Betrayal to Guardian, worth it?

[Laereneth]

<p>I currently have a level 70 Zerk on my roster which I'm finding I'm on more often of late (group needs).  A thought that has been in the back of my mind for quite some time is 'should I betray over to Guard for stronger tanking?'.</p><p>I don't raid on this character (I've got another character that raids), but I do want to be able to handle the top end dungeons (Unrest, CMM, etc).  I've noticed that some of those zone pack quite a nice spike damage from time to time.  Does the Guard have more or stronger tools to deal with the rougher zones?  Or is the difference between the two tanks pretty nominal until you get to raid tanking?</p><p>And how is the agro difference between the two?</p><p>Thank you very much for your feedback.  This question has been plaguing me for quite some time!</p><p>Laer</p>

[Rolande']

 I betrayed from guardian to zerk over a year ago, I myself am going to be going back when the expansion comes out since all new spells.  I have tanked all the group dungeons/instances in the game... Nizara, castle, unrest ... its more about the group, having good healers and a good chanter makes all the difference in those zones. The thing I am not liking about zerks so much is the need to dps to hold aggro, and when you are in defensive stance going against 74-76's the hit ratio is crap.  I look forward to getting the slash,crush and piercing group buff back to help me hit mobs in defensive. Also the group def buff to help up my avoidance with a buckler spec. The other thing is the hate decreaser on one target, this specifically is good for me since in my guild groups we normally have one high dps scout and mage. The scout transfers to me, so I can lower the hate of the mage to make aggro much easier.  And of course the extra HP's ... as a zerk its pathetic to see all but SK's beating my hp't total... I am not a raider, but I have solid gear... full set of eof legendary and a few kos relic I switch in and out.. So the added STA and the group hp's buff is going to be a nice change.  Those are my reasons for switching. Yes you can tank the zones as a zerk, but you might have a bigger margin for error as a guardian with the extra hp's .. avoidance and buffs like sentinel and tower of stone...

[Ep]

don't bother betraying to a guard if all your going to do is instances. a guard is only, only empowered tanking epic encounters over any other class, that is the one and true time a guard out shines anyone. If it's not ever for tanking, avatars or cmayong those type of mobs, stick w/ your zerker. scouts tank unrest, it's pretty simple to do w/o a class respect.

[spa]

<p>Top end raider DPS classes prefer Zerk or Crusader apart from when the need arises to tank the hardest epic nameds in the game. In groups Guards struggle to hold aggro, heavily reliant on hate buff mod's even if he's got lots of hate proc gear.</p><p>Guards are the best at taking the hits but when some noob groupy with a big [Removed for Content] or does some aoe aggroing adds around you, you hit reinforcement then spam a couple of your aoe's and then you start casting your temporary defense buffs... its in that time there of casting those buffs that the DPS dont consider what the Guard is doing to stay alive longer, they just continues to go all out expecting the Guard to hold aggro regardless. In pickup groups with mostly none raid equipped DPS players aggro is generally fine/easy under such heavy fire power from the mobs. Some people such as Warlocks easily prefer Zerks/Crusaders because they hold aggro usually very easily of adds, just need quite a good healer.</p>

[uadarthmaul]

Which of the 2 classes solo better?

[Wilin]

Zerkers solo better.

[Tremelle]

My main is a guardian, but i also have a low level zerker. Zerkers are a bit better for soloing, but agro control in groups is lacking some. I am not sure about zerkers, since my is still low, but guardian have the ability at high levels to take 100% of the groups damage at higher levels. But keep in mind, your going to have to spend alot or plat to get your skills back at level 70.

[uadarthmaul]

Can berserkers betray to shadowknight?  I've just had a super hard time levelling in my 50s with my zerker.

[Tremelle]

No

[Laereneth]

<p>I'm seeing, as I probably should expect, two schools of thought here.</p><p>To give a little more background, I play about 80% - 90% of the time with the same players (RL friends), so pick up issues are usually not an issue for me.  And they are knowledgable players.  And since I'm grouping the vast majority of my play time, soloability is not a deciding factor either.  I'm basically shooting to be the best group tank I can.</p><p>I have been looking at some of the differences in the tools (CAs) that the two classes have to work with.  The Zerk defenitely takes the lead in AoE dps.  And I see some nice protective abilities that the Guard has to mitigate damage on the group.</p><p>How does the agro tools differ between the two classes?</p><p>Thanks again for your feedback!</p><p>Laer</p>

[Ep]

zerker gets the easy button for aggro, simply by the nature of more dps=more aggro. the guards ability to mitigate dmg is pretty much fruitless unless it's used to prevent against epic spike dmg.

[TuinalOfTheNexus]

<cite>Bloodletter@Runnyeye wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Top end raider DPS classes prefer Zerk or Crusader apart from when the need arises to tank the hardest epic nameds in the game. In groups Guards struggle to hold aggro, heavily reliant on hate buff mod's even if he's got lots of hate proc gear.</p><p>Guards are the best at taking the hits but when some noob groupy with a big [I cannot control my vocabulary] or does some aoe aggroing adds around you, you hit reinforcement then spam a couple of your aoe's and then you start casting your temporary defense buffs... its in that time there of casting those buffs that the DPS dont consider what the Guard is doing to stay alive longer, they just continues to go all out expecting the Guard to hold aggro regardless. In pickup groups with mostly none raid equipped DPS players aggro is generally fine/easy under such heavy fire power from the mobs. Some people such as Warlocks easily prefer Zerks/Crusaders because they hold aggro usually very easily of adds, just need quite a good healer.</p></blockquote><p>This is totally incorrect, in my opinion.</p><p>A Guardian has Moderate, one of the best single target deaggros in the game, and in most groups there's only one AE-heavy class with no self-deaggro (read: Warlock). A Zerker relies on Destruction / Open Wounds to DPS for aggro, which are great abilities but on 3 minute timers, a fact often overlooked. When I play a Warlock, it's much easier to rip aggro from a Zerker than a Guardian, because there's a good chance the big damage CAs for a Zerker won't be up, whereas Moderate is always on. Guardians also have better tools when they lose aggro; Guardian Sphere and Sentry Watch are both life-savers, as are Sustain and Reinforcement.</p><p>In terms of single target DPS there's a very small gap between the two classes; again Juggernaut gives a Zerker more burst DPS, but with a 3 min reuse. If you want to chain-pull, then a Guardian offers a set of fast-refreshing CAs and very consistent hate generation. If you want to pull a tough named, then a Guardian offers survivability and similar burst aggro to a Zerk via Reinforcement (which can be reduced to 1:30 reuse).</p><p>It strikes me that if you're losing aggro whilst casting temporary defensive buffs, perhaps you should either be pre-casting or not casting them at all? 1000 more mit isn't any good if the mob isn't hitting you, and if a Zerker can get away with going fully offensive on the same mobs there's no reason a Guard can't.</p>