Raid healing... wow...

[Xiasi8]

<p>Just came back to the game after a long hiatus. I join a guild to raid with while I level up to 70 (currently 66). </p><p>Last night we hit a raid instance and pull a boss mob. A 70 Mystic and I are in the MT group and, after a long fight, we are victorious. The Mystic pulls up the heal parse and I am shocked...</p><p>Mystic - 73k healing Me - 22k healing </p><p>On one side it was nice to be second in the whole raid in healing at 66... but wow... how did the mystic triple my healing output? I did have the mob debuffed the entire fight so I would have expected those debuffs to add up.</p><p>A couple thoughts of what it could be:</p><p>- Her parser was not catching Stoneskin, Involuntary healing, Celestial, Glory - Her wards superceded my reactives so mine had minimal chances to heal - My level had something to do with it - I suck (this could always be the case <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Any thoughts?</p><p>Xiasi of Permafrost</p>

[Ironcleaver]

It is hard to believe prasers at times. I believe that wards "tick" on the raw damage before the damage even hits the character - reactives on the other hand, react to the character taking the damage then "ticking" for however the much the spell amount should me. I like to think of it this way. A tank is going to get hit for 1000 damage. A ward with absorb 1000 damage ((1000 point ward, just an example)) and the tank is fine. If there is no ward, the damage then goes through the tank's armor mitigation, lowering the damage, say, to 300 - your reactive then "reacts" and ticks for (say) 450. If the tank takes this hit and started out unharmed, his health would drop by 300 then climb back up by 300. In the end the reactive healed the tank for 300 damage from a 1000 damage attack and the ward protected the tank for 1000 damage from a 1000 damage attack. This is a very simple way of looking at it, but it dose explain why the number are skewed so badly. Unlike damage, Heal prasing is sometimes very tricky to read. Of course i could be completely wrong, i know this is the way it use to be, a few versions of the game ago - but it still might possibly hold true.

[Kizee]

<cite>Xiasi8 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Just came back to the game after a long hiatus. I join a guild to raid with while I level up to 70 (currently 66). </p><p>Last night we hit a raid instance and pull a boss mob. A 70 Mystic and I are in the MT group and, after a long fight, we are victorious. The Mystic pulls up the heal parse and I am shocked...</p><p>Mystic - 73k healing Me - 22k healing </p><p>On one side it was nice to be second in the whole raid in healing at 66... but wow... how did the mystic triple my healing output? I did have the mob debuffed the entire fight so I would have expected those debuffs to add up.</p><p>A couple thoughts of what it could be:</p><p>- Her parser was not catching Stoneskin, Involuntary healing, Celestial, Glory - Her wards superceded my reactives so mine had minimal chances to heal - My level had something to do with it - I suck (this could always be the case <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Any thoughts?</p><p>Xiasi of Permafrost</p></blockquote><p>Get used to being second best if there are a couple shamans on the raid. <img src="/smilies/1069449046bcd664c21db15b1dfedaee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Parsers will pick up everything except stoneskin and reverance.</p><p>If a shaman can keep their wards refreshed (on mobs that don't hit the tank hard) then a templar has no chance to heal because the reactives wont trigger.</p><p>The words I hate the most on raids is "oberon barrier up" because I could be ahead in a parse by alot and that [I cannot control my vocabulary] spell will jump the mystic ahead every time.</p>

[Mabes]

<p>Several things:</p><p>1) The MT Shaman will almost always be first on parse, because the way heals work is wards are used up first, then reactives, then regens.  If the shaman's ward recast timer comes up and they recast their ward before the previous ward was fully used up, then the tank will not take damage, and your reactives will not fire off.  On harder fights where the wards are wearing off quickly, you will be much closer to the shaman in parsed heals.</p><p>2) Stoneskin is not included in parsers, because the damage it shows blocked is un-mitataged, and so appears like it is stopping way more than it really is.  All your other debuff/buff heals will be parsed and added in (in fights w/ aoe's, mark of celest. and invol. heal are awsome for your parse)</p><p>3) Yes, you're lvl has something to do with it, you'll heal for more at lvl 70</p><p>4) That was a pretty easy fight, considering the top two healers healed for less than 100k, so yes on easy fights shaman will own the heal parse</p>

[SenorPhrog]

Heal parsing is almost useless for anything other than cracking on ninja-afkers.  It doesn't count stoneskin or revereance as Kizee stated.  It also doesn't count mitigation debuffs, our recast AA ability, etc...  I've actually mocked people who bragged about outparsing me with heals.  It's nice to know your numbers so you can tell if you are getting better, but I wouldn't put stock in it.  If they stuck another healing class in that MT group you guys probably wouldn't have faired very well.

[Whitemane]

<cite>Xiasi8 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Just came back to the game after a long hiatus. I join a guild to raid with while I level up to 70 (currently 66). </p><p>Last night we hit a raid instance and pull a boss mob. A 70 Mystic and I are in the MT group and, after a long fight, we are victorious. The Mystic pulls up the heal parse and I am shocked...</p><p>Mystic - 73k healing Me - 22k healing </p><p>On one side it was nice to be second in the whole raid in healing at 66... but wow... how did the mystic triple my healing output? I did have the mob debuffed the entire fight so I would have expected those debuffs to add up.</p><p>A couple thoughts of what it could be:</p><p>- Her parser was not catching Stoneskin, Involuntary healing, Celestial, Glory - Her wards superceded my reactives so mine had minimal chances to heal - My level had something to do with it - I suck (this could always be the case <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Any thoughts?</p><p>Xiasi of Permafrost</p></blockquote><p>Well the prior posts sum it up pretty well but also keep in mind this that you are only 66v. a level 70. Thats a Huge gap healing wise as you do not have all your t7 heals yet as those come at lvl69-70 so you're at a disadvantage there, and two you WILL die at any and every AoE at level 66. That doesnt help much at all =). Also Stoneskin doesnt parse but the other 2 do if the parsee is close enough.  Reverance wont show up as you healing X either but it is sorta parsible as I think it shows up as the tank healing himself (I'll have to check again as its been awhile)</p><p> As for not "winning" the parse. If the tank lived you did ok <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>And as a templar you can easily top the parse. Simply put up involuntary and mark on every mob in the encounter. Coupled with your normal heals you should come out on top no problem. Before the change the MT Defiler and I used to battle for the #1-2 spots with me usually loosing by 1-2% depending on the zone. With just the change to involuntary I pretty much own the parses now but I havent done anything different. ( Another reason you shouldnt put too much faith in them ). </p>

[Gagla]

<cite>Whitemane wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Xiasi8 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Just came back to the game after a long hiatus. I join a guild to raid with while I level up to 70 (currently 66). </p><p>Last night we hit a raid instance and pull a boss mob. A 70 Mystic and I are in the MT group and, after a long fight, we are victorious. The Mystic pulls up the heal parse and I am shocked...</p><p>Mystic - 73k healing Me - 22k healing </p><p>On one side it was nice to be second in the whole raid in healing at 66... but wow... how did the mystic triple my healing output? I did have the mob debuffed the entire fight so I would have expected those debuffs to add up.</p><p>A couple thoughts of what it could be:</p><p>- Her parser was not catching Stoneskin, Involuntary healing, Celestial, Glory - Her wards superceded my reactives so mine had minimal chances to heal - My level had something to do with it - I suck (this could always be the case <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Any thoughts?</p><p>Xiasi of Permafrost</p></blockquote><p>Well the prior posts sum it up pretty well but also keep in mind this that you are only 66v. a level 70. Thats a Huge gap healing wise as you do not have all your t7 heals yet as those come at lvl69-70 so you're at a disadvantage there, and two you WILL die at any and every AoE at level 66. That doesnt help much at all =). Also Stoneskin doesnt parse but the other 2 do if the parsee is close enough.  Reverance wont show up as you healing X either but it is sorta parsible as I think it shows up as the tank healing himself (I'll have to check again as its been awhile)</p><p> As for not "winning" the parse. If the tank lived you did ok <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>And as a templar you can easily top the parse. Simply put up involuntary and mark on every mob in the encounter. Coupled with your normal heals you should come out on top no problem. Before the change the MT Defiler and I used to battle for the #1-2 spots with me usually loosing by 1-2% depending on the zone. With just the change to involuntary I pretty much own the parses now but I havent done anything different. ( Another reason you shouldnt put too much faith in them ). </p></blockquote>It's true. I typically top zonewide from the MT group, but there are pulls where I come in fifth. It depends on the difficulty of the pull and the relative skill of the people playing their classes. With a good shaman... difficult pulls can make Clerics and Druids look like gods and easy pulls can make it look like I might as well have sat out the raid. With a bad shaman... difficult pulls turn into near wipes and easy pulls favor the cleric.

[TheBu]

its intresting aboutthe comment that wards might be counting first and not allowing the reactives to trigger. Thats really does not sound good if the tank is say 10% health.. . the reactives could really be usefull... But yea.. .you missing two key lvls...   68 and 70 Your using old tier spells... go run a few instances and get to at least 68

[Eriol]

I'm not 100% sure, but I'm PRETTY sure that the above poster explaining how it works is only half-right.  I'm almost-certain that mitigation takes effect BEFORE the ward's amount is calculated.  I think it ORIGINALLY did not, but NOW it does.  But the part about the reactive not triggering until they take ACTUAL damage is I'm fairly sure correct. Yes, lots of hedging in that post, but I'm not 100% certain.

[Kendricke]

<cite>Eriol wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm not 100% sure, but I'm PRETTY sure that the above poster explaining how it works is only half-right.  I'm almost-certain that mitigation takes effect BEFORE the ward's amount is calculated.  I think it ORIGINALLY did not, but NOW it does.  But the part about the reactive not triggering until they take ACTUAL damage is I'm fairly sure correct. Yes, lots of hedging in that post, but I'm not 100% certain. </blockquote><p> Mitigation is calculated prior to wards taking damage.  This was changed in LU13 in September, 2005.  </p><p>Reactives will use a trigger on any hit taken, even if the ward absorbs all of it (in which case, reactive triggers but has nothing to heal).  If ward does not absorb full damage, reactive will trigger and heal (even through the ward).</p>

[Hopefulne]

<p>Strange i thought that reactives only used a tick when damage (not warded and is taken off the hp of the tank) was taken. As for topping parses. mark involuntary and glory are a must. Spot healing raid (but not grp) members is a good one. I tend to use word of reparation on spot healing my grp and save the direct ones for others. </p><p>One useful parse trick is to rez peeps when you can because the hp gain will count as well. That's 4 or 5k per rezz. If you can somehow manage to grp rez a downed grp that's almost 20k-odd.</p>

[EQPrime]

Hopefulness wrote: <blockquote><p>One useful parse trick is to rez peeps when you can because the hp gain will count as well. That's 4 or 5k per rezz. If you can somehow manage to grp rez a downed grp that's almost 20k-odd.</p></blockquote><p> I don't see the need to to try to inflate my healing numbers just to have the highest numbers on the parse.  I'm usually more concerned with keeping the MT alive.  To me, beating the encounter is a lot more important than having high HPS numbers.</p>

[Kizee]

Uguv@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote>Hopefulness wrote: <blockquote><p>One useful parse trick is to rez peeps when you can because the hp gain will count as well. That's 4 or 5k per rezz. If you can somehow manage to grp rez a downed grp that's almost 20k-odd.</p></blockquote><p> I don't see the need to to try to inflate my healing numbers just to have the highest numbers on the parse.  I'm usually more concerned with keeping the MT alive.  To me, beating the encounter is a lot more important than having high HPS numbers.</p></blockquote><p> Yeah, leave the rezes to the pali's and bards.</p><p>I am normally too busy trying to keep the MT up to worry about rezzes.</p>