MO made easier.

[CrazedMut]

<div></div><hr size="2" width="100%">- The Mutagenic Outcast and the Mutagenic Swarmers will now be part of the same encounter.<hr size="2" width="100%">We got this [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] to 21% yesterday but controlling all the non-linked adds was a serious PITA. Now they nerf it???? Bah! Should be a little easier from now on anyway.<div></div>

[Krontak]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> CrazedMutha wrote:<BR> <HR width="100%" SIZE=2> - The Mutagenic Outcast and the Mutagenic Swarmers will now be part of the same encounter.<BR> <HR width="100%" SIZE=2> <BR>We got this [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] to 21% yesterday but controlling all the non-linked adds was a serious PITA. Now they nerf it???? Bah! Should be a little easier from now on anyway.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I guess now you won't be allowed to have 50,000 adds spawn and not have to worry about them at the end if you wipe or not cause if you wipe now, you wont get a chest or something like that.  But yes, it will help do deal with the adds a bit more.

[CrazedMut]

True, I guess it depends how u good your DPS is for this encounter and how many adds you end up with <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.<div></div>

[ChaosUndivided]

People were exploiting it by using groups out of raid to kill the heroic adds, although this change may or may not make it easier it was probably needed to stop the exploiting. The guilds who did should be ashamed.

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>ChaosUndivided wrote:People were exploiting it by using groups out of raid to kill the heroic adds, although this change may or may not make it easier it was probably needed to stop the exploiting. The guilds who did should be ashamed.<hr></blockquote>I thought they fixed that already and made the adds lock onto the encounter engaged with MO, even if you can get your aes off in time, the adds still locked onto the main MO.But either way, this change does make the mob even easier.

[Woz]

Lol so now every ae I toss out hurts the adds too? Lol now this fight went from a joke to a yawn fest.

[EasternKing]

i belive this was changed to prevent guilds from completly ignoring his adds and just burning the MO down then wiping adds depop come back and loot the chest, imo its a good change you actually have to deal with ALL the adds now not just the ones that heal the MO.

[quetzaqotl]

<P>To the op if this change came into effect yesterday you wouldntve had even a chance on atempting it as we wouldve killed yesterday before you even arrived and thats  w/o a rogue.</P> <P>So yeah dont be disappointed <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:23 PM</span>

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>quetzaqotl wrote:<P>To the op if this change came into effect yesterday you wouldntve had even a chance on atempting it as we wouldve killed yesterday before you even arrived w/o a brig.</P><P>So yeah dont be disappointed <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P><hr></blockquote>Lol how does that make sense? Yesterday was just the MO you had to kill and get your chest. Now instead you have to kill the MO and all the adds that spawns.I think this makes the enounter easier because of encounter AE's hitting the spawned adds, but it makes getting the chest a little harder since they removed the initial adds and all you had to worry about was the MO. Too many guilds were just killing the MO encounter and dieing to the adds, at least this prevents that. Now they need to bring back the original adds as well.

[quetzaqotl]

<P>I know a certain guild killed MO but not the adds and no chest dropped yesterday so yeah.</P> <P>The chest dropping after mo was dead but the adds were still up got fixed earlier on.</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:27 PM</span>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>quetzaqotl wrote:I know a certain guild killed MO but not the adds and no chest dropped yesterday so yeah.<hr></blockquote>Those are the adds that were part of the encounter that they failed to kill. NOT the spawned adds. Now from this patch note, the spawned adds are part of the encounter, which is silly, but I guess well, no it's silly either way. They should have just left the adds that were part of the initial encounter, and if you were stupid enough to kill them, you didn't deserve a chest.

[quetzaqotl]

<P>Ah yeah could be I dont have too much experience with the MO as were competing with a korean guild (in a diff time zone they raid before server down)  and he always spawns during the morning on our server.</P> <P>But as the encounter got fixed i spose they couldnt kill the MO as yesterday evening we could really try again as in the 1st time in 3 months (yes mo keeps spawning in the mornings so we never had a chance on taking this mob on, dont know if its the same on other servers).</P> <P>We got him down way low without a rogue in guild so tonight hes bound to die with this change especially.</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:07 PM</span>

[Pins]

That's because MO has an easy to guess spawn time, and is based on when he dies. Which is what really needs to be fixed. He shouldn't be on the same spawn time every time, but on a more random spawn time like Hurricanas and The Princes.

[MeridianR]

Everfrost + Asian Guild = <span class="field_data_small">Arirang </span>....and not sure how they are doing now, but here is thinking if they had the force, MO won't be up for you to do tonight.<div></div>

[Aandien]

<DIV>You still cant just ae down the adds anyway since half of them are immune to spells -- unless you have a strong ae melee presence anyway.</DIV><p>Message Edited by AncientElster on <span class=date_text>08-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:06 AM</span>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>AncientElster wrote:You still cant just ae down the adds anyway since half of them are immune to spells -- unless you have a strong ae melee presence anyway.<hr></blockquote>This is completely false.

[quetzaqotl]

<P>Arirang has had 2 days the time on killing MO, they tried killing mo and running/yelling adds whatever same goes with their serverfirst princes kill zerging etc. we down [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] w/o cheap tactics, so please dont try to talk down me as Im in the top raiding guild on Everfrost which is Heroes Fate (moved over from grobb where we owned everything for quite some time).</P> <P>Weve had bad luck on the spawn time of the MO b/c it always spawns during the mornings weve killed all the same [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] as arirang did cept for this mob which is unkillable for them for the past few days we have only tried fighting the mo a few times so yes we learned more yesterday being in a small guild w/o a rogue has its downs but the people in our guild are hardcore and know their class very well.</P> <P>MO is going down tonight.</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:49 PM</span>

[MeridianR]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>quetzaqotl wrote:<div></div><div></div><p>Arirang has had 2 days the time on killing MO so please dont try to talk down me as Im in the top raiding guild on Everfrost which is Heroes Fate (moved over from grobb where we owned everything for quite some time).</p><p>Weve had bad luck on the spawn time of the MO b/c it always spawns during the mornings weve killed all the same [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] as arirang did cept for this mob which is unkillable for them for the past few days we have only tried fighting the mo a few times so yes we learned more yesterday being in a small guild w/o a rogue has its downs but the people in our guild are hardcore and know their class very well.</p><p>MO is going down tonight.</p><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class="date_text">08-16-2006</span><span class="time_text">08:47 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>Discovered By:Everfrost  -  -  - That is for Chel'draks' tooth, so sorry but I don't relate Top Raiding Guild and Everfrost in the same sentance.  Maybe Arirang have slipped since DoF (when they were a top 5 WW guild), but they are the closest thing to top end on that server.</div>

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>quetzaqotl wrote:<P>Heroes Fate (moved over from grobb where we owned everything for quite some time).</P><hr></blockquote>Um....you mean you killed some stuff after Malice quit?

[quetzaqotl]

<P>Im not into this whole measuring up private parts, arirang/heroes fate are at least at the same lvl as you know a lot of your succes is in balancing the right classes we lack a few away from perfection but yes chel drak  he will die in the near future.</P> <P>We have had our problems building up again after some people had to go b/c of rl etc. we arent a monster guild we are a small guild with the best people  we down [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] and have fun at the same time no need for ww firsts most people in our guild also have a social life/job but yeah when we come together [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] dies and we have a good time at the same time.</P> <P>Ive been in the guild that cured the plague ww first back in the day while it was a good time i enjoy this guild much better good individuals and we acomplish the same things maybe not ww first but well get it.</P> <P>Indeed malice reigned supreme for quite some time noone questions that (tho liw came close quite some times) if there was an exploit to figure out theyd find out first, never liked the people in malice some where ok most were 15 yo [Removed for Content] (when malice poofed my ignore list was almost empty) just like on these boards i spose hiding behind their characters.</P> <P>Ill leave it at that.</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:09 PM</span>

[Xede]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> MeridianR wrote:<BR>Everfrost + Asian Guild = <SPAN class=field_data_small>Arirang </SPAN>....and not sure how they are doing now, but here is thinking if they had the force, MO won't be up for you to do tonight.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>They didnt have the force and Hero's Fate killed it about a half hour ago. They yelled the adds that spawned and still got a chest.

[MeridianR]

<div><blockquote><hr>Patrix513 wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> MeridianR wrote:Everfrost + Asian Guild = <span class="field_data_small">Arirang </span>....and not sure how they are doing now, but here is thinking if they had the force, MO won't be up for you to do tonight. <div></div> <hr> </blockquote>They didnt have the force and Hero's Fate killed it about a half hour ago. They yelled the adds that spawned and still got a chest.<hr></blockquote>Yelled the adds, lame <span>:smileyindifferent:</span></div>

[LexxerCoV]

Yelled the adds after MO was dead. Chest was there...not sure what point would be to kill 20 trash mobs?

[ChaosUndivided]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quetzaqotl wrote:<BR> <P>Im not into this whole measuring up private parts, arirang/heroes fate are at least at the same lvl as you know a lot of your succes is in balancing the right classes we lack a few away from perfection but yes chel drak  he will die in the near future.</P> <P>We have had our problems building up again after some people had to go b/c of rl etc. we arent a monster guild we are a small guild with the best people  we down [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] and have fun at the same time no need for ww firsts most people in our guild also have a social life/job but yeah when we come together [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] dies and we have a good time at the same time.</P> <P>Ive been in the guild that cured the plague ww first back in the day while it was a good time i enjoy this guild much better good individuals and we acomplish the same things maybe not ww first but well get it.</P> <P>Indeed malice reigned supreme for quite some time noone questions that (tho liw came close quite some times) if there was an exploit to figure out theyd find out first, never liked the people in malice some where ok most were 15 yo [Removed for Content] (when malice poofed my ignore list was almost empty) just like on these boards i spose hiding behind their characters.</P> <P>Ill leave it at that.</P> <P>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <SPAN class=date_text>08-16-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:09 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Come now ath I know you <3'd me.</DIV>

[vortfu]

Since quetzaqotl forgot to mention in his last post that they dont have a rouge in their guild, I thought it would be best to reiterate it here in case somebody truely does care.vortfu

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>LexxerCoV wrote:Yelled the adds after MO was dead. Chest was there...not sure what point would be to kill 20 trash mobs?<hr></blockquote>Because they are part of the encounter. If SOE could do it, those adds would be linked to the MO and if you didnt kill them, no chest for you. Verdict says: Pathetic kill.

[Xede]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LexxerCoV wrote:<BR> Yelled the adds after MO was dead. Chest was there...not sure what point would be to kill 20 trash mobs?<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>/shrug we killed all the adds that spawned when we killed him last night. But you guys were half dead when you killed MO so obviously couldnt kill the rest of the adds.</P>

[quetzaqotl]

<DIV>It was a good fight yesterday we got MO down quite cleanly there were some adds up yes we mightve been able to clean em all but like lexx said there was no real need to maybe it wouldve looked flashier if they were linked to the encounter we wouldve killed em Im sure.</DIV> <DIV>We didnt play that long with the MO before we killed em so we did good next time and the time after that itll be more smooth.</DIV> <DIV>I dont know why people are so interested in bashing us but its Im not interested in that.</DIV> <DIV>So I apoligize to my guild for putting us in this spot, Im not interested in adding more to it really.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh btw khalan no I didnt have any problem with you so no worries <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> had more of a problem with the little people as it were <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:13 PM</span>

[Xede]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quetzaqotl wrote:<BR> <DIV>It was a good fight yesterday we got MO down quite cleanly there were some adds up yes we mightve been able to clean em all but like lexx said there was no real need to maybe it wouldve looked flashier if they were linked to the encounter we wouldve killed em Im sure.</DIV> <DIV>We didnt play that long with the MO before we killed em so we did good next time and the time after that itll be more smooth.</DIV> <DIV>I dont know why people are so interested in bashing us but its Im not interested in that.</DIV> <DIV>So I apoligize to my guild for putting us in this spot, Im not interested in adding more to it really.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh btw khalan no I didnt have any problem with you so no worries <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> had more of a problem with the little people as it were <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <P>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <SPAN class=date_text>08-17-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>04:13 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>oh so about an 1hr+ isnt much time? i know i was standing there for at least that long....DD maybe had 3 or 4 pulls in that time as well...but cleanly is far from it....you guys wiped about 10 times...maybe not 10 but close to it. Not trying to flame you but get the facts straight...i was there the entire time you guys were killing him.</P> <P>oh and btw the whole Arirang zerging the princes...i've watched numerous kills they had on them and by no means do they zerg it.</P>

[Deicide`]

<DIV>You know for a contested that has been monopolized on the server in question due to spawn times or other variables, I think the guilds that finally had a chance to try him did a good job. All the 3 or so guilds attempting made some good attempts, and I would hardly call killing him pathetic when one of these guilds did it. These people haven't had much chance to try him out. If I recall correctly there was only about 2 people dead that I saw when MO dropped his chest. And I do have to agree, what would be the point of killing 15 trash adds when there is a chest right there /shrug.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It just dissapoints me that people have to get their jollies from downplaying others achievements... that is what is truly pathetic here. Kudos to Arirang for job well done keeping him down, and kudos to the guilds who were out there and finally getting a chance to mess with MO. No kudos to the ones who were in no way a part of this posting the hate.</DIV>

[Kyriel]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Deicide` wrote:<BR> <DIV>You know for a contested that has been monopolized on the server in question due to spawn times or other variables, I think the guilds that finally had a chance to try him did a good job. All the 3 or so guilds attempting made some good attempts, and I would hardly call killing him pathetic when one of these guilds did it. These people haven't had much chance to try him out. If I recall correctly there was only about 2 people dead that I saw when MO dropped his chest. And I do have to agree, what would be the point of killing 15 trash adds when there is a chest right there /shrug.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It just dissapoints me that people have to get their jollies from downplaying others achievements... that is what is truly pathetic here. Kudos to Arirang for job well done keeping him down, and kudos to the guilds who were out there and finally getting a chance to mess with MO. No kudos to the ones who were in no way a part of this posting the hate.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Very well said. Thank you. </P> <P>For video tapes of our many failed attemps before the final slaughtering, giving deaths door a few times to pull, the final death of MO, showing the metal chest, with adds still up, abi fighting the adds while the rest of his raid left him to die >< , (yes, see... abi and a few others stood there to kill the adds but the rest of us were skerred =/) and looting of the beautiful chest, please send a 5pp check/money order to :</P> <P>Kyriel Doku</P> <P>123 Wood Elf Lane</P> <P>Willow Wood, Qeynos 98765</P> <P>Thankies <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P>

[Woz]

It dissapoints me that people can yell off mobs that should be tied to the encounter and pretend like oh we killed it 100% legit.

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Deicide` wrote:<BR> <DIV>And I do have to agree, what would be the point of killing 15 trash adds when there is a chest right there /shrug.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It just dissapoints me that people have to get their jollies from downplaying others achievements... that is what is truly pathetic here. Kudos to Arirang for job well done keeping him down, and kudos to the guilds who were out there and finally getting a chance to mess with MO. No kudos to the ones who were in no way a part of this posting the hate. <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Killing the adds is doing the encounter correctly.  Obviously SOE needs to tweak it some more so guilds like these, who yell/wipe to the adds receive no loot.</P> <P>Survey says... WEAKSAUCE, #1 answer.<BR></P>

[Ratty31]

Once I see a chest I'm officially done with the encounter, if they make it so the adds have to be killed for a chest I'll kill em. Untill then who gives a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] about adds.

[Gyilok]

<P>the patch notes are bs as it seems atm, the only change is that not even the initial adds are linked to MO anymore</P> <P>edit: also noticed the adds that used to be up before pull, now spawn on pull with the little "no-loot for yoo!" icon, so they cant be linked at all</P><p>Message Edited by Gyilok on <span class=date_text>08-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:25 AM</span>

[Deicide`]

<DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Deicide` wrote:<BR> <DIV>And I do have to agree, what would be the point of killing 15 trash adds when there is a chest right there /shrug.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It just dissapoints me that people have to get their jollies from downplaying others achievements... that is what is truly pathetic here. Kudos to Arirang for job well done keeping him down, and kudos to the guilds who were out there and finally getting a chance to mess with MO. No kudos to the ones who were in no way a part of this posting the hate. <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Killing the adds is doing the encounter correctly.  Obviously SOE needs to tweak it some more so guilds like these, who yell/wipe to the adds receive no loot.</P> <P>Survey says... WEAKSAUCE, #1 answer.<BR></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>This is exactly what I am talking about in my post. Lol what is with you folks? Why does Dissolution even care about this anyway, because he was harder when they defeated him?... Well come on now guys that happens.. look at deathtoll access for one of many many examples of this.</BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>

[Woz]

They probably care because its sad to see EVERYTHING in this game made easier and easier.

[FuRiouSQ]

<blockquote><hr>Wozza wrote:They probably care because its sad to see EVERYTHING in this game made easier and easier.<hr></blockquote>Dont worry Vanguard is coming soon <span>:smileyhappy:</span>. But yet it is going to be with sony so who knows, may start out hard but like EQ get easier and easier /shrug. <div></div>

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> Deicide` wrote: <P>Well come on now guys that happens.. look at deathtoll access for one of many many examples of this.</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Making an instance <EM>quest</EM> require contested raid dropping loot mobs was silly in my opinion.  So I don't care that it was changed.</P> <P>Killing a named mob but none of the millions of adds it spawns, and then WIPING but still getting rewarded isn't even close to the same.<BR></P><p>Message Edited by Gaige on <span class=date_text>08-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:41 PM</span>

[Ratty31]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> Deicide` wrote: <P>Well come on now guys that happens.. look at deathtoll access for one of many many examples of this.</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Making an instance <EM>quest</EM> require raid dropping loot mobs was silly in my opinion.  So I don't care that it was changed.</P> <P>Killing a named mob but none of the millions of adds it spawns, and then WIPING but still getting rewarded isn't even close to the same.<BR></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>What if instead of wipeing you run to the wall?

[Krontak]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <P>What if your guild isn't efficient enough at the beginning to kill the encounter and kill all the adds, then slowely work on killing them as you become a more efficient fighting force.  Is that [Removed for Content]?  Not everyone can defeat the MO right off the bat can they?  I'm sure even some of you couldn't kill the MO and ALL the adds right away. </P> <P>What if they unintentially die to the adds, do they deserve the reward if they tried?  If they get too many adds and think they wont be able to kill them all while fighting the MO should they yell the MO and run even though they would get a chest?  Would that be the honorable thing to do?</P> <P>Maybe, just maybe, the adds were introduced to be more of a nuiscance rather than all be defeated.  Who knows.  I don't think any of us do.  Unless you got specific intructions that adds are to be killed or the encounter is void then and only then would the encounter be cheated.  Until then, I see the adds as only a nuiscance to be dealt with until the real trophy, MO, is defeated.  Anyways, I'm off the boards,  I mean work now.  See everyone in the morning!</P> <P> </P></BLOCKQUOTE><p>Message Edited by Krontak on <span class=date_text>08-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:40 PM</span>

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> Krontak wrote: <P>What if they unintentially die to the adds, do they deserve the reward if they tried? </P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>SOE rewards people for trying now?  Where are all our chests from the Matron then.  Please send them to our ingame mailboxes!

[FuRiouSQ]

Round and Round we go eh? What to say about all the times everyone wiped on first pull on Tarinax making the ***ADDS*** non popable? Fact of the matter is everyone done something that wasnt ment to be done (relic lockout farming before lockouts were put in, pulling harla out of her room, killing princes about 10 times within 1 week,,,,,,) i could go on but im sure you all get the point. So take a look back at what you have done before downing others for what they have done.  Like the fisherman said "job is done when named is dead and metal is waiting".. Weaksauce 101 anyone? Anyways stop the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing, my dady can kick your dadys [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn].. grats HF on getting your kill <span>:smileyhappy:</span>.. <div></div>

[LexxerCoV]

<P>Lets get the facts straight here as Xede seems to like to toss around misinformation.</P> <P>1. When MO died 98% of our raid was alive and in good health (think we maybe had 2 dead).</P> <P>2. We had a total of 3 add spawns before he died, which was about 18 mobs, give or take a few that may have died to AE's.</P> <P>3. When MO died, he dropped a chest. We saw chest, decided not to kill remaining trash and ran to wall. At no time did we "wipe". In fact, our MT tanked most of those adds for a good minute or so afterwards.</P> <P>4. We could have killed em all, but I still dont see the point. Chest was there, MO was dead. That to me says, encounter over. If they change encounter to where you have to kill adds, then we will do that. Right now you dont.</P> <P>Working as intended or not...no idea. Only SOE knows.</P>

[Gaige]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>FuRiouSQ wrote:<BR>Round and Round we go eh?<BR><BR>What to say about all the times everyone wiped on first pull on Tarinax making the ***ADDS*** non popable?  <FONT color=#ffff00>The encounter was broken and fixed.  I thought in my first post I said SOE needs to fix the MO so you don't get loot unless you kill the adds.  Did you not read that?</FONT></P> <P>Fact of the matter is everyone done something that wasnt ment to be done</P> <P>(relic lockout farming before lockouts were put in <FONT color=#ffff00>You can't exploit a failure lockout if there isn't one.  My main problem with relic farming is that the trash is too easy to reward fabled, anyway.</FONT></P> <P>pulling harla out of her room  <FONT color=#ffff00>Never did this and never saw the point.</FONT></P> <P>killing princes about 10 times within 1 week  <FONT color=#ffff00>The respawn timer was broken, they were killed legitly everytime and it was petitioned and condoned.</FONT>)</P> <P>i could go on but im sure you all get the point. So take a look back at what you have done before downing others for what they have done.  Like the fisherman said "job is done when named is dead and metal is waiting"..  <FONT color=#ffff00>Which is why I've said SOE needs to fix the MO to make sure the metal chest doesn't drop until all of his adds are dead and the encounter is fully beaten.</FONT><BR><BR>Weaksauce 101 anyone?  <FONT color=#ffff00>No thanks.</FONT><BR><BR>Anyways stop the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing, my dady can kick your dadys [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]..  <FONT color=#ffff00>You didn't even spell daddy right.</FONT><BR><BR>grats HF on getting your kill <SPAN>:smileyhappy:</SPAN>..  <FONT color=#ffff00>Gratz HF on killing part of an epic encounter and getting rewarded fully.</FONT><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR></DIV>

[Kyriel]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> FuRiouSQ wrote:<BR> Like the fisherman said <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>lol :smileywink:

[Ratty31]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LexxerCoV wrote:<BR> <P>Lets get the facts straight here as Xede seems to like to toss around misinformation.</P> <P>1. When MO died 98% of our raid was alive and in good health (think we maybe had 2 dead).</P> <P>2. We had a total of 3 add spawns before he died, which was about 18 mobs, give or take a few that may have died to AE's.</P> <P>3. When MO died, he dropped a chest. We saw chest, decided not to kill remaining trash and ran to wall. At no time did we "wipe". In fact, our MT tanked most of those adds for a good minute or so afterwards.</P> <P>4. We could have killed em all, but I still dont see the point. Chest was there, MO was dead. That to me says, encounter over. If they change encounter to where you have to kill adds, then we will do that. Right now you dont.</P> <P>Working as intended or not...no idea. Only SOE knows.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Sounds like a clean kill to me, gratz and don't feel like you need to defend what you did because honestly noone cares about the adds. The adds are there to make the fight difficult when MO is alive. If sony wants to link them to the encounter and require them to die for a chest drop then do it. Untill then [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] those [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing adds.

[Woz]

I would expect this encounter to undergo more changes. I think regarldess of what you feel about killing the adds, we all know that they are intended to be part of the encounter and dealt with (ie killed) during the course of the fight.

[FuRiouSQ]

LOL Gaige i didnt point to any names now did i? I was just bring up old bugs that where taken advantage of by im sure every guild that could. So why down a guild for killing a mob and getting the chest but yelling/running/wiping the adds off? SOE did this not them so blame SOE, chest droped - job is done - do as you wish with whats remaining. Now untill SOE fixes these broken encoutners then they are working as intended and once that metal drops its over, so no need on downing anyone but SOE. Grats again HF for getting your kill, and Grats SOE for making it so the adds can be yelled off <span>:smileysurprised:</span>.. <div></div>

[FuRiouSQ]

Oh "The Fisher man" = Koenig <span>:smileyhappy:</span> Nice sig. <div></div>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>Wozza wrote:I would expect this encounter to undergo more changes. I think regarldess of what you feel about killing the adds, we all know that they are intended to be part of the encounter and dealt with (ie killed) during the course of the fight.<hr></blockquote>You know, I've been thinking about this. I think before it got changed(due to the exploit) it was supposed to work like that, and it somewhat did. Then, of course, somebody exploited it a bit too much(won't name any names, but we all know which 2 guilds did), and well we have what we have now because of the change.

[Kyriel]

<DIV>he will always spawn again anyway. </DIV>

[Ratty31]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Wozza wrote:<BR>I would expect this encounter to undergo more changes. I think regarldess of what you feel about killing the adds, we all know that they are intended to be part of the encounter and dealt with (ie killed) during the course of the fight.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Untill then don't give people [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] for not killing worthless adds that have no loot and are a waste of time.

[Maweg]

Yawn, we need more threads where members of a certain guild tell us how do do encounters right and then are corrected by a red name guy.

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>Ratty31 wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Wozza wrote:<BR>I would expect this encounter to undergo more changes. I think regarldess of what you feel about killing the adds, we all know that they are intended to be part of the encounter and dealt with (ie killed) during the course of the fight.<BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Untill then don't give people [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] for not killing worthless adds that have no loot and are a waste of time.<hr></blockquote>But if/when they are changed, that would mean their way of doing it was incorrect.

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>Mawegda wrote:Yawn, we need more threads where members of a certain guild tell us how do do encounters right and then are corrected by a red name guy.<hr></blockquote>Yup, it is impossible to have an arguement/discussion about a raid topic before the noob patrol comes in.

[angelkain]

What about that mysterious first set of adds?  I think if soe connected the adds to the mob appropriately they wouldnt have been able to avoid the first wave completely x_x; not a dis, it's "pls fix soe"~  Seems to have made the kill so much easier.

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>angelkain wrote:What about that mysterious first set of adds?  I think if soe connected the adds to the mob appropriately they wouldnt have been able to avoid the first wave completely x_x; not a dis, it's "pls fix soe"~  Seems to have made the kill so much easier.<hr></blockquote>They did have them connected to MO at first, then some guild sucked it up and couldn't kill them after they killed MO and got wiped. Then some even [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]tier guild came in and killed the 1 add they had left up because the first guild got unlucky/wiped to all the adds.

[Dogm]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <P> <FONT color=#ffff00>The encounter was broken and fixed.  I thought in my first post I said SOE needs to fix the MO so you don't get loot unless you kill the adds.  Did you not read that?</FONT></P> <P>...</P> <P> <FONT color=#ffff00>Which is why I've said SOE needs to fix the MO to make sure the metal chest doesn't drop until all of his adds are dead and the encounter is fully beaten.</FONT><BR><BR>...</P> <P> <FONT color=#ffff00>Gratz HF on killing part of an epic encounter and getting rewarded fully.</FONT><BR></P></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>You never had to kill Krathuk's adds to get his chest.  You could burn Vox and get the chest before her adds died.   MoTM dropped your chest before you killed the spawned adds.  King Zalak dropped a chest before you killed the spawned adds.  King Drayek dropped a chest before you killed the spawned adds.  The new "guild" raids , that are there to train people how to raid, will drop a chest if you kill the named before the adds die (and yes the point of the zone is to teach add management, which doesnt always mean kill them).   </P> <P> </P> <P>The whole point of the adds in MO is to figure out how to control them, which does not have to be done by killing them. </P>

[Leawyn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Dogmae wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <P> <FONT color=#ffff00>The encounter was broken and fixed.  I thought in my first post I said SOE needs to fix the MO so you don't get loot unless you kill the adds.  Did you not read that?</FONT></P> <P>...</P> <P> <FONT color=#ffff00>Which is why I've said SOE needs to fix the MO to make sure the metal chest doesn't drop until all of his adds are dead and the encounter is fully beaten.</FONT><BR><BR>...</P> <P> <FONT color=#ffff00>Gratz HF on killing part of an epic encounter and getting rewarded fully.</FONT><BR></P></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>You never had to kill Krathuk's adds to get his chest.  You could burn Vox and get the chest before her adds died.   MoTM dropped your chest before you killed the spawned adds.  King Zalak dropped a chest before you killed the spawned adds.  King Drayek dropped a chest before you killed the spawned adds.  The new "guild" raids , that are there to train people how to raid, will drop a chest if you kill the named before the adds die (and yes the point of the zone is to teach add management, which doesnt always mean kill them).   </P> <P> </P> <P>The whole point of the adds in MO is to figure out how to control them, which does not have to be done by killing them. </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Good examples, except I've never been in a raid that DIDN'T kill the adds in all these encounters before looting the chest. It may not be an exploit, but it certainly is [Removed for Content] to not kill them and wait for them to despawn.

[Dogm]

<DIV>Yes, it isn't hard to kill them (and we always did / do) .  The point is just that the adds are something additional for you to figure out how to deal with, and not part of the encounter, so they don't have to be killed in order to get your rewards.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Dogmae on <span class=date_text>08-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:13 PM</span>

[Wabit]

<DIV>MO is definatly nerfed...  when the inital adds spawn and show as a broken encounter then its hard to justify saying that hitting the wall is wrong...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>we killed MO and all the adds tonight, the entire encounter felt felt alot easier...  might as well have been a crab raid with 4 groups instead of 2 and actully trying to dps...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>but ehh we didn't get a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ty robe and the same earing again for the 5th straigh kill...  we got a different ear and the leather hat and BP at least <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Unmask]

/cry <font size=-10>I hate furies</font>Yeah it was definitely odd when we pulled and the adds showed up as a broken encounter since no one yelled. It seems like there is a bug with the adds but I don't really think it's going to add much to the encounter when/if it's fixed.Definitely easier though.

[Riversideblues]

frankly there's not much you can do, kill it and if it isn't changed just go with it. calling the adds after mo is dead and you still got loot? why not, what's the difference if you whipe and come back, kill them, or call them and kill them, you still got your reward. just pretty much the old layout untill they fix it properly.<div></div>

[kw]

<DIV>I wonder why all ppl are concerned with the adds after MO?</DIV> <DIV>I think the bigger problem of MO is the 1st adds.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Many of u know u don't need to fight the 1st adds after patch.</DIV> <DIV>It make u can focus full dps on MO without  the 1st adds, and u can start at 60% of MO's hp with the 2nd adds.</DIV> <DIV>If the reason u don't mention about this is just because it is one of tactics, I think yelling after killing MO is also one of tactics.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anyway, MO is totally nerfed. and now he is the easiest mob in KOS, I think.</DIV> <DIV>1. You don't need to fight the 1st adds.</DIV> <DIV>2. All adds are same encounter now. Extremely easier for off tank to keep adds.</DIV> <DIV>3. You don't need to clear all adds because u can get chest after killing just MO.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think MO should be patched again.</DIV> <DIV>If not patched, it means SoE intend MO for the raid guilds who has middle power in their server.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by kwan on <SPAN class=date_text>08-18-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>01:29 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by kwan on <span class=date_text>08-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:33 AM</span>

[angelkain]

<DIV>complete agreeance...</DIV>

[LexxerCoV]

<DIV> <DIV>"Anyway, MO is totally nerfed. and now he is the easiest mob in KOS, I think."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why didnt you kill it then? It was up for 2 days on Everfrost. Hell you guys are so good should be able to 2 or 3 group it. :smileywink:</DIV></DIV>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>kwan wrote: <DIV>I wonder why all ppl are concerned with the adds after MO?</DIV> <DIV>I think the bigger problem of MO is the 1st adds.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Many of u know u don't need to fight the 1st adds after patch.</DIV> <DIV>It make u can focus full dps on MO without  the 1st adds, and u can start at 60% of MO's hp with the 2nd adds.</DIV> <DIV>If the reason u don't mention about this is just because it is one of tactics, I think yelling after killing MO is also one of tactics.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anyway, MO is totally nerfed. and now he is the easiest mob in KOS, I think.</DIV> <DIV>1. You don't need to fight the 1st adds.</DIV> <DIV>2. All adds are same encounter now. Extremely easier for off tank to keep adds.</DIV> <DIV>3. You don't need to clear all adds because u can get chest after killing just MO.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think MO should be patched again.</DIV> <DIV>If not patched, it means SoE intend MO for the raid guilds who has middle power in their server.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by kwan on <SPAN class=date_text>08-18-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>01:29 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by kwan on <span class=date_text>08-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:33 AM</span><hr></blockquote>Actually I did say it was lame, because some not-so-good guild died leaving 1 add up because they didn't kill them before MO, while some newb guild had to be a bunch of dickheads and kill the only add up. Of course, there are a lot more newb guilds out there that would kill his initial adds, yell, and run it off to the wall, then jump off it, and re-engage without the adds. So, something needed to be done, because newb guilds just couldn't kill it properly.

[Snarks]

while you're at it can you remove the robe from the loot table and replace it with another copy of the 30str30int ring, thankx<div></div>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>snarkteeth wrote:while you're at it can you remove the robe from the loot table and replace it with another copy of the 30str30int ring, thankx<div></div><hr></blockquote>Never! Skratch's rings > YOURS!

[Aandien]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>FuRiouSQ wrote:<BR>Round and Round we go eh?<BR><BR>What to say about all the times everyone wiped on first pull on Tarinax making the ***ADDS*** non popable?  <FONT color=#ffff00>The encounter was broken and fixed.  I thought in my first post I said SOE needs to fix the MO so you don't get loot unless you kill the adds.  Did you not read that?</FONT><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Tarinax was never broken on the first pull -- for all those guilds that intentionally walled Tarinax after the first pull -- you gimped the encounter intentionally  just as MO can be gimped now.<BR></P> <P>So don't go [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing at other guilds that [Removed for Content] MO today because they can -- because every single guild gimped tarinax previous to a few weeks ago because they could...</P> <P> </P>

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>AncientElster wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Gaige wrote:<BR><DIV><BR><BLOCKQUOTE><P></P><HR><P>FuRiouSQ wrote:<BR>Round and Round we go eh?<BR><BR>What to say about all the times everyone wiped on first pull on Tarinax making the ***ADDS*** non popable?  <FONT color=#ffff00>The encounter was broken and fixed.  I thought in my first post I said SOE needs to fix the MO so you don't get loot unless you kill the adds.  Did you not read that?</FONT><BR></P><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR></DIV><BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Tarinax was never broken on the first pull -- for all those guilds that intentionally walled Tarinax after the first pull -- you gimped the encounter intentionally  just as MO can be gimped now.<BR></P><P>So don't go [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing at other guilds that [Removed for Content] MO today because they can -- because every single guild gimped tarinax previous to a few weeks ago because they could...</P><P> </P><hr></blockquote>Well that statement couldnt be more wrong. Thanks for playing, please try again.

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> AncientElster wrote:<BR> <P>Tarinax was never broken on the first pull -- for all those guilds that intentionally walled Tarinax after the first pull -- you gimped the encounter intentionally  just as MO can be gimped now.<BR></P> <P>So don't go [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing at other guilds that [Removed for Content] MO today because they can -- because every single guild gimped tarinax previous to a few weeks ago because they could...</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>It was the same difference.  You could pet pull Tarinax in order to get the add, kill the add and let Tarinax reset and fight Tarinax with no adds.</P> <P>You could pet pull the MO which would leave the adds over there by themselves (the initial set) and you could burn the MO by himself until the adds started popping.</P> <P>Same thing.</P> <P>I was saying I hope MO is changed to make killing the adds a necessary part of the encounter, much like Tarinax was changed.<BR></P>

[Scort]

Tying the MO to the adds is lame. If they make it so you have to kill the adds that drop nothing because MO summoned them, and then you wipe and another guild runs in and kills the adds and gets the chest, well, that would be BS.Since the MO summons them, they should be more like swarm pets. They should basically be nothing more than dots. They should bug out when MO dies.<p>Message Edited by Scortch on <span class=date_text>08-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:42 PM</span>

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>Scortch wrote:Tying the MO to the adds is lame. If they make it so yu have to kill the adds that drop nothing because MO summoned them, and then you wipe and another guild runs in and kills the adds and gets the chest, well, that would be BS.Since the MO summons them, they should be more like swarm pets. They should basically be nothing more than dots. They should bug out when MO dies.<hr></blockquote>Why not put in the code so the encounter enters that "invincible" state should a raid force wipe?You know how like sometimes when a mob is resetting it tells you that you can not attack and it stands there non aggro? Have the MO encounter do that and the problem is solved.

[Snarks]

im confused, people were pulling MO so they could avoid 1 set of adds? hahahathis cant be the only thing they changed anyway, everyone after we killed mo a few days ago felt it was rediculously nerfed.Also, can someone clarify this update note. Do the adds that spawn now somehow "Add" themselves to the MO encounter? I didn't even know this was possible<div></div>

[Woz]

When you engage the MO, an encounter of ^^ adds spawn. These were the adds that were originaly tied to the MO, but now they just spawn when he is pulled as a seperate encounter. From then on the fight is as it has been. The only thing is you dont need to kill those adds now so you just burn the MO in a minute and loot your chest.The encounter is a joke now.

[Snarks]

oh, i thought there was some other change. anyways nearly all changes to this encounter were because of exploits tied to the adds so im not surprised they threw in the towel<div></div>

[Woz]

The towel comes in Test Update 27b.- The Mutagenic Outcast will no longer summon his minions.

[Aandien]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Wozza wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Well that statement couldnt be more wrong. Thanks for playing, please try again.</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Obviously you never tried to kill him cleanly on the first pull.  If you did, you would know he was never broken on the first pull.  Which is probably why it took the devs so long to fix it -- because they didn't discover it in beta, and once the players discovered it on live -- like any bug that swings in the favor of the players, it goes un-reported and un-escalated until you eventually get enough people seeing the bug (generally the less hard-core, competitive folks) and one of them reports it.</P> <P>Of course -- if one of these types of bugs are introduced *after* some extended period of time -- they are immediately escalated by all the hardcore players because the encounter is gimped.  Interesting irony eh?<BR></P>

[ChaosUndivided]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> AncientElster wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Wozza wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Well that statement couldnt be more wrong. Thanks for playing, please try again.</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Obviously you never tried to kill him cleanly on the first pull.  If you did, you would know he was never broken on the first pull.  Which is probably why it took the devs so long to fix it -- because they didn't discover it in beta, and once the players discovered it on live -- like any bug that swings in the favor of the players, it goes un-reported and un-escalated until you eventually get enough people seeing the bug (generally the less hard-core, competitive folks) and one of them reports it.</P> <P>Of course -- if one of these types of bugs are introduced *after* some extended period of time -- they are immediately escalated by all the hardcore players because the encounter is gimped.  Interesting irony eh?<BR></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Gimme a break, this bug was Documented, reported and posted on for MONTHS, everyone and their cousin knew about the bug, infact EVERY guild to have ever fought tarinax knew about the bug. It was in forums posts aplenty. </P> <P>The devs if they actually played the game and raided their own content would have know about the bug.</P> <P>But like everything SOE, fixes takes months and months to go in and are often neglected due to lack of resources.</P>

[Woz]

<blockquote><hr>AncientElster wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Wozza wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><BLOCKQUOTE><DIV><BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>Well that statement couldnt be more wrong. Thanks for playing, please try again.</P><HR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Obviously you never tried to kill him cleanly on the first pull.  If you did, you would know he was never broken on the first pull.  Which is probably why it took the devs so long to fix it -- because they didn't discover it in beta, and once the players discovered it on live -- like any bug that swings in the favor of the players, it goes un-reported and un-escalated until you eventually get enough people seeing the bug (generally the less hard-core, competitive folks) and one of them reports it.</P><P>Of course -- if one of these types of bugs are introduced *after* some extended period of time -- they are immediately escalated by all the hardcore players because the encounter is gimped.  Interesting irony eh?<BR></P><hr></blockquote>Again you couldnt be more wrong. Thanks for playing, please try again.And since you seemed to miss out on it the first time, I was refering to how you said every guild in the game purposefully walled/wiped to him on the first pull to avoid the adds. Believe it or not, some guilds are just good and dont look for cheap ways to avoid things.

[KrayzieK]

<DIV>We killed MO last night on our first pull ... I dunno, seems easier to me for some reason.  But anyways yeah once the chest drops grats move on, don't let people try to convince you otherwise.  For some reason people think they are the ones who regulate what is right and what is wrong, it's like a flash-light cop ... the guys who don't actually have a gun but they have that super uber cool 5-star badge and leet walky talky.</DIV>

[Woz]

Yeah by all means move on, just dont complain when the encounter gets changed around again to combat yelling the adds. And dont cry for weeks when someone laughs because you didnt do it the intended way.

[Unmask]

We killed him on the 1st pull maybe 15 minutes after he spawned. Normally I'd take some pride in that but really MO is now much easier than princes, easier than hurricanus and easier than a lot of the instanced encounters.

[Adrioni]

<DIV>Hahahahahahah [Removed for Content] can't believe you owned the encounter and got the chest legit and yelled the [Removed for Content] adds! No seriously though there is a big difference between Legit and Intended, MO has been killed 100 times so if it is not as intended than that about says what some people do with their time. I'd say maybe they should've done more Beta-Testing on this encounter but i'd rather see people cry that the mob is hader than cry about beta advantages.</DIV>

[HomeChicken]

<DIV>you said its easier than hurricanus... i didnt know it was possible for a mob to be easier than hurricanus :-</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[KrayzieK]

<DIV>Just remember that the update notes are official, alot of the stuff posted on here is just a flash-light cop with an imagination and wishful thinking.  If you got the chest, the guild status, and SOE hasn't taken it away due to questionable methods of killing it, then what is there to discuss?  Some flashlight guy thinks his method is more uber than yours?  Gimme a break.</DIV>

[Woz]

Also, another good thing to remember is, if your going to use laughable tactics, dont proclaim them publicly so everyone can make fun of you for being lame.

[KrayzieK]

<DIV>Wozza who exactly is everyone, or do you speak for the world yourself?</DIV>

[Leawyn]

<P> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> KrayzieKal wrote:<BR> <DIV> <DIV>We killed MO last night on our first pull ... I dunno, seems easier to me for some reason.  But anyways yeah once the chest drops grats move on, don't let people try to convince you otherwise.  For some reason people think they are the ones who regulate what is right and what is wrong, it's like a <STRONG><EM>flash-light cop</EM></STRONG> ... the guys who don't actually have a gun but they have that super uber cool 5-star badge and leet walky talky.</DIV></DIV><BR> <HR> <BR></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> KrayzieKal wrote:<BR> <DIV>Just remember that the update notes are official, alot of the stuff posted on here is just a <EM><STRONG>flash-light</STRONG> <STRONG>cop </STRONG></EM>with an imagination and wishful thinking.  If you got the chest, the guild status, and SOE hasn't taken it away due to questionable methods of killing it, then what is there to discuss?  Some <STRONG><EM>flashlight</EM></STRONG> guy thinks his method is more uber than yours?  Gimme a break.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You have some straaaaange obsession with flash-light cops.... New term you heard recently and now you're like uber cool cuz you can use it too?</P> <P>Sorry, but even if the chest drops, yelling/walling adds is [Removed for Content]. You can rationalize it all you want, but its [Removed for Content].</P>

[KrayzieK]

<DIV>That's funny that you are calling me obsessed for using the same phrase a whopping three times.  Nope, no wierd obsession here, just stating my opinion.  Anyways I'm not trying to rationalize anything, all I'm saying is once you get the chest, grats, move on.  If you don't like something, have a cry ... cry a river.  But just because you are drowning in your own tears don't expect someone to jump in and try to save you.  Some people state their opinion as if they are a player in a raiding guild, e pleribus unum, one of many.  Others feel as if their opinion is official, as if their one single opinion far out-weighs everybody elses.  No player can determine what is officially intended or not, that's SoE's job.  Seeing as this encounter has been changed like 4 times already one would expect that SoE would have it working properly by now ... and until they state otherwise, then this encounter is "working as intended."  Looting the fabled means you beat the encounter, grats, have a nice day.</DIV>

[Leawyn]

<P>I've never made it a secret that I'm not an "uber raider" ... I'm in a semi-casual raiding guild that is just now getting a force strong enough to do our own raids without the help of an alliance. I like where I am and in no way do I pretend to be in the same league with hard core raiders.</P> <P>But at the same time... saying yelling off adds is [Removed for Content] is NOT the same as saying its not intended. YOU don't know that its intended either, so quit pretending you do. It is [Removed for Content], its the lazy mans way of getting the chest. Yeah, the chest dropped, but instead of finishing the job, you run for a wall and wait for it to despawn. You are SO cool. Can I touch you, so that some of your coolness can rub off on me, pretty please?</P> <P>No, I can't say its intended to kill them, just like you can't say its intended not to, but I can say that if a mob spawns during an encounter, it needs to be "dealt with," either by mezzing (as in the Gnorbl fight) until they despawn because they are dumbfires, or killed if they are heroic mobs that do not despawn until the encounter is completed or broken. Breaking an encounter and running for a wall, to me, is not dealing with it.</P>

[Gaige]

If you weren't supposed to kill them they'd despawn when you kill the MO.

[KrayzieK]

<DIV>"Do you make them laugh?"  --- Yeah.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>"Do you get paid?"   --- Yeah.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>"Then tell Bill I said to have a coke and shut up."  --- Okay.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That's a quote from Eddie Murphy Raw when Ed tries explaining to Richard Pryor that Bill Cosby doesen't approve of his swearing method to incite laughter from his audience.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just because you don't like how someone does something doesen't make it wrong.</DIV>

[Dogm]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> If you weren't supposed to kill them they'd despawn when you kill the MO.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Vox's adds never despawn, MoTM adds never despawn etc. etc. etc.      So  If you where supposed to kill them then MO wouldn't drop a chest untill you kill them.

[Leawyn]

<blockquote><hr>Dogmae wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Gaige wrote: <div></div>If you weren't supposed to kill them they'd despawn when you kill the MO. <hr> </blockquote>Vox's adds never despawn, MoTM adds never despawn etc. etc. etc.      So  If you where supposed to kill them then MO wouldn't drop a chest untill you kill them.<hr></blockquote>I always killed the adds on Vox before looting... just made it easier to take pictures with the chest. I always killed the adds on MoTM... unless i wanted to watch a squishy die, that was always fun. If i were still in a raiding guild, I sure as hell would feel like we were doing something wrong if we didn't kill the adds on MO before looting too.<div></div>

[black_cap]

<blockquote><hr>Dogmae wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Gaige wrote: <div></div>If you weren't supposed to kill them they'd despawn when you kill the MO. <hr> </blockquote>Vox's adds never despawn, MoTM adds never despawn etc. etc. etc.      So  If you where supposed to kill them then MO wouldn't drop a chest untill you kill them.<hr></blockquote><div></div>Who said the encounter was working as intended?  Half the post here are just ideas of what should happen.  Yeah I think its pretty messed up on how they killed it, then come here and boast about it, then get hurt when they get flamed.  I hope someone at sony see's this and atleast fixes it back to what it was or atleast test the fix they put in before it goes live.  As of right now this encounter is a joke.

[Unmask]

Offtopic but referring to an earlier post of yours (I may be on the wrong thread). Since you're a coercer why did your raid alliance use the leash tactic on Alzid? I understand you don't like the tactic and don't use it now but that just sort of struck me as odd.Anyway back on topic, as other raiders have noted in the test update thread, epics are for loot. Once you get the loot what else is there? The chest drops when it drops and only SOE can control that. In MoTM we'd loot the chest while fighting the mobs and evac the raid to Everfrost to do Drayek. Or was that an exploit too (well maybe the same as using death as a cheap evac)? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Seriously though, I don't see why it's such a big deal since even if you wipe to the adds for some reason you can still waltz back and loot the chest. I'm all for making this encounter tougher, and in fact want this mob to be completely unnerfed. But I have to agree that once the chest is dropped the rest is a formality. You don't see the home team bat in the bottom of the ninth inning if they are already winning. The chest is the almighty symbol of victory. The game is over. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Leawyn]

Because just today I dinged level 67. I haven't been a high enough level to raid with this toon, and raided as my Paladin. <div></div>

[Unmask]

Ah ok that makes more sense. Thanks. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Woz]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> KrayzieKal wrote:<BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just because you don't like how someone does something doesen't make it wrong.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Just because you think it was right, doesnt make it so either.

[Riversideblues]

let's let soe decide how the encounter should run and just let kaledon keep making his guild look worse<div></div>

[KrayzieK]

I didn't say anything was right or wrong so don't put words in my mouth.  I said once you get the chest grats, move along.  It doesen't matter if it's Vox, MotM, Mutagenic Outcast, whatever.  Anyways we kill MO and all of the adds every single week ... I never said we didn't.

[Riversideblues]

<div><blockquote><hr>KrayzieKal wrote:<div></div>I didn't say anything was right or wrong so don't put words in my mouth.  I said once you get the chest grats, move along.  It doesen't matter if it's Vox, MotM, Mutagenic Outcast, whatever.  Anyways we kill MO and all of the adds every single week ... I never said we didn't.<hr></blockquote>well, you misunderstand, i was saying generally that we should just chill and let sony decide/fix what ever's up with mo. personally i like a harder mob so i'd rather have to kill the adds and not just kamakazi him.but the second part of my sentance was towards you, the thread calmed down till you showed up.</div>

[Anterra]

<DIV>Keep things civil please.  This is not the place for guild wars.  There's a whole nother game just for that.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[KrayzieK]

<DIV>All I said is when the chest drops grats, what's so un-calm about that?  Like someone else who just posted all that other stuff is a formality until SOE changes it get over it.</DIV>

[Woz]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> KrayzieKal wrote:<BR> <DIV>get over it.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Ever consider taking your own advice or is that a foreign concept?

[black_cap]

<div><blockquote><hr>Riversideblues wrote:<div>well, you misunderstand, i was saying generally that we should just chill and let sony decide/fix what ever's up with mo. personally i like a harder mob so i'd rather have to kill the adds and not just kamakazi him.</div><hr></blockquote>Agreed, hopefully a dev can take a look into this.  Make the first wave of adds lock onto raid regardless of position and have the last mob drop the chest.</div>

[MexStrat]

This is freaking insane.   "Let's let the developer's decide what is the intended way."    That is great.  We do that, every time they update the game.  I have to say, with that mentality, the way MO is currently makes all the uber guilds look like Horses [Removed for Content], since apperently killing the initial set of adds was never intended.They change the encounter.  You have new criteria to meet.  There is a new way to kill the encounter.   Possibly, they will change the encounter again.  There will be new criteria to meet. There will be a new way to kill the encounter.Just curious here.   to all the uber guilds that defeat MO and then clean up the adds.  Strictly hypothetical of course, 'cause your uberness drips from you like sweat.  Say, something disasterous happens, while you are fighting MO.  The untinkable occurs, you wipe to the pesky adds.  Do you petition a GM and ask them to remove the chest from the game and repop MO so you can kill it legit.  Or at the least let the chest rot, since you obviously didn't earn it.    Again just curious.  Gratz to all that kill this encounter,  If the made it easier or not.  It is still a difficult encounter.    <div></div>

[Scort]

The fact that an encounter is not being killed the intended way, in no way makes it wrong to do it by the players. It just means that ...A. There are bugs in the encounter or the dev team missed something.B. You have hundreds of thousands of players and a lot of intelligent ones that are very good at figuring out ways of doing things the dev team never dreamt of, like combining certain spells or skills to kill something.Just because something isn't working as intended, doesn't necessarily make it wrong for the players to keep killing it. Just because you can use skill X and spell Y to make the encounter a lot easier, doesn't make it wrong.If the Dev team thinks something is wrong, then it's their job to fix it or remove the encounter till it is fixed (if it's bad enough like killing one add and it drops a master chest).The players move in, kill the mob, take the loot and leave. That's what the game is about. just because it's easier than it should be and players kill it anyway, is no reason to go start hollering these people are less than honorable or whatever. Whoop te do if you go in and kill it the way it's intended. If that's the way you roll, fine but, don't assume anything about other guilds because they choose not to. You do nothing but resort to trying to push your morals on other people.People killing Tarinax knowing his adds were not popping did nothing wrong. SOE knew of the issue for a LONG time and chose not to do anything about it.If the dev team chooses to leave an encounter in the game knowing that it's easy to kill or whatever, then it's THIER fault, not the players.<p>Message Edited by Scortch on <span class=date_text>08-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:18 PM</span>

[quetzaqotl]

<P>On a side note grats Heroes Fate on killing chel drak server first yesterday.</P> <P>3rd time in zone</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>08-22-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:34 PM</span>

[Kyriel]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quetzaqotl wrote:<BR> <P>On a side note grats Heroes Fate on killing chel drak server first yesterday.</P> <P>3rd time in zone<BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Even tho that doesnt have anything do with with MO i'd just ilke to add:</P> <P><BR>and yes... they killed the adds!:smileywink:</P>

[thorvang]

what's the name of the t5 raiding instance on feerrott again? that thing with the evil eye and his gibberish companion. you tried different tactics on him just to find out: pump the mt up to 100% avoid and just let him tank this insane amount of adds. as soon as the eye is dead we loot the chest and leave the zone. only exception: someone went ld, then we'd kill the adds.why bother with something that doesn't oppose a threat if you don't need to kill it to finish the encounter?now the adds are linked to the MO and you need to kill them to get your reward. fine, we'll do it.it really doesn't matter to me how some raid kills a specific mob. as long as they don't bring more than the intendet players and don't make use of pathing exploits or somesuch.

[MeridianR]

I believe it's Trembling Legoon?  (Meeting of the Minds) <div></div>

[merkla]

<DIV>still dont understand this step , you prolly expect more guilds to become capable of killin stuff they failed to handle because they didnt put in the same effort like other guilds did  , on the other hand u create us mobs which cant be beaten by guilds who spend a lot of time in learning an encounter ?</DIV> <DIV>I cant get the point behind this ,   thats not the way gettin people start to think about what to do so guilds never grow into </DIV> <DIV> this is so last year SoE</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Leawyn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> merklarx wrote:<BR> <DIV>still dont understand this step , you prolly expect more guilds to become capable of killin stuff they failed to handle because they didnt put in the same effort like other guilds did  , on the other hand u create us mobs which cant be beaten by guilds who spend a lot of time in learning an encounter ?</DIV> <DIV>I cant get the point behind this ,   thats not the way gettin people start to think about what to do so guilds never grow into </DIV> <DIV> this is so last year SoE</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>o.O what the...... nevermind. my brain is cramping now, thanks.

[Wabit]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> merklarx wrote:<BR> <DIV>still dont understand this step , you prolly expect more guilds to become capable of killin stuff they failed to handle because they didnt put in the same effort like other guilds did  , on the other hand u create us mobs which cant be beaten by guilds who spend a lot of time in learning an encounter ?</DIV> <DIV>I cant get the point behind this ,   thats not the way gettin people start to think about what to do so guilds never grow into </DIV> <DIV> this is so last year SoE</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>i can't make heads or tails of this...

[quetzaqotl]

<P>I think hes complaining about Soe making some mobs "burn down w/o any strategy" so people dont have to come up with a good strat to beat the encounter. While there are encounter that need a good strat but are unkillable atm (overseer of change for instance)?</P> <P>So I think he means SOE doesnt reward people who come up with strats?</P> <P>At least thats what i read in his post /shrug.</P>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>quetzaqotl wrote: <P>I think hes complaining about Soe making some mobs "burn down w/o any strategy" so people dont have to come up with a good strat to beat the encounter. While there are encounter that need a good strat but are unkillable atm (overseer of change for instance)?</P> <P>So I think he means SOE doesnt reward people who come up with strats?</P> <P>At least thats what i read in his post /shrug.</P><hr></blockquote> Overseer of Change is killable. And if you can't kill him, you suck as a guild.

[Ratty31]

MO was actually made harder on Befallen due to the fact we have to random for pulls.

[Luca Blight]

<DIV>dam that sucks to have to random.</DIV>

[Ratty31]

If it spawns in prime time it's unkillable with the lag. I'd prefer sony fix the game but if we have to have a GM make people /random so they'll zone out when it's not thier turn then that's what we'll do I guess.

[Unmask]

The GMs will do that for you?

[Ratty31]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Unmasked wrote:<BR>The GMs will do that for you?<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>He just showed up and did it, I didn't ask him to.

[Unmask]

We had a similar problem a couple of weeks ago. Three guilds there and massive lag. We just waited it out.

[quetzaqotl]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Pinski wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quetzaqotl wrote:<BR> <P>I think hes complaining about Soe making some mobs "burn down w/o any strategy" so people dont have to come up with a good strat to beat the encounter. While there are encounter that need a good strat but are unkillable atm (overseer of change for instance)?</P> <P>So I think he means SOE doesnt reward people who come up with strats?</P> <P>At least thats what i read in his post /shrug.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Overseer of Change is killable. And if you can't kill him, you suck as a guild.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Pls dont be an [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] I meant overseer as the whole encounter incl. the matron and I dont think anyone has killed it yet or did disso or whatever kill it?</P> <P>With the change of spell crits it will make a big difference, but yeah getting to the matron isnt hard.</P> <P>No need to keep being an [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn].</P>

[electricninjasex]

We had 3-4 guilds at contesteds regularly on Blackburrow server... heck it still is that way... I'd hate to be the sorry GM that pulls the /random card out. <div></div>

[LexxerCoV]

3-4 guilds is one thing... 6 plus guilds as well as all kinds of partial guilds and onlookers made for a very interesting and horribly laggy night on everfrost.

[Kyriel]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LexxerCoV wrote:<BR> 3-4 guilds is one thing... 6 plus guilds as well as all kinds of partial guilds and onlookers made for a very interesting and horribly laggy night on everfrost.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR><FONT size=3>You exxagerate. There was hardly anybody in zone... I mean, the zone crashed twice cuz SOE right?</FONT></P> <P> </P> <P><IMG src="http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y265/niluvani/EQ2_000030.jpg"></P> <P><IMG src="http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y265/niluvani/EQ2_000027.jpg"></P> <P>I was seeing double.. :smileysurprised:</P> <P><IMG src="http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y265/niluvani/doubles.jpg"></P>

[Leawyn]

Wow......... that so brings me back to the memories of EQ1 raids... nothing like 200 people in an underwater zone to lag ya out! <div></div>

[electricninjasex]

Those screenshots are nothing new to me. <div></div>

[gnarkill]

See now if that was Nagafen..everyone would be killing each other before/during/after MO was dead (which probably would not happen with all the pvp) nothing like running in charming the MT and running him away from the mob! Look at all that yummy infamy...i am jealous =D<div></div>

[Unmask]

Well say what you want about my server we're all at least friendly towards our competition and hence ...<a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=206&message.id=8853&jump=true" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=206&message.id=8853&jump=true</a>had trouble on the g for some reason... <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Be-min]

Ya was a crazy night on Everfrost.... Ok guys in 10...  5....  sending in pet....  player A has gone LD, Player G has gone LD, Player H has gone LD, then my screen does the flicker of death, looking at desktop <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.   6 guilds raiding MO makes a tasty night!  But hell, was a ton of fun at any rate! Grats HF for surviving the lagfest!!

[Scort]

Yep and you have people saying everything is fine and dandy with SOE coding. That nothing is wrong at all.If everything was fine and dandy, you wouldn't have all this lag with people being in the zone and all the lag in your own instance when others are doing an instance in the same zone. Lag and LDs when several guilds doing same instances or in the area of contested is just unreasonable.The network code needs a major overhaul.<p>Message Edited by Scortch on <span class=date_text>08-28-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:57 PM</span>

[MeridianR]

<div><blockquote><hr>Scortch wrote:Yep and you have people saying everything is fine and dandy with SOE coding. That nothing is wrong at all.<hr></blockquote>/sigh</div>

[HellRaiserXX]

the chest still drops when MO dies even if there are adds left.  They are not the same encounter just locked to that encounter so you can bring extra grps to control the adds.  From I have seen the straight burn still works fine, just need more DPS. So when MO dies you can yell off the adds and hit the wall and still get your chest.