2nd to last skill as increased focus is quite pointless when you're entirely immune to interrupts.</p><p>I also invested heavily in the Agi line as well.  I didn't take the last ability (though I'd love to) but instead chose to max all the skills that increase the use of my Lend Shield (or whatever it's called).  As I raid a couple days a week and group often, I find this helps keep the tank alive which in turn saves me from healing quite as much.  Combine this with the double attack and dps also increases.  As we can't dual weild anyway, why not take advantage of this line?</p><p>On the Templar trees, I went down the Blessings line for the additional 20% proc.  As I carry mostly procing weapons and gear and I'm often grouped, this is indeed a "blessing" for everyone.  I also went down the Smite lines until the end.  I figure, I'm now immune to interrupts, so lets get some more bang out of these nukes.  The nukes are faster, use less power, and are more damaging, all of which helps me offset my normally low dps.</p><p>In summary, I believe I've found a way to increase my dps, help protect the tank, and have little fear of wading in there right next to him/her without any fear of not doing my job well as a key healer.  I believe we've gotten a great series of options in our AA.</p>

[Ilavatar]

<p>I've read all your posts and studied the trees. Thanks for the feedback.</p><p>Unlike the Necro tree, which I know well, the Cleric tree doesn't seem to have such clear philosophies such as tank, scout, mage and solo, group, raid. It seems more mixed. Also, unlike Necros, the Cleric tree seems much better than the Templar tree.</p><p>Hunting Undead doesn't seem like something I'd like to spend my AAs on since it's so specific so WIS is out.</p><p>The end of the AGI and STA trees seem less useful on a regular basis.</p><p>So it seems to come down to STR and INT which both give good damage and solo ability and useful end abilities.</p><p>Since immunity to interrupts seems the most useful, I guess I'll start with STR 4/8/8/2/1</p><p>Then I'll go INT 4/4/8/8/1</p><p>That should keep me busy for a long time. I'm sure I won't get it done before RoK comes out.</p><p>Any suggestions or comments?</p>

[Maryk]

<p>I personally went down the Blessings and Cures lines.  Not regretting it...seems to be working fine for me.</p><p>At level 70  I find I spend a good deal of time watching the tank's cures in addition to the normal healing.</p>

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Marykim wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I personally went down the Blessings and Cures lines.  Not regretting it...seems to be working fine for me.</p><p>At level 70  I find I spend a good deal of time watching the tank's cures in addition to the normal healing.</p></blockquote><p>Yes, I'm thinking those might be a good way to go once I reach higher levels and do raiding and more challenging regions.</p><p>In fact, I might respec all my AAs at that time.</p>

[Enoa]

<p>After having the cures for most of my templar life i spec'd out of it a few months back.   IMO the only useful thing in that line is the extra 10s sanctuary... and 20 points is a lot to spend just to get that.   Mana Cure is a waste of a point.  </p><p>The only zone that has made me miss sanctuary is shade of fear and maybe the golems in NTR... but certainly not enough to respec back. </p><p> Blessing /Smites FTW</p><p>Prepull Group reactive.... single target reactive timed to land as the tank is taking his first hit.... Spurn/IR/Mark... by that time "disable smites" is long gone ... nuke / nuke / nuke ... followed by making fun of the people you out "dps'd" while staying on top of the heal parse.   </p><p>Also using the ACT plugin that counts reactive charges left will make you more efficient by preventing premature reactive refreshing.  </p><p>Enoa - Templar</p><p>Kithicor</p>

[Jevangal]

First thing I thought I would mention is that I found the wisdom line to be almost useless.  Apart from Crypt of Valdoon and Estate of Unrest, there aren't many top end zones where you can benefit from bonuses vs undead (I know divine soothing can be useful but then I've never found too big a problem with pulling aggro from the MT anyway).Second, the strength line is good for soloing/pvp and has some great stuff on it for those situations (as others have mentioned).Beyond those two lines, there is no ideal answer to your question and you are left with a difficult choice between 3 highly useful lines.  Your decision depends on your style of play.  So I guess all I can do is share my setup with you and my thinking behind it.After trying various setups, I have so far settled on the stamina/agility line on the KoS tree and the blessings line on the EoF tree (with another 20 points spent on smites).The stamina line gives a nice boost to your heal crit chance.  Looking at this parse data I have in front of me now, in my last raid (AoA x2), my crit heal triggered 1014 times, the next closest being 645, a massive difference of almost 57%.  I have little doubt that helped me top the heal parse (above another templar, a fury and a warden), as well as keeping the tank standing.  Severe judgement is good for solo or group, giving a nice little boost to melee crit chance.  Hammer smite is good for buying a few seconds while soloing to recast reactive heal or cure and an extra few hitpoints always come in useful!The agility line is the least understood of all the cleric lines, probably because the description of shield ally is somewhat confusing.  But that misunderstood little gem called Shield Ally can make your job a lot easier.  It's a bit of a pain to explain why, but the bottom line is shield ally results in the tank getting hit less (so you have less work to do).  Although in my experience shield ally does not make a significant difference to avoidance tanks such as monks, on a plate tank it really can make the difference between success and failure.  But with this line, your equipment set up is absolutely vital, and its gonna cost you.  To get the +2% parry wrist adornments, you will need to be forking out about 15 plat if the other servers are anything like splitpaw (unless you have a kind guildmate who can make them for you).  The tank will also benefit from you equipping the Disc of Protection or Bulwark of the Brave (usually between 1 and 3 plat on broker), again adding a suitable and expensive adornment.  Both of these roundshields is legendary, which can confuse people when you turn up on a raid wearing it with a fabled adornment on it!!!  So the agility line is geared towards grouping or raiding and you can end up spending a whole 8 points on shield ally, which will give you absolutely no benefit when soloing.  But in a group situation, this is the line that can increase the group's performance massively.Ok, now onto the EoF tree.  Even after being nerfed from 25% to 20% chance, blessings is unbelievably good.  And all of the points spent in lotto heals and stoneskin are good investments (I cast stoneskin and glory of combat on myself when soloing and on the main tank when in a group).  On the last few raids I have been on, involuntary healer and mark have each done 5% of the healing, with glory of combat doing about 10% of the healing.  The biggest heals come from my single target reactive (usually between 40 and 50% of the total).  Getting that to adept III or master is a priority.So that is my setup and the results it gives me.  Ball is in your court now...

[Jevangal]

<cite>cyric22 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>After having the cures for most of my templar life i spec'd out of it a few months back.   IMO the only useful thing in that line is the extra 10s sanctuary... and 20 points is a lot to spend just to get that.   Mana Cure is a waste of a point.  </p></blockquote>I agree.  I can't see the cures being much use for anything other than PvP.

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Jevangal@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>...After trying various setups, I have so far settled on the stamina/agility line on the KoS tree and the blessings line on the EoF tree (with another 20 points spent on smites).The stamina line gives a nice boost to your heal crit chance.  ... <p>The agility line is the least understood of all the cleric lines, probably because the description of shield ally is somewhat confusing.  But that misunderstood little gem called Shield Ally can make your job a lot easier.  It's a bit of a pain to explain why, but the bottom line is shield ally results in the tank getting hit less (so you have less work to do).  Although in my experience shield ally does not make a significant difference to avoidance tanks such as monks, on a plate tank it really can make the difference between success and failure.  But with this line, your equipment set up is absolutely vital, and its gonna cost you. ...</p><p>...Ok, now onto the EoF tree.  Even after being nerfed from 25% to 20% chance, blessings is unbelievably good.</p></blockquote><p>Thanks for the great explanation. </p><p> My problem with both STA and AGI is that the beneficial stuff you mention doesn't come until the end of the tree - that's a lot of AA points spent to get there. </p><p>Plus, if what Kendricke says is true, and we can handle most healing situations without AAs then it looks like your advice would be very good for the endgame once I start raiding but not as useful at lower levels where I have fewer AAs and need less hardcore healing. </p><p>Finally, I think the end of the line abilities are less useful than other lines - at least at lower levels.</p><p>Having said that, I'm taking another look at the AGI tree and that melee improvement combined with the casting inprovement from the INT line might make a great solo combo: melee and nuking improved.</p><p>Once RoK comes out, I'll probably be putting some more points into those.</p><p>It seems everyone thinks Blessings is the way to go on the Templar Tree.</p>

[Jevangal]

<cite>Ilavatar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>Thanks for the great explanation. <p> My problem with both STA and AGI is that the beneficial stuff you mention doesn't come until the end of the tree - that's a lot of AA points spent to get there. </p><p>Plus, if what Kendricke says is true, and we can handle most healing situations without AAs then it looks like your advice would be very good for the endgame once I start raiding but not as useful at lower levels where I have fewer AAs and need less hardcore healing. </p><p>Finally, I think the end of the line abilities are less useful than other lines - at least at lower levels.</p><p>Having said that, I'm taking another look at the AGI tree and that melee improvement combined with the casting inprovement from the INT line might make a great solo combo: melee and nuking improved.</p><p>Once RoK comes out, I'll probably be putting some more points into those.</p><p>It seems everyone thinks Blessings is the way to go on the Templar Tree.</p></blockquote>Yes, blessings rocks!  Pre-EoF, templars were not the most common healer at the top level; now we seem to have loads of us at level 70, and I think blessings is the reason.  I know an inquisitor in our guild betrayed to templar because of blessings and I'm sure this inspires people to roll a templar, even after they nerfed blessings from 25% to 20%.  You also get Glory of Combat and Stoneskin in the blessings line, both of which are absolutely vital in my experience.  My Glory does about 10% of the healing on a typical raid, without me having to lift a finger; when we did the epic crab in Fallen Dynasty the other day, the inqusitor grumbled that Glory needs to be nerfed lol.  Boosting the chances of a lotto heal means your performance goes up without you having to do anything at all.  Very nice!  Every point spent in that part of that EoF templar tree will improve your healing.But I disagree that points spent in the stamina tree are wasted; this line boosts both your solo and group/raid performance - it gives you extra hitpoints, an extra attack (with knockdown) and better melee crit chance (boosts your dps).  Then after that, its the heal crit!  I agree the agility line is geared towards raiding, although the ability to mezz can get you out of trouble in a solo fight.  With my setup, geared towards raiding as it is, I can nevertheless solo level 66 ^^^ heroics in the bonemire (admittedly it does take a long time lol).  Every point spent in shield ally is a point wasted unless you are in a group or raid.So you can see by now that there is no ideal answer to this question; we can only share our experiences.

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Jevangal@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>But I disagree that points spent in the stamina tree are wasted; this line boosts both your solo and group/raid performance - it gives you extra hitpoints, an extra attack (with knockdown) and better melee crit chance (boosts your dps).  Then after that, its the heal crit!  </blockquote><p>I don't think STA points are wasted at all. But I think the end of the STR line may be more useful - at least at the earlier levels.</p><p>Now that we'll be getting more points in RoK, the best solution (for me) will probably be to put more points in STA once they become available after STR (and maybe INT) are done.</p><p>I decided to go with INT instead of STA (at the early levels) because, based on my limited experience over the past few days, I can do way more damage with nukes and DoTs than with melee - even using the imbued Faysteel hammer.</p><p>That's not too different from what I did with my necro - in the Mage tree which is parallel to this Cleric tree - I never took any of the lines to their final ability because I didn't think it was worth it vs. spending the AAs on other trees.</p><p>As you mentioned, there is no one solution. This is a very valuable discussion to bring out all the various points from each perspective.</p>

[Jevangal]

<cite></cite>You're probably using a decent solo setup if you chose str/int lines.  Bear in mind though that the KoS tree was designed for both cleric classes (inquisitor and templar) and that the strength line will be of more benefit to an inquisitor than it is to us, because they get to use their strikes as melee attacks, whereas we get no such thing.  But being protected against interrupts maybe redresses this balance.My advice would be to try a few setups (the respec cards allow 5 respecs) to see which one boosts your performance the most.  But try to base your decision on parse data (Advanced Combat Tracker is awesome) and the end result (are you dying more, are you able to take down even con mobs etc).

[Gagla]

Unless I'm mistaken I believe Bolt of Power was changed to proc on any attack, not just melee.

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Gaglaak@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote>Unless I'm mistaken I believe Bolt of Power was changed to proc on any attack, not just melee.</blockquote> Yes, it says it "causes additional divine damage when striking with a weapon or spell".

[Ilavatar]

<cite>Jevangal@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>You're probably using a decent solo setup if you chose str/int lines.  Bear in mind though that the KoS tree was designed for both cleric classes (inquisitor and templar) and that the strength line will be of more benefit to an inquisitor than it is to us, because they get to use their strikes as melee attacks, whereas we get no such thing.  But being protected against interrupts maybe redresses this balance.My advice would be to try a few setups (the respec cards allow 5 respecs) to see which one boosts your performance the most.  But try to base your decision on parse data (Advanced Combat Tracker is awesome) and the end result (are you dying more, are you able to take down even con mobs etc).</blockquote><p>Your comments have caused me to take another look at STA. I agree that STR/INT is a good solo choice. </p><p>Based on my experiences yesterday in duoing, STA/INT is starting to look better. The two main reasons I've had people die on me are because 1) I don't have enough healing power or 2) I can't cast fast enough to keep up. Healing crits with STA take care of the first and casting speed with INT takes care of the other.</p><p>So for someone who does a good amount of grouping but who wants some soloing benefits, STA/INT might be the better choice. It would give you that extra edge when things go bad.</p><p>For someone who does more soloing than group, STR/INT might better.</p><p>Comments?</p>

[Maryk]

<cite>Jevangal@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>cyric22 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>After having the cures for most of my templar life i spec'd out of it a few months back.   IMO the only useful thing in that line is the extra 10s sanctuary... and 20 points is a lot to spend just to get that.   Mana Cure is a waste of a point.  </p></blockquote>I agree.  I can't see the cures being much use for anything other than PvP.</blockquote>It just seems that lately I'm starting to spend a lot of time watching for poison/trauma etc and curing the tank. 

[Caethre]

<cite>Ilavatar wrote:</cite> <blockquote><p>For someone who does more soloing than group, STR/INT might better.</p><p>Comments?</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">OOC.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">NOTE: I am responding just to the soloing comment quoted.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">The INT line is taken as read, yes, absolutely.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">But as for this continued talk of the STR line being the good choice for soloers ... it does continue to surprise me. Have the people saying this actually tried STA 448 and AGI 448 and not taking the STR line at all?</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">I have *not* tried the STR line for a year now, I openly admit this, but just looking at the skills again, as I have recently I cannot see how going down to the foot of he STR line would give anything like the same melee DPS benefits as STA 448 (100% melee crits) combined with AGI 448 (32% double attack). [I do stress, I only would advise taking those two lines to the third skill for the solo/small group Templar player who is looking specifically improving their DPS.]</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">I've not seen any data yet to suggest that the STR line is even worth considering for a solo or small group Templar, when stacked against STA+AGI+INT lines. I would be interested to see if anyone does infact have such comparative data (where all other factors are the same).</span></p>