Mystic/Defiler...Beastlord discusion

[JasonArgile]

<p>i dont think many of you have read it yet but there is a disscusion going on about the old Beastlord class from EQ1 and about its not makeing it into EQ2... much of this discusion hinges on ways that it might be brought in to eq2... during the thread some one said that a mystic when properly speced out was as close as any one could get to beeing a beastlord in eq2... now there are Alot of things wrong with that but it got another discussion started on How to bring in the beastlords as a option ....</p><p>AA lines... i thought i would pop over to the mystic class disscusion and find out what you all thought about it...</p><p>how would many of you feel about another AA line (the next time AA lines get added) that would give you.</p><p>1 a choice of new pet skins... instead of GhostDog... </p><p>2 an increase in DPS from your pet... an increase in Hit points from your pet and over all a DPS increase (puting you about say just under a monks)... at a real Cost of Healing power (leaveing you just a little Better at healing than a pally or monk)...  when Speced for this New Beastlord AAline... you and your pet should be able to Solo very well, you should Be able to fill Group DPS slots...</p><p> Now before the yelling .... NO this would not be the Only options in the New AA lines for your class there should be options to continue down the main Healers Pathway... this would only be ONE posible Option for you to take as a Mystic.</p><p>any way i wanted to see what the Mystic community had to say. </p>

[Sandain666]

Personally I don't care for adding an AA line to my class just because some people want a feeling of nostalgia from their days of playing EQLive. Mystics can solo very well now and when properly specced/equipped and we can fill DPS spots in groups as well. I dont see why any of us would want to give up healing power for a beastlord AA line. Personally I would like an AA that allows us to cure while stunned 

[Rythen16]

<p>That is not going to happen. And no way would the Mystic community want that. We are Shaman.</p><p>If people want beastlords then they should play a game with them in it. Not, change other classes to be what they want. </p>

[Finora]

<p>I personally just wish people would shut up about the beastlords lol.</p><p>I'm sick of hearing about them, discussions have been going on about them since the game was released and heat up every single time they announce an expansion. People going on about how the game 'needs' another class and blah blah blah.</p><p>If they add an aa line for a more powerful pet, great. If they don't, whatever. It doesn't matter much to me either way, as long as SOE doesn't suddenly decide one day that mystics are no longer healers, they are a lame DPS pet class.</p>

[EDofEDs]

<cite>Finora@Everfrost wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I personally just wish people would shut up about the beastlords lol.</p><p>I'm sick of hearing about them, discussions have been going on about them since the game was released and heat up every single time they announce an expansion. People going on about how the game 'needs' another class and blah blah blah.</p><p>If they add an aa line for a more powerful pet, great. If they don't, whatever. It doesn't matter much to me either way, as long as SOE doesn't suddenly decide one day that mystics are no longer healers, they are a lame DPS pet class.</p></blockquote>Word

[Baccalarium]

You can do whatever you want with the rez line.   If you want to turn it into a beast lord line,   I won't care.For that matter if you want to add more pet bufs on the wimpy cure wards,  I might have reason to take that line too.   Oh and let me turn dogdog into an attack beaver same size as the self illusion.    LOL. (kidding)Hey I've thought all along our mystic AA lines were depressing, and the rez and cure lines need work (or replacement).   I know there's some folks that enjoy those lines though so I see chances at new options unlikely.

[EDofEDs]

<cite>Baccalarium wrote:</cite><blockquote>You can do whatever you want with the rez line.   If you want to turn it into a beast lord line,   I won't care.For that matter if you want to add more pet bufs on the wimpy cure wards,  I might have reason to take that line too.   Oh and let me turn dogdog into an attack beaver same size as the self illusion.    LOL. (kidding)Hey I've thought all along our mystic AA lines were depressing, and the rez and cure lines need work (or replacement).   I know there's some folks that enjoy those lines though so I see chances at new options unlikely. </blockquote>People like the rez line?!?... Have you been drinking? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> hehe

[rumblepants]

I don't care much for the Beastlord. I played one to raid level in EQ1 and I've had it with it. That being said I would like DogDog to be slightly beefier and I would love to have the option to change him to CubCub or BoarBoar...

[thedu]

Making the doggy any stronger would make us a pet class which would not be in keeping with what a Shaman should be.  Not that I don't wish the doggy would be stronger <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[Rayche]

I'd love an AA line that would give us the option to move towards Beastlord or Shaman.You could pick which direction you wanted to go.

[JamesRay]

The rez AA line never did make much sense to me...if you're that focused on dying (and possibly en masse)...why even bother? Maybe in some obscure raid scenario? If so, that is a lot of attention for a class development line to focus on.  Maybe if the end line was a group or raid wide ghastly savior type death prevention spell good for X number of charges, that might be fun.

[Vinh]

<p>Wow, sounds like a lot of people never played EQ1....</p><p>If you did you'd know that beastlords were just pain awesome.  I can see how somethink that a shaman could almost be one, but really it's no where close.  A  Beastlord pet was more like a conjuror tank/scout pet.  They could tank, and dps anything.  Yes they can heal too and have many spells.  But their pet was far more powerful then my little mystics dog could ever be.</p><p> I have ever right to play this game and want a beastlord in it.  I started playing this because it was supposed to be the 'new EQ'. </p><p> But for them to implement it into EQ2, they would have to either create another archetype (they were considered hybrids in EQ1 like bards) or add another subclass to each of the 3 existing archetypes.  Either way, I don't think SoE will do either one.</p>

[Rayche]

What I didn't like in EQ1 was the way Beastlords began to overshadow the Shaman class. Once they had a 65% melee slow, and the Shaman class had a 75% melee slow, you could take or leave it somewhat. Then they gave Beaslords Spiritual purity and they became MUST haves on raids.They could never really tank raid level mobs, but they did awesome as an off tank or in an XP group if properly geared out.I would be upset if I found that they decided to add a Higher DPS version of me, with 85% of my buff/debuff skills with a pet that could tank almost as well as a Conjuror's earth pet, and made them Monk like with dual wield and double attack. and heals... and sow...Just give the Mystics the option to spec that way and we can call it good <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Nolim]

EQ1 is EQ1 is EQ1 period.No beastlords please!! even if I play/ed one on EQ1, i dont want a beastlord in eq2

[Draghixia]

I wouldn't have a problem with Beast Lords being introduced into EQ2 provided there were a couple rules in place.Beast Lords do not get slows.Beast Lords heals made pet only.Beast Lords do not get power regen buffs.Beast Lords do not get feign death.Beast lords are NOT given AA lines to provide the above mentioned items.I played a Shaman in EQlive and saw my class destroyed by the introduction of the Beast Lord.  Once slow mitigation went into the game there was no reason to play a Shaman due to gimped heals or heals with detrimental side effects which were put into place because we supposedly had unlimited mana supplies thanks to cannibalize.  Obviously this was only propigated by people who had never played a shaman past level 32.Let Beast Lords do what they want just do not give them ability's that are the domain of Shaman, Enchanters or Monks.

[Rayche]

<cite>Draghixia wrote:</cite><blockquote>I wouldn't have a problem with Beast Lords being introduced into EQ2 provided there were a couple rules in place.Beast Lords do not get slows.Beast Lords heals made pet only.Beast Lords do not get power regen buffs.Beast Lords do not get feign death.Beast lords are NOT given AA lines to provide the above mentioned items.I played a Shaman in EQlive and saw my class destroyed by the introduction of the Beast Lord.  Once slow mitigation went into the game there was no reason to play a Shaman due to gimped heals or heals with detrimental side effects which were put into place because we supposedly had unlimited mana supplies thanks to cannibalize.  Obviously this was only propigated by people who had never played a shaman past level 32.Let Beast Lords do what they want just do not give them ability's that are the domain of Shaman, Enchanters or Monks.</blockquote>This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about.People keep saying "Keep the Beastlords out of the game" and "I don't want these options"... well, you won't want those options until the Beastlord gets introduced as a new class and destroys you. Then you would have wished you had the option to become that class.Here it is in simple terms:- Mystics asked for more DPS? - They're asking to be a beastlord.- Mystics asked for a beefier pet? - They're asking to be a beastlord.- Mystics asked for some kinda mana regen? - They're asking to be a beastlord. You don't want people to be able to enjoy a class they loved in EQ1... but you have Necromancers... and you have Paladins... and Warriors.. and Wizards... and Conjurors... and Rogues... and Shadowknights... these classes deserve to play with they loved in EQ1? Just not the beastlords?If you don't call it "A Beastlord".. and just say "We're adding dual wield, beefier pet and some critical buffs to the Mystic EoF AA tree" you'd be thrilled for the options... and you'd be making a beastlord, you just wouldn't know it. (At least the ones that wanted to)

[Cybin]

<p>BL would require a whole new class line, with a 3 new subclasses for good and 3 for evil,,   </p><p> fighter- Priest - Mage - Warder</p><p>Under Warder class we would have, 2 others and.... </p><p>BeastLords - good    Spawnlords- evil </p><p>They would be a mesh between the monk class and the summoner class. Not monk and shaman. </p><p>Now I loved my EQ1 Beast Lord and would very much like to see them in the game, but it would have to be done so very carefully that it pains me to even give it the /nod for my beloved Eq2 game.</p>

[Sandain666]

There are too many problems with current class balance without introducing a whole new class or classes.

[Skua]

as EOF line? sure whatever is better....in eof u get Cas ...now change rez line for a pet line.....and u are set... checking defilers eof aas.....omg what i choose? , mystic eof aa sux ...in the end mystics  just have 1 line in eof...and its melee mystic line....

[Rayche]

It's actually a lot simpler than it sounds.Beastlord isn't a combination of the Summoner and Monk.It's the Mystic and Monk easily. Beastlords only had one pet.The Mystic class is litteraly one pet buff line (In fact, a single buff for the dog to raise his level and stats would be all it took) and double attack away from being a Beastlord. (Well, that and Spiritual purity)

[EDofEDs]

Man let this thread die.. please. This subject has been discussed to DEATH since launch. Do you really think the devs can't think of a way to include beastlords in the class lineup. They are CHOOSING not to. They don't need more crap to worry about when it comes to balance. There is plenty to play in this game go find something you enjoy and relax a while.

[Rayche]

<cite>Dominik@Blackburrow wrote:</cite><blockquote>Man let this thread die.. please. This subject has been discussed to DEATH since launch. Do you really think the devs can't think of a way to include beastlords in the class lineup. They are CHOOSING not to. They don't need more crap to worry about when it comes to balance. There is plenty to play in this game go find something you enjoy and relax a while.</blockquote>Man, let your desire to kill this thread die.. please.If people want to discuss, they shall.The Devs read our threads, and make decisions based on community feedback.This thread is community feedback.Please stop trying to kill community feedback.

[blazerpuppies79]

<p>beastlords would be very hard to implement for shamans.  I vote for a completely new class archetype.  It's so simple really.  Instead of caster dmg it would be melee dmg + a pet.  Look at how Conjurers and Necros are.  Think the same thing but instead of casting spells you would have your own CA's.  </p><p>Nostalgia..........yes I mean that's why I started to play eq2 in the first place ya know!</p><p>Leather Armor</p><p>Spirtual line(+hp regen +mana regen)</p><p>off/def stance for pet</p><p>berserk for pet</p><p>ca's for pet</p><p>ca's for you(both combined to be about monk dps)</p><p>typical debuffs(nothing crazy like 70% slow but maybe some offensive skill debuffs....like -slashing, piercing, crushing etc)</p><p>pet heals</p><p>pet FD only!</p><p>God i would looooooooooooovvvvvvvvvvvvvvve to design this class!!!!</p><p>Beastlord supporter over and out!</p>

[Eugam]

<cite>JasonArgile wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i dont think many of you have read it yet but there is a disscusion going on about the old Beastlord class from EQ1 and about its not makeing it into EQ2... much of this discusion hinges on ways that it might be brought in to eq2... during the thread some one said that a mystic when properly speced out was as close as any one could get to beeing a beastlord in eq2... now there are Alot of things wrong with that but it got another discussion started on How to bring in the beastlords as a option ....</p><p>AA lines... i thought i would pop over to the mystic class disscusion and find out what you all thought about it...</p><p>how would many of you feel about another AA line (the next time AA lines get added) that would give you.</p><p>1 a choice of new pet skins... instead of GhostDog... </p><p>2 an increase in DPS from your pet... an increase in Hit points from your pet and over all a DPS increase (puting you about say just under a monks)... at a real Cost of Healing power (leaveing you just a little Better at healing than a pally or monk)...  when Speced for this New Beastlord AAline... you and your pet should be able to Solo very well, you should Be able to fill Group DPS slots...</p><p> Now before the yelling .... NO this would not be the Only options in the New AA lines for your class there should be options to continue down the main Healers Pathway... this would only be ONE posible Option for you to take as a Mystic.</p><p>any way i wanted to see what the Mystic community had to say. </p></blockquote>I d like to have a grey wolf instead of a ghostly. But on everything else: NO !There are allready two pet classes. If people want a beastlord then ask SOE for a NEW class. But leave the Mystic alone.

[Banditman]

<cite>Draghixia wrote:</cite><blockquote>I wouldn't have a problem with Beast Lords being introduced into EQ2 provided there were a couple rules in place.Beast Lords do not get slows.Beast Lords heals made pet only.Beast Lords do not get power regen buffs.Beast Lords do not get feign death.</blockquote>This class is already in game, it's called Conjuror.

[Ko]

<cite>Banditman wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Draghixia wrote:</cite><blockquote>I wouldn't have a problem with Beast Lords being introduced into EQ2 provided there were a couple rules in place.Beast Lords do not get slows.Beast Lords heals made pet only.Beast Lords do not get power regen buffs.Beast Lords do not get feign death.</blockquote>This class is already in game, it's called Conjuror.</blockquote>Dude I'd so love to have the BST aa's for my mystic

[Sandain666]

SOE cant even get itemization right in ROK after weeks of Beta. Does anyone honestly have faith SOE can pull something like adding either a beastlord class or Beastlord AA's sucessfully? We currently have 2 AA lines that many mystics say need major work. The rez line and the cure line that adds a ward. And other mystics have valid concerns with some of the other AA skills.  Another decent segment of Mystics feel defilers have too many advantages over them already. Why not push for the developers to use their limited time on current valid concerns ? There are only a limited number of hours in the day. Is this really what SOE should be concentrating on?

[Rayche]

<cite>Sandain666 wrote:</cite><blockquote>SOE cant even get itemization right in ROK after weeks of Beta. Does anyone honestly have faith SOE can pull something like adding either a beastlord class or Beastlord AA's sucessfully? We currently have 2 AA lines that many mystics say need major work. The rez line and the cure line that adds a ward. And other mystics have valid concerns with some of the other AA skills.  Another decent segment of Mystics feel defilers have too many advantages over them already. Why not push for the developers to use their limited time on current valid concerns ? There are only a limited number of hours in the day. Is this really what SOE should be concentrating on?</blockquote>In one sentence you say Mystics have two messed up AA lines, yet in the same paragraph you are proposing we stop giving suggestions for alternatives to these broken AA lines? That didn't make sense.

[Sandain666]

<cite>Rayche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Sandain666 wrote:</cite><blockquote>SOE cant even get itemization right in ROK after weeks of Beta. Does anyone honestly have faith SOE can pull something like adding either a beastlord class or Beastlord AA's sucessfully? We currently have 2 AA lines that many mystics say need major work. The rez line and the cure line that adds a ward. And other mystics have valid concerns with some of the other AA skills.  Another decent segment of Mystics feel defilers have too many advantages over them already. Why not push for the developers to use their limited time on current valid concerns ? There are only a limited number of hours in the day. Is this really what SOE should be concentrating on?</blockquote><b>In one sentence you say Mystics have two messed up AA lines</b>, That is not what I wrote<i>"We currently have 2 AA lines that many mystics say need major work"</i>I said many mystics say they need major work. I don't happen to agree they need major work but I definitely understand those mystics who are concerned about them. There are already numerous suggestions on how these 2 lines can be made more appealing and useful. <b>yet in the same paragraph you are proposing we stop giving suggestions for alternatives to these broken AA lines?</b> That is not what I wrote<i>"Why not push for the developers to use their limited time on current valid concerns ? There are only a limited number of hours in the day. Is this really what SOE should be concentrating on?</i>Again I did not say stop giving suggestions nor did I say those AA lines are broken. Please explain to me what portion of my comments made you think I wrote that everyone should stop giving suggestions? What I did was ask everyone to reflect on what would be the best way for the developers to spend their limited time considering the numerous issues many mystics are bringing up concerning Defiler/Mystic balance, power regen, inability to cure through stuns and other issues.<b>That didn't make sense.</b>It makes perfect sense if you actually read what I wrote<b></b></blockquote>I will attempt to simplify my reasoning further for you:If you have one developer in charge of all Spells and achievements for all 24 classes who works a 7-8 hour day do you think he will be more likely to:a) make adjustments to the existing AA lines b) create and code new Beastlord AA lines

[Baccalarium]

I'd like some healer AA's please.     Please, please, please don't let these beast lord fanatics cause you (any devs that might read this) to move mystic AA's even further from the class already are.   EOF aa tree should have been designed to have some decent choices for healers,  and now that it doesn't,  there are those thinking they can convince you to make the mystic a non-healer class.     I beg of you,  I started this class to be a healer,   If you can add some flavor's to the class but still make it a solid healer I applaud you.   Most the suggestions I see here sound a heck of a lot more like a pet class than a healer.      My pet exists for one reason,   because it helps me heal.    This is my function in groups and raids.    This healing function sets me and the other priests appart form the scouts and mages that do damage,  and the fighters that control a monster's aggresion.   Don't ruin the mystic AA's yet again by trying to turn a priest into a DPS class.   Mystics are priests.   Priests aid and protect their comrades.   Give me options that allow me to aid and protect my comrades.   If the flavor of that aid and protection is ghostly or beastly doesn't matter to me.    But ghostly or beastly,   my function is a healer.edit:on rereading  something looked like an attack and was unintended.Yes I enjoy the soloability the melee line offers,   but I'd trade them for options that help me aid and protect.    If I were a mystic beastlord,  perhaps my dog would proc my debufs on the mobs so that I didn't have to spend as much time debuffing.Perhaps my newfound melee ability would proc beneficial effects (wards, bufs, and power)  on target of the mob I'm meleeing and on me.But making a mystic a beastlord shouldn't be nearly the priority as making the eof AA tree have reasonable healer options.Damage (DPS) is merely a side effect from my main task.