SOE lose a lawsuit?

[Bouncey]

<p>Did SOE lose a lawsuit to someone and have to change the names of Dire Worgs to Dire Wargs by force? </p><p>I am just curious about this as there was no explanation given at all but the dire worgs were removed from Loping Plains for several days. In the meantime the quest journal changed to reflect the new naming of the mobs before another two days lapsed when the dire wargs started appearing. Now they are everywhere the Dire Worgs used to be and nothing was ever said anywhere that I know of to explain the change. Anyone out there know any better?</p>

[RipFlex]

<p>I doubt it was a lawsuit, Worg or Warg are simply different spellings of the same thing - Google it.</p><p>I'm just glad they got them back to finish my quest all I care.</p>

[Galithdor]

I dont think LOTR has a copywrite on Worg anyways heh

[xcoltsfancoltsx]

they didn't lose they got their [Removed for Content]'s handed to em

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<p>Worg or Warg can't be copyrighted... there's no original creator of the term/named. It's part of old mythology, and the actual spelling has been around a lot longer than Tolkien's works. Even then, the old english term <i>was</i> Warg, not Worg... so if anything they changed it to be even MORE like Tolkien's material (which really, took it from the spelling of english at the time).</p><p>Besides... the only people that could copyright any LOTR reference it at all would be Tolkien's estate, not some game company that bought the rights to be able to make a game out of the works. Specific words and names would go through the copyright of the original owner.</p><p>And no, despite what some insane Tolkien "enthusiasts" might claim, he didn't invent everything. Popularizing old mythological things doesn't make you the owner, nor creator of said things.</p><p>I really don't know what happened here. They obviously wanted to change it to Warg (which is like the original english term anyways), but dunno why they did it this way. From the Dev comment in the thread about them missing, it sounds like they intended the change but goofed in the application, hence why it took like 3 or 4 days.</p>

[sah]

my guess is that some dev who's a big lotr fan had the bright idea to make a really simple change from worgs to wargs but didn't realize the consequences of doing it and whatever system is used to spawn mobs was still trying to spawn worgs so nothing was getting spawned (if that was the case much better than a zone crash!).  and on top of that he didn't update quests to use the new wargs.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Armawk]

Kaisoku@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote><p>And no, despite what some insane Tolkien "enthusiasts" might claim, he didn't invent everything. Popularizing old mythological things doesn't make you the owner, nor creator of said things.</p></blockquote>I like to think  he would have been pretty horrified at the thought of it (and at the sometime behaviour of his antecedents), as he was always totally open and ready to discuss and write about his sources and inspirations.

[deKoven]

Kaisoku@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote>....And no, despite what some insane Tolkien "enthusiasts" might claim, he didn't invent everything. Popularizing old mythological things doesn't make you the owner, nor creator of said things....</blockquote>Hmmm, lessee... As Tolkien didn't (or did, as the case may be) use a lot of stuff from the half mythological world I'd think that others would be able to use the same things. If you study carefully the Tolkien books you'll find elements from all over the world. Obscure place names, names of people and such, abound in his books. His genius was bringing those elements together with a VERY fertile imagination. If I could do something which was fully alive 70 years after I'm gone, I'd consider myself well served.

[Allisia]

<cite>deKoven wrote:</cite><blockquote>If I could do something which was fully alive 70 years after I'm gone, I'd consider myself well served. </blockquote>Tolkien has only been dead 33 years. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Cusashorn]

<p>I remember when Scars of Velious came out for EQlive, some player mentioned how he was forced to have his name changed because it was the same as an NPC found in Thurgadin.</p><p>He fought back by proving that his character name has existed since the 1980's. He's been using it as his very first character in Dungeons & Dragons, he uses it in all his emails, and his character existed since EQlive went live.</p><p>Sony had to change the name of the NPC.</p>

[ZachSpastic]

<cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I remember when Scars of Velious came out for EQlive, some player mentioned how he was forced to have his name changed because it was the same as an NPC found in Thurgadin.</p><p>He fought back by proving that his character name has existed since the 1980's. He's been using it as his very first character in Dungeons & Dragons, he uses it in all his emails, and his character existed since EQlive went live.</p><p>Sony had to change the name of the NPC.</p></blockquote>That's just silly and I don't believe it. The game publisher owns everything you do within the game. SOE owns your character and everything about him. You own nothing within the game. If SOE changed the name of an NPC they did so for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with how an player names his characters within the game or in an outside game.

[Valdaglerion]

<p>While I dont have the background on this particular instance, what I can tell you is that while Sony and ever other gaming company claim to own everything within the game, IF, they brought about the copyrighted name of a NPC as a legal issue and it was shown that the name they claim to have copyrighted in fact existed prior to their claim, a court of law would force the change as a finding for the defendant thereby granting copyright to the original owner.</p><p> Just a point of note...interesting none the less.</p><p> On a separate point, the companies are beginning to take a less stringent approach to the we own everything in our virtual world due to some cases starting to come to light which hold them RESPONSIBLE for everything that happens within their virtual world.</p><p> You cant make the legal argument that you own everything in your virtual world and its all yours but your inability to properly police and be aware of what happens within that world is not your responsibility when a "real" law is broken. Makes for interesting topics of discussion.</p>

[Ravaan]

<cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I remember when Scars of Velious came out for EQlive, some player mentioned how he was forced to have his name changed because it was the same as an NPC found in Thurgadin.</p><p>He fought back by proving that his character name has existed since the 1980's. He's been using it as his very first character in Dungeons & Dragons, he uses it in all his emails, and his character existed since EQlive went live.</p><p>Sony had to change the name of the NPC.</p></blockquote> they probably did it just to be nice, not because of a lawsuit or anything. I'm sure the guy didnt trademark the name or what not.

[ZachSpastic]

<cite>Valdaglerion wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>While I dont have the background on this particular instance, what I can tell you is that while Sony and ever other gaming company claim to own everything within the game, IF, they brought about the copyrighted name of a NPC as a legal issue and it was shown that the name they claim to have copyrighted in fact existed prior to their claim, a court of law would force the change as a finding for the defendant thereby granting copyright to the original owner.</p><p> Just a point of note...interesting none the less.</p></blockquote> What are you thinking, that as a player I hold the copyrights to my D&D character names? Everyone please take notice, I hold the copyright to the name 'Bill' and will sue anyone who uses the name 'Bill' for any purpose without my authorization.

[Srukin]

<cite>sahet wrote:</cite><blockquote>my guess is that some dev who's a big lotr fan had the bright idea to make a really simple change from worgs to wargs but didn't realize the consequences of doing it and whatever system is used to spawn mobs was still trying to spawn worgs so nothing was getting spawned (if that was the case much better than a zone crash!).  and on top of that he didn't update quests to use the new wargs.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote> That's pretty much almost exactly what happened <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[interstellarmatter]

<cite>Saerkin wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>sahet wrote:</cite><blockquote>my guess is that some dev who's a big lotr fan had the bright idea to make a really simple change from worgs to wargs but didn't realize the consequences of doing it and whatever system is used to spawn mobs was still trying to spawn worgs so nothing was getting spawned (if that was the case much better than a zone crash!).  and on top of that he didn't update quests to use the new wargs.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote> That's pretty much almost exactly what happened <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> That's minus 20 DKP

[Mystfit]

<p>*Ellery Jones Monkey Designer* - EQII *I design monkeys. </p><hr /><p>Haven't you always wanted a Monkey <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Spyderbite]

Only in Litigation Crazed America would one jump to such a conclusion.. glad I moved to Canada. When somebody slips on a grape in the produce section or spills coffee on themselves in the drive-up they're apologized to by management and that's the end of it. In the states, its on the front page of USA Today the next morning. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Worgs and Wargs have been used in various books & movies thousands of times since LoTR. Tolkien intended his works to be an inspiration to authors. If not, his son Christopher would have a full time job filing suits against hundreds of authors such as Jordan & Palini. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Espyderman]

<cite>Saerkin wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>sahet wrote:</cite><blockquote>my guess is that some dev who's a big lotr fan had the bright idea to make a really simple change from worgs to wargs but didn't realize the consequences of doing it and whatever system is used to spawn mobs was still trying to spawn worgs so nothing was getting spawned (if that was the case much better than a zone crash!).  and on top of that he didn't update quests to use the new wargs.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote> That's pretty much almost exactly what happened <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> Aww, the speculation of what happened was interesting to read though! You shouldnt of said anything and see where this could of went! LOL. (seriously good thing you said something before it got out of hand)

[Chay]

<cite>Saerkin wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>sahet wrote:</cite><blockquote>my guess is that some dev who's a big lotr fan had the bright idea to make a really simple change from worgs to wargs but didn't realize the consequences of doing it and whatever system is used to spawn mobs was still trying to spawn worgs so nothing was getting spawned (if that was the case much better than a zone crash!).  and on top of that he didn't update quests to use the new wargs.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote> That's pretty much almost exactly what happened <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> This makes me smile the smile of sincere contented joy. Thank you for sharing that.

[liveja]

<cite>Mystfit wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Haven't you always wanted a Monkey <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote><p>Shock the monkey to life!</p><p>It's good to hear this was all a matter of a mistake, rather than legal action. </p>

[Dasein]

<span style="color: #0000ff">While I dont have the background on this particular instance, what I can tell you is that while Sony and ever other gaming company claim to own everything within the game, IF, they brought about the copyrighted name of a NPC as a legal issue and it was shown that the name they claim to have copyrighted in fact existed prior to their claim, a court of law would force the change as a finding for the defendant thereby granting copyright to the original owner. <span style="color: #000000">Names alone cannot be copyrighted, so the point is moot. </span></span><p> On a separate point, the companies are beginning to take a less stringent approach to the we own everything in our virtual world due to some cases starting to come to light which hold them RESPONSIBLE for everything that happens within their virtual world.</p><p> You cant make the legal argument that you own everything in your virtual world and its all yours but your inability to properly police and be aware of what happens within that world is not your responsibility when a "real" law is broken. Makes for interesting topics of discussion.</p><span style="color: #000000">So far, the only cases of this sort I am aware of involve Second Life, which has a different IP model than most other games, as it does allow it's users to own their creations, and sell them for real money. Where you thinking of these same cases, or do you know of other cases challenging the publisher's claims to ownership, as I would be quite interested in following them.</span>