Lower Levels As an untwinked Coercer

[Denubisdjinn]

<p>Greetings just getting into the game and I've played a Coercer to 10th so far... to put it bluntly, I'm a complete and utter newb.  I'm curious does charm break as often as it does at my level ?  Most fights I end up having to run from both npc's.  It almost seems like if I cast a heroic opportunity or certain spells my charm breaks every single fight.</p><p> Is it just because I haven't upgraded the spell ?  I don't have much money to spend on upgrading spells every 5 levels either so that seems a waste.  </p>

[Kocia]

<p>Having played both, in my opinion, it is easier to level as Illusionist and then betray to Coercer.  Having your pet at ad3 is fine, no need for M1, and you can level and solo easily if you must.   With a coercer you really need M1 Charm and the price of it is prohibitive.  Your life as untwinked Coercer is much harder than untwinked Illusionist.</p><p> As you level up, your understanding of the game and your wealth increase, then you can buy master charm spell and betray to Coercer.</p>

[Denubisdjinn]

Whats this betray option ?

[Kocia]

<cite>Denubisdjinn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Whats this betray option ?</blockquote> You can switch Illusionist <-> Coercer at any level with a series of quests.

[Oriax]

If your having trouble with your charm breaking often it could depend on a couple things. One you are using apprentice 1 of the spell. Atleast get an Adept 1 version if money is an issue. Two could the the level of the mobs your charming. Try to charm only mobs your level or lower. Thirdly could be the mobs mental resists. Some mobs will have higher mental resists and will be harder to control. The road to 70 as a coercer is painful, or atleast it was for me. Once you get there though it really pays off. Or as Kocia mentioned Illusionist-betray option is always a way around low lvls also.

[ZarethPixiemezzer]

I have a 68 Illusionist that I started when EoF came out and it was incredibly easy to solo that char.  I have started a coercer and got her to 20 last night and I'm finding it incredibly hard.  I have thought about starting another illusionist and leveling it up and then betraying, but I am concerned about doing that and then really having no idea of the new class I have obtained.  I have seen some say that Illusionist and Coercer are way different classes.  I have also seen some say that betraying to a coercer at a late level may make  it hard to figure out how to play the class.  Has anyone here done this and if so, how hard was it to make the transition to effectively playing a coercer after betrayal?

[Kocia]

<cite>ZarethPixiemezzer wrote:</cite><blockquote>some say that betraying to a coercer at a late level may make  it hard to figure out how to play the class. </blockquote><p> Personally I think it's BS...the classes are similar, they have different buffs and are put in different raid groups but if you played an Illusionist to 68 then you sure as heck have an understanding of what's going on.  Your in group play differences can be figured out in oh, about 30 minutes.</p><p>Also, another advice to the OP.  To be perfectly honest, choosing an enchanter as your first eq2 char is not the correct choice.  Playing enchanter is something you do best after you played a more straightforward class and learned the mechanics of grouping and dungeons etc.  Of course some will say NO! GREAT CLASS TO LEARN GAME WITH!    Well, I group with a 70 chanter once in a while that never played a tank or healing class and trust me, it shows.  Crappy newbie chaters (level 70 means nothing) make me cry.</p><p> So overall an awesome class, but as your first I'd choose something more straightforward.</p>

[Jesdyr]

Kocia wrote: <blockquote><p>To be perfectly honest, choosing an enchanter as your first eq2 char is not the correct choice.  Playing enchanter is something you do best after you played a more straightforward class and learned the mechanics of grouping and dungeons etc.  Of course some will say NO! GREAT CLASS TO LEARN GAME WITH!    Well, I group with a 70 chanter once in a while that never played a tank or healing class and trust me, it shows.  Crappy newbie chaters (level 70 means nothing) make me cry.</p><p> So overall an awesome class, but as your first I'd choose something more straightforward.</p></blockquote> I picked Coercer as my first class for 4 reasons. 1 - It is the least played class (from the numbers I have seen) 2 - The class looked like it would be more than pressing buttons without really having to think about much. 3 - Looked like every battle had a good chance you would die. 4 - I like playing pet classes. My fav characer in any mmog was my UO tamer (before they were powerfull). You are right .. lvl 70 doesnt mean you are not a noob. Someone could play every class to 70 and not know how to group. It doesnt matter what they start with some people just never get it. Other people just know how to play well in a group no matter what role they are playing. I have been playing MMOGs for a long time. I know how to tank, heal, mez, DPS, so on.  I have played these roles before in other games. Some roles I am better at than others but I understand them all and even enjoy the more utility classes. But here is the thing .. a Coercer will not get very far SOLO unless they figure out how to play the class. Playing this class really requires you to know the zone you are in and what the strongpoints of all the mobs are (more so that any other class). Now if you find a group that doesnt really care or notice that you are a poor player, then you could make it to 70 just leeching. Many groups will put up with it just for the power regen and honestly not many people have any clue what a coercer does anyway.

[DwarvesR]

<cite>JesDer wrote:</cite><blockquote>Kocia wrote: <p>honestly not many people have any clue what a coercer does anyway. </p></blockquote><p>Sad but true.  I was playing with an IRL friend earlier today who's played several alts into at least T6.  Right now he's focusing on his warlock, trying to blow it up to 70 so he can start raiding with it.  He's been grinding with groups in EoF more than anything, so he's not really explored KoS yet, so I had him go to Bonemire and met him there.  Showed him around to the discovery points, looked for the various "solo named" mobs for aaxp for him, etc.  Yes, I had me a corpse flame pet.  What you think I'd charm something else in BM? <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Anyway. . .we get on to HoF island and I'm clearing the excavators and agents so we can run down the chain without having to train it on his 1st ever attempt.  We moved up a bit and a couple that a prior group had cleared repopped on us.  We'd been doing fine up until now with him not casting dots or anything, just straight nukes on rooted mobs to help the pet out, but. . . once we had those extra adds on us, he panicked and went full blue aoe mode. . .and yes, that means dots.  I couldn't mez becuz of the dots, so I just rooted and stunned and backed out.  Almost saved him, but not quite.  Once he died, his dots canceled though, and I was able to pull it out on my own.</p><p>When he got back, I just made sure to tell him that "control is the name of the game."  He apologized (I'm thinking "Why are you apologizing?  It's not like *I* died. . . .&quot<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> and said "never played with a coercer before, so I'm still not sure what all you can do or how you work."  Never mind that he'd just watch me solo a named ^^^ caster mob without taking any damage to me or my pet whatsoever. . . .</p><p>Yeah sure, we may not have done as much dps as he was capable of, but with the mobs controlled, we survived easily.  Eventually we ran the 2 of us into the hive section and were cleaning up on the xp in there.  My root and control spells, plus his 2 roots meant that it was realllllly hard for the mobs to break root, and we just burned them down.  Worked really nice.  He left adds to me, and it was a really fun afternoon. . . . once he learned how coercers work, anyway.</p><p>It was fun for me too, seeing how force magnified even with having just a non-traditional duo too.  </p><p>Still. . it was sad.  A friend of mine who I've played with a lot (though not on my coercer before) who's done well over 200 levels on his various alts, and he still could say "I've never played with a coercer before." <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p>

[WasFycksir]

<p>The first charm we get breaks alot, we have to just accept that.  Do some harvesting and sell the rares or start crafting and make some cash for better spells/gear, that will help some.  BUT don't blow your cash too much in the lower tiers, you will go through them very quickly unless you are level locking for AA or whatever reason.</p><p>Like others have said coercer is a tough choice for a first character, but it's cool you are trying it.</p><p>You want some real fun, start an untwinked coercer on a PVP server, which is where my first/only coercer was rolled.  That will truly teach you the meaning of death in a game.  He is much better now at lev 47 but in the beginning OMG, talk about pain and suffering.</p><p> Read the stickies and this forum for more advice, there are some really great tips here.  Good luck.</p>

[Jesdyr]

<cite>WasFycksir wrote:</cite><blockquote> teach you the meaning of death in a game. </blockquote> Hehe .. I remeber as a new coercer (new to the game as well) .. I died ALOT .. mainly because I dont give up and would try to kill things I really should have left alone <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> .. Still the one thing that many people forget about is the "/pet ranged" command is now inplace. This alone makes coercer much easier to play even at low levels. When I was learning to play coercer I had to learn to juggle while still keeping the battle in my control. I died many times just getting use to juggling my pet <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Sydias]

<cite>Denubisdjinn wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Greetings just getting into the game and I've played a Coercer to 10th so far... to put it bluntly, I'm a complete and utter newb.  I'm curious does charm break as often as it does at my level ?  Most fights I end up having to run from both npc's.  It almost seems like if I cast a heroic opportunity or certain spells my charm breaks every single fight.</p><p> Is it just because I haven't upgraded the spell ?  I don't have much money to spend on upgrading spells every 5 levels either so that seems a waste.  </p></blockquote><p> Charm does break a lot at the lower levels and you are mostly right that it is due to a lower grade spell.  To combat this (without shelling out a lot of plat for a lvl 20 or 30 spell) you can put 5 points into the charm AA (Beguile I think).  This will help with the resists and breaks quite a bit.  You can also buy the adept 1 spell which aren't too expensive, but do give a decent boost to the resists.  If you can't find or afford an adept 1, the Apprentice 2 available at your trainer is most affordable.</p><p>Some great tips I got when I was starting out was to not rely on a pet for the duration of your charm.  If you want to solo, grab a pet and use it right away against another mob.  Once you have killed the mob, either move on to the next one if the pet still has enough health for another kill or if it's health is low, cancel the charm, kill it and grab another one.  Do not charm a heroic mob at the lower levels.  This is because even if your pet is at very low health and is a heroic mob, when it breaks or you cancel the charm the health of the heroic will still be very high, then you are in trouble.</p>

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<p>Another tactic is that when you are sending your pet to attack... target through you pet to cast damage and crowd control spells.</p><p>When your pet breaks mid combat, you will be already targetting him and can land a mez quick. It can be hard to do in groups because you have to switch around what you are target all the time.. but solo play, it's not that hard to get into the habit of doing this.</p><p>As long as your charm is within your level range (and you aren't using a 40 levels lower master 1 charm like I am, lol), you'll get a few seconds grace to get your mez on him. Often I've found that that time can be spent just trying to find your pet and target him.</p><p>So having him already targetted can help a lot on breaks.</p>

[thebunny]

Kaisoku@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote><p>Another tactic is that when you are sending your pet to attack... target through you pet to cast damage and crowd control spells.</p><p>When your pet breaks mid combat, you will be already targetting him and can land a mez quick. It can be hard to do in groups because you have to switch around what you are target all the time.. but solo play, it's not that hard to get into the habit of doing this.</p><p>As long as your charm is within your level range (and you aren't using a 40 levels lower master 1 charm like I am, lol), you'll get a few seconds grace to get your mez on him. Often I've found that that time can be spent just trying to find your pet and target him.</p><p>So having him already targetted can help a lot on breaks.</p></blockquote> Wow, that's a great idea, I never even thought of that!  I'll have to try that next time I'm on my noob Coercer.  Thanks for the tip.