Suggestions for new item: Surcoats and?

[Armawk]

<p>Given we have now got fluff armour slots (like them or no) I started to think of ways they might be used to do something actually interesting and improving to the roleplaying aspects of the game.</p><p>I have two initial ideas, which I think are eminently practical for inclusion in something like an addon.</p><p>Idea 1: Surcoats. This would be a chest only armour item, cloth with no stats but requiring guild membership of a certain level to purchase it. It would cover the chest area with a plain white/red/blue/yellow/green/grey/black cloth overshirt (basic colour tied to the item purchased), which would have guild insignia/colours applied to it in the same way that it is applied to a cloak at present. Availability of these could be tied to the purchase of one of the new guild halls, the item itself being very cheap so that all guild members of a guild who had a hall could have one. I think this item could be universally loved and become a real status symbol!</p><p>Idea 2: Voluminous overcloak. This would be no more than a modified cloth robe, with a hood and arms.. but designed to give a very clear appearance of a cloack that is covering whatever else is currently being worn. They would primarily be black/grey/brown, and expensive versions could come with some enhanced stealth ability or the like. These could be immensely popular with assassins or other secretive characters.</p><p>Shaun</p>

[Hikinami]

I like those.

[Leatherneck]

<p>I'd like to see Shield covers with the guild heraldry.</p><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.medieval-weapons-online.com/large-G-GMI-SH805-GL.htm" target="_blank">Example  </a></p><p>I'd like to see lance pennants (basically any spear).</p><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.warpaint.biz/shop/images/articles/editor/lance%20pennant%20close%20up.jpg" target="_blank">Example</a>  </p><p>I'd LOVE to see PERSONAL heraldry.  (Guild heraldry/Personal heraldry as a choice on shields, cloaks, pennants, etc).  You'd be able, for example, to have the guild heraldry on your cloak and personal heraldry on your shield.</p><p>I'd love to see a coat-of-arms house item with guild or personal heraldry.</p><p>Edit***  When I say Lance Pennants, I mean heraldric (guild colors, etc).</p>

[Armawk]

<p>Id love personal heraldry, available to buy from a special merchant just like the guild heraldry designer (non guilded could however buy it also), it would use the same mechanisms as guild heraldry and cost a big pile of status/faction to get (thereby making it a status symbol, but one you can wear all the time) </p><p>Who honestly wouldnt get something like that?</p>

[StrafaeSwiftleaf]

Would love to see paladins and SK's duke it out with surcoats on :p

[Zard]

<p>The overcloak sounds awesome too but I imagine the demands on a video card for simulating that much cloth, especially if it flowed properly, would encourage many people to disable that graphics option; assuming it was an option.</p>

[LordPazuzu]

I like the idea of surcoats or tabards with personal or guild heraldry on them.  The same with sheilds.  We can already do it on cloaks.  The guild tabard and guild sheilds were some of the best parts of WoW and DAoC respectively.

[FireDragon]

I think i would like to see some things more simple:Scabbards (and a choice for wether you want them at your sides or on your back)/bow option, to show your bow instead of your swords.a /lie option, to lie downAnd a choice of sanding poses. Oh, and new dances.. i hate EQ's dance.

[Gondwana]

<p>it sure would be awesome with some more guild colors showing, especially like the shield idea, </p><p>but then again i am a tank, i would be crazy not to like that idea</p>

[Seidhkona]

<span style="color: #33ccff;"><b>The OP asked me if I'd reproduce <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=500&topic_id=379858#4307279" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">my earlier post</a> from the thread on fluff appearance items in the <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/forums/show.m?forum_id=748" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">In Testing Feedback</a> forum, so here ya go...</b></span><span class="postbody"><span style="color: #33ccff;"><b>(<i>Click on these to see a full-size version for detail!</i>)1330 - warrior wearing surcote <a rel="nofollow" href="http://home.arcor.de/mustangace/sca_class_heraldicdisplay26.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://home.arcor.de/mustangace/sca_class_heraldicdisplay26.jpg" border="0" alt="" height="250" /></a> 1300s - <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml" target="_blank">Manesse Codex</a> - chain-wearing knights in more surcotes (and, by the way, all these knights are poets, so troubs and dirges take heed) <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/img/025.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.manesse.de/img/025.jpg" border="0" alt="" height="250" /></a> 1300s - <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml" target="_blank">Manesse Codex</a> - can't even see this knight's armor, it's so well covered <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/img/044.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.manesse.de/img/044.jpg" border="0" alt="" height="250" /></a> 1300s - More <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml" target="_blank">Manesse Codex</a>, but look at the bucklers, these fellows must be zerkers! <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/img/062.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.manesse.de/img/062.jpg" border="0" alt="" height="250" /></a> 1300s - Still More <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml" target="_blank">Manesse Codex</a>, and this knight is wearing a woman in a dress, on his head! <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/img/077.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.manesse.de/img/077.jpg" border="0" alt="" height="250" /></a> 1563 - Surcote over plate <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.sca.org.au/st_florians/university/library/articles-howtos/heraldry/HeraldicFrocksS_files/image075.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.sca.org.au/st_florians/university/library/articles-howtos/heraldry/HeraldicFrocksS_files/image075.jpg" border="0" alt="" height="250" /></a></b></span></span>

[Armawk]

<p>Great pictures.. Im working on some 3D models of knights etc at the moment and original material always gives me a big morale and interest boost (not to say some nice links for reference)</p><p>Im not sure what you mean about troubadors though? Essentially all knights were (in a very narrow time/space frame) poets and singers in theory, though more pragmatic fact has those poet warriors as more of a figment of the imagination of early romance's authors than the real lives of these often full time soldiers. Certainly thats nothing to do with troubadors in any sense of the word though!</p><p>Troubadors and minstrels throughout the middle ages were merely performing singers and players, and often itinerant. The idea of them as a class of 'rogue' merely comes from a common default association of them, like any other itinerant group, with vagabonds and thieves.. by any logic they ought to be cloth wearing people with the lightest of weapons such as daggers for protection/casual brigandry.</p><p>The (interesting) version used in everquest 2 is a pure construction of the developers.</p>

[Mirander_1]

It'd be a relatively minor addition, but how about making graphics for belts?  It's not as big a change as tabards and the like, but it would be a little extra added diversity; and frankly, some sets of armor kinda look like they need a belt graphic on them.

[Seidhkona]

<cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Im not sure what you mean about troubadors though?</p></blockquote><span style="color: #3399ff;"><b>The Manesse Codex very specifically represents the love songs of about 140 <i>Minnesänger</i>, the High German adaptation of the Provençal troubadour tradition. The items in the codes are in order of social rank, starting with the poet-rulers such as the Holy Roman Emperor Henry VI, and King Conradin, and so on down through dukes, counts, knights. So in this specific case, these troubadours are knights, though there are some commoners in the lot also.You can find a complete set of the illustrations from the Codex at <a href="http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml</a>Personally, I would like to have helm crests, like the elaborate ones in the Manesse Codex. There are also tons of helm crests shown in the <a href="http://www.vikinganswerlady.com/ZurichRoll/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Zurich Roll</a>.</b></span>

[Armawk]

<cite>Seidhkona wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Im not sure what you mean about troubadors though?</p></blockquote><span style="color: #3399ff;"><b>The Manesse Codex very specifically represents the love songs of about 140 <i>Minnesänger</i>, the High German adaptation of the Provençal troubadour tradition. The items in the codes are in order of social rank, starting with the poet-rulers such as the Holy Roman Emperor Henry VI, and King Conradin, and so on down through dukes, counts, knights. So in this specific case, these troubadours are knights, though there are some commoners in the lot also.You can find a complete set of the illustrations from the Codex at <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml" target="_blank">http://www.manesse.de/manesse0-9.shtml</a>Personally, I would like to have helm crests, like the elaborate ones in the Manesse Codex. There are also tons of helm crests shown in the <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.vikinganswerlady.com/ZurichRoll/" target="_blank">Zurich Roll</a>.</b></span></blockquote><p>Knight as wandering minstrel/troubador for hire is unthinkable though, and you would agree thats the archetype we are dealing with in everquest 2? Them being classed with the "rogues" and all? The courtly poem/song writing ideal is a long way from a troubador in the sense we use it. Its also not a word I think was applied at the time either (or not twice at any rate), for all that they did like their love songs.</p><p>helm crests I love.. I think most people not given to reading old material would find the reality more unbelievable than made up ones though, people had some seriously strange stuff on their heads, as you evidently know!</p>

[Tae]

I think before adding more items that guild heraldry can be displayed on, they need to add more guild heraldry. In Shadowbane, there were so many choices for crests and colours that I never saw some of the choices that were there. They had a good 150 different emblems to pick. In EQ2 there's about 20, and they're all rather dull. When I was in The Rat Pack we never picked a guild cloak simply because there weren't any good emblems to fit the guild. Perhaps SoE should give us a bit more choice, first.

[Lilj]

A surcoat can look rather cool on top of a plate armor or perhaps chain armor, but I can't really imagine them on leather armor or cloth.I can see most people in this thread are talking about knights, and EQ2 has a lot of people/classes that are not knightly. So is this suggestion mostly for plate or chain users, or do you have ideas for leather and cloth users also?

[Zabjade]

<p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Monk alt idea for the Surcoat, the <a href="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/43/Genova-Poncho.jpg" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Poncho</a>!</span></p>

[Armawk]

<p>Well, the short surcoat/tabard would be applicable over all other clothing, as a very hasty look at a google search will illustrate. Its just an identifying overshirt or apron after all. The more flowing full length surcoat is perhaps more of a knightly thing indeed.</p><p>And naturally an overrobe is just an all encompassing robe, which would include such as monkly garb (a simple brown robe with a rope belt would be a nice choice for healers and some paladin types) </p>