Next exp pack, level cap and raiding.

[Norrsken]

With a new expansion in the planning, there are a few things that seem to concern a lot of people. One being level cap increase, ruin of endlessly grinded raid gear and all that. Other being, lack of level cap increase ending up lacking new progression for characters. And then there is that tidbit about raids getting scarce if the cap increases (TBH, an exp pack with as many raid zones as 2 put together? Nah.. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ) So, I had an idea (I dont raid much myself, so its just an idea) Why not make raid zones scale up, but not go down below certain lvls. So the t5 raids will start scaling up after lvl 50, t6 after 60, t7 after 70. The result would be a lot of fun raids available to do, lessening the repetetive grind of it all. As it is now, a bunch of cool raid zones just sit there vacant in t5, because, what would be the point of doing them really? Of course, each tier would need their own set of raid loot, so you dont gate t5 loot for doing a t5 raid at lvl 70. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And with 3-4 new raid zones for each expansion, EQ2 would eventually end up with the most raids at engame any game has. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Well, feel free to shot it down, beat it up and burn it in mad flames.

[MirageE]

<p>As a raider (non-hardcore) and a casual player for my alts, etc., I've contemplated the same, and while I agree we need some more raid content instances...plus some more contested in particular.... if everything scales up from level 50+ or whatever raiding will probably be overdone in my opinion.... next thing you know <u>everyone</u> will also be running around in fabled gear and while the casual players won't mind this the hardcore folks will.  </p><p>By scaling up the zones all this does is add content.... and it doesn't update the progression that some raiders (including myself) want.  If they updated some of those mobs and zones to now be included in a progression, it would work short-term, but last thing I want is to be going back and killing Rognog again because his loot is more uber than that in Inner Sanctum or the Avatars or something.</p><p>Personally after reading people's opinions on this for months and months I rather just see what a poster wrote the other day in one of the threads that was perfect IMO (I would link but dont feel like looking for it, but kudos to him/her).  They wrote something like the first couple of lines below....</p><ul><li>Add an new continent like Kunark and put <u>lots</u> of lvl 1-25 content in it.... this forces players to take advantage of the already existing zones for further character progression and gives the altaholics something to play with</li><li>Also on that new continent add lots of level 60+ content (they may have written lvl 50+ but you get my drift), including: </li><li>a new EPIC questline in traditional fashion</li><li>3 or 4 new raid instances similar to what was released in EOF that include a progression scale making these mobs tougher than the EOF ones (for example you will need EOF fabled gear to fight these and Avatar fabled gear to make it easier)</li><li>A couple (like 4 or 5) more contested mobs including some more avatars</li><li>Add 3 or 4 new instances for new legendary gear for the smaller raiders and casual players to strive for new armor, weapons, etc. similar to the new set armor.</li></ul><p>Balance is the key.... and the last expansion overall was nicely done... a few quirks like not enough contested (ex Avatars), no epic storyline complete, etc.... but I think SOE is doing a good job overall and thats a good thing.</p>

[Norrsken]

<cite>MirageEIG wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>As a raider (non-hardcore) and a casual player for my alts, etc., I've contemplated the same, and while I agree we need some more raid content instances...plus some more contested in particular.... if everything scales up from level 50+ or whatever raiding will probably be overdone in my opinion.... next thing you know <u>everyone</u> will also be running around in fabled gear and while the casual players won't mind this the hardcore folks will.  </p><p>By scaling up the zones all this does is add content.... and it doesn't update the progression that some raiders (including myself) want.  If they updated some of those mobs and zones to now be included in a progression, it would work short-term, but last thing I want is to be going back and killing Rognog again because his loot is more uber than that in Inner Sanctum or the Avatars or something.</p><p>Personally after reading people's opinions on this for months and months I rather just see what a poster wrote the other day in one of the threads that was perfect IMO (I would link but dont feel like looking for it, but kudos to him/her).  They wrote something like the first couple of lines below....</p><ul><li>Add an new continent like Kunark and put <u>lots</u> of lvl 1-25 content in it.... this forces players to take advantage of the already existing zones for further character progression and gives the altaholics something to play with</li><li>Also on that new continent add lots of level 60+ content (they may have written lvl 50+ but you get my drift), including: </li><li>a new EPIC questline in traditional fashion</li><li>3 or 4 new raid instances similar to what was released in EOF that include a progression scale making these mobs tougher than the EOF ones (for example you will need EOF fabled gear to fight these and Avatar fabled gear to make it easier)</li><li>A couple (like 4 or 5) more contested mobs including some more avatars</li><li>Add 3 or 4 new instances for new legendary gear for the smaller raiders and casual players to strive for new armor, weapons, etc. similar to the new set armor.</li></ul><p>Balance is the key.... and the last expansion overall was nicely done... a few quirks like not enough contested (ex Avatars), no epic storyline complete, etc.... but I think SOE is doing a good job overall and thats a good thing.</p></blockquote>They could make the latest released raids the hardest, thus simply adding mnore progression every round of exp packs. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And of course, keep the progression in by not adding loot that is better in t5 raids than t8 raids have. Would be a rather easy way to make raid progression transparent. Its simply the order of which the raids became available to you. t5 first, t6, 7 and 8 following in order. Each tier can of course have their internal pecking order as well. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> The uber raiding guilds would really be uber, and the newbies chipping away at lower progression raids would be awestruck at what the uber guild could pull off. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And well, its not too bad if some gear is tradeable, and sold on the broker, but it would prolly be like it is now, most of it being no-trade. And, I'd like some progression added to heroic dungeons as well. Make some easy crap ones, and then progressively harder fromt here up to dungeons where the very best geared raid dudes will have a tough time.

[possi002]

<p>Well as the game moves up maybe change riading as it is now for lower lv's.  Not 100% if a t5 needs 3 groups or 2 groups but if it needs 3 cut it down to 2 and if it needs 2 cut it down to 1. Make the mobs a little bit easyer.  Same goes for t6 raids just make the groups less meaning less people to do them start to turn them in to normal dungeons. So they become funner zone's for a group rather then trying to get 24 people to do a raid need 12-18.  Keep higher raids as they are now needing 4 groups till newer expansions come out and the player core gets weeded out. Kinda like dof right now was there yesterday counted 4 people in one hour in all of dof zone's even on teh player find listing.  </p><p>One other idea is to add to zone's.  Like rather then push out a new expansion with new zone's maybe add on to the zone's we have.  Like some of the dof zone's add new area's to the dungeons.  Like one area in kos that u could add on to is poa.  Keep the main area the same but open up some new door ways that lead to lv 70-90 mobs.  Same could be for dof have hte main area be 50-60 but then have area's that lead to 60-70 and 70-90.  Would bring back some of this zones that are dead now and keep players more together then weeding us out to the out skirts of new zone's.  Maybe add a few new dungeons in to current zone's.  </p>

[Rahatmattata]

Please don't nerf more epics into heroics/x2.

[quamdar]

imo the best thing to do if they plan on raising the level cap is just make an expansion the size of EoF and make it all for 65-80 since you are going to need a ton of places for people to level up to 80 anyway so making a 0-80 expansion wouldn't be a good idea in connjunction with a level cap increase.

[Hadanelith]

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote: <blockquote>With a new expansion in the planning, there are a few things that seem to concern a lot of people. One being level cap increase, ruin of endlessly grinded raid gear and all that. Other being, lack of level cap increase ending up lacking new progression for characters. And then there is that tidbit about raids getting scarce if the cap increases (TBH, an exp pack with as many raid zones as 2 put together? Nah.. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ) So, I had an idea (I dont raid much myself, so its just an idea) Why not make raid zones scale up, but not go down below certain lvls. So the t5 raids will start scaling up after lvl 50, t6 after 60, t7 after 70. The result would be a lot of fun raids available to do, lessening the repetetive grind of it all. As it is now, a bunch of cool raid zones just sit there vacant in t5, because, what would be the point of doing them really? Of course, each tier would need their own set of raid loot, so you dont gate t5 loot for doing a t5 raid at lvl 70. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And with 3-4 new raid zones for each expansion, EQ2 would eventually end up with the most raids at engame any game has. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Well, feel free to shot it down, beat it up and burn it in mad flames. </blockquote><p>Frankly, I think it'd be cool if (for example) T5 stuff would scale up to max out at level 65 or so, <u><i>but</i></u> <i>drop drop the same loot</i>.</p><p>Why? Not just because I'm crazy, though that's certainly a factor. The real reason, however, is so that I (and others) can farm lower-level tradable Fabled without having to find some random "noob" (relative term here) to mentor-down to for <i><b>EACH</b></i> group you want to bring into the raid.</p><p>And really, would anyone really mind having more tradable low-level Fabled for sale on the broker? Would it hurt the higher-end game at all? No, and no.</p><p>-Hadanelith Raswrolski / Mossda Odis'Ossda, Kithicor Server </p>

[rubels]

<p>For the guy that wanted to know if T5 required 2 groups or 3 etc... at level 70.</p><p>On bored days seriously this is what I do . T5 zones single group all 70's 1 , level 62 .. mentor . </p><p>I clear all t 5 in under 2 hours .... guess what still bored .... grab a few more peeps at max its x 2</p><p>and yup , go clear all t 6 only exception is Rtpp ... you should try it sometime keep lotto on and its </p><p>a fun run and yea , I consider them instant zones. Oh ps you can also do every single group zone t5</p><p>and t6 this way ... cuts down the time for all of those instants per tier to about a hour. Basicly make </p><p>sure the lvl 62 can self invis .... you can skip all grey mobs , mentor on named in and out of zone 10 mins tops.</p><p>- Krovax</p>

[dieschatten]

Das mit den neuen Zone das sie schwerer werden finde ich ja so nicht schlecht. Nur den Zusatz das sie leicht werden mit Avatar Ausrüstung finde ich total scheiße. Dann Sorgt bitte dafür das auch die Leute die sich nicht HArzt4 Spieler nenne in der Lage sind mal Avatare anzugehen. MAcht Instanzen aus ihnen oder sowas. Von der länge her wie Clockwork. Damit mal ein bißchen mehr loot ins Gam e kommt. Finde die Ausbeute bis jetzt lächerlic h.  Man macht alle 6 Tage Freethinker und 3 mal droppen die selben sachen die keine Sau im Raid braucht.   Ist ja schön das ihr euch Setitems ausdenkt und sie einbaut in das Spiel, aber sorgt dann auch bitte dafür das man nach über 5 Monaten Raiden auch mal ein paar Items hat. Ich bin Zauberer und habe noch nicht 1 mal ein Zauberer Item in irgenteinem unserer Raids gesehen. Wenn ihr alle Avatare in Instanzen umwandelt mit 6 Tage Timer haben alle Leute mehr von ihnen und sehen auch mal die Mobs die ihr baut. Viele der Contestet werden sowieso immer nur von den selben Gilden gefarmt und kleiner Gilden haben nie eine Chance auf diesen Contest. my english is not very good so i write in german. maybe somebody can translate ist or use a tool <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> hf

[theriatis]

<p>@DieSchatten</p><p>You got Treffer für XXXXX Übersetzungsbedingteren Damage <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Hm, i could use Bablefish to translate, heck, it's what EQ2 does to translate english to german, so why not use it vice versa.</p><p>SCNR,</p><p>Regards, theriatis.</p><p>I'll give it a try - remember, i just translate, it doesn't mean i share or share not that Opinion.</p><p>"It's ok that the new Zones are harder than the old one. But the Addition that they will become easy with Avatar Gear is Bull*. If so, then please have a look that people with a Real Life can also beat them (Comment from my side: Fixing the Lags would suffice). Use Instances for the Avatars, in Length like the clockwork. So that a little more Loot enters the game. I find the yield is pathetic. You do all 6 days Freethinkers and all you get is the same Item, dropping 3 times in the whole Raid, which no one ever needs. It's nice that you thought of the Idea of Setitems and have integrated them in the Game, but then try to set it, that the players can really get them (comment from my side: Yeah, i also said something, like trying to parse the Raid for classes and give Setitems for classes which are in the Raid a small higher chance to drop - which got me flamed from all the hardcores who thought that i want loot on a silver platter :-/ ) I am a Wizard and i've never seen any single Wizard Setitem in the whole Time we raid. (Comment: Me too). If you get every Avatar in an Instance, more people will actually see them and will have a chance to beat them. Most Contested will be beaten over and over again from the same guilds (Comment: Good for the hardcore Guilds (1% of the playerbase), bad for all the others)."</p><p>Ok, an additional comment from my side: Fixing the Lag would help get us to the encounters, even the contested. Most contested will be never beaten (and Instances, too) because of the Lag on German Servers. Sorry, 30s - 1m Lag is RIDICOLOUS.</p><p>Regards, theriatis.</p>