Absurd

[Dracot]

<p>Wow a almost 10 second ranger vs necro fight....</p><p>((1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] You send your pet in for the attack!(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] You have entered into combat by casting Dread on Jedil.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] You prepare to inflict Terror on Jedil.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] YOUR Lich's Siphoning hits Jedil for 135 disease damage.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] YOUR Lich's Siphoning heals YOU for 84 hit points.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] Jedil flees in terror!(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] Dracot's Graven Frenzy hits Jedil for 89 disease damage.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] Jedil is no longer terrified.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] Dracot's Graven Frenzy hits Jedil for 106 disease damage.(1192420620)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:00 2007] Dracot's Graven Frenzy hits Jedil for 140 disease damage.(1192420621)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:01 2007] Dracot hits Jedil for 211 crushing damage.(1192420624)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:04 2007] YOU try to disease Jedil with Abate Life, but Jedil resists.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's Rain of Arrows hits YOU for 1287 crushing damage.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's gracelessness afflicts you.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's Quick Shot hits YOU for 241 crushing damage.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's Rain of Arrows hits Dracot for 1458 crushing damage.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil is struck with a dynamic attack!(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Dracot's Grisly Feedback hits Jedil for 26 disease damage.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] YOUR Grisly Feedback heals YOU for 21 hit points.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's gracelessness afflicts you.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil critically hits YOU for 1186 crushing damage.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] You were interrupted!(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's caustic poison hits YOU for 259 poison damage.(1192420626)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:06 2007] Jedil's Quick Shot critically hits YOU for 313 crushing damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Dracot hits Jedil for 191 crushing damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Jedil's Triple Volley critically hits YOU for 222 crushing damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Jedil's caustic poison critically hits YOU for 337 poison damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Jedil's Triple Volley critically hits YOU for 407 crushing damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Jedil's Triple Volley critically hits YOU for 665 crushing damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Darkness begins to swirl about you.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] YOUR Dooming Darkness hits Jedil for 52 disease damage.(1192420627)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:07 2007] Jedil is engulfed in darkness!(1192420629)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:09 2007] Dracot critically hits Jedil for 308 crushing damage.(1192420630)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:10 2007] Jedil's Devitalizing Arrow critically hits YOU for 868 crushing damage.(1192420630)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:10 2007] Your magical shield begins to fade.(1192420630)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:10 2007] Your favor begins to fade.(1192420630)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:10 2007] The Mark of the Miasmic disappears.(1192420630)[Sun Oct 14 23:57:10 2007] Alas, Dracot has died from pain and suffering.</p><p>An amazing total of 1099 dmg done by a tank pet  vs a ranger since the caster was unable to get in melee range, nor cast anything besides opening with fear. </p><p>Ya this is balanced....</p><p>What more do the devs need to see b4 a necro will have an overhaul in pvp?</p><p>Oh and notice within the first split second, not even a total second fear is broken....</p>

[tooloose]

<p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p>

[WasFycksir]

<p>43 nec here on Nagafen.  I totally agree with your post.  But dude 10 seconds, you should be crowned necro of the year lasting that long, seriously.</p><p>My gear is not uber, but it's ok, and I have died before ANY spell has gotten off vs. a ranger!</p>

[Mildavyn]

<p>Couple of ideas:1. Perceptor's Command is your friend. Get it, use it!2. Use the Scout pet, no one is going to try killing it, it does more damage, and it still taunts (via PC)3. Find something to hide behind! Get behind a tree, duck behind a rock, find something to break LOS, and STAY there. Let your pet do some damage while you're hiding away nicely4. Get a level 34-36 friend to mentor, then go clear out the Vault of the Fallen every time you can. Get the wand, it's got a clicky-snare which doesn't break on damage.</p><p>If you see them coming, you should not be losing... especially not to Jedil <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> If you don't see them coming, then you need to start looking around.</p>

[Dracot]

<cite>WasFycksir wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>43 nec here on Nagafen.  I totally agree with your post.  But dude 10 seconds, you should be crowned necro of the year lasting that long, seriously.</p><p>My gear is not uber, but it's ok, and I have died before ANY spell has gotten off vs. a ranger!</p></blockquote>I know i was totally shocked...

[Dracot]

<cite>Paikis@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Couple of ideas:1. Perceptor's Command is your friend. Get it, use it!2. Use the Scout pet, no one is going to try killing it, it does more damage, and it still taunts (via PC)3. Find something to hide behind! Get behind a tree, duck behind a rock, find something to break LOS, and STAY there. Let your pet do some damage while you're hiding away nicely4. Get a level 34-36 friend to mentor, then go clear out the Vault of the Fallen every time you can. Get the wand, it's got a clicky-snare which doesn't break on damage.</p><p>If you see them coming, you should not be losing... especially not to Jedil <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />" width="15" height="15"> If you don't see them coming, then you need to start looking around.</p></blockquote><p>i have PC maxxed AA, used it, it never landed apparently, you lose Shockwave using scout pet, which is usually the one thing that buys time anymore in pvp.  Shockwave does a nice AE knockback + nice dmg, and if you spec correctly you can get a nice amount of dps from a tank pet.  Trouble with this log was my pet was in defensive mode, not offensive.For the PC idea, yes SOMETIMES it works but is very resistable, its not a guarantee.  Also after hours of testing with a 2 box Q alt, all you need is a key to target nearst PVP character and your back onto target. </p><p>And i ALWAYS see Jedil coming, trouble is, somehow he is able to deal all his CA's within melee range.  Could be a lag issue, im not sure but it is happening.  Would explain alot to me of just how he obtained General in a week.  What I find hard to understand is how you think you can only see them coming when they are 2 ft from you, you can see a ranger coming in a long ways, which gives them plenty of time to dish out that first mass burst thsat normally drops necros in a split second.</p><p>Had a very simliar encouter right b4 this with aggony, and was able to lock him in melee range easily, he was pretty well screw'd until Orxo got a nice fat Ice comet off onto me from behind.</p><p>OH and what mob drops this wand, i can 2 box that place easily to farm for that if its really that good.  A name of the item would help some.</p>

[Gimet]

<cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting. Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p>

[azekah]

<p>I know it's not the same, but I've dueled a bit with my 55 necro against a 55 bruiser...</p><p>I was able to win a few times when my roots held long enough for me to get enough dps out to take him down.</p><p>Also, casting all my pet dots while he was rooted, and then running my [Removed for Content] off so he couldn't catch me helped...</p><p>If my roots broke too quick or resisted, he could take me down in a matter of seconds...</p>

[Norrsken]

<cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting. Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p></blockquote>The thing with necros are, vs tanks, I expect to live 5 seconds, tops.Pair this with a damage style that takes 5-10 seconds to even get going. See the problem?When I stack EVERY [Removed for Content] variable in my favor, ie, I have a monster dps charmed pet, all my spells are mastered and I get the jump on someone that cant see me, that is when I get kills. ALL my other toons, including my 2 other mage types, can actually recover fromg etting jumped, or it doesnt matter too much for them if people see them coming. And they dont have to get everything work out perfectly, they ahve tools to deal with crap. Necros dont. Sure, best case scenario, necros can kill people in about 3-5 seconds. For this they need to be in a zone where there are undead wizard mobs, and they need to get the jump. and theyc ant get any resists on their 2 pets, or themselves. I havent played any other class that is so dependant on getting lucky as a necro. Not even my coercer.

[Gimet]

<cite>Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting. Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p></blockquote><span style="font-size: medium;color: #0099cc;">The thing with necros are, vs tanks, I expect to live 5 seconds, tops.</span>Pair this with a damage style that takes 5-10 seconds to even get going. See the problem?When I stack EVERY [I cannot control my vocabulary] variable in my favor, ie, I have a monster dps charmed pet, all my spells are mastered and I get the jump on someone that cant see me, that is when I get kills. ALL my other toons, including my 2 other mage types, can actually recover fromg etting jumped, or it doesnt matter too much for them if people see them coming. And they dont have to get everything work out perfectly, they ahve tools to deal with crap. Necros dont. Sure, best case scenario, necros can kill people in about 3-5 seconds. For this they need to be in a zone where there are undead wizard mobs, and they need to get the jump. and theyc ant get any resists on their 2 pets, or themselves. I havent played any other class that is so dependant on getting lucky as a necro. Not even my coercer.</blockquote><p>Here you are saying how horrible your survivability is. This is not exclusive to Necromancers. You don't think Conjurors have the same issue? In fact, ALL mages except Sorcerers WITH manasheild have this problem. Guess what, we're cloth wearers. We're not supposed to live very long. Given, our survivability needs a little boost, but as cloth wearers we also need to understand we can't have too much of a boost.</p><p>A tick, if I remember, is 6 seconds. For PvE this is no problem. But since day 1 I've wondered why a tick wasn't made to...let's say...4 seconds for PvP. Why? Because health recovery, power recovery, AND DoT's are inneffective when it takes 6 seconds for them to do their damage. When I finish fighting someone, my power and health are often drained. Next thing I know a scout comes and one-shots me. A tick needs to be decreased in time so our Health and Power regeneration have a chance to allow us to fight on without getting one shotte dbetween fights. Necromancers are also not the only class that relies on ticks for damage. </p><p>Do I have a problem with Necromancers wanting to get "fixed"? No, I absolutely do not. I just hate the fact that most necros go to the extremes of what's broken so they can get fixed...not realizing that other classes have it worse than them. All the threads I've seen lately are about necros needing to be fixed. Well, if necros are needing to be fixed, what about their sister class the Conjuror? Or what about the other classes that have similiar problems? I just think as a PvP community, we should stop focusing on one or two classes all of the time, and focus on what's wrong with PvP in general.</p><p>I've yet to see a thread striving to fix more than one class, or aspect of PvP. It's always "Nerf Rangers" "Fix Necros" "Take away titles" "Teir 2 level locking"</p><p>And now I'm just rambling on.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/47941865eb7bbc2a777305b46cc059a2.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Dracot]

<cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting. Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p></blockquote><p>Care to explain why a necro in role and lore and pve is able to deal with multiple mobs of melee and caster orgins but in pvp you label us MAGE HUNTERS?  Also lifetaps don't provide enough to survive in pvp.   Most lifetaps do about 800ish dmg on a crit which provides back around 150-200hp, not nearly enough to be productive in pvp when any other class is auto attacking rapidly for this much or more.  You claim fear is not broken?  Check the log above sir, opened with fear, didn't get one other cast off entire duration of the fight yet, it breaks b4 even 1 second passes. Root works exactly the same way and so does our snare.  This is all based upon a slight chance the spell even lands.  High disease resists do factor into all these spells.</p><p>Maybe actually PLAYING the class in tier 7 would show you more perspective on the flaws a necro has, otherwise, all your calculations and assumptions are based n theory not application.</p>

[Dracot]

<cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting. Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p></blockquote><span style="font-size: medium;color: #0099cc;">The thing with necros are, vs tanks, I expect to live 5 seconds, tops.</span>Pair this with a damage style that takes 5-10 seconds to even get going. See the problem?When I stack EVERY [I cannot control my vocabulary] variable in my favor, ie, I have a monster dps charmed pet, all my spells are mastered and I get the jump on someone that cant see me, that is when I get kills. ALL my other toons, including my 2 other mage types, can actually recover fromg etting jumped, or it doesnt matter too much for them if people see them coming. And they dont have to get everything work out perfectly, they ahve tools to deal with crap. Necros dont. Sure, best case scenario, necros can kill people in about 3-5 seconds. For this they need to be in a zone where there are undead wizard mobs, and they need to get the jump. and theyc ant get any resists on their 2 pets, or themselves. I havent played any other class that is so dependant on getting lucky as a necro. Not even my coercer.</blockquote><p>Here you are saying how horrible your survivability is. This is not exclusive to Necromancers. You don't think Conjurors have the same issue? In fact, ALL mages except Sorcerers WITH manasheild have this problem. Guess what, we're cloth wearers. We're not supposed to live very long. Given, our survivability needs a little boost, but as cloth wearers we also need to understand we can't have too much of a boost.</p><p>A tick, if I remember, is 6 seconds. For PvE this is no problem. But since day 1 I've wondered why a tick wasn't made to...let's say...4 seconds for PvP. Why? Because health recovery, power recovery, AND DoT's are inneffective when it takes 6 seconds for them to do their damage. When I finish fighting someone, my power and health are often drained. Next thing I know a scout comes and one-shots me. A tick needs to be decreased in time so our Health and Power regeneration have a chance to allow us to fight on without getting one shotte dbetween fights. Necromancers are also not the only class that relies on ticks for damage. </p><p>Do I have a problem with Necromancers wanting to get "fixed"? No, I absolutely do not. I just hate the fact that most necros go to the extremes of what's broken so they can get fixed...not realizing that other classes have it worse than them. All the threads I've seen lately are about necros needing to be fixed. Well, if necros are needing to be fixed, what about their sister class the Conjuror? Or what about the other classes that have similiar problems? I just think as a PvP community, we should stop focusing on one or two classes all of the time, and focus on what's wrong with PvP in general.</p><p>I've yet to see a thread striving to fix more than one class, or aspect of PvP. It's always "Nerf Rangers" "Fix Necros" "Take away titles" "Teir 2 level locking"</p><p>And now I'm just rambling on.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/47941865eb7bbc2a777305b46cc059a2.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>IF your lucky enough as a conjy to come across an exiled ranger I'm willing to bet my bank in game that that beautiful stoneskin they get will allow them to live long enough to get things rolling.  Now your claiming ALL mages without manashield have this problem, but you are wrong.  I watch many of the coercers in my guild and many illusionsits on the server completely devastating rangers.  So obviously they have tools to work it, necros don't. No single other class in game is completely without either, stoneskin, mez, heals, runspeed, evac, stealth, track and so on.  </p><p>As far as rangers are concerned, again i'll say, play the class we speak of in the situation, notice it takes you alsmot a year to get only 3 peices of pvp armor, and most don't see over a slayer title, meanwhile a ranger get's General in a week and all pvp armors in 2 months.  Something is broken there, completely broken. </p><p>You can next say get a group....group = this prevents nothing from stopping a ranger from massing all his frontal dps in the first split second it takes to single out the necro in group and do what most refer to as "One Shot" them.  Only if we can survive the initial attacks can we be productive in pvp, problem lies right then nd there, we die way too fast even in legendary/fabled gear.  When the ranger dishes out 6k dmg in a 0-3 second period an our casts average 2 second casts, there is no possibility of survival, none.</p><p>Now as for conjurors needing fixes, I cannot claim that cause the conjies I've seen are very well balanced imo vs a necro, and also I do not know what flaws they have, simply i do not play the class.  I will back you up 100% though if you do what necros do and post here on the forums what your flaws are. Just because the necro community took forth the effort to post our needs and conjurors haven't don't mean we only care about necros. </p><p>Simply start a fix conjy thread, its exactly what we are doing for our class.</p>

[Gimet]

<p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Harbing]

Ok, so i "met" Dracot 3 times today and i sense a nerf Swash post incoming <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />.Seriously mate, how about you work on your IRL reaction time and use totems and anti-stun potions ?!BladesCaineVenekor

[Tae]

<cite>Harbinger wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok, so i "met" Dracot 3 times today and i sense a nerf Swash post incoming <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />.Seriously mate, how about you work on your IRL reaction time and use totems and anti-stun potions ?!BladesCaineVenekor</blockquote>It doesn't matter what he uses, he'll be dead anyway. Right now necromancers/conjurers are the easiest targets there are. And illusionists don't have this problem - their crowd control works, and works well.

[Magius789]

<cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside <b>from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting.</b> Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p></blockquote><p><b>Care to explain why a necro in role and lore and pve is able to deal with multiple mobs of melee and caster orgins but in pvp you label us MAGE HUNTERS?</b>  Also lifetaps don't provide enough to survive in pvp.   Most lifetaps do about 800ish dmg on a crit which provides back around 150-200hp, not nearly enough to be productive in pvp when any other class is auto attacking rapidly for this much or more.  You claim fear is not broken?  Check the log above sir, opened with fear, didn't get one other cast off entire duration of the fight yet, it breaks b4 even 1 second passes. Root works exactly the same way and so does our snare.  This is all based upon a slight chance the spell even lands.  High disease resists do factor into all these spells.</p><p>Maybe actually PLAYING the class in tier 7 would show you more perspective on the flaws a necro has, otherwise, all your calculations and assumptions are based n theory not application.</p></blockquote>Dracot if I understand his post correctly he isn't calling a necro mage hunters he is calling rangers mage hunters, hence the see invis. when we are stealthed when other scouts see stealth instead.

[Harbing]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Harbinger wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok, so i "met" Dracot 3 times today and i sense a nerf Swash post incoming <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />.Seriously mate, how about you work on your IRL reaction time and use totems and anti-stun potions ?!BladesCaineVenekor</blockquote><b><span style="color: #cc0000;">It doesn't matter what he uses, he'll be dead anyway</span></b>. Right now necromancers/conjurers are the easiest targets there are. And illusionists don't have this problem - their crowd control works, and works well.</blockquote>Thats just plain ignorant. Of course it does matter what he uses. It does matter to use m1s, excellent gear, potions, symbols and ofc tactic. I had 3 fights this day with him; the 1rst i won easily because i catched him off guard and broke his fear with a pod and cured his root, the 2nd one my pod was still down and i didnt feel like using the Bristlebane blessing to break fear and he & his pet(s) took 70% of my HP within seconds despite me having a noxious reprive up and 55% dis resistance (fear didnt break), the 3rd fight he let me prebuff with all i have and he died in seconds to me because i stunned / detaunted him from the beginnning on. If he would have used antistun potions and eg. noxious reprieves to ward of my poison damage he would have had at least a chance. But no, he decided he would just stand near me ..... (can you say reach).I mean jeez, i would have lost quite some fights without the help of my potions, symbols etc. Thats what they are for, to give you a temporary edge, to counter a specific advantage your enemy has.Granted Summoners could need a little love (Solo) PvP wise but they are in no way that underpowered like some people want them to appear. Imho its just that a lot of people with no clue play them in PvP; yes it sounds harsh but i do consider a Summoner (or any other class without the inherit ability to see stealth) running around with no Butterfly totem up, a noob. Hes practically asking for an ambush. It also helps a lot to know about the class you encounter (see above, eg. dont stand near the swash and think you are out of melee range, get max range, start your dots and get out of sight, let your pet(s) do some damage) and there are few Necros on Venekor who seem to know anything except their own class. Oh and Taear, would be nice if you would stop running from me every time i encounter you solo, mkay?BladesCaineVenekor

[Tae]

<cite>Harbinger wrote:</cite><cite></cite> <blockquote>Oh and Taear, would be nice if you would stop running from me every time i encounter you solo, mkay?</blockquote>Respec so you don't have reach and you have a deal fyi. Against a swashbuckler, a single second of lag means I'm dead, and I'm not risking my title to something like that. Especially with all your potions, since Brigands rely absolutely on being able to stun. And honestly I don't care what a summoner uses. They just don't have any way of stopping you killing them when you get close. Plus rangers don't even need to get close, so they're dead no matter what happens. A single freedom of action potion costs about 50 silver, and renders any sort of survivability a Necromancer has utterly bunk. How are they supposed to compete with that? 50 silver to make them instantly killable? Or maybe you resist the root altogether, then they're even worse off.

[DravynX]

<p>Have to side with Taer on this, necro's survivability relies solely on root and or fear sticking, which it rarely does. The only way a necro is going to drop 70% of your hp in a "matter of seconds" is if they get off a 10sec cast lifeburn.  My master 1 AA root NEVER lasts more than 1 second if that long, and my fear usually breaks around the two to three second mark. In the event that my fear does stick for longer than two seconds, that's no dps being done while i cast my ten second dmg spell because I can't risk fear breaking. The second my dot hits or my pet hits fear is done. If I choose to load dots on you, I'll be dead before they've even begun to stack dps.</p><p>Necro's have zero protection, even conjy's have more protection in the form of stoneskin. Necro's have zero burst dps, the lifetaps are crap the higher you go, and our snare breaks itself. We have one ranged lifetap that does mediocre dmg and heals for even less, and one aoe lifetap that requires melee range, which, frankly, I would rather not be in melee range with any melee class.</p>

[Frozenshade]

<p>I <3 my necro.</p>

[Bloodfa]

<p>I agree 100%!  It <b>is</b> absurd that you lasted that long!  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Honestly, though, I think it's been at least 20 levels since I've had a Necro give me trouble (barring one particularly embarassing encounter), and I'm not exactly a PvP legend.  <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/136dd33cba83140c7ce38db096d05aed.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />    I doubt many people would disagree about summoner-types needing some love.  Maybe a better root, or something to buff the pets up a bit.</p>

[Frozenshade]

I havent pvped or played my necro much in the past 5 months but last night I tried to solo pvp and found it was alot harder than before, did my toon get ninja nerfed or was it the vodka......

[Bloodfa]

Vodka.  Try Jack Daniels.  Makes you invincible.

[Magius789]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Harbinger wrote:</cite><cite></cite><blockquote>Oh and Taear, would be nice if you would stop running from me every time i encounter you solo, mkay?</blockquote>Respec so you don't have reach and you have a deal fyi. Against a swashbuckler, a single second of lag means I'm dead, <b>and I'm not risking my title to something like that</b>. Especially with all your potions, since Brigands rely absolutely on being able to stun.And honestly I don't care what a summoner uses. They just don't have any way of stopping you killing them when you get close. Plus rangers don't even need to get close, so they're dead no matter what happens. A single freedom of action potion costs about 50 silver, and renders any sort of survivability a Necromancer has utterly bunk. How are they supposed to compete with that? 50 silver to make them instantly killable? Or maybe you resist the root altogether, then they're even worse off.</blockquote><p>This comment made me sad  <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />   You play a very good soloable class and I think it'd be a good fight who knows how it would turn out?  He might be off his game, might not have some timers up, or you could just parry the good stuff who knows.  To many people just see a class they have a tough time with and run instead of saying "What the hell lets give it a go, who knows maybe I'll win and if I don't whats the worst that can I happen. My fictional character in a video game dies."  To hell with Fame/Infamy!!!!!!!  Plus do you think people will respect your title now when you said you run?</p><p>I'm not direacting this at you Tear you just happen to make the comment I think a lot of people feel the same way and its, at times, why its hard to get a good fight.</p>

[Amphibia]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>Respec so you don't have reach and you have a deal fyi. Against a swashbuckler, a single second of lag means I'm dead, <span style="color: #cc0000;"><b>and I'm not risking my title to something like that.</b></span> Especially with all your potions, since Brigands rely absolutely on being able to stun.</blockquote>.... and there we have the main reason why titles (or at least fame loss through PvP death) should be removed, and quickly. The player isn't to blame for avoiding fights to protect his/her title, it's poor design on SOE's part and one of the biggest hinders to PvP - right next to evac and perma immunity.

[Mildavyn]

<cite>Magius789 wrote:</cite><blockquote>To hell with Fame/Infamy!!!!!!!  </blockquote><p>/cheer</p><p>/thumbs</p><p>Oh, and that wand drops off Tseralith... usable by just about everything that isnt a scout... that's right, even tanks can get a snare that doesn't break on damage!!</p><p>Don't say I never give you nothing.</p>

[Norrsken]

<cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tooloose wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I just want to know why our pets are so utterly broken, and yet nothing exept goofy workarounds, that as far as I know, we figured out. The pet follow is....still broken. Moving on a mount is asking for a beatdown~ because the pets halfway accross the zone most of the time.</p></blockquote><p>Pet follow is "broken" for any class with a summoned pet. If you have speed enhacements, your summoned pet does not inherit them. Being on a horse leaves them in the dust because they run at 0% run speed. Ask a Warden to sow your pet if you see one running around.</p><p>Necro's pets aren't strong because how much damage do you expect to take off one person? Conjuror= Destroy a whole group of things, while your pet needs to hit hard and focus on one. Necromancer= Can utterly destroy one target by themselves. Pet is there as a back up damager. If a Necromancer's pet needs any fix, they should have more group directed aoe damage to damage whatever target the Necromancer isn't focusing on. Please discover what your class is meant to do before you complain about it being broken. And if you do complain about it being broken see how it stacks up to it's sister-class.</p><p>As for the whole 10 second fight thing...Welcome to being a cloth wearer. Aside from the fact that Ranger's are unbeleivably powerful, would you realize yet again what this class if for. They specialize in mage hunting. Ever wonder why they can see invisibility and not stealth like the other scouts? Ever wondered why they can attack from afar? That's right! Because mages can root people...you'd have to attack form afar to kill them. Given, rangers are over powerful, but I wish necros would stop connecting this to their classes disorders.</p><p>AND, next time someone complains about Fear and Life-taps not working properly....I suggest you guys imagine a day without them. Will much change? Or do you actually rely on them in some way? Necromancer does not equal only broken class in EQ2.</p></blockquote><span style="font-size: medium;color: #0099cc;">The thing with necros are, vs tanks, I expect to live 5 seconds, tops.</span>Pair this with a damage style that takes 5-10 seconds to even get going. See the problem?When I stack EVERY [I cannot control my vocabulary] variable in my favor, ie, I have a monster dps charmed pet, all my spells are mastered and I get the jump on someone that cant see me, that is when I get kills. ALL my other toons, including my 2 other mage types, can actually recover fromg etting jumped, or it doesnt matter too much for them if people see them coming. And they dont have to get everything work out perfectly, they ahve tools to deal with crap. Necros dont. Sure, best case scenario, necros can kill people in about 3-5 seconds. For this they need to be in a zone where there are undead wizard mobs, and they need to get the jump. and theyc ant get any resists on their 2 pets, or themselves. I havent played any other class that is so dependant on getting lucky as a necro. Not even my coercer.</blockquote><p>Here you are saying how horrible your survivability is. This is not exclusive to Necromancers. You don't think Conjurors have the same issue? <b>In fact, ALL mages except Sorcerers WITH manasheild have this problem. </b>Guess what, we're cloth wearers. We're not supposed to live very long. Given, our survivability needs a little boost, but as cloth wearers we also need to understand we can't have too much of a boost.</p><p>A tick, if I remember, is 6 seconds. For PvE this is no problem. But since day 1 I've wondered why a tick wasn't made to...let's say...4 seconds for PvP. Why? Because health recovery, power recovery, AND DoT's are inneffective when it takes 6 seconds for them to do their damage. When I finish fighting someone, my power and health are often drained. Next thing I know a scout comes and one-shots me. A tick needs to be decreased in time so our Health and Power regeneration have a chance to allow us to fight on without getting one shotte dbetween fights. Necromancers are also not the only class that relies on ticks for damage. </p><p>Do I have a problem with Necromancers wanting to get "fixed"? No, I absolutely do not. I just hate the fact that most necros go to the extremes of what's broken so they can get fixed...not realizing that other classes have it worse than them. All the threads I've seen lately are about necros needing to be fixed. Well, if necros are needing to be fixed, what about their sister class the Conjuror? Or what about the other classes that have similiar problems? I just think as a PvP community, we should stop focusing on one or two classes all of the time, and focus on what's wrong with PvP in general.</p><p>I've yet to see a thread striving to fix more than one class, or aspect of PvP. It's always "Nerf Rangers" "Fix Necros" "Take away titles" "Teir 2 level locking"</p><p>And now I'm just rambling on.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/47941865eb7bbc2a777305b46cc059a2.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote>Wrong. My coercer has all the tools he need to pwn face.I never played a conjurer, but I bet they are about in the same boat as a necro, save their stoneskin. I even started a thread that grew a lot about summoner survivability, and how to fix it. Lots and lots of good suggestions in that thread.The chanters really dont need any more than what they have. Well played, they tear pretty much everyone to shreds unless they get unlucky. with necros (remember, I never played a conjurer) after t6, I have to get lucky to get a kill. Prior to t6 I used to kill duos and trios solo, with some treasured gear a few tiers old. I know how to play the necro, and how to kite and all that. Problem is, t6+ everyone gets lots and lots of dps, whereas necros get no extra survivability. Chanters get some more toys for killing people, but what they need to be effective they get in t3/4. It just gets better with levels.And, taking care of one issue at a time is a good way to work. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Divide and conquer.

[jam3]

zero problems killing most rangers who dont have a fabled bow on my conjuror just by stunning them and getting in there face, you can use your fear and [Removed for Content]

[Norrsken]

<cite>Aeeron@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>zero problems killing most rangers who dont have a fabled bow on my conjuror just by stunning them and getting in there face, you can use your fear and [I cannot control my vocabulary]</blockquote>What level is your conj, and are you using stoneskin?

[Dracot]

<cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OMG your such uneducated person about lifetaps and fear obviously.  Look at the log i posted at first, look where i opened with fear and b4 one second passed it was expired.  Look at what a lifetap master2 does in pvp, 800ish on a crit which returns a max of 200 hp to the necro, which is on a 10 second timer, so don't profess to even think that helps the slightest.  And don't put a monk or bruiser in comparison, you get great tools called SELF HEALS, devastating fist, massive amounts of stuns and knockbacks.  Thing is a monk isn't a problem for necro, we just snare, root keep distance and all is good. </p><p>Not my fault your conj threads get turned aorund, but seriously rangers arent much a proelm for you unless exiled.  Assasins you should be able to deal with no problem having ssee stealth totems running, its not like they aren't right up your [Removed for Content] b4 they can attack, on the other hand a ranger can hide in the distance and drop someone.</p>

[Dracot]

<cite>Harbinger wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok, so i "met" Dracot 3 times today and i sense a nerf Swash post incoming <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />.Seriously mate, how about you work on your IRL reaction time and use totems and anti-stun potions ?!BladesCaineVenekor</blockquote><p>Nah Blades your actually one person who I honestly cannot beat, but i don't think your class is OP, plenty other swashies are easily controled with roots and such, thing with you in particular was all the resists.</p><p>Most other swashies ive come across i just pop a freedom of mind potion and root/fear/ stun, dps dps dps, snare get distance dps more.....you have insane ability to resist most my master spells even after AA's included into them.  </p><p>Your not like JEdil who will simply hide, gank, run.  Anytime ive fought him and gotten the jump he just usually jumps off the could or evacs. </p><p>Reaction time on a necro? Do you not understand we cannot cast ANYTHING on the run, nor is ANY of our spells fast cast, or fast dmg?  All you do is stunlock me plain and simple, not like your really all that talented.  </p>

[Dracot]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Harbinger wrote:</cite><cite></cite><blockquote>Oh and Taear, would be nice if you would stop running from me every time i encounter you solo, mkay?</blockquote>Respec so you don't have reach and you have a deal fyi. Against a swashbuckler, a single second of lag means I'm dead, and I'm not risking my title to something like that. Especially with all your potions, since Brigands rely absolutely on being able to stun.And honestly I don't care what a summoner uses. They just don't have any way of stopping you killing them when you get close. Plus rangers don't even need to get close, so they're dead no matter what happens. A single freedom of action potion costs about 50 silver, and renders any sort of survivability a Necromancer has utterly bunk. How are they supposed to compete with that? 50 silver to make them instantly killable? Or maybe you resist the root altogether, then they're even worse off.</blockquote>Its not worth arguing with them Taear, they know everything, notice how they all have General titles?  General Jedil, obtained from dread in one week, Blades been General awhile, same goes with the entire GW ganksquad that requires 2-4 rangers to run with.  Anti stun pot are great, but do almost nothing after 10secs and i dont know where he saw my pet got him anywhere below 80% health.  Anytime a summoner or mage starts a thread to get dev fixes, these people will farm them as much as they farm solo's using stealth track etc etc....take those skills away from them and watch the tides turn a bit.

[Dracot]

<cite>Aeeron@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>zero problems killing most rangers who dont have a fabled bow on my conjuror just by stunning them and getting in there face, you can use your fear and [I cannot control my vocabulary]</blockquote><p>Fear breaks on any dmg, so how is that useful?  Rarely ive seen fear last more than 2 seconds.  Its not the end all "I Win" button people claim it to be.  HEll our own snare breaks on dmg as do alot of our abilities, the interesting part of the snare breaking on dmg is the snare itself CAUSES DMG!!!</p><p>As for the case of Blades saying my pet gopt him low, he is wrong, my pet isn't what got him low, I actually got a fear to stick and I didn't wanna break it with a dot so I lifeburned him.  10 second cast to get him to about60% health.  Which leaves me at 1 hp, he could have farted and i would have died.  Lifeburn won't even kill him ion that manner, the spell does tops 60% to all health on opponent IF you are receiving efficient heals to make the spell work correctly.</p>

[Croniccaster]

 I play a conjuror that I resently dinged 70 on, 90% solo. I feel the Necro's pain. In solo pvp both classes are at a real disadvantage vs most other classes. As has been said before its not that we have bad damage, we don't. We just have terrible defence.  We don't have the tools we need to stay alive long enough to use most of the skills we have.           We have no burst damage. I'm not going to embarrass myself by telling you how much my highest damage spell hits for..<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/499fd50bc713bfcdf2ab5a23c00c2d62.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />. We have nothing remotely like mana shield. Stoneskin is ok. But usually only keeps me alive 2-3 more seconds because of how fast other classes get their ca's off. Its 3 hits. How long does it take a Brigand to get off 3 ca's? Most of our spells are long cast time and we can't move while casting.          Do I kill people? Sure I do. But usually I have to have lots of things going in my favor. See them 1st. Hit all my spells and potions right against whatever class I'm fighting, etc. This is not an all together bad thing. Makes this class very challenging to pvp with. Defiantly not for button mashers. But we defiantly need some love in pvp and so do Necro's. And you know what? I think the dev's will give us our turn. And I don't want any other class nerfed at all. Keep your track, evac, whatever. I want you to give me a tough fight. I just want to be able to stay alive long enough to give you one in return. Anyone who's fought me on Vox(yes there is pvp on Vox, hell it usually finds me), knows I don't run unless at a huge disadvantage(sometimes not even then). But I don't want to be just an easy token. By the way I do use potions, totems and any other tools I can.          Here's how much regard we're held in. I've grouped with rangers and swashie's. Know what they say? "Lets go to kos and see if we can catch some clothe's", " I know where a couple of Necro's go all the time". I'm like wait a minute, I'm a cloth wearer dammit...<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />. Now in a group ugh...hmmmm, yeah we still suck, please ignore the conjuror standing over there wiggling his fingers.......<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/908627bbe5e9f6a080977db8c365caff.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />. Love the class just need a little tweaking defense wise. Come on dev's, show us a little love, you know you want to.

[Gimet]

<cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OMG your such uneducated person about lifetaps and fear obviously.  Look at the log i posted at first, look where i opened with fear and b4 one second passed it was expired.  Look at what a lifetap master2 does in pvp, 800ish on a crit which returns a max of 200 hp to the necro, which is on a 10 second timer, so don't profess to even think that helps the slightest.  And don't put a monk or bruiser in comparison, you get great tools called SELF HEALS, devastating fist, massive amounts of stuns and knockbacks.  Thing is a monk isn't a problem for necro, we just snare, root keep distance and all is good. </p><p>Not my fault your conj threads get turned aorund, but seriously rangers arent much a proelm for you unless exiled.  Assasins you should be able to deal with no problem having ssee stealth totems running, its not like they aren't right up your [I cannot control my vocabulary] b4 they can attack, on the other hand a ranger can hide in the distance and drop someone.</p></blockquote><p>You're (notice how I didn't use your like you keep doing) just a little whining box aren't you? Tell me again what you want? Is it a nerf to rangers? An enhancement on Life-taps and Fears? A Plea for more defense? I'm missing something here...you're more repeating yourself and blatantly insulting poeple than asking for anything.</p><p>If you're (There goes that "you are" instead of "your" again) trying to tell me fear and Life-taps never stick...I completely understand that. But welcome to not having them (being they're so weak) like the other classes. I'm still failing to understand what you're trying to tell me aout them however.</p><p>To everyone else...MY GOD, not all Conjuror's have Stoneskin. -_-</p>

[Dracot]

<cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OMG your such uneducated person about lifetaps and fear obviously.  Look at the log i posted at first, look where i opened with fear and b4 one second passed it was expired.  Look at what a lifetap master2 does in pvp, 800ish on a crit which returns a max of 200 hp to the necro, which is on a 10 second timer, so don't profess to even think that helps the slightest.  And don't put a monk or bruiser in comparison, you get great tools called SELF HEALS, devastating fist, massive amounts of stuns and knockbacks.  Thing is a monk isn't a problem for necro, we just snare, root keep distance and all is good. </p><p>Not my fault your conj threads get turned aorund, but seriously rangers arent much a proelm for you unless exiled.  Assasins you should be able to deal with no problem having ssee stealth totems running, its not like they aren't right up your [I cannot control my vocabulary] b4 they can attack, on the other hand a ranger can hide in the distance and drop someone.</p></blockquote><p>You're (notice how I didn't use your like you keep doing) just a little whining box aren't you? Tell me again what you want? Is it a nerf to rangers? An enhancement on Life-taps and Fears? A Plea for more defense? I'm missing something here...you're more repeating yourself and blatantly insulting poeple than asking for anything.</p><p>If you're (There goes that "you are" instead of "your" again) trying to tell me fear and Life-taps never stick...I completely understand that. But welcome to not having them (being they're so weak) like the other classes. I'm still failing to understand what you're trying to tell me aout them however.</p><p>To everyone else...MY GOD, not all Conjuror's have Stoneskin. -_-</p></blockquote><p>How's bout you go make a conjy thread and ignore this one if its bothering you so much? This is what gets threads locked. People like yourself jsut antagonizing arguments. If you're not going to be part of the solution do us all a favor and not post in this. I haven't insulted one person in this thread directly, a group of people who imo, which im entitled to play their classes cause of the cheapness of the thing, other than that I've never directly insulted anyone.  Sitting in this thread trying to be a english instructor won't win any points here man, just drive thru and go make a conjy love thread to get help with your class.</p><p>I even stated b4 that if you make a thread i would back you up, all you're doing is trying to start a fight. I won't allow this thread to die like the hundreds of others that have been ignored cause people like yourself  have the need to de-rail it.</p><p>No this isn't a nerf ranger thread, its yet another plea and a proof giver to the devs to see what the customer base who play necro's are going through.</p><p>Ya know both conjy and necro are great PVE solo classes, you ever stop to think of WHY?  Now if the devs would tune our chars to be able to use the TOOLS we have to be successful in PVP maybe I wouldn't be here posting at all.  Don't try and Bs me either that pve is differnt than pvp, my skills are still the same except dumbed down in pvp.  Make the pets actually do theire jobs in pvp, atm they do not pose any real threat to an opponent, which is the main reason you don't see the pets being attacked much. Make taunts work and don't allow a target nearest pvp hotkey affect it for at least 2 seconds.  Take the break on dmg out of snares, roots and fears, bad enough all these can be potioned off as it is.  Conjies get nice AE's and stuns, guess what I get 1 AE lifetap thats basically melee range and one stun thats ona ridiuclous recast timer. Fear recast needs to be addressed in pvp also, if we die in under 5 seconds, it might help to be able to semi chain cast fear maybe every 2-5 seocnds to gain a slight edge in pvp. So much needs to be addressed on both classes its pathetic.</p>

[Echgar]

Some of the comments here are getting a bit personal and insulting.  Please be mindful that while you are welcome to disagree with each other, please keep your comments constructive and respectful.  Just because you don't share the same opinion as someone else, there is no need to be so hostile with each other.

[Notsovilepriest]

<cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OMG your such uneducated person about lifetaps and fear obviously.  Look at the log i posted at first, look where i opened with fear and b4 one second passed it was expired.  Look at what a lifetap master2 does in pvp, 800ish on a crit which returns a max of 200 hp to the necro, which is on a 10 second timer, so don't profess to even think that helps the slightest.  And don't put a monk or bruiser in comparison, you get great tools called SELF HEALS, devastating fist, massive amounts of stuns and knockbacks.  Thing is a monk isn't a problem for necro, we just snare, root keep distance and all is good. </p><p>Not my fault your conj threads get turned aorund, but seriously rangers arent much a proelm for you unless exiled.  Assasins you should be able to deal with no problem having ssee stealth totems running, its not like they aren't right up your [I cannot control my vocabulary] b4 they can attack, on the other hand a ranger can hide in the distance and drop someone.</p></blockquote><p>You're (notice how I didn't use your like you keep doing) just a little whining box aren't you? Tell me again what you want? Is it a nerf to rangers? An enhancement on Life-taps and Fears? A Plea for more defense? I'm missing something here...you're more repeating yourself and blatantly insulting poeple than asking for anything.</p><p>If you're (There goes that "you are" instead of "your" again) trying to tell me fear and Life-taps never stick...I completely understand that. But welcome to not having them (being they're so weak) like the other classes. I'm still failing to understand what you're trying to tell me aout them however.</p><p>To everyone else...MY GOD, not all Conjuror's have Stoneskin. -_-</p></blockquote><p>How's bout you go make a conjy thread and ignore this one if its bothering you so much? This is what gets threads locked. People like yourself jsut antagonizing arguments. If you're not going to be part of the solution do us all a favor and not post in this. I haven't insulted one person in this thread directly, a group of people who imo, which im entitled to play their classes cause of the cheapness of the thing, other than that I've never directly insulted anyone.  Sitting in this thread trying to be a english instructor won't win any points here man, just drive thru and go make a conjy love thread to get help with your class.</p><p>I even stated b4 that if you make a thread i would back you up, all you're doing is trying to start a fight. I won't allow this thread to die like the hundreds of others that have been ignored cause people like yourself  have the need to de-rail it.</p><p>No this isn't a nerf ranger thread, its yet another plea and a proof giver to the devs to see what the customer base who play necro's are going through.</p><p>Ya know both conjy and necro are great PVE solo classes, you ever stop to think of WHY?  Now if the devs would tune our chars to be able to use the TOOLS we have to be successful in PVP maybe I wouldn't be here posting at all.  Don't try and Bs me either that pve is differnt than pvp, my skills are still the same except dumbed down in pvp.  Make the pets actually do theire jobs in pvp, atm they do not pose any real threat to an opponent, which is the main reason you don't see the pets being attacked much. Make taunts work and don't allow a target nearest pvp hotkey affect it for at least 2 seconds.  Take the break on dmg out of snares, roots and fears, bad enough all these can be potioned off as it is.  Conjies get nice AE's and stuns, guess what I get 1 AE lifetap thats basically melee range and one stun thats ona ridiuclous recast timer. Fear recast needs to be addressed in pvp also, if we die in under 5 seconds, it might help to be able to semi chain cast fear maybe every 2-5 seocnds to gain a slight edge in pvp. So much needs to be addressed on both classes its pathetic.</p></blockquote>Dracot or whoever you char is, Following your posts are just making me laugh anymore. If you don't like your class....Re-Roll or quit. Problem solved and you can stop posting about how underpowered your class is. A good Necro can do really good for themselves in PvP against almost any class as long as they are paying full attention. Madevil does really well for himself in Solo PvP. Lets look at something though of the 2 summoners I would have to say that Necro's have it better.Conj: Stoneskin Woot! Could Absorb 1 dmg for all you knowNecro: Life taps...I would say Necro's winNecro: Scout Pet-95% chance if Scout pet spec'ed to interuptConj: Possibly the sameNecro Pets: Can proc fears which are deadlyConj Pets: Nothing special for themConj level 70 Skill Blazing AvatarNecros get this skill at either 52, 55, 58 as an ancient teaching while they still get lich.Also, About the GW gank squads as you like to say...That is just funny.

[DravynX]

<p>To be honest with you, I'd trade our lifetap for stoneskin..a very very low hp heal with a ten second recast that can be resisted? Not quite as amazing as you make it out to be. Its also our hardest hitting nuke, and even at Master 1 its not that impressive.</p><p>edit - of course there's our aoe lifetap, nice dmg, nice heal..but personally the farther I am from melee range the better, unless i'm fighting a ranger, and I need to be in melee range to use it. </p><p>Shadow Knights can nuke and self heal better than necro's by a mile. Funny reversal from the old days, uh? </p>

[Khrunk]

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OMG your such uneducated person about lifetaps and fear obviously.  Look at the log i posted at first, look where i opened with fear and b4 one second passed it was expired.  Look at what a lifetap master2 does in pvp, 800ish on a crit which returns a max of 200 hp to the necro, which is on a 10 second timer, so don't profess to even think that helps the slightest.  And don't put a monk or bruiser in comparison, you get great tools called SELF HEALS, devastating fist, massive amounts of stuns and knockbacks.  Thing is a monk isn't a problem for necro, we just snare, root keep distance and all is good. </p><p>Not my fault your conj threads get turned aorund, but seriously rangers arent much a proelm for you unless exiled.  Assasins you should be able to deal with no problem having ssee stealth totems running, its not like they aren't right up your [I cannot control my vocabulary] b4 they can attack, on the other hand a ranger can hide in the distance and drop someone.</p></blockquote><p>You're (notice how I didn't use your like you keep doing) just a little whining box aren't you? Tell me again what you want? Is it a nerf to rangers? An enhancement on Life-taps and Fears? A Plea for more defense? I'm missing something here...you're more repeating yourself and blatantly insulting poeple than asking for anything.</p><p>If you're (There goes that "you are" instead of "your" again) trying to tell me fear and Life-taps never stick...I completely understand that. But welcome to not having them (being they're so weak) like the other classes. I'm still failing to understand what you're trying to tell me aout them however.</p><p>To everyone else...MY GOD, not all Conjuror's have Stoneskin. -_-</p></blockquote><p>How's bout you go make a conjy thread and ignore this one if its bothering you so much? This is what gets threads locked. People like yourself jsut antagonizing arguments. If you're not going to be part of the solution do us all a favor and not post in this. I haven't insulted one person in this thread directly, a group of people who imo, which im entitled to play their classes cause of the cheapness of the thing, other than that I've never directly insulted anyone.  Sitting in this thread trying to be a english instructor won't win any points here man, just drive thru and go make a conjy love thread to get help with your class.</p><p>I even stated b4 that if you make a thread i would back you up, all you're doing is trying to start a fight. I won't allow this thread to die like the hundreds of others that have been ignored cause people like yourself  have the need to de-rail it.</p><p>No this isn't a nerf ranger thread, its yet another plea and a proof giver to the devs to see what the customer base who play necro's are going through.</p><p>Ya know both conjy and necro are great PVE solo classes, you ever stop to think of WHY?  Now if the devs would tune our chars to be able to use the TOOLS we have to be successful in PVP maybe I wouldn't be here posting at all.  Don't try and Bs me either that pve is differnt than pvp, my skills are still the same except dumbed down in pvp.  Make the pets actually do theire jobs in pvp, atm they do not pose any real threat to an opponent, which is the main reason you don't see the pets being attacked much. Make taunts work and don't allow a target nearest pvp hotkey affect it for at least 2 seconds.  Take the break on dmg out of snares, roots and fears, bad enough all these can be potioned off as it is.  Conjies get nice AE's and stuns, guess what I get 1 AE lifetap thats basically melee range and one stun thats ona ridiuclous recast timer. Fear recast needs to be addressed in pvp also, if we die in under 5 seconds, it might help to be able to semi chain cast fear maybe every 2-5 seocnds to gain a slight edge in pvp. So much needs to be addressed on both classes its pathetic.</p></blockquote>Dracot or whoever you char is, Following your posts are just making me laugh anymore. If you don't like your class....Re-Roll or quit. Problem solved and you can stop posting about how underpowered your class is. A good Necro can do really good for themselves in PvP against almost any class as long as they are paying full attention. Madevil does really well for himself in Solo PvP. Lets look at something though of the 2 summoners I would have to say that Necro's have it better.Conj: Stoneskin Woot! Could Absorb 1 dmg for all you knowNecro: Life taps...I would say Necro's win<span style="color: #0033ff;">seems my master 1 gets resisted way more than it should</span>Necro: Scout Pet-95% chance if Scout pet spec'ed to interuptConj: Possibly the same<span style="color: #0000ff;">if this was true every necro would be an overlord. </span>Necro Pets: Can proc fears which are deadlyConj Pets: Nothing special for them<span style="color: #0033ff;">no</span>Conj level 70 Skill Blazing AvatarNecros get this skill at either 52, 55, 58 as an ancient teaching while they still get lich.<span style="color: #0033ff;"> it is called consumption and is a bit different than blazing avatar. which is at 58 and we get lich at 50. </span>Also, About the GW gank squads as you like to say...That is just funny.</blockquote><p>i agree in pve necros are way better than conjys, but in pvp they both blow chunks compared to some of the other classes. though they do tend to die rather quickly if that is a good thing. whats really is cute is the huge amount of resists that some master spells seem to get, all the while i have yet to resist a combat art from a melee class. </p>

[Dracot]

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dracot72 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enlocke@Vox wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So you Dracot are simply whining about fighting Rangers? Given, Conjuror's don't fight Rangers...but if YOU are lucky enough you'll perhaps fight another necro...or even an assassin. You necros aren't as easy to beat as you'd like to think, and assassins may not be as strong as Rangers, but they're no cake-walk either. As Mages, quite often we only win flawlessly or die flawlessly. There quite often is no between. And if your problem is Rangers then I don't think your class needs help. EVERYONE's problem is rangers.</p><p>And you guys do Have Heals/mezzes. It's called fear and lifetaps. You guys do have a stealth, it's called Invisibility. So on that little list you gave you don't have Stoneskin, mez, runspeed, evac, and track. But name a class that has none of those at all. Hmmm...Most fighter classes. Especially low defense Brawlers.</p><p>Necromancers are still not the only class on the failing stick. And if you guys want to talk about rangers, then EVERYONE is close to the failing end.</p><p>And every fix conjy thread turns to people talkign about their Necromancers.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>OMG your such uneducated person about lifetaps and fear obviously.  Look at the log i posted at first, look where i opened with fear and b4 one second passed it was expired.  Look at what a lifetap master2 does in pvp, 800ish on a crit which returns a max of 200 hp to the necro, which is on a 10 second timer, so don't profess to even think that helps the slightest.  And don't put a monk or bruiser in comparison, you get great tools called SELF HEALS, devastating fist, massive amounts of stuns and knockbacks.  Thing is a monk isn't a problem for necro, we just snare, root keep distance and all is good. </p><p>Not my fault your conj threads get turned aorund, but seriously rangers arent much a proelm for you unless exiled.  Assasins you should be able to deal with no problem having ssee stealth totems running, its not like they aren't right up your [I cannot control my vocabulary] b4 they can attack, on the other hand a ranger can hide in the distance and drop someone.</p></blockquote><p>You're (notice how I didn't use your like you keep doing) just a little whining box aren't you? Tell me again what you want? Is it a nerf to rangers? An enhancement on Life-taps and Fears? A Plea for more defense? I'm missing something here...you're more repeating yourself and blatantly insulting poeple than asking for anything.</p><p>If you're (There goes that "you are" instead of "your" again) trying to tell me fear and Life-taps never stick...I completely understand that. But welcome to not having them (being they're so weak) like the other classes. I'm still failing to understand what you're trying to tell me aout them however.</p><p>To everyone else...MY GOD, not all Conjuror's have Stoneskin. -_-</p></blockquote><p>How's bout you go make a conjy thread and ignore this one if its bothering you so much? This is what gets threads locked. People like yourself jsut antagonizing arguments. If you're not going to be part of the solution do us all a favor and not post in this. I haven't insulted one person in this thread directly, a group of people who imo, which im entitled to play their classes cause of the cheapness of the thing, other than that I've never directly insulted anyone.  Sitting in this thread trying to be a english instructor won't win any points here man, just drive thru and go make a conjy love thread to get help with your class.</p><p>I even stated b4 that if you make a thread i would back you up, all you're doing is trying to start a fight. I won't allow this thread to die like the hundreds of others that have been ignored cause people like yourself  have the need to de-rail it.</p><p>No this isn't a nerf ranger thread, its yet another plea and a proof giver to the devs to see what the customer base who play necro's are going through.</p><p>Ya know both conjy and necro are great PVE solo classes, you ever stop to think of WHY?  Now if the devs would tune our chars to be able to use the TOOLS we have to be successful in PVP maybe I wouldn't be here posting at all.  Don't try and Bs me either that pve is differnt than pvp, my skills are still the same except dumbed down in pvp.  Make the pets actually do theire jobs in pvp, atm they do not pose any real threat to an opponent, which is the main reason you don't see the pets being attacked much. Make taunts work and don't allow a target nearest pvp hotkey affect it for at least 2 seconds.  Take the break on dmg out of snares, roots and fears, bad enough all these can be potioned off as it is.  Conjies get nice AE's and stuns, guess what I get 1 AE lifetap thats basically melee range and one stun thats ona ridiuclous recast timer. Fear recast needs to be addressed in pvp also, if we die in under 5 seconds, it might help to be able to semi chain cast fear maybe every 2-5 seocnds to gain a slight edge in pvp. So much needs to be addressed on both classes its pathetic.</p></blockquote>Dracot or whoever you char is, Following your posts are just making me laugh anymore. If you don't like your class....Re-Roll or quit. Problem solved and you can stop posting about how underpowered your class is. A good Necro can do really good for themselves in PvP against almost any class as long as they are paying full attention. Madevil does really well for himself in Solo PvP. Lets look at something though of the 2 summoners I would have to say that Necro's have it better.Conj: Stoneskin Woot! Could Absorb 1 dmg for all you knowNecro: Life taps...I would say Necro's winNecro: Scout Pet-95% chance if Scout pet spec'ed to interuptConj: Possibly the sameNecro Pets: Can proc fears which are deadlyConj Pets: Nothing special for themConj level 70 Skill Blazing AvatarNecros get this skill at either 52, 55, 58 as an ancient teaching while they still get lich.Also, About the GW gank squads as you like to say...That is just funny.</blockquote><p>LEts start off by saying I play my class because I love the lore behind it and have a lvl 70 necro on eq1 pvp, which there was a very versatile class.  Re-roll or quit?  Who are you to tell me what to do?  BTW aren't you the 100% immune to disease priest?  </p><p>Again lets go down the list you provided...</p><p>Lifetaps, 200 hp regen vs 300-800 auto attack hits = WORTHLESS.</p><p>Scout pet interupts maybe 1 hit out of 50, thats not enough to rely on.</p><p>Fears omg, how blind are we, EVERY necro says the same thing, fear breaks too fast for it to be a RELIABLE form of crowd control.  Also now we have a new round sheild in game that procs fear immunity.  Your assumption here is based on #'s and not facts.</p><p>We don't get Blazing Avatar, nice try though.</p><p>The GW ganksquad is not a myth, its the notorious group that runs around with 2 or more rangers and thats all they do is find solo's or duos and farm.  No skill involved.</p>

[Mildavyn]

<cite>Khrunk@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>i have yet to resist a combat art from a melee class. </blockquote><p>I've yet to parry a spell either. CAs don't get resists, but a spell can't be parried/deflected/dodged/avoided.</p><p>Believe me when I say that my CAs miss alot more than my spells are resisted, and the best thing? When my spells are resisted, I can cast em again in 1 second. Miss with a CA though and you get to wait full duration.</p>

[Tae]

<cite>Magius789 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite> To hell with Fame/Infamy!!!!!!!  Plus do you think people will respect your title now when you said you run?</blockquote>I don't care if people respect it. It's the only way to measure any sort of PvP, and if I log off with a title lower than the one I logged in with, I feel like I shouldn't even have bothered to log in that day. Plus as a Dreadnaught I am automatically first target in any fight, which is utterly ridiculous and I would hope it's not what Sony intended when they put the fame system in.

[Magius789]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Magius789 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>To hell with Fame/Infamy!!!!!!!  Plus do you think people will respect your title now when you said you run?</blockquote>I don't care if people respect it. <b>It's the only way to measure any sort of PvP</b>, and if I log off with a title lower than the one I logged in with, I feel like I shouldn't even have bothered to log in that day.Plus as a Dreadnaught I am automatically first target in any fight, which is utterly ridiculous and I would hope it's not what Sony intended when they put the fame system in.</blockquote>I think you'll find most people on these board will disagree with that statement.  There are so many easy and unintended ways to get fame that no, title does not equal PvP skill.   Look at Exur he basically stays in the slayer/destroyer range and he def. knows how to PvP.  And no offense but it doesn't require skill to run around in your little gank group with Ajjantis and kill solo's to get fame.

[Khrunk]

<cite>Paikis@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Khrunk@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>i have yet to resist a combat art from a melee class. </blockquote><p>I've yet to parry a spell either. CAs don't get resists, but a spell can't be parried/deflected/dodged/avoided.</p><p>Believe me when I say that my CAs miss alot more than my spells are resisted, and the best thing? When my spells are resisted, I can cast em again in 1 second. Miss with a CA though and you get to wait full duration.</p></blockquote>from what i have seen with my guard and my necro in pvp. i can say that my guard hardly ever misses a ca on a enemy unless its a monk, as compared to my necro that gets masters resisted way more than adpet 1 combat arts on my guard get avoided/parried/deflected/blocked.

[Tae]

<cite>Magius789 wrote:</cite><cite></cite> <blockquote>I think you'll find most people on these board will disagree with that statement.  There are so many easy and unintended ways to get fame that no, title does not equal PvP skill.   Look at Exur he basically stays in the slayer/destroyer range and he def. knows how to PvP.  And no offense but it doesn't require skill to run around in your little gank group with Ajjantis and kill solo's to get fame.</blockquote>Ajjantis hasn't played his fury in months, I got dreadnaught entirely solo, thanks. And I mean only visual way. I like being a dreadnaught.

[Cyst]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Magius789 wrote:</cite><cite></cite><blockquote>I think you'll find most people on these board will disagree with that statement.  There are so many easy and unintended ways to get fame that no, title does not equal PvP skill.   Look at Exur he basically stays in the slayer/destroyer range and he def. knows how to PvP.  And no offense but it doesn't require skill to run around in your little gank group with Ajjantis and kill solo's to get fame.</blockquote>Ajjantis hasn't played his fury in months, I got dreadnaught entirely solo, thanks.And I mean only visual way. I like being a dreadnaught.</blockquote><p>Some say they've seen him get his Dreadnaught on his Swashie by killing his friends, and they killing him. Doesn't suprise me that once he got a Swashbuckler in your level range, you're all of a sudden Dreadnaught. It also wouldn't suprise me to find out he has the totems ALREADY to get PvP gear with his Swashbuckler.</p><p>This may be another exiled moment we all know.</p>

[Darq]

<cite>Paikis@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Khrunk@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>i have yet to resist a combat art from a melee class. </blockquote><p>I've yet to parry a spell either. CAs don't get resists, but a spell can't be parried/deflected/dodged/avoided.</p><p>Believe me when I say that my CAs miss alot more than my spells are resisted, and the best thing? When my spells are resisted, I can cast em again in 1 second. Miss with a CA though and you get to wait full duration.</p></blockquote>oh it can, i've seen it happen many times and found it very odd

[Tae]

<cite>Demron wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>Some say they've seen him get his Dreadnaught on his Swashie by killing his friends, and they killing him. Doesn't suprise me that once he got a Swashbuckler in your level range, you're all of a sudden Dreadnaught. It also wouldn't suprise me to find out he has the totems ALREADY to get PvP gear with his Swashbuckler.</blockquote>Some are wrong, I've never killed Ajjantis, and nor has anyone else in the guild. Don't come here spreading rumours like that. They're utterly incorrect, and they're the type of thing people get banned for. I got Dreadnaught from Hithit in Lesser Faydark. (derail over tia)

[Darkor]

I wanna see which of my lovely friends would give me their free fame so i can get the next higher title. I surely wont say no lololol.

[Cocytus]

Omg I died in pvp. /wrists

[Spyderbite]

<cite>Cocytus wrote:</cite><blockquote>Omg I died in pvp. /wrists</blockquote><img src="http://sloan.fcpages.com/smilies/Lol14.gif" alt="" border="0" />

[Norrsken]

<cite>Darq wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Paikis@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Khrunk@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote>i have yet to resist a combat art from a melee class. </blockquote><p>I've yet to parry a spell either. CAs don't get resists, but a spell can't be parried/deflected/dodged/avoided.</p><p>Believe me when I say that my CAs miss alot more than my spells are resisted, and the best thing? When my spells are resisted, I can cast em again in 1 second. Miss with a CA though and you get to wait full duration.</p></blockquote>oh it can, i've seen it happen many times and found it very odd</blockquote>enchanters get an aa that basically is a spell riposte. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> counterblade I think its called.

[dakmore scorpain]

<p>You get 2 lifetap style spells, a 6 second stun, if you went down just 2 cirlces in the lifeburn tree(you should have the whole deal mind you) your withering coil and pest blast upgrades should easily be wiping the floor, you have MANY summoned pets, a root that fears.</p><p>And you choose to fear him off the bat without a root followup?</p><p>Firstly, you obviously need to root and run up on a ranger. You're fault.</p><p>Secondly, you need to run up on the ranger for the AOE lifetap spell to keep you up along with lifetap. You're fault.</p><p>Thirdly, you threw no dots on him, if a ranger starts taking alot of damage alot of the newbier ones will run, your pet and dots will kill him.</p><p>On my 44 necro i see nothing broken when I play him. You just don't use your spells to your advantage and you want a click-and-kill class. Reroll a wizard. Or just reroll a fury with that vortex crap.</p>

[Tae]

<cite>dakmore scorpain wrote:</cite><blockquote>On my 44 necro i see nothing broken when I play him. You just don't use your spells to your advantage and you want a click-and-kill class. Reroll a wizard. Or just reroll a fury with that vortex crap.</blockquote><i>You're not level 70 so you don't know what you're talking about.</i> Furies are terrible at level 70 too. The problem isn't at low levels. It's at T7.

[dakmore scorpain]

<p><i>He's not t7 either, so your point is invalid.</i></p>

[Tae]

<cite>dakmore scorpain wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><i>He's not t7 either, so your point is invalid.</i></p></blockquote>Drakot? Yes he is. I've met him.

[dakmore scorpain]

<p>I don't understand how t7 he isn't using the proper pvp spells in pvp.</p><p>I've used the same rinse-repeat setup since 12, and never had a real problem soloing. Granted, it's a squishy class, but it's far from the worse.</p><p>(My coercer went something like 20-92 solo, locked from 10-27, and is now 200-102 group pvp. That's a bit rediculus, no toon should rely on a group to kill 1 or 2 greens.)</p><p>I will however give you guys the benefit of the doubt, maybe things turn uber sour for roots, dots, and nukes in t7. (He was using a buff that takes life to keep up, and fighting a class that deals alot of damage? Am i the only one who notices that he cast 2 spells for ticks on the lich form?)</p>

[Norrsken]

<cite>dakmore scorpain wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I don't understand how t7 he isn't using the proper pvp spells in pvp.</p><p>I've used the same rinse-repeat setup since 12, and never had a real problem soloing. Granted, it's a squishy class, but it's far from the worse.</p><p>(My coercer went something like 20-92 solo, locked from 10-27, and is now 200-102 group pvp. That's a bit rediculus, no toon should rely on a group to kill 1 or 2 greens.)</p><p>I will however give you guys the benefit of the doubt, maybe things turn uber sour for roots, dots, and nukes in t7. (He was using a buff that takes life to keep up, and fighting a class that deals alot of damage? Am i the only one who notices that he cast 2 spells for ticks on the lich form?)</p></blockquote>Its not a case of CC going sour, but everyone in t7 stocks cure pots so they do. Its a matter of not having any defence, so even the low dps classes will kill you in 10 seconds, or less. and there is nothing at all you can do about it except killing them faster. the not low dps classes? expect to live 5 seconds or less.Can you do 6-7k damage in 5 seconds or less as a necro?Yes, if you have a perfect streak. does any other classes need a perfect streak or they die? Well, the conjie. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Other than that, basically no. though, I must confess I never played a bard, but they seem pretty capable from what I've seen some of them do.

[Dracot]

<cite>dakmore scorpain wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>You get 2 lifetap style spells, a 6 second stun, if you went down just 2 cirlces in the lifeburn tree(you should have the whole deal mind you) your withering coil and pest blast upgrades should easily be wiping the floor, you have MANY summoned pets, a root that fears.</p><p>And you choose to fear him off the bat without a root followup?</p><p>Firstly, you obviously need to root and run up on a ranger. You're fault.</p><p>Secondly, you need to run up on the ranger for the AOE lifetap spell to keep you up along with lifetap. You're fault.</p><p>Thirdly, you threw no dots on him, if a ranger starts taking alot of damage alot of the newbier ones will run, your pet and dots will kill him.</p><p>On my 44 necro i see nothing broken when I play him. You just don't use your spells to your advantage and you want a click-and-kill class. Reroll a wizard. Or just reroll a fury with that vortex crap.</p></blockquote>Nothing more naive than a pre t7 necro psoting about t7 events.

[Dracot]

<cite>dakmore scorpain wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>You get 2 lifetap style spells, a 6 second stun, if you went down just 2 cirlces in the lifeburn tree(you should have the whole deal mind you) your withering coil and pest blast upgrades should easily be wiping the floor, you have MANY summoned pets, a root that fears.</p><p>And you choose to fear him off the bat without a root followup?</p><p>Firstly, you obviously need to root and run up on a ranger. You're fault.<span style="color: #cc0000;">Wrong, b time you run up on a rooted ranger he's done roughly 6k dmg and you dead.</span></p><p>Secondly, you need to run up on the ranger for the AOE lifetap spell to keep you up along with lifetap. You're fault.<span style="color: #cc0000;">/sigh, look above</span></p><p>Thirdly, you threw no dots on him, if a ranger starts taking alot of damage alot of the newbier ones will run, your pet and dots will kill him.<span style="color: #cc0000;">dots take way too much time to be effective, yes we throw dots IF we can even get one cast off. </span></p><p>On my 44 necro i see nothing broken when I play him. You just don't use your spells to your advantage and you want a click-and-kill class. Reroll a wizard. Or just reroll a fury with that vortex crap.<span style="color: #cc0000;">This explains it all... You are completely clueless at 44 to a t7 necro.</span></p></blockquote>Nothing more naive than a pre t7 necro posting about t7 events.

[Dracot]

<cite>Taear@Venekor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>dakmore scorpain wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><i>He's not t7 either, so your point is invalid.</i></p></blockquote>Drakot? Yes he is. I've met him. </blockquote>omg rofl, ive been 70 and mastered out fully  EOF legenedary/fabled for over a year now on this character.....