Sonic Fists stealth change...

[Cocytus]

<p>This skill no longer teleports you to your target and back to where you were standing. It's now basically just a really long range punch.</p><p>Not cool, IMO. I loved using Sonic Fists + Drag to split mobs in raids when need  be, or to drag the really slow mobs to me faster in Unrest.</p><p>Why did they take the teleport out? It's still in the description....</p><p>Oversight maybe?</p>

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

This had better be a mistake. Why would you need to change this? It eliminates a whole avenue of Utility, and TRUE utility.. not some buff bot crap.Please, please, please fix this before it goes live. I do not want my paltry utility stripped away.And along with that, could you make sure that Callous Stomp's description does extra damage when the target is knocked down, as well as freeing up Mez and Fear so I don't lose an ability compared to our Monk counterparts? Seriously.. it feels like any little piece of ability that would give some kind of utility or require the slightest thinking involved is being stripped away.These were the things that made us more than just button mashers in combat... please don't do this to Bruisers.

[Cocytus]

<p>Bruisers did receive a small amount of utility update. The "Rabid Cry/Brutality" line is no longer a dps mod. At master 1, Rabid Cry adds 90 to all combat arts.</p><p>Regardless of this, I really think the change to Sonic Fists is uncool. It's honestly one of the two skills I refuse to betray to monk over because they lack them. (The other is Close Mind)</p>

[tt66]

Oh you're kidding me. <b>Another </b>stealth change? So, since we still haven't had an answer about callous stomp or the fear/mez change..  should we start complaining now?Although. There are many times when sonic fists doesn't quite work and we don't teleport at the moment. Normally involving stairs or slopes. So it's possible the OP just had a bad run of luck. But given the amount of sense previous stealth changes have made, I'm not holding out much hope..(The rabid cry change sounds interesting, tho)

[Zarafein]

Oh it(rabbid cry) sounds really nice imo, but btw callous stomp is still bugged on test server(no additional damage listed).

[Novusod]

The old <span class="postbody">Callous Stomp to me was a broken mechanic. You could get additional damage by knocking a mob down before using Callous Stomp. This was great for solo'ing but provided less benefit in raids because epics could never be knocked down and you could never get the additional damage bonus when it was really needed. Overall the whole bruiser class is broken. It is the only class that is more powerfull as a solo'er than as a raider. All these abilities that are radically overpowed in a solo context but get reduced use in raids need to go. This includes: Sonic Fists, Callous Stomp, Devistation Fist, Closed Mind, and the king of all radical abilities Feign Death. All this is detrimental to the class and needs to be, nerfed, changed, or done away with entirely because it is Unacceptable to design a class around avoiding other players in a MMORPG.</span>

[Zarafein]

Maybe they could change it like devastation fist so those abilitys work different against epics.. you could get the higher damage of callous stomp(after knockdown against normal/heroic enemies) against epics without the needed knockdown for example.

[Geothe]

<p>to the poster above.</p><p> Read the Test Server patch notes <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Devastation Fist now affects epics. hehe.There is a glitch in the spell description currently, One place it says 1% damage to Epics, another place it says 4%.It could be 1% against epic x4s and 4% against x2s, who knows. lol</p>

[Zarafein]

i was refering to this change in my post geothe. Since they can change how devastation works against epics, they could do the same to other abilitys.

[tt66]

<cite>Novusod wrote:</cite><blockquote><span class="postbody">Overall the whole bruiser class is broken. It is the only class that is more powerfull as a solo'er than as a raider. </span></blockquote>Heh. I think there are some Shadow Knights over in the corner that'd like to have a little word with ya <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I've never been against the idea of changing Callous Stomp <i>per se</i>, my argument has always been that it was never mentioned in the patch notes. If the devs are trying to move away from the idea of a different amount of damage being dealt depending on the status of the mob then that's fine.. if they had just written a line or two to explain it, I wouldn't have an issue.(On the other hand, I am still against putting our mez and fear on the same timer, even though this <i>was</i> mentioned in the patch notes, on the grounds that such a change was frankly silly)However, if both the changes to Devastation Fist and the changes to Rabid Cry make it to the live servers unchanged, I promise I'll shut up about both!(really hope the sonic fists thing is a bug tho. i mean, the teleporting is sorta the whole point of it...)

[Cornbread Muffin]

<cite>Lhangion@Innovation wrote:</cite><blockquote>Oh it(rabbid cry) sounds really nice imo, </blockquote>The DPS buff was much, much better than this new stuff I think.

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

I checked it out on my Bruiser on Test Copy, and the change to Rabid Cry is about equal in damage increasing for a Bruiser...Considering how prolific DPS mods are out there, something different replacing a measly 25 modifier isn't that big a deal. I mean.. with +30ish from items, another +30ish from someone giving you a zerk like effect, another +60-90 from other class buffs... our +25 seems to diminish quite a bit.As for Sonic Fists.. I tested it myself on the Test Copy server. It simply does not teleport you anymore. I know what can cause it to not teleport, I've done it before.. usually when that happens you don't damage but you do pull aggro at least.This isn't what is happening... it's a flat plane, the mob gets damaged, but I never moved. No more warping in, hitting Drag, and warping back.Simply put... this change sucks. It wasn't overpowered, it didn't hurt the game. I could be used on Epics (Novusod, Sonic Fists works fine on Epics.. it was just as much utility there as here, so it doesn't need to be changed in your little list).This change detracts from the fun of the game without any reason at all.Please do not keep it this way!

[tt66]

<cite>tt66 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>However, if both the changes to Devastation Fist and the changes to Rabid Cry make it to the live servers unchanged, I promise I'll shut up about both!</blockquote>Well that didn't take long. Fastest nerf in history?<b>OK DEVS. EXPLAIN THE FOLLOWING :1) WHO DECIDED THAT FEAR AND MEZ SHOULD BE ON THE SAME TIMER?2) WHY HAS CALLOUS STOMP BEEN CHANGED SO THAT IT DOES NOT DO MORE DAMAGE TO PRONE TARGETS?3) WHY HAS THE TELEPORTING ASPECT OF SONIC FISTS BEEN REMOVED?4) WHY DO BRAWLERS HAVE LESS UNCONTESTED AVOIDANCE THAN PLATE TANKS?5) WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO DO SOMETHING WITH THE BRAWLER STR AA LINE?6) WHICH DEVELOPER WAS SO DENSE THAT HE DID NOT REALISE THAT EPIC MOBS HAD A LOT OF HEALTH?</b>

[Cocytus]

<p>lol, I love how people think Sonic Fists is buggy atm and only teleports you sometimes.</p><p>It's not buggy...It just has low accuracy. If the punch lands, you teleport. If it doesn't, you don't.</p><p>But on test...YOu just plain do not teleport. At. all.</p>

[Zarafein]

Would like some answers to tt66 questions as well, my bruiser was my main some time ago...

[EQ2Luv]

<cite>Cocytus wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>lol, I love how people think Sonic Fists is buggy atm and only teleports you sometimes.</p><p>It's not buggy...It just has low accuracy. If the punch lands, you teleport. If it doesn't, you don't.</p><p>But on test...YOu just plain do not teleport. At. all.</p></blockquote>I've seen it hit for damage and not teleport on live.... I've heard that it has to do with your relative elevation but I really havent confirmed. Either way, they should fix this bug of not teleporting at all, and while theyre at it make it teleport reliably. Every time.  The skill doesnt say 'does not teleport if you miss', and in what way would that make sense role-playing wise?  My aim was so bad that I teleported on top of myself :O

[Novusod]

<cite>EQ2Luv wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cocytus wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>lol, I love how people think Sonic Fists is buggy atm and only teleports you sometimes.</p><p>It's not buggy...It just has low accuracy. If the punch lands, you teleport. If it doesn't, you don't.</p><p>But on test...YOu just plain do not teleport. At. all.</p></blockquote>I've seen it hit for damage and not teleport on live.... I've heard that it has to do with your relative elevation but I really havent confirmed. Either way, they should fix this bug of not teleporting at all, and while theyre at it make it teleport reliably. Every time.  The skill doesnt say 'does not teleport if you miss', and in what way would that make sense role-playing wise?  My aim was so bad that I teleported on top of myself :O</blockquote>From a role-playing point of view why does a spell called Sonic Fists teleport your entire charactor? You are creating a sonic wave with your fist like Ken's Hadoken or the Kamama Wave from dragonball.

[ArchconvokerPher]

Hentai RP aside, this nerf takes away alot of utility in PVP, cant see WHY this was needed. i hope this gets fixed before it hits live, my enjoyment of pvp would be lessened greatly.

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<cite>Novusod wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>From a role-playing point of view why does a spell called Sonic Fists teleport your entire charactor? You are creating a sonic wave with your fist like Ken's Hadoken or the Kamama Wave from dragonball.</blockquote>You can just as easily say that your fist moves faster than th speed of sound... "fist" as in your "punch". Since your hand is attached to your body, you have to kinda follow it.Regardless... this change eliminates a cool, unique utility that was useable in any situation (solo, heroic, pvp, epic), and wasn't overpowered in any of them.The ONLY thing that happens with this change is that Bruisers become a little bit less fun to play. That is the very definition of a bad change.

[Aeralik]

This is just a bug and it is the same issue double up is having since the effect changed slightly.  It will be fixed so no need to worry about "stealth nerfs" and what not. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

[Laywon11]

Hey...can we just cut the legs off of bruisers next and make them crawl on their elbows? Im still not sure why sonic fists is being changed, or the change for same timers for scared still and intimidate? Why dont we just delete the class totally and you guys can stop coming up with ways to screw us over..and over...and over...

[Zarafein]

Well one answer is better than nothing, so thanks.. but whats up with the remaining questions.