EQ Ban Accidents, this frequent?

[Glisca]

Recently I was playing until my game just shut off on me.  When I tried to log back on it said my account was banned.  I checked my email wondering what in the world could be the reason to only find there wasn't anything from Sony.  So I end up calling Sony and begin talking to a support person.  He tells me the reason for my account being banned was a massive eq ban against plat farmers and botters (which blew my mind cause I'm 44, slayer title, 300,000 status, point being what farmer does all that).  As he is talking to me, he stops and says "weird, they just unbanned you".  Good news for me, except my friend that I level up with and was lanning with the day before this logs on to find out he has also been banned.  He has contacted Sony, but they keep telling him things like "all bans are permanent" and they will recheck out his case.  The only reason I can think of why they randomly targeted us was that we responded to and made fun of a spammer called Creditjack since we both did it but our third friend didn't (who didn't get banned). To the point of this message, do these accident bans happen a lot?  Is there anything I can do to not be wrongly targeted like this again?  Is there anyone else out there experiencing this crap?

[Norrsken]

<cite>Glisca wrote:</cite><blockquote>Recently I was playing until my game just shut off on me.  When I tried to log back on it said my account was banned.  I checked my email wondering what in the world could be the reason to only find there wasn't anything from Sony.  So I end up calling Sony and begin talking to a support person.  He tells me the reason for my account being banned was a massive eq ban against plat farmers and botters (which blew my mind cause I'm 44, slayer title, 300,000 status, point being what farmer does all that).  As he is talking to me, he stops and says "weird, they just unbanned you".  Good news for me, except my friend that I level up with and was lanning with the day before this logs on to find out he has also been banned.  He has contacted Sony, but they keep telling him things like "all bans are permanent" and they will recheck out his case.  The only reason I can think of why they randomly targeted us was that we responded to and made fun of a spammer called Creditjack since we both did it but our third friend didn't (who didn't get banned). To the point of this message, do these accident bans happen a lot?  Is there anything I can do to not be wrongly targeted like this again?  Is there anyone else out there experiencing this crap? </blockquote>I think they have some automated system that sniffs for plat shoppers/sellers and that this system aint the hottest in town. There were massive bans a while back that were pulled back because they were wrong, so I guess this might be more of the same.

[Calthine]

My understanding is when they bust a real big RMT ring sometimes people who've touched "tainted plat" get caught up in it.  So if Bob Exploiter bought plat and bought stuff off you from the broker you might get caught up in it.  I think it's happened, um, maybe 4 times since launch.  They seem to be very quick about releasing the accounts they've gotten mistakenly. I'd have your friend call back, be prepared to spend some phone time, and keep trying.  Perhaps /petition and see if you can get it escalated that way.

[Chondrichtheyia]

Could it also be possible that the plat farmer you and your friend made fun of reported you guys for plat selling?

[Glisca]

I'd doubt he would, it was more of a playful joke where he was kidding back.  If he reported it most likely get his own account banned.  Not to mention I would hope Sony would read the log and see that he was the one spamming plat messages and I was clearly not interested as they would see in my joke replies <img src="/smilies/136dd33cba83140c7ce38db096d05aed.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.  Sorry but this ban first then ask questions later behavior by Sony is a bit surprising <img src="/smilies/c30b4198e0907b23b8246bdd52aa1c3c.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Its been a day and half now that my friends account is still banned.  Mine was returned in 20 minutes, not sure what separated me from my friend on our response times (leveled up together since 10, so everything is pretty much the same).

[aardda]

<p>The SOE method of dealing with things like this is to use overkill.</p><p>They ban anyone even slightly implicated, whether they knowlingly cheated or not and then give access back to those who aren't guilty after further investigation.</p><p>While it might seem harsh to those affected, i'd rather they do it this way than allow a few real cheats to escape the net by not acting quickly enough. Better to be safe than sorry, and all that.</p>

[xOnaton1]

Your friend may have had some contact with the bad money. He needs to talk to Customer Support and they should be able to take care of it: <a href="http://soe-ing.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/soe_ing.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=11580" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://soe-ing.custhelp.com/cgi-bin...p?p_faqid=11580</a> Othesus - Dirge - Lucan DLere Vaspar - Fury - Lucan DLere

[Calthine]

<cite>Chondrichtheyia wrote:</cite><blockquote>Could it also be possible that the plat farmer you and your friend made fun of reported you guys for plat selling? </blockquote> And besides, they research this stuff (which is why known plat farmers don't poof right when reported).  If they *did* report your friend they probably just wasted some poor GM's time.

[Kazak]

Hi, I am Glisca's friend that got his account banned. This whole incident has been a nightmare for me. After calling the sony support number yesterday morning I spoke with a guy named Jim who pretty much told me bans are permanent and I was banned for plat farming and botting. I assured him that I was not a plat farmer or botter and this ban was some kind of mistake. After arguing with him he told me that bans are initiated by management and the only way I could have been banned was if a GM would have witnessed me botting or plat farming (which I knew was not true because I am not a botter or plat seller). Since I got nowhere with Jim from customer service, I decided to login to the online live chat on the sony support site to see if someone would help me with this issue. After waiting in line for 15 or 20 minutes, I finally was connected with a agent, who reviewed my question and told me that he could not discuss banned accounts online and I had to contact the customer support number (which I had just called earlier). At this point I thought that I was not going to get my account back and was going to be banned forever for something I know I did not do. I decided to call the support number one last time to see if maybe someone would listen to me and help me out. I was connected with Andrew, who seemed alot nicer than the guy I spoke with earlier. He also told me that bans were permanent and I explained that I was not a plat seller. I told him that I am a level 44 shadowknight with 50 AA's and I only have 6 plat in the bank (all of which I farmed from rares/drops) and my gear is horrible. He seemed to believe me but replied with "It only takes 1 plat to be a plat farmer/seller." After a short discussion, he told me he would escalate the issue and they would review my logs (which I was happy about since I knew when they reviewed the logs they would see that I was innocent). But he told me he wouldn't promise anything and didn't give me a time frame for how long this process would take. Today I finally checked my account and it is now unbanned. 2 days later and 2 phonecalls and 1 livechat later, my account is once again mine, but I still haven't recieved a response from Sony of why it was banned or any apologies for the time and frustration they cost me. I really hope they can improve their customer service and how they go about banning accounts. They should review the logs and have evidence BEFORE they ban an account. Oh well, back to grinding away again! -Kazak Level 44 Shadowknight Nagafin

[Calthine]

Gratz on sticking to your guns and welcome back <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Chondrichtheyia]

I'm glad justice prevailed in your case. However, the issue about unwarranted bans still remains. What would have happened if your English had not been good enough to explain and assert your innocence when speaking to a rep on the phone? Would they still have reviewed your logs, etc? That remains the question...

[kukubird]

I personally would rather them catch 1000 farmers and actually do something ... like you guys are saying that might have done recently.... then let things go on with no action. Yes, I would be upset if I had to go through what you did, however, I would be jumping for joy as it would be the first time I had actually saw an effort to clean up the game. A long time back they had some bogus announcement how they had deleted 50,000 toons.   What they NEVER  went into detail about was... was it 50,000 accounts? or 50,000 toons.. was it all in one banning? Or was it from long long time ago that they finally got around to deleteing the toons out of the database? BUT AGAIN, if what you guys are saying is true... I am happy as hell they are actually doing something, ANYTHING!

[Grimwell]

Any time you cast a net you are going to get some fish you didn't intend to catch. From there it's all about working out getting those fish back into the water safely. Sometimes it goes smoothly, sometimes it does not. I know it sucks when someone is identified and banned even though they are not a farmer, but any tool any company creates is going to get some false positives. If we loosen up the restrictions, more farmers get through, and we get plenty of feedback indicating that we don't catch enough of them already. I believe that falls under the 'Rock and a hard place' category. Please don't think I'm trivializing it (and I'm always available if you think you were nabbed for the wrong reasons), but farming is something where you have to draw a line in the sand somewhere, and there is no perfect line to draw sadly. Kukubird: I can't tell ya if it was toons or accounts, or if it was just a db purge - that was before my time and I don't see the CS stuff anyway, but any farmer removed is a good thing eh? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[kukubird]

Grim - yes, you don't know how happy it makes me that action is being taken <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I applaud any efforts <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  And to anyone that was caught that didn't do anything wrong.... trust me ... it might have been incovenient... but the damage these guys can do to your game play is far more reaching then you can imagine. If it is them taking your named... them spamming you with plat tells, them making it so you can't sell anything on broker at a decent price.. them making artificial inflation due to increased plat supplies.... I could go on .. but I imagine you get the point. Again I feel for you and the inconvenience... but I can honestly say if I was nabbed unintentionally and got my account back.. I would be ok with it for the greater good <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Ordate]

<p>First, I want to say you have my deepest sympathies that you got banned and had a bit of a problem getting back.  I know it has to suck, one of my guildies got "banned" about a month ago also.  He fummed he fussed he got reactivated.</p><p>That being said.  I think this shows that SOE IS in fact listening to their customers.  Customers are tired of plat farmers/sellers.  In the cases where people were wrongfully accused, I don't know what happened.  But watch your own actions.  Those sellers exsist because some of the customer base does in fact buy plat online.  If it causes some frustration to those innocent but if it catches a lot of people both buying and selling plat, then I think it is a good thing.  Hope SOE keeps that line where it is or even makes it a little tighter.</p>

[wow1970]

Are plat farmers the people you get random tells from that offer to sell plat or pwr lvl you? What else would make them think someone is a plat farmer?  I'm back on here after about 2 years and I just want to be sure that I am not gonna do something that will make them mistaken me for a plat farmer like they have to other people. 

[Gladiia]

<cite>wow1970 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Are plat farmers the people you get random tells from that offer to sell plat or pwr lvl you? What else would make them think someone is a plat farmer?  I'm back on here after about 2 years and I just want to be sure that I am not gonna do something that will make them mistaken me for a plat farmer like they have to other people.  </blockquote><p>Just play the game, and don't buy any illegal plat.  I doubt that there are a substantial number of accounts banned that weren't supposed to be.  I doubt there is any way to prevent yourself from accidentally getting a hold of 'illegal plat' from people buying stuff of your broker sales.</p>

[Dracostem]

<p>Glad to hear you guys got cleared of the situation, but I do agree with te actions taken.  90% of my petitions are for plat sellers and it gets really annoying to the point of being frustrating to check your tells window just to see their ads.</p><p>Again, glad your guys are back on even though it must of been a nightmare... withdrawl symptoms anyone? =)</p>

[Kaldrin]

All I know is I get spammed at least two or three times for every time I'm online... even when online for only a half hour the other day I got a tell. Maybe they can just add the domains they give to the swear list...

[SisterTheresa]

<p>What I think is bad about this all is that the CS automatically said "you're banned because ..."  not .. "Okay let's see what I can do to look this up"</p><p>Automatically being called something, even if getting pulled into the accidental net, is not goo.  Goold ole guilty until proven innocent?  And nary and apology.</p><p>Sometimes SoE needs to man up and say whoops.</p>

[Decad]

<cite>SisterTheresa wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What I think is bad about this all is that the CS automatically said "you're banned because ..."  not .. "Okay let's see what I can do to look this up"</p><p>Automatically being called something, even if getting pulled into the accidental net, is not goo.  Goold ole guilty until proven innocent?  And nary and apology.</p><p>Sometimes SoE needs to man up and say whoops.</p></blockquote><p>Exactly, at the least anyone mistakenly caught up in the net as I think Grimwell put it, should at least get credit on their account for the banned days.</p><p>Now, i'm not for plat sellers and whatnot. I don't think that I would mind having my account checked out at some point in the future if they thought I did something. But be nice about it.</p><p>I haven't been this upset about getting spam plat tells as I am right now reading about how that first CS agent treated the OP.</p><p>Considering that treatment, I think at least a free month is in order for getting innocently dragged into a net, and losing a few days game play.</p><p>That would be a good customer service policy, no?</p><p>Hello SOE customer,</p><p>Sorry for the inconvience. Our filters inadvertently flagged your account for being fraudently involved with actions against the SOE terms of service. Thank you for being patient with our customer service agents in correcting OUR error. Please enjoy and accept some free subscription time in the form of <insert period of subscription time> for your incovience.</p><p>Yours truly,</p><p>SOE</p>

[Glisca]

SisterTheresa wrote: <blockquote><p>What I think is bad about this all is that the CS automatically said "you're banned because ..."  not .. "Okay let's see what I can do to look this up"</p><p>Automatically being called something, even if getting pulled into the accidental net, is not goo.  Goold ole guilty until proven innocent?  And nary and apology.</p><p>Sometimes SoE needs to man up and say whoops.</p></blockquote> I think thats exactly what makes me unhappy about this.  I'm all for catching these people and cleaning up my text box too, but Sony was a bit rude about it to Kazak.  The guy I got to help me was really nice, but the first guy Kazak got was telling him that he WAS a plat farmer and GM's wouldn't do this on accident because they have solid proof.  Heck Kazak even asked for a manager or another person to talk to, but this guy wouldn't do it.  He had to call back again for a different guy to get a petition sent through.  Two days later they finally take him off, but is there any two free days added to his billing? No.  Is there anything in his email or anywhere saying sorry? No. <img src="/smilies/c30b4198e0907b23b8246bdd52aa1c3c.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Decad]

<cite>KaldrinXanthin wrote:</cite><blockquote>All I know is I get spammed at least two or three times for every time I'm online... even when online for only a half hour the other day I got a tell. Maybe they can just add the domains they give to the swear list... </blockquote><p> That "other game" did that, however the plat sellers found another way around that too. </p><p>/que benny_hill_music;</p><p>/start film;</p><p>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZ-3W27f1LM</p>

[RelicAbyss]

Yanno, I can honestly say I haven't been hit up but maybe three times in the couple of weeks I've been back to EQ2.  I play on AB, and am flagged for RP, so I don't know if that makes me more difficult to pick out of the crowd and send a /tell to, or not.  I see quite a few people flag themselves as Anon for that purpose as well /shrug.

[Nolrog]

<cite>Chondrichtheyia wrote:</cite><blockquote>Could it also be possible that the plat farmer you and your friend made fun of reported you guys for plat selling? </blockquote><p> They don't ban based on one report.  Come to think of it, they don't ban based on any number of reports only.  They need a lot more evidence than that.  </p><p>They tried an automated ban thing in EQ, but it did catch a few people that were innocent.  So they turned the autoban off, and set it to notify CS about a person so they could investigate and manually ban if necessary.</p>

[Ama]

<cite>Grimwell wrote:</cite><blockquote>Any time you cast a net you are going to get some fish you didn't intend to catch. From there it's all about working out getting those fish back into the water safely. Sometimes it goes smoothly, sometimes it does not. I know it sucks when someone is identified and banned even though they are not a farmer, but any tool any company creates is going to get some false positives. If we loosen up the restrictions, more farmers get through, and we get plenty of feedback indicating that we don't catch enough of them already. I believe that falls under the 'Rock and a hard place' category. Please don't think I'm trivializing it (and I'm always available if you think you were nabbed for the wrong reasons), but farming is something where you have to draw a line in the sand somewhere, and there is no perfect line to draw sadly. Kukubird: I can't tell ya if it was toons or accounts, or if it was just a db purge - that was before my time and I don't see the CS stuff anyway, but any farmer removed is a good thing eh? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote><p> Actually I would have to say it's a catch 22 grim because your danged if you do danged if you don't as you say.  You catch flack from being too strict while you catch flack for being too loose.  </p><p>One thing I will say is that from alot of CSR complaints i've read I have hardly ever had problems with them.  </p><p>Deffinately believe the OP did the right thing calling SoE saying what happened, being clam and explaining his side in a thorough manner to the person on the other side of the phone.  If his account had not been unbanned as he was talking I assume it would have been unbanned if he explained what had happened.  </p><p>Dealing with CSRs and any phone scenario you have to be methodical.  First is being calm and making sure to explain your side of the story even though you may not get the response you want.  Second is being very detailed about what happened so SoE can check their logs.  If everything adds up then you may get lucky, however if things don't add up that means more time for investigation.  Third thing is to remember specific events and give explanations as to why you got banned or this happened to you.  </p><p>Obviously as one person said some people have gotten "accidentally" banned because they probably received tainted plat.  I don't buy plat and hate plat sellers/farmers with so much passion I could be considered a fanatic.  If I get banned over that incident where I have "tainted plat" i'll tell em to look at my merchant logs off my bulletin board.  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[chobitz]

<p>This happened on the other MMORPG I play (the game about "that ring" <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. They did a huge gold selling/buying ban and got some innocents in the net.</p><p> They called it getting the some dolphins in the net along with the tuna. I don't know how SOE does it but that other game's program flagged accounts that a) were a certain level, b) gave/mailed at least 1g to someone, and/or c)played x amount of hours a day.</p><p>I'm glad they reinstated the OP and his friend.</p>

[Kazak]

Kazak here again. Soe finally responded to my email and a Lead GM ended up apologizing for the inconvenience the ban caused me and ended up giving me 14 days for free added to my account. All is well, and I am back to the grind! -Kazak 51 Shadowknight Nagafen Server