OMG ZERKERS SHOULD HAVE...

[Elk]

<p>In the interest of Class Balancing I would like to propose that the Berserkers get the following:</p><p>1) The ability to transfer agro to another char ( ala Murderous Designs )  Starting with 10% at App 1 and increasing 2% every App level:  30% increasing 2% per Adept level and finally 40% at Master 1...</p><p>You see - despite what all the Uber Guilds will tell you - Berserkers are NOT just tanks....they can actually be a highly effective DPS class too...when played properly.  DPS parses up to and into the 3k range inside zones like Emerald Halls, Inner Sanctum, Freethinkers and Deathtoll are not unheard of...  BUT - when I hit those kinds of numbers on our raids, there's not a tank in the world can hold agro off me (expect a Paladin amending me during those high-damage bursts.)</p><p>If you're going to give us Scout-like damage capability...give us Scout-Like hate transfer as well.</p><p>2) Feign-Death</p><p>Monk classes are worthless - may as well give FD to zerkers and just delete all Monk characters</p><p>3) Group-Rez</p><p>We're often the last characters alive on wipes...remove this ability from Inquisitors and give it to zerkers.  Nobody plays the OMG-HOW-BROKEN-IS-THIS-CLASS Inquisitor anyway.</p><p>4) Ability to Drag Corpses</p><p>You know you want this...</p><p>and finally</p><p>5) Self and Group Stealth</p><p>/Shrug I was on a roll...figured I may as well throw this out there.</p><p>OK - So I wasnt serious about 2, 3 or 4...but I am serious about 1!</p><p> -LK</p>

[Ivellious]

not going to comment on 2-4 =D but monks won't like you at all!, but I don't agree with the hate transfer, for the purpose of you not being a scout, you are a dps version of guardi, that was the point of the zerker class.  you would make a crappy off tank if you're giving up your hate to someone else, me personally I would dps my soul out as a zerker to the border of pulling hate, (if possible) then when the mt drops you could easily taunt up to tank, instead of having to rescue up and burn every taunt to do so.  (note, I don't play a zerker, just my personal opinion, but the tanking tree only needs 1-2 classes that are more dps then tank, not saying they can't tank, but please keep zerker and guardi as tanks)

[Brorimed]

<p>LOL ROFL and  ROFLMAO</p><p> yours </p><p>Brorim</p>

[selch]

<p>Don't want to comment...</p>

[Kainsei]

FYI, brawlers are supposed to be top fighters dps since we're the worst tanks. Atm zerkers are top fighters dps and 2nd best tanks. Apart from a swing of the legendary bat, I can't think of anything else that zerkers should get. Maybe you should remove the monk "joke" in order to avoid this thread turn in a flame-fest (it's like making a post in the troubs board saying that they do too much dps).

[trainzebra]

So because you can achieve Scout levels of dps... and still be able to be an effective tank... you think you should get the one thing a scout class has over you?  Wow, posts like this are a great way to get yourself nerfed =p

[selch]

Lanari@Storms wrote: <blockquote>FYI, brawlers are supposed to be top fighters dps since we're the worst tanks. Atm zerkers are top fighters dps and 2nd best tanks. Apart from a swing of the legendary bat, I can't think of anything else that zerkers should get. Maybe you should remove the monk "joke" in order to avoid this thread turn in a flame-fest (it's like making a post in the troubs board saying that they do too much dps). </blockquote> He pointed some truths in that joke tho..

[Bromir]

<p>On a side note </p><p>Zerkers arent supposed to transfer agro they are supposed to eat it for breakfast </p><p>Nothng like heating up your zerk,  open wounds > destruction > Juggernaut > masters rage</p><p>gimme agro .. hehe  </p><p>Yours</p><p>Brorim</p>

[Beldin_]

<cite>Ivellious wrote:</cite><blockquote>but I don't agree with the hate transfer, for the purpose of you not being a scout, you are a dps version of guardi, that was the point of the zerker class.  you would make a crappy off tank if you're giving up your hate to someone else, </blockquote><p>I know a better solution .. give Zerkers a 100% stoneskin proc whenever they are hit, or give them a proc-buff that increases their mitigation to 100% whenever they are hit, so the can do 10k DPS and even if they get aggro they never die .. lolz <img src="/smilies/49869fe8223507d7223db3451e5321aa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>After that SOE can cleanup the classes from 24 to 1, and we never again will have problems with class-balance <img src="/smilies/ed515dbff23a0ee3241dcc0a601c9ed6.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Image_Vain]

Zerks should have HT

[Noaani]

<p>If you want to balance zerkers, or all fighters for that matter, make it so zerkers can only wear leather armor.</p><p>Change nothing else about the class.</p><p>This will then have the effect of zerkers being the top DPS fighter and lowest on ability to tank (although they would still be able to tank heroic content easily enough). It wouldalso have the effect of making guardians the only choice for raid MT, which is also how it shoudl be.</p><p>Only issue with this is paladins still have no place. Guardians are the best pick to tank and lowest DPS, the others all have DPS and tanking ability that scales from guardian to zerker at the other end, but paladins still suck as tanks, and have no real DPS to speak of.</p>

[Lakaah]

From playing a zerker to level 47 and reading the class forums, it seems to me that they do not have all that much dps until they get some extra tricks in the 50's, and if they go down the buckler AA line. Please keep that in mind when calling for zerker nerfs, because I can tell you for certain that at level 47 without a buckler (zerkers should not use any shields let alone a stupid little buckler, how ridiculous!), it is not an overpowered class in any way.

[Nemoscat]

<cite>Elkay wrote:</cite><blockquote>3) Group-Rez<p>We're often the last characters alive on wipes...remove this ability from Inquisitors and give it to zerkers.  Nobody plays the OMG-HOW-BROKEN-IS-THIS-CLASS Inquisitor anyway.</p></blockquote> OK, so what is so broken with the Inqisitor again? I find it very interesting to play.

[Siclone]

<p>I agree with the OP</p><p>If your going to have elite Classes (Zerker, Swahies, Necro, furies) then why mess around, just give them everything.</p><p>I have seen Zerkers break 2.6 k on the parse and still be able to MT a raid--silly-- since it is already silly just do it up right.  </p>

[Siclone]

<cite>Lakaah wrote:</cite><blockquote>From playing a zerker to level 47 and reading the class forums, it seems to me that they do not have all that much dps until they get some extra tricks in the 50's, and if they go down the buckler AA line. Please keep that in mind when calling for zerker nerfs, because I can tell you for certain that at level 47 without a buckler (zerkers should not use any shields let alone a stupid little buckler, how ridiculous!), it is not an overpowered class in any way. </blockquote>what do you know your only 47 still in training. 

[Zyphe]

<cite>Elkay wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>2) Feign-Death</p><p>Monk classes are worthless - may as well give FD to zerkers and just delete all Monk characters</p></blockquote> You actually had my attention until this. Now I know you're just [Removed for Content].

[azekah]

lol...an option to transfer aggro for a tank class...   now that's a classic thread...

[azekah]

Kekeloko@Guk wrote: <blockquote><cite>Elkay wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>2) Feign-Death</p><p>Monk classes are worthless - may as well give FD to zerkers and just delete all Monk characters</p></blockquote> You actually had my attention until this. Now I know you're just [I cannot control my vocabulary]. </blockquote>you must not have read the rest of the post...hehe

[Chooba]

  How about a big metal pillow for them to cry on?

[Etchii]

<p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian > Paladin > SK > Beserker > Brawler</p><p>VS</p><p>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</p><p>Thoughts?</p>

[azekah]

i have a 46 zerker...so I think it should be zerker > all but then again... I may be a tad partial...

[Foretold]

<cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian > Paladin > SK > Beserker > Brawler</p><p>VS</p><p>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote>I like it <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And three cheers to the OP for his monk *joke* - way to continue to spread the unjust bias against the monk class.  I think 50% of the EQ2 thinks the monk class is useless simply because they've read it somewhere.  While this thread is not the place for THAT debate, I KNOW the OP knows a monk/brawler whose playstyle and abilities he respects...  way to screw em just a bit more.  We all appreciate it.

[Gutwren]

<cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian > Paladin > SK > Beserker > Brawler</p><p>VS</p><p>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote>Have to take three three main tanking attributes into play. 1.) The ability to take a hit/avoid taking a hit. 2.) Taunts and taunt reuses. 3.) Using DPS to hold taunt. I personally think a Brawlers defensive stance should not lower their attack skills at all, should just put them back on the bare min.

[Gungo]

<p>I would not worry about agro transfer, because if lockeye does remove the wpn requirements from koS AA's he will need to adjust the most overpowered abitlity for dps. Double atk since its % based and auto atk increases with each tier, they will need to lower the  % gain in order to balance classes. Basically double atk is why rogues and warriors are overpowered in DPS. </p><p>If they removed wpn requirments, then rogues/warriors with dual wields would be WAY WAY overpowered in comparison to other dps clases. So i would expect the % of double atk given to drop like they did with crits initially down to ~20=25%. This includes the brawlers str aa line as well. Which is fine if they remove the wpn requirements.  What that means? Most likely a nerf to warrior/rogue dps. Which is how it should of been. Sword and board should be less dps then a 2hander or dual wield for tanks and for rogues.  Its all speculation at this point, but there is no way they can remove wpn requiremnts without changing (read: nerfing) some aa's. If lockeye does that then warriors dps will fall below brawlers as it should and rogues dps will not rival predators. As it does.  </p>

[Vorlak]

<p>Honestly i think sony screwed up by saying what classes "HAVE" to wear what items. They put in Negfactors to fast without adding benifitis. Then again they screwed up when they allowed zerks to wear vanguard plate in beta rather then limiting them to chain like eq1.</p><p>Guard/Zerk = Plate class granted but they should NOT be able to dps in vanguard type plate.... They should have to put on chain gear. </p><p>SO... Guard/Zerk in Plate ++mit, -avoid, -atk, +hate Guard/Zerk in Chain --mit, +avoid, +atk, +dps Guard/Zerk in Leather ---mit, ++avoid, ++atk, ++dps Guard/Zerk in Cloth no mit, 50%avoid(cap), +++atk, +++dps (after all you are basicly naked and gonna die IF you get it, thats a 50/50 shot either you get hit or you dont)....</p><p>There should be some sort of value added to armor to show its effecting your overall (stat), item type SHOULD effect what your character can do. </p>

[Proudfoot]

Oephelia@Najena wrote: <blockquote><cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian > Paladin > SK > Beserker > Brawler</p><p>VS</p><p>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote>I like it <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And three cheers to the OP for his monk *joke* - way to continue to spread the unjust bias against the monk class.  I think 50% of the EQ2 thinks the monk class is useless simply because they've read it somewhere.  While this thread is not the place for THAT debate, I KNOW the OP knows a monk/brawler whose playstyle and abilities he respects...  way to screw em just a bit more.  We all appreciate it. </blockquote>Having played a Monk and now betrayed to Bruiser, I can say that Monks are broken. The need x2 damage boost and they'd be fine, but as it is, they can avoid pretty good, but don't dish damage like they -should-.

[AdamWest007]

<cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian > Paladin > SK > Beserker > Brawler</p><p>VS</p><p>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote>An argument as old as the "dps tiers".  Will never happen.  Roll a Zerker.

[Slayer505]

We're just fine as is.  I usually OT and if I pull aggro my healers heal me.  Berserkers are supposed to be MT/OT, not DPS.  My DPS is pretty good but I still get beat by scouts and mages as it should be.  The only scouts and mages that don't consistantly beat me are Bards and Chanters.  Our Brigand is usually around my level or slightly higher and all the other scouts and mages beat me pretty consistantly.  If this isn't the case for you then you have some very lax DPSers in your raid.  Even the best zerker will rarely break 2k single target.  I'm usually anywhere from 1.6-2k single target and most of our DPS is well over 2k-3k+.  Yeah I can put out even bigger numbers in AE encounters, but not bigger then a Swashy, Ranger, Conjurer or Warlock in the same encounter.  If you're putting out enough DPS to pull aggro you need to be tanking or off tanking, not being DPS.  You're a FIGHTER, not a scout.

[Zabjade]

<cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian <span style="color: #009900">=</span> Paladin <span style="color: #009900">=</span> SK <span style="color: #009900">=</span> Beserker <span style="color: #009900">=</span> Brawler</p><p><strike>VS</strike></p><p><strike>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</strike></p><p>DPS Barzerker</p><p>Dodge and Resistances HP Monk/Bruiser<span style="color: #000033">/Beastlord joke</span></p><p>Mitigation Guard</p><p>Magic Paladin/SK</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote><p>Corrected</p>

[Siclone]

<cite>Zabjade wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian <span style="color: #009900">=</span> Paladin <span style="color: #009900">=</span> SK <span style="color: #009900">=</span> Beserker <span style="color: #009900">=</span> Brawler</p><p><strike>VS</strike></p><p><strike>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</strike></p><p>DPS Barzerker</p><p>Dodge and Resistances HP Monk/Bruiser<span style="color: #000033">/Beastlord joke</span></p><p>Mitigation Guard</p><p>Magic Paladin/SK</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote><p>Corrected</p></blockquote><p>NOPE still not right</p><p>Tank= Guardian--Zerker-Paladin-Sk-Brawler</p><p>now its right </p>

[Lakaah]

<cite>Siclone wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Lakaah wrote:</cite><blockquote>From playing a zerker to level 47 and reading the class forums, it seems to me that they do not have all that much dps until they get some extra tricks in the 50's, and if they go down the buckler AA line. Please keep that in mind when calling for zerker nerfs, because I can tell you for certain that at level 47 without a buckler (zerkers should not use any shields let alone a stupid little buckler, how ridiculous!), it is not an overpowered class in any way. </blockquote>what do you know your only 47 still in training.  </blockquote>What I know is how the class has performed for me through 47 levels, obviously. You probably didn't read past the first 7 words I typed, but in case you did, here is my point spelled out a little more plainly for you. Nerfing a class based on how it performs at high-level, with a specific AA spec, could render it hopelessly [Removed for Content] at lower levels. Its probably just that stupid buckler AA line that needs fixing, I've heard it can increase the zerks DPS by 50% or more.

[hoppopo]

<p>.... and I have seen a templar parse for 1600 in a group whats the point?</p><p>Why not get rid of the useless regens and give us something useful.</p>

[TheSource123]

This is far too true to be funny..

[mr23sgte]

<p>Wow, Your complaining about too much DPS and gaining aggro....................glad I don't have those problems cause I play a Monk. </p><p>I  too would like beserkers to get the Feign death skill and have it delete a monk from the game everytime its used --thats a great idea!</p>

[Araxes]

Don't make jokes like that. People won't bother to see you were joking and that will be the end of any point you were trying to make.

[Raveller]

<cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If you want to balance zerkers, or all fighters for that matter, make it so zerkers can only wear leather armor.</p><p>Change nothing else about the class.</p><p>This will then have the effect of zerkers being the top DPS fighter and lowest on ability to tank (although they would still be able to tank heroic content easily enough). It wouldalso have the effect of making guardians the only choice for raid MT, which is also how it shoudl be.</p><p>Only issue with this is paladins still have no place. Guardians are the best pick to tank and lowest DPS, the others all have DPS and tanking ability that scales from guardian to zerker at the other end, but paladins still suck as tanks, and have no real DPS to speak of.</p></blockquote>I disagree with you on this. My Paladin makes a fine Armorer alt.

[selch]

<cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote>I disagree with you on this. My Paladin makes a fine Armorer alt. </blockquote>Since our primary role in game is to harvest nodes as a monk, we can make a nice business together.

[Squigglle]

so basicly your trying to get zerkers to be like the jedi of pre cu swg? which if u dont know there gods.

[Lornick]

This thread just screams "nerf me!".

[Squigglle]

<p>why not just give  zerkers a instant kill button with instant reuse? lol </p><p>id like to see zerkers get more stuff, heck id like to see everyprof get some loving but thats just sad... </p>

[Mithru]

Norrath belongs to Berserkers. The rest of you are just visitors.

[Mithru]

<cite>Etchii wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>IMO Tanks should follow as such:</p><p>Best tanking ability : Guardian > Paladin > SK > Beserker > Brawler</p><p>VS</p><p>Highest DPS : Brawler > Beserker > Sk > Paladin > Guardian</p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote>Tanks should go: Guard, Zerk, who cares... DPS should go: Wizard, Mage, Warlock, Berserker, who cares... Healing: Templar, Berskerker, who cares... Wards: Berserker, who cares... After that zerkers just need group invis and SoW along with some type of CoTH  and reverse CoTH and they will be balanced. And by balanced I mean them on one side of the scale and everyone else on the other.

[jagermonsta]

zerkers <img src="/smilies/e78feac27fa924c4d0ad6cf5819f3554.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Beldin_]

<cite>Mithrull wrote:</cite><blockquote>Tanks should go: Guard, Zerk, who cares... DPS should go: Wizard, Mage, Warlock, Berserker, who cares... Healing: Templar, Berskerker, who cares... Wards: Berserker, who cares... After that zerkers just need group invis and SoW along with some type of CoTH  and reverse CoTH and they will be balanced. And by balanced I mean them on one side of the scale and everyone else on the other. </blockquote>Nahh .. you forgot the Teleports .. Zerkers should get Teleports to ALL (also the inactive) Druid Rings and Spires (also Spires in KoS), and also maybe Ports to each mariner bell at least <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[FightGame]

<p>If you want all that, roll a scout or a healer.  Every one of those suggestions are terrible.</p><p>A zerker in this game is a tank.  Sure we can do good burst damage, and in an almost perfect group set up, we can sustain it ok, but if you've ever played with a good DPS class, over time they will nearly double your dps, some will even triple.</p><p>What the zerker class needs now is defensive stuff.  Not stealth, evac, rez, and all that crap.</p><p>Compare zerker AA's to guard AA's.  Guards win, big time.</p><p>Compare zerker EoF gear and bonuses to guards.  Guards win, big time. (eof class pants - omg)</p><p>Guards already have better tanking like abilities with their CA's and by enhancing them through their EoF AA tree, only gives them a bigger lead.</p><p>Don't tell me to roll a guard.  I'm happy with my zerker.  I just don't think it's right to continue spreading the classes further apart in tanking ability.</p>