Update 37 huh.

[mappam]

<p>I have looked at the places I thought I would find the info on the patch/addition of GU#37 tomorrow - without any luck.</p><p>Anyone have any links or time(s) that this will take place - and about how long it will take?</p><p>Thanks </p>

[Squigglle]

is gu37 tommorow? i hope <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Spyrit]

<p> Yep, due to go live on the 31st <a href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/news_archive_content.vm?id=1254&section=News&locale=en_US" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Link here</a>.</p><p>Your best source for info is still the test server update notes. No way of telling what will actually make it in but this is always the best place to start.</p>

[mappam]

<p><span style="color: #99ffcc">Thanks for the link.</span></p><p><span style="color: #99ffcc">I tried that and I tried the Sever Status page and everywhere else I could think of - I can still find no time(s) or info on this patch. I am "assum"ing that it will be the normal time of 10am Pacific time?? but can not confirm this. And no info on how long they estimate it will take.</span></p>

[Istaril]

7  to 10 PST (if all goes well) <a href="http://help.station.sony.com/cgi-bin/soe.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=16180&p_created=1133386625&p_sid=sXEn1-Hi&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_lva=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPTEmcF9zb3J0X2J5PSZwX2dyaWRzb3J0PSZwX 3Jvd19jbnQ9MjYwJnBfcHJvZHM9JnBfY2F0cz0mcF9wdj0mcF9 jdj0mcF9zZWFyY2hfdHlwZT1zZWFyY2hfbmwmcF9wYWdlPTEmc F9zZWFyY2hfdGV4dD1zY2hlZHVsZWQgZG93bnRpbWU*&p_li=&p_topview=1" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://help.station.sony.com/cgi-bi...amp;p_topview=1</a> If that link actually works. If not, look up "scheduled downtime" on the Station Knowledgebase

[Owilliams]

<p>Thorough information on the patch should have been front and center on the launchpad for at least the last several days, but we aren't allowed to bemoan that fact because there are forum [Removed for Content] here that will deride us to hades and back for such heresay.</p><p>Mum's the word.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p>

[Ruut Li]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Thorough information on the patch should have been front and center on the launchpad for at least the last several days, but we aren't allowed to bemoan that fact because there are forum [Removed for Content] here that will deride us to hades and back for such heresay.</p><p>Mum's the word.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote> LOL! so true <img src="/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[liveja]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Thorough information on the patch should have been front and center on the launchpad for at least the last several days.</p></blockquote> <span style="color: #00cc00"><b>QFE.</b></span>

[bensilvi]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Thorough information on the patch should have been front and center on the launchpad for at least the last several days, but we aren't allowed to bemoan that fact because there are forum [Removed for Content] here that will deride us to hades and back for such heresay.</p><p>Mum's the word.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote> They can not give patch details days in advanced. That is why the provide the preview. Not everything makes it to Live on Patch day. Things happen at the last minute and they pull stuff. PAtch Notes are not official until hours after the servers are up on patch day. It has been stated many many times why.

[BoriKitty]

<p>For some odd reason I thought it was on Wednesday.  Oh well..</p><p>What's the estimated downtime?</p>

[liveja]

Mondary@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Thorough information on the patch should have been front and center on the launchpad for at least the last several days, but we aren't allowed to bemoan that fact because there are forum [Removed for Content] here that will deride us to hades and back for such heresay.</p><p>Mum's the word.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote> They can not give patch details days in advanced. </blockquote><p>I would be perfectly happy if the actual DATE & TIME were announced on the launch pad a few days in advance.</p><p>Or, if the Network Status Page were updated at least the day before to indicate a patch going in the next day.</p><p>I don't need full patch notes until after the patch has gone through, but telling me WHEN it's going in is pretty helpful, & can't possibly be all that difficult to do.</p>

[LakelandSeasky]

Mondary@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Thorough information on the patch should have been front and center on the launchpad for at least the last several days, but we aren't allowed to bemoan that fact because there are forum [Removed for Content] here that will deride us to hades and back for such heresay.</p><p>Mum's the word.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote> They can not give patch details days in advanced. That is why the provide the preview. Not everything makes it to Live on Patch day. Things happen at the last minute and they pull stuff. PAtch Notes are not official until hours after the servers are up on patch day. It has been stated many many times why.</blockquote><p>  Why can't they at least put it on the "Netwark Status" page? The last "scheduled downtime" is the 25th.  Was this not scheduled?  Why can't they put a little note up yesterday for people who don't scoure there horribly structured webpage for downtimes that aren't posted on the "scheduled downtime" section.  I don't care that the game is down, I like that they are (hopefully) making it better what I don't understand is there ability to make a MMO that is available to millions (if they wanted) even in diffrent countries that manages to stay up and running almost flawlessly yet they can't figure out how to make a website that simply tells that they are going to take the game down for what could be a big patch.  Tell me what you did later, just tell me your going to do it in advance.  Not that much to ask for I wouldn't imagine.  Oh, if please don't post some obscure post from the test server page and say "it's right here" because I don't play test server so why would I go there to look for downtime when they have a page ("network status&quot<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> that lists downtimes already.</p><p>   Again, not really complaining that the game is down, just dont understand why they hide these patch downtimes so much. </p>

[jmcgorlick]

LakelandSeasky wrote: <blockquote><p>  Why can't they at least put it on the "Netwark Status" page? The last "scheduled downtime" is the 25th.  Was this not scheduled?  Why can't they put a little note up yesterday for people who don't scoure there horribly structured webpage for downtimes that aren't posted on the "scheduled downtime" section.  I don't care that the game is down, I like that they are (hopefully) making it better what I don't understand is there ability to make a MMO that is available to millions (if they wanted) even in diffrent countries that manages to stay up and running almost flawlessly yet they can't figure out how to make a website that simply tells that they are going to take the game down for what could be a big patch.  Tell me what you did later, just tell me your going to do it in advance.  Not that much to ask for I wouldn't imagine.  Oh, if please don't post some obscure post from the test server page and say "it's right here" because I don't play test server so why would I go there to look for downtime when they have a page ("network status"<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> that lists downtimes already.</p><p>   Again, not really complaining that the game is down, just dont understand why they hide these patch downtimes so much. </p></blockquote><p> I agree... I checked "network status" page and NOTHING.... why do we need to scour the forums to find out that there is a 3 HOUR downtime expected!  Hasn't this downtime been planned for days, quite possibly a week?  The least SOE could do is inform their customers about the downtime a bit in advance, never mind WHILE its happening! </p><p>Don't get me wrong.. I too am HAPPY that they took the game offline to do the Live Update... but they REALLY need to get on top of the "network status" page</p>

[Cyris]

I went to log in and I downloaded a bunch of stuff... there's no reason my files shoulda been corrupt to force it... was there some sorta update? Anyone else download anything?

[Norrsken]

<cite>Cyris wrote:</cite><blockquote>I went to log in and I downloaded a bunch of stuff... there's no reason my files shoulda been corrupt to force it... was there some sorta update? Anyone else download anything? </blockquote>Game Update 37 went live today.

[Cyris]

Ahh, was wondering if that was the case... I don't see any mention of it by SoE on the forums =  Game's still down right now.. when does it normally come back up?

[Ruut Li]

you have to accidentally stumble into the super irrelevant (to many customers) forum section to see such info because....because...I cannot explain why theres no logic to it <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Denubisdjinn]

I'm surprised links to the patch notes aren't readily available.  Compared to certain other games which provide them on the front page...

[Krystara]

<p><a href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/game_updates_details.vm?id=37" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://eq2players.station.sony.com/...etails.vm?id=37</a></p><p> From the front news page - click the link that says Game Update on the side.</p>

[Loolee]

<cite>Cyris wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ahh, was wondering if that was the case... I don't see any mention of it by SoE on the forums =  Game's still down right now.. when does it normally come back up? </blockquote>Thats because they announced it a <a href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/news_archive_content.vm?id=1254&section=News&locale=en_US" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">couple of days ago.</a>

[Krystara]

<p>Front page.. Home button, Forum button, Game Update button.. not hard to find at all</p><p>http://eq2players.station.sony.com/game_updates_details.vm?id=37</p>

[Ropewild]

GU 36 took about 10 hours for them to get up, anyone wanna place wagers on how long its gonna take em for this one?

[Ruut Li]

hmm 4 clicks is the magic number then. Having it in launcpad would be like giving into the insta grat crowd? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Or simply being more new player friendly? i'd go for the latter.

[Norrsken]

<cite>Ropewild wrote:</cite><blockquote>GU 36 took about 10 hours for them to get up, anyone wanna place wagers on how long its gonna take em for this one?</blockquote>1h 30 min? <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Something msut have gone wrong with 36, since its usually not that long.

[Krystara]

Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote>hmm 4 clicks is the magic number then. Having it in launcpad would be like giving into the insta grat crowd? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Or simply being more new player friendly? i'd go for the latter.</blockquote><p> Three clicks.  It's on the front page underneath the forum button.  Process is</p><p>1. Go to EQ2Players</p><p>2. Click on Game Update button.. it's on the left hand side</p><p>3. Click on Game Update 37.</p><p>4. Read Notes.</p><p>Granted, it doesn't say anything about what time all this is happening so there are still flaws in the system, but works for me.</p>

[Ropewild]

<p>Wow, an hour and a half? That would be pretty remarkable considering half of their regular patches take an hour themselves.</p>

[Bingeaux]

<p>Yep, you're right, it is right there.</p><p> I guess it was the huge GU36 headline, and the fact that GU37 did not appear in the prominent list of recent updates on the right-hand side of the page, that led me not to scroll way down to the bottom to find the real link.</p>

[Themaginator]

<cite>Ropewild wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow, an hour and a half? That would be pretty remarkable considering half of their regular patches take an hour themselves.</p></blockquote> Waa? try 30 minutes on the download but eh w/e

[Krystara]

Weird.  While I see the graphic for Update 36 (boy does that need to change or go away) Update 37 is *clearly* marked as the first one on top on the right for me.

[Ropewild]

half the scheduled downtimes for the regular patches are at least an hour though, i cant see a game update taking that long when the last one took much longer, idk maybe its my always look for the worst attitude lol

[Norrsken]

<cite>Ropewild wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow, an hour and a half? That would be pretty remarkable considering half of their regular patches take an hour themselves.</p></blockquote>Its not impossible though. Though I must admit I said 1h30 min because the servers had been down for 1h30 mins at that time. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Kizee]

<p>I didn't see any mention of the raid loot table updates they did. </p><p>Did that go in also?</p>

[Ropewild]

lol that makes sense. yea im hoping it doesnt take all day, tis' my day off =[

[Norrsken]

<cite>Ropewild wrote:</cite><blockquote>lol that makes sense. yea im hoping it doesnt take all day, tis' my day off =[</blockquote>Seems all servers are up but locked now though.

[Galldora]

ARRGGH!  Don't you just HATE waiting for game updates to go in?  I am SO excited about all the new stuff going in, especially all the new furniture!  Our houses are going to be even more super now -- this little carpenter will be rushing out those new items just as quickly as possible. I'm guessing the servers will be back up at 11:30am PST, so, 4 1/2 hours.  (GU36 took 10 hours?  Really?  I thought it was a rather quick update.  I suppose I might have dreamed that...)

[Ropewild]

it took a while, im pretty sure it took them all day for that one. and yea im looking forward to it for sure, i just hate sitting around lol. hopefully 4 hours at the MOST.. lol

[Owilliams]

<p>See... asking for upcoming server downtime info front and center on the launchpad instantly got some panties in a knot.</p><p>Does it every time.</p><p><snicker></p><p>--Orv</p>

[Ruut Li]

Lysari@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote>hmm 4 clicks is the magic number then. Having it in launcpad would be like giving into the insta grat crowd? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Or simply being more new player friendly? i'd go for the latter.</blockquote><p> Three clicks.  It's on the front page underneath the forum button.  Process is</p><p>1. Go to EQ2Players</p><p>2. Click on Game Update button.. it's on the left hand side</p><p>3. Click on Game Update 37.</p><p>4. Read Notes.</p><p>Granted, it doesn't say anything about what time all this is happening so there are still flaws in the system, but works for me.</p></blockquote>for me the process starts with: launch the net and since im not a forum nerd i dont have the page up-front. So its 4 clicks thx though.. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Krystara]

<p>It would be great to have server status on the launchpad, but wouldn't do me a bit of good because I'm at work not home so I still wouldn't have a clue when the servers will be back up.  And if you are home, you have the notes as soon as you patch because they are on the launchpad.</p><p>Maybe that's why this stuff never bothers me.. I'm at least eight hours away from being able to play so it doesn't matter that the notes don't magically appear and the server status page isn't give a second by second countdown of when they'll be up.  Or would that not be good enough either?</p>

[Ruut Li]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>See... asking for upcoming server downtime info front and center on the launchpad instantly got some panties in a knot.</p><p>Does it every time.</p><p><snicker></p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote><p> But they like the feeling of the knot or they would also ask for soe to inform people on the launcpad so that there would not be these constant threads every gu.</p><p>One is goin wild here treating ppl like [Removed for Content] <img src="/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[bryldan]

<cite>Kizee wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I didn't see any mention of the raid loot table updates they did. </p><p>Did that go in also?</p></blockquote> What the part about the class gear? I dont remember seeing that if thats what you are talking about.

[Krystara]

Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote>Lysari@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote>hmm 4 clicks is the magic number then. Having it in launcpad would be like giving into the insta grat crowd? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Or simply being more new player friendly? i'd go for the latter.</blockquote><p> Three clicks.  It's on the front page underneath the forum button.  Process is</p><p>1. Go to EQ2Players</p><p>2. Click on Game Update button.. it's on the left hand side</p><p>3. Click on Game Update 37.</p><p>4. Read Notes.</p><p>Granted, it doesn't say anything about what time all this is happening so there are still flaws in the system, but works for me.</p></blockquote>for me the process starts with: launch the net and since im not a forum nerd i dont have the page up-front. So its 4 clicks thx though.. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote>I don't either.. I just happen to have a bookmarked link to the news page.  But you are welcome and I'm glad something I did today was helpful to someone.

[Krystara]

Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote><p>One is goin wild here treating ppl like [Removed for Content] <img src="/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote><p> Gods I hope that isn't about me because that wasn't my intent.. I was just trying to show someone where to find the information they were asking about.  If it is me you are talking about.. <span style="color: #ff0033">edited to remove something I didn't need to say.. sorry.</span></p><p>If someone took my post the wrong way, I'm sorry that I didn't type it out clearer.  I didn't mean to insult anyone.</p>

[Owilliams]

Lysari@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote><p>One is goin wild here treating ppl like [Removed for Content] <img src="/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote> Gods I hope that isn't about me because that wasn't my intent.. I was just trying to show someone where to find the information they were asking about.  If it is me you are talking about.. take a long walk off a short pier.  I really don't need that kind of nonsense.</blockquote><p> I don't think he was referring to you. =)</p><p>--Orv</p>

[Vatec]

<cite>Loolee wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cyris wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ahh, was wondering if that was the case... I don't see any mention of it by SoE on the forums =  Game's still down right now.. when does it normally come back up? </blockquote>Thats because they announced it a <a href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/news_archive_content.vm?id=1254&section=News&locale=en_US" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">couple of days ago.</a> </blockquote>And if you clicked on that link, saw all the pictures and, quite rightly, said to yourself, "Fluff piece, ignore and move on," you had no idea it was happening today. Very poorly handled by SOE compared to GU36 which got several days advance notice with the date prominently featured. My guess is that the community staff is overwhelmed by all the FanFaire silliness.  But that just indicates poor planning on their bosses' parts....

[badtupram]

All I can say is I'm tickled pink about the new Griff Towers.  A whole lot less suicide for my toon getting from one place to the other. <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Vatec]

Lysari@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>Ruut Li wrote: <blockquote>hmm 4 clicks is the magic number then. Having it in launcpad would be like giving into the insta grat crowd? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Or simply being more new player friendly? i'd go for the latter.</blockquote><p> Three clicks.  It's on the front page underneath the forum button.  Process is</p><p>1. Go to EQ2Players</p><p>2. Click on Game Update button.. it's on the left hand side</p><p>3. Click on Game Update 37.</p><p>4. Read Notes.</p><p>Granted, it doesn't say anything about what time all this is happening so there are still flaws in the system, but works for me.</p></blockquote>Yep. And up until an =hour= after the downtime began, that link led to information about GU 36.  So, no real advance notice =and= they failed to post update notes until an hour after the process had started.  Blame FanFaire....

[Ruut Li]

<p>of course its not you! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>These threads are nonsense, which could be easily avoidable every GU..oh well.</p><p>It took me a year of eq2 gaming before I bothered to come to the boards. Far from all of game customers are interested in hanging out in game boards. Soe would only and definatley benefit from better comunications. Think of the innocent fragile newbies!</p>

[Siberien]

What time will the servers come back online?

[Norrsken]

<cite>Siberien wrote:</cite><blockquote>What time will the servers come back online?</blockquote>when the update is done. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Kizee]

<cite>bryldan wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kizee wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I didn't see any mention of the raid loot table updates they did. </p><p>Did that go in also?</p></blockquote> What the part about the class gear? I dont remember seeing that if thats what you are talking about. </blockquote><p> They were suppost to redistribute the loot around on mobs but I don't see it in patch notes. Basicly...it will give everybody 2 chances a slot every week. Here is the post from eqflames:</p><p>In addition to the changes Aeralik mentioned about Smart Loot, we're also redistributing the Fabled Armor Sets.  The following changes are planned to go live with GU37, and should arrive on the Test Server soon(tm). The following encounters will drop the noted armor set piece for all 24 subclasses .  They also have an <b>additional</b> chance to drop loot other than armor set pieces: <u>Freethinker Hideout</u> Malkonis D'Morte - Boots. Treyloth D'Kulvith - Gloves. Othysis Muvarian: No longer drops armor set pieces. <u>Mistmoore's Inner Sanctum</u> Mayong Mistmoore - Chest (x2). D'Lizta Viswin - Gloves. D'Lizta Cheroon - Forearms. Enynti - Shoulders. Tactician's Armor - Helms. V'Tekla K'Zalk - No longer drops armor set pieces. <u>The Emerald Halls</u> Wuoshi - Leggings (x2). Gardener Thirgen - Forearms. The Herald of Wuoshi - Helms. Sariah the Bloomseeker - Boots. Tender of the Seedlings - Shoulders. Treah Greenroot - No longer drops armor set pieces. The bosses that drop armor-set pieces are now aware of which set pieces characters in the raid currently possess.  These bosses will only drop an armor-set piece that someone attending needs.  (Note that as long as you have the item either equipped, in inventory, or bank, you are counted as "possessing" the item.) For example:  When a raid defeats Malkonis D'Morte in Freethinkers Hideout, set-boots will drop for one of the classes present who does not already have their set-boots.  When this raid reaches the point where everyone present has their set boots, Malkonis will drop a pair of set boots randomly as before. </p>

[Siberien]

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote: <blockquote><cite>Siberien wrote:</cite><blockquote>What time will the servers come back online?</blockquote>when the update is done. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> INFIDEL!

[Norrsken]

<cite>Siberien wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote: <blockquote><cite>Siberien wrote:</cite><blockquote>What time will the servers come back online?</blockquote>when the update is done. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> INFIDEL!</blockquote>hehe. honestly though, I dont know if the devs give estimates anymore. The ones we used to get were ususally wrong anyway. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[badtupram]

Ruut Li you are completely correct.  I'm still fairly new but now I come straight to the threads when the servers are down or I'm having any problems.  But the first time I thought I had a problem with my PC. LOL!  I had only been playing about a week.   To bad Sony isn't putting the news in red or something at log in.  I see flashing ads but something different that catches the eye with a link to the changes would keep everything from being a surprise for a lot of us. Just my opinion.

[Owilliams]

<p>Estimate is 3 hours... that is another 30 minutes from the time of this posting til the estimated time servers come back up.</p><p>Your actual mileage will almost certainly vary.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p>

[Ropewild]

ALL SERVERS ARE UP.

[mappam]

<p><span style="color: #99ffcc">Off Topic = BUT I started this message (if you look at the first post) but the title changed and it shows that it was started by someone else - CONFUSED! How is this possible?</span></p><p><span style="color: #99ffcc">Glad servers are up....</span></p>

[Galldora]

Wow, servers up by 9:30am!  There's one estimate I'm glad to be way off on.  Gratz to the whole team who got this update running so swiftly, and thank you! /skips off happily to make more bread pans and muffin tins....