the unfortunate cussing i hear and other stuff

[firestorck]

<p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Abrez]

All you really can do is /report [playername] /petition and also for an added thing take a screenshot of the offending behavior and attach it to the petition. The rest would be up to Sony. What they do after that no one really can say. I am guessing a warning, then a suspension and then a longer suspension possibly a complete ban on there account? Though with the number of foul mouthed people that seem to think its cool, i am guessing nothing really gets done. This could all be a guess but it would have to start with the report and petition for anything to even get started. There is a player on one of the servers that got tagged as an egregious guide a while back because he/she reported some one for botting and they crucified SOE and that player on the forums for it. Personally i would like to see more guides like that guide running the game maybe then cleaning up the mmo community would send a message you agreed to the rules and chose to ignore them now see you down the road. Maybe after we log on to the forums and here a few crying there accounts got banned for saying a simple cuss word, then maybe the rest of the community would clean its act up.

[Leatherneck]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p></blockquote>I don't think they forget it.  I truly think they believe the rules don't really apply to THEM.  Kinda like plat-sellers.

[Phazation]

[Removed for Content], you're right.

[VelvetPan]

To be honest, most people don't read the EULA, and you all know it..Sad, really, reading EULAs might give them +2 Intelligence.:/

[Xdatinelia]

<p>From the prospective of a gamer with a very young child, and having been guilded with 2 of the smartest teenagers I have ever had a chance to know.  I honestly think explination and supervision would be better than straight censorship.</p><p>Meaning: explain to your child that some poeple will use words we do not use in this household, If you read these words, please do not sue them in public or our household.  We are giving you a huge responsibility here, and do think you are mature enough to follow not only the game rules, but our own.  </p><p>Each child will be ready for this speech at a different age.  I am guilded presnetly with a 13 year old girl, who for her birthday just just got her own account, before that she played on her mom's.  We do not let members into our guild willy nilly and do take the time to explain and ask you hold back your own language, at least in guild chat, when she is online.  I watched a boy in everquest 1 grow up from 14 now.. he is now retired from eq1 and attending some east coast school I can not remember the name of.  He, to me, is the most polite young man, now, I have ever had the chance to know.</p>

[LordDarthKhan]

Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.

[brokejaw]

<cite>Xdatinelia wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> I honestly think explination and supervision would be better than straight censorship.</p><p>Meaning: explain to your child that some poeple will use words we do not use in this household, If you read these words, please do not sue them in public or our household.  We are giving you a huge responsibility here, and do think you are mature enough to follow not only the game rules, but our own.  </p></blockquote>/agreed

[-.dE.-]

zomg grow up sir, this is not hello kitty adventure island !

[Leatherneck]

<cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.</blockquote><p>Beside the fact that filters don't catch everything, there's not even anything right about it except the liberal aptitude (sic) of some hippies who think anything goes all day all night.</p><p>It goes both ways.</p>

[AudioMechaniK]

<p>Really hate to burst your bubble, but I too have 2 kids. Difference is, i know that this is the INTERNET..and that this is a GAME..and also, i find it funny that you call this `criminal`..but you want your kids to play eq2. Ok, heres a lovely scenerio...honey, i want you to be nice, friendly and mature, dont say any bad words ok sweety?..now, go do this quest for mommy and KILL EVERYTHING ON THIS LIST!!!..yeah...great one there...how bout we get into the perverts in the game?...im gonna have to jump on SOE first....screw the EULA.....have u seen the female /flirt emote?...i dont remember a /sex filter....but yet sony sure did put that in...why? because the same ppl that want to have the /flirt emote..are the same people that cuss...just because you dont like it...dont make it wrong. </p><p>I mean honeslty..you cant make a 7th grade class not cuss for gods sake...what in the world makes you think you can make a bunch of grown adults not cuss just to please you?</p><p>I think you `cussing` whiners need to take a step back and look at exactly what you are complaining about.</p>

[Xdatinelia]

<p>Firestorck, I am not for the life of me saying however that if you choose not to let your children play because of the cussing you are in the wrong.. It is a very personal decision to even let a child watch EQ or EQ2 imo.  What is good for one isn't exactly good for another.  ATM I have to filter disney for an almost 3 year old obbessed with fish.  Good luck whatever your decision, understand tho this game has at least a 13 rating maybe even MA, I haven't bothered to check in ages.</p>

[Faelian]

<cite>Xdatinelia wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>From the prospective of a gamer with a very young child, and having been guilded with 2 of the smartest teenagers I have ever had a chance to know.  I honestly think explination and supervision would be better than straight censorship.</p><p>Meaning: explain to your child that some poeple will use words we do not use in this household, If you read these words, please do not sue them in public or our household.  We are giving you a huge responsibility here, and do think you are mature enough to follow not only the game rules, but our own.  </p></blockquote><p>What an intelligent, well thought-out response. Kudos to you -- as a parent and a gamer! </p><p>I agree completely with what you said. When we try and shelter our kids from everything, we are doing them a disservice. When we do as you said and explain to them what *we* expect of them -- even when society shows them differently -- then we will be raising children who will be able to think for themselves and have a strong moral compass.</p><p>My son (now 11) has grown up on EQ and EQII with me, also as a roleplayer. He has been playing on his own for a number of years. He can hold his own, and I don't think anyone has known he's 11 outside of the people who know us. I'm very proud of his gaming ethic! Because in a way, dealing with the ingame morons helps him prepare to deal with the real life morons he will encounter more and more as he gets older. It's my job to give him the tools to handle words/actions/situations outside of what is acceptable to me as his mom. </p>

[Hamervelder]

Some cussing is permitted, so long as it is in-character, and within the scope of the Everquest timeline.  Though I do agree that foul language is excessive, it does remain a fact that adults (and even teenagers) do pepper our speech with mild expletives.  The best thing to do is probably to be a proactive parent, and teach your kids that some things are not acceptable, regardless of how many other people they see doing those things.  I'd encourage you to report people whom you see flagrantly violating the rules, and also file a petition as well.  If people like LordDarthKhan want to insult you for doing so, kindly point them to the existence of the rules under which we play, and let them go on their merry way.@ LordDarthKhan:  I won't even address your blatant lack of intellect.  Regardless of your obvious lack of social skills and complete ignorance that a world of thought outside your own opinion may exist, Sony sets the rules for this game, and their rules specifically state the following:<b>Foul language is not permitted, in any language.Excessive use of foul language in an inappropriate context, including swear words, real-world racial slurs, and other language that is not consistent with the fantasy environment and designed to hurt, will be considered a disruption and will not be tolerated. The existence of the filter (/filter) is not a license to be profane.</b>It has nothing to do with the OP's values, aptitude, or any of the other derogatory comments you made.  The rules by which we have all agreed to abide specifically prohibit foul language.  That has nothing to do with the middle-ages, burning witches, or any of the other examples that you so crudely spewed out.  Foul language is prohibited by Sony.  End of story.

[Lokida]

<p>What's really sad is that if my server wasn't down I wouldn't even be reading this garbage.  Keep your kids in your little bubble as long as you can and when they go into the real world and it explodes on them they will thank you for shielding them from life.  I have 4 children, one who is almost a teen and although I KNOW they hear and see worse every day in school we TALK about it.  I explain to them it's not considered appropriate and most people who cuss do not have the vocablulary to express themself.  Myself included at times.  Don't come here preaching shut your pie hole and play the game and if you don't like what you hear or read then don't play.</p><p>/rant off</p>

[VelvetPan]

I'm 13 and also grew up on EQ1 and 2. ^_^;Just thought you'd like to know..

[Videlous]

As with any game, the gaming experience and the rating are due to change when you go online.While I personally do not have children, I have a 13yr old and 16yr old brother and they both play.  They have never complained about language, even though they see it all the time, but you will have that on any online game.~Under

[sENADIN]

<p>I understand the concern but it's very ironic. On one hand we have games that are violent, that have blood in it and swear and all that. Yet if i turn the news i see death, disease, war and all other sort of human tragedy. This is something we all have access and you think the cussin is such a bad thing? </p><p>Use the filter, that's what it's there for.</p>

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>Leatherneck wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.</blockquote><p>Beside the fact that filters don't catch everything, there's not even anything right about it except the liberal aptitude (sic) of some hippies who think anything goes all day all night.</p><p>It goes both ways.</p></blockquote>I love it, when someone try to remember poeple what parenting is, he's eighter an hippy or a  liberal ? How wonderful.. and why not a pinko since we are at it ? I wonder if you or anyone realize how words, their use and application change over time. Just to make a quick example, 10-20 years ago to call someone a [Removed for Content], even joking betwen friends.. no wait a second, 10-20 years ago they whould have never do that in the first place because it WAS an offence. Now, call a friend a [Removed for Content] because he beat you at a poker game or any other kind of activity is not uncommon. So why instead of lecturing other on how they should or should not talk (or type in this case) people like the OP don't start with doing his job as a parent instead of demant it to other "media".

[Phazation]

One time someone cussed and I died. True story.

[Leatherneck]

<cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Use the filter, that's what it's there for.</p></blockquote><p>Not really.  It's there because some people are unable to control themselves.</p><p>That's like saying the reason there's airbags is so people can speed and crrash all they want.</p>

[Leatherneck]

<cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Leatherneck wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.</blockquote><p>Beside the fact that filters don't catch everything, there's not even anything right about it except the liberal aptitude (sic) of some hippies who think anything goes all day all night.</p><p>It goes both ways.</p></blockquote>I love it, when someone try to remember poeple what parenting is, he's eighter an hippy or a  liberal ? How wonderful.. and why not a pinko since we are at it ? I wonder if you or anyone realize how words, their use and application change over time. Just to make a quick example, 10-20 years ago to call someone a [I cannot control my vocabulary], even joking betwen friends.. no wait a second, 10-20 years ago they whould have never do that in the first place because it WAS an offence. Now, call a friend a [I cannot control my vocabulary] because he beat you at a poker game or any other kind of activity is not uncommon. So why instead of lecturing other on how they should or should not talk (or type in this case) people like the OP don't start with doing his job as a parent instead of demant it to other "media".</blockquote>You missed it.  He IS doing his job as a parent and not allowing the child to play EQ/EQ2.  He was lamenting the reason that is so is, in part, due to people who choose to go around the rules.

[Hamervelder]

<cite>Lokida wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What's really sad is that if my server wasn't down I wouldn't even be reading this garbage.  Keep your kids in your little bubble as long as you can and when they go into the real world and it explodes on them they will thank you for shielding them from life.  I have 4 children, one who is almost a teen and although I KNOW they hear and see worse every day in school we TALK about it.  I explain to them it's not considered appropriate and most people who cuss do not have the vocablulary to express themself.  Myself included at times.  Don't come here preaching shut your pie hole and play the game and if you don't like what you hear or read then don't play.</p><p>/rant off</p></blockquote>Your argument is flawed. Do you allow your children to view pornography?  Watch disturbing movies?  If you've any sense about you at all, then you probably don't.  We all shelter our children to a certain extent.  To what extent a parent feels foul language is appropriate, is up to that parent, and you've no business insulting them for it.And let's be honest.  How many of us work in a place that allows profanity?  Probably not many.  Profanity in the professional world is almost universally considered tacky and tasteless.  If you go into a shopping mall or a restaurant and start cursing profusely, you'll probably be asked to leave.  It's a fact that profanity is almost universally frowned upon in professional and social situations.  Yes, there are times and places when profanity is acceptable. However, some people apparently have either forgotten, or never learned, that the language we use in the barracks and the bar rooms is supposed to stay there.  If you haven't grasped that concept, then perhaps it's you who shouldn't be playing or socializing with others.

[AudioMechaniK]

<p>[Removed for Content]...<b>Atelos</b></p><p><b>Your argument is also flawed...you may have your proper spelling, your proper punctuation, your `im smarter than you` proper words, but your sig says that you are a `Raider of panties` man, you are just as crude as the next guy...what if that insulted me, wouldnt that violate the EULA?</b></p><p><b>QUIT WHINING</b></p>

[ScouseU]

soe plz put the game back up so i stop reading stuff like this,lol mate i hate to break it to you but this is the internet and belive me when your kid is old enough and your back is turned she will look on sites and find stuff that is worse than what is here....my sisters 10 yo girl was on our laptop when i was looking after her and she was playing on the cbbies website or so i thought until i walked in and looked at the screen and a window closed before i new what it was....she was on youtube watching vids she really shouldnt have been watching.but i rollocked her and took the laptop off her until she promised not to do it again and sure enough she dosnt.....dont forget computers are everywere now and unless u home teach your kid then there aint much you can do to stop kids from seeing stuff there not supposed to....

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>Leatherneck wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Leatherneck wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.</blockquote><p>Beside the fact that filters don't catch everything, there's not even anything right about it except the liberal aptitude (sic) of some hippies who think anything goes all day all night.</p><p>It goes both ways.</p></blockquote>I love it, when someone try to remember poeple what parenting is, he's eighter an hippy or a  liberal ? How wonderful.. and why not a pinko since we are at it ? I wonder if you or anyone realize how words, their use and application change over time. Just to make a quick example, 10-20 years ago to call someone a [I cannot control my vocabulary], even joking betwen friends.. no wait a second, 10-20 years ago they whould have never do that in the first place because it WAS an offence. Now, call a friend a [I cannot control my vocabulary] because he beat you at a poker game or any other kind of activity is not uncommon. So why instead of lecturing other on how they should or should not talk (or type in this case) people like the OP don't start with doing his job as a parent instead of demant it to other "media".</blockquote>You missed it.  He IS doing his job as a parent and not allowing the child to play EQ/EQ2.  He was lamenting the reason that is so is, in part, due to people who choose to go around the rules.</blockquote>No he's not, he's disguiseing his frustration for not been able to deposit his daughter in front of a pc 24/7 instead of doing his job as a parent. It looks like everyone here forget something that should be enforced by such rightrous parents, even before the EULA, and is this game is T rated, meaning it should only be played by 13 years old or older ( <a href="http://www.esrb.org/ratings/ratings_guide.jsp#symbols" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.esrb.org/ratings/ratings...ide.jsp#symbols</a> you may want to check it yourself if you don't believe me heh).

[LordDarthKhan]

Oh I forgot something else.. this is a game where you kill people and slaughter animals like there's no tomorrow and then you complain about some bad words ? are you kidding me ??

[Hamervelder]

<cite>AudioMechaniK wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>[Removed for Content]...<b>Atelos</b></p><p><b>Your argument is also flawed...you may have your proper spelling, your proper punctuation, your `im smarter than you` proper words, but your sig says that you are a `Raider of panties` man, you are just as crude as the next guy...what if that insulted me, wouldnt that violate the EULA?</b></p><p><b>QUIT WHINING</b></p></blockquote>It's called <i>humor</i>.  Atelos is a swashbuckler, a class stereotypified as being preoccupied with the opposite gender.  If you weren't looking for an avenue to make a sarcastic comment, you'd probably notice that.  If my sig insults you, then I'm sure all of the courtesans, ie, prostitutes, in North Freeport offend you too.   /rollseyes

[Josgar]

I started EQ1 in third grade... and the cussing I came across did not affect me...  especially with the filter that makes cussing into (*^*%... it shouldn't be that bad... and I don't cuss... Just tell your daughter that its wrong to do what these people are doing. Or somthing like that.

[ScouseU]

<cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Lokida wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What's really sad is that if my server wasn't down I wouldn't even be reading this garbage.  Keep your kids in your little bubble as long as you can and when they go into the real world and it explodes on them they will thank you for shielding them from life.  I have 4 children, one who is almost a teen and although I KNOW they hear and see worse every day in school we TALK about it.  I explain to them it's not considered appropriate and most people who cuss do not have the vocablulary to express themself.  Myself included at times.  Don't come here preaching shut your pie hole and play the game and if you don't like what you hear or read then don't play.</p><p>/rant off</p></blockquote>And let's be honest.  How many of us work in a place that allows profanity?  Probably not many.  Profanity in the professional world is almost universally considered tacky and tasteless.  If you go into a shopping mall or a restaurant and start cursing profusely, you'll probably be asked to leave.  It's a fact that profanity is almost universally frowned upon in professional and social situations.  </blockquote>have you ever been to st johns shopping center in liverpool you cant walk 2 feet with out hear and swear word and the sercurity are worst than most

[AudioMechaniK]

no actually they dont, and neither does cussing, why? because its a game....and why in the hell should somebody saying a cuss word bother me more than seeing a prostitute for the love of god?....DO YOU REALLY MEAN TO ARGUE THAT???....roll your [Removed for Content] eyes some more

[Phazation]

I'll be fine as long as Freeport's prostitutes watch their language.

[AudioMechaniK]

<p>now that is funny....hell is not a `foul` and filtered word...but r e t a r d e d is?...nice </p><p> theres some of your CUSSING </p>

[sENADIN]

<p>Ahhh but it is humor to YOU! For other folks it maybe totally insulting! Same goes with some cuzz words.....some folks use it between friends and such as a joke. When you hear so called bad stuff in OOC, do you have a clue if they arent long time budies?</p><p>Everything is subjective.</p>

[Hamervelder]

<cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Ahhh but it is humor to YOU! For other folks it maybe totally insulting! Same goes with some cuzz words.....some folks use it between friends and such as a joke. When you hear so called bad stuff in OOC, do you have a clue if they arent long time budies?</p><p>Everything is subjective.</p></blockquote>If Sony says my sig is a violation of their rules, I'll gladly change it.  The folks who espouse vulgarity, however, will go right on telling the rest of us that we're stupid for wanting it curtailed.  There's the difference.

[AudioMechaniK]

for somebody with all that proper language and quoting the EULA one would think you could have seen that nobody was saying that your stupid sig WAS ACTUALLY violating the EULA...simply saying its no different that what you are griping and whining about...just a different way of doing it. Call it what you want, but if you want to get into `character`, then im pretty sure that EVIL ppl, that intend on killing everything good and right, dont give a flying flip about TALKING PROPER...and making sure that your precious lil eyes dont get corrupted by a little cuss word...you people amuse me.

[ScouseU]

<cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Ahhh but it is humor to YOU! For other folks it maybe totally insulting! Same goes with some cuzz words.....some folks use it between friends and such as a joke. When you hear so called bad stuff in OOC, do you have a clue if they arent long time budies?</p><p>Everything is subjective.</p></blockquote>so like others have said its not ok to show your kid swear words but you will show your kid how to kill people and animals kinda hypocritical isnt it

[sENADIN]

<p>I didnt say it was against the rules, i said it's subjective, I mean your defence was that you have that has a humoristic purpose. Well, for some it may insult them. SOE has never really enforced the rules with an iron fist. Folks brandish the EULA to support their point, yet SONY itself doesnt even fully support their EULA. If the comapny itself doesnt support it, do you honestly think the players do and will?</p><p>Bottom line in my book is use the filter if it offend you, if you see someone constantly being a dink in game, then report him/her....it's that simple. I been around for a while and i see those post coming up and all that jazz, yet it's simply a personal choice that you can make. I dont see the big deal to get offended, just as for me the fact that you have the word panties in your sig.....i honestly couldnt care less.</p><p>/wave</p>

[taloron]

While I  have sympathy for the OP. I do believe someone needs to be alittle realisitc. Unless you plan to home school your child/children. Never allow them outside to play with any of the neighborhood kids. Never let them listen to the radio or watch TV. Never leave them with a babysister. Your  comments are pretty much out there in la la land . Cussing has become so wolven into our society as a whole by the time a child is in kintergarden or 1st grade they know all the cuss words out there. You can complain all you want throw out comments like this all you want about people in this game. But the fact remains there is no realistic way to  shelter your child from foul language. Unless you want to polk there eyes  out and  burst there eardrums so they never hear or see it unfortunately. It might be time to  just accept it and start focusing more on educating your child/children on why cussing is bad and the  penalties of using  such language. I have 2 teenage children both of which knew every cuss word you could think  of before age 8. Does that mean they use them alot? Nope  I am very proud oi my kids. There not saints no one is but they are not foul mouthed  either.

[Xdatinelia]

<p>The OP is doing his job as a parent, and like the rest of us was prolly only here because of the server outage.  In all honestly atm I do censor.. a lot, but I have a really good reason.  My daughter just expirenced the death of her 5 week old brother 2 months ago.  She picked up an *s* word and a *b* word while family was visiting, and has become obessed with death in general.  We do not cuss around her personaly, nor do we talk about death now.  It has been killer hard tho, seemingly easy little things like loading up eq2 and playing while she is coloring or taking a nap are no longer possible without great thought.  Mostly I tradeskill in front of her and save my gaming until she is good and asleep and not waking up in a few hours.  If you *die* in game at least in 1st person you can not see anything but a loading screen, but it is too easy to say to husband I died again, which starts the questions again on if you are really dead and where is her brother and can we go find him in heaven.</p><p>Point is Some censorship is needed some of the time.  That being said, I will not censor what she is old enough to handle, but will try and explain to her right and wrong at her level and what she can and can not do at her age.</p>

[AudioMechaniK]

im deeply sorry for the loss of your son...i cant imagine...prayers be with you.

[Hamervelder]

<cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I didnt say it was against the rules, i said it's subjective, I mean your defence was that you have that has a humoristic purpose. Well, for some it may insult them. SOE has never really enforced the rules with an iron fist. Folks brandish the EULA to support their point, yet SONY itself doesnt even fully support their EULA. If the comapny itself doesnt support it, do you honestly think the players do and will?</p><p>Bottom line in my book is use the filter if it offend you, if you see someone constantly being a dink in game, then report him/her....it's that simple. I been around for a while and i see those post coming up and all that jazz, yet it's simply a personal choice that you can make. I dont see the big deal to get offended, just as for me the fact that you have the word panties in your sig.....i honestly couldnt care less.</p><p>/wave</p></blockquote>You do have a point, but I suppose that the difference is that if someone were actually offended by my sig, and made me aware, I'd certainly change it asap.  The same often can't be said for those who espouse open vulgarity.  Just look at the responses in this thread for proof.  The OP has been ripped nine ways to Sunday over the issue.  For some reason, some people think they should be able to just blurt out whatever comes to mind, with no thought of how it may affect others, or how others may respond.  If someone chooses to use profanity (and we've all done it from time to time) then that person should not be angry or surprised if and when he or she is called into account for violating the rules.  If anyone is actually offended by my signature, they're welcome to PM me or report me for it.  I doubt, however, that anyone is.

[Wargod1968]

<cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?

[Hamervelder]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>omg I just snorted cola out my nose.  /bows to the master.  You, my friend, have a greater intellect than I could ever hope, for you summed up all I could have wished to say, in five words.

[acctlc]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing</p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>Make sure you don't send her to school ...you'll find a lot more immaturity there than on eq2.  And while we are at it...don't forget to preach abstinence only, so she can go get knocked up at 16 because she had no idea </p><p>what birth control is.  /end rant</p></blockquote>

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>Honestly I had to google that one. Looking from wiki I can't really judge the character of this writer so I can't really replay.

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>omg I just snorted cola out my nose.  /bows to the master.  You, my friend, have a greater intellect than I could ever hope, for you summed up all I could have wished to say, in five words.</blockquote>Still can't find the fun of that.

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Arieva@Oasis wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing</p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>Make sure you don't send her to school ...you'll find a lot more immaturity there than on eq2.  And while we are at it...don't forget to preach abstinence only, so she can go get knocked up at 16 because she had no idea what birth control is.  /end rant</p></blockquote>Good thing you didn't use hyperbole or dramatic license in your well-grounded response.

[Hamervelder]

<cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>omg I just snorted cola out my nose.  /bows to the master.  You, my friend, have a greater intellect than I could ever hope, for you summed up all I could have wished to say, in five words.</blockquote>Still can't find the fun of that.</blockquote>PM Inbound.

[Necronimous]

<cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Ahhh but it is humor to YOU! For other folks it maybe totally insulting! Same goes with some cuzz words.....some folks use it between friends and such as a joke. When you hear so called bad stuff in OOC, do you have a clue if they arent long time budies?</p><p>Everything is subjective.</p></blockquote>If Sony says my sig is a violation of their rules, I'll gladly change it.  The folks who espouse vulgarity, however, will go right on telling the rest of us that we're stupid for wanting it curtailed.  There's the difference. </blockquote>Atelos you seem rather pompous in your demeanor... We are glad you have a firm grasp of the english language and well versed in the alternative terms of the much simpler forms of the words in which you use. Get off your soap box and stop belittling people with your "I am holier than thou" attitude. Seriously man.. do you have a thesaurus sitting your desk so you can respond in a manner that portrays arrogance within yourself? IT IS A GAME... who cares if someone cusses and who cares if that violates the EULA.. I do not see in the EULA anywhere that is says any eq2 gamers can be a EULA enforcer or Police... Let Sony take care of that and just play your game.. if something offends you.... then feel free to report away and if you have kids and do not want them to see it.. either filter it or do not let them play instead of trying to wage a war on every single person who doesn't fit into your perfect little world. And as far as your tag that says raider of panties... No it doesn't violate EULA but you want to take a defensive stance on behalf of the parents with children, well what if those parents are reading the reply's to this thread and their child is standing there with them and they read that you are a raider of panties... and then that child says.. hey mom or dad.. what does that mean raider of panties??? Do not Push that POMPOUS attitude onto this forum and justify your tag because it has no profanity in it. It represents a sexually deviant attitude.. If you still think saying [Removed for Content] is worse than saying you are a raider of panties... tell you what.. lets go up town and I will tell a 13 year old girl [Removed for Content] and you tell her you are a raider of panties... lets see who gets in trouble!!!!!! Do us all a favor.. stop posting, because quite frankly i find your responses to be rather irritating and condescending.

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>omg I just snorted cola out my nose.  /bows to the master.  You, my friend, have a greater intellect than I could ever hope, for you summed up all I could have wished to say, in five words.</blockquote>Still can't find the fun of that.</blockquote>PM Inbound.</blockquote>Alright.

[Wargod1968]

<cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>Honestly I had to google that one. Looking from wiki I can't really judge the character of this writer so I can't really replay.</blockquote>Not to worry, this is just an MMO message board, in the big scheme of things it doesn't matter if you got it or not.

[Gnevil]

<p>Hmm little floored by this post, i guess having the servers down for the entire day has brought out the extremes on both ends of the spectrum.</p><p>While I understand your concern I do not however support your drive to eliminate any foul (definitions of this term vary widely by the public at large) language in the game.  This game is not aimed at sub teens, and parents who allow their sub teens to play this game unsupervised, or for that matter surf the internet at large without supervision are in the wrong.  Not the public who do partake of the game. </p><p>I will give you that at times the chat channels are a tad excessive, vulgar and way over the top on the sexual stuff but then this just mirrors the life outside our little computer consoles.  Have you watched Music Videos, Movies, Television, listened to the radio lately?</p><p>I agree with those that say explain this to your children and impress upon them the importance of trying to not use this language in public unless you deem it absolutely neccessary.  Sorry to say this but my wife is a elementary school teacher, 4th grade.  I have heard way worse walking across a playground then I hear in game.  And yes I do have my filter turned on, I have just learned to ignore it if it.</p><p>Keep in mind that mostly late teens and adults play this game, a large portion of the player population is well beyond the Disney years...</p><p>And you are most likely the type of person that I ran into this morning that gets a pickup group going, then after the 4th idiotic wipe because player x was to stupid for their own good.  And a couple of the group members said [Removed for Content] it stop casting you [Removed for Content] so we can get mentored and do this right... And the group leader firmly and forcefully told the two members that would be enough cussing... I kid you not, damnit was all they said at the time, I am sure they were saying way worse in their computer rooms but all they said in chat was damnit... Both players said well thank you very much I am outa here... and promptly left the room.</p><p>The world we live in is not the idealistic reality that some of you would love to have.  And it has nothing to do with Religion or cultures its all to do with the morals you teach your children from the time they are born... If you have done it right then your kids will grow up and be respectable.. </p><p>I was in a board meeting the other day and the chairman got extremely upset with the director of marketing and completely [Removed for Content] chewed him in front of everyone... I swear he would have made a sailor blush..  and before all you Human Resource managers say oh oh theres a lawsuit.. not in my industry you pull something like that and you won't land that next job .. it's really that simple.</p>

[Cincyspider]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>OMG...the attack of the religious right.</p></blockquote>

[ScouseU]

<cite>Necronimous wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Ahhh but it is humor to YOU! For other folks it maybe totally insulting! Same goes with some cuzz words.....some folks use it between friends and such as a joke. When you hear so called bad stuff in OOC, do you have a clue if they arent long time budies?</p><p>Everything is subjective.</p></blockquote>If Sony says my sig is a violation of their rules, I'll gladly change it.  The folks who espouse vulgarity, however, will go right on telling the rest of us that we're stupid for wanting it curtailed.  There's the difference. </blockquote>Atelos you seem rather pompous in your demeanor... We are glad you have a firm grasp of the english language and well versed in the alternative terms of the much simpler forms of the words in which you use. Get off your soap box and stop belittling people with your "I am holier than thou" attitude. Seriously man.. do you have a thesaurus sitting your desk so you can respond in a manner that portrays arrogance within yourself? IT IS A GAME... who cares if someone cusses and who cares if that violates the EULA.. I do not see in the EULA anywhere that is says any eq2 gamers can be a EULA enforcer or Police... Let Sony take care of that and just play your game.. if something offends you.... then feel free to report away and if you have kids and do not want them to see it.. either filter it or do not let them play instead of trying to wage a war on every single person who doesn't fit into your perfect little world. And as far as your tag that says raider of panties... No it doesn't violate EULA but you want to take a defensive stance on behalf of the parents with children, well what if those parents are reading the reply's to this thread and their child is standing there with them and they read that you are a raider of panties... and then that child says.. hey mom or dad.. what does that mean raider of panties??? Do not Push that POMPOUS attitude onto this forum and justify your tag because it has no profanity in it. It represents a sexually deviant attitude.. If you still think saying [I cannot control my vocabulary] is worse than saying you are a raider of panties... tell you what.. lets go up town and I will tell a 13 year old girl [I cannot control my vocabulary] and you tell her you are a raider of panties... lets see who gets in trouble!!!!!! Do us all a favor.. stop posting, because quite frankly i find your responses to be rather irritating and condescending.</blockquote>wow and very true

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>Honestly I had to google that one. Looking from wiki I can't really judge the character of this writer so I can't really replay.</blockquote>Not to worry, this is just an MMO message board, in the big scheme of things it doesn't matter if you got it or not.</blockquote>There is goes the [Removed for Content].. If you want to say something, just say it son.

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Cincyspider wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote>OMG...the attack of the religious right.</blockquote>OMG, the attack of the jumpers-to-conclusion. Good thing you don't display any of your own biases.

[LordDarthKhan]

<cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>LordDarthKhan wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sooo, your daughter will never watch a movie, never listen to music and most likely never go to a public school right ? I already feel sorry for her.Beside the fact that there are filters for cussing, there's not even anything wrong about it except the conservative aptitude of some parents whom whould gladly throws us all back in the middle-age to burn witches and all the people they don't like all in the name of the holy god.Now, if you want to live in a world like this be my guest and go build some bunker like they used to do in the 50s. Otherwise grow up, and do your job as a parent and explain your children how, when and if cussing is right isntead of demant it to some computer video game.</blockquote>Ward Churchill, is that you?</blockquote>Honestly I had to google that one. Looking from wiki I can't really judge the character of this writer so I can't really replay.</blockquote>Not to worry, this is just an MMO message board, in the big scheme of things it doesn't matter if you got it or not.</blockquote>There is goes the [I cannot control my vocabulary].. If you want to say something, just say it son.</blockquote>Oh lol this forum has a very vast accessory of word blocked ahaha

[Wargod1968]

AB is up (for now). GL everyone on your own servers, hopefully the roll-back will be kind to you. Cheers.

[Phazation]

<p>The real issue here is that one of the brigand taunt CA's is named 'Cuss'. Brigand tanking could be a violation of the EULA, I personally do not want my family exposed to it.</p>

[Hamervelder]

<cite>Necronimous wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>sENADIN wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Ahhh but it is humor to YOU! For other folks it maybe totally insulting! Same goes with some cuzz words.....some folks use it between friends and such as a joke. When you hear so called bad stuff in OOC, do you have a clue if they arent long time budies?</p><p>Everything is subjective.</p></blockquote>If Sony says my sig is a violation of their rules, I'll gladly change it.  The folks who espouse vulgarity, however, will go right on telling the rest of us that we're stupid for wanting it curtailed.  There's the difference. </blockquote>Atelos you seem rather pompous in your demeanor... We are glad you have a firm grasp of the english language and well versed in the alternative terms of the much simpler forms of the words in which you use. Get off your soap box and stop belittling people with your "I am holier than thou" attitude. Seriously man.. do you have a thesaurus sitting your desk so you can respond in a manner that portrays arrogance within yourself? IT IS A GAME... who cares if someone cusses and who cares if that violates the EULA.. I do not see in the EULA anywhere that is says any eq2 gamers can be a EULA enforcer or Police... Let Sony take care of that and just play your game.. if something offends you.... then feel free to report away and if you have kids and do not want them to see it.. either filter it or do not let them play instead of trying to wage a war on every single person who doesn't fit into your perfect little world. And as far as your tag that says raider of panties... No it doesn't violate EULA but you want to take a defensive stance on behalf of the parents with children, well what if those parents are reading the reply's to this thread and their child is standing there with them and they read that you are a raider of panties... and then that child says.. hey mom or dad.. what does that mean raider of panties??? Do not Push that POMPOUS attitude onto this forum and justify your tag because it has no profanity in it. It represents a sexually deviant attitude.. If you still think saying [I cannot control my vocabulary] is worse than saying you are a raider of panties... tell you what.. lets go up town and I will tell a 13 year old girl [I cannot control my vocabulary] and you tell her you are a raider of panties... lets see who gets in trouble!!!!!! Do us all a favor.. stop posting, because quite frankly i find your responses to be rather irritating and condescending.</blockquote>You know, I've had it with people that post things like what you posted.  Would you prefer that I sling insults like you do?  Maybe call you a few four-letter names?  Would that make you feel better?  I bet you'd get all giddy and excited, wouldn't you.  But no.  You can't find any fault with my actual point, so you choose to get angry because I use some semblance of proper grammar.  I'm sorry if you find my posts irritating and condescending.  That's your problem, not mine.  But you know, I will stop posting.  I'll deprive you of the opportunity to sling any more insults.  Take care.

[PlatinumPlayer]

<p >Look lets make this simple.</p> <p > </p> <p >An mmo, especially everquest mimics real life. When a player logs in their just a new person in this virtual world walking the streets, a world much like our own.</p> <p > </p> <p >When I go shopping or even too a movie it is unavoidable to overhear others speaking. Couples chatting, friends joking or even an angry customer blowing his top at management. <span> </span>I hear things I’d rather not but I don’t stop and tell them to watch their mouth, why? Because it’s completely unnecessary, people are not idiots despite what you may think. They know swearing is rude and wrong at times, but all of us have done it on one occasion or another without shame or care of who overheard. Do we lay awake at night weighted with guilt? If you do then you should get some psychiatric help as soon as possible.</p> <p > </p> <p >You are naïve and think you are entitled to dictate what should and shouldn’t be and bias or not; I find thoughts of high education and deep religion beliefs are the first the think their opinion of what is or should be has divine weight and greater importance then any others. If you’re religious you would defend your ethics and morals with god’s words. If your highly educated you would defend with someone being uneducated or to the extreme lower class.</p> <p > </p> <p >Everyone in this world has an opinion. We all want our way of thinking to be the right one or the only one. Well to bad. There are 7 billion people on this planet that think their center of it and society, government, and individuals have to adapt and find a middle ground to deal with each other.</p> <p > </p> <p >The cussing is bad! Who raise theses people? Its phrases like this that incite conflicts and create arguments like these and there is absolutely no need for it.</p> <p > </p> <p >My own opinion is this. I hear cussing in common day life often, everquest is public social world. Should I get ear muffs on in real life to beep out the cussing? Should I write up a news article in my local newspaper saying “People swear I can’t let me child live in this world!” No because it’s completely ridicules to do so. </p> <p > </p> <p >As for everyone that likes to state you don’t swear in a professional setting. The last time I checked this game was in fact a game. A place to socialize and relax and have fun. Not conform to the rigors of office life in another world. Are we going to start having casual Friday where we can remove our armor to ware dress cloths? I don’t think so.</p> <p > </p> <p >Everyday you meet someone you do and don’t like, you can’t just do /ignore them in real life but you can in the game. You expect a virtual world to evolve above common place society and transcend into a utopia of proper manners and common curacy, you my friend are insane.</p> <p > </p> <p >Fix real life before trying to fix a fake one and don’t think you opinion is worth more then someone else’s. <span> </span>Don’t hide behind titles like parent, father, or mother, educated and so forth. It means nothing other then you believe you’re entitled to more then you truly are. People are selfish and will use whatever advantage they can to prove their own point too others.</p> <p > </p> <p >IF everyone grew a thicker skin life would be much more bearable.</p> <p > </p> <p >(And to all the grammar and spelling police. Don’t bother flaming me I know I can’t type. And yes I’m guilty of everything I stated in my own argument since I even bothered to post this.)</p>

[AudioMechaniK]

<p>/shakes <cite>Necronimous` hand</cite></p><p><cite>you would think that people would figure out that the harder they try to appear intelligent, and/or proper, the worse it makes them look (heres an eye roll for ya)</cite></p>

[Tiernu]

<span style="color: #990033;"><span style="font-size: small;"><span style="font-family: georgia,palatino;"><i><b> Hi,      Just to add a lil note, I am well beyond the "Disney years" and have on occasion seen the cussing  in chat. I grew up in a time when if I cussed, simply put, I got a belt across my  backside.  This made me   remember "never cuss in front of your parents" .  I don't to this day.  However, those days are gone and  we see in real life, everyday,  worse things than I have ever seen ingame. To put it mildly, and politely,  Be a parent!  Take responsiblity for what your kids learn, don't expect SOE or Sony to raise them.  I do   cuss at times but so far never in game, due to manners ,,, "so far".     I can't predict the future though, so   I will not say  I will never cuss. Just enjoy the game as it is, use "parental control", and just play a very  cool game.   </b></i></span></span></span><img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[funkmasterflex]

<p>some folks swear, some dont. why do i have to not just because you dont? that said i swear and act like a tool with guildies cause that's the kind of guild im in and everyone's about the same.  however if someone tags along on one of our groups and if they ask me to tone down the language ive got no problem.  maybe if you just ask someone to cut out the saucy talk rather than seek immediate death penalty itd go along way to fixing the issue.  sticks and stones and all that jazz. and chances are your kid already knows the words from the bus anyways.  most kids know by 1st or 2nd grade.  so to blame online people for kids potty mouth is silly. be a parent and monitor them and you be responsible for what they say and dont say. dont blame a ULEA</p>

[Echgar]

This is an interesting discussion and I am inclined to leave it open for now, but for those getting a special kick out of trying out the profanity filter on the forums, please don't.  As stated in the <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?topic_id=176" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">forum rules</a>, you may not post material that:<ul><li>Contains obscenity, vulgarity, profanity or is sexually explicit. Though we do have a filter in place to catch unintentional obscenity from time to time, this is not a license to abuse it. Bypassing the obscenity filter by using letter, number, or character combinations that allow the obscene or inappropriate word to appear is unacceptable as well.</li></ul>As for in-game, the Rules of Conduct for EverQuest II has that covered too:<ul><li>Foul language is not permitted, in any language.Excessive use of foul language in an inappropriate context, including swear words, real-world racial slurs, and other language that is not consistent with the fantasy environment and designed to hurt, will be considered a disruption and will not be tolerated. The existence of the filter (/filter) is not a license to be profane.</li></ul>

[Jaxl]

There's no difference between censoring phrases and censoring words; get over it.   Do you enjoy dictating other's morals for them?

[Ama]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>Sadly Swearing, Cussing, Cursing, etc... are apart of life and that is why Sony implemented the "bad word filter".  </p><p>Just like any other community there are those that swear like Sailors with Tourettes syndrom and others like myself that let a curse word fly here or there accidentally or on purpose.  You cannot control people and their actions which again is why SoE implemented the filter.  </p><p>If cussing gets out of hand the /petition and /report functions are there.  Also I can't help, but find humor in your statement above "i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing." .  I have watched the most foulest language out there thanks to games like Counter-Strike:Source and other FPS games.  Compared to that language EQ2 is rather tame and no offense, but you sound rather controlling hoping EQ2 has language that only gets as bad as darn or dang. </p>

[Mawie]

<cite>AudioMechaniK wrote:</cite><blockquote>no actually they dont, and neither does cussing, why? because its a game....and why in the hell should somebody saying a cuss word bother me more than seeing a prostitute for the love of god?....DO YOU REALLY MEAN TO ARGUE THAT???....roll your [I cannot control my vocabulary] eyes some more</blockquote>Wow. You're a shining beacon of humanity.

[Xanrn]

<p>Oh deary me.</p><p>Swearing in a game that teaches "Might is Right", that all you need to become rich and famous is a sharp sword.</p><p>I spend most of my time in this game, [Removed for Content] the world of its natural resources, killing wildlife and breaking into people's homes, killing them and robbing their corpses.</p><p>I do love Americans, violence is fine aslong as noone swears or has sex.</p>

[tass]

well sometimes cussing brings out the true feeling of the topic at hand.  Like say your grp just wiped right in front of that named you wanted really REALLY BAD. And then u watched another grp stroll past and get the loot. You could say gosh darn it gee willykers! (lol holy cow batman) or the correct response is [Removed for Content]! Or sunofa (edited)Anyway technological terms aside, who cares. Unless ur some extreme religion like Amish in which case what the hell are u doing with a computer you con artist.

[Wheeze]

I can 'control' my vocabulary just fine, thank you. I'm an English teacher. I choose to swear because I am not a [Removed for Content], and I don't like to pretend 'shoot' or 'dang' is any different than '[Removed for Content]' or '[Removed for Content]'. Take your ancient and idiotic notions about 'swear words' and shove 'em right back in the dank, dark hole they came out of - this is the future, where we know better than to be offended by nonsense. There are [Removed for Content] few words in the English language anyone understands, I say we use all of 'em at our disposal.Swear on, humanity. Swear on.

[Wheeze]

<cite>Xanrn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Oh deary me.</p><p>Swearing in a game that teaches "Might is Right", that all you need to become rich and famous is a sharp sword.</p><p>I spend most of my time in this game, [Removed for Content] the world of its natural resources, killing wildlife and breaking into people's homes, killing them and robbing their corpses.</p><p>I do love Americans, violence is fine aslong as noone swears or has sex.</p></blockquote>Amen (well, except I'd say it's hardly just us yanks, but still - well put).

[de lori]

<p>I really do fail to see why "words" themselves upset people.....if anything...by using swear words those people are giving you the oppurtunity to filter it out.</p><p>I could quite easily say something vile and rude without ever using a "cuss" word. Implying that swearing just shows someones lack of intellegence is flawed....anything that a cuss word "means" can be said with "normal" words without the filter picking it up and in many ways ,when done in this manner the result can be even more derogatory....so really...you should be thankful that they do use cuss words...so the filter can do its job.</p>

[Tokam]

<cite>Xanrn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I do love <b><i><span style="color: #ffcc00;">Hollywood</span></i></b>, violence is fine aslong as no one swears or has sex.</p></blockquote><p>Fixed</p><p>I enjoy swearing, I find it to be succinct and expressive, conveying my thoughts and feelings accurately to the person I direct these words towards. If you wish your children to be so isolated then I sugest that you remove their access to the interbet from them. Perhaps this would meet with less rancor.</p>

[Zyphe]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote>Guess what? The world doesn't revolve around YOU.I really hate Bible thumpers.

[Mawie]

I really think it is unfair to crap on someone because they think there are people who go off the deep end swearing.I think it isn't swearing that's the problem, but knowing your audience. I curse amongst my guild (never AT my guild), but not amongst my entire server. I think it comes down to courtesy. There are certain times in life and certain environments where bad language is just tacky. I have no problems with someone dropping the f-bomb in a public channel, but it's out of hand when it is directed AT someone or if they use it every other word.A well placed expletive can be so powerful, but as soon as it is overused it just looks silly. People who litter their chat with swears looks stupid. I'm not offended, but I feel kinda bad that they cannot think of a better way to express what they are thinking.

[q149]

<p>You're wrong.. </p><p>If you don't want your children to pick up habbits by being exposed to real people, then you can shelter them and not let them play the game.  There you go, it's your only choice.</p><p>There are going to be people swearing anywhere there is speaking or typing, at least you have a filter to turn on here..  as well as the ability to ignore anyone you want.  What was the point in this thread anyway?.. it is just a display of irrational thinking on your part. </p><p>Personally, I would not want my children hanging around reading the writings of someone with such horrible grammar..  I don't start threads and go off about it though.</p>

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Xanrn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Oh deary me.</p><p>Swearing in a game that teaches "Might is Right", that all you need to become rich and famous is a sharp sword.</p><p>I spend most of my time in this game, [Removed for Content] the world of its natural resources, killing wildlife and breaking into people's homes, killing them and robbing their corpses.</p><p>I do love Americans, violence is fine aslong as noone swears or has sex.</p></blockquote><p>I was concerned. 5 Pages, and no one had yet begun the America bashing. Thank heavens you arrived.</p>

[liveja]

<p>We have an 18-or-over requirement for our little friends-&-family guild -- exceptions made for kids related to guildies -- & we STILL take a very dim view of cursing, foul language, overtly sexual discussion, drug talk, & so forth in our guild channel.</p><p>Mama Bear doesn't like that kind of talk, & she's taught the rest of us well. I think people can get their point across without the profanity, though I admit that my highwayman mouth sometimes runs afoul ... but never around my guildies! *crosses heart, looks innocent & gentlemanly*</p><p>OTOH, we recently had an incident on Mistmoore in which a GM booted people from the server -- albeit only briefly, for just a few minutes -- because they had typed "lmfao" in the chat channel. He/she asserted that "abbreviated profanity is still profanity." I thought that was just a bit heavy-handed <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[tass]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Xanrn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Oh deary me.</p><p>Swearing in a game that teaches "Might is Right", that all you need to become rich and famous is a sharp sword.</p><p>I spend most of my time in this game, [Removed for Content] the world of its natural resources, killing wildlife and breaking into people's homes, killing them and robbing their corpses.</p><p>I do love Americans, violence is fine aslong as noone swears or has sex.</p></blockquote><p>I was concerned. 5 Pages, and no one had yet begun the America bashing. Thank heavens you arrived.</p></blockquote>[Removed for Content] if you dont want cussing and sex you best just cross back on the liferaft you forged here on cause if theirs 1 thing America has its the self morals to tell someone to go (edited) off, with it making their day lol.Also to the sheltering childeren from learning and useing cuss words. Here an idea. You here little boy junior telling you his pop or mom to go (edited) off. You go outside find a tree, break off a branch about 3 feet long, take all the leaves off this thing cant be soft, and beat the little (edited) until his [Removed for Content] is red. And if he cusses more guess what ya do? (parent): appologize and swear i'll never do it again? ( note if thats ur responce you can just slap urslelf upside the head with the switch)correct answer: thats right you beat them more.  Now their is a possibility some nosy neighbor calls social services on you and they try and take the kid. But at that point if ur taking that kinda crap from ur kid u might as well just hand the failure away if the court doesn't like you teaching it.This has been the idiots guide to people trying to shelter and raise kids lol.

[JohnDoe058]

<cite>VelvetPanda wrote:</cite><blockquote>To be honest, most people don't read the EULA, and you all know it..Sad, really, reading EULAs might give them +2 Intelligence.:/</blockquote><p>Yeah, especially you.</p><p>The Rules of Conduct are mentioned only in the following paragraphs:</p><p><b>YOU PROMISE, THEREFORE, THAT YOU WILL NEVER ASSERT OR BRING ANY CLAIM OR SUIT AGAINST SOE, ITS LICENSOR(S), ANY SONY COMPANY, OR ANY EMPLOYEES OF ANY OF THE ABOVE, WHICH IS RELATED TO OR BASED ON (I) A CLAIM THAT YOU "OWN" ANY VIRTUAL GOODS IN ANY GAME, (II) A CLAIM FOR THE "VALUE" OF VIRTUAL GOODS IF SOE DELETES THEM (AND/OR TERMINATES YOUR ACCOUNT(S)) IF YOU OR ANYONE ACTING IN CONCERT WITH YOU VIOLATES ANY PROVISION OF THE EXCHANGE AGREEMENT, THIS AGREEMENT, THE GAME'S RULES OF CONDUCT, SOE'S TERMS OF SERVICE AND/OR SOE'S PRIVACY POLICY (ALL OF WHICH ARE POSTED AT A LINK AT WWW.EVERQUEST2.COM), (III) A CLAIM FOR THE "VALUE" OF VIRTUAL GOODS THAT YOU MAY LOSE IF SOE DOES ANYTHING THAT IT IS ENTITLED TO DO PURSUANT TO ANY PROVISION OF THE EXCHANGE AGREEMENT, THIS AGREEMENT, THE GAME'S RULES OF CONDUCT, SOE'S TERMS OF SERVICE AND/OR SOE'S PRIVACY POLICY, OR FOR ANY MALFUNCTIONS AND/OR "BUGS" IN THE GAME, AND/OR (IV) A CLAIM THAT THE "VALUE" OF ANY VIRTUAL GOODS HAS INCREASED OR DECREASED BY VIRTUE OF ANY GAME MODIFICATION THAT SOE HAS MADE OR WILL MAKE . ALL OF THE ABOVE APPLIES WHETHER ON AN EXCHANGE ENABLED SERVER OR ON A NON-EXCHANGE ENABLED SERVER.</b></p><p><b>6. We may terminate this Agreement (including your Software license and your Account) and/or suspend your Account immediately and without notice: (i) if you violate any provision of this Agreement; (ii) infringe any third party intellectual property rights; (iii) if we are unable to verify or authenticate any information you provide to us; (iv) upon game play, chat or any player activity whatsoever which we, in our sole discretion, determine is inappropriate and/or in violation of the spirit of the Game; (v) upon any violation of the Station Terms of Service and/or the Game Rules of Conduct and/or (vi) upon any violation of the Exchange Agreement. If we terminate this Agreement or suspend your Account under these circumstances, you will lose access to your Account for the duration of the suspension and/or the balance of any prepaid period without any refund. We may also terminate this Agreement if we decide, in our sole discretion, to discontinue offering the Game, in which case we may provide you with a prorated refund of any prepaid amounts. </b></p><p>In none of these cases, are the Rules of Conduct specified overtly as part of the EULA.  In fact, in the latter paragraph, it is stated as a separate condition from "if you violate any provision of this agreement".</p><p>Rather, it is stated that your account can be cancelled if you violate the Rules of Conduct, not that such is a sort of legal infraction.</p><p>And btw, thanx all for trying to abridge our freedom of speech.  Kthxbye. </p>

[KunamitsuUK]

<cite>-.dE.- wrote:</cite><blockquote>zomg grow up sir, this is not hello kitty adventure island !</blockquote><p>Since hearing about that game on South Park I have been unable to find that game anywhere......<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>EDIT: Have discovered it is a made up game, this news makes me a SAD Panda <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Vonotar]

Don't expect Sony to care about swearing.A couple of members of our guild reported some 10-19 chat that basically revolved around somebody making out they were a preteen child sitting on their fathers ... well you get the idea.We never got any response to our petition... well we did actually... they sent us a 'satisfaction survey'....Now I work in the UK gambling industry, and if that had happened in one of our Bingo chat rooms we would have to report the incident to the police for investigation <b>by law</b>.Sony however doesn't even care if it breaks the EULA....

[MrDaerion]

<cite>Wheeze wrote:</cite><blockquote>I can 'control' my vocabulary just fine, thank you. I'm an English teacher. I choose to swear because I am not a [Removed for Content], and I don't like to pretend 'shoot' or 'dang' is any different than '[I cannot control my vocabulary]' or '[I cannot control my vocabulary]'. Take your ancient and idiotic notions about 'swear words' and shove 'em right back in the dank, dark hole they came out of - this is the future, where we know better than to be offended by nonsense. There are [I cannot control my vocabulary] few words in the English language anyone understands, I say we use all of 'em at our disposal.Swear on, humanity. Swear on.</blockquote>I think I just fell in love with you.

[KunamitsuUK]

<cite>Vonotar@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>Don't expect Sony to care about swearing.A couple of members of our guild reported some 10-19 chat that basically revolved around somebody making out they were a preteen child sitting on their fathers ... well you get the idea.We never got any response to our petition... well we did actually... they sent us a 'satisfaction survey'....Now I work in the UK gambling industry, and if that had happened in one of our Bingo chat rooms we would have to report the incident to the police for investigation <b>by law</b>.Sony however doesn't even care if it breaks the EULA....</blockquote><p>Thats Totally NOT COOL and I hope that serious flaming accompanied the petitions.</p><p>Strange that that was allowed to go on when a female member of my old guild had her toon almost instantly deleted when someone reported her for being called CyberS**t, despite her being able to level into the early 20s without complaint until coming accross the one who got her banned.</p><p>What they need to bring back is visable online GMs who can observe the behavious once its reported. On a lighter note, in this instance it should be an Epic group of Knights - The Knights of Standards and Practices. <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

[Kasar]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p> <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote>Already using your daughter to try and get what you want.  That's exploitative and absurd.Because you want something done just in case, in a few years, maybe she were to play... what kind of sense is that."For the children" as a blind imperative only works in politics.

[Armawk]

<cite>Vonotar@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>A couple of members of our guild reported some 10-19 chat that basically revolved around somebody making out they were a preteen child sitting on their fathers ... well you get the idea.</blockquote><p>Why would your friends get a response? the person who did it is the person who would be dealt with, theres no reason the reporter in a case such as that (as opposed to a request case concerning yourself) should get any information on what action is taken. In fact there are many reasons why they would not.</p><p>There is precisely ZERO chance that if this is genuine, and if the report contained the appropriate log info (i.e. if sony staff were able to see verifiable logs of this behaviour) that this person still has a sony account.</p>

[Vonotar]

<cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Vonotar@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>A couple of members of our guild reported some 10-19 chat that basically revolved around somebody making out they were a preteen child sitting on their fathers ... well you get the idea.</blockquote><p>Why would your friends get a response? the person who did it is the person who would be dealt with, theres no reason the reporter in a case such as that (as opposed to a request case concerning yourself) should get any information on what action is taken. In fact there are many reasons why they would not.</p><p>There is precisely ZERO chance that if this is genuine, and if the report contained the appropriate log info (i.e. if sony staff were able to see verifiable logs of this behaviour) that this person still has a sony account.</p></blockquote>Maybe, but we didn't even get an acknowledgement that our petition had been received, the person in question was still chatting away in chat after we received our 'satisfaction survey'.Naturally they didn't score very highly on those surveys.

[Armawk]

<cite>Vonotar@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>Maybe, but we didn't even get an acknowledgement that our petition had been received, the person in question was still chatting away in chat after we received our 'satisfaction survey'.Naturally they didn't score very highly on those surveys.</blockquote><p>It sounds like maybe your petition didnt get through maybe? I guess you also sent a report also because it was chat text you were reporting?</p><p>Anyway.. just saying, no company would tolerate what you described. If they know about it.</p>

[Tanan]

<p>Has anyone suggested turning off the chat channels? If the language is that bad in certain channels, just turn them off.  Problem solved.</p>

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Wheeze wrote:</cite><blockquote>I can 'control' my vocabulary just fine, thank you. I'm an English teacher. I choose to swear because I am not a [Removed for Content], and I don't like to pretend 'shoot' or 'dang' is any different than '[I cannot control my vocabulary]' or '[I cannot control my vocabulary]'. Take your ancient and idiotic notions about 'swear words' and shove 'em right back in the dank, dark hole they came out of - this is the future, where we know better than to be offended by nonsense. There are [I cannot control my vocabulary] few words in the English language anyone understands, I say we use all of 'em at our disposal.Swear on, humanity. Swear on.</blockquote>Prometheus wept sorrowfully at your birth.

[Katsi]

<cite>Wheeze wrote:</cite><blockquote>I can 'control' my vocabulary just fine, thank you. <b>I'm an English teacher.</b> I choose to swear because I am not a [Removed for Content], and I don't like to pretend 'shoot' or 'dang' is any different than '[I cannot control my vocabulary]' or '[I cannot control my vocabulary]'. Take your ancient and idiotic notions about 'swear words' and shove 'em right back in the dank, dark hole they came out of - this is the future, where we know better than to be offended by nonsense. There are [I cannot control my vocabulary] few words in the English language anyone understands, I say we use all of 'em at our disposal.Swear on, humanity. Swear on.</blockquote>I am very surprised to hear this.  I know that the public schools in our area do not support our kids swearing.  Yes, I know that doesn't stop them, but the teachers do not allow the students to swear in their classes, and the teachers are not allowed to swear in front of the students.As willing to swear and allow swearing as you might be, I doubt that you would allow a student to express the profanity that I have seen some spew in this game.  And if you expressed it, in class, to the volume I have seen it in this game (I'm not referring to the occasional wipe or whatever), and my child was in your class, my child would not be in your class for much longer.- Katsi

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Katsi wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wheeze wrote:</cite><blockquote>I can 'control' my vocabulary just fine, thank you. <b>I'm an English teacher.</b> I choose to swear because I am not a [Removed for Content], and I don't like to pretend 'shoot' or 'dang' is any different than '[I cannot control my vocabulary]' or '[I cannot control my vocabulary]'. Take your ancient and idiotic notions about 'swear words' and shove 'em right back in the dank, dark hole they came out of - this is the future, where we know better than to be offended by nonsense. There are [I cannot control my vocabulary] few words in the English language anyone understands, I say we use all of 'em at our disposal.Swear on, humanity. Swear on.</blockquote>I am very surprised to hear this.  I know that the public schools in our area do not support our kids swearing.  Yes, I know that doesn't stop them, but the teachers do not allow the students to swear in their classes, and the teachers are not allowed to swear in front of the students.As willing to swear and allow swearing as you might be, I doubt that you would allow a student to express the profanity that I have seen some spew in this game.  And if you expressed it, in class, to the volume I have seen it in this game (I'm not referring to the occasional wipe or whatever), and my child was in your class, my child would not be in your class for much longer.- Katsi</blockquote><p>Katsi, from the construction of their post, I highly doubt the writer is much more than a sophmoric teenager or failing collegiate. </p>

[Katsi]

<cite>funkmasterflex wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>some folks swear, some dont. why do i have to not just because you dont? that said i swear and act like a tool with guildies cause that's the kind of guild im in and everyone's about the same.  <b>however if someone tags along on one of our groups and if they ask me to tone down the language ive got no problem.  </b>maybe if you just ask someone to cut out the saucy talk rather than seek immediate death penalty itd go along way to fixing the issue.  sticks and stones and all that jazz. and chances are your kid already knows the words from the bus anyways.  most kids know by 1st or 2nd grade.  so to blame online people for kids potty mouth is silly. be a parent and monitor them and you be responsible for what they say and dont say. dont blame a ULEA</p></blockquote>Funkmasterflex -If everyone were this courteous there would be no problem.  But often when one asks a fluent swearer to stop or even just tone it down, they often turn it around a direct it at you.  Then they get everyone else to jump on their bandwagon accusing you of being a prude or something, much like what is going on in this thread.In general, I agree with Mawie.Cussing/Profanity/whatever has it's place.  But it is "properly" used (if there is such a concept) as a sudden outburst reflecting that someone has been hurt, disappointed, frustrated, or insulted.  The sudden single word coming from someone who rarely employs that particular strain of speech is much more startling than the stream that comes from the mouths of those who intend to shock.To me, cussing is much like litter.  A pristine park with a single soda can rolling along a path strikes me as the "one that got away" and makes me want to help.  - Much as the person who doesn't normally swear letting one loose, and catches my attention resulting in my wanting to help solve the problem.The park that is full of garbage, from cigarette ends to candy wrappers, fast food containers to soda cans I find disgusting and makes me want to never return.  - Much as the person who drops cuss words from his lips on a regular basis results in my not wanting to group/play with him, no matter his need or problem.- Katsi

[Daysy]

Just because I'm not a child shouldn't mean I have to put up with vulgarity. If some people have no respect for themselves or for anyone else, that's their problem, not mine. If I see anyone using profanity, I immediately consign them to /ignore and forget they exist. My children have learned to deal with them the same way.

[Dead Knight]

This thread is dumb, what do you want SoE to do about it? Swearing is a part of life, deal with it.

[Loolee]

At the very least, they make good examples of bad behavior.

[tass]

you know what. these guys are right swearing is wrong. We shouldn't be swearing at people expecially when probably half cant understand most of it. We should be learning other peoples languages so that we can fully get the picture through.Also did you know that these filters don't edit out sub language curse words? I tried it once lol.Now onto a more interesting fact who actually decreed the different words to be swear words? My guess is it was some snob politician in rome back in the day.I mean lets take the simplest of the supposed curse words and say dam, I cant add the n otherwise the imagination would probably reconfigure it to something else.Now this word here means a dam, logs, stone whatever it holds water. The actual curse word mean that you yourself are trying to dam something. So you see some words are just an action that the person wants to dam you to hell, or compare a person to a piece of animal feicies lol.lol cant believe this hasn't been moved or locked. Half the stuff thats moved to god knows where is at least a quarter game play related.

[Rentack6390]

Coming from someone who started playing EQ1 back in 5th grade, now a Senior in HS, I'm personally glad I played when I was that young. The words weren't anything new, and if you think your child is innocent of everything you are in most cases wrong. There are too many things to keep them away from anymore. You have the internet which is probably your worst enemy as far as keeping things filtered. Television, radio. The list goes on and on. If you are keeping them away from a lot of these things at home, one would suspect they would only learn it from their friends at school. It has to happen eventually. As I said I am glad I started playing EQ at an early age. I found myself growing as a person with time, and becoming very mature. I found out how to handle myself in certain situations online, and in real life. Instead of having someone come up to me and explain in horrible detail to keep me sheltered even more, I learned most things on my own. I wouldn't have had it any other way. When I was 14-15, I was extremely mature for my age due to everything I experienced by myself. I found that I was having better conversations with older people, rather than those of my current age. My point is, you can shelter them to an extent, but there is always something that you cannot help. Let your kids play the game, if you are worried about them seeing a character die, explain to them it is what they see. A video game. It isn't real. I don't see why language is a big deal honestly. Unless they start using these bad words around the house, or not repeating them in general, I think it is fine. I'm not a parent or anything, but coming from someone who grew up and matured pretty much over the internet maybe some of you parents can understand where I am coming from. Also, [Removed for Content] and language are two completely different things, for whoever made a comparison earlier.

[Mawie]

<cite>Rentack6390 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Alot of good points which I am editing out because it makes the post too darn long. </blockquote>I get what you're saying, but it is the responsibility of the parent's to shelter their kids and/or teach them appropriate times to swear. It is a valid complaint to say that the swearing needs to stop.It isn't appropriate to swear around little children (that's a fair enough statement). It isn't appropriate to swear at someone (even out of anger). It isn't appropriate to swear in certain social settings (such as an expensive restaurant or in Disney World).Kids will hear it, there is no doubt. But no one (adults or kids) should be exposed to some of the blatant stupidity set forth on some channels by some people. The filter exists, but it only goes so far. Courtesy is the next step.

[NosajMa]

I'm continually amazed by the people who seem to think they need to control other people in every way, shape, form, and fashion, and the things they'll come up with in order to do so.First of all, let's be honest: SOE isn't going to go out of its way to lock down all the cussing because I imagine that a majority of the playerbase cusses.  I assume SOE would wait for someone's /report or /petition before looking into an alleged 'cusser' (assuming anyone actually bothers to take the time to /report or /petition someone for cussing); if we thought CS was tied up before with reports on training and botting, they'd have their work cut out for them now.  I also assume SOE would warn or temporarily ban a player before totally banning their account for cussing; hell, it takes directly cussing out a dev to even get a temp ban on these forums.  Does anyone honestly believe SOE would think it worth the time and effort to do all of that?  And do you think that players who get perma-banned for cussing are going to turn around and start a new account?  Not likely unless they're Bad People (tm) as well, so that's going to be a lot of lost revenue right there.So, that said, let's ignore the EULA for a moment and assume that SOE is <i>not</i> going to do anything about people cussing.  That means it's up to those of you who get offended by cussing to decide how you personally are going to deal with it.  You've got a few options:1. Stop playing Everquest 2.  You may also refer to this as the Ostrich Maneuver, i.e. burying your head in the sand so you aren't forced to look at something and admit that it exists and that you can't control it.  Keep in mind that if you feel this option is your only choice, you'll have to make this choice for everything else in life as well that doesn't conform to exactly how you want it.  This includes but is not limited to television, radio, movies, magazines, and out-loud conversations in general.2. Grow up, approach the situation maturely, and realize that things aren't always going to be the way you want them to be.  You're more than welcome to ask people not to cuss around you--there's nothing wrong with that, and if anyone gets irked by you simply asking them once, then they're at fault.  But don't <i>expect</i> people to stop just because you asked, and certainly don't demand they do so; that will just make them do it all the more specifically to aggravate you.  If you ask, and they refuse, that's what /ignore or /filter is for, whichever you want to use.And let that be the end of it.  It's that simple.  There's no need to act high and mighty over someone that doesn't do what you want them to do; just because they don't agree with you doesn't mean they're morally wrong and going to hell for it.  That's not even up to you, so don't worry about it.

[Kasar]

<cite>Katsi wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>I am very surprised to hear this.  I know that the public schools in our area do not support our kids swearing.  Yes, I know that doesn't stop them, but the teachers do not allow the students to swear in their classes, and the teachers are not allowed to swear in front of the students.As willing to swear and allow swearing as you might be, I doubt that you would allow a student to express the profanity that I have seen some spew in this game.  And if you expressed it, in class, to the volume I have seen it in this game (I'm not referring to the occasional wipe or whatever), and my child was in your class, my child would not be in your class for much longer.- Katsi</blockquote>Not allowing it in class doesn't mean much, just walk through the parking lot of a middle school sometime, makes the swearing in this game sound tame.Yes, I know.  This is America, everyone's nanny and your freedom ends where I don't agree with something.  If my position's illogical and indefensible, I'll just say "think of the children" and I win.

[Miss_Jackie]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p></blockquote>This makes me laugh. You expect people to not curse and then play a game that is so geared towards teenage boys. Yeah. Okay. I've heard cursing ever since I was about 10 years old and yet I've still grown up to be a good person. How about not censoring your children and allowing them to express themselves without having to worry that mommy and daddy are gonna punish them for saying the wrong thing? How about letting them read or hear those words and teaching them to be a moral and decent person anyways?

[Miss_Jackie]

<cite>Mawie@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>It isn't appropriate to swear around little children (that's a fair enough statement). </blockquote>Since when? My parents cursed in front me as a kid and I didn't grow up to be some kind of monster. Nor did I grow up to be an immoral and horrible person either. Curses are just words. Get over it.

[Katsi]

<cite>Kasar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Katsi wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>I am very surprised to hear this.  I know that the public schools in our area do not support our kids swearing. <b> Yes, I know that doesn't stop them</b>, but the teachers do not allow the students to swear in their classes, and the teachers are not allowed to swear in front of the students.As willing to swear and allow swearing as you might be, I doubt that you would allow a student to express the profanity that I have seen some spew in this game.  And if you expressed it, in class, to the volume I have seen it in this game (I'm not referring to the occasional wipe or whatever), and my child was in your class, my child would not be in your class for much longer.- Katsi</blockquote>Not allowing it in class doesn't mean much, just walk through the parking lot of a middle school sometime, makes the swearing in this game sound tame.Yes, I know.  This is America, everyone's nanny and your freedom ends where I don't agree with something.  If my position's illogical and indefensible, I'll just say "think of the children" and I win.</blockquote>um.. please re-read the bolded part.  I did acknowledge that the students will do it.  But it is not accepted IN the classes themselves.In addition, if people took the "think of the children" concept to heart, our society would be a LOT better.  (Actually I really wanted to swear there to stress it, heh.)  If everything we did in real life, education, working, resource gathering, relaxation, recreation, and religion, was done with then intent to better our children, then this planet would be a LOT better place, both now, and in the future.- Katsi

[Wingrider01]

<cite>Loolee wrote:</cite><blockquote>At the very least, they make good examples of bad behavior.</blockquote><p>Actually they do act on it, have seen people kicked from groups and suspended because of it.</p><p>Have a simple rule - if a group member cusses excessively, said group member is  asked once to tone it down, if they do not, then the second request is a /report and a /petition. no second request no matter who you are.</p>

[Fian]

For those of you who think shielding a child from the world is wrong, tell me how your are raising your child. I hear so many people say that they are going to hear it anyway so why shield it. I say to you...At least I can say that they don't hear it while my wife and I are around. And, I have enough <b>respect for them</b> to try to keep them from hearing and seeing filth under our roof. I am not naive in thinking they aren't experiencing things in school but I am going to make sure I don't influence it. I think parents are failing in their parental duties to appear as the cool parent. Where I live, you see kids on dates at 12 years of age. I am sure that those of you that are of my generation (39) didn't see that at 12 years of age. And if you did, their parents were considered incompetent. Just my opinion

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Fian wrote:</cite><blockquote>For those of you who think shielding a child from the world is wrong, tell me how your are raising your child. I hear so many people say that they are going to hear it anyway so why shield it. I say to you...At least I can say that they don't hear it while my wife and I are around. And, I have enough <b>respect for them</b> to try to keep them from hearing and seeing filth under our roof. I am not naive in thinking they aren't experiencing things in school but I am going to make sure I don't influence it. I think parents are failing in their parental duties to appear as the cool parent. Where I live, you see kids on dates at 12 years of age. I am sure that those of you that are of my generation (39) didn't see that at 12 years of age. And if you did, their parents were considered incompetent. Just my opinion</blockquote><p>Great response. As a father of two, I underscore that parental examples are important, as it is a part of equiping one's kids with the right tools to make the best choices they can when outside your sphere of influence (ie, with friends, outside the home, etc). I'm not sure everyone will understand your perspective Fian, but I know I do. </p>

[Femke]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p></blockquote>My daughter used to be in a guild that she left for rude language. She had no need to know "who licks whoms <bliep>" or "wanted to <bliep> by whom". She joined now the guild I am in. She feels better there. We look after our language without being childish.Femke.

[Femke]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Fian wrote:</cite><blockquote>For those of you who think shielding a child from the world is wrong, tell me how your are raising your child. I hear so many people say that they are going to hear it anyway so why shield it. I say to you...At least I can say that they don't hear it while my wife and I are around. And, I have enough <b>respect for them</b> to try to keep them from hearing and seeing filth under our roof. I am not naive in thinking they aren't experiencing things in school but I am going to make sure I don't influence it. I think parents are failing in their parental duties to appear as the cool parent. Where I live, you see kids on dates at 12 years of age. I am sure that those of you that are of my generation (39) didn't see that at 12 years of age. And if you did, their parents were considered incompetent. Just my opinion</blockquote><p>Great response. As a father of two, I underscore that parental examples are important, as it is a part of equiping one's kids with the right tools to make the best choices they can when outside your sphere of influence (ie, with friends, outside the home, etc). I'm not sure everyone will understand your perspective Fian, but I know I do. </p></blockquote>I agree.... besides that I think a 12 or 13 year old one should not play games as EQII unwatched or being alone at a computer with Internet at all.Femke.

[Mawie]

<cite>Miss_Jackie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Mawie@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>It isn't appropriate to swear around little children (that's a fair enough statement). </blockquote>Since when? My parents cursed in front me as a kid and I didn't grow up to be some kind of monster. Nor did I grow up to be an immoral and horrible person either. Curses are just words. Get over it.</blockquote>I've never actually said that curse words offend me, but seriously, little kids (and I am talking the 7 and under set here... not 11 year olds who we all know swear when they are not near adults) shouldn't hear that kind of talk. You might not be a monster, but you were probably one of those kids who taught the other kids the bad words, being totally counterproductive to what the other parents who were sheltering their kids were doing.And my dad swore in front of me-- I have a <i>very</i> colorful vocab. I just chose not to break it out at the wrong times.

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Femke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Fian wrote:</cite><blockquote>For those of you who think shielding a child from the world is wrong, tell me how your are raising your child. I hear so many people say that they are going to hear it anyway so why shield it. I say to you...At least I can say that they don't hear it while my wife and I are around. And, I have enough <b>respect for them</b> to try to keep them from hearing and seeing filth under our roof. I am not naive in thinking they aren't experiencing things in school but I am going to make sure I don't influence it. I think parents are failing in their parental duties to appear as the cool parent. Where I live, you see kids on dates at 12 years of age. I am sure that those of you that are of my generation (39) didn't see that at 12 years of age. And if you did, their parents were considered incompetent. Just my opinion</blockquote><p>Great response. As a father of two, I underscore that parental examples are important, as it is a part of equiping one's kids with the right tools to make the best choices they can when outside your sphere of influence (ie, with friends, outside the home, etc). I'm not sure everyone will understand your perspective Fian, but I know I do. </p></blockquote>I agree.... besides that I think a 12 or 13 year old one should not play games as EQII unwatched or being alone at a computer with Internet at all.Femke.</blockquote><p>Aye; when my son plays (he's 6), he plays with me by my side (he gets one hotbar, I get the other). He's a great reader, so he can read chat language, so I only keep /guildchat and group on, and when I'm with him I do not do PUGs, just guild groups. We have Vent running, also, but the entire guild keeps it clean because we know occasionally members' kids are online.</p><p>When I let my son play in City of Heroes (which he can play by himself, less hotbars to worry about, and he's much tougher, so if his timing is off, not too serious), I turn off all chat and put on auto-decline for group and duel invites. Then he can fly all around by himself and fight bad guys or run instances to his heart's delight.</p><p>Does he know swear words? Yes. Does he use them? No. Why? Because responsible adults have let him know what the dividing line is between acceptable behavior and coarse behavior. Will he curse when he's with his friends as he gets older? Perhaps. But I'm sure when he's in polite company or at work, or school, he'll know when it is appropriate to drop them, and as he matures, he may drop the use altogether as I did, when I realized I it was detrimental to my own self-opinion, and that of others.</p>

[liveja]

<cite>Miss_Jackie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Mawie@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>It isn't appropriate to swear around little children (that's a fair enough statement). </blockquote>Since when? My parents cursed in front me as a kid and I didn't grow up to be some kind of monster.</blockquote><p>It's great that you didn't turn out to be a monster or some sort of immoral person. But that has nothing to do with whether or not it is APPROPRIATE to curse in front of children.</p>

[liveja]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>Does he know swear words? Yes. Does he use them? No. Why? Because responsible adults have let him know what the dividing line is between acceptable behavior and coarse behavior. Will he curse when he's with his friends as he gets older? Perhaps. But I'm sure when he's in polite company or at work, or school, he'll know when it is appropriate to drop them, and as he matures, he may drop the use altogether as I did, when I realized I it was detrimental to my own self-opinion, and that of others.</p></blockquote>QFE.

[Armawk]

<cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Miss_Jackie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Mawie@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>It isn't appropriate to swear around little children (that's a fair enough statement). </blockquote>Since when? My parents cursed in front me as a kid and I didn't grow up to be some kind of monster.</blockquote><p>It's great that you didn't turn out to be a monster or some sort of immoral person. But that has nothing to do with whether or not it is APPROPRIATE to curse in front of children.</p></blockquote><p>Firstly, swearing is agains the EULA so theres really no discussion to be had about it. Its not allowed in game. End.</p><p>However, we should all remember that this game has a 13 rating. That means its not for small children, and we should all be ready for themes and behaviours that would not be appropriate for children younger than 13. </p><p>There is mass violence, slavery, prostitution, murder, poisoning, gambling etc throughout the game. A few swear words are the least of your worries I would think.</p>

[liveja]

<cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote>A few swear words are the least of your worries I would think.</blockquote><p>I'm not "worried" about players swearing in game. I'm an adult, & I don't have kids, & I'm not about to worry about how other parents raise their children.</p><p>However, none of that changes my opinion that it's inappropriate to swear around little kids, regardless of other contexts. People should learn how & when to moderate their speech & conduct. I think that's a reasonable enough proposition.</p>

[Amethest]

okay sorry I couldnt read every single post, but I read more than half of them..One thing that struck me about the op statements...what does cussing have to do with being a criminal element? Just struck me as odd that it went from cussing around children to..cussing and being compared to a criminal? ya had my sympathy till that statement..sorry.

[Xdatinelia]

<cite>Fian wrote:</cite><blockquote>For those of you who think shielding a child from the world is wrong, tell me how your are raising your child. I hear so many people say that they are going to hear it anyway so why shield it. I say to you...At least I can say that they don't hear it while my wife and I are around. And, I have enough <b>respect for them</b> to try to keep them from hearing and seeing filth under our roof. I am not naive in thinking they aren't experiencing things in school but I am going to make sure I don't influence it. I think parents are failing in their parental duties to appear as the cool parent. Where I live, you see kids on dates at 12 years of age. I am sure that those of you that are of my generation (39) didn't see that at 12 years of age. And if you did, their parents were considered incompetent. Just my opinion</blockquote>My censorship of my daughter is listed in this thread in a previous post.  I still say it is the parent's responsibility to explain to the child right and wrong behavior, what is tolerated in your home as far as cussing, ect.  Of course supervise any child who you feel as a parent is ready for EQ2 but not ready to go it alone.  My 1st post on this subject also explains more... Putting the OP down is wrong, he/sh was prolly flustered on the night of the great crash and posted what s/he felt atm.  Maybe the OP has learned something from the constructive posts here, but turning this into a right/wrong, political, bashing thread is probally hurting his/her morale more than anything.

[Decad]

<p>Wow, an EULA discussion.... I may end up turning this into a bit of an OT discussion here. Reason being I had one of those horrendoudly boring days at work where all I COULD DO was surf the web.</p><p>So, I came across this article about this lawsuit going through the California courts between I believe one record label and an E-Bay seller that "sells" those promotional CDs. The Record label claims he can't sell them because the promotional CDs are leased out to people. The person being sued is making the contention that the CDs are in fact meant as gifts. </p><p>Basically I followed the case through several links via Google today, and in the end, a lot of bloggers (including 2 professional sounding software people) were making the contention that if the defendent wins, it could very well make all EULA's null and void. </p><p>Reason being, it would strengthen something called the "First Sale Law" I think it is. The reason it would affect EULAs is because software companies content that the software we buy has been leased to us, not sold.</p><p>Please don't take this as a "I hate EULAs." Just mentioning it because I was reading about it today, and saw this discussion bringing up the EULA. Trust me, I don't want to see a lot of the things that the EULA for this game does for us, such as hacking, player behavior issues, and such become way more prevalent.</p><p>EDIT: Forgot to add that the blogger I mentioned earlier said one way that the software companies could perhaps then get around EULA issues if the defendent wins is to make all software free on the physical end, and the user would have to "lease" the product. AKA, monthly fees. Would basically ruin that new idea that some MMORPG devs are running with in terms of buying the game, playing for free, and buying odd and end items.</p><p>Also, I'm in a bit of a rush to regoogle the links. If my computer's history hasn't been "cleaned" I'll post them tomorrow, as some of them were several pages deep in the google searches I did.</p>

[Leatherneck]

<cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Miss_Jackie wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Mawie@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>It isn't appropriate to swear around little children (that's a fair enough statement). </blockquote>Since when? My parents cursed in front me as a kid and I didn't grow up to be some kind of monster.</blockquote><p>It's great that you didn't turn out to be a monster or some sort of immoral person. But that has nothing to do with whether or not it is APPROPRIATE to curse in front of children.</p></blockquote><p>Firstly, swearing is agains the EULA so theres really no discussion to be had about it. Its not allowed in game. End.</p></blockquote>Exactly.  On a personal level, I don't have much concern one way or another about swearing.  What ticks me off is people who think they are too good for the rules.

[Caethre]

<p><span style="color: #ff6600;">OOC.</span></p><p><cite>Atelos@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Sony sets the rules for this game, and their rules specifically state the following:<b>Foul language is not permitted, in any language.Excessive use of foul language in an inappropriate context, including swear words, real-world racial slurs, and other language that is not consistent with the fantasy environment and designed to hurt, will be considered a disruption and will not be tolerated.</b> <b><u>The existence of the filter (/filter) is not a license to be profane.</u></b>It has nothing to do with the OP's values, aptitude, or any of the other derogatory comments...  The rules by which we have all agreed to abide specifically prohibit foul language.  That has nothing to do with the middle-ages, burning witches, or any of the other examples that you so crudely spewed out.</p><p>Foul language is prohibited by Sony.  End of story.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">Precisely.</span></p><p><cite>Dead Knight wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>This thread is dumb, what do you want SoE to do about it? Swearing is a part of life, deal with it.</blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">Yes, some of the responses on this thread are dumb, but not the way you mean. Swearing *is* prohibited in game by the rules <u>you </u>voluntarily agree to when you log in each day.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">As you said, deal with it.</span></p><p><cite>Leatherneck wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>What ticks me off is people who think they are too good for the rules.</blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">QFE.</span></p>

[liveja]

<blockquote><p><b><u>The existence of the filter (/filter) is not a license to be profane.</u></b></p></blockquote><p>I'm always amused by the people who think otherwise. </p><p>Sadly, those people are more common than they should be <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Dasein]

The TOS seems contradictory - is foul language prohibited entirely, or only excessive foul language inappropriate for a fantasy environment?

[liveja]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>The TOS seems contradictory - is foul language prohibited entirely, or only excessive foul language inappropriate for a fantasy environment? </blockquote>That depends entirely on which GM comes to moderate the chat channels.

[Gromph]

This was a hard one. I have never heard the term 'cuss' before.Looking it up gives: 'cuss = Common Use Self Service'. This doesn't make sense in this con text, however. After digging further it seems that cuss is some variant of swearing and cursing language. So the OP seem to find a certain part of the language inappropriate to use (for others). Please note that cussing is different from swearing and cursing, so cursing and swearing is not included in the OP complaint.Now what part of the language is included in cussing? Unfortunately this turns out to be difficult to define. (at least I couldn't find any definition). What people typically do in such cases (to save their face) is to give a list of examples and then expect that others should magically understand what is meant.What is particular interesting here is the first example on cussing that was given:         CONFOUND ITFew of us have managed to avoid observing that this phrase (cussing) is what some of the vendors/brokers in EQ2 is saying.Since some posters means that cussing is prohibited by the EULA, why are they not complaining that SONY is using such language in-game. Or are they? Have I missed that.(My daughter has read Inuyasha which is a long excercise in cussing/swearing/cursing, and she seem to be the same nice person as before. What the kids read/hear in EQ2 is probably polished compared to the schoolyard).

[Wiqd]

<p>Seriously ... PARENT your children. Don't censor them. Censoring never helped anyone, at any time. All it does it put them in a fantasy box, with the walls painted black, with a TV that doesn't turn on. You don't want your kids to swear? TEACH them. Don't want them to do drugs? TEACH them. Oh, and LISTEN to them too. It's not everyone elses' job to monitor YOUR child. </p><p>One more thing: "appropriate" is subjective. Yes I know what the EULA says and I agree to it. We go by what Sony deems as apppropriate, which could very well differ from any other single person out there.</p>

[Strums]

<cite>-.dE.- wrote:</cite><blockquote>zomg grow up sir, this is not hello kitty adventure island !</blockquote><p>lulz...best first post evah!!!</p>

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Strums wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>-.dE.- wrote:</cite><blockquote>zomg grow up sir, this is not hello kitty adventure island !</blockquote><p>lulz...best first post evah!!!</p></blockquote>-1

[Armawk]

<cite>Gromph wrote:</cite><blockquote>What is particular interesting here is the first example on cussing that was given:         CONFOUND ITFew of us have managed to avoid observing that this phrase (cussing) is what some of the vendors/brokers in EQ2 is saying.</blockquote>I might also mention that the specific phrase in question, as repeated perhaps 10000 times, has resulted in many a player informing their computer/cat/significant other where they would like to shove the aforementioned ledger, should ms cliffjumper ever find it.

[Finora]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p></blockquote><p>Now, I'm not going to defend cursing/cussing/swearing in game. Excessive use is definately against the EULA blah blah blah.</p><p>However, the /rude emote is in the game via SOE's choice and as such, does nothing to violate the EULA in any way. Just another of the things in game. Moon is there too if you look, moon your foes for a laugh after you make some rude gestures at them. The flirt is a bit lascivious for female characters. And there is alcohol in game as well as various criminal elements you do quests for. All part of the teen rating. If you find it inappropriate for your child, then don't buy the game for her.</p><p>To the child thing though, and this is the part that really bugged me about your post. Speaking as a mother myself, unless you lock your kid in the hall closet until she's 18, she's going to be exposed to some bad language, behavior and unsavory folks while she's growing up. That is life. If she's started school I can GUARENTEE she's already been exposed to all of that stuff. Some of the things they hear in school these days could make a sailor blush.  </p><p>I'm not going to condone the behavior of children while they are at school either, but that is where parents come in. If you teach your child it is rude and unnecessary to curse to get your point across, then they'll be less likely to do so, or at least will watch thier mouths when you are around. </p><p>Further more, people using foul language in the game are just as likely to be adults blowing off steam as they are to be kids bucking the system and fighting 'the man' by cursing and trying to be all tough. Either way it really doesn't reflect much on thier parents. Their parents could have been perfect examples of parenthood from your point of view and still had a child that cursed like there was no tomorrow. Some kids are rebellious and will do ANYTHING that they think the adults don't want them to do. As for the adults cursing, well they are adults, their parents don't really have much to say about what they can and cannot do anymore. If either element is overly offensive the only actions you can take in game are /report name, /ignore name and turning on your filter. From there it is up to the GM's to do what they do with people who are foul.</p>

[KBern]

<p>Wow a 9 page troll with only 2 posts to the OP's name.</p><p>Good job!</p>

[woolf2k]

I particularly don't like gratuatous cussing. There is a time and a place for it and over text chat it's generally not neccessary. however, PLEASE DON'T SHOVE YOUR KIDS IN MY FACE! if I wanted to play with children I'd play WoW. Most adults are child like enough imo.

[Laomie]

I would have to agree woolf2kI don't think kids have any business playing this game. If there are people out there that simply must have their kids playing this rather then out playing or playing something a bit more educational, fine turn the word filter on shut your pie holes and hope for the best.While your at it start a petition to have /moon and /rude taken out as well. Oh and don't forget to take away our freedom of speech too.So, be sure to keep your children away from me, I play an adult game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Mawie]

<cite>Laomie wrote:</cite><blockquote>Oh and don't forget to take away our freedom of speech too.</blockquote>Not that I give two hoots what people say, but you really don't have freedom of speech when in the game. SOE can pretty much ban you for whatever reason they want.

[tass]

lol unless ur a spammer

[Tokam]

<p>Yep banal feckless banter would be about the only thing that Gnobrin tolerates, somewhat like this thread in fact.</p><p><span style="font-size: xx-small;color: #ffcc00;">edit: name spelling</span></p>

[Wingrider01]

<cite>Laomie wrote:</cite><blockquote>I would have to agree woolf2kI don't think kids have any business playing this game. If there are people out there that simply must have their kids playing this rather then out playing or playing something a bit more educational, fine turn the word filter on shut your pie holes and hope for the best.While your at it start a petition to have /moon and /rude taken out as well. Oh and don't forget to take away our freedom of speech too.So, be sure to keep your children away from me, I play an adult game <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote><p>1. It is not only childern that are affected by your vulgarity, older players can and do find vulgarity offensive</p><p>2. please utilize google to research what freedom of speech entails -  basicly this is a provate subscription based environment - freedom of speech does not apply at all. There are other things that also pertain to this, but google will give you the information needed.</p><p>3. If you want to utilize vulgarity in a situation that it specificly states it is not allowed - then if someone - be it adult or child takes offense and passes it on the the local authorituies, then deal with the results.</p><p>4. Actually if you look at the ESRB rating for the game - you do not play an "adult game", if you did thie rating would be set higher.</p>

[liveja]

<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>2. please utilize google to research what freedom of speech entails -  basicly this is a provate subscription based environment - freedom of speech does not apply at all. </p></blockquote><p>QFE.</p><p>& I'm one of those older people who thinks gratuitous cursing is a sign of immaturity, a poor vocabulary, or both.</p>

[jarlaxle8]

<p>Seriously, a 10 page thread? For this?</p><p>Let me make it short and clear. The game is rated T for teen. From Wikipedia:</p><p> <b>T</b> - <b>Teen</b>: Contains content that is considered suitable for ages 13 and older. Titles in this category may contain violence, suggestive themes, crude humor, minimal blood, simulated gambling, and/or infrequent use of strong language.</p><p>See that? I won't go into the killing and stuff, just this: <b>infrequent use of strong language.</b></p><p>If someone swears too much in general chat, then ok I see some merit in the complaint. In the TOS it's mentioned as well: '<b>Excessive</b> use of foul language in an inappropriate context...' (note that it says excessive).But I personally never encountered this and if someone has an issue with an occasianal f-word or other words (not used in a way to attack someone personally of course), then I think that person should just shove off and play something else.</p>

[Leatherneck]

<cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>2. please utilize google to research what freedom of speech entails -  basicly this is a provate subscription based environment - freedom of speech does not apply at all. </p></blockquote><p>QFE.</p><p>& I'm one of those older people who thinks gratuitous cursing is a sign of immaturity, a poor vocabulary, or both.</p></blockquote>It always amuses me how people think their right to freedom of speech is "granted" in a private forum.

[tass]

well since this is the.... I cant believe this thread is still here. I make a thread about some kind of malware bug being in this website and its moved in less than a minute flat.So anyway the threads basically moved into spam. So heres my interesting spam. enjoy.<h3>DO NOT GO GENTLE INTO THAT GOOD NIGHT</h3> <blockquote><blockquote><span style="font-size: medium;"> Do not go gentle into that good night, Old age should burn and rave at close of day; Rage, rage against the dying of the light. </span><p><span style="font-size: medium;">Though wise men at their end know dark is right, Because their words had forked no lightning they Do not go gentle into that good night. </span></p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay, Rage, rage against the dying of the light. </span></p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight, And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way, Do not go gentle into that good night. </span></p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be [Removed for Content], Rage, rage against the dying of the light. </span></p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">And you, my father, there on the sad height, Curse, bless me now with your fierce tears, I pray. Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light. </span> </p></blockquote></blockquote>Oh ya and this is freedon of speech ..I..Flip the bird to everyone and everything. The border patrol, the state troopers as ur trying to outrun them, the bank manager, the kids in the street, the kid you just smacked in the head with ur side mirror on a bike for being in the road, The IRS, The old lady across the street, the dev in game right before he bans you lol. Flip em all off and know that if they dont have some kind of road rage where it turns into who can aim faster you win.

[Eddes]

<p>I just choose to ignore most conversations that are upsetting - and theres Always the ever so lovely <i>/ignore dumbarse</i> feature! <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />  My daughter plays around with low lvl characters and shes much younger than the suggested age.  She could care less what would be going on in chat - I've also taken the liberty to turn off her main chat tab anyways.  She doesnt care she just wants to run around with her fairy and see what neat drops she can get.  </p><p>Also with the gestures & socials - those have always been around from what i understand.  Some are funny if cued at the right time when your grouping with guildies or friends.   Theyve never been that offensive to me, and much of the same ones you can find on the Cartoon network or local primetime shows around 5-6pm anyways.  No more family TV during dinner time!  </p><p>The roleplaying aspect of the game i think would be damaged if everyone dampered down everything to be peaches and cream for everyone.  How can you RP a evil dark elf effectively while your wondering around in TS or EL when you can only /wave /dance or /blowkiss?  Or is that inappropriate also?   </p><p>Im in no way trying to say that someone is wrong or rude, i get repulsed by some conversations also that go on but i just choose not to read - or cue in the occansional "next subject already - no one wants to hear that!"</p>

[mellowknees72]

No matter what anyone thinks about "cursing" and/or "vulgarity", try and remember: THEY'RE JUST WORDS.

[Saihung23]

<p>I used to actively tell people in Heritage chat that they should not curse...children are apt to see it.  I would be bullied sort of, and told in a million different ways...turn on the profanity filter if I didn't like it.</p><p>The problem is...I am an adult, I am okay with someone cursing in front of me. So, I am not going to turn off the profanity filter.</p><p>I used to love the banter...or discussions...not that I ever followed their logic about why cursing in such a public chat was okay.</p><p>I never reported anyone...I don't think...at least not on purpose...lol.</p><p>I loved doing this though...when someone would get really insulting to another person or be cursing like a madman in public chat channels...</p><p>I would type a /report soandso's name in the chat channel.  They would either get really irked or suddenly become very very polite.</p><p>meh, with kids and immature adults you are always going to be dealing with this...don't get too flustered over it I say.  At least don't stress.</p>

[Dagorgil]

<cite>firestorck wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>i'm getting sick of folks who think it is either "kewl" or grownup to cuss. that or they pull the"there is a bad word filter" bit. as well as sayings, macro's/emotes that are crude in actions</p><p>thing is. it dont matter . all those who cuss are forgetting that when they agreed to accept the EULA in order to get into the game. that they agree not to cuss.</p><p>i would love to have my daughter when she gets old enough to play both EQ's. but due to the immature behavivior of some of the other players. i dont want her exposed to their bad habits. i dont need her growing up to think that the need to cuss and being proud of being criminal types is a good thing.</p><p>makes me wonder if the ones who are not behaving. where their parents went wrong in raising them. </p><p><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>You just completely contradicted yourself in the same post.</p><p>If you are raising your daughter to be a good person, then why should it matter what other people do?  If other people think it's cool to cuss and act "grown up," that's their own problem.  What other people do shouldn't have any impact on your daughter other than her thinking "Dude, that guy's a d**k."  If you don't want her seeing or hearing bad words, then maybe you should lock her up in her room with no radio, no tv, no phone, and no computer.  You might as well homeschool her too.  You know, the world is bad, and people can't make up their own minds whether they want to cuss or not.  You have to control your kids and everything they do or say, or they will go to Hell! OMG!!!</p><p>Seriously... If your daughter's not a sheep, then you shouldn't worry about her picking up any bad habits.  People cuss everywhere, and you can't expect to shield her from every Tom, Harry, and Sally out there.</p>

[Ama]

<cite>Mawie@Mistmoore wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Laomie wrote:</cite><blockquote>Oh and don't forget to take away our freedom of speech too.</blockquote>Not that I give two hoots what people say, but you really don't have freedom of speech when in the game. <b>SOE can pretty much ban you for whatever reason they want.</b></blockquote><p>Yup</p><p>It also depends upon what CSR/GM you get with that petition.  Some really don't give a flying *bleep* about what you say and will just write it off.  Others maybe more action proned talking to the player, asking what is wrong, how can they help, etc... .  The most strict of CSR/GMs will suspend the player on the spot and consider it taken care of. </p><p>Had a guildmate suspended for a week because of "Innapropriate language".  He's keeping his mouth shout now barely speaking in chat channels cause some nut job reported him.  When it comes to cursing people really need to get a life and just flip on the profanity filter.  </p><p>In our guild we keep swearing PG-13, but do cross into the R area at times.  Very rarely if ever do we have to tell a guildmate to tone it down because the swearing is getting out of hand.  </p><p>The world of the 1900-1950's with people saying "Darn, Dang, Shoot, etc..." is dying off rapidly.  </p>

[steelbadger]

Of the many things people complain about in eq2, this one has to come under my "huh?" category, unfortunately. As soon as a child goes to school they are surrounded by massive numbers of peers who all think it appropriate to use "bad" language. Maybe parents don't notice it as much, but as a University student for whom school was not so long ago I can say that children above the age of 6 or so know 90% of the bad words out there. And use them. You cannot protect them from swearwords by prohibiting them in EQ2, thats like putting up an umbrella in a hurricane, indeed prohibition is one of the reasons why it is seen as "kewl". Swearwords are part of society, hence they are part of eq2, you must learn to deal with it as best you can.

[Leatherneck]

<cite>Pipes@Najena wrote:</cite><blockquote>No matter what anyone thinks about "cursing" and/or "vulgarity", try and remember:THEY'RE JUST WORDS.</blockquote><p>So is the Magna Carta.  So is the Declaration of Independance.  So is hate speech.</p><p>It's the meaning behind the words that make them more than words themselves.  The sum is greater than the parts.</p>

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Algazeed@Runnyeye wrote:</cite><blockquote>Of the many things people complain about in eq2, this one has to come under my "huh?" category, unfortunately.As soon as a child goes to school they are surrounded by massive numbers of peers who all think it appropriate to use "bad" language. Maybe parents don't notice it as much, but as a University student for whom school was not so long ago I can say that children above the age of 6 or so know 90% of the bad words out there. And use them. You cannot protect them from swearwords by prohibiting them in EQ2, thats like putting up an umbrella in a hurricane, indeed prohibition is one of the reasons why it is seen as "kewl".Swearwords are part of society, hence they are part of eq2, you must learn to deal with it as best you can.</blockquote>When you get older, you may gain the maturity to see that swearing is a limiter.

[Wargod1968]

<cite>Pipes@Najena wrote:</cite><blockquote>No matter what anyone thinks about "cursing" and/or "vulgarity", try and remember:THEY'RE JUST WORDS.</blockquote><p>I suggest you put your theory into practice. Next time you see your mother greet her with a warm "F%$# you, mom."</p><p>Then, when you arrive for work in the morning, make sure you tell your boss "A F'n good morning, isn't it?"</p><p>And if you ever get into a supervisory role, make sure to tell your subordinate at their performance review "Your performance was really sh*!!y this year."</p><p>Everyone will love you for it, because, as you say, they are just words.</p>

[Armawk]

<cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I suggest you put your theory into practice. Next time you see your mother greet her with a warm "F%$# you, mom."</p><p>Then, when you arrive for work in the morning, make sure you tell your boss "A F'n good morning, isn't it?"</p><p>And if you ever get into a supervisory role, make sure to tell your subordinate at their performance review "Your performance was really sh*!!y this year."</p></blockquote>Thats what we call "Monday"

[Crisila]

<p>Well as it goes this world revolves around "what I want and not what is respectful to others". I had an issue with a player who was cussing in and out of groups, and I hear from the guild he is as well.  I have tried to talk with this person and to no extent he pretty much ignores what I have to say and keeps on cussing. This game was meant for fun and not for torment from other language. We should all learn to watch our mouth here in the game as it may be your kid who is on. If I am thinking right this could constitute as online harassment and who knows someone my file charges, Myself would not do this I just do a /ignore (username) and that helps. But it does not help others. I feel the person should be kicked from the game and if they get another account so be it, but sooner or later they will get tired of getting kicked and may not come back. Again this is all just my opinion, not a fact other than I have been harassed buy people like this</p><p>Later</p>

[Eddes]

<cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I suggest you put your theory into practice. Next time you see your mother greet her with a warm "F%$# you, mom."</p><p>Then, when you arrive for work in the morning, make sure you tell your boss "A F'n good morning, isn't it?"</p><p>And if you ever get into a supervisory role, make sure to tell your subordinate at their performance review "Your performance was really sh*!!y this year."</p></blockquote>Thats what we call "Monday"</blockquote>LOL oh yes....it IS indeed what we call F*&(#$ Mondays.  Free coffee and baileys for all.

[simpwrx02]

<cite>Corvina@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Pipes@Najena wrote:</cite><blockquote>No matter what anyone thinks about "cursing" and/or "vulgarity", try and remember:THEY'RE JUST WORDS.</blockquote><p>I suggest you put your theory into practice. Next time you see your mother greet her with a warm "F%$# you, mom."</p><p>Then, when you arrive for work in the morning, make sure you tell your boss "A F'n good morning, isn't it?"</p><p>And if you ever get into a supervisory role, make sure to tell your subordinate at their performance review "Your performance was really sh*!!y this year."</p><p>Everyone will love you for it, because, as you say, they are just words.</p></blockquote><p>Why are you trying to combine formal and casual into one.  If i go to work and speak to my boss in the office, sure I will not use profanity most of the time, it may slip out , but I make a complete effort to not use it.  If I am joking around with some one at work in a casual manner then I may or may not cuss as I am not really watching what I say as it dosent matter.  </p><p>Point I am making is that EQ2 is not a formal setting, it is a time where you shoudl be able to relax and not worry about all the little PC issue you have to deal with at work, hence if a few bad words slip out, let it go.  If you have a child playing with you then inform the group to try to be nice as there is a youngster involved, 95% of the people will make a concious attempt to not use foul words.</p><p>However stuff slips sometimes and that is the point of the filter, also many cuss words are used to emphisize a point and do so in a way that most understand.  Now if someone is droppig the F bomb in every way possibel to use the word aka noun, adjative, verb. etc  it is more than likely either a teenager or a person with a very limited vocabulary, get over it it is easy to type /ignore and problem solved by using the tools that SoE gave you to deal with small cases like that.  </p><p>And kicking some one from the game is totally excessive imho because they use cuss words, seriously online harassment.  If you are that offended by cuss words you need to out of your little box you live in and explore the hate filled violent world we live in.  Now if the person is threatening you with actual physical harm then sure I can see that as harassment, but just from cuss word, open your eyes, we do not live in Candy Land.  </p><p>If you are concerned about what your child reads while playing EQ2, then your child is probably to young to be playing the game as it involves large scale killings of animlas and humaniod forms.  I do love the people who use children as an ecuse to push thier own agenda's aka KILLING IS OKAY just dont say any bad words.  </p>

[StormCinder]

<p>Been playing since Spring '05.  I have noticed an increase in the number of /ignores I have to apply each night.  </p><p>Used to be could go weeks without one.  Nowadays, it's about 1-2/session.  And at least once a week I have to turn off an entire channel.</p><p>The community is evolving/devolving.</p><p>SC</p>

[Leatherneck]

<cite>Eddessa wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wargod1968 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I suggest you put your theory into practice. Next time you see your mother greet her with a warm "F%$# you, mom."</p><p>Then, when you arrive for work in the morning, make sure you tell your boss "A F'n good morning, isn't it?"</p><p>And if you ever get into a supervisory role, make sure to tell your subordinate at their performance review "Your performance was really sh*!!y this year."</p></blockquote>Thats what we call "Monday"</blockquote>LOL oh yes....it IS indeed what we call F*&(#$ Mondays. <b> Free coffee and baileys for all.</b></blockquote>Apparently I have the wrong job.

[Kendricke]

<cite>simpwrx02 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Why are you trying to combine formal and casual into one.  If i go to work and speak to my boss in the office, sure I will not use profanity most of the time, it may slip out , but I make a complete effort to not use it.  If I am joking around with some one at work in a casual manner then I may or may not cuss as I am not really watching what I say as it dosent matter.  </p><p>Point I am making is that EQ2 is not a formal setting, it is a time where you shoudl be able to relax and not worry about all the little PC issue you have to deal with at work, hence if a few bad words slip out, let it go.  If you have a child playing with you then inform the group to try to be nice as there is a youngster involved, 95% of the people will make a concious attempt to not use foul words.</p></blockquote><p>See, that's where you and I disagree as well.  If I go to a casual sushi resturaunt and sit down at the bar and start using any old language I please when I speak with the server, the chefs, and the people around me, there's a good chance I'll find myself asked to leave - children or not.  </p><p>It's not exactly a formal setting, and it's not exactly what I'd call a family establishment, but it is mixed company and generally speaking, I tend to watch my language when I'm in mixed company.  It's just socially courteous behavior.</p><p>Now, if you want to join a group of people you know, feel free to cut loose.  If your guild is fine with it, again - say whatever you want.  I consider those to be private channels, where everyone basically knows everyone - just as if you wandered into your neighborhood bar or you've all met at a friend's house.  </p><p>But the moment you start spouting off into a public channel within my earshot, it's liable to offend me.  Is it offensive to me because I'm thinking of the children?  Not in the least - I'm not a child, nor would I be offended for someone else's benefit.  Is it offensive to me because I consider myself perhaps a bit more genteel than the average person, or because I've had a strict upbringing and would never deign to use such vulgarity myself?  Absolutely not - anyone who's spoken with me for longer than 5 minutes at a FanFaire (especially when drinking's involved) will probably learn a few new combinations of words that probably shouldn't have been uttered in the light of day.  Is it because it's a computer game and *gasp* I don't like to play games that depict gore or nasty language?  Not in the least - I'm enjoying Bioshock quite a bit right now, and wouldn't have considered making the game even the least bit less violent or gratiutious in use of language (Frankly, they could have cranked it up a bit, so far as I'm concerned).</p><p>No, I just don't like the language in Everquest 2.  I bought the game with certain expectations.  I agreed to the same rules of conduct that everyone else agreed to.  When I join public channels, I tend to expect that everyone else adhere to the same general rules of restraint that I agreed to.  I tone down my own language, and easily slip into my game personas as I play.  It's fun for me to immerse myself in the game.  The occasional slip of the tongue isn't likely to garner too much of my attention, especially if it's used contextually.  However, if I join OOC or Shout and start seeing profanity with every other sentence, I'll likely fire off a report and a petition.</p><p>To me, it catches my eye and tends to annoy me while I'm playing.  That's it, really.  It's not a freedom of speech issue with me, because I accept that the company running the server has the right to impose their own rules of conduct on what is and is not acceptable and I have the right to agree or not.  I agreed.  So did you.  So over and above the annoyance of the language itself, I'm not dealing with the additional annoyance of seeing someone who feels that the rules we all agreed to don't apply to them.</p><p>It's not about whether or not I personally care about the words, or whether or not I personally use the words.  It's about knowing the time and the place.  It's about knowing the difference between public and private speech.  It's about personal responsibility and avoiding dual standards.  It's about not caring to deal with it from people I don't know or necessarily care to know.  </p><p>I won't argue or belabor the point, and certainly won't deal with it in public channels.  I'll report it, petition it, and then place the offender on ignore if it bothers me that much.  Frankly, I don't want to spend time on it - hence the reason for the petition in the first place.  I'd rather let someone who's paid to deal with it actually do so.  I've got a dungeon to run or a new priest deck to build.  </p>

[StormCinder]

<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>simpwrx02 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Why are you trying to combine formal and casual into one.  If i go to work and speak to my boss in the office, sure I will not use profanity most of the time, it may slip out , but I make a complete effort to not use it.  If I am joking around with some one at work in a casual manner then I may or may not cuss as I am not really watching what I say as it dosent matter.  </p><p>Point I am making is that EQ2 is not a formal setting, it is a time where you shoudl be able to relax and not worry about all the little PC issue you have to deal with at work, hence if a few bad words slip out, let it go.  If you have a child playing with you then inform the group to try to be nice as there is a youngster involved, 95% of the people will make a concious attempt to not use foul words.</p></blockquote><p>See, that's where you and I disagree as well.  If I go to a casual sushi resturaunt and sit down at the bar and start using any old language I please when I speak with the server, the chefs, and the people around me, there's a good chance I'll find myself asked to leave - children or not.  </p><p>It's not exactly a formal setting, and it's not exactly what I'd call a family establishment, but it is mixed company and generally speaking, I tend to watch my language when I'm in mixed company.  It's just socially courteous behavior.</p><p>Now, if you want to join a group of people you know, feel free to cut loose.  If your guild is fine with it, again - say whatever you want.  I consider those to be private channels, where everyone basically knows everyone - just as if you wandered into your neighborhood bar or you've all met at a friend's house.  </p><p>But the moment you start spouting off into a public channel within my earshot, it's liable to offend me.  Is it offensive to me because I'm thinking of the children?  Not in the least - I'm not a child, nor would I be offended for someone else's benefit.  Is it offensive to me because I consider myself perhaps a bit more genteel than the average person, or because I've had a strict upbringing and would never deign to use such vulgarity myself?  Absolutely not - anyone who's spoken with me for longer than 5 minutes at a FanFaire (especially when drinking's involved) will probably learn a few new combinations of words that probably shouldn't have been uttered in the light of day.  Is it because it's a computer game and *gasp* I don't like to play games that depict gore or nasty language?  Not in the least - I'm enjoying Bioshock quite a bit right now, and wouldn't have considered making the game even the least bit less violent or gratiutious in use of language (Frankly, they could have cranked it up a bit, so far as I'm concerned).</p><p>No, I just don't like the language in Everquest 2.  I bought the game with certain expectations.  I agreed to the same rules of conduct that everyone else agreed to.  When I join public channels, I tend to expect that everyone else adhere to the same general rules of restraint that I agreed to.  I tone down my own language, and easily slip into my game personas as I play.  It's fun for me to immerse myself in the game.  The occasional slip of the tongue isn't likely to garner too much of my attention, especially if it's used contextually.  However, if I join OOC or Shout and start seeing profanity with every other sentence, I'll likely fire off a report and a petition.</p><p>To me, it catches my eye and tends to annoy me while I'm playing.  That's it, really.  It's not a freedom of speech issue with me, because I accept that the company running the server has the right to impose their own rules of conduct on what is and is not acceptable and I have the right to agree or not.  I agreed.  So did you.  So over and above the annoyance of the language itself, I'm not dealing with the additional annoyance of seeing someone who feels that the rules we all agreed to don't apply to them.</p><p>It's not about whether or not I personally care about the words, or whether or not I personally use the words.  It's about knowing the time and the place.  It's about knowing the difference between public and private speech.  It's about personal responsibility and avoiding dual standards.  It's about not caring to deal with it from people I don't know or necessarily care to know.  </p><p>I won't argue or belabor the point, and certainly won't deal with it in public channels.  I'll report it, petition it, and then place the offender on ignore if it bothers me that much.  Frankly, I don't want to spend time on it - hence the reason for the petition in the first place.  I'd rather let someone who's paid to deal with it actually do so.  I've got a dungeon to run or a new priest deck to build.  </p></blockquote><p>Well $^&#!@ said.</p><p>SC</p>

[Magiocracy]

Yup, Kendricke pretty much hit the nail on the head here - trying to make artificial distinctions between formal and informal settings is simply trying to avoid the issue. The bottom line is that the EULA forbids excessive swearing. Don't like what the EULA says ? Then don't play the game.From my own point of view I have no moral problems at all with swearing per se (as opposed to the use of deliberatley offensive racial/religous slurs etc etc), what annoys me is the poverty of imagination of people who's total vocabulary seems to extend to about three or four swear words (all in CAPS of course). Incidentally, I'd say that the use of 'internetspeak' annoys me probably more (you know the sort, the person who is only capable of making 'sentences' out of the following three 'words' - S-T-F-U/Noob/lol) than swearing does, but that's another argument.Unfortunately, the sad truth is that unless the public channels are actively policed and the EULA actually enforced (which will never happen), the loudest and most obnoxious brats will always rule the proverbial roost.

[liveja]

<cite>simpwrx02 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Point I am making is that EQ2 is not a formal setting</p></blockquote><p>Neither is my house, but if I invite you over, & you begin filling the air with noxious words just because, you know, it's an "informal setting", you'll be out the door in a heart-beat.</p><p>EQ2 is SOE's house, & they set the rules, & those of us they allow into their house either respect & follow those rules, or don't & find somewhere else to play.</p><p>I fail to see why people are still arguing this point. SOE sets the rules against plat-selling, & people by & large support them on that rule, so why people see fit to violate SOE's rule on cursing is beyond me.</p>

[Despak]

Unfortunately the game is polluted by alot of brainless idiots that think being able to type four letters in an amusing fashion and break the EULA at the same time, may help their balls actually begin to drop.