Defilers are healers that Ward and heal.

[Gang]

<p>My Defiler was in a group with a Inquisitor tonght.  We are both healers but the Defiler will Ward mostly and only heal when needed.  The Defilers' wards will absorb and stop any damage from happening in the first place.  Heals can only heal the damage already done <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Right... Tonight the inquisitor ask me too start healing and accused me of not healing and helping him out.  I did try to explain that I was casting wards all the time, casting the single ward spell and then casting the group ward spell and so on and only healing when I really needed too.  He was not happy at all and left the group.</p><p>But in groups with a main healer and a (defiler/mystic) setup,  the (defiler/mystic) wards and cures while the other healer heals any damage done.</p><p>So I don't really know where this guy was coming from... <img src="/smilies/136dd33cba83140c7ce38db096d05aed.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> and the group was also confused.  I was warding my butt off so he only needed to heal little.</p>

[Nuhus]

Yeah, I agree. Defiler heals are much longer a casting time then wards. Ward effectively do the same thing, just pre emptively. Sounds like he just wanted to do some work. Unless you cast at the wrong time and draw a little aggro. I usualy stay off the group wards unless they are needed. IIRC the stacking was changed, group wards don't stack with single target wards do they?

[Raveller]

You were grouped with a [Removed for Content].

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<p>This is where ACT (Advanced Combat Tracker) comes in handy. Wards are counted as heals in that parse, and as a Shaman, you can send out a heal parse that would utterly shame any non-shaman healer that tried to tell you that you weren't doing a good job.</p><p>Wards [Removed for Content]-block all other heals. Quite frankly, if you are warding, you will be first on any heal parse over any other healer since all your heals get used up completely while theirs runs out unused or ticking while full hp.</p><p>The only time I've seen any healer really beat the snot out of a Shaman doing their job is a Warden laying down some sickening group heals against an AoE situation. With something like that going on, a Warden (and to a somehwhat lesser extent a Fury) will utterly dominate in healing.</p><p>But in a regular fight, keeping the MT or group Tank alive situation, Wards > all.</p><p>I'll admit though.. it's scary if you aren't used to it. I've played only rarely with a Shaman solo healing, and watching my health go to yellow or red and stay there for a long time is kinda freaky. But I won't die cuz the wards are always there eating up all the damage. Shaman love the Bruiser self heal in that case... when I see it happen I pop it off and save them from having to cast a long cast direct heal.</p>

[Kizee]

<cite>Ganger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>My Defiler was in a group with a Inquisitor tonght.  We are both healers but the Defiler will Ward mostly and only heal when needed.  The Defilers' wards will absorb and stop any damage from happening in the first place.  Heals can only heal the damage already done <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Right... Tonight the inquisitor ask me too start healing and accused me of not healing and helping him out.  I did try to explain that I was casting wards all the time, casting the single ward spell and then casting the group ward spell and so on and only healing when I really needed too.  He was not happy at all and left the group.</p><p>But in groups with a main healer and a (defiler/mystic) setup,  the (defiler/mystic) wards and cures while the other healer heals any damage done.</p><p>So I don't really know where this guy was coming from... <img src="/smilies/136dd33cba83140c7ce38db096d05aed.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> and the group was also confused.  I was warding my butt off so he only needed to heal little.</p></blockquote>Should have told him to shut up and dps.....thats about all inquisitor's do anyways. Stoopid battle priests.<img src="/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Ciarr]

<p>situation could easilly be reversed, he was casting reactives and expected you to heal, both classes have slow direct heals </p><p>it's one of the reasons why if there are 2 healers in the group I strongly prefer shaman/druid or cleric/druid combinations</p>

[Melodar]

Something else to be aware of is mystics/defilers and Inquisitors/Templars don't play well together. Each has a primary method of healing that is counterproductive to the others.  M/D has wards and I/T uses reactives. Well reactives require that tank be hit and the ward prevents that. Which forces I/T to use normal heals more instead of the reactives. Sure they can work together but they arent as effective as they can be one or the other will be using only 50% of their normal healing stuff. One thing I doubt he knew is your heals eat your life too. So rather dumb to ask you to heal. If you have a decent level ward he should easily keep up backing up with heals when ward goes down. Personally on my Inquis I keep a reactive up anyway in case M/D can't get new ward up or some special spell shatters the ward fast. Don't worry few even know Defilers can heal so feel good that he knew that <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Finora]

<p>You definately found a [Removed for Content]. You probably should have told him to shut up and DPS and let you show him how to 'heal'. </p><p>At least he didn't ask you for a port =(, that happened to me the other day.</p>

[Zyphe]

Nolus@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote>Yeah, I agree. Defiler heals are much longer a casting time then wards. Ward effectively do the same thing, just pre emptively. Sounds like he just wanted to do some work. Unless you cast at the wrong time and draw a little aggro. I usualy stay off the group wards unless they are needed. IIRC the stacking was changed, group wards don't stack with single target wards do they?</blockquote> They do stack. But first one cast is the one that will be reduced first. So it's best to use the group ward and the single target ward, unless you're trying to avoid pre-ward agro. Before a pull I single target ward myself, group ward, then single ward the tank. That way my ward will block and agro I get from pre-warding without using up the group ward. Then the group ward used up first on the tank (around 3k) and after that is up the single target ward is used (about 1800.)

[rakki]

Defilers are such great healers I was able to solo heal a valdoon run with a brigand as MT.... Or should I say solo WARD lol....

[metacell]

Urganabee@Crushbone wrote: <blockquote>Something else to be aware of is mystics/defilers and Inquisitors/Templars don't play well together. Each has a primary method of healing that is counterproductive to the others.  M/D has wards and I/T uses reactives. Well reactives require that tank be hit and the ward prevents that. </blockquote> Are you sure? I assumed that a ward prevents someone from taking damage from a hit, but that it still counts as a hit. And that reactive heals trigger on hits, not damage. I admit I've never tried it, though.

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<p>If the person has full health when the ward takes all the damage, then it wouldn't matter if the reactive goes off or not... the person is at full health and there is no damage for it to heal.</p><p>I almost hope it DOESN'T go off, that could be wasted triggers.</p>

[baguetteovenfresh]

Aquarius@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote>Urganabee@Crushbone wrote: <blockquote>Something else to be aware of is mystics/defilers and Inquisitors/Templars don't play well together. Each has a primary method of healing that is counterproductive to the others.  M/D has wards and I/T uses reactives. Well reactives require that tank be hit and the ward prevents that. </blockquote> Are you sure? I assumed that a ward prevents someone from taking damage from a hit, but that it still counts as a hit. And that reactive heals trigger on hits, not damage. I admit I've never tried it, though. </blockquote> 100% sure. my wards are in purple font, heals are in green. when they are warded, purple numbers spam above the player and no green (unless direct heals are used). the shadowknight selfheal while getting hit damage sheild works because it does damage back and ignores the ward entirely.

[Armawk]

<p>I dont see his problem at all... Templar speaking here too.</p><p>If Im in a group where I pretty much never have to heal because someones wards are preventing all damage getting through then the group has an overabundance of healing power. Which is fine, theres other things to do like stand up and be a plate assistance to the tank for example, I do wear the stuff and carry a big f'ing hammer for a reason, and I  make sure the plate and the hammer are serious as well just for this reason!. usually when paired with a ward class their wards dont keep up with the damage though, so, correctly, my job is to patch the holes that appear.</p><p>Maybe he was just too inexperienced to realise you were doing something at all? Its a perenial problem with wards and debuffs, ignoramuses dont even see them happening.</p>

[Mimzel]

I cant count all the times I have heard "we need a healer" after I've joined the pickup group... Defilers are NOT necro-bard hybrids! <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> A little comment on the OP's story: I can sympathise with being 2nd healer in a shaman group. Utterly booring <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> If I know our group can handle it, I'll sometimes ask the other healer if he wants to take turns healing - I then heal every other mob <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Nothing more booring being a healer that doesnt need to heal. However, wards are usually needed, so I only do this for trash clearing etc.

[Laenai]

<p>It shocks me the number of people that don't realize what subclass defilers are...even up to level 70.</p><p>What's worse is I still run into people that don't know what a 'shaman' is at T7.</p><p>I tend to run my defiler more as a warder/debuffer. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> The more a mob is debuffed, the faster it goes down, the less I have to worry about healing/warding.</p>

[Bozidar]

<p>in all honesty.</p><p>next time group with a fury.  if they dont' have to heal, they dont' even NOTICE it becuase they're too busy nuking <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Norrsken]

<cite>baguetteovenfresh wrote:</cite><blockquote>Aquarius@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote>Urganabee@Crushbone wrote: <blockquote>Something else to be aware of is mystics/defilers and Inquisitors/Templars don't play well together. Each has a primary method of healing that is counterproductive to the others.  M/D has wards and I/T uses reactives. Well reactives require that tank be hit and the ward prevents that. </blockquote> Are you sure? I assumed that a ward prevents someone from taking damage from a hit, but that it still counts as a hit. And that reactive heals trigger on hits, not damage. I admit I've never tried it, though. </blockquote> 100% sure. my wards are in purple font, heals are in green. when they are warded, purple numbers spam above the player and no green (unless direct heals are used). the shadowknight selfheal while getting hit damage sheild works because it does damage back and ignores the ward entirely. </blockquote>I rather think its because the SK proc lifetap procs thru wards because it procs on successful attacks, doesnt need to be damage, whereas the reactives procs on damage. With a ward on you, you take no damage.

[Mistletoes]

On my mystic the other night, grouped with an Inquisitor and a plate tank, I decided to concentrate more on debuffing on inc, not casting a ward unless it was really necessary. After every mob around us was debuffed, if the inq's power was less than mine, I would apply a group ward. Of course, I would use my dog with his AE ward, and my bear if needed, but generally the inq's reactives were keeping up pretty well. The parses had him a little above me on healing. It seemed to work very well, and I was able to do more DPS, causing mobs to drop faster. Group worked out nicely. I think I may try this out with a templar next time too. I have been in a group where another healer just left, saying that they were bored, and it looks like it just doesn't need to be that way.

[Ba]

<p>Best 2nd healer with a Shaman (Mystic or Defiler) is a Druid (Fury or Warden).</p><p>- Both preventative and restorative healing aspects are covered superbly with the Druid able to quickly and easily heal any lost HP even while wards are running using class special heals (HoT)</p><p>- The two healers are able to fully cover each other's weaknesses. The Druid has the fastest, most powerful and most efficient group heals in the game and also the ability to take anyone from 10% to full in an incredibly short amount of time -- Shamans are average/slow when it comes to restoring HP (especially for an entire group). Druids also get a significant number of very powerful useful caster-stat and melee-offensive buffs for the group. The Shaman provides superb protection against huge amounts of burst damage (which Druids are weak-average against), provides great defensive/stat/hp buffs and the ability to severely debuff tougher monsters in meaningful ways (Druids get very few debuffs that actually have any kind of noticable affect on monsters -- snare/root are the only really useful ones)</p><p>- If a Druid doesn't need to heal they will nuke for significant amounts of DPS (especially the Fury, highest spell damage of all the priests) thus you aren't losing any group efficiency even when fighting those monsters where two healers are overkill</p><p>- Utility: Portals (either Druid), enhanced SoW (if Mystic or Warden), group invis (if Fury), evac (if Warden), pact of cheetah (if Fury), powerful damage shields (either Druid), auto-rezzing healer (if druid has Heirophant title), etc etc</p><p>Clerics work well with Druids too.</p>

[Tallika_Runwithbears]

when on my defiler and grouping with another cleric healer i let them primary heal and stick to debuffing mobs and assisting them when the fit hits the shan.   lets them feel like they are doing stuff.

[kcirrot]

<cite>Bozidar wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>in all honesty.</p><p>next time group with a fury.  if they dont' have to heal, they dont' even NOTICE it becuase they're too busy nuking <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>QFT.  <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[MullenSkywatcher]

Defilers need a challenge.  The harder the mob or encounter, the more you want a Defiler/Mystic with you.  Its hard to realize how much benefit a defiler brings unless you macro chat all of your debuffs and wards into group chat, lol. Ironically, Defilers are weakest against weak mobs that go down quickly, because they don't last long enough for the debuffs to be effective, reducing you to being a single target ward bot. Lately during raiding, I'm happiest being grouped with a shaman, since I find a lot more epics that group dot poison/disease than elemental/trauma.  Shaman have saved my bacon way more times than I can recall.  The toughest gig seems to be that lone fury in the caster group, keeping a bunch of aggro stealing squishes alive is a task I wouldn't wish on anyone!

[Kwill]

<p>As a person who likes to play healer classes, I think anyone wanting to play a straight reactionary healing class should try a ward healing class for a bit to understand how it works.</p><p>After playing my fury, I tried a defiler, and it's a very different strategy to ward heal.  The wards are very powerful but you do need to get your timing right!  I found it tough to get a rhythym with the defiler, especially when the tank pulled without warning.  (I also find warding slightly boring, but that's just me).</p><p>This style of healing wasn't for me, obviously, but I appreciate the power of the defiler now and like grouping with them as a fury.  I am moving my old templar over to my new server with the transfer service, so I am going to see how I like playing her again.</p><p>I think as this game matures more people will understand the roles of the various classes and that will help.  Just because you play one class doesn't mean you shouldn't know what the role of other classes are in a group.  My main is an illusionist and that class is still a mystery to some people.  We are far from useless even if we aren't mezzing!  But that's another topic!</p>

[mellowknees72]

<cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote>You were grouped with a [Removed for Content]. </blockquote><p> Ha HA!</p><p>A [Removed for Content] who knows nothing about other classes and how they work.</p><p>When someone is about to type "You're not doing ____." or "Cast ____ now!", they really should stop and think how they feel when someone else tells them how to play their character.</p><p>Grr!</p><p>It's nonsense like this that keeps me steadfast in my solo/duo/group only with people I know mindset. <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  </p><p>PUGs=nightmares for me. <img src="/smilies/0320a00cb4bb5629ab9fc2bc1fcc4e9e.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[zaun2]

What I like doing with mystic in a group is doing my usual tapdance with group and individual wards, and telling the tank that he rocks, as he never even takes a hit... and wait to see if any group members figure it out.  Scary thing, most don't, as they are used to fury/warden heals, and not wards.

[Skar]

<p>When i group with my defiler and there is another healer on board, i just dps it up - laying a ward pre-fight then doing it up Chieftan style. </p><p> At level 61 I can avg.  250dps solo just dots and melee. Can do a lot more dps depending on group settup (if theres someone along with group melee procs, dps mod, etc). Which granted isnt a lot, but it beats two healers with 0dps. If its a hard zone, i ward more, cure more, debuff more, and my dps drops. </p><p> But main point, If the secondary healer gets [Removed for Content] because I'm not allowing him to heal, I just dps and let him keep the tank up till someone gets in trouble.</p>

[Nilliam]

As a templar, I like grouping with shamans. Up go the wards, means I can debuff my little plate armoured heart off., then cast a few reactives to cover the gap (if any) between the wards coming down and the new ones. Plus, if I see green numbers, it generally means we're in the soup. The only thing I'd like is a bit of warning before the ward expires. Sounds like the OPs quizzie was a cnut.