Minion's Warding...GU:36 Gone Wrong...

[Supernova17]

<b>Copied from the original thread: <a href="http://www.eq2flames.com/showthread.php?t=7143" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.eq2flames.com/showthread.php?t=7143</a> What SOE did:</b> # Intelligence 3 - Minion's Warding: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. # Intelligence 4 - Arcane Minion: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. <b> What SOE should have done:</b> # Intelligence 4 - Arcane Minion: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. # Intelligence 5 - Empower Servant: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. Tell me if you don't see the problem here... Live (Left) - Test (Right) <img src="http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/3333/eq2001430by7.jpg" border="0"> I'll make it simple, since no one outside our class (meaning Conj's and Necro's) understand our class better than we do. This ability is currently controlled by the Summoner as far as casting it goes, and can be applied to any of the Summoner's pets per of their choosing. The proposed changes make us lose that choice and the AA is instead forced upon us, with drastic consequences... The Mage pet has the HP of a wet paper bag and it's mitigation / resists make real people in treasured gear look like uber raiders in full fabled gear by comparison. Why exactly do we want the Mage pet intercepting damage? Especially on raids? We lose our pet to a strong AOE (which we had it /backed off and Bubble protected to begin with), we lose our DPS potential for at least the next 15-20 seconds, that is if we don't peel the mob off the tank since our pet's hate list just got dumped on top of our head and get pasted to the wall. I've been feedbacking and bug reporting for the last couple of days, hopefully they'll hear us and take notice.

[Xalmat]

Good points made. I'm not 100% sure I'll always want my Fire pet to intercept damage. On the other hand, this ability isn't Fire pet only; it also works on the Earth, Air, and Water pets.

[DobyMT]

The point we're making Xal is that this is a complete slap in the face of raiders, since we all have AE immunity for the pet, and AEs will STILL hit the pet visa vie intercepting damage from us. This spell should be toggleable.

[Xalmat]

<cite>DobyMT wrote:</cite><blockquote>This spell should be toggleable.</blockquote>/agree

[mdell]

<p><img src="http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/3333/eq2001430by7.jpg" border="0"> </p><p>Hmm, the way i read this is that we while previously we recieved only 4% damage when the spell procs, now we will recieve 91%</p><p>Damage when it procs. (I am assuming at rank 4 it will be 64% although i have no idea if it is 9% per rank after the 1st)  To me it</p><p>looks as if in exchange for the added damage that the conj takes when the spell procs the damage component to the pet has been </p><p>removed.  This stands to reason because the old version of the spell at rank 4 did 4% to you, 64% to pet, and negated the other</p><p>32% completely.  So if the spell does do 9% per rank at 4 you would now take 64% of the damage and 36% will be negated.  Maybe</p><p>I am being optomistic here, but if I am right it seems like a fine change and something we have some control over with resist gear, and stuff. </p>

[DobyMT]

Well, also atm, resists are broken, or better stated, not working properly. That kinda throws that one out too. Either way, there's no reason this is permanent.

[Themaginator]

<cite>Supernova17 wrote:</cite><blockquote><b>Copied from the original thread: <a href="http://www.eq2flames.com/showthread.php?t=7143" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.eq2flames.com/showthread.php?t=7143</a> What SOE did:</b> # Intelligence 3 - Minion's Warding: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. # Intelligence 4 - Arcane Minion: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. <b> What SOE should have done:</b> # Intelligence 4 - Arcane Minion: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. # Intelligence 5 - Empower Servant: Is now a permanent buff applied to pet. Tell me if you don't see the problem here... Live (Left) - Test (Right) <img src="http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/3333/eq2001430by7.jpg" border="0"> I'll make it simple, since no one outside our class (meaning Conj's and Necro's) understand our class better than we do. This ability is currently controlled by the Summoner as far as casting it goes, and can be applied to any of the Summoner's pets per of their choosing. The proposed changes make us lose that choice and the AA is instead forced upon us, with drastic consequences... The Mage pet has the HP of a wet paper bag and it's mitigation / resists make real people in treasured gear look like uber raiders in full fabled gear by comparison. Why exactly do we want the Mage pet intercepting damage? Especially on raids? We lose our pet to a strong AOE (which we had it /backed off and Bubble protected to begin with), we lose our DPS potential for at least the next 15-20 seconds, that is if we don't peel the mob off the tank since our pet's hate list just got dumped on top of our head and get pasted to the wall. I've been feedbacking and bug reporting for the last couple of days, hopefully they'll hear us and take notice. </blockquote>i think if i ever went to that website the sheer amount of whining about EQ2 may make me gouge out my eyes

[Supernova17]

It's actually a great resource and a good place to bounce ideas off some of the best players in the game, especially new combat changes. The Developers are more active/responsive there than they are here because there's actual facts and data to support claims and such rather than *OMG we got nerfed, ever since LU35 my tank pet takes more damage* nonsense drivel you hear here. The problem with Minion's Warding was caught on the first night the notes were released by Flames regulars, and none of the regulars here caught on (as there's a lack of posts or knowledge about the subject) until we put up threads like these. Did you have something constructive to add to this post though? If not, lets get back on topic because this is an important issue with regards to our Mage pet's viability.

[Themaginator]

<cite>Supernova17 wrote:</cite><blockquote>It's actually a great resource and a good place to bounce ideas off some of the best players in the game, especially new combat changes. The Developers are more active/responsive there than they are here because there's actual facts and data to support claims and such rather than *OMG we got nerfed, ever since LU35 my tank pet takes more damage* nonsense drivel you hear here. The problem with Minion's Warding was caught on the first night the notes were released by Flames regulars, and none of the regulars here caught on (as there's a lack of posts or knowledge about the subject) until we put up threads like these. Did you have something constructive to add to this post though? If not, lets get back on topic because this is an important issue with regards to our Mage pet's viability. </blockquote>Don't take it so seriously its just a small comment that was made in jest on a silly little forum about another silly forum about a video game=P. Who cares if it was off topic, i mean why do we play this game and post on these forums...not to be mad all the time and always arguing about things that are in the big picture trivial, i don't know but i play EQ2 to have fun isn't there enough conflict in real life, i don't like to be mean to people on the forums and i think its crazy to hold grudges against random people on the interwebs, so yeah just try to lighten up a bit dude. Anyway theres already another well developed thread on this so you should of posted it there, and as for the website, sounds interesting i guess i should check it out, it just sounds like its filled with whining from the name LOL.

[Supernova17]

This thread brings more attention to a specific problem, the other thread is just a general one and can be prone to going off to another topic like the scout pet etc, while this is the topic that concerns solely our Mage pet.

[Themaginator]

<cite>Supernova17 wrote:</cite><blockquote>This thread brings more attention to a specific problem, the other thread is just a general one and can be prone to going off to another topic like the scout pet etc, while this is the topic that concerns solely our Mage pet. </blockquote>well ok i guess that works...carry on, i've retired from this argument because it was taking up far to much of my time where i could have been gaming or something else lol.

[hellfire]

Its a good site with very dedicated and knowledge people.These forums actually have  10X more  whineing imo.

[mdell]

<p><span style="font-size: x-small">Ok so the last reply that actually talked about the changes to minions warding was mine, and then crazyness ensued.  I</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small">just see it as changing from an emergency spell to one that mitigates some of the aoe's damage when we do get hit.</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small">Supernova and xalmat think it is a mage pet killer so can anyone chime in with anything else.  </span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small">If you want to read eq2flames then do and if you don't then don't, but that is not what supernova started this thread about</span></p>

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

I always thought this spell worked like this: Summoner Point of View - Puts an effect on your pet called Minion's Warding. Pet Point of View - Has a buff that says the following: 20% of the time you intercept damage of target (in this case, the summoner... otherwise, why are we intercepting damage from the pet?). Caster of the effect from the buff takes a small % of damage, and the target (the one who's damage is being reduced) is showing a reduced amount of damage. So in the end, the pet is only taking like 1% damage per rank, while reducing the summoner's damage by 9% per rank. The new one on test seems to at least match the amount reduced, without really saying how much the pet is taking. However, as per the testers on the necro board, the tooltip is saying that the pet is now taking 0 damage from the intercept. So basically the end result is a reduction in pet damage to nil (from a very small percent to begin with), as well as no longer needing to cast it AND it's useable on all pets. As a soloer, I'd be very much tempted to try going down all three lines and see how 3x 20% avoidance, physical and magical blockings help on the tank pet. For raiding though, as far as I can tell it just seems like a very nice way to reduce AE damage, and now it works regardless of which pet you have.

[Treefellinawood]

<p>I only ever play with warlock in offensive stance and don't raid. I 2 box with my warden and self tank using my necro. I always have minions warding up (as it should help in theory - unless my pet is constantly dying). What I've found is my pet almost never takes any serious damage from having minion's warding up and I can't recall ever having lost my pet due to this spell (although lost pet plenty when he pulls aggro). I don't parse so I was wondering if it really IS proccing 20% of the time (considering my pet (M1) has a little over 1k health and I take some pretty serious spike damage sometimes of up to 2.5k from named...Gear is mostly legendary + Xhaviz GoG).</p><p>If SOE have to make this spell passive (it must be pretty awful on raids from what posters are saying) would it maybe make more sense to turn it into a buff that let's the caster have a 20% chance to gain an additional roll with the pet's defense to evade an incoming attack or something similar).</p><p>ps I know it's off topic, but in relation to charmed pets no longer being implodable (or splodable as our guild has so lovingly come to know this ability)...../cry</p>

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

If it's only absorbing 8% of the damage, then it's not going to get hit for a lot anyways. A 5k hit will only do 400 damage to the pet. And if it's ignoring other AE's then that's the only damage it should ever take unless it pulls aggro. And going by the tooltips on the test (according to a full time tester on the necro forums), it's doing 0%... so NO damage. So I fail to see how this is going to be some major issue.

[DobyMT]

Again, like we've said, that goes against the Intercept mechanic, BUT if i goes like that, then no problem. Also, who said 8% Its 36% at rank 4. That's an 1800 hit, which kills my pet. That's the issue.

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

Live description shows 1% per rank in damage to the pet, and a reduction of damage on the "target" (summoner). So while it's reducing the damage by 36% (target takes only 64% damage), the pet is only taking 4% damage. That's how it worked in Live... and as far as I've heard in test, it's only better (0%.. but that might be a bug that gets fixed).

[DobyMT]

<img src="http://www.EQ2Flames.com/imagehosting/20294677593fa224c.jpg" border="0"> This is what's there now at rank 8. Doing what testing I can, mobs in Bloodlines instance Unearthed, and dueling with my boxed Fury, WHILE running my ACT, it appears to be true. This is a change that isn't bad, but its not a great change, since its so unreliable. However, I tried this with the Mage pet, Tank pet, AND Scout pet. Intercept on all 3 pets, and none of them took a point of dmg. As of now, this going live we are not hurt.

[Xalmat]

<cite>DobyMT wrote:</cite><blockquote><img src="http://www.EQ2Flames.com/imagehosting/20294677593fa224c.jpg" border="0"> This is what's there now at rank 8. Doing what testing I can, mobs in Bloodlines instance Unearthed, and dueling with my boxed Fury, WHILE running my ACT, it appears to be true. This is a change that isn't bad, but its not a great change, since its so unreliable. However, I tried this with the Mage pet, Tank pet, AND Scout pet. Intercept on all 3 pets, and none of them took a point of dmg. As of now, this going live we are not hurt. </blockquote>If it stays this way when it goes live, then I'd say it's one good improvement.

[DobyMT]

Yah, it certainly is. I recant my slamming against the devs until the change is live. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Sunrayn]

<p>As of right now, the description on Minion's Warding says:</p><p>Grants pet a 20% chance to *prevent* 36% of the spell damage you recieve.</p><p>Pet takes no damage from prevented spell damage.  It also works with all primary pets.  I got to try it out in ToS last night as did a necro from test server.</p><p>Which is as it should be for being the only 'Intercept' ability that is passive.</p><p>I guess I dont need to 'learn game mechanics' or 'L2P', I think I know them pretty well.</p><p>Some folks need to have an open mind about things before slamming someone else with childish remarks.</p><p>Sunrayn, 70 guard/Garinof 70 conj--Test server</p>