When and CAN SOE implement flying mounts into EQ2??

[xpraetorianx]

When do you guys think this will happen?  Can they do it?  Will they do it? With the open ended areas in Faydwer, can it be done in the smaller zones that is from the Original Release? What do you guys think, is there a chance at all?

[Josgar]

Well, if you get a certain height off of the ground in certain places, everything disappears. Plus you would have to land to be able zone.

[Kaalenarc]

<p> Everything dissapears because you character has a set limit of how far he can see in any direction. That number is, however, adjustable. </p><p> The problem with flying mounts is that there are many "invisible walls" in the game  - areas that the DEVs dont want you to get to. (top of the aquaducts in antonica for example)</p><p> So for the DEVs to implement them in most exisiting zones would be tough  - Certainly bonemire or barren sky or tenebrous tangle would be doable. </p><p>My best guess is that IF it is ever done, it would be limited to a few or new zones only.</p><p> Having said that - flying mounts are the #1 item on my "wish list"</p>

[Naubeta]

Being able to fly/levitate everywhere spoils the feeling of a game (I know this from EQ1). Same goes for moving very quickly.

[Sphiriah]

If they were to ever implement flying mounts into the game, they would have to only work in zones designed for them.

[Besual]

I fail to see the need for flying mounts.

[erin]

They've stated a number of times that they will not add levitation to this game.  I think it caused too many issues in other games (EQ1).  This is in the same category so I don't ever expect to see it.  The griffons are a tightly controlled flying mount, there's no variation to deal with.

[the flu]

Kaalenarc@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><p> Everything dissapears because you character has a set limit of how far he can see in any direction. That number is, however, adjustable. </p><p> The problem with flying mounts is that there are many "invisible walls" in the game  - areas that the DEVs dont want you to get to. (top of the aquaducts in antonica for example)</p> </blockquote>Not entirely true. There are several areas, particularly in cities, where you can notice this and it has nothing to do with distance. Rather, there are places where inventive players can get too, but we are not meant to. In order to lessen the load on players computers alot of things that wewere not meant to see were left out. The tops of buildings, walls from certain angles, that sort of thing. The easiest place to see this is on top of the building next to the back in Qeynos Harbor. Most zones, particularly in the old world, do not seem to be built for characters to go much above griffin height.

[Dutchgrrl]

<cite>xpraetorianx wrote:</cite><blockquote>When do you guys think this will happen?  Can they do it?  Will they do it? With the open ended areas in Faydwer, can it be done in the smaller zones that is from the Original Release? What do you guys think, is there a chance at all? </blockquote><p> I understand the desire for a flying mount..  And of course there ARE flying mounts sort of... The carpets "fly" and you can ride the chicken from tower to tower and the carpet in Sinking Sands to Maj'Dul and around that zone... But as for a fully controllable and autonomous flying mount, I think I can see a major problem with implementing that.</p><p>The structure of the game is based largely upon challenges.  You do not enter a zone and then warp directly to the named mob in that zone and kill him, or to the place you need to go for a given quest - you have to travel through that zone, either avoiding or more likely slaying the things that are in that zone that prevent you from simply waltzing to where you want to go.  In a significant way, this experience is part of the quest and adventure process.</p><p>Adding a flying mount would very quickly make this the most boring and unchallenging game in the world.  You would simpley and much too quickly complete all the quests, and where would you be?  Bored.</p><p>Kat</p>

[Winter]

<span style="font-size: small; color: #ff66cc; font-family: comic sans ms,sand">I believe it was said that it would require quite a redo of all the zones as it would exploit the geometry.</span>

[Rocc]

Naubitzi@Crushbone wrote: <blockquote>Being able to fly/levitate everywhere spoils the feeling of a game (I know this from EQ1). Same goes for moving very quickly. </blockquote><p>That was one of the best features of EQ1 !</p><p>Anyway, we've had this discussion before. When we were playing beta and right after launch, this was a huge stink and alot of people quit because of it. It's not just the geometry but the engine they use to develop the game. That was their response anyway.</p><p>Personally I think that is by far one of the worst things about this game design. I hate that they wont allow you to run over hills, mountains and whatnot. It's something that irritates me every time I try to get somewhere and have to take the long route. Terrain features have been restricted and it almost feels like someone is purposely trying to [Removed for Content] us off and make us go around. TT, Ferrott, Zek... the list goes on and on.</p><p>Levitation is something we have been begging for since beta. As far as flying mounts go, I think Vanguard leads by example in this department. </p>

[doctorbow]

<cite>Winter wrote:</cite><blockquote><span style="font-size: small; font-family: comic sans ms,sand"><span style="color: #ff66cc">I believe it was said that it would require quite a redo of all the zones as it would exploit the geometry.</span></span></blockquote>     And it is IMO that this is why it would not happen.  ESPECIALLY for old world zones.  And, as someone said, it's doable for future zones, if the content is designed around that ability, but here's the rub: IF that happens, and people get flying, controllable mounts designed to work in this-or-that zone, then the debate will begin "Why oh why can't I use my flying warg (LOL) in xxxxxxx zone??? I earned it, I wanna use it, blah blah blah (insert other reasons here)"     The problem with this line of thinking, is eventually it WOULD come down to a necessary re-design of those zones (as you said, mainly to avoid exploits) which, again, IMO, is developer's time better spent elsewhere.  The old world content is not broke really, in any major way atleast, but this would eventually come down to people wanting to USE the mounts in old-world content, so they'd be set for a re-design, possibly broken, etc etc.  I just see alot of problems implementing something like this.  Again, I feel this is developer's time better spent elsewhere.

[Winter]

<span style="font-size: small; color: #ff66cc; font-family: comic sans ms,sand">I can agree with that line of thought. That said, who knows... Maybe one day there will be a huge overhaul - heck, it happened for EQlive... Granted, I think the original engine stayed largely intact. I personally would prefer the game keep a nice continual smooth feel... Specific zones for flying mounts would create a disconnect for me. The game wasn't created with those in mind so, for the time being, we just have to accept that. As I said - perhaps down the line the entire game will be updated, graphically and otherwise... Granted, I imagine that would be quite a few years down the line...</span>

[Tweian-Tree-Hugg]

<p>EQ2 isnt big enough for Flying mounts, it would, imo, be a waste.</p><p> If we look at the size of games like Vanguard youll see a noticeable difference, in Vanguard it can take up to 1 hour just to go from 1 main city to another - sometimes even more if your heading from 1 island to another. In EQ2 (without using bells etc) its like 10 or 20 min from Qeynos to Freeport. We also already got a ton of ways to transport us from place to place. Druids, Wizards, Bells, Griffons, Horses with a special route. </p><p>I think a flying mount would take alot of the fun out of the game, because the game would seem smaller. In Vanguard they can afford it because the world already is so big so its minimal how small people will feel it is - even with flying mounts. But to counter the "Freedom of movement" with flying mounts in Vanguard, theyve also thrown in flying mobs - ie. you can accidently run into a dragon if your not careful, so its not a "get from a to b free"-card like it would be in EQ2 (if they get X, Y, Z agro fixed)</p>

[interstellarmatter]

I'm sure that it would be possible in new zones to implement flying mounts.  That's how WoW got around using them with the expansion.  Having said that, I just fail to see the allure of flying mounts.  It's just a mode of transportation that would require a lot of programming effort.  Remember how bad that it used to be with mobs getting stuck in walls?  Can you imagine getting stuck in clouds?

[Dethica_WARLOCK]

<p>Can you imagine Aerial combat?</p><p>Would be thrilling......chances to get knocked from flying mount, and plummet to your death</p>

[Xs-142]

<p>WHY would you want this anyways?</p><p> Flying mounts.. pfft! Give us flying clockwork fortresses instead</p>

[Rashaak]

<p>There is technically a flying mount in-game already, known as the Flying carpet...however due to the way the world maps are set up, you can only go a certain distance straight up, so...the carpet only appears to be floating.</p><p>Look at the Griffons...they fly on set paths, and generally follow the most traveled paths that you can go on foot. The way the world is designed would not allow for free movement in the air...</p><p>Not saying it won't happen, but they would have to readjust how the geometry works in the zones in order to allow for any type of flying mount. However...it is unlikely to happen, since it's been said that Levitate would not make its return to the game....so seriously doubt Flying Mounts would show up.</p>

[heedical]

<p>vanguard has them eq2 can also</p>

[Velsha]

I personally would like to see some more variety of ground mounts before we start seeing anything that flies. And yeah, flying mounts would require a complete engine redesign, so they would most likely only work in zones designed for such mounts.

[tass]

<cite>heedical wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>vanguard has them eq2 can also</p></blockquote>thats because vanguard was built for them along with alot of other things everquest 2 was not. Just like eq1. It would take a massive overhaul of changing all everything if they ever wanted to give it graphics like eq2. And since soe gets cash from people subscribing to both vanguard and eq2 odds are they would leave the feature specifically for vanguard so ud have to pay to get that type of content. Its evil yes but it suckers more people into additional payments of cash.

[Valdaglerion]

Doubtful, it would require additional development on every zone to design and develop the height factors of the game. Those zones with flying mounts, ie the griffons were only designed with heights for the specific paths the griffons follow. Its another reason you cant climb to the top of every mountain in the game. If there is no reason to be up there, you simply cant go star gazing because its a better view...

[Lornick]

<cite>tass wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>heedical wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>vanguard has them eq2 can also</p></blockquote>thats because vanguard was built for them along with alot of other things everquest 2 was not. Just like eq1. It would take a massive overhaul of changing all everything if they ever wanted to give it graphics like eq2. <b>And since soe gets cash from people subscribing to both vanguard and eq2 odds are they would leave the feature specifically for vanguard so ud have to pay to get that type of content. Its evil yes but it suckers more people into additional payments of cash. </b></blockquote>God I love board conspiracy theorists.  I'm sure this is exactly how the conversation went in the dev conferance room when the topic was brought up...  As if Vanguard was even a factor when EQ2 was being designed =p

[Drewx]

<p>I admit I'd like flying mounts, ranging from Griffons, Drakota, Bats, really [Removed for Content] big hawks/eagles, and other various monsters would work...however currently...the game engine and design will not.</p><p>In order to have flying mounts work in all zones they will have to recode all the zones, just like to implement new more unique and fluid armor and animation they have to recode the character skeltons.</p><p>However I see this as a very likely possibility. With Rise/Ruins of Kunark (can't seem to remember the name) in development we have alot of hope.</p><p>First off, they have said they are working on character skeletons...what could be an easier method to implement such a drastic gameplay change than in an expansion? Also EQ II was developed with technologies growth following a certain path, now with technology taking a different path aka: dual cores and etc. The current game engine is...alittle old and it needs to be tweeked/changed. Hopefully in RoK or a large GU...[although a new expansion would be a better method imo]...they will also have a game engine update/change. Currently EQ II is very clean imo, if you go into a battle and don't rapidly spam techniques you'll notice combat is very fluid and etc. However in higher lvl gameplay to stay alive you're often reliant on abilities and the heavy partical effects tend to injure the fluidity of combat.</p><p>With RoK they say the zones will be alot bigger and expansive. Since EQ II is very graphic intensive...I don't see zonelines vanishing. BUT like with DoF, EoF, and the Neriak GU they have shown that the game can flow without having to click a zone. So in truth...when recoding the old content they just have to raise the zoneline but they'd also have to add some more terrain and definately restrict how high you could indeed fly. also theyd have to revamp MOB aggro radius'. EX: Lets take Sinknig Sands...to zone into Pillars of Flame you run into the canyon/mountain path and then the screen changes and you load into Pillars. On a flying mount...while flying across Sinking Sands...lets ay you fly over the Desert Tarantula pit...you don't want those spiders to aggro you high in the sky and chase ya from below...training and slaughtering all the players below (unless they are Fse and/or Arasai) or to land to see a groupmate and notice an army of spiders behind you. Also they'd have to restrict your max flying height to be inline with the Maj'dul mesa/mountaintop...so you could zone into Maj'dul, but that'd mean the Pillars of flame mountains would need to reach higher in line with the Maj'Dul mountain so you don't fly over the zoneline/mountaintop of Pillars of Flame and/or zone in midair when all you see is sky. It'd feel ackwar if you could zone midflight when you see nada around.</p><p> If they choose to try to go for background loads and unloads they have to extend the pathing to other zones. EX: To go from Commonlads to Nektulos...you'd have torun through that tunnel or fly over it. Otherwise the zones would take a graphical hit. Some zones are small and IMO could be merged. Overall like Shadows of Luclin did for EQ I......EQ II would need a massive expansion pack to add such a change. Currently KoS would work, and even some of EoF would work as flyable only zones. With how spread out mobs are landing would be a problem so players couldn't just "warp" from point a to point b. The biggest problem is just coding. On the subject on Vanguard...from the get go they developed and CODED those zones to support flying mounts...hell to travle in that game you need a mount! There isn't any other way, no teleports, etc. EQ II's current system is good. Flying mounts would not only be cool and useful they would also pull in new players. But I don't see any of this happening until either RoK but mostl ikely he expansion AFTER RoK.</p><p>That's my 2gold...I'm too longwinded...</p>

[tass]

<cite>Lornick wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>tass wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>heedical wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>vanguard has them eq2 can also</p></blockquote>thats because vanguard was built for them along with alot of other things everquest 2 was not. Just like eq1. It would take a massive overhaul of changing all everything if they ever wanted to give it graphics like eq2. <b>And since soe gets cash from people subscribing to both vanguard and eq2 odds are they would leave the feature specifically for vanguard so ud have to pay to get that type of content. Its evil yes but it suckers more people into additional payments of cash. </b></blockquote>God I love board conspiracy theorists.  I'm sure this is exactly how the conversation went in the dev conferance room when the topic was brought up...  As if Vanguard was even a factor when EQ2 was being designed =p </blockquote>lol well 1 its not a theory its business. If you own a company your not going to throw away a chance to collect more cash. Sry but its the corporation dream. And 2 I should hope vanguard wasnt a factor as it came about 3 years later after eq2 came out. And to sum up why this game will never have anything like that is because it would cost money to change. And while the corporation has to keep the game running smooth or as smooth as possible in game play they aernt about to heft over some pocket money for a server coding and changes unless they could do something productive for it like raising the $15 a month charge to $20. Believe it or not the main purpose of any business is to make cash. What a customer thinks isnt to important as long as they continue to fork out the cash. Which makes my point why would soe change there eq2 game costing them money to implement things already available subsequently on another game that they just bought. Answer? They wouldn't.

[re1master]

Honestly, flying is possible now, it just involves deep water -- I'll leave it at that. Sadly though, you're constrained to the small area of the zone that's loaded at the time of your 'departure' as land seems to only load if you're within a certain distance of the ground (height wise). This bug has been in since launch, and I've reported it, but it still can be triggered (pictures follow)... <a href="http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/8630/eq2000038mr6.jpg" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/...q2000038mr6.jpg</a> <a href="http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/5817/eq2000039jx5.jpg" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/...q2000039jx5.jpg</a> <a href="http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/9051/eq2000040ch7.jpg" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/...q2000040ch7.jpg</a> Just a warning: Unless you're a fae/arasai and you succeed, you'll want to find water quick as you rocket towards ground.

[LordPazuzu]

Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>They've stated a number of times that they will not add levitation to this game.  I think it caused too many issues in other games (EQ1).  This is in the same category so I don't ever expect to see it.  The griffons are a tightly controlled flying mount, there's no variation to deal with. </blockquote> They won't add levitation and true flight to the game because they can't.  They've tried internally and it's failed.  The EQ2 engine simply doesn't support it.  I had a conversation with Blackguard at Fan Faire in Atlanta about it.

[Noaani]

Drakhammor@Everfrost wrote: <blockquote><cite>Winter wrote:</cite><blockquote><span style="font-size: small; font-family: comic sans ms,sand"><span style="color: #ff66cc">I believe it was said that it would require quite a redo of all the zones as it would exploit the geometry.</span></span></blockquote>     And it is IMO that this is why it would not happen.  ESPECIALLY for old world zones.  And, as someone said, it's doable for future zones, if the content is designed around that ability, but here's the rub: IF that happens, and people get flying, controllable mounts designed to work in this-or-that zone, then the debate will begin "Why oh why can't I use my flying warg (LOL) in xxxxxxx zone??? I earned it, I wanna use it, blah blah blah (insert other reasons here)" </blockquote><p>I tried to find the interview, but couldn't even remember who it was with, however, I seem to recall a suggestion that SoE were planning on redoing some of the oldworld zones in a manner similar to the "superzones" we have heard about that are coming with RoK.</p><p>If this is the case, it is moer than concievable that they may make the changes necessary for flying mounts to be come a possability in every zone that normal mounts can be used in currently.</p><p>not saying it will happen, not even saying I 'want' it to happen, just saying that I recall someone mentioning they are looking at redoing some of the old zones, and that its a concievable possability that they may look at this in the future.</p><p>Also, I would be very supprised if SoE, with their track record as of late, did the same half arsed implementation of flying mounts that WoW have done reciently. I would assume that if they were to implement them, they would hold off until they were able to get them to work propperly in all zones that they would be expected to work in.</p>

[Noaani]

<cite>tass wrote:</cite><blockquote>they aernt about to heft over some pocket money for a server coding and changes unless they could do something productive for it like raising the $15 a month charge to $20. </blockquote><p>Or turn 200k subscriptions into 250k subscriptions...</p><p>You are right, if it doesn't make monry, it is not likely to happen. However, you are missing the single biggest metho SoE (particularly EQ2) can increase its profit margin. Adding 50k new subscriptions will have a much bigger impact in the game than increasing the current ubscription fee.</p><p>Question is, will adding flying mounts make the difference for enough people to come to this game over whatever else they are playing for it to be worth it to EQ2? </p>

[Stuge]

<img src="http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l7/stugein/BeatDeadHorse.gif" border="0">

[Ama]

<p>It is deffinately plausible to implement flying mounts.  Already we got carpets that "Hover" off the ground so to speak even though it's only 1-2ft off the ground.  </p><p>What would be interesting is in an adventure pack or expansion pack introduce flying mounts for a zone.  You need this to get to particular areas just like the cloud stations in KoS.  However the big difference is you can guide where you want to go in the zone.  This would add a better level of detail to EQ2 imho and it would allow for more player discoveries.  </p>

[tass]

Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><img src="http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l7/stugein/BeatDeadHorse.gif" border="0"> </blockquote>that poor camel. Here this works better "hands over the machete" And as for the added subscribers response while that might be the differance that some companies like blizzard would do this isnt exactly the  advertising company of industry lol I cant even find a poster of this game or any other games in an ebgames or gamestop.

[Arinwulf]

<p>you know, whenever I see someone say that we won't get  something in the game because the devs said so, it makes me angry.</p><p> The devs will do what they are told to do.  Money is their boss and with declining server populations all over SOE products the EQ2 devs had better start being CAN DO and stop this CAN'T DO nonsense.</p><p> Levitation in EQ was NEVER a problem.  If you had a zone that levitation would short cut around challenging content, then they would simply deny levitation for that zone.</p><p> MMOG playing people have made it plain.  Flying mounts are what they want. The Devs WILL do it or the game will suffer and the devs lose their jobs.</p><p> The Devs work for us, we don't work for them.  Its time everyone got that straight.  Especially the devs.</p>

[LordPazuzu]

<p>The 'flying' carpets and the griffon station mounts are not truly flying.  The griffons move along a preset path from which they can not deviate.  The carpets just have their Z axis position set a virtual foot above the ground.  They cannot travel up and down on the z axis.  It's the same for the flight movement of "flying" mobs.  They are not truly flying in the sense they can navigate the z axis freely; they have their movement animation set at specific height on the z axis and that's where they stay unless attacked.</p><p>For whatever reason EQ2's engine simply was not built with free navigation of the z axis as a posibility.</p>

[Siogai]

Flying mounts? Meh...  the concept of them is pretty lame, IMO, especially since mounts don't have an upkeep cost to them, and WoW stole the idea from Lineage (afaik, cant think of any other game that has them).  Now, if you had to feed and stable your mounts, and higher-quality (ie, faster) mounts cost more for both (akin to paying for a second house of that geneal status-level or something) then I could see having flying mounts as an option. They'd also need to add in aerial hazards appropriate to the zone, to prevent the content-avoidance nature of simply flying over the heads of all the mobs, over the hills, mountains, etc.  Wild griffons, wyverns, giant bats, the occasional barrage of ballista or archer fire from DFC (when flying in Zek)... things that put you and your flying mount in as much risk as someone on a horse or warg would have on the ground.