Double warding

[Bardrick]

When it is all hot and heavy, and your blowing through your wards fast and hard, is it worth stacking wards?  Cast single and group before the pull?  Is this a waste, or does one wards take damage first, lending the second to be a backup as you restack the first ward?

[Lana]

When the tank is taking HEAVY damage fast, I spam my single target and group ward. They do stack, and has saved my group sooo many times. If you get the timing right, you can cast single target, group ward, heal, single target blah blah. Defiler FTW.

[cggerth]

they do stack, but it's really up to you whether or not you want to stack them.  The group ward does take 5s to cast, and that 5s is A LONG LONG time when you need it.  I can cast my long and short heal that the combination heals for about as much as the group ward does.  I always stack my group and ST ward before a pull, but during the battle it really depends on who is there, what other healers are there, and what else you have.  Also remember that if your tank is taking heavy dmg, drop your spiritual circle.  That will soak up about 500 dmg per I think 5 or 6s (how ever long it takes to refresh).  I personally will very rarely cast a group ward in group unless I know there is an AoE coming and my spiritual circle isn't up, but that's me and how the raid is setup that I'm part of.

[Bardrick]

<cite>cggerth wrote:</cite><blockquote>they do stack, but it's really up to you whether or not you want to stack them.  The group ward does take 5s to cast, and that 5s is A LONG LONG time when you need it.  I can cast my long and short heal that the combination heals for about as much as the group ward does.  I always stack my group and ST ward before a pull, but during the battle it really depends on who is there, what other healers are there, and what else you have.  Also remember that if your tank is taking heavy dmg, drop your spiritual circle.  That will soak up about 500 dmg per I think 5 or 6s (how ever long it takes to refresh).  I personally will very rarely cast a group ward in group unless I know there is an AoE coming and my spiritual circle isn't up, but that's me and how the raid is setup that I'm part of.</blockquote>Thank you for the advice. I am only level 20 at the time, so I don't have all those cool spells.  I am just looking for a bit of advice as I level up.

[simonladen]

Just be sure to tell your tank you are prewarding him and to pull with a taunt because if you dont tell him and he body pulls you will get agro 100% of the time. Communication is the key

[Bardrick]

mmm didn't know that.

[Estean1]

<p>Wow.  I constantly keep my wards stacked..  I can't believe what I"m reading.  I am hesitant about pre wards but during the fight both group wards and single target wards are up at ALL TIMES.  A properly set up defiler should not have to worry about power that much.  If a ward goes down you fix that first no matter what.  You learn to anticipate how hard the mobs hit so you can have that ward back up right when it drops.  </p><p>A typical raid fight in the MT group would be for me.  Pre-pull - spiritual circle (possible solo ward if its hard - and spam my aggro reducer once they get in range) and my AA spell to speed the MT's casting up. </p><p>Mob is on MT then.   Single target ward, Group ward, Bane of shielding, Single target ward again, Slow debuff, stats debuff, single target ward, Group ward, - more debuffs and heals as needed - but you get the picture.  Both wards up at all times while healing and debuffing in between. </p><p> I can't imagine not using group wards and using heals instead, but hey whatever style that works for you. </p>

[ShadowyStingray]

If you are in an MT group and not using your group ward as often as possible, you are wasting a lot of potential 'healing power' that the shaman has to offer.  Specialty heals (i.e., wards) are more power efficient than direct heals, so they should be used as often as possible, resorting to direct heals only when necessary (group healing after an AE, single target healing to recover from spike damage, etc.).  Yes, the group ward takes ~5 secs to cast and it is sometimes a gamble to cast if damage is spiking (you have to rely on your other healers to help out while you are 'tied up' casting), but it is almost always worth using.In many ways, it is one of your defined 'roles' for being in the MT group - any random shaman can be spamming a single target ward from any group in the raid - you are the only one who can make use of your group-specific tools to full advantage.  These are what you should be focusing on.

[Estean1]

<p>I am a MT group defiler, but on the rare occasions I am not in the MT group, I still use group ward.  You can cast it pre pull in an off group with no fear of aggro, why wouldn't you?  Who cares if it takes 5 seconds to cast. You could just start casting 10 seconds before he pulls and you are allready ahead of the game on healing</p>

[Arielle Nightshade]

<p>I agree with Estean completely.  I stack wards.  It's either that much ward amount on the tank if he uses it up, or the single target on him, and whomever else in the group gets aggro.   Either one is pretty powerful.   </p><p>A Defiler worrying about single target heals before worrying about warding (in a raid group) is either in a horrible fight, or doesn't trust the other 2 healers in the group very much.   If it's the former, wards are STILL the best thing a defiler can be doing (along with ward proc spells and debuffs...if possible).  If it's the latter, then that's another story and not anything to do with wards vs. heals.   The 5s it takes to cast the group ward still yields a pretty big anti-damage spell, and is argueably 'worth it' in time cost.</p><p>The way I look at it, wards are the foundation, Cleric reactives are the bricks and druid heals are the glue that keeps the MT standing.  Any other heals or debuffs you can throw in are a bonus, but these absolutely can't be neglected.</p><p>70 Defiler on Venekor and</p>

[Blumfield]

<cite>Arielle Nightshade wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The way I look at it, wards are the foundation, Cleric reactives are the bricks and druid heals are the glue that keeps the MT standing.  Any other heals or debuffs you can throw in are a bonus, but these absolutely can't be neglected.</p><p>70 Defiler on Venekor and</p></blockquote>good analogy

[knightofround]

What I do is cast the group ward first, the single target ward second, hit spiritual circle when the tank presses his pull macro. Depending upon far the mob has to travel to the tank, I cast the group ward for a second time, trying to land it exactly after the mob gets his few attack thru the tank's avoidance/stoneskin. It's usually the second "attack" of the mob. Hopefully this gives you enough time to get off abasement before you have to refresh the single target ward.This way you basically get twice the group ward in at that critical 10 second period it takes for the raid to debuff the mob. Ever since the soulward nerf, I've had to learn how to time this technique more and more.It's better to have the second group ward hit the tank later, rather than sooner...that 30sec recast timer is a pain.

[Thatdumbg]

Sometimes, debuffing is more effective then warding early in a fight... in fact, with some debuffs, it always is anytime in the fight. Let the priests that have very little else to do keep a tank alive on the initial spike. Of course, preward and that helps as well. Hell, blow your instants between debuffs if you have to. But get the mob debuffed.