Squeletal revamp: ok, work in progress but ...

[Titigabe]

Hi everyone. We'ev been wainting soooooo long for it, and still not yet implemented. Ok ok ... I know, I know... it'll come when it is done, and this is quite a good news, since they seem to take the time it takes. So, really good point to it. But... this is a long date work in progress... I'm sure there are many things that can already be presented, even in a alpha, beta ... or whatever state. Look and Feel forum is the perfect place for it, it could help dev's and players to discuss about what we are waiting from it, and how they are working on it, sharing ideas and precious opinion, to make this change a real success, and not a "surprise" wich will, as alaways, disappoint some. Yes, yet another topic about this... And I guess it'll not be the last one, until we don't know more about this <img src="/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Mirander_1]

Well, in the EQ2 Alla Dev Chat, they did give a little info on it, including a rough date of when it should be completed: <b><Tamat> Our first question comes from Mirander of Unrest <Tamat> Are you guys still working on that revamp of character models?  And if you are, could we get any new info on it?  A rough timeframe until it's finished, more info on what exactly this change entails, things like that.</b> <Gallenite> Indeed we still are.  I'm thrilled to say that it's been progressing very well.  For the past few months, this has become much more of a hard production project and much less of an R&D effort.  When we said this was a long term project last year, we weren't joking around.  It has been a ton of work.    (more) <Gallenite> There are two main goals - Both improvements in performance as well as improving the speed at which we can create new visible armor.  <Gallenite> We've had to improve both the underlying character systems, as well as how they tie into our game data, and introduce significant new morphing tech into our engine. <Gallenite> At the moment, we're targetting having it out by the end of calendar 2007.  Expect us to start talking more about it this fall.

[Velsha]

It took me a moment to figure out what this thread was about.

[Titigabe]

Thank you Mirander, this is good news, thank you for sharing them :p

[DanaDark]

<p>Hmm "new morphing tech" ... this could mean easier armor creation since armors could morph better to fit a character...</p><p>...</p><p>BUT, could also mean morphing of character skeletons and models to allow for... SITTING maybe.. I hope.. ><</p>

[Themaginator]

Squeletons? heh

[Chay]

Will there be a new l and l for Squeletals? OMG! They so need to make a new NPC race and call them Squeletals! They can have chibi heads with big pulsing eyes, drool coming out one side of their mouth, they can have big bunny ears, and run around going "SQUEEE! SQUEE!" when they encounter something cute. Then they eat it!

[Themaginator]

<cite>Chayna wrote:</cite><blockquote>Will there be a new l and l for Squeletals? OMG! They so need to make a new NPC race and call them Squeletals! They can have chibi heads with big pulsing eyes, drool coming out one side of their mouth, they can have big bunny ears, and run around going "SQUEEE! SQUEE!" when they encounter something cute. Then they eat it! </blockquote>HAHAHA i want one!

[Wyrmypops]

<p>Hehe, that description of a Squeletal got me thinking of a cute <a href="http://paizo.com/image/product/catalog/DTW/DTWPZO01_500.jpeg" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Cthulhu. </a><img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Always called then Skelebones myself. <img src="/smilies/499fd50bc713bfcdf2ab5a23c00c2d62.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>I'm looking forward to this skeletal revamp even more after that tidbit from the devs. Improving performance. Blimey. Nice one.  <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Chay]

i'm still squeeptical... or skeptical even... ~~~squee squee~~~

[Emerix]

Coming out with Rise of Kunark i bet .

[Drewx]

<p>I too believe that the revamp will end up in the RoK expansion. It just seems like something that would be easier to implment in an expansion.</p><p>I just hope it isn't just like new appearances so we don't have... Normal, SOGA, Revamp. I think it's new animations, and armor fittings. Hopefully it won't be bland though...I want the races to move more uniquely and fluidly, and their armor to look more unique to the race.</p><p>For example: Kerra, I think they should huntch alittle like Gnolls, and when they fight they should get into a very vicious cat like stance, breathing deeply, tails up in the air, snarling, and swinging viciously and quickly. Trolls and Ogres should swing away violently and recklessly cutting the ground, pulling their sword out of the ground, you know like a big brute does fight...kinda like in that opening movie and etc. Iksar should tail whip and when they swing a weapon it should look like they are swinging it with all their might, Iksar have never been forgiving foes so why should they attack so casually? The Elves need to be quick and agile and fluid in their moves, it'd be nice if they strike once then spin around and strike again as they come out of the spin, and then quickly throw in a third hit and so on in a very smooth and agile rage.</p><p>Frogloks should jump with some attacks, like jump up and drive their weapon down on or into their enemy, and duck low, and have a nice little sidestep/sidehop animation, perhaps even have a powerful jumping upward slash. Gnomes, Halflings, and Ratoinga need to flip around. They are so small they should swing fast and spin around, flip back, forward, from side to side, and etc while parrying and countering and attacking. I know fro mthe movies...small races use their height and speed to their advantage. I see a Ratonga Assassin leaping around, rolling across the dirt, and springing up with a slash.</p><p>Humans, Barbarians, and Dwarves just need some unique animation, they've never been all that different from the current style...although Barbarians should have some UMPH in their swings, and Dwarves should do some crazy crap with axes.</p><p>Half Elves...I say get a choice of Human or Elvin fighting styles.</p><p>Erudites (High Elves should have the option too)....they should attack like sissies...like tap the enemy with the tip of their sword and poke them mildly with it, then they should cower and somehow evade, and in a fit of rage backhand the mob with their weapon.</p><p>Dark Elves...if they dont take that agile path they should fight like the evil sons of ____es they are. Kicking in the groin, pistol-whiping enemies with their sword, slashing furiously, slashing below the belt, every blow almost like a mortal blow.</p><p>Fae and Arasai...good grief...2 styles... 1. On the ground they actually fight like the other races....but they use the wings to evade and dodge, and etc. 2. They dive into the enemy, and twirl away, and connect with consequtive quick precise blows. The current Fae style looks like they are having a tantrum...or a seizure.</p><p>Anyways thats my 2 cents I doubt any of this would happen but it's fun to dream.</p>

[Josgar]

<cite>Drewx wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I too believe that the revamp will end up in the RoK expansion. It just seems like something that would be easier to implment in an expansion.</p><p>I just hope it isn't just like new appearances so we don't have... Normal, SOGA, Revamp. I think it's new animations, and armor fittings. Hopefully it won't be bland though...I want the races to move more uniquely and fluidly, and their armor to look more unique to the race.</p><p>For example: Kerra, I think they should huntch alittle like Gnolls, and when they fight they should get into a very vicious cat like stance, breathing deeply, tails up in the air, snarling, and swinging viciously and quickly. Trolls and Ogres should swing away violently and recklessly cutting the ground, pulling their sword out of the ground, you know like a big brute does fight...kinda like in that opening movie and etc. Iksar should tail whip and when they swing a weapon it should look like they are swinging it with all their might, Iksar have never been forgiving foes so why should they attack so casually? The Elves need to be quick and agile and fluid in their moves, it'd be nice if they strike once then spin around and strike again as they come out of the spin, and then quickly throw in a third hit and so on in a very smooth and agile rage.</p><p>Frogloks should jump with some attacks, like jump up and drive their weapon down on or into their enemy, and duck low, and have a nice little sidestep/sidehop animation, perhaps even have a powerful jumping upward slash. Gnomes, Halflings, and Ratoinga need to flip around. They are so small they should swing fast and spin around, flip back, forward, from side to side, and etc while parrying and countering and attacking. I know fro mthe movies...small races use their height and speed to their advantage. I see a Ratonga Assassin leaping around, rolling across the dirt, and springing up with a slash.</p><p>Humans, Barbarians, and Dwarves just need some unique animation, they've never been all that different from the current style...although Barbarians should have some UMPH in their swings, and Dwarves should do some crazy crap with axes.</p><p>Half Elves...I say get a choice of Human or Elvin fighting styles.</p><p>Erudites (High Elves should have the option too)....they should attack like sissies...like tap the enemy with the tip of their sword and poke them mildly with it, then they should cower and somehow evade, and in a fit of rage backhand the mob with their weapon.</p><p>Dark Elves...if they dont take that agile path they should fight like the evil sons of ____es they are. Kicking in the groin, pistol-whiping enemies with their sword, slashing furiously, slashing below the belt, every blow almost like a mortal blow.</p><p>Fae and Arasai...good grief...2 styles... 1. On the ground they actually fight like the other races....but they use the wings to evade and dodge, and etc. 2. They dive into the enemy, and twirl away, and connect with consequtive quick precise blows. The current Fae style looks like they are having a tantrum...or a seizure.</p><p>Anyways thats my 2 cents I doubt any of this would happen but it's fun to dream.</p></blockquote>Excuse me... but I don't know where all of this "High Elves are sissies" bull is coming from. Elves are noble... and have always been noble. We wouldnt poke things with the end of our swords. We would gallantly swing our swords. People really need to pay more attention to lore.

[Drewx]

<cite>Josgar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Drewx wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I too believe that the revamp will end up in the RoK expansion. It just seems like something that would be easier to implment in an expansion.</p><p>I just hope it isn't just like new appearances so we don't have... Normal, SOGA, Revamp. I think it's new animations, and armor fittings. Hopefully it won't be bland though...I want the races to move more uniquely and fluidly, and their armor to look more unique to the race.</p><p>For example: Kerra, I think they should huntch alittle like Gnolls, and when they fight they should get into a very vicious cat like stance, breathing deeply, tails up in the air, snarling, and swinging viciously and quickly. Trolls and Ogres should swing away violently and recklessly cutting the ground, pulling their sword out of the ground, you know like a big brute does fight...kinda like in that opening movie and etc. Iksar should tail whip and when they swing a weapon it should look like they are swinging it with all their might, Iksar have never been forgiving foes so why should they attack so casually? The Elves need to be quick and agile and fluid in their moves, it'd be nice if they strike once then spin around and strike again as they come out of the spin, and then quickly throw in a third hit and so on in a very smooth and agile rage.</p><p>Frogloks should jump with some attacks, like jump up and drive their weapon down on or into their enemy, and duck low, and have a nice little sidestep/sidehop animation, perhaps even have a powerful jumping upward slash. Gnomes, Halflings, and Ratoinga need to flip around. They are so small they should swing fast and spin around, flip back, forward, from side to side, and etc while parrying and countering and attacking. I know fro mthe movies...small races use their height and speed to their advantage. I see a Ratonga Assassin leaping around, rolling across the dirt, and springing up with a slash.</p><p>Humans, Barbarians, and Dwarves just need some unique animation, they've never been all that different from the current style...although Barbarians should have some UMPH in their swings, and Dwarves should do some crazy crap with axes.</p><p>Half Elves...I say get a choice of Human or Elvin fighting styles.</p><p>Erudites (High Elves should have the option too)....they should attack like sissies...like tap the enemy with the tip of their sword and poke them mildly with it, then they should cower and somehow evade, and in a fit of rage backhand the mob with their weapon.</p><p>Dark Elves...if they dont take that agile path they should fight like the evil sons of ____es they are. Kicking in the groin, pistol-whiping enemies with their sword, slashing furiously, slashing below the belt, every blow almost like a mortal blow.</p><p>Fae and Arasai...good grief...2 styles... 1. On the ground they actually fight like the other races....but they use the wings to evade and dodge, and etc. 2. They dive into the enemy, and twirl away, and connect with consequtive quick precise blows. The current Fae style looks like they are having a tantrum...or a seizure.</p><p>Anyways thats my 2 cents I doubt any of this would happen but it's fun to dream.</p></blockquote>Excuse me... but I don't know where all of this "High Elves are sissies" bull is coming from. Elves are noble... and have always been noble. We wouldnt poke things with the end of our swords. We would gallantly swing our swords. People really need to pay more attention to lore. </blockquote><p>Ahaha...Josgar I admit I was purposely taking a cheap shot at High Elves and Erudites just for the hell of it.</p><p>NO one would play them if they tapped an enemy and then ran away screaming like a rich englishman who just spilled his tea in his lap. It was just a cheap shot.</p><p>But you have to agree some racially unique stances, fighting styles would breath some fresh air into the game. </p>

[Emerix]

I doubt they put in really new animations . its more a skeletal revamp so its easier to put in new armors as far as i know .

[Findara]

Well with a new skele as the base for all the models one would think not only is it easier to lay on new armor, but scripting the joints to move would be easier.

[Emerix]

<p>if you make different animations for every race it will be even harder than now to make new armor and stuff . fortunately this isnt Morrowind where characters are made of hard parts . Like action figures . here the different parts like arms and such are morphing themselves as they move .So you have to make every animation with every single piece of armor . that makes it all so hard .</p><p>i think ...</p>

[kitsuneshou]

Id like it if they would somehow merge the claymation and anime apperances so that I dont have to go back out and fiddle around with the claymation version so my chara isnt ugly.

[Emerix]

buy yourself a better pc or turn the settings up . So not clay ..

[DanaDark]

Kalyria@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>buy yourself a better pc or turn the settings up . So not clay ..</blockquote><p> I play on max settings without shadows... For no reason what so ever do I ever turn character detail Below Maximum.</p><p>Still: Claymation.</p>

[Dragowulf]

<cite>DanaDark wrote:</cite><blockquote>Kalyria@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>buy yourself a better pc or turn the settings up . So not clay ..</blockquote><p> I play on max settings without shadows... For no reason what so ever do I ever turn character detail Below Maximum.</p><p>Still: Claymation.</p></blockquote> agreed. drago.

[Darian]

Why was the skeletal system made the way it is in the first place? did they not know it would take forever to make armors for each race? Don't they know people like different looks, different armors, different colors? seems like a half [Removed for Content] concept for them not to have the revamp way from the get go.

[Deson]

Paznos@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote>Why was the skeletal system made the way it is in the first place? did they not know it would take forever to make armors for each race? Don't they know people like different looks, different armors, different colors? seems like a half [Removed for Content] concept for them not to have the revamp way from the get go. </blockquote>When the current engine was being built, a lot of factors where being built with the expectations of tools/hardware that never materialized or didn't work as well has intended. One of those tools was an armor auto-resizer demonstrated in an alpha clip a long time ago. SOGA was also unplanned and when it was conceived, the thought was that it's art was going to be done by what is essentially now Taiwan office. They've been working on this for at least a year now but, changes of this magnitude for everything involved take a ridiculous amount of time