A question for all you off tanks out there

[dr_essex]

<p>What sort of dps are you putting out.  I'm well aware that there are group arrangements that are optimal purely for SK dps, but I am unlikely ever see them as an OT/MA for an end game raiding guild.  But I'm curious what sort of zw's some of you guys put out.  Again, i'm not looking for the strictly dps set up.  Just a realistic output from being OT buffed a lot of the time.  </p>

[Coica]

keep in mind you could get a broad range of responses if everyone from the "average" SK to  the "my E  p   e   e   n is huge" SK responds? which are you trying to guage your dps against?

[dr_essex]

<p>I'm just curious where my dps should be.  I've been told its sub par for my gear (have the best gear I can get short of avatars).  Some have told me my dps should be higher but I'm not sure how I can eek out anymore while equipping myself in a way that keeps me ready to pick up mobs if need be.  </p><p>Being blunt - If I go full offensive, 2 hander, proc gear, etc... my ZW is about 1500.  If I go defensive, with defensive gear, and hammer and shield, its about 1100.  If its not up to par, I need to know.  </p><p>Need to know if they're full of it, or I'm slacking.  I see a lot of people listing off their gear and what not, but where does that put you parse wise.  </p><p> Thanks.</p>

[Hugsnkissums]

<p>I think judging yourself by other people's standards is what's wrong here. You're going to get some guys who'll say that's about right and others telling you that's not enough. So either you're doing just doing par or below par, so how's that sound...pretty terrible I'd say. Look, if you're able to fill the role as an OT, the mages aren't getting aggro, you're not draining the healer's power, etc...who cares where your DPS is?! You're doing the job that obviously no one else wants to do, or thinks that they can do better. It's easy as all hell to sit back and say, "whoa man, that SK needs some help with his damage output." and for them to leave it at that. </p><p>I'm just trying to say if you are having a hard time doing the job then yes you need to heed what these people are telling you, but if you can be a good OT/MT...then what does it matter what your DPS is?  You're not trying to be DPS, you're taking the hits so that others can do all the big damage. That's just my take on it.</p>

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<p>Tell them that they are not debuffing the mobs WIS and disease enough, and that you are lacking a few buffs to maximize...lol.</p><p>What's your most usual group setup by the way, and which zone are trying to gauge (EH? TNT? MMIS?).</p>

[Dead Knight]

2K ZW on a 30-35k raid-wide. Dirge, Swashy, Assassin, Defiler, Templar/Inquisitor/Warlock in group. (Last one is zone dependant). Keep in mind however that if your raid is only parsing say 15k raid-wide, you will never reach those numbers, and group setup, gear and masters are very important. Gear is the least important of all as it will only really account for 10% of your DPS at most. Group setup is the most important.

[Dead Knight]

<cite>Gutan@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I think judging yourself by other people's standards is what's wrong here. You're going to get some guys who'll say that's about right and others telling you that's not enough. So either you're doing just doing par or below par, so how's that sound...pretty terrible I'd say. Look, if you're able to fill the role as an OT, the mages aren't getting aggro, you're not draining the healer's power, etc...who cares where your DPS is?! You're doing the job that obviously no one else wants to do, or thinks that they can do better. It's easy as all hell to sit back and say, "whoa man, that SK needs some help with his damage output." and for them to leave it at that. </p><p>I'm just trying to say if you are having a hard time doing the job then yes you need to heed what these people are telling you, but if you can be a good OT/MT...then what does it matter what your DPS is?  You're not trying to be DPS, you're taking the hits so that others can do all the big damage. That's just my take on it.</p></blockquote>The more DPS you do, the more DPS the entire raid does, the faster the raid goes, the more useful you are, the faster you can move onto something else.

[rabid.pooh]

<p>I'm the OT in my guild also, really some zones your gonna have a crappy ZW, as your waiting for the adds to pop, you'll do some damage to the main mob, but your also going to hold back your disease debuff and aoe's for when the adds pop.</p><p>We only have one raiding dirge, so the make up of my group tends to be, two healers, swashy for hate xfer, and whatever else class.  Usually nothing that really pumps my DPS output, so I'll be around 1.5k.  Long fights I'll have an illy in the group, but won't get the double attack and Time compression, just a haste or synergism.  If it's an add fight I'll get the TC, syner and haste, but DPS will go down as your holding back for the adds.</p><p>DPS is group dependant and also scales with the DPS of raid.  As an OT your job isn't DPS it's picking up the named if the MT drops, or it's picking up the adds, if your meeting these two requirements then your a good OT.  All classes that are OT'ing loose DPS as it requires a different gear config.</p><p>I never base my DPS on what my personal number is, more where am I on the list, I'm usually the top fighter DPS and bellow the scouts/mages (cept coercers and bards).  If your here then your doing good DPS IMO. </p>

[Dead Knight]

<cite>Toesmash@Oasis wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">I never base my DPS on what my personal number is, more where am I on the list, I'm usually the top fighter DPS and bellow the scouts/mages (cept coercers and bards).  If your here then your doing good DPS IMO. </span></p></blockquote>Too true, you will know how good your DPS is by how high you are on the list in comparison to others and your total % of the raid-wide DPS. Don't listen to the numbers others post because at the end of the day, their guild probably does different raid-wide DPS, if it's lower then their numbers may be lower but they may be doing the same %, if it's higher, their parse will be inflated but they still may be doing the same %, although the higher raid-wide DPS goes, the lower our % gets.

[Beldin_]

<p>Yepp .. DPS is alway relative .. just compare your DPS against others in your raid/group .. and don't compare with people who brag about 10k DPS or whatever <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>If i go into unrest or Vadoon and i only do 600-800 dps but i'm still Number 2 than thats fine. If i go Nest and do 300 ... ok then thats really crap *g*</p>

[Rylight]

honestly, I just  got back on after six months, so I dont know how much gear is helping dps nowadays, but when I left, I was dpsing the same as necros and some scouts, seriously, the aoes we have can really put you in par with the rest of the dps in the group, and yes this was main tanking in defensive stance. however, like many said, if your tanking or off-tanking, then dps isnt your main concern, and also, as an sk, we are simply better dps when fighting group encounters, thanks to our many aoes and dot aoes. honestly I dont know what else to tell you.

[MaCloud1032]

Being a MT will almost always inflate the parse.  As MT you get so many buffs.  Thorns, reactives, and other buffs count tword you.  As a MT i have seen 3k parses and ushaly run about 1800.  Ill finish deathtoll with a 1600 zw as mt.  When Iam OT/DpS is about 1200 zw.  When i get tossed into any old group my dps sucks. like 600 zw.(has been happening a lot more as of late)