spells or melee

[Luier]

Does SK have more melee attacks or spells?  I'm looking for a class that has mostly melee with a few spells, has good solo potential and also desired in groups and raids... help!

[Dead Knight]

Spells.

[melaine_dvarvensplitter]

<cite>Dead Knight wrote:</cite><blockquote>Spells.</blockquote>QFE!!! Spells are approx 75% of our damage and melee is approx 25%. Someone wrote a great write up about our damage and such, not sure if it got lost in the new forums or what.

[hellskitten]

<p>Please dont take this as a insult because its not ment as one.... but all those question could been self answered if spent 5 mins even looking over thread titles much less taking time to read them. There is donzens after dozens of threads on each subject <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>But since Im in halfway decent mood today (which just means Im not in mood to be my normal bytchy lil self..)---</p><p>1) hands down we are spell casters in plate <honestly I dont understand the difference.. does the category title given to the skill really matter aslong as the targets is laying face down in pool its own blood after ya use it?)</p><p>2) we are fantastic solo</p><p>3) we make great group tanks</p><p>4) ya want on raids? meh... good luck. Not that we bad at it, more for fact what most players preconceive when comes to a SKs usefulness. Doesnt really matter why we get picked last (usually.. I seem to sneak my way onto a few) the point is ya chances are lower then other choices out there</p>

[Dead Knight]

<cite>hellskitten wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Please dont take this as a insult because its not ment as one.... but all those question could been self answered if spent 5 mins even looking over thread titles much less taking time to read them. There is donzens after dozens of threads on each subject <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img mce_tsrc=" />" /></p><p>But since Im in halfway decent mood today (which just means Im not in mood to be my normal bytchy lil self..)---</p><p>1) hands down we are spell casters in plate <honestly I dont understand the difference.. does the category title given to the skill really matter aslong as the targets is laying face down in pool its own blood after ya use it?)</p><p>2) we are fantastic solo</p><p>3) we make great group tanks</p><p>4) <u><i><b>ya want on raids? meh... good luck. Not that we bad at it, more for fact what most players preconceive when comes to a SKs usefulness. Doesnt really matter why we get picked last (usually.. I seem to sneak my way onto a few) the point is ya chances are lower then other choices out there</b></i></u></p></blockquote>If you're talking about pickup raids, that's nothing to base this on. Getting into raid guilds for us is just as hard as any other tank and you have just as equal an oppurtunity as a Warrior to get into a raid guild if you don't suck at your class. Oh, and on last night's MMIS raid melee auto attack was exactly 22% of my DPS to give you an idea of how much melee we do vs spells.

[Beldin_]

In groups my autoattack is mostly just 10-12%, thats also one of the reasons why i don't understand when people think that tanking with a 2-hander has any benefits <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Dead Knight]

<cite>Shalla@Valor wrote:</cite><blockquote>In groups my autoattack is mostly just 10-12%, thats also one of the reasons why i don't understand when people think that tanking with a 2-hander has any benefits <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img mce_tsrc=" />" /></blockquote>That's because heroic and epic content are 2 different animals, with group content being a joke, lol. Practically every zone except Unrest can be duo'd, with Unrest needing a trio, sad. Remember, Heroics die in mere seconds, whereas Epics sometimes take minutes to down, not to mention Heroics have a pathetic amount of HP, lol. I forgot Nizara, <3 Nizara.

[hellskitten]

<cite>Dead Knight wrote:</cite> <blockquote><p>If you're talking about pickup raids, that's nothing to base this on. Getting into raid guilds for us is just as hard as any other tank and you have just as equal an oppurtunity as a Warrior to get into a raid guild if you don't suck at your class. Oh, and on last night's MMIS raid melee auto attack was exactly 22% of my DPS to give you an idea of how much melee we do vs spells.</p></blockquote><p>Yes Im refering to pickup raids. Based on fact I figure that will be raids hes looking for if hes asking this (ie not in a raid guild already.) While Im not familiar with getting into a so-called raid guild.. as thats not what I want... from what I here from many on my server; it is a viscious circle even trying to get into one.... lot them require you already have certain quality of gear which ya cant get till someone lets ya in on raids....</p><p>As for pickup raids; atleast on my server; lot the populace incorrectly believes guard/zerker > SK. Therefore ya usually last to be picked. As I said, thats not 100% always true as Ive snuck onto my fair share of raids, but happens often enough that should be mentioned to give true picture of current situation.</p><p>Either way its irrevelent to me. I didnt become a SK because wanted get in on every raid going. I became a SK cause wanted be the baddest lil bytch walking Norrath. Being a SK insured that.</p>

[Antryg Mistrose]

<cite>Luier wrote:</cite><blockquote>Does SK have more melee attacks or spells?  I'm looking for a class that has mostly melee with a few spells, has good solo potential and also desired in groups and raids... help!</blockquote>Sounds like you are after more of a Rogue (Swashbuckler or Brigand) in terms of mleee rather than spells and solo capability.Monks and Bruisers have decent solo capability and raid use (not as tanks generally though and groups are a bit iffyer)  The other melee class is Assassin, but they are a more specialised DPS class and comparatively weaker soloing as they are very positional (behind and stealthed which is hard solo)SK is a good soloer, and as a tank class is fine in groups (fighter & priest are start of any normal group). Rogues can also tank if well geared too.  Raids though (posts here from those in denial aside) there is no class in the game that is less desired.  We can tank raids, but other more specialised classes have always done it far easier.  The gab is closer now (with EoF and AA changes) than it used to be, but its still there, and the stigma remains.

[rabid.pooh]

<cite>Dead Knight wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>hellskitten wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Please dont take this as a insult because its not ment as one.... but all those question could been self answered if spent 5 mins even looking over thread titles much less taking time to read them. There is donzens after dozens of threads on each subject <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img mce_tsrc=" width="15" height="15" />" /></p><p>But since Im in halfway decent mood today (which just means Im not in mood to be my normal bytchy lil self..)---</p><p>1) hands down we are spell casters in plate <honestly I dont understand the difference.. does the category title given to the skill really matter aslong as the targets is laying face down in pool its own blood after ya use it?)</p><p>2) we are fantastic solo</p><p>3) we make great group tanks</p><p>4) <u><i><b>ya want on raids? meh... good luck. Not that we bad at it, more for fact what most players preconceive when comes to a SKs usefulness. Doesnt really matter why we get picked last (usually.. I seem to sneak my way onto a few) the point is ya chances are lower then other choices out there</b></i></u></p></blockquote>If you're talking about pickup raids, that's nothing to base this on. Getting into raid guilds for us is just as hard as any other tank and you have just as equal an oppurtunity as a Warrior to get into a raid guild if you don't suck at your class. Oh, and on last night's MMIS raid melee auto attack was exactly 22% of my DPS to give you an idea of how much melee we do vs spells.</blockquote><p>Our damage being based 25% based on spells is a red herring of sorts, sorry it sucks I know.  To me this is a design flaw by SOE.</p><p>I think your not taking your CA damage into account, and also your procs which do spell damage and can get a crit off our int line.</p><p>If I look at my tonights raid parse and break it down 27% of my damage was based on autoattack swings (was hasted 94%, with a 3 delay weapon).  8% was due to hemotoxin, 7% Grimstrike, 3% strike of Faith, 3% agony, 2% smash, 2% death circle, 1% joust.  So  just adding all of that up, we see that my autoattack was responsible for 51% of my total DPS.  11% damage was from our CAs (there's way more stuff on my parse, I'm just pointing out these).  I parsed 9th position, lost DPS due to being off tank, dealing with adds dieing etc...  This was a raid setup, however in a group it's not uncommon to have people buff you.</p><p>The person who's parsing 11% - 12% of the their damage using autoattack, really needs to learn how to pace and time their spells to allow autoattack to occur.  On average there is a 1 second delay when using a CA, and a 1.5 sec to 2.5 sec delay when using our spells.  So you should be aware of how much your hasted and how fast it's making your weapon, because your missing autoattack time.  For instance I have a 2hander that has a 2 sec delay, tonight at 94% haste, that would give me about a 1 second delay, that delay is perfectly fine for a CA ability, as it takes .5 sec to cast the CA and a .5 sec recovery period, so CA, swing, CA, Swing.  in about 2.3 secs However  If I cast a Wrath, that has a 2 second casting time, because of this I miss 1 autoattack while I'm casting it.  So with that 2 sec weapon (which is 1 sec) if I cast a 2 sec spell, it would look like this, cast,swing,cast,swing, it's taken 4.3 seconds, I've lost 2 autoattacks.  Now if I use a 4 second weapon I can que up my CAs, so it's CA,CA,swing,CA,Spell (we have some .5 spells), swing, In that same 4.3 second peroid I did a lot more damage, because I was using a slower weapon, that took advantage of my casting timers.</p><p>So my point here is not to discount your autoattack and CA damage, it is responsible for more then the 25% that most people believe.  I think it's important to establish how much actual damage is done by our spells, so we can determine where we should focus our energies.  The big question is are spell damage adorns worth it?  And what's more significant, a 45 spell damage adorn, or 10% DPS Adorn.  Spell damage adorns only work on spells on not on the procs.</p><p>(Okay, I just did a nest run on test with my Illy GF, a quick breakdown for just the two of us, which including her spell proc, time coompression and arm, my slash was 29% damage, 10% grim strike, 2% death circle, 2% agony, 2% pariash brand, 1% unholy strike.  Which totals 46% of the damage.)</p>

[DMIstar]

I agree with the above Post ^.. Spells are a focal point.. but a 100% spells gets us no where in overall DPS. I normally have 22-25% of my dps just auto attack.. In MMIS ofcourse its upwards to 35% due to long fights.. For spells, our dots is life ... But some stuff is situational.. MMIS vs a group zone is two different things.. In group zones my Autoattack is execptionaly Less. Esp on trash mobs... A mob can only die so fast ;P "<i>The big question is are spell damage adorns worth it? And what's more significant, a 45 spell damage adorn, or 10% DPS Adorn. Spell damage adorns only work on spells on not on the procs."</i><i></i>At this time im leaning on Spell dmg Items. even though my Autoattack is doing around 2 5percent .. My spells that are effected by the spell dmg increase do upto 45percent of my dmg, leaveing the rest on buffs and some procs.  spell dmg ups those spells evenly esp with whats on test now.

[troodon]

<cite>Toesmash@Oasis wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The person who's parsing 11% - 12% of the their damage using autoattack, really needs to learn how to pace and time their spells to allow autoattack to occur.  </p></blockquote>This really is essential.  If you just que up your spells all the time you are not allowing your autoattack to get through most of the time

[rabid.pooh]

<cite>Bloodravenger@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote>I agree with the above Post ^.. Spells are a focal point.. but a 100% spells gets us no where in overall DPS. I normally have 22-25% of my dps just auto attack.. In MMIS ofcourse its upwards to 35% due to long fights.. For spells, our dots is life ... But some stuff is situational.. MMIS vs a group zone is two different things.. In group zones my Autoattack is execptionaly Less. Esp on trash mobs... A mob can only die so fast ;P"<i>The big question is are spell damage adorns worth it? And what's more significant, a 45 spell damage adorn, or 10% DPS Adorn. Spell damage adorns only work on spells on not on the procs."</i><i></i>At this time im leaning on Spell dmg Items. even though my Autoattack is doing around 2 5percent ..My spells that are effected by the spell dmg increase do upto 45percent of my dmg, leaveing the rest on buffs and some procs.  spell dmg ups those spells evenly esp with whats on test now.</blockquote><p>The one thing that is shying me away from spell damage is the fact that we don't have many spells that actually use it, procs are uneffected by it, and so are our CAs.</p><p>My autoattack damage may be a little more sku'd as I'm spec'd AGI/STA/INT 4/4/8.  The reason for this spec is when I hit something I wanted it to count, in the STR line shares is the same concept however (as two abilities are based on your autoattack).  The Raid was almost always single mob pulls, so the AGI wasn't a factor, in the nest however AGI is a big factor.</p>

[Pitt Hammerfi]

<p>Sk's should focus on increasing melee dps</p><p>I would rather a dirge over a troubie anyday </p>

[AziBam]

I wouldn't kick either one out of the group with me.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Both rock.  I would probably have to say though that some of my overall highest dps has been with a dirge in the group.  With a good two hander we can do a significant amount of melee damage. (Not more than spell damage of course.)

[MaCloud1032]

<cite>Pitt Hammerfist wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Sk's should focus on increasing melee dps</p><p>I would rather a dirge over a troubie anyday </p></blockquote><p>Do what...?  My god you have a troub that has his spell proc up.(when ever you cast a spell had a chance of procking mental dmg)  Presision of the mistro?  If you cast something and it procs reaver it will proc the troubs spell buff.</p><p>For the most part you wont be hitting over 3k dps unless your running with a troub.  For tanking they only reason i like a drige is for the stoneskin.</p>