Aggro: Multiple Mobs

[Tristin2]

<p>I have recieved a number of different answers to this question.  I put it to you all to find out what the Majority and or Consensus is.    </p><p>On the pull for MULTIPLE MOBS - Do you as a guardian switch between raid mobs to help keep aggro?  Whether it is often, sometimes, or never, I would like to know why you do or do not?  I'm curious because i have heard different opinions on the matter when holding aggro.  Some suggest that it is imperitive to switch between targets to help keep aggro from the consistent AOE from the RAID MOB; and some suggest that switching between mobs only makes matters worse and will often cause the MT to LOSE aggro...  Either u do or do not switch between multiple raid mobs that is the question!  </p><p>It has also been suggested that have your traditional MA, and an off tank.  If its recommended to NOT switch targets for the guardian, have an off tank get the one that may break away, (generally a mob u are not targeting).  Or again just the opposite do most of you switch targets to help keep aggro so you lessen the chance of losing a target mob?</p><p>I have understood from Zerkers, and SK's (IF THEY ARE MT) that they generally do not need to switch between targets at all or if ever during the course of a multiple mob encounter -  I've also been told that once the Guard selects a Raid mob, it should stay with that one until it dies, (it should not select another target within its threat range at all) then move to the next mob.  </p><p>Though take into consideration, as i am sure someone will ask - -what does your MT grp generally look like.  </p><p>Def, Coer, Dirge, Temp, Tank and either another healer or another class of some type.  Generally we do NOT.... run CONSISTENLY with a swashy or assassin, for the extra hate.  If we do have those classes (on occassion), yes i fully understand and am aware the extra hate (when u can get it) from especially a swashy helps a TON.  </p><p>Just curious to find out what the consensus is on the matter.  Thanks for your feedback.</p><p>    </p>

[Wilin]

<p>I am DPS specced. (STR/AGI/STA 448, Slaughtering to double attack, Stalwarting to Block and max Reinforcement)</p><p>My dirge is DPS specced.</p><p>Typical group is me/shaman/templar/coercer/dirge/scout xfer.</p><p>I use the slower delay higher crit formula for dps, but on groups of mobs, I have a routine that I do.</p><p>Change weapon>Protection>Confront on the pull</p><p>And dirge hits mastered CoB</p><p>Plant>Reinforcement>Dragoon Spin>Obliterate>Flay>Lay Waste>Tab+couple CAs>Repeat for every mob>until back to MAs target>Change weapon when CoB and reinforcement are down>Concentrate on MAs target but tab through occasionally and drop some aggro as needed until everything is dead</p><p>The weapon that I use during the CoB/reinforcement fest (both 100% proc rate) at the beginning of the fight is fast delay(formerly a DW). It's got an 80+ rating and has a decent damage proc and my hasted delay with it is somewhere around .8 seconds and I've got the 40% chance to AE auto attack as well. So even though I'm tabbing through targets, I'm still hitting them all 40% of the auto swings.</p><p>For any situation, it's a balance of the top single target dps and the top AE dps. If you switch to the other mobs to keep the warlock from dying, you run the risk of having the assassin pull aggro because he's all single target dps.</p><p>I tried alot of different ways to hold AE aggro, but this is the one that works for me. I'm sure others have their ways as well.</p>

[Yourbestfriend]

secret to holding mobs sequence.reinforcementdragoon spinbesiegeGG.

[Barok]

<cite>Jaraxx@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>secret to holding mobs sequence.reinforcementdragoon spinbesiegeGG.</blockquote><p>/agree </p><p>i add plant after beseige also.</p>

[Zo]

Call reinforcement in vent when you use it so your AOE'ers know when to blow it up.  If reinforcement isn't up, I tab pretty equally with my swash transfer staying on the MA target.Either way, I can't think of more than a couple names where the adds are up for more than 15 seconds.

[Wilin]

<cite>Jaraxx@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>secret to holding mobs sequence.reinforcementdragoon spinbesiegeGG.</blockquote>I got some mileage out of that sequence but I still had warlocks peeling mobs sometimes.

[crazsliz]

<p>I am the SK in Tristin's guild we are trying to figure out how often guardians change targets on an encounter. Tristin will typically hit tab every 2 or 3 seconds to taunt one of the mobs in the encounter. While the Zerker and my SK will never change targets. Sure you can say I have deathmarch but the fact is I rarley use it unless I see mobs start breaking off which is pretty rare. It seems that when a MT starts switching targets to try and hold aggro on multiple mobs they break off easier then when you were just staying on a single target that the rest of the Raid was attacking.</p>

[Rob626]

Try this macro by the way: /target BigNastyMobName /autoattack 1 /usea SingleTargetTaunt works really well when tabbing through the targets .... gets me back to the main critter without any questions, makes sure I am still swinging, and if the taunt happens to be up when i hit the macro it's a bonus. I keep this macro very accessible and it takes only a second or two to modify it for each encounter. The followup question is if and when a mob peels how do you generally react? Let the OT take it or try to reel it back in with Rescue or taunts? My own response depends on if the critter that peeled is still healthy or almost dead and if the OT is getting pasted by the critter or handling the pain well. How do you all handle it?

[Tristin2]

<p>Thanks so much about your feedback about sequencing etc.  I think that will no doubt help, but i was wondering as my friends will, do most of you when you are MT - Do you switch or cycle through targets often on multiple raid mobs or not to help you keep aggro?  If so why or why not?  </p>

[Tristin2]

<p>This is a post from Raahl:  Great post!</p><p>I'd stay Zerker if I were you.   IMO, your group hate generation is superior to a guardians.</p><p>I still have problems with aggro with certain classes.  Sometimes it's really not the class it's the person behind the class.   I've seen 2 similarly equipped Wizards, one never seems to get aggro and the other constantly gets aggro.</p><p>I find tabbing between the enemies and throwing a taunt helps, but it can also cause the mob that the group is beating on to break off and kill the DPS classes.  If you have classes that use AoE's a lot they will more than likely get aggro off of you.  Being a guardian will only make this happen more often.</p><p>Just get the best equipment you can find and upgrade all your CA to Adept 3 or Master 1, if they are not already.</p><p>***</p><p>Just seems to me that Raahl has got a really good point of view.  Zerkers and SK's don't really have to worry about Multiple mobs like Guards do.  There aggro for multiple mobs it seems are far superior to that of a guardian.  He also makes a point, that because that guards do not generate as much hate on multiple mobs, they have to compensate by switching targets to keep hate up, but the moment that you switched from your original target you run great RISK of losing it to classess that AoE a lot....</p><p>So should we should we switch targets or not??</p>

[BoneSmasher]

<p>So many variables!</p><p>A few points:</p><p>1. Switching targets every 2 or 3 seconds will almost guarantee you will lose agro.  You are spreading it too thin in my opinion.</p><p>2. Having the right group make up to support you is critical.</p><p>3. Zerkers and SKs should have an easier time of holding AOE agro, but don't get lazy and think it is a given.</p><p>4. Any skill you have that increases hate or DPS should be mastered if possible.</p><p>5. If one player is consistantly getting agro, that is probably an issue with them, not you as the MT.  Warlocks that cast apocalypse right after you pull are going to die. Same with wizards that hit Fusion during the pull so it will hit faster since it is on a looong timer. (Dead players do zero DPS, so trying to top the parse while dying constantly is not a good tactic.)  If they don't understand how to manage their agro, you can't fix it for them.</p><p>Anyway, here is my deal: </p><p>I am specced STR/STA/INT.</p><p>I use Vilucidae's and Buckler of the Howler and tank in Offensive mode 90% of the time.</p><p>First of all, on things like Lyceum trash where you get an epic and a bunch of heroics or just big groups of heroics, I don't even try to hold aoe agro against Warlocks, Zerkers, etc who are going to be busting a ton of DPS on the little mobs.  If they peel off, it doesn't really matter since they die so fast.</p><p>On harder trash like the 4 pulls in FTH, I do work to keep AoE agro.</p><p>Here is my routine any time I think I need to hold agro on a bunch of mobs:</p><p>Depending on the difficulty of the encoounter, I may start in Defensive stance with a tower shield.</p><p>Normally I am body pulling btw.</p><p>Grab the mobs, pull them back, hit Confront.</p><p>Then depending on the situation, I will hit Plant or Reinforcement followed by Besiege, followed by Plant.</p><p>If the healers have it stabilized, I swtich to my buckler, wath my health for a few seconds, and then go to Offensive stance.</p><p>Then I go into DPS mode with Accel Strike, Weapon Mastery, and normal CAs timed to my auto attack.</p><p>I will hit goading assault or confront once in a while.  If they are all tough mobs, I will then switch every 10 seconds or so and whack one of them and swtich back to the main mob via the MA.</p><p>If it is a long fight and the mobs are still at 30% or higher and Reinforcement recyles, I may hit it again if I think it will be needed.  Most times it is not.</p><p>If a mob peels to an SK or Brig, I will switch to it, dps a little and normally get it right back.</p><p>A lot of this depends on your hate transfer in your group.  Using a swash will help you so much on holding AE agro since they are transferring agro using their class AoEs and autoattack.</p><p>Having your taunts and other skills at Master helps a ton as well.</p><p>I think every raiding guardian, uses a method that works for them the best based on experience.</p><p>My typical MT group is Defiler, Templar, Coercer, (Dirge when I can get one), Swash, Guardian (me) and either a druid if no dirge is present or an assassin.</p><p>Once I get into an encounter, unless it is an AoE deal, I don't taunt at all for the most part and just hold agro with DPS.</p><p>I normally parse 1500-2100 in off stance, 1100-1500 in defensive stance, if that helps.</p>

[Wilin]

<p>Going back to my earlier post above with my crazy speed style. I was in FTH last night and had warlocks near 5K DPS on the groups of 4 and never lost aggro to them or the assassins who were shredding the same mobs one at a time for over 3K. Coercer dehate might have been on them, not sure. But there were no pallies for amends.</p><p>I use vilucidae's/howler for normal dps, scepter of destruction/howler for the 100% proc period.</p>