A new class?.. Ninja?

[Taiken]

<p>Hi Everyone,</p><p>This is my first post but I've been on the game for nearly 3 years. Anyways on to my suggestion. I was wondering if sometime down the road if EQII could release a ninja class.. It would likely be a DPS class. The reason why I suggest this is...</p><p> I don't know about everyone else, the majority or the minority.. But I just feel like the game itself just keeps going further back in time rather than progressing towards teh future. Get what I mean?... </p><p> The development of a ninja class would attract a lot of people, because it's new... And it's interesting. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with the classes as they are right now.. The thing is it's jsut all been done before... There's nothing that new about them.. </p><p> There's very few mmo's that have a ninja class... Probably because it takes a lot to develop it into a game.. But I just feel like this could open up so many different doors to the franchise. The biggest influence for me on EQII is the Island of Mara, because it's looks kinda modern but still has that ancient feel.. The city, the people .. I actually became captivated by the quests. And to be honest the rest of the game was just that, a game... Interesting places, cool mobs etc.. But I didn't feel like it was really sparking the imagination.. Where as the whole whistling fist idea and that different clan thing is just really off the wall! </p><p> If you had a ninja class.. You could have villages in each of the starting cities instead of having just one starting city... Just think about it you know?.. No other mmo has something really developed like this. if EQII had a ninja class it'd be very well done and it would set the standard... The framework you know? </p><p> I'd be like moving forward in-time.. Instead of moving backwards going into the history of a snake race, or a history of a gnoll.. Why not have something like this that would kinda keep the medium between the medievil and the modern times?</p><p>Essay completed, what are you guys thoughts?.. Wouldn't you love to see a ninja class in EQII?.. </p>

[Legiax]

<p>Goto class forums, then goto Assassin.</p><p>Get yourself a Fae Wing Cloak and you an RP a ninja alll day.</p>

[MadTexan3]

<cite>Taiken wrote:</cite><blockquote> The development of a ninja class would attract a lot of people, because it's new... And it's interesting.</blockquote>There is nothing new or interesting about a ninja 'class', as a ninja is nothing more than an assassin in a certain costume.

[Jal]

If they added ninja they'd *HAVE* to add Pirate.

[TerriBlades]

<p>Its already been said, but Ima say it again anyways.</p><p>Assassins are your Ninja class you are looking for. They even have the hood to prove it. Deck that assassin out with a few Katana styled blades and there ya go.. Instant ninja gratification for ya. Ninjas are nothing more then glorified assassins. No need to add this as a new class. SFile this with all the beastlord requests.</p>

[joebyrdw]

<p>We really have a ninja class already only its not called ninja its called assassin. Our class armor is very ninja-esque. I keep my katana's and my gnomish spring stilts on me all the time. The Devs have already said no new classes untill the others are balanced and with they're current plans that will never happen. </p><p> Roll an assassin and pick up a class hat, some katana graphic swords, and gnomish stilts or a fae wing cloak and live on the Isle of mara. </p>

[Owilliams]

<p>OP an anime fan... ya think?</p><p>Ninja...</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p>

[Bozidar]

They already have a Ninja class...

[Galithdor]

And they already have a pirate class in too <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Swashy!

[Image_Vain]

In case that the last 10 posts didn't do it for ya: <span style="color: #cc0000">ASSASSIN</span> is a <span style="color: #cc0000">NINJA</span>!!!!!

[Bozidar]

<cite>Image_Vain wrote:</cite><blockquote>In case that the last 10 posts didn't do it for ya: <span style="color: #cc0000">ASSASSIN</span> is a <span style="color: #cc0000">NINJA</span>!!!!! </blockquote><p> I was going for</p><p>SOE Developers ==== Ninjas</p><p>Assassins work, though.. </p>

[Bre]

<p>I'm all for adding new classes! Once they master the current 24. And I think it would be really difficult adding without further getting into redundancy. Also to the above posters, ninjas using katana's... huh? </p><p>Brega - 70 Ranger, Test Server </p>

[Alir]

A <b>ninja</b> (忍者, <i>ninja</i><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Japanese" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">?</a>) is an <b><span style="font-size: xx-large">assassin</span></b> or spy in Japanese culture, usually trained for stealth. Appearing in fourteenth century feudal <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Japan</a>, and active from the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamakura_period" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Kamakura</a> to the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edo_period" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Edo period</a>, their roles may have included <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabotage" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">sabotage</a>, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espionage" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">espionage</a>, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconnaissance" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">scouting</a>, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">assassination</a> missions, perhaps in the service of feudal rulers (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daimyo" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">daimyo</a> or <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shogun" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">shogun</a>).

[Volkscience]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>OP an anime fan... ya think?</p><p>Ninja...</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote> That's hilarious... then we would have any number of "creative people" using names like "Narruto, Naruuto, Naaruto" <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Ranger13]

<p><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman">I want to be a Nija Vampire.</span></p>

[Taiken]

<p>Wow...I'm never posting here again you guys are so mean....Ever reply was a put down.. I hope somoene does this to you guys one day..</p>

[Rahatmattata]

<p>They should make the ninja class and make it a scout cloth tank IMO. Idea pretty much ripped from FFXI, but they would tank by avoidance and use ninjutsu to cast shadows of themselves so when the mob swings it hits the shadow instead of them. When there is a small window of time when the shadows are down waiting on recast, they rely on avoidance and if they get hit, its like a wizard taking a hit. No taunts, hold aggro through pure dps and ninjutsu spells. Awesome soloer, ok group tank, horrible raid tank.</p><p>Just an idear.</p><p>Don't pay any attention to the other posters. People just like to flame anything they don't agree with and make themselves look like morons on e-forums. A ninja may be an assassin, but an assassin is most definatly not a ninja. For that matter, a brigand, swashbuckler wizard and any other class in the game that kills stuff can be considered an assassin.</p>

[Galithdor]

<cite>Taiken wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow...I'm never posting here again you guys are so mean....Ever reply was a put down.. I hope somoene does this to you guys one day..</p></blockquote> mine wasnt a put down...i saw someone mention a pirate class and i just stated that swashy is pirate <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[joebyrdw]

<cite>Taiken wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow...I'm never posting here again you guys are so mean....Ever reply was a put down.. I hope somoene does this to you guys one day..</p></blockquote><p> Woa there slick almost all of us simply told you there is already a "ninja" type class in game. Honestly given your idea this thread stayed pretty nice. If you want to hear some really mean stuff make a post about wanting a vampire race.</p><p>Sounds like you might want to invest in some thicker skin, if you can't take criticisim you shouldn't ask what other people think.</p>

[Vifarc]

A new class: Ranger. Why not? They would choose being mainly sword user (Aragorn), or bow wielder. The D&D3.5 was a really good thing about. At now, the tanking Ranger, trough AAs, is only good with Fabled armors.

[Stabbath]

Maybe one day we can multiclass a monk and assassin. Uber ninja there.

[Norrsken]

Hmm.. Assassin for ninja, and brigand for pirate.

[Bozidar]

<cite>Taiken wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow...I'm never posting here again </p></blockquote>Promise? =P

[Galithdor]

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote: <blockquote>Hmm.. Assassin for ninja, and Swashbuckler for pirate. </blockquote>Fixed <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Maroger]

No new classes until BEASTLORDS are brought back.

[Rahatmattata]

<cite>Galithdor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote: <blockquote>Hmm.. Assassin for ninja, and Swashbuckler for making me sandwhiches and doing my laundary. </blockquote>Fixed <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote>Fixed again <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Norrsken]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>No new classes until BEASTLORDS are brought back.</blockquote>Beastlord NINJAS!

[liveja]

<p>I think the chances of new classes coming any time soon are pretty poor, regardless of what sort of classes they are. It's certainly not going to happen before the ROK expansion.</p><p>At this point, I don't think it should happen at all. There are simply too many issues in the way. Besides, we already have assassins.</p>

[Rahatmattata]

I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit. I could really care less if you want to call it a ninja or dreadnaught or happy fun time scout tank.

[Norrsken]

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit. I could really care less if you want to call it a ninja or dreadnaught or happy fun time scout tank.</blockquote>Problem is, this game already suffers from having too many tank classes.

[interstellarmatter]

<cite>Taiken wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow...I'm never posting here again...</p></blockquote> That would make you a ninja poster.

[Lornick]

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit. I could really care less if you want to call it a ninja or dreadnaught or happy fun time scout tank.</blockquote>I think monks & bruisers have a lock on the avoidance tank role.  I know that's not exactly what you're talking about.  You're talking more along the lines of a mix of a monk, assassin, and illusionist.  While it's not a bad idea, it would step on not one... but 3 class toes and just blur the line between classes even more.  Not only that but you would get all the classic hybrid gripes from other players... including your "ninja's".  They would be even worse then the monks whining.  "Why have a ninja tank for a group when XXX classes do it better? And if no one will take me as a tank then I should be able to do more damage then XXX classes otherwise why would a group choose me over them? etc"  Any of that sound familiar?  It's not like there aren't 1,000 consol games out there with ninja themes to get a ninja fix and they are designed and balanced around those types of game mechanics.

[Siogai]

<blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit.</blockquote> They call them Monks and Bruisers, they just aren't Scouts.  Scouts aren't, surprisingly, meant to tank... hence the "Scout" archetype.  We skirmish, we don't fight pitched battles. And, I'm sorry, but Swashbucklers =/= Pirates.  Don't care what you prancing fops want to call yourselves, but everyone knows that Brigands are the only *true* Pirates.  The (not so) few, the proud, the Seafury Buccaneers.

[Bozidar]

<cite>interstellarmatter wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Taiken wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Wow...I'm never posting here again...</p></blockquote> That would make you a ninja poster.</blockquote>/rofl'd irl..

[Malkosha]

<cite>Siogai wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit.</blockquote> They call them Monks and Bruisers, they just aren't Scouts.  Scouts aren't, surprisingly, meant to tank... hence the "Scout" archetype.  We skirmish, we don't fight pitched battles. And, I'm sorry, but Swashbucklers =/= Pirates.  Don't care what you prancing fops want to call yourselves, but everyone knows that Brigands are the only *true* Pirates.  The (not so) few, the proud, the Seafury Buccaneers. </blockquote><p> Unless you have ship to sail on, neither one of you are pirates. You can however, be Ninjas <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Maroger]

<cite>Malkosha wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Siogai wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit.</blockquote> They call them Monks and Bruisers, they just aren't Scouts.  Scouts aren't, surprisingly, meant to tank... hence the "Scout" archetype.  We skirmish, we don't fight pitched battles. And, I'm sorry, but Swashbucklers =/= Pirates.  Don't care what you prancing fops want to call yourselves, but everyone knows that Brigands are the only *true* Pirates.  The (not so) few, the proud, the Seafury Buccaneers. </blockquote><p> Unless you have ship to sail on, neither one of you are pirates. You can however, be Ninjas <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Actually the pirates have been shipwrecked -- what do you think all those old wrecks are but remnants of Pirate ships <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[DanaDark]

<p>...</p><p>I want ships =X</p><p>-gasps-</p>

[Raveller]

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>They should make the ninja class and make it a scout cloth tank IMO. </p></blockquote> Assassins can wear cloth armor. You're all set now.

[Malkosha]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Malkosha wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Siogai wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit.</blockquote> They call them Monks and Bruisers, they just aren't Scouts.  Scouts aren't, surprisingly, meant to tank... hence the "Scout" archetype.  We skirmish, we don't fight pitched battles. And, I'm sorry, but Swashbucklers =/= Pirates.  Don't care what you prancing fops want to call yourselves, but everyone knows that Brigands are the only *true* Pirates.  The (not so) few, the proud, the Seafury Buccaneers. </blockquote><p> Unless you have ship to sail on, neither one of you are pirates. You can however, be Ninjas <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Actually the pirates have been shipwrecked -- what do you think all those old wrecks are but remnants of Pirate ships <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> Ah. So, what do you call a shipwrecked Pirate (they must really byte at being Pirates) that can't get another ship? Why they must be a .... <drumroll> Brigand! <img src="/smilies/49869fe8223507d7223db3451e5321aa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Gninja3]

ooo add (g)ninjas Gnome Only Ninjas FTW!

[JohnDoe058]

<p>OP, sounds more like ur lookin for an addition to History/Lore and new geographic content, rather than a new class that would be functionally identical to an existing one.</p>

[Sanati]

The mythical ninja is absolutely nothing like the assassin of EQ2. Ninja are much more mystical, using body energy and "magic" to attack, and while assassination is in the job description, it's not necessarily their specialization. The real ninja is even further from the EQ2 assassin, as I don't believe it's possible to crouch down a little bit and make yourself invisible to somebody standing 2 feet away and looking in your direction. Not only that, but a ninja is simply a person whose practices ninjutsu, a form of martial arts much like any other, but is more specialized on survival and using anything available for that goal. They are as much assassins as the short fat kid living next door that takes taekwondo lessons after school.

[Siogai]

<cite>Malkosha wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Siogai wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit.</blockquote> They call them Monks and Bruisers, they just aren't Scouts.  Scouts aren't, surprisingly, meant to tank... hence the "Scout" archetype.  We skirmish, we don't fight pitched battles. And, I'm sorry, but Swashbucklers =/= Pirates.  Don't care what you prancing fops want to call yourselves, but everyone knows that Brigands are the only *true* Pirates.  The (not so) few, the proud, the Seafury Buccaneers. </blockquote><p> Unless you have ship to sail on, neither one of you are pirates. You can however, be Ninjas <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Last time I checked, I was hopping ships in Freeport to Nektulos and Thundering Steppes, and again from either of those places (on another ship!) to points beyond. Now, unless you're swimming from your home port to your adventuring places... <blockquote>The mythical ninja is absolutely nothing like the assassin of EQ2. Ninja are much more mystical, using body energy and "magic" to attack, and while assassination is in the job description, it's not necessarily their specialization. The real ninja is even further from the EQ2 assassin, as I don't believe it's possible to crouch down a little bit and make yourself invisible to somebody standing 2 feet away and looking in your direction. Not only that, but a ninja is simply a person whose practices ninjitsu, a form of martial arts much like any other, but is more specialized on survival and using anything available for that goal. They are as much assassins as the short fat kid living next door that takes taekwondo lessons after school.</blockquote> Excepting that, historically, the ninja were practitioners of the "art of the low war" which involved subterfuge, sabotage and, you guessed it, assassination!  I don't know about dancing on water, disappearing into thin air, catching arrows in the air and all that other crazy stuff, but the historical references remain that the "ninja" were, indeed, assassins... doing what the honour and Code-of-Bushido-bound Samurai could, as a point of honour, not do.

[Raveller]

<cite>Sanati wrote:</cite><blockquote>They are as much assassins as the short fat kid living next door that takes taekwondo lessons after school. </blockquote>Halflings can betray and become assassins. Really, they can.

[Rahatmattata]

<cite>Siogai wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>I still like my idea (well not originally my idea) of a cloth-wearing avoidance tank scout that uses "mystical and fantastic" abilities to hold aggro and cast shadows to avoid getting hit.</blockquote><p> They call them Monks and Bruisers, they just aren't Scouts.  </p><p><i>No, brawlers use hand to hand fighting or blunt crushing weapons, and parry/deflection/dodging/etc to avoid getting hit, and wear leather.</i> <i>The class I'm talking about would use stealth, have tracking, wield a katana and other martial arts weapons like nunchucks and shurikens and sicles and other crap. They would wear cloth which means they could get 2-3 shotted if they take a hit, maybe 1 shotted if unlucky, but have a base avoidance like a brawler, and even higher artificial avoidance through the use of casting shadows of themselves to trick the mobs into hitting the shadows. So a fully fabled/mastered well played ninja could have like 95%+ actual avoidance, but that 5% of the time they do take hits, they get pwnd. They could have some kind of abilities centered around stealth attacks and ambush such as smoke bombs, flash powders, etc to dump aggro to a target of their choice, or stun/daze a mob for a couple seconds: long enough to get a sneak attack in aimed at a vital part of the mob causing massive damage. Illusions, ranged attacks, poisons, single target memwipes could all be tricks of a ninja. Obviously this would have to be balanced to not make other classes obsolete (I'm not a dev but they could make stances that provide bonuses and penalties to certain abilities and lower the success/resistablitly of some abilities etc...).</i></p><p><i>But saying a ninja as I describe it is a brawler is pretty narrow minded. Just because they are both avoidance tanks doesn't make them play even remotely the same. Kinda like saying a warrior and crusader play the same <img src="/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></i></p><p>Scouts aren't, surprisingly, meant to tank... hence the "Scout" archetype.  We skirmish, we don't fight pitched battles. </p><i>Ironic then that I have an entire AA line dedicated to tanking, and do in fact tank quite a bit.</i></blockquote>

[Ithilmar]

<blockquote>No, brawlers use hand to hand fighting or blunt crushing weapons, and parry/deflection/dodging/etc to avoid getting hit, and wear leather. The class I'm talking about would use stealth, have tracking, wield a katana and other martial arts weapons like nunchucks and shurikens and sicles and other crap. They would wear cloth which means they could get 2-3 shotted if they take a hit, maybe 1 shotted if unlucky, but have a base avoidance like a brawler, and even higher artificial avoidance through the use of casting shadows of themselves to trick the mobs into hitting the shadows. So a fully fabled/mastered well played ninja could have like 95%+ actual avoidance, but that 5% of the time they do take hits, they get pwnd. They could have some kind of abilities centered around stealth attacks and ambush such as smoke bombs, flash powders, etc to dump aggro to a target of their choice, or stun/daze a mob for a couple seconds: long enough to get a sneak attack in aimed at a vital part of the mob causing massive damage. Illusions, ranged attacks, poisons, single target memwipes could all be tricks of a ninja. Obviously this would have to be balanced to not make other classes obsolete (I'm not a dev but they could make stances that provide bonuses and penalties to certain abilities and lower the success/resistablitly of some abilities etc...).</blockquote> So what you are asking for is a jack of all trades and master of all. ninja screwd up FFXI, and it is almost exactly as you are requesting here. Summoning shadows to defend you, using high DPS to keep hate, ect. All it did was make people say they 'need' Ninjas because the Warriors didn't have the mitigation, Monks didn't have the armor, Paladins slow down XP. Same exact thing would happen in EQ2, why take a fighter class when you can have 2-3 ninjas all bouncing hate around each other, never getting hit(95% avoidance... yeah just a bit high ya think), high DPS, can stealth around, scout, ect. With a huge avoidance of that nature and those tricks, there would be no purpose to having a standard fighter class at all. Heck with illusions and other little things, we might as well get rid of the mage classes and just have healers and ninjas.

[Dragowulf]

<cite>TerriBlades wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Its already been said, but Ima say it again anyways.</p><p>Assassins are your Ninja class you are looking for. They even have the hood to prove it. Deck that assassin out with a few Katana styled blades and there ya go.. Instant ninja gratification for ya. Ninjas are nothing more then glorified assassins. No need to add this as a new class. SFile this with all the beastlord requests.</p></blockquote> an assassin isnt a stupid ninja. an assassin is someone who assassinates. gosh drago.

[Image_Vain]

<cite>Dragowulf2 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>TerriBlades wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Its already been said, but Ima say it again anyways.</p><p>Assassins are your Ninja class you are looking for. They even have the hood to prove it. Deck that assassin out with a few Katana styled blades and there ya go.. Instant ninja gratification for ya. Ninjas are nothing more then glorified assassins. No need to add this as a new class. SFile this with all the beastlord requests.</p></blockquote> an assassin isnt a stupid ninja. an assassin is someone who assassinates. gosh drago. </blockquote> Ninja assassinate when ordered.

[Dragowulf]

Byakuya@Crushbone wrote: <blockquote><cite>Dragowulf2 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>TerriBlades wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Its already been said, but Ima say it again anyways.</p><p>Assassins are your Ninja class you are looking for. They even have the hood to prove it. Deck that assassin out with a few Katana styled blades and there ya go.. Instant ninja gratification for ya. Ninjas are nothing more then glorified assassins. No need to add this as a new class. SFile this with all the beastlord requests.</p></blockquote> an assassin isnt a stupid ninja. an assassin is someone who assassinates. gosh drago. </blockquote> Ninja assassinate when ordered. </blockquote>so do assassins or hitmens. i dont call a hitman a ninja do i? he is an assassin. they are assassins. have you ever played the game thief: deadly shadows? hes an assassin and he aint a ninja. he was more like a thief, a rogue the ninjas that were assassins were assassins in china. do our assassins do ninja kicks and throw shurikens?

[Sanati]

<cite>Siogai wrote:</cite><blockquote>Excepting that, historically, the ninja were practitioners of the "art of the low war" which involved subterfuge, sabotage and, you guessed it, assassination!  I don't know about dancing on water, disappearing into thin air, catching arrows in the air and all that other crazy stuff, but the historical references remain that the "ninja" were, indeed, assassins... doing what the honour and Code-of-Bushido-bound Samurai could, as a point of honour, not do. </blockquote> Any form of martial arts can be, and has been, used for killing people. Ninjutsu is no more designed for that purpose than any other, in fact the very basis of ninjutsu is opposite of killing. "Nin" means "endurance" and "self-restraint" and "jutsu" is "art" or "technique." Ninjutsu is the art of survival, created in a time of unrest in Japan where samurai following different leaders were always fighting each other. The battle fields (and often the spoils of victory) were the common people's fields and towns. They needed a way to protect themselves, so the ninja was born. I mean they literally use farm implements as weapons. Do not mistake the black robed figure in cheesy martial arts movies as accurate historical information. Yes some ninja did accept jobs as thieves and assassins as a way to survive, but so did many of the samurai you call honorable.

[Owilliams]

<p>OK, that's it!!</p><p>If we are gonna go all far-east and off target with EQ2 and start gnashing teeth for a sissy ninja, then we might as well go far west and make ME happy.</p><p>The new class to balance against the new ninja class will be... COWBOY!!!</p><p>Complete with Quick Draw ability and a nice pair of colt revolvers.</p><p>My point being that the world of Norrath has a certain lore and flavor to it that is specifically supposed to be along the classic fantasy lines for the most part.  I suspect that the current assassin class is gonna have to be what all the eastern gaming fans settle for if they want to be a ninja.  The actual NINJA would be a bit of a stretch for fitting into EQ2 without just throwing up the hands and making it a free-for-all.</p><p>If swashbuckers are as close as I am gonna get to being a cowboy, I think that the ninja fans are just gonna have to settle for assassins.</p><p>Happy Trails,</p><p>--Orv</p>

[Rahatmattata]

<cite>Ithilmar wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>No, brawlers use hand to hand fighting or blunt crushing weapons, and parry/deflection/dodging/etc to avoid getting hit, and wear leather. The class I'm talking about would use stealth, have tracking, wield a katana and other martial arts weapons like nunchucks and shurikens and sicles and other crap. They would wear cloth which means they could get 2-3 shotted if they take a hit, maybe 1 shotted if unlucky, but have a base avoidance like a brawler, and even higher artificial avoidance through the use of casting shadows of themselves to trick the mobs into hitting the shadows. So a fully fabled/mastered well played ninja could have like 95%+ actual avoidance, but that 5% of the time they do take hits, they get pwnd. They could have some kind of abilities centered around stealth attacks and ambush such as smoke bombs, flash powders, etc to dump aggro to a target of their choice, or stun/daze a mob for a couple seconds: long enough to get a sneak attack in aimed at a vital part of the mob causing massive damage. Illusions, ranged attacks, poisons, single target memwipes could all be tricks of a ninja. Obviously this would have to be balanced to not make other classes obsolete (I'm not a dev but they could make stances that provide bonuses and penalties to certain abilities and lower the success/resistablitly of some abilities etc...).</blockquote><p> So what you are asking for is a jack of all trades and master of all. ninja screwd up FFXI, and it is almost exactly as you are requesting here. Summoning shadows to defend you, using high DPS to keep hate, ect. All it did was make people say they 'need' Ninjas because the Warriors didn't have the mitigation, Monks didn't have the armor, Paladins slow down XP.</p><p><i>FFXI still seems fine and running strong to me. If you want someone that can cement aggro to themselves you get a paladin. If you want someone that has to avoid special abilities that can near 1 shot the most ubah paladin you get a ninja. But in most groups, it really doesn't matter who tanks. Warriors and monks are just sub par tanks compared to ninjas and paladins and theres only a few special circumstances where it's best to have a war/nin tank (like in some CoP missions). Also there's a HNM Charbroils or something like that (I forget spelling) in Sea Serpent Grotto that it's best to have a thf/nin tank with a bard because the straight up have the highest evasioin in the game hands down. But enough about FFXI, this isn't even about that game.</i> Same exact thing would happen in EQ2, why take a fighter class when you can have 2-3 ninjas all bouncing hate around each other, never getting hit(95% avoidance... yeah just a bit high ya think), high DPS, can stealth around, scout, ect. <i>You make assumptions on how much dps a ninja in eq2 would have, but let me quote because apparently you missed it.... "(I'm not a dev but they could make stances that provide bonuses and penalties to certain abilities and lower the success/resistablitly of some abilities etc...)" And no, 95% actual avoidance (using shadows) is not too high for a main tank with 20% mitigation and the HP of a scout. If it is, it can be balanced. I'm just throwing out numbers to show an example. Other tanks would still be desirable, but a ninja tank would just be a new way of tanking. Better in some situation, worse in others.</i> With a huge avoidance of that nature and those tricks, there would be no purpose to having a standard fighter class at all. Heck with illusions and other little things, we might as well get rid of the mage classes and just have healers and ninjas.</p><p><i>The class could be balanced. Don't get me wrong, I'm not fool enough to actually think there will be any new classes coming soon, but it's still fun to think about IMO. I'd play a blink tank.</i></p></blockquote>

[Morticus]

Great thread, thanks for the laughs.  <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Sanati]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>My point being that the world of Norrath has a certain lore and flavor to it that is specifically supposed to be along the classic fantasy lines for the most part.  I suspect that the current assassin class is gonna have to be what all the eastern gaming fans settle for if they want to be a ninja.  The actual NINJA would be a bit of a stretch for fitting into EQ2 without just throwing up the hands and making it a free-for-all.</p><p>If swashbuckers are as close as I am gonna get to being a cowboy, I think that the ninja fans are just gonna have to settle for assassins.</p><p>Happy Trails,</p><p>--Orv</p></blockquote> Now I am not asking for a ninja class, I'd be happy with <b>any</b> new classes, but the way this game is going I think ninja are more likely than most guesses or suggestions to make it in. The MMO market is Asia, plain and simple, and since EQ2 has come out the game has continuously been pushing for that market. New models, Fallen Dynasty, solo play, they are doing everything they can to make the game more appealing to Asian gamers, throwing ninja or samurai in wouldn't surprise me. A game's lore is not a static unmoving wall. It's fiction created at a whim to suit whatever the devs want added. Anything can be made to fit into the lore, just look at WoW. I would love a dual gun slinging class BTW. With all the engineered gadgets in the game, I don't see simple pistols being added as much of problem.