Resists in PVP.

[Aeg]

<p>hi, i just recently came back from vanguard and i am disapointed to see that resists are still as broken as they were when i left. i would have hoped that the people are sony would have payed attention to all of the petitions and posts made when this problem started happening, instead. resists are just as broken as they were before in pvp.</p><p>allow me to lay it out for you. classes who rely on CAs and physical damage have a much easier time in pvp than people who rely on spells because damage is unresistable. it is mitigatable sure, but so is spell damage. CAs can be avoided, but the majority of classes with CAs can just go on to the next quick casting one when one gets parried, blocked or avoided. it is much easier to get resists as any class than it is to get physical mitigation as all classes.</p><p>spells require people to stand still, they can be easier interupted if they are long casting (as most sorceror nukes are) and the focus system is so broken right now that it is even worse than the old system which had a lesser chance to interupt than the new system which resets spells. spell resetting is MUCH worse in many ways.</p><p>i realize that an MMO will never have all equal classes, but EQ2 can start to close the gap by significantly lowering the resist rates of spells in pvp across the board. as it stands, any scout in treasured resist armor can kill my wizard in pvp if they know what they are doing. i know what i am doing in pvp and when it comes down to resists which are causing me to lose in pvp, i get very frustrated.</p><p>i also realize that i am playing a dying breed of pvp classes. most people who played casters when pvp servers launched have either quit, rolled a scout pvp toon or just dont pvp. im doing the best that i can to prove to people that it is possible to play this game in pvp as a caster.</p><p>please at least look into this issue in some way or another.</p>

[Ibunubi]

It seems the best way to PvP in T7 is to be level 40~

[Bozidar]

This is a purely T7 discussion, is it not?  Are there major resist issues at other tiers?

[Spyderbite]

<cite>Aegiz wrote:</cite><blockquote>i also realize that i am playing a dying breed of pvp classes. most people who played casters when pvp servers launched have either quit, rolled a scout pvp toon or just dont pvp. im doing the best that i can to prove to people that it is possible to play this game in pvp as a caster.</blockquote> 5 of your friends does not constitute "most people who played casters". There are nights that I can't swing my stiletto in full circle without hitting a mess of spell casters trying to root me. *whispers to OP* Did you get that subtle hint?? Root them.. don't stand toe to toe with them. That's not how your class was built. I believe this is my virgin use of the term... L2P your class.

[holypaladin28]

<p>please the resists are fine</p><p>omg you cant oneshot somebody im rolling with8k in cold in my group and the other night i got fusioned 5 times in 40 minutes and only once did it resist the other times about 5k-7k in damage and once i was oneshotted</p><p>yeah 8k cold resists and 10k life and i get oneshotted they arent broke </p>

[Aeg]

<p>i was testing my spells on a ranger friend of mine yesterday with 4500 cold resist and 5600 heat, i was getting upwards 65% resist rates on all my spells and major mitigation on even big nukes like fusion and ice nova. i havent one shotted someone in over 6 months, the only people who i hit for more than 50% of their health are greens and blues.</p><p>on pvp servers about 70% of classes who pvp are scouts because they have the obvious advantages of attacking fast and dealing damage quickly after they start casting. they have almost none of the hinderances that all offensive casters do.</p><p>i resent the comment that i dont know how to play my class. i have been playing wizard since february 21st 2006, that is the day pvp opened for everquest 2. i know how to play my class in every way possible and i am speced in the best way possible in pvp with capped disruption and focus and just 40 below the cap on subjugation, yet i am still unable to land spells on people at a decent rate with even medium resists. </p><p>any caster who is serious about pvp will tell you that resist rates are totally broken. just before christmas a change was made in stealth to make it so if a person had lower resists they would resist more often. this change is out of hand and has been out of hand since it went live. someone with 1000 cold resist can resist about 80% of my spells before one lands and the way resists are scaled they will mitigate just slightly less than someone with 4000 cold resist. the higher resists are, the more they land on someone. this is a bug among many other imbalances which needs fixing.</p><blockquote>Did you get that subtle hint?? Root them.. don't stand toe to toe with them. That's not how your class was built. I believe this is my virgin use of the term... L2P your class.</blockquote><p>it is unfortunate for you that you are not good enough to figure out an easy way to overcome the control effects of root, a spell which if cured still maintains immunity from when it first landed. see if you can catch my subtle hint and apply it to the game before you post like you know anything about pvp and casters in this game. my only other advice is to not charge into huge groups of people solo and to maybe invest about 50 gold into a set of resist gear.</p><p>P.S. believe it or not, roots can be resisted too.</p><blockquote>omg you cant oneshot somebody im rolling with8k in cold in my group and the other night i got fusioned 5 times in 40 minutes and only once did it resist the other times about 5k-7k in damage and once i was oneshotted <p>yeah 8k cold resists and 10k life and i get oneshotted they arent broke </p></blockquote><p>in order to one shot someone id need to be able to land an ability on them first, wouldent you agree? anyway, i can tell you right now, that with 8k resists you should be just fine, you arent going to be one shotted by anyone, especially with 10k life. i challenge you to post me a fraps of you getting one shotted with 10k life and 8k cold resists. it is simply impossible. the way mitigation works will effectly cut the max damage of fusion and ice nova in half. the way the math works is, you mitigate about 60% with 8k cold, ice nova hits for about 4.5k max in pvp, all of a sudden you get hit by one of my most powerful spells with a 4 second cast time for a devastating 1800 points of cold damage, not even 20% of your supposed max health. </p><p>the fact that you are getting hit with fusion at all speaks of your ability in pvp. fusion is a 5 meter cone ability with a unique graphic, 5 second cast time (one of the the longest in the game) and a loud noise that sounds like a freight train when it is being cast. if you got hit with fusion 5 times in a row in one night, you got bigger problem to worry about. i might suggest turning your spell graphics up, or perhaps your volume a notch.</p><p>maybe when you learn how to dodge fusion, the easiest spell in the game to avoid getting hit by, you can come back and start telling me that resists arent broken.</p>

[Elephanton]

<p>I've got a very simple question: why resists no longer mitigate magical damage after EOF revamp? Should not armor be changed not to mitigate physical damage as well?</p><p>Right now, I see huge imbalance of spells vs combat arts in PVP.</p><p><b>Spells</b></p><p>- have chance to be outright resisted</p><p>- if not resisted, they land at full power - RESISTS ARE NOT TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT</p><p><b>Combat Arts</b></p><p>- have chance to be outright resisted (dodged/parried/blocked)</p><p>- if not resisted, they land and deal mitigated damage depending on armor type - PHYSICAL "RESISTS" ARE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT</p>

[Dodger Sunsoar]

Aegiz wrote: <blockquote><blockquote>omg you cant oneshot somebody im rolling with8k in cold in my group and the other night i got fusioned 5 times in 40 minutes and only once did it resist the other times about 5k-7k in damage and once i was oneshotted <p>yeah 8k cold resists and 10k life and i get oneshotted they arent broke </p></blockquote><p>in order to one shot someone id need to be able to land an ability on them first, wouldent you agree? anyway, i can tell you right now, that with 8k resists you should be just fine, you arent going to be one shotted by anyone, especially with 10k life. i challenge you to post me a fraps of you getting one shotted with 10k life and 8k cold resists. it is simply impossible. the way mitigation works will effectly cut the max damage of fusion and ice nova in half. the way the math works is, you mitigate about 60% with 8k cold, <b><span style="color: #00ff33">ice nova hits for about 4.5k max in pvp</span></b>, all of a sudden you get hit by one of my most powerful spells with a 4 second cast time for a devastating 1800 points of cold damage, not even 20% of your supposed max health. </p></blockquote><p>that green highlited statement of yours is purely BS; i have been hit by IceNova Several times for over 5.5k Damadge; this absolutely wrong statement of yours makes you stand there without credibilite .....</p><p>try again</p><p>CHeers!</p>

[holypaladin28]

<cite>Aegiz wrote:</cite><blockquote>with8k in cold in my group and the other night i got fusioned 5 times in 40 minutes and only once did it resist the other times about 5k-7k in damage and once i was oneshotted <blockquote><p>yeah 8k cold resists and 10k life and i get oneshotted they arent broke </p></blockquote><p>in order to one shot someone id need to be able to land an ability on them first, wouldent you agree? anyway, i can tell you right now, that with 8k resists you should be just fine, you arent going to be one shotted by anyone, especially with 10k life. i challenge you to post me a fraps of you getting one shotted with 10k life and 8k cold resists. it is simply impossible. the way mitigation works will effectly cut the max damage of fusion and ice nova in half. the way the math works is, you mitigate about 60% with 8k cold, ice nova hits for about 4.5k max in pvp, all of a sudden you get hit by one of my most powerful spells with a 4 second cast time for a devastating 1800 points of cold damage, not even 20% of your supposed max health. </p><p>the fact that you are getting hit with fusion at all speaks of your ability in pvp. fusion is a 5 meter cone ability with a unique graphic, 5 second cast time (one of the the longest in the game) and a loud noise that sounds like a freight train when it is being cast. if you got hit with fusion 5 times in a row in one night, you got bigger problem to worry about. i might suggest turning your spell graphics up, or perhaps your volume a notch.</p><p>maybe when you learn how to dodge fusion, the easiest spell in the game to avoid getting hit by, you can come back and start telling me that resists arent broken.</p></blockquote><p>yah its easy to avouid fusion when you are fighting its you and oneother and your fighting 4 others others and the wizzy comes out of now place and lands the nuke.  because you know when other tanks taunt it means i cant switch targets.</p><p>maybe you should learn to play your class because i know plenty of wizzys that dont have problems. maybe try a debuff  </p>

[slashalot]

Dodgerius@Darathar wrote: <blockquote>Aegiz wrote: <blockquote><blockquote>omg you cant oneshot somebody im rolling with8k in cold in my group and the other night i got fusioned 5 times in 40 minutes and only once did it resist the other times about 5k-7k in damage and once i was oneshotted <p>yeah 8k cold resists and 10k life and i get oneshotted they arent broke </p></blockquote><p>in order to one shot someone id need to be able to land an ability on them first, wouldent you agree? anyway, i can tell you right now, that with 8k resists you should be just fine, you arent going to be one shotted by anyone, especially with 10k life. i challenge you to post me a fraps of you getting one shotted with 10k life and 8k cold resists. it is simply impossible. the way mitigation works will effectly cut the max damage of fusion and ice nova in half. the way the math works is, you mitigate about 60% with 8k cold, <b><span style="color: #00ff33">ice nova hits for about 4.5k max in pvp</span></b>, all of a sudden you get hit by one of my most powerful spells with a 4 second cast time for a devastating 1800 points of cold damage, not even 20% of your supposed max health. </p></blockquote><p>that green highlited statement of yours is purely BS; i have been hit by IceNova Several times for over 5.5k Damadge; this absolutely wrong statement of yours makes you stand there without credibilite .....</p><p>try again</p><p>CHeers!</p></blockquote>got to agree here. i 1 shotted a blue caster for 4.6k with <b>Ice Comet</b> just last night. although i did get 4 straight resists off of a L55 regular NPC on the same spell.

[Balrok]

<p>Didn't see it in the post, but what level are your spells?  App1, App3, Adept1, Adept3 or Master I?</p><p>I don't even bother with Adept1's... raise money for Adept3 or find the Master.  Does a Wiz have any debuff spells?  Before I try anything, it's Debuff mental... till then I'm either fearing, rooting, mezzing, stunning or stifling.  I don't try any damage spells with out a debuff on.  I'm currently 1 aa away from opening an EoF tree that will give me a spell to drop mental 3500 and it's 50% harder to resist.  Can't wait!  Unless the Q is Fabled, I don't run into resist issues that much anyway... oh, and my main Debuff spell is M2'ed.  Heck, I even will cast my debuff first and then root/mez.  With a Caster, it's see a Q coming or be killed.  </p><p> As a fellow caster, don't change anything.  I get one shotted by Wizards all the time, they shouldn't complain.  If resistances are nerfered more, they will win 99% of the time.  My solo pvp'ing is me vs someones resist.  If I get threw, I win... if I don't, I lose.</p><p> Exur - 67 Coercer</p>

[Ekelefer]

Spyderbite@Venekor wrote: <blockquote><cite>Aegiz wrote:</cite><blockquote>i also realize that i am playing a dying breed of pvp classes. most people who played casters when pvp servers launched have either quit, rolled a scout pvp toon or just dont pvp. im doing the best that i can to prove to people that it is possible to play this game in pvp as a caster.</blockquote> 5 of your friends does not constitute "most people who played casters". There are nights that I <span style="color: #cc0000">can't</span> swing my stiletto in full circle without hitting a mess of spell casters trying to root me. *whispers to OP* Did you get that subtle hint?? Root them.. don't stand toe to toe with them. That's not how your class was built. I believe this is my virgin use of the term... L2P your class. </blockquote><p>Before you go spouting off about L2p your class, get your facts straight. I play a lvl70sk and resists are borked. I've gotten multiple resists from some of the worst equipped players in-game (I know, after getting 2 to 3 resists from some people I logged a Q alt and came and inspected them, finding out they had 40% disease mit or lower)</p><p>As for focus, haha, it never works. It is beyond frustrating for your spell to be .2secs from finishing and someone interupts you. Supposedly when your casting a spell focus it suppose to act as some kind of mitigation aganst stuns/interupts/stifle. It doesn't work though.</p><p>TBH, if you are swinging your stilleto around and can't hit a caster, you need L2P your class. The only archetype that gets 360 degrees of avoidance are brawlers, take an extra second to stand behind a caster and launch your CAs and you will never miss unless it is a very unlucky "You MISS your target". If you are trying to AE a slew of casters, well again, L2P your ambush class, you're not Chuck Norris and you're not gonna come roll a few casters unless they are all noob.   </p><p>P.S....The letter highlighted in red shows how you pwned your own rebuttal....you can't hide the truth.<img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p>

[Bozidar]

Ekeleferal wrote: <blockquote><p>TBH, if you are swinging your stilleto around and can't hit a caster, you need L2P your class. The only archetype that gets 360 degrees of avoidance are brawlers, take an extra second to stand behind a caster and launch your CAs and you will never miss unless it is a very unlucky "You MISS your target". If you are trying to AE a slew of casters, well again, L2P your ambush class, you're not Chuck Norris and you're not gonna come roll a few casters unless they are all noob.   </p><p>P.S....The letter highlighted in red shows how you pwned your own rebuttal....you can't hide the truth.<img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p></blockquote> Uhm... WOW.  How's your hair doing?  What he was really saying just blew right over your head so fast i'm amazed you didn't get scalped.

[Chia_Pet]

Resist problems??/ try playing a pally...every freaking armor peice seems to have divine resists on it...and ALL our attacks just about are divine damage. We got it the worst.

[DankShasta]

<cite>Aegiz wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> i am speced in the best way possible in pvp with capped disruption and focus and just 40 below the cap on subjugation, yet i am still unable to land spells on people at a decent rate with even medium resists. </p></blockquote><p>  I actually agree with you, but I'll say this your subjugation probably sucks. They fixxed the way it levels up while you were gone. Max it out becuase 40 is WELL SHORT OF MAX. That's 8 levels worth of subjugation. * levels means you are casting as if you were green conned, or grey depending on the level of your final root.</p><p>   The resists are messedup though, my 70 Dirge has a hard time landing master1's. I have had my lvl 70 master1 resisted 5 times in a row! That seems alittle nuts to me. I don't care what thier resists are, a maxed level master1 cast by a maxxed level toon, with maxxed out casting skill, should land more often PERIOD!</p><p>Dankshasta/Technics</p>

[Groma]

I'd have to agree that resists are broken.  Like Kalgore said, on those people that have high resists, spells are still landing.  Its the people with weak resists that are getting off easy.  When i attack a botter, i get resisted 2/3 of the time or more.  When my spells do land, they hit hard, but they don't land nearly as often as they do on a well equipped player. In their current state, you can totally forget about resists and focus on stats that are much more beneficial in pvp(avoid, parry, int/str/sta/agi) because with low resists you get hit harder, but not nearly as often.

[Aerlyn]

<p>I can't comment on the issue regarding T7 resists, since the highest that I've PVPed in is T4.  However, one thing from the OP that I can identify with is the issue of spell interruption.  I play a mystic, and can get interrupted very frequently.</p><p>I'm not trying to complain, as I think I've had a number of good fights, but I will say that it can be frustrating to try to cast a ward just to stay alive long enough to cast something else offensive, only to have it be interrupted over and over again.  Getting a single target ward up can be hard enough, sometimes, but with a 5 second cast time on my group ward, it's pretty painful when that gets interrupted near the end.  There are a few tricks I can try, though, such as using my emergency ward to buy a few seconds to get something better in place.</p><p>As I mentioned, some fights I do ok, but other fights (most I think), I spend a lot of my time trying to recast wards.  I think that in a few fights I've had, I never even get to finish casting an initial ward to protect me.  Not that I go down extremely fast, it's just that by the time I'm dead I might never get to finish casting anything due to being interrupted so much.  If I'm alone and getting beat on by a big group, that's what I'd expect, but that's not the kind of fight I'm talking about.</p><p>As I said, I'm not trying to complain.  I'm just giving my perspective as a mystic PVPing in T4.  Maybe interrupts are just fine as they are, but if not then here are a few ideas.  These are just off the top of my head as I'm typing this, so I'm not sure if they have any merit:</p><p>1.  Instead of having to restart casting completely on an interrupt, have it set back the casting progress by some amount.</p><p>2.  Have the recast timer start when casting is started, not when it finishes (add some extra time to the recast as appropriate).  At least that way, if It takes me 2 + X seconds to cast my 2 second spell(where X is extra time due to interrupts), then I don't have to wait 2 + X + R seconds between casts (where R is recast time).</p><p>3.  For select spells/abilities, reduce casting time but add that extra time to the recovery time as well as recast time.  I don't know if there are really any spells or abilities that merit this kind of a change (though of course I'd love to see that happen to my group ward <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />).  It would just make it a lot easier (less impossible?) to get the benefit of the spell during combat without changing how fast I can finish casting it and start casting something else.</p><p>I'm just brainstorming some ideas here.  I'm not saying these are good ideas.  I'm just throwing stuff out there. </p>

[loveybutt]

Dankshasta@Nagafen wrote: <blockquote><cite>Aegiz wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> i am speced in the best way possible in pvp with capped disruption and focus and just 40 below the cap on subjugation, yet i am still unable to land spells on people at a decent rate with even medium resists. </p></blockquote><p>  I actually agree with you, but I'll say this your subjugation probably sucks. They fixxed the way it levels up while you were gone. Max it out becuase 40 is WELL SHORT OF MAX. That's 8 levels worth of subjugation. * levels means you are casting as if you were green conned, or grey depending on the level of your final root.</p><p>   The resists are messedup though, my 70 Dirge has a hard time landing master1's. I have had my lvl 70 master1 resisted 5 times in a row! That seems alittle nuts to me. I don't care what thier resists are, a maxed level master1 cast by a maxxed level toon, with maxxed out casting skill, should land more often PERIOD!</p><p>Dankshasta/Technics</p></blockquote><p>Welcome back gilgame!..</p><p>And yeah I agree, resists still suck... Every now n then I log my troub in and try and pvp some, but then i get resisted constantly... and I always run with dove song on (increases subjugation and all those other castery buffs) and still get resists out the butt..</p><p>Sometimes I try and pvp on my 70 pally.. and its not much better... so i did what every decent human being does: rolled a ranger, and at 70 I have much for success/fun on him..</p><p>Hobs 70 troub, Exodus</p><p>Silllk, 70 pally, Exodus</p><p>Lifesong, 70 ranger, Exodus </p>

[Aeg]

its really bad for all classes with longer casting times. classes with all CAs and no resists have a huge advantage as they cannot be interupted. and scouts and interupt the hell out of anyone with spells with the new system.