Help promote mezz-wise groups! Inform these peoples!

[Bluu]

I recently put up a thread in the main gameplay forum that is basically strenuously trying to inform people about what to do while grouped with an enchanter. I'm tired of our CC abilities being tossed aside in groups. Please help me inform people! Go to this thread and post your advice on what to do when you're grouped with an enchanter. Keep these people enchanter-informed! <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=364625�" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...25�</a>

[Lee Hor]

yes, its very anoying that people could be saved if they just did what they should be doing and assisting the tank, but to them they see such a loss in dps doing this.. i understand this but what realy does get to me is when your in unrest/oob/niz/Nek 3 or any other zone that contains white/ yellow conned heroic mobs and you get adds then the wiz/warlock takes it upon himself to root and nuke/dot the add(s). I had this in oob a couple, of days ago with a tank that pulled the fairy creatures with the night blood named so i first attempted to mezz named because tank was targeting the fairys then the wiz decided to nuke the named, so i switched to the fairys and mezzed what i could there and then people were confused and started fighting everything again, so i remezzed the fairys again and again while souting to the wiz on vent ASSIST THE F*****G TANK!!!. also I have macros set up for mezzes. We won in the end lol. Maybe wizards DPS isnt enough for them, maybe they want to cc too, or maybe there just trigger happy or want to play the hero. Its kinda funny sometimes when the grp get wiped though this and/or your the last man standing.. But most of the time it makes me feel abit [I cannot control my vocabulary] and i wonder if there is someone in the grp thinking Why didnt the coercer do his job, when we trying too, but are prevented. We do have a few other backup options though being the end wisdom line charm and grp stun etc, but mezzing is realy what should be used in an OH [I cannot control my vocabulary] situation i think.

[Flipmode]

You are wasting your time.  Aside from a few zones in this game, mez is not needed in a group setting.  It is mainly a solo or small group tool.  A solid group in your average zones will not need mez and you are slowing them down trying to mez.  DPS and earn your keep.

[Tallika_Runwithbears]

your wasting your time trying to educate the masses here on the forums.  too many trolls and flamers will pop up to tear into each post you make.  Instead keep trying to educate the groups you're in about how they can change their usual stratagy to mesh better with your most powerful skills.   Everytime they start screaming DPS DPS they should be instead looking to you for more control of the situation.   But with any really powerful skill you should know when to use it and more importantly when NOT to use it.   Fortuantly this is much easier when your in guild groups among people that you play with frequently, probably harder to do in PUGs where your just a group of strangers and there are people that just keep doing what they always do and never listen to advice.

[Sigunn]

<p>Flip - I am always surprised at coercers who think mezzing is not needed. If you dont need to mezz - then your group is taking on too easy stuff. Maybe its because your tank doesnt understand what a coercer adds to the group.</p><p>If you are fighting lower lvl and white conned mobs, you only need to dps and stun/daze/whatever. By all means do so, and dont slow the group by mezzing. </p><p>But to really have fun, you need a group w good people who know their classes, everyone use all their best abilities and work together. With the coercer mezzing and using all the tools we have, groups can achieve things they didnt know they could. Why go slaughter easy mobs when you can go for the tougher ones and have a real fight! You are the CC, you should have to be on your toes all the time!</p><p>I repeat - if you dont need to mezz, you are fighting baby stuff.</p><p>/Ramborg, lvl 59 coercer of Norrsken, Venekor</p><p>Proud conqueror of Nest of the Great Egg at lvl 58 w a t6-group</p>

[Mistletoes]

That's actually an interesting take on things. Rather than attacking the mezzer, attack the group's choice of targets. Unfortunately, there aren't many Nizara-like zones in the game that people want to go to. It looks like people just always want the low hanging fruit.

[AziBam]

Sorry, but it is just silly to say that if you don't mez in groups then you are fighting too low content.  Why you might ask?  Because in all the T7 zones other than 2 (or maybe 3) the vast majority of groups complete them just fine without an enchanter.  Furthermore, if they do those same instances with an enchanter that is group mezzing (within encounters in particular) then it will take them substantially longer to finish the run.  That is just the plain and simple truth.  I totally agree with Flipmode.  In a full group it is rarely needed.  In small groups or certainly solo it can be huge.  We trio'd most of OoB recently with myself, a 70 brig, and a fury.  Could we have done that without mez?  Of course not.  After more guildmates logged in and joined us I mezzed virtually nothing else in the zone and just focused on dps and stuns.  Doing otherwise would have been a waste and hampered our progress through the remainder of the zone.  My runs through unrest have been just as successful when I've tanked as my SK without a chanter as when I've brought the coercer.  (Although I loved stunning the ever loving bejeezes out of the High Priest in particular...I believe his total damage output for the fight once was only about 1000 points...I think it was one hit.)  <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  The benefits of bringing the coercer to that zone were in buffs, regen, stuns, some dps, etc.  Am I saying I never mezzed in unrest?  Certainly not.  That is a zone with mobs that hit hard enough that if you take an add they warrant being told to shush and stay still for a while until they can be disposed of at our leisure. But that was only when it was needed for keeping the group alive and certainly not a regular event. In short, mezz is a tool.  Use it wisely.  Knowing when <b>not</b> to use it is just as important as knowing when <b>to</b> use it. 

[Sigunn]

<p>AziBam, not everyone is lvl 70.</p><p>And to get back to the subject of the thread, I have had very little problems with groups breaking my mezzes. When I get a pickup group and someone breaks mezz, I re-mezz and use the "Mezzing %t!" macro. After a few fights they usually get it. If not, I send the person breaking mezz a tell asking him to assist the tank and that usually solves the problem. Apparently there are good PUGs out there!</p><p>/Ramborg, 59 coercer of Norrsken, Venekor</p>

[JackAll]

<p>Lol how arogant is that?</p><p>"I havnt really been a coercer for a long time but Im pretty sure I know better than you. I know you are higher level and have played longer but I guess you are just a little slow..."</p><p>If you are mezzing one of 3 thing are happening.</p><p>1. You are slowing your group down (most likely you are one of those "I dont do dps I just CC" types that gives enchanters a bad name)</p><p>2. The tank had a bad pull and you have more mobs than you can handle. And this is slowing you down.</p><p>3. You are in one of the few hard zones in the game.</p><p>Pick one</p><p>/Zaleo</p>

[Wrapye]

I remember talking to Lyndro at last year's Fan Faire.  He designed Blackscale Sepulcher, and had elements in there specifically to allow an enchanter to use more of his/her CC abilities.  Until KoS, there really wasn't much need for CC in the game, and I think that some of the devs realized this, and designed things where CC would make life a lot easier for groups.  I think that is why since that time we have seen zones like Nizara and Castle Mistmoore where I frequently see people asking for an enchanter. The unfortunate thing is that even in the newer lower tier zones, like those in EoF, there isn't a need for CC.  Kaladim is about the lowest level EoF instance I can think of where CC can frequently come in handy, and certainly none of the overland zones need it.

[Jesdyr]

JackAll wrote: <blockquote><p>3. You are in one of the few hard zones in the game.</p></blockquote> I think that is the problem <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> well that and the huge amount of AE damage abilities that are in the game... If you are in a group with poor AE but really really good single target DPS, then Mez away !  ... most of the time this is not the case so stuns, stifles, and roots are the CC of choice. I always ask if the group wants me mezzing. really after a few fights you get an idea of what the group can do and go from there.

[Catsy]

It depends on the group, and it depends on the content. The content: there are really only a few non-raid zones in the game that require an enchanter. Nizara and CMM come to mind. Unrest has lots of yellow mobs but can easily be handled without a chanter with a good group. The group: you need to think about what class your tank is, and what classes your DPS is. If your tank is a brawler, mezzing adds and encounters can help, since they sometimes have a hard time holding agro on more than one target. If your tank is an SK or zerk, though, mezzing will seriously harm their ability to hold agro, because their AOE damage will be blocked by the mez. Similarly, if you are grouping with a warlock or conjy, or another class that does good AOE damage, mezzing will dramatically reduce their DPS, and cripple your group's killing speed. When they constantly break encounter mezzes, you should take that as a hint to stop mezzing encounters. Ultimately, mez is very situational, and you should keep in practice, but reserve it for emergencies. A good rule of thumb is to risk a wipe or two getting a feel for the capabilities of your group: if the group can survive adds without you mezzing, don't mez. While there are a few zones in which it is constantly invaluable, most of the time you--and your group--will be more effective if you rely on your stuns for crowd control. Coercers have a long single target stun, a medium encounter stun, a short blue aoe stun, and a reactive stun debuff with three triggers. When you combine our daze with our stifle, it results in what is effectively another medium stun in terms of preventing the mob from doing damage. Put all these together, and put some AA points into reducing the recast timers on your stuns, and you can keep a single mob stunlocked indefinitely. When I am in a group, I make a point of trying to prevent the mob from taking a single action for the entire fight. Open with ST stun. Time casting encounter stun for when that's about to wear off. Joust in and drop blue AOE stun if it's safe to do so, otherwize cast stifle, then daze. When daze is about to wear off, debuff with reactive stun. With AA points invested and good timing, by this time your ST stun should have cycled; use it if so, otherwise let the mob get in one swing, with which it will stun itself for 4s. Then ST stun it and repeat the cycle, occasionally shuffling the order as needed to account for resists or missed timing. Against encounters and adds it's much harder to keep them all stunlocked, but with good DPS it can be done. Open with encounter stun. Joust in to drop sonic boom when it's about to run out, then cast stifle and daze. Resists happen, and the recast timers are too long to keep an entire encounter locked down this way, but this provides around 17 seconds of denying the mob ability to do anything, which is plenty of time for a group with good AOE DPS to burn them down. If it takes longer, ST stun one of them, put reactive stun on another, and rely on your tank to actually take a few hits until your other stuns/stifle/daze cycle. Practice this strategy, and in normal groups you will never need to mez in order to handle CC duties. This will have the added benefit of dramatically increasing the killing speed and agro management abilities of most groups, since stuns don't block AOE the way mez does.

[Sigunn]

<p>JackAll, are you calling ME arrogant? haha...</p><p>OK, at lvl 70, maybe almost no mezzing is needed. Fine. That leaves 69 lvls where my reasoning is valid. Why do you measure all coercer play to lvl 70? Or do you mean that only lvl 70s can post on these forums? Or that the discussion only applies to them? </p><p>Of course I dont mezz when it only slows the group down. But I prefer playing in harder zones, where all my skills are needed. If there are almost no such zones once you get lvl 70, then maybe I should lock my xp. I dont like easy play.</p><p> /Ramborg</p>

[Catsy]

<cite>Sigunn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>OK, at lvl 70, maybe almost no mezzing is needed. Fine. That leaves 69 lvls where my reasoning is valid. Why do you measure all coercer play to lvl 70? Or do you mean that only lvl 70s can post on these forums? Or that the discussion only applies to them?</p></blockquote> I arrived at my philosophy on mezzing (or not-mezzing, as the case may be) around my 30's, when I was venturing into Runnyeye. At that point I'd been playing a coercer for a little less than a month, and I noticed that most groups were breaking my mezzes, and that they killed considerably faster when I stopped bothering to mez adds or encounters. This forced me to use my stuns, which up until then I had used somewhat randomly, as crowd control. By the time I hit Permafrost I had developed stunlocking into a fine art, and used it to help a solid group completely trivialize the zone when it was still mostly yellow. I don't have any hate for mez, it's a valuable tool in my arsenal--but there's a proper time and place for it. When I was just starting out, it was the shiny toy that I didn't have before, so I used it more than I needed to. I quickly learned a better way of doing things, and am a much more effective chanter for it. While his tone was unnecessary, JackAll is essentially correct. The only time it's really a good idea to mez in a group is if you are taking on content that is sufficiently difficult that the healers can't keep up if you don't lock some of them down. I should clarify that that doesn't necessarily mean only Nizara and Mistmoore, or any other end-game zone--it might be venturing into FG at 20, RoV at 28, RE at 32, or an even-con zone with a bad tank or half-full group. And truthfully, even in those zones the mobs are very straightforward. It's sometimes also necessary if the tank goes down or you get adds/repops that the group can't handle. The reason most people talk about Nizara and CMM is because that's where we first started seeing zones that required more thought than "next pull, burn til they drop". Outside of those circumstances, mez just slows things down and bores the healer.

[Verrie77]

<p><span style="font-size: xx-small"><span style="color: #66ffff">When I was a young mezzer i found that Runnyeye was a place where mezzing were very handy....im sure there are more. So ofc there are lower lvl zones where it can be handy...its all a matter of the group members lvl really...if you need it or not....high enough members can burn through...lower lvl are helped alot by mezz.</span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: xx-small"><span style="color: #66ffff">Of topic: Gotta love Runnyeye though...really fun xp zone in that lvl.</span></span></p>

[Flipmode]

<cite>Sigunn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>JackAll, are you calling ME arrogant? haha...</p><p>OK, at lvl 70, maybe almost no mezzing is needed. Fine. That leaves 69 lvls where my reasoning is valid. Why do you measure all coercer play to lvl 70? Or do you mean that only lvl 70s can post on these forums? Or that the discussion only applies to them? </p><p>Of course I dont mezz when it only slows the group down. But I prefer playing in harder zones, where all my skills are needed. If there are almost no such zones once you get lvl 70, then maybe I should lock my xp. I dont like easy play.</p><p> /Ramborg</p></blockquote>Any competent group at any level will not require mez.  The game was designed to NOT need mez.  I am not saying I never mez.  I mez adds to the encounter but never in the encounter.  If I have to mez inside an encounter for the grp to live, we are fighting content too hard for us or that is by design (i.e. Nizara, CMM).  If you just randomly fire off aoe mez and block 2/3 of your grps dps just because you feel like mezzing, you suck.  Plain and simple.

[chily]

<cite>Flipmode wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Sigunn wrote: </p><p>Any competent group at any level will not require mez.  The game was designed to NOT need mez.  </p></blockquote><p>Not every group is geared from raids and even oob and cov can be hard. My Sk isn't the best geared one for sure so we died twice in oob at the some mobs near the nightblood. I was happy that a freind was on and came with his enchanter and mezzed one of the 2 mobs and we killed one by one. Even zones like Lava or ever needs some mezzing. Yes mezz depends on group, zone and pull. I saved my group not only once coz the tank died from to much mobs. I holded 3 mobs mezzed the healer that survived it started to rezz the other 4, i just said regen up and heal up .. bumped them with channel and we killed em one by one. I start mezzing short before .. i die <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> .. to check out how much the group can take. Coercer are hated till the tank is dead and you solo (with mezz) more mobs then he can tank. I welcome this post, coz when are on the edge between full wipe and just the tank quick up it's annoying that some sill don't know what CC can be <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> and ... Stun/stifle/daze reduces the coercer dps <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> a big part of dps comes from the let mob hit us the more the merrier. In my eye's even stun is CC <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

People don't understand what a Coercer can do until the sit hits the fan. People go LD? Someone dies abruptly from an add, lags into lava, whatever... put the fight on pause. In a packed zone and repops or social aggro is a problem? Mez. Tank and both healers go LD, leaving just a mage and scout? Mez adds and stun lock single target while the scout takes the hits and burn down the fight. A good enchanter can replace a healer in the group (a high level Coercer can nearly stun lock encounters to the point that you don't even need a healer at all). A good enchanter makes it so a group can be sloppy or at least don't have to be perfect all the time and still be a total success. A good enchanter can make it so a group short on players can still go and succeed where you'd otherwise need a full group. What other class can say this? We don't need more than 4 people.. we have a Coercer! Are we worth 3 people to a group when all of our abilities are being fully used? It's nearly to that point, at least in non-Epic situations. Mez has it's place... for when crap happens. And since we live in an imperfect world, this isn't that bad a tool to have.

[Catsy]

Chillispike@Splitpaw wrote: <blockquote><p>Not every group is geared from raids and even oob and cov can be hard. My Sk isn't the best geared one for sure so we died twice in oob at the some mobs near the nightblood. I was happy that a freind was on and came with his enchanter and mezzed one of the 2 mobs and we killed one by one. </p></blockquote>There's only a few places in OOB where it's really helpful to mez if you have a weak tank. Beyond that you'll get better results by stunlocking the mobs. This has nothing to do with being raid-geared. Any PUG of non-raiders who has someone with a clue leading it can clear OOB and Unrest. It's a question of tactics. <blockquote><p>Even zones like Lava or ever needs some mezzing. </p></blockquote>Not even remotely. You may find that mezzing makes it easier, where ease is defined as locking down the mobs and killing them one by one. But by no stretch of the imagination is mezzing "needed" for Lavastorm or Everfrost, even with a half-competent PUG. In fact, with a group that's only half-competent you're better off filling the Coercer's slot with a good tank or healer, or another DPS. <blockquote><p>and ... Stun/stifle/daze reduces the coercer dps <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> a big part of dps comes from the let mob hit us the more the merrier.</p></blockquote>And mezzing /doesn't/ reduce our DPS? Mezzing hurts DPS even worse, since it prevents AOE. Our contribution to group DPS is typically so minimal that our time is better spent stunning. <blockquote><p>In my eye's even stun is CC <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>No "even" about it. Stuns are the best CC for anything that doesn't require taking multiple mobs out of the fight for prolonged fights. You can accomplish the non-emergency role you say you need mezzing for--crowd management--without reducing group DPS.

[Rarlin]

Chillispike@Splitpaw wrote: <blockquote>Flipmode wrote: Coercer are hated till the tank is dead and you solo (with mezz) more mobs then he can tank. </blockquote><p> This statement is SO true!  Most of the times I won't bother mezzing with PUGs that don't know the true power of a Coercer.  It's great to be the last one standing and kill off 4+ heroics while you're standing over the top of corpses.... <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p> As a general rule I try not to worry about crowd control until the group begs for mercy... <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[chily]

Sotanyavejin@Guk wrote: <blockquote>Chillispike@Splitpaw wrote: <blockquote><p>and ... Stun/stifle/daze reduces the coercer dps <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> a big part of dps comes from the let mob hit us the more the merrier.</p></blockquote><p>And mezzing /doesn't/ reduce our DPS? Mezzing hurts DPS even worse, since it prevents AOE. Our contribution to group DPS is typically so minimal that our time is better spent stunning.</p></blockquote><p>Yup but it depends on situation for sure</p><p>If you don't stun/stifle or daze coercer dps goes up (on the most mobs i would say) and dmg on tank doesn't go down. Mezzing only reduces AoE dps from group and dec the dps inc on tank. If you fight vs 2 encounter's and you mezz 1 encounter and burn the other Encounter you don't have a big dps decrease coz the only spell that could to dmg on the second encounter is Sonic boom. The most dps spells from the most classes that hit more then one mob are AE ones. Sotanyavejin@Guk wrote: </p><blockquote>Our contribution to group DPS is typically so minimal that our time is better spent stunning.</blockquote><p>Stun has the same casting time like mezz, but mezz holds longer. Charm a nice mob and dmg em out.</p>

[Fawlyn]

<p>I think this thread starter started this thread because he wants people to know that coercers can mesmerize stuff when needed and that targets mesmerized shouldn't be attacked until required.</p><p>All this talk of when to mez, where to mez, etc... is all situation based. Everyone could give 100000000000 examples where they should/shouldn't mez.</p>

[chily]

<cite>Fawlyn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>All this talk of when to mez, where to mez, etc... is all situation based. Everyone could give 100000000000 examples where they should/shouldn't mez.</p></blockquote> yup

[Lord Montague]

<cite>Flipmode wrote:</cite><blockquote>If you just randomly fire off aoe mez and block 2/3 of your grps dps just because you feel like mezzing, you suck.  Plain and simple. </blockquote><p> *laughs*  This makes me think of something that happened last night.  I had setup a group to go to Living Tombs, and inadvertantly an illusionist got added to our group (yeah, I should've asked...lesson learned though).  I thought "oh great, this is gonna clash a little."  Trouble was we really didn't have an agreement as far as who was doing what.  We had a 59 berserker with us so unless things got really ugly I really didn't think mezzing was going to be all too critical.  But what does he do?  He starts mezzing everything, and I do mean everything that we were attacking.  So then I said "your mezzes are blocking people's AoE's (including mine *coughs*)"  He didn't get it, and kept mezzing stuff.  I just sort of rolled with it though - we accomplished what we had set out to accomplish but it could've been quicker if he had listened a bit better.  Ah well though.</p><p>I will say in his defense, though, that he did say he had been away from the game for an extended amount of time so I can imagine it felt like being a noob again.</p>

[tracheaspider]

<a href="mailto:Chillispike@Splitpaw" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Chillispike@Splitpaw</a> wrote: <blockquote>Flipmode wrote: <p>Not every group is geared from raids and even oob and cov can be hard. My Sk isn't the best geared one for sure so we died twice in oob at the some mobs near the nightblood. I was happy that a freind was on and came with his enchanter and mezzed one of the 2 mobs and we killed one by one. Even zones like Lava or ever needs some mezzing. Yes mezz depends on group, zone and pull. I saved my group not only once coz the tank died from to much mobs. I holded 3 mobs mezzed the healer that survived it started to rezz the other 4, i just said regen up and heal up .. bumped them with channel and we killed em one by one. (snip)</p></blockquote><p>Implying people need raid gear to make those zones easy is a load of crap.  Not being stupid makes these zones easy.  Fabled out folks can do them in their sleep with half a group.  Case in point, I've done the top of Unrest before with me CCing, a high end raider swash tanking, a templar healing, and a ranger for added DPS.  Only the swash had particularly badass gear and I mezzed maybe three times total and we were doing 2-3 encounters at once (4+ tended to be  bit much).  Raid-geared people hardly do these instances the "normal" way since that takes more time than necessary.</p><p>Nothing in a regular group <i>needs</i> mez.  If mezzing is "needed" then instead of educating people not to break mez, you solve it by fixing the reason behind the adds: yell at the [Removed for Content] pulling adds or give the tank some tips on successful body pulls.  Doesn't matter what tier you're in--mez in regular groups should, 99% of the time, be a last resort for genuine accidents.  Constant mezzing should be for soloing or unconventional grouping like 3 mages + a fury doing up to the priest in Unrest or bruiser + coercer duoing all of PoA.</p>(Edited to replace everything these buggy forums ate when I hit Submit the first time.)

[Flipmode]

<cite>tracheaspider wrote:</cite><blockquote><a href="mailto:Chillispike@Splitpaw" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Chillispike@Splitpaw</a> wrote: <blockquote>Flipmode wrote: <p>Not every group is geared from raids and even oob and cov can be hard. My Sk isn't the best geared one for sure so we died twice in oob at the some mobs near the nightblood. I was happy that a freind was on and came with his enchanter and mezzed one of the 2 mobs and we killed one by one. Even zones like Lava or ever needs some mezzing. Yes mezz depends on group, zone and pull. I saved my group not only once coz the tank died from to much mobs. I holded 3 mobs mezzed the healer that survived it started to rezz the other 4, i just said regen up and heal up .. bumped them with channel and we killed em one by one. (snip)</p></blockquote><p>Implying people need raid gear to make those zones easy is a load of crap.  Not being stupid makes these zones easy.  Fabled out folks can do them in their sleep with half a group.  Case in point, I've done the top of Unrest before with me CCing, a high end raider swash tanking, a templar healing, and a ranger for added DPS.  Only the swash had particularly badass gear and I mezzed maybe three times total and we were doing 2-3 encounters at once (4+ tended to be  bit much).  Raid-geared people hardly do these instances the "normal" way since that takes more time than necessary.</p><p>Nothing in a regular group <i>needs</i> mez.  If mezzing is "needed" then instead of educating people not to break mez, you solve it by fixing the reason behind the adds: yell at the [Removed for Content] pulling adds or give the tank some tips on successful body pulls.  Doesn't matter what tier you're in--mez in regular groups should, 99% of the time, be a last resort for genuine accidents.  Constant mezzing should be for soloing or unconventional grouping like 3 mages + a fury doing up to the priest in Unrest or bruiser + coercer duoing all of PoA.</p>(Edited to replace everything these buggy forums ate when I hit Submit the first time.) </blockquote> I dont think i said what you quoted me as saying...