8 second charm

[Jooneau]

AKA Bria's Entrancing Sonnet.What the hell were you thinking?It destroys the spell for all practical purposes in PvE.<p>Message Edited by Jooneau on <span class=date_text>05-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:58 PM</span>

[regalus]

<P>just a test</P> <P> </P>

[Geekyone]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> regalus wrote:<BR> <P>just a test</P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>F-       </P> <P>8 seconds is nothing.  Then to say we have limited pet controls during that time...HA!  What are you going to be able to do in 8 seconds.</P> <P>/pet run off cliff  <-- that is about all we can hope to accomplish...by the time it runs off the charm will have ended, and we can hope it dies upon impact and we get the exp...thats our best hope.</P>

[Emerix]

<DIV>Uhm . It is absolutely pointless .</DIV>

[Gungo]

Um yeah i have nothing to add.. seriosuly i can't think of anyway to say this skill is useful for its orginal purpose. Its really just an 11 sec mezz (8 sec charm 3 sec mezz on expiration). At least it costs no conc anymore.

[QQ-Fatman]

<DIV>It seems like soe doesnt want non chanter class to have any useful mez or charm. They're going to change brusier's 25sec duration, 30sec recast mez to 10sec duration, 60sec recast and share the same recast with our fear line. Just like what they're doing to troubador's charm - making it useless. This control spell change is nothing more than a big nerf to everyone and it doesnt help chanters at all.</DIV>

[Tanit]

Well now it's like a long stun. While it's nothing like real charm, it's hardly useless.<div></div>

[VericSauvari]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Tanith_ wrote:Well now it's like a long stun. While it's nothing like real charm, it's hardly useless.<div></div><hr></blockquote> the kicker, from what i have read... it STILL does not let you make the pet attack things...so basically its a 8 second unbreakable mez. why have we had no feedback on these troubador changes? the troubador forums have seen more activity the last 3 days then they have in months. all calling for some sort of acknowledgment that as a whole that the dev's know how unimpressed the troubadors are and that at least they are not ignoring us.<div></div><p>Message Edited by VericSauvari on <span class=date_text>05-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:50 PM</span>

[Tanit]

<blockquote><hr>VericSauvari wrote: the kicker, from what i have read... it STILL does not let you make the pet attack things...so basically its a 8 second unbreakable mez. <font color="#ffff99">Yeah.. as a charm the spell's useless, but a 8 sec unbreakable mez/stun is quite nice.</font>why have we had no feedback on these troubador changes? the troubador forums have seen more activity the last 3 days then they have in months. all calling for some sort of acknowledgment that as a whole that the dev's know how unimpressed the troubadors are and that at least they are not ignoring us.<div></div><p><span class="time_text"></span><font color="#ffff99">I don't understand all this "omg soe hates my class" stuff when every single class has it's CC spells nerfed...</font></p><hr></blockquote><div></div>

[Rast]

Mainly because theirs went from a 7.5 minute charm to an 8 second one.  And then had the casting time increased to boot.  That is a bit more than a nerf if you ask me.

[Lynadianya Zeran]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Tanith_ wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P> <HR> <P></P> <P>VericSauvari wrote:<BR><BR>the kicker, from what i have read... it STILL does not let you make the pet attack things...so basically its a 8 second unbreakable mez.<BR><BR><FONT color=#ffff99>Yeah.. as a charm the spell's useless, but a 8 sec unbreakable mez/stun is quite nice.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffcc33>And, and after that charm breaks, that mob and all of it's children will hate you forever.  Basically, in my small trio (Paly, Conjurer and me), charming a mob in combat is = to /suicide.  The only reason I would do it is to sacrifice myself for the healer in a larger group.  It is coming off of my button bar.  Troubadours have very low personal DPS (except for a few extremely well equiped (read that as fabled) troubs with master everythings and far into their AA lines) so, one of the ways that we soloed was to charm a mob and have it help us.  This was (and still is) a reactionary charm.  That means we could not send it to attack.  We would begin the fight and the mob would back us up if we started getting hurt.  This would allow me to take on single up blues and the occasional non-caster single up white.  These are considered solo mobs through the con system.  There is no reason that any class in this game (that includes the healer classes) should not be able to dispatch a single up blue with relative ease since they are considered solo mobs beneath us in level.  I was not using it to take on triple up heroics (and for the record, even with a charmed mob helping me, I have only ever been able to kill 2 triple up heroics by myself, and they were both 10 levels below me - every other time, before I starting using charm, I was killed if I attempted it).  And, we could not use our pets to tank for us, unless we wanted the charm to break and then have to fight 2 mobs.  I never charmed a mob that I couldn't also kill if the charm broke.<BR></FONT><BR>why have we had no feedback on these troubador changes? the troubador forums have seen more activity the last 3 days then they have in months. all calling for some sort of acknowledgment that as a whole that the dev's know how unimpressed the troubadors are and that at least they are not ignoring us.<BR></P> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN><FONT color=#ffff99>I don't understand all this "omg soe hates my class" stuff when every single class has it's CC spells nerfed...</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffcc33>We have been asking the devs to give us an idea of what their vision for the class is, since they took away our charm, castrated our mez (which is what made group combat for me fun and was in no way over powered  or better than an enchanter) and made our spell procs only proc on the few long casting spells out there (yeah, honestly, what is an extra 200 points going to do for an ice comet anyway).  Our spell proc was one of the things that made soloing for me viable (and I am not talking about soloing heroics - I am talking about soloing no arrow singles or multiple down arrow even con or lower groups).  I have seriously noticed the change in how well I solo now.  It went from difficult to just plain sad.  So, when you strip us of those things that make the class viable (except for as an afk buff bot) I think it is fair to ask for some answers from the powers that be.  And, oh yeah, our cheap shot is getting nerfed too.  That takes another 200 points of damage out of my combat as I will only be able to get off my positional attack with it, not my stealth to back attack also.  Just read the boards and you will find many non-troubadour people asking why troubies are getting hurt so much.  We were not overpowered.  We did not need nerfing!<BR></FONT></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR><FONT color=#ff9933>Charm was not used in group combat (at least by me) but my mez kept me busy and having fun with crowd control while I kept the group hasted and added spell proc damage.  Now, my spell proc damage is next to worthless and I have a mez that will allow me to mez a single target only, and I will not be able to re-mez if the mez breaks early (as the recast is now the same as the duration).  I don't really have anything to do anymore.  Nothing makes my class special.  When we complained that our class description specifically stated that we had crowd control, Sony changed the class description.  That is why we think Sony hates us.</FONT></P><p>Message Edited by Lynadianya Zeran on <span class=date_text>05-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:18 PM</span>

[Bassist]

<div><blockquote><hr>Lynadianya Zeran wrote:<div></div> <div></div><blockquote> <hr> </blockquote> <p><font color="#ff9933">Charm was not used in group combat (at least by me) but my mez kept me busy and having fun with crowd control while I kept the group hasted and added spell proc damage.  Now, my spell proc damage is next to worthless and I have a mez that will allow me to mez a single target only, and I will not be able to re-mez if the mez breaks early (as the recast is now the same as the duration).  I don't really have anything to do anymore.  Nothing makes my class special.  When we complained that our class description specifically stated that we had crowd control, Sony changed the class description.  That is why we think Sony hates us.</font></p><p>Message Edited by Lynadianya Zeran on <span class="date_text">05-18-2006</span> <span class="time_text">09:18 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>Don't forget that they not only changed the class description, but didn't tell us they changed it.  I'm not saying they hate us, they just don't pay attention to our viability and don't give us a toolset from which to make something useful.</div>

[VericSauvari]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Tanith_ wrote:<blockquote><hr>VericSauvari wrote: the kicker, from what i have read... it STILL does not let you make the pet attack things...so basically its a 8 second unbreakable mez. <font color="#ffff99">Yeah.. as a charm the spell's useless, but a 8 sec unbreakable mez/stun is quite nice.</font>why have we had no feedback on these troubador changes? the troubador forums have seen more activity the last 3 days then they have in months. all calling for some sort of acknowledgment that as a whole that the dev's know how unimpressed the troubadors are and that at least they are not ignoring us.<div></div><p><span class="time_text"></span><font color="#ffff99">I don't understand all this "omg soe hates my class" stuff when every single class has it's CC spells nerfed...</font></p><hr></blockquote><div></div> <hr></blockquote>As the others have said, we don't think SOE hates our class...I think they forgot we actually have a non-afkbot presence in the game  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I think it would be safe to say we have recieved almost ZERO feedback / acknowledgement of changes since LU#13 ... Hell when chanters get their panties in a wad at least a red name would come and comment on it (for better or worse.) We all know if a favored class of the devs (brawler classes, druids, etc) as much as get a 0.00001% change a royal herald comes to the forums and has a statement to calm the masses. Lets count the troubador nerfs and the direct troubador improvements in the last patches since LU13 <font color="#ff3300">LU#13 - </font> Bard debuff songs are now 0 concentration, 0-second reuse timer, 2-second cast time, 25m range, toggleable, 15m radius, and 1 minute duration. ( AWSOME! Oh wait...check out LU#16) <font color="#ff3300">LU#14 -</font> Quiron's Joyous Celebration had its casting icon changed to not confuse it with other group songs. (cosmetic change) Selo's no longer expires and can be toggled off. (cosmetic change) <font color="#ff3300">LU#15 -</font> nothing <font color="#ff3300">LU#16</font> - Aria of Excitement's proc damage was reduced. (nerf) - Kian's Destructive Anthem and Demoralizing Processional now have a casting time of 1 second and a reuse time of 4 seconds. (nerf) - Reproaching Discante and Zander's Choral Rebuff now have a casting time of 1 second and a reuse time of 2 seconds. (nerf) - Precision of the Maestro had its reuse timer increased to 90 seconds and duration changed to 20 seconds. Hate assignment is spread across each caster that procs it instead of being entirely blamed on the Troubador. (Nerf) - The Aria of Excitement and Minstrel's Fortune lines now have updated icons to reduce confusion with other songs. ( (cosmetic change)) - The Songster's Luck line now has updated icons to reduce confusion with other songs. (cosmetic change) - Minstrel's Fortune has a better explanation of how casting skill increases affect the spell. (cosmetic change) <font color="#ff3300">LU#17</font> Plenty of non-bard changes <font color="#ff3300">LU#18</font> Plenty of non-bard changes <font color="#ff3300">LU#19</font> Classes that use multiple stats to calculate their power pools (Dirges, Paladins, Shadowknights, and Troubadors) will now gain double the benefit from increasing their secondary power stat.  (multiclass Improvement) <font color="#ff3300">LU#20</font> - Alin's Serenade should no longer produce more than 41% hate reduction. (nerf) <font color="#ff3300">LU#21</font> - Bria's Infatuating Sonnet can no longer charm creatures that should not be charmed. The dismiss command now also works properly.  ("fix" AKA nerf) - Jester's Cap can now be cast on raid members.(improvement) - Plenty of non-bard changes <font color="#ff0000">LU#22</font> - Bard: Harbinger's Sonnet's effect radius has been increased. (uuh..thanks i think.  This is the *ONLY* AA change we have had.) <font color="#ff0000">LU#23</font> - A spell's chance to trigger a proc is now adjusted based on its cast time. (huge nerf) We have a ton of COSMETIC changes and changes/fixes that are only brought around when it improves another class. I did not bother to even go through the indirect nerfs we have recieved.<div></div><p>Message Edited by VericSauvari on <span class=date_text>05-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:47 AM</span>

[Jooneau]

<blockquote><hr>Tanith_ wrote:Well now it's like a long stun. While it's nothing like real charm, it's hardly useless.<div></div><hr></blockquote>It's still breakable. If the charmed NPC takes any damage, it still has the same 10% chance of charm breaking as it did before.Cure Arcane/Dispel Arcane will dispel it, too; that's more of a PvP issue than a PvE one though.Don't get me started on the mez change. Not only can we only mez one monster now (20s duration/20s recast), but any debuff will break the mez early (rather than just damage).Whoever's responsible for this fiasco needs to be fired...<p>Message Edited by Jooneau on <span class=date_text>05-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:34 PM</span>

[Bassist]

<div><blockquote><hr>Jooneau wrote:<blockquote><hr>Tanith_ wrote:Well now it's like a long stun. While it's nothing like real charm, it's hardly useless.<div></div><hr></blockquote>It's still breakable. If the charmed NPC takes any damage, it still has the same 10% chance of charm breaking as it did before.Cure Arcane/Dispel Arcane will dispel it, too; that's more of a PvP issue than a PvE one though.Don't get me started on the mez change. Not only can we only mez one monster now (20s duration/20s recast), but any debuff will break the mez early (rather than just damage).Whoever's responsible for this fiasco needs to be fired...<p>Message Edited by Jooneau on <span class="date_text">05-19-2006</span> <span class="time_text">01:34 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>The debuff issue was fixed on test.</div>

[Jooneau]

Re: debuffs not breaking mez, that's great news.

[VericSauvari]

<blockquote><hr>Jooneau wrote:Re: debuffs not breaking mez, that's great news.<hr></blockquote>however remember, if something procs off your debuff it will break the mez. I used to have this problem with illusionist/coercer recasting mez because it used to go MEZ then PROC then MEZ BREAK whereas troubador mez was PROC then MEZ<div></div>

[Jooneau]

Procs off debuffs breaking mez is bad news, given the increased recast timers on mez. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Gungo]

iTs best not to think of yoru charm as a charm anymore it is now an 11 sec concentration free almost unbreakable mezz. 8 sec charm 3 sec mezz.

[Zeral498]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Gungo wrote:<div></div>iTs best not to think of yoru charm as a charm anymore it is now an 11 sec concentration free almost unbreakable mezz. 8 sec charm 3 sec mezz.<hr></blockquote>It is an 8 second concentration free almost unbreakable mez. I don't know why you tossed in 3 seconds. And yes, it has a 10% chance of breaking when the target takes damage, and it will periodically "check" to see if the charm will stil apply in a certain interval (not sure how long that is - shouldn't matter much with the small duration of the charm). By the way, if we shouldn't think of it as a charm, they should just re-do the spell altogether and make it into a 8 second mez. Also, some of you have mentioned that having a near-unbreaking mez for 8 seconds is handy to have. Although it might seem nice on paper, in actual practical uses, it SUCKS. EDIT: Word choice.<div></div><p>Message Edited by Zeral498 on <span class=date_text>05-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:19 PM</span>

[Snublefot]

<P>Help not to think about it? How can I help not think about a 7 minute duration 10(?) second recast charm?</P> <P>Or my 50s duration 10s recast mez reduced to 20/20? </P> <P>Its just plain silly. But I guess we'll just have to bend over, take one for the greater good of the game again. Smiling in the knowledge we give away our incredible uber powerfull abilities and spread it a little more fair...</P> <P>I know what the warm feeling inside is called. Anger. Not at the nerf, but at the extreme stupidity shown by whoever was in charge of this. FFS, its hitting the troubadour hard. In the part of gameplay we didnt exactly shine in previously. Why not aim the nerfbat at some of the classes that can and still will solo tripple up heroics and in some cases named? Have you ever seen a bard try to solo-pull a named in Bonemire? No?</P> <P>I live in the hope someone will back off this change and tell us it really only was the pvp-part of the spells that will be changed as described.</P>

[Gungo]

i was being slightly sarcastic about the charm but its not ment in jest. You really dont have a charm it is effctivly a near unbreakable mezz now. To call it a charm is really not true. abotu 11 secs i was under the presumption that your charm had a 3 sec mezz when the charm wore off.

[Zeral498]

<blockquote><hr>Gungo wrote:<div></div>i was being slightly sarcastic about the charm but its not ment in jest. You really dont have a charm it is effctivly a near unbreakable mezz now. To call it a charm is really not true. abotu 11 secs i was under the presumption that your charm had a 3 sec mezz when the charm wore off.<hr></blockquote>Heh, nope. No mez when it wears off. They run straight to you and beat you into a bloody pulp.<div></div>

[ssumthing]

From what I remember reading the charm has a 1 min recast timer on it anyway. So even if it is a 3 second casting its pointless... as stated above using it in a group would = dead bard.

[Snublefot]

<DIV>I take it you mean 1 minute on test. Just to clear any misunderstanding its 5 seconds from charm breaks on live.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And its actually less usefull then cheap shot and a mez. At least you can use those to get into position for a sneak attack or backstab. The charm is just ... useless.</DIV>

[Ryus]

<DIV>Ummm.. why was a spell ability reduced by 98.1%? I'm not even a bard, but SoE, you slaughtered the class. How is making a spell/CA useless, balancing a class? Would it not be a better idea to remove the spell and give them something useful? <DIV>Reconsider what you are doing, or else we will lose what little bard population remains after the LU 13 fiasco.</DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Whatever you are thinking, is <EM><U><STRONG>wrong.</STRONG></U></EM></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><U></U></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV>I threw in my 2 cents, whatever it means to you devs</DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><U></U></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Jooneau]

What's even crazier about this nerf to charm is that they left Coercer charm alone. So you can't even say, "well, they nerfed it, because charm is too powerful in EQ2," because Coercers can still charm. For the record, having played Enchanter in EQ, I love that Coercers can charm and do not in any way want SOE to nerf their charm like they did Troubadour charm.I guess you can't really expect too much from a company that can't spell "troubadour" right to begin with.

[Jooneau]

<blockquote><hr>Gungo wrote:iTs best not to think of yoru charm as a charm anymore it is now an 11 sec concentration free almost unbreakable mezz. 8 sec charm 3 sec mezz.<hr></blockquote>6.5 second "unbreakable mez"... WITH A ONE MINUTE RECAST TIMER. Are you [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing kidding me?

[Sss'thasine'ss]

<P>Just a thought,</P> <P>After a mob is charmed, the bard can use these 8secs to regain his hp & power...at out-of-combat speed.</P> <P>The bard can recast charm again and again till fully healed, then continue to  finish off the mob.</P> <P>The recast is 2sec right? Will this be a good wau to solo hard mobs?</P> <P> </P> <P>Sorry for my bad english.</P> <P>Thanks for reading.</P>

[ssumthing]

Yes test is what I meant... thats why it would be useless to even use as an "8 second mez" ... - Troubador - Bria's Entrancing Sonnet - Now works as a very short-term charm. Reduced casting time to 3s. Has full use of pet commands. Duration greatly reduced. Removed concentration costs.<b> Increased reuse time to 60s. </b>Taken from the test update notes. That's just .......... unreal ........... <span>:smileyindifferent:</span> <b> </b>

[Zeral498]

<blockquote><hr>Sss'thasine'ss wrote:<div></div> <p>Just a thought,</p> <p>After a mob is charmed, the bard can use these 8secs to regain his hp & power...at out-of-combat speed.</p> <p>The bard can recast charm again and again till fully healed, then continue to  finish off the mob.</p> <p>The recast is 2sec right? Will this be a good wau to solo hard mobs?</p> <p>Sorry for my bad english.</p> <p>Thanks for reading.</p><hr></blockquote>Recast is 1 minute. You can't cast it over and over.<div></div>

[Rominian]

Fighters mezzing? gimme a break. Only bards and chanters should have any form of mez whatsoever. period.

[Bassist]

I know the poster was feeling embittered when mentioning "think of it as a mezz" and will agree with what I say here, but we can't even look at it as something as great as our LU24 mezz.  This is a worse spell than our mezz:<ul><li>8 Second duration vs. 20 second duration</li><li>Mob is always facing vs. standing still (positional CAs)</li><li>No debuffing vs. debuffing</li><li>1 minute recast vs. 20 second recast</li><li>Tons of agro vs. hundreds of pounds  (useful to know since you'll be more likely to see "You slow down due to overburdening.")</li><li>Can break early in an uncontrollable way vs. breaks in known fashion</li></ul>So, the positive of the charm vs. the mezz for LU24?<ul><li>Up to 8 seconds of damage done for you vs. no damage done for you</li></ul>You do have to give credit where credit is due <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Snublefot]

<P>Focus of the changes seems to move from spells to tradeskill and broker.</P> <P><STRONG>Still no word from devs on Troubadour Charm and Mez NERF!</STRONG></P> <P>How hard can it be to actually give a word here? Do you intend to take away the Troubadour CC abilities like the change currently do. If so why not just be blunt and say so? Or are we waiting for as many accounts as possible to pay their monthly, maybe even the adventure pack? Come on, there aint that many of us Troubs left anyway.</P>

[pikeymoose]

Lets assume Sony changes this game to make more revenue.Hands up for this LU24 getting more subscriptions than if they left it alone?What kind of a company makes change to worsen a game and lose money?I am confused.Did I miss something here, and subscriptions will go up?? after this change, and the game will be better?Get started on your suicide note SONY.Moose

[Mezzelli]

<DIV> <DIV>I don't post a lot, I ussually only pipe up when devs are gonna break something major,  <STRONG><FONT color=#ff0000>AND THIS IS MAJOR !!</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I didn't like the changes that were coming the last time the devs changed the Troubador class.  Though they changed a lot of what was the Troubador, taking away buffs and making us caster-buddies instead of melee-buffers, they gave us the charm and mezz that went along with <FONT color=#66ff33>the new concept of being chain wearing enchanters.</FONT>  </DIV> <DIV>--In the end, I learned to like the new class for its massive amount of utility even though soloing was difficult at best.</DIV> <DIV align=center>...And now they go and nerf the few things that make the class viable.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The lack of <FONT size=3>damage</FONT> that the Troubadors did was balanced by the fact that we now have charmed pets and a mezz.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The Devs are destroying that balance by :</DIV> <DIV> - 1) taking damage away from some of our attacks (the lowest of any scout class already - no poisons)</DIV> <DIV> - 2) reducing mezz's duration (this I can tolerate, but it should be 30 sec duration - 20 sec recast)</DIV> <DIV> - 3) making <STRONG>CHARM</STRONG> last only 8 secs(which as a <U><EM>chain-wearing enchanter</EM> </U>should be a main stay of the class)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=4><FONT size=3>The main problem is</FONT> the EQ2 Dev team has yet to decide exactly what the Troubador class does.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>The in-box book does not match the online write up <U>and neither match the in-game character !!</U></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>  Link - <A href="http://everquest2.station.sony.com/en/main.vm#professionTroubador" target=_blank>http://everquest2.station.sony.com/en/main.vm#professionTroubador</A></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3><EM>" When will the hurting stop ?! "</EM></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>____________________________________</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Madam Mariel - 66 Troubador</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Viviana Vedette - 33 Troubador PvP Destroyer</FONT></DIV></DIV>

[Blakeavon]

<P>Still no word on this silliness, sure if you want to nerf charm thats fine but 8 SECS!!!!</P> <P> </P> <P>I really do wish some of the DEVS had enough respect to us gamers to at least explain the theory behind going from a 7min to 8sec....and inform us what exact can we do in 8 secs.</P> <P> </P> <P>Something tells me alas, they are far from caring. if they havent answered us so far its not going to happen <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </P>

[Blakeavon]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> pikeymoose wrote:<BR><BR>Get started on your suicide note SONY.<BR><BR>Moose<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>what i think is amusing is that we who have played since the beginning have seen many changes in 23 LU's but i cant recall any (not even lu13) that have caused so must angry and distress to the gaming public. they say we should respect their decision thoughhard have to be made for the betterment of the game, yet the game has been running fine since NOV the year before last. i play on AB and it is d.e.d. dead as a server... no where near as full of life as in was even two months ago... where have these gone? a lot of my friends just dont want to play anymore because the game seems foreign to them now. sure as an MMO its about chnaging and moving, but you have to ask yourself who are these changes for? </P> <P>surely you should be trying to keep the old players here? not trying feed off the dregs of people escaping from WoW or DDO? <BR></P> <P>this LU24 has got a lot of people really concerned and unfortunately it is obvious that SOE doesnt have a customer service department that is reading these feedbacks because if you were it would be really obvious that through all the complaints is are certain core lines of fact. a good customer service team could see that beyond all these threads troubadours arent happy, for truely logically reasons.most are asking for a simple explaination. Sure Moorgard has posted a few generic things about nerfins and way MMO work. but any strong professional customer service department would troll these forums lookings beyond the screaming and cries of nerf to see that there is a problem and a lot of unhappy people.</P> <P> </P> <P>in the real world if you have a problem with a product you ring up and speak to a customer service manager, they spin you a few yarns (propagada) but there job is to alivate your fears and intice you to continue using a product. So in a thing like EQ2 boards you think that a customer service manager would see that there is this growing anger with troubs and realised here is a really sizable section of our customers are unhappy... we cant order the devs to change what they are doing but how about we talk to the troubs and at least pretend that our concerns are heard. Surely SoE would rather a whole class of upset but pacified customers than a whole class extremely angry, screaming and filling boards with endless threads WHEN ALL THEY HAVE TO DO is communicate </P> <P> </P><p>Message Edited by Blakeavon on <span class=date_text>05-25-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:53 AM</span>

[Snublefot]

<DIV>AB = where every sheep-minded player used to go => they are now on a pvp server currently at level 20 something and most likely started another toon on a diffrent server that everyone said was much better. The curse of beeing the highest populated server. <STRONG>But thats a completely diffrent discussion, so end that here or take it to another thread. Do not derail this one!</STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>SOE aint going to feel a Troub nerf at all. There just isnt that many of us left. But its kinda funny how there suddenly is a ton of Troub masters for sale on the broker. Kinda inverted Acrylia :p</DIV><p>Message Edited by Snublefot on <span class=date_text>05-24-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:44 PM</span>

[Caldar]

<P>Adding my 2 cents.   Started my friend playing, she was afraid of anything too complicated so I had her make a troub figuring she could just hang out, not work too hard.   Boy was I right... bards now need do nothing but stand there chatting.  That's all they can do if lu24 goes through as-is. </P> <P>Please heal the bards, DEVS.   I think they are the second neediest class(dirges too?) after the chanters. </P> <P>It's so depressing to see the DEVS go and do a live chat for stratics, then answer the questions that nobody really cares about while skipping over the questions the community really wants answered.</P> <P>I feel the lack of a voice for the players of eq2.  Sure we have the forums but it's obvious the devs aren't listening.   If you're going to tell us you have a better view of the balance than all of us, that doesn't mean you can't tell us what you're thinking when you do things that everyone playing the game thinks is a bad (seriously messed up) thing.</P> <P>When the players of everquest 1 got fed up, it took popular website hosts voicing their opinions to get sony to listen. (which lasted about two months.. then it was back to the usual)   But they did get one player/dev conference out of it.</P>

[Kasar]

<div><blockquote><hr>Blakeavon wrote:<div></div> <p>Still no word on this silliness, sure if you want to nerf charm thats fine but 8 SECS!!!!</p><hr></blockquote>Wouldn't expect one.  Zero dev posts in the troub forums since launch.  They probably don't play the class unless it's boxed and just AF.</div>