WTB LU21

[Uumuuanu]

<div>Can you please just finish this already.   There are alot of us that have been waiting on the fixes in this since KOS was released (example tradeskillers).</div><div> </div><div>If the package cannot be put up as a whole, can you at least start putting it up in pieces or give us a date which you expect to put it up.</div>

[Majes]

Paying more than what Uumuuanu offers....PST<div></div>

[Moorgard]

<P>We are planning Live Update #21 for next week, tentatively March 22.</P> <P>Though we fully intend to keep on offering frequent and significant updates to the game, we also plan to include additional polish time in our update cycles. That's the case here, where we gave LU21 an extra week of fixes and tweaks before it goes live.</P>

[Ceruline]

Coming from test.. Trust us, there were good reasons it was held back a wee bit <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  All of which are currently getting fixed, thankfully.<div></div>

[rot]

<div></div>Could you allow Crusaders to use T7 crafted pikes when you launch it please? Mine is getting lost under all of the dust.

[Rezikai]

<div></div><div></div><p>giving 5pp !</p><p>to the person that comes up with a better icon then that gawd awfull Halfling hiding his face icon Morr uses... every time i see it, it gives me the creeps...</p><p>lol...</p><p>LU#21</p><p>-<em>Due to popular demand Moorguard created a new icon to replace the villianous halfling he has used for years now...lol</em></p><p>:smileytongue:</p><p>Message Edited by Porkchop133 on <span class="date_text">03-15-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:14 PM</span></p>

[Trepan]

Please never delete this thread so I can reference it when next someone complains about fixes getting pushed out too soon.  <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span><div></div>

[Cirro]

<div></div><p>It's good that things ar getting polished, but c'mon.  Sony atrociously over-nerfed the rangers, then prompty back-pedaled with 'we'll fix (a very small amout of) it next LU!'   Let's get on with this already.</p><p>I think one poster was right.  Sony knee-jerk nerfs classes before figuring out what the real issue is, and then takes MONTHS to get those characters back to playable status.</p><p>Prove me wrong.  Get the Ranger's **raid** DPS back on par.</p>

[frooz]

<div></div>On the subject of it taking months to fix anything with a class, I only have 1 thing to say.... enchanters...That is all.Rangers got off lightly. The nerf bat knows all!<div></div><p>Message Edited by froozle on <span class="date_text">03-16-2006</span><span class="time_text">03:16 AM</span></p>

[Silverpaws]

I dont see the crafting change going in with LU21.  Is this true?<div></div>

[Mabes]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div></div><p>We are planning Live Update #21 for next week, tentatively March 22.</p><p>Though we fully intend to keep on offering frequent and significant updates to the game, we also plan to include additional polish time in our update cycles. That's the case here, where we gave LU21 an extra week of fixes and tweaks before it goes live.</p><hr></blockquote>Woo hoo!  Can't wait:smileyhappy:

[Rijacki]

<span><blockquote><hr>Silverpaws wrote:I dont see the crafting change going in with LU21.  Is this true?<div></div><hr></blockquote>Crafted armor changes...I sure as heck hope the tradeskill change isn't going Live without ever touching Test and getting.. umm.. tested on anything other than their internal server (if that).</span><div></div>

[Vandileir]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Rijacki wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>Silverpaws wrote:I dont see the crafting change going in with LU21.  Is this true?<div></div><hr></blockquote>Crafted armor changes...I sure as heck hope the tradeskill change isn't going Live without ever touching Test and getting.. umm.. tested on anything other than their internal server (if that).</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>I'd like to see some crafted weapon changes. As a Guardian/Weaponsmith, I've gotten the fat end of the shaft 2 expansions in a row <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. My poor Barbarian really cant take much more abuse.

[HolyAvengerOne]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Uumuuanu wrote:<div>Can you please just finish this already.   There are alot of us that have been waiting on the fixes in this since KOS was released (example tradeskillers).</div><div> </div><div>If the package cannot be put up as a whole, can you at least start putting it up in pieces or give us a date which you expect to put it up.</div><font color="#339900"></font><hr></blockquote><font color="#339900">Dude, KoS was released not 1 month ago, give it time.</font></span></div>

[EvilIguana9]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Porkchop133 wrote:<div></div><div></div><p>giving 5pp !</p><p>to the person that comes up with a better icon then that gawd awfull Halfling hiding his face icon Morr uses... every time i see it, it gives me the creeps...</p><p>lol...</p><p>LU#21</p><p>-<em>Due to popular demand Moorguard created a new icon to replace the villianous halfling he has used for years now...lol</em></p><p>:smileytongue:</p><p>Message Edited by Porkchop133 on <span class="date_text">03-15-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:14 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>That's not a halfling, it's an EQ1 human.</span></div>

[Uumuuanu]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div></div><p>We are planning Live Update #21 for next week, tentatively March 22.</p><p>Though we fully intend to keep on offering frequent and significant updates to the game, we also plan to include additional polish time in our update cycles. That's the case here, where we gave LU21 an extra week of fixes and tweaks before it goes live.</p><hr></blockquote>Thank you MG <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />    I know there are lots of goodies in this, just the anticipation is killing alot of us (hopefully not dying from bugs hehe).

[Sunrayn]

<div></div><p>As the other tester said, you dont want it early.  If it had gone live before the other day, probably 25% of the population wouldnt have even been able to login.</p><p>That bug just got fixed in full last night.  What a nightmare.</p>

[Koehianna]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Porkchop133 wrote:<div></div><div></div><p>giving 5pp !</p><p>to the person that comes up with a better icon then that gawd awfull Halfling hiding his face icon Morr uses... every time i see it, it gives me the creeps...</p><p>lol...</p><p>LU#21</p><p>-<em>Due to popular demand Moorguard created a new icon to replace the villianous halfling he has used for years now...lol</em></p><p>:smileytongue:</p><hr></blockquote><p>If I'm not mistaken, that's actually a Barbarian from EQ1, the character model from the Luclin expansion.</p><p>Anyways...</p><p>Can anyone tell us if the betrayal quests are going live with LU#21?  Please oh please please omg please please omg omg please say it is.  I've waited too long for this and if I have to wait for the next LU I just might die.</p><p>Message Edited by Koehianna on <span class="date_text">03-16-2006</span><span class="time_text">03:21 PM</span></p>

[-Vanchelo]

<div>I would also love to get some information on betrayal quest, if I should get my hopes up or wait another month for it... <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Karioki]

<div></div><p>I'll be the Third Person to ask.  Will the new crafting system (aka crafting changes) for the remaining tiers be in LU 21?????????????????????????</p><p>Please answer Moorgard.</p><p> </p>

[Zaviur]

<div></div>Rangers feel your pain too we have been waiting TOOOOOO long for a fix.  (not as long as some classes i know)

[NViDiaFReaK]

<div></div><p>So adding to the pot....</p><p>Can we get a response on wether or not the crafting update is going into LU21 as has been speculatd</p>

[Kaknya]

<div></div><font color="#ffff00">It takes me about a week and a 1/2 to do 2 10 level ranges like 1-20.  So I'm expexcting these to be done in anyware ranging from 2 weeks to a month and a 1/2.  Depending on how long testing takes on them and when the next live update it could stretch that time a little longer.  This, rare t6 carpentry recipes, and outstanding bugs are currently on my plate for things to work on for a bit.</font> <div>Ben____________________________Mechanics Designer, EverQuest II____________________________</div><span><span class="date_text">03-01-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:27 PMthis was posted by Beghn march 1st,.. and with a time frame of 2 weeks, to a month and a half,.. i would say no,.. won't be in this update, and we haven't seen anything of this on Test as of yet either.</span></span><div></div>

[Rijacki]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Kaknya wrote:<div></div><font color="#ffff00">It takes me about a week and a 1/2 to do 2 10 level ranges like 1-20.  So I'm expexcting these to be done in anyware ranging from 2 weeks to a month and a 1/2.  Depending on how long testing takes on them and when the next live update it could stretch that time a little longer.  This, rare t6 carpentry recipes, and outstanding bugs are currently on my plate for things to work on for a bit.</font> <div>Ben____________________________Mechanics Designer, EverQuest II____________________________</div><span><span class="date_text">03-01-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:27 PMthis was posted by Beghn march 1st,.. and with a time frame of 2 weeks, to a month and a half,.. i would say no,.. won't be in this update, and we haven't seen anything of this on Test as of yet either.</span></span><div></div><hr></blockquote>Just as an aside... for the crafting changes.. jsut because it hasn't gone to Test doesn't mean it won't go Live at any time.  I -hope- it goes to Test first and that it is actually tested on Test for at least a week (preferably more) not to give a warning date, but to actually iron out some of the bugs that are bound to be there (not because Beghn is a bad coder but because it is a pretty substantial change).  BUT, it might not go to Test first because of the nature of some of the changes and the fact that there will be a demarkation of pre-LU# made items and post-.</span></div>

[Xaana]

<div></div><div>Test QA's say that the crafting changes won't be included in lu21.</div><p>Message Edited by masburrito on <span class="date_text">03-19-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:21 PM</span></p>

[kryysa2]

<div> I don't mind waiting for Updates(Live or regular) aslong as they are worth waiting for;Sucks waiting an jhour in the morning to find no changes made or just one about the dullness of a conversation between a rock and a grass blade;/</div><div> </div><div>  Surely there will be things added and fixed in LU21 that's worth waiting a cpl weeks for.</div>

[Hiro]

<div>well i figure we [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] because SOE pushes out content now they take their time to do it right and we [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn].</div>

[Elephant]

<div></div><p>I stopped playing my INQ until LU21 comes out.</p><p>This is ridiculous, I need AA, thus I need tons of small quests done - and I can't, cause it takes me forever to solo even even blue con no arrows mob :smileysad:</p>

[4lta]

<div></div><p>We are planning Live Update #21 for next week, tentatively March 22.</p><p>Though we fully intend to keep on offering frequent and significant updates to the game, we also plan to include additional polish time in our update cycles. That's the case here, where we gave LU21 an extra week of fixes and tweaks before it goes live.</p><p>===========================Steve Danuser, a.k.a. Moorgard.Game Designer, EverQuest II</p><p> LOL u gave a extra Week of testing and you guys still Messed up rangers that bad and still didnt know where we got our dmg !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do u guys ever read test server Info or the test boards must not .. hury get back to buffiing summoners more cause they arent enough Dps yet or do they not have enough utility wait maybe give more pets Oh snap u did any 1 can buy em from vendors !!</p>

[Kaharthemad]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>4lta wrote:<div></div><p> LOL u gave a extra Week of testing and you guys still Messed up rangers that bad and still didnt know where we got our dmg !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do u guys ever read test server Info or the test boards must not .. hury get back to buffiing summoners more cause they arent enough Dps yet or do they not have enough utility wait maybe give more pets Oh snap u did any 1 can buy em from vendors !!</p><hr></blockquote><div>Can you write in english please?  I have a 2nd grader that writes better. Lets see if I get the jist of it:</div><div> </div><div>You are upset about the Ranger nerf.</div><div>You feel Summoning classes get more help than you do.</div><div>You are lashing out towards them in order to vent the frustration you feel.</div><div> </div><div>Look I can understand your upset. Atleast they are fixing the change that has you so screwed up. I think I would have given you more credit had your sentence structure and grammer been in place.</div><div> </div><div><hr></div><div>Looking forward to this going live. I need my Umbral Attendant! Been a rough couple of weeks without him!</div><div></div>

[Kaknya]

 News flash.... Umbral attendants are back. Unfortunatly due to thier extended leave, and imbibed stupor, they are now afflicted with Halas Migraine. A master 2 that reduces intel, agi, str, and  constitution by 300, with a 5% chance to proc drunken brawl which increases strength by 150, but reduces intel to -5.<span>:smileyvery-happy:    <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span>    <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span></span><div></div>

[Elephant]

<div></div><p><font size="3">So is it coming out today or what?</font></p><p><font size="3">It's March 22nd</font></p>

[Zeijandi]

I thought these big updates happened on Thursdays.<div></div>

[Karioki]

<div></div><p>Sony has a real problem keeping its PAYING CUSTOMERS informed.  They tell us LU21 will happen on march 22nd.  Then the day arrives and not a peep from Sony or their uncaring reps.  No downtime at all and no mention of when the update will occur or when they will attempt to be ready with the update.</p><p>If I ran a business like this I would be cout of business soon.</p><p> </p>

[Magiocracy]

<span><blockquote><hr>Karioki wrote:<div></div><p>Sony has a real problem keeping its PAYING CUSTOMERS informed.  They tell us LU21 will happen on march 22nd.  Then the day arrives and not a peep from Sony or their uncaring reps.  No downtime at all and no mention of when the update will occur or when they will attempt to be ready with the update.</p><p>If I ran a business like this I would be cout of business soon.</p><p> </p><hr></blockquote>To be fair Moorgard said that it was 'tentatively' scheduled for March 22nd, so he did give himself some wriggle room, and since there was no official notice of downtime I personally assumed it wasn't going to happen today. Now I'm the last one to defend SOE but I'd much rather they take their time and get it right than push it to live before it's ready.I too want to see this update, but if they pushed it to live with issues like Scout stuns not working then we'd all be shouting at them for that as well, so you can't have it both ways.</span><div></div>

[Vlath]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div></div><p>We are planning Live Update #21 for next week, tentatively March 22.</p><p>Though we fully intend to keep on offering frequent and significant updates to the game, we also plan to include additional polish time in our update cycles. That's the case here, where we gave LU21 an extra week of fixes and tweaks before it goes live.</p><hr></blockquote>I take it "Tentatively" is the disclaimer being used here? Cuz its the 22nd, and no LU21.

[Roloc]

Man... cry about it if it is buggy... cry about it if it is late.. you guys sheesh. I am a fellow customer and I can see you are impossible to please.

[Blackguard]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Karioki wrote:<div></div><p>Sony has a real problem keeping its PAYING CUSTOMERS informed.  They tell us LU21 will happen on march 22nd.  Then the day arrives and not a peep from Sony or their uncaring reps.  No downtime at all and no mention of when the update will occur or when they will attempt to be ready with the update.</p><p>If I ran a business like this I would be cout of business soon.</p><hr></blockquote>Sorry, I was asleep. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> There are a couple of outstanding issues that we'd like to address before pushing Live Update #21 to live servers. We could very well have pushed it this morning, but we'd rather get it out there more polished than push it and immediately have to hotfix issues we already know about. Edit: I also was notified about this late last night, and thought I had posted something. It appears I must have either never submitted it or something happened when it was being submitted, so sorry for not letting you know as soon as I did.</span><div></div><p>Message Edited by Blackguard on <span class=date_text>03-22-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:40 AM</span>

[selch]

<div>May it be later than being it bad.</div><div> </div>

[Etherium]

<div></div>I must be in the minority.  I would rather see it be right than see it right now.

[Vlath]

<div></div>I too would rather it be right then rushed. Thanks for the update and for communicating. I think alot of classes, rangers especially, are full of anticipation for this Update and are just getting antsy, but I also believe most want it to be working as intended before its published. Just want to stay informed.

[Barakas]

<div></div><div>Thanks for the heads up.  It's the little things like a quick message that will keep most of us happy.</div>:smileyvery-happy:

[Tallika_Runwithbears]

...and then their are all the people watching their atomic clocks to see is stuff happens on the correct nanosecond and if it doent immediatly start freaking out.  cut these people some slack.  cause unlike you perfectionists they are only human.<div></div>

[nightlith]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Karioki wrote:<div></div><p>Sony has a real problem keeping its PAYING CUSTOMERS informed.  They tell us LU21 will happen on march 22nd.  Then the day arrives and not a peep from Sony or their uncaring reps.  No downtime at all and no mention of when the update will occur or when they will attempt to be ready with the update.</p><p>If I ran a business like this I would be cout of business soon.</p><p> </p><hr></blockquote>And if I ran a business that had to put up with the number of insulting personal attacks that flood these forums I wouldn't ever want to BE in business. If you guys had to file your complaints in person I'm sure we wouldn't see the amount of public outlash we see here. I play a class that's either been completely ignored or nerfed since the last combat revamp, and I'm probably just as frustrated as you, but that's no excuse to lash out just because you feel you have the anonymous right to.You want to attack the devs, go to Fan Faire and show me the true size of you cajones.</span></div>

[JoePa]

People like this are reasons why the Devs hate giving dates to begin with, they are damned if they do, damned if they don't.

[Ranger1017]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Karioki wrote:<div></div><p>Sony has a real problem keeping its PAYING CUSTOMERS informed.  They tell us LU21 will happen on march 22nd.  Then the day arrives and not a peep from Sony or their uncaring reps.  No downtime at all and no mention of when the update will occur or when they will attempt to be ready with the update.</p><p>If I ran a business like this I would be cout of business soon.</p><p> </p><hr></blockquote><p>Who said it would be on the 22nd? Oh, you mean, Moorgard? He didn't say that. He did say it was tentatively scheduled... perhaps he should have used smaller words, so that you would understand?</p><p> </p><!-- begin ahd4 --><!-- google_ad_region_start=def --><b>ten·ta·tive</b> <i>adj.</i><ol><li>Not fully worked out, concluded, or agreed on; provisional: tentative plans.</li><li>Uncertain; hesitant.</li></ol><p>It means that, at the time, it was possible it would have been the 22nd. Not by any means certain. If you must bash SOE or the devs, come up with a REAL reason to bash them, don't just make things up.</p><p>*definition provided by dictionary.com</p>

[Kraks_Aforty]

At least put in Halls of the Seeing and some of the fixes for Ascent.  We're bored to death here, if you hadn't noticed.<div></div>

[Korpo]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>nightlith wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr>Karioki wrote:<div></div><p>Sony has a real problem keeping its PAYING CUSTOMERS informed.  They tell us LU21 will happen on march 22nd.  Then the day arrives and not a peep from Sony or their uncaring reps.  No downtime at all and no mention of when the update will occur or when they will attempt to be ready with the update.</p><p>If I ran a business like this I would be cout of business soon.</p><p> </p><hr></blockquote>And if I ran a business that had to put up with the number of insulting personal attacks that flood these forums I wouldn't ever want to BE in business. If you guys had to file your complaints in person I'm sure we wouldn't see the amount of public outlash we see here. I play a class that's either been completely ignored or nerfed since the last combat revamp, and I'm probably just as frustrated as you, but that's no excuse to lash out just because you feel you have the anonymous right to.You want to attack the devs, go to Fan Faire and show me the true size of you cajones.</span></div><hr></blockquote>I'd take it a step further; if I ran the business, people that threw fits if the update wasn't in at the moment they demanded would be shown the door. People think paying $13 or whatever it is a month entitles them to demand whatever their stupid heart desires because they're a PAYING CUSTOMER. Next time you are at the grocery store try running down the aisles throwing cans everywhere. When they ask you to leave, just tell them you're a PAYING CUSTOMER and that means you can do whatever you want. Next time you're at a baseball game start throwing your beer and hotdog onto the field and running around screaming that you don't like the team. When they throw you out just tell them that you're a PAYING CUSTOMER and that allows you to act like a horse's rear all you want.SOE under Korpo's rule:<img src="http://www.rajobo.nl/images/soup_nazi.thumb.jpg">No game for you! Come back, one year!</span></div>

[Ceruline]

<div>I'd like to reiterate, coming from Test, that Blackguard is being quite truthful about the issues with this patch.</div><div> </div><div>Right now I have at least 4 skills which are totally nonfunctional in over 50% of the games zones.</div><div> </div><div>Autoattack can get totally broken so that unless you relog or zone, you simply will not do any AA damage.</div><div> </div><div>Coming from a CS background, I know that seemingly trivial bugs can end up being monsters that take a week of grinding away at.  As anxious as all of the Live players are for some of the fixes in this patch, I've been waiting nearly two weeks to be able to solo effectively again - and I'm lucky, as some classes cannot solo at all due to a few of the skill issues.  This isn't a complaint, as these issues are all part of playing on the Test server... I'm just trying to illustrate why it is that this patch isn't going Live on schedule.</div><div> </div><div> </div><div>Trust those of us who are currently playing the patch - this is a much, much better situation than rushing the patch out with the bugs it currently has.</div>

[Styk]

<div>SO no tweeks to the AA system? Once again another [Removed for Content] patch where sorcerors get left in the dust ( rangers cried hard and they got their fix within 1 LU but hell sorcerors are still waiting ) OH WAIT there is a "fix" ( i mean nerf ) to sorcerors, we are losing our only deagro spell in LU 21 ( who gives a crap about resistance increase etc when you get one shotted before you hit 30% )</div><div> </div><div>/sigh i dont know why im giving money to SOE still after all these years you would think i learned my lesson with Gates of Discord and the intial phukk up with the berserker class there...</div><div> </div><div>/sigh</div>

[Kraks_Aforty]

I think you miss some of the points.  The other poster didn't really verbalize it very well, mind you, but this expansion is severely lacking in content once you and your guild reach level 70.  LU21 isn't just a fix for a class problem here or there, it is more of a missing piece of a puzzle.  Look at it whatever way you want, but if I buy a puzzle and 1/3 of it is missing and on the box it says "Coming soon, the other 200 pieces!", yeah, I'm gonna expect it soon and on time, and I'm gonna expect to be kept well informed. Except, of course in this case, we're not even told there are missing pieces until we've bought the dang thing, put it together, and are left wondering where the poor kids' heads are.<div></div>

[Cirro]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Styker wrote:<div>SO no tweeks to the AA system? Once again another [Removed for Content] patch where sorcerors get left in the dust ( rangers cried hard and they got their fix within 1 LU<hr></div></blockquote><p>You're kidding, right?  Not only are rangers not getting fixed within 1 LU, assuming it ever gets installed, but this is a SMALL thing for SOLO rangers.   They STILL have NOT addressed the real issue about raid DPS!!!!  </p><p> </p>

[Kraks_Aforty]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Ceruline wrote:<div>I'd like to reiterate, coming from Test, that Blackguard is being quite truthful about the issues with this patch.</div><div> </div><div>Right now I have at least 4 skills which are totally nonfunctional in over 50% of the games zones.</div><div> </div><div>Autoattack can get totally broken so that unless you relog or zone, you simply will not do any AA damage.</div><div> </div><div>Coming from a CS background, I know that seemingly trivial bugs can end up being monsters that take a week of grinding away at.  As anxious as all of the Live players are for some of the fixes in this patch, I've been waiting nearly two weeks to be able to solo effectively again - and I'm lucky, as some classes cannot solo at all due to a few of the skill issues.  This isn't a complaint, as these issues are all part of playing on the Test server... I'm just trying to illustrate why it is that this patch isn't going Live on schedule.</div><div> </div><div> </div><div>Trust those of us who are currently playing the patch - this is a much, much better situation than rushing the patch out with the bugs it currently has.</div><hr></blockquote>rofl This doesn't make me wanna say "Way to go SOE!" it makes me wonder what incompitent people they have working on things that can't even keep the things that are working already functional.  That's a very bleak message you're sending us from Test.</span></div>

[Memran]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Etherium wrote:<div></div>I must be in the minority.  I would rather see it be right than see it right now.<hr></blockquote>Well I'd like both :p

[Cirro]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Kraks_Aforty wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr>Ceruline wrote:<div>I'd like to reiterate, coming from Test, that Blackguard is being quite truthful about the issues with this patch.</div><div> </div><div>Right now I have at least 4 skills which are totally nonfunctional in over 50% of the games zones.</div><div> </div><div>Autoattack can get totally broken so that unless you relog or zone, you simply will not do any AA damage.</div><div> </div><div>Coming from a CS background, I know that seemingly trivial bugs can end up being monsters that take a week of grinding away at.  As anxious as all of the Live players are for some of the fixes in this patch, I've been waiting nearly two weeks to be able to solo effectively again - and I'm lucky, as some classes cannot solo at all due to a few of the skill issues.  This isn't a complaint, as these issues are all part of playing on the Test server... I'm just trying to illustrate why it is that this patch isn't going Live on schedule.</div><div> </div><div> </div><div>Trust those of us who are currently playing the patch - this is a much, much better situation than rushing the patch out with the bugs it currently has.</div><hr></blockquote>rofl This doesn't make me wanna say "Way to go SOE!" it makes me wonder what incompitent people they have working on things that can't even keep the things that are working already functional.  That's a very bleak message you're sending us from Test.</span></div><hr></blockquote>Wow.   Yep, I'm with Kraks, aside from the obvious incompetence going on, why wouldn't Sony push out the obviously needed fixes, such as the incremental ranger de-nerfs, in a DAILY patch?   Why do the small and obviously needed changes get hung up with the obviously poorly coded items.   And why do I never see Sony hiring more programmers?  I love the 'You think you can do it better' line in the last posting.  [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] right I can.  After programming for 30 years, I obviously couldn't do any worse and I bet I could do a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] sight better than what we've seen.

[Ceruline]

<div></div><div>Look, it's not a matter of cheerleading anything.  In complex software, things will break when you make changes.  It's not even a matter of competence - once you're talking about a complicated enough system, you're going to be dealing with unanticipated consequences of any change.</div><div> </div><div>The fact of the matter is that for whatever reason one of the changes in this patch caused some issues which are obviously proving extremely nontrivial to get sorted out.  It happens constantly when it comes to software.   How many times has Longhorn been delayed?  How many games get release dates pushed back?  How many Blizzard games ever come close to shipping at their originally predicted date?  Are they *ALL* "incompitent"?</div><div> </div><div>Nope.  It's just the nature of the medium.</div><div> </div><div>The time to criticize is when the patches get pushed Live in spite of the reported bugs which haven't been fixed.</div>

[Karioki]

<div></div><p>First of all, I want to thank for Moorgaard for responding to my post.</p><p>I see my message touched some sore spots.  I absolutely agree that I would much rather have it right than on time.  My issue, which many seem to have missed, is a lack of communication.  I don't care if a release is on time.  I just want to know whether or not it is going to happen.  If you think a lack of posting about it on the server staus page is definitive you are wrong.  I remember servers going down with no warning whatsoever and no planned downtine announced on the status page.  To find out what is going on I have to sort through 4 or 5 different forums and then I cannot be sure I didn't miss the one post with the info.  If there had been updates in the "Live Update Notes" forum letting us know what is going on with the upcoming update you wouldn't have seen this post from me.</p><p>Say what you like I do not believe that my expectation to be informed is unreasonable and it is nothing like throwing cans around in the grocery store or ragging on the developers.  I was, at various times of a previous life a developer, QA leader and a program manager.  In all cases the focus was on the end user.</p><p> </p>

[Corwinus]

<div></div><p>Thanks for giving us some heads up Blackguard, but do you know now when this is going to go live? Tommorrow? Friday or next week on Wednesday? new ETA?</p><p>Regards,</p><p>Corwin Ranger 67 - Oasis</p>

[Blackguard]

We'd like to have everything fixed and tested today so LU #21 can hit live servers tomorrow (Thursday). <div></div>

[Trepan]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Kraks_Aforty wrote:<div><span>rofl This doesn't make me wanna say "Way to go SOE!" it makes me wonder what incompitent people they have working on things that can't even keep the things that are working already functional.  That's a very bleak message you're sending us from Test.</span></div><hr></blockquote>Every "new" feature in a system is going to introduce another permutation of tests that need to be performed.   Therefore, test times will increase overtime unless there is a system in place to say "This change does not effect X,Y and Z".However, a lot changes that are being done are to core methods and either do, or possibly could affect X, Y and Z (and A,B, C and LMNOP).So we have the following situation:1.  Managers and Customers screaming for fixes.2.  Industrialization trying to cover all highlights within the current release schedule.3.  Devs scrambling to not only get their assigned highlights complete, but to fix bugs in these highlights and take care of the regressions that are found.4.  Marketing setting dates that the expansions will be for sale in order to meet revenue expectations.5.  Team leads negotiating what can be dropped and fixed later because there's NO WAY IN HELL they're going to get everything done in the time allotted.This is the development cycle reality in large development shops.   Add the emergant behavior of a large code base.  Shake vigorously.Yes, it sucks all around.  The only people who don't end up suffering because of this environment are the ones that aren't in it - Marketeers, Higher level management looking at revenue projections and accuisition costs, and shareholders (whose influence is a completely different rant that normally drives me to foaming at the mouth and flopping around).Addendum:  The people making the decisions for what goes in are not the people who know how long it'll take.  And most of the time you don't know how long it'll take until after you've done it.  If you knew all the steps and all the processes, you'd have already done it.</span></div>

[Draughi]

<div></div>Is it possible to see the predator int line final AA to be not only melee proc but also a range proc?  Seems with the new changes to bows and the bow being  aprimary weapon of rangers, it would only be fitting.  Also, the proc on teh planar orb of the wanderer...states melee.  Can we see this on a ranged attack also.  I currently parse higher on melee than I do on ranged combat.  Would like these procs to be range/melee to keep rangers in line with the bow changes being primary autoattack weapons. 

[Corwinus]

<div></div><p>Again, thank you for your prompt answer Blackguard.</p><p>Be assured that despite of the rants here and there, 24hours delay, for most of us, is nothing if quality is met.</p><p>Regards,</p><p>Corwin Ranger 67 - Oasis</p>

[Uumuuanu]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Blackguard wrote:We'd like to have everything fixed and tested today so LU #21 can hit live servers tomorrow (Thursday).<div></div><hr></blockquote>BG,  watch the over use of the term EVERYTHING.    Thanks for the update though.

[Kraks_Aforty]

Thanks Blackguard, its nice to see a little sense of urgency from some of you from time-to-time.<div></div>

[ke'la]

<div></div>Wow.   Yep, I'm with Kraks, aside from the obvious incompetence going on,<b> <font color="#ff0000">why wouldn't Sony push out the obviously needed fixes, such as the incremental ranger de-nerfs, in a DAILY patch?</font> </b>  Why do the small and obviously needed changes get hung up with the obviously poorly coded items.   And why do I never see Sony hiring more programmers?  I love the 'You think you can do it better' line in the last posting.  [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] right I can.  After programming for 30 years, I obviously couldn't do any worse and I bet I could do a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] sight better than what we've seen.<hr size="2" width="100%">Maybe because they are the SORCE of the Bugs. As someone who troubleshoots broken systems for a living, the fact that the MAJOR bug currently being told to us has to do with SCOUT(yes ranger is a scout) STUNS. It very easy to see the connection between that bug and the RANGER DENERFS, therefor using your logic if the Buged/Poorly Coded iteam is in the Ranger Denerfs then maybe they should just hold back on the Ranger Denerfs and push the rest live.As to why you never see them hiring new programers. its because you are NOT PAYING ATTN. they had just a week or 2 ago a post talking about how they are hiring and that they are going to Software Devlopment Job Fairs looking for People.  BTW. MOST bussiness don't ADVERTISE when they are hiring as it show that they need workers and it puts tha company in a bad posision when negosiating wages.<div></div><p>Message Edited by ke'la on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">03:38 PM</span></p>

[Dajuuk]

<div>Wow, some of the people here have obviously never been in any kind of production environment.   "It takes as long as it takes" is one of the truisms of any kind of development.   If your an artist, predict the exact number of days its gonna take you to paint a masterpiece, compose a symphony, write a novel.  Any time you have an environment that involves creative people having to come up with an inspiration and then figure out how to form it into a medium you can't have definitive timelines.   The EQ2 dev team has some incredibly creative people on it (they would have to in order to come up with somethign as cool as the game) those people then have to form those creative ideas into code in order to make them come to life for us.   Would it have been nice to have seen a "LU21 has been postponed, more info to follow" post letting us know sure, but the fact that it was postponed is not proof of incompetance.</div><div> </div><div>Furthermore, Software companies when making any change usually do regression testing.   This testing phase is meant to determine if the fix broke any thing that was previously working.   That is because whenever you make a change to anything is a system it can have a consequental effect on ANY other part of the system.  The delays to fix the kind of problems reported by the testers is not indicative of bad development work.   But rather the delay proof of good testing. </div><div> </div><div> </div>

[TheAp0st]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><p>I'm going to try to limit this to constructive criticism despite a very deep seeded sense of dissapointment and frustration.</p><p>    First off, remember the 5 P's - Prior Planning Prevents (*Explicative haxxorred by - myself) Poor Performance..</p><p>I don't think a majority off the problems that are making people irrate stem from programming/bug issues, rather than a lack of attention paid to details of new content and changes to the game that are being released. You are making too many changes too quickly to various things that may never have needed to be changed in some instances before you think of the underlying consequences.  Lately you have been trying to revamp and alter the game to suite a very diverse and demanding current player base and also to make the game more appealing to potential new players. In attempting to do so large portions of the game have been altered from the origional structure and mechanics of what the game was origionally intended to be. These changes instead of complimenting gameplay, have actually been deminishing gameplay.</p><p>For starters, many portions of the game that were introductory to new players have either been altered or completely removed, such as adventure class/subclass and tradeskills. While immediately jumping into your chosen adventure class can be good to let a player know what it is they are going to be playing before wasting time on something they may not like, there is nothing there to show the player how to play that class, no basics or bread and butter if you will. Ok, i'm this class, but i have no idea what my purpose is or how i'm supposed benifit a group. Also, there have been many changes to classes due to popular demand for individuals to be able to solo effectively. Soloing is good, but when people go to group with others they have the mentality that they are still soloing and not grouped with others, wich in turn causes group mechanics to fail because the combat system i.e. spells and combat arts do not appropriately counterbalance when several people in the group play as if they were soloing. For example, a tank can't hold aggro (he can't keep up with the dps of other classes wich renders his taunts lacking) on multiple mobs and alot of times even one single mob because a dps class is going all out as if they are soloing and in turn somone else gets aggro or multiple people and then the healer with its slow cast times can't keep up with heals because one guy just got dropped in one hit and three others are rapidly taking massive damage.</p><p> Also with the spells/combats arts constantly being changed people either have a hard time adapting to the changes or flat out just don't like the changes and as far as that goes why fix what isnt broken. If a spell/combat is defective and isnt working as intended then yes it needs to be fixed, but completely altering it to be something other than it origionally was is completely problematic and then you face the problem as it stands today with a constant fluctuation in altering spells/combat arts.  And on to another huge issue I turn to tradeskill. the format for wich tradeskill works for tiers 1,2 and 7 have been completely altered while the other tiers have been left the same, wich makes an already confusing system into complete insanity especially for persons already not familiar with tradeskilling. The use of only raw materials to make a finished product definitely simplifies the process to make it easier, but not less time consuming or more enjoyable. To completely eradicate subcombines not only takes away from the sense of actually making something, but it also limits extra xp gain for first time pristines. Now you are left with needing a massive quantity of raw components which takes hours and hours of harvesting to aquire and a very monotonous and singular crafting progress that becomes very dull.  At least with some amount of subcombines it breaks up the monotony with making things that are a bit faster to crank out.  Also with the the components from which spells are crafted the addition of loam to make fighter spells and only one type of precious stone to make the rest is problematic, especially when concerning rares. It makes one rare almost worthless while making two rares almost unattainable and stifles players from getting upgrades they need.</p><p>Another big issue and i think this one is probably the most important is the quality of tier7 player crafted goods. The dropped gear in tier7 is better if not far greater than any player crafted goods, even rare crafted items. honestly the rares items are terrible because the lack of a decent amount of mitigation and a total lack of versus/resists and the common gear is just flat out garbage. the change of legendary to treasured was a bad idea in so much as it creates alot of confusion and more importantly reduces the importance of tradeskillers and almost eliminates the point to tradeskilling entirely. While more nice dropped gear in the game is nice, player crafted rare items should be at least the equivilant to if not slightly better in some way than any dropped legendary item.  I do like that good gear drops off mobs and i would like to see more of it and more randomly off just any mob rather than a named or epic mob. I see that this is happening to an extent, but i think it should be expanded upon more spell/gear drops spread out more randomly, and this is a good thing because not everyone belongs to a super duper raiding guild and would like to actually have the ability to come across a couple of nice upgrades for there character. But in doing this give artisans a fighting chance at making at least gear of the same quality so that people have a reason to buy player crafted goods and players still have a reason to even bother tradeskilling. </p><p> There are other issues that i think could be improved, but i think i've gotten a bulk of some of the more important issues across. Don't get me wrong there are alot of things about the game that i do enjoy very much, but some of these issues make the game far less than what it could and should be. Give us a reason why we should be playing THIS game you know. Involve us, let us know that you care about what WE the players want and genuinly show a sense of concern about our issues with problems with the game. You have to stop looking at it from the perspective of a corporation merely supplying customers with a product and start looking at it from the perspective of a gamer who wants to be completely immersed in your game and when they have finished playing for the day are still captivated by the grand adventure they had and look forward even more so to continuing that adventure. There is a large society of people that has developed here playing this game, friends, family, and people who have yet to meet all counting on you to make this THE gaming experience for them. Don't let us down.</p><p>Message Edited by TheAp0stle on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:11 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by TheAp0stle on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:21 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by TheAp0stle on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:26 PM</span></p>

[nightlith]

I think you need to add a 6th P to that...Paragraphs.<div></div>

[Kraks_Aforty]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>TheAp0stle wrote:<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><p>I'm going to try to limit this to constructive criticism despite a very deep seeded sense of dissapointment and frustration.</p><p>    First off, remember the 5 P's - Prior Planning Prevents (*Explicative haxxorred by - myself) Poor Performance..</p><p>I don't think a majority off the problems that are making people irrate stem from programming/bug issues, rather than a lack of attention paid to details of new content and changes to the game that are being released. You are making too many changes too quickly to various things that may never have needed to be changed in some instances before you think of the underlying consequences.  Lately you have been trying to revamp and alter the game to suite a very diverse and demanding current player base and also to make the game more appealing to potential new players. In attempting to do so large portions of the game have been altered from the origional structure and mechanics of what the game was origionally intended to be. These changes instead of complimenting gameplay, have actually been deminishing gameplay.</p><p>For starters, many portions of the game that were introductory to new players have either been altered or completely removed, such as adventure class/subclass and tradeskills. While immediately jumping into your chosen adventure class can be good to let a player know what it is they are going to be playing before wasting time on something they may not like, there is nothing there to show the player how to play that class, no basics or bread and butter if you will. Ok, i'm this class, but i have no idea what my purpose is or how i'm supposed benifit a group. Also, there have been many changes to classes due to popular demand for individuals to be able to solo effectively. Soloing is good, but when people go to group with others they have the mentality that they are still soloing and not grouped with others, wich in turn causes group mechanics to fail because the combat system i.e. spells and combat arts do not appropriately counterbalance when several people in the group play as if they were soloing. For example, a tank can't hold aggro (he can't keep up with the dps of other classes wich renders his taunts lacking) on multiple mobs and alot of times even one single mob because a dps class is going all out as if they are soloing and in turn somone else gets aggro or multiple people and then the healer with its slow cast times can't keep up with heals because one guy just got dropped in one hit and three others are rapidly taking massive damage.</p><p> Also with the spells/combats arts constantly being changed people either have a hard time adapting to the changes or flat out just don't like the changes and as far as that goes why fix what isnt broken. If a spell/combat is defective and isnt working as intended then yes it needs to be fixed, but completely altering it to be something other than it origionally was is completely problematic and then you face the problem as it stands today with a constant fluctuation in altering spells/combat arts.  And on to another huge issue I turn to tradeskill. the format for wich tradeskill works for tiers 1,2 and 7 have been completely altered while the other tiers have been left the same, wich makes an already confusing system into complete insanity especially for persons already not familiar with tradeskilling. The use of only raw materials to make a finished product definitely simplifies the process to make it easier, but not less time consuming or more enjoyable. To completely eradicate subcombines not only takes away from the sense of actually making something, but it also limits extra xp gain for first time pristines. Now you are left with needing a massive quantity of raw components which takes hours and hours of harvesting to aquire and a very monotonous and singular crafting progress that becomes very dull.  At least with some amount of subcombines it breaks up the monotony with making things that are a bit faster to crank out.  Also with the the components from which spells are crafted the addition of loam to make fighter spells and only one type of precious stone to make the rest is problematic, especially when concerning rares. It makes one rare almost worthless while making two rares almost unattainable and stifles players from getting upgrades they need.</p><p>Another big issue and i think this one is probably the most important is the quality of tier7 player crafted goods. The dropped gear in tier7 is better if not far greater than any player crafted goods, even rare crafted items. honestly the rares items are terrible because the lack of a decent amount of mitigation and a total lack of versus/resists and the common gear is just flat out garbage. the change of legendary to treasured was a bad idea in so much as it creates alot of confusion and more importantly reduces the importance of tradeskillers and almost eliminates the point to tradeskilling entirely. While more nice dropped gear in the game is nice, player crafted rare items should be at least the equivilant to if not slightly better in some way than any dropped legendary item.  I do like that good gear drops off mobs and i would like to see more of it and more randomly off just any mob rather than a named or epic mob. I see that this is happening to an extent, but i think it should be expanded upon more spell/gear drops spread out more randomly, and this is a good thing because not everyone belongs to a super duper raiding guild and would like to actually have the ability to come across a couple of nice upgrades for there character. But in doing this give artisans a fighting chance at making at least gear of the same quality so that people have a reason to buy player crafted goods and players still have a reason to even bother tradeskilling. </p><p> There are other issues that i think could be improved, but i think i've gotten a bulk of some of the more important issues across. Don't get me wrong there are alot of things about the game that i do enjoy very much, but some of these issues make the game far less than what it could and should be. Give us a reason why we should be playing THIS game you know. Involve us, let us know that you care about what WE the players want and genuinly show a sense of concern about our issues with problems with the game. You have to stop looking at it from the perspective of a corporation merely supplying customers with a product and start looking at it from the perspective of a gamer who wants to be completely immersed in your game and when they have finished playing for the day are still captivated by the grand adventure they had and look forward even more so to continuing that adventure. There is a large society of people that has developed here playing this game, friends, family, and people who have yet to meet all counting on you to make this THE gaming experience for them. Don't let us down.</p><p>Message Edited by TheAp0stle on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:11 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by TheAp0stle on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:21 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by TheAp0stle on <span class="date_text">03-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:26 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>A lot o this I agree with.  Only a few class mechanics were really still "broken" by the end of T6, yet some classes (Rangers mainly) were worked over so badly they are nearly useless.  Just leave things alone for a bit, give people a real chance to see how things are and say "Yeah, this sucks, please fix".  So much of the game is changed every month in a "Live Update" that you can never truely get a pulse of what is going on.</span></div>

[Lornick]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>TheAp0stle wrote:<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><p>the change of legendary to treasured was a bad idea in so much as it creates alot of confusion and more importantly reduces the importance of tradeskillers and almost eliminates the point to tradeskilling entirely. <font color="#ff3300">While more nice dropped gear in the game is nice, player crafted rare items should be at least the equivilant to if not slightly better in some way than any dropped legendary item.</font> </p><hr></blockquote><p>Wow, that's a mouthful.  I agree with a number of the things your saying.  Player perception is very important.  With teir 7 alot of loot that is pretty uber is flagged as treasured or legendary that would previously be labeled fabled.  Alot of complaints would disappear if rare harvested and rare crafted items were labed 'legendary' even if the stats didn't change. </p><p>I disagree that rare crafted stuff should be better than *any* dropped legendary gear.  It's all well and good to give the crafters a reasonable market to sell their wares, but adventurers should have the means to acquire some great gear w/o raids or crafters so long as the challenge is fitting. </p><p>Halls of Fate is a good example.  A rag-tag group simply won't succeed there.  I see no reason why I shouldn't be rewarded with something better for my adventure than I could get mining a rare and paying a tradeskiller 40g.  I promise, Halls of Fate takes more effort.  The key is balance.  I shouldn't necessarily be able to outfit myself entirely with quested or adventure loot better then what the tradeskillers can make with rares, but I feel I should be able to get over half my stuff that way.</p>

[Verit]

Hello, Blackguard.There is a thing i dont understand.There is no more live dev team?LU21 is just a fix patch.Nothing new.No more <u><b>adventure pack</b></u>, no more <u><b>live event</b></u>, no more <b><u>new features</u></b> in LUs.In DoF, a lot of things are still not corrected.Where is the live dev team?

[Magiocracy]

Look at SWG with it's CU then NGE. Look at EQ2 with it's CC (LU13). Look at the frequent radical changes to functionality with each LU. Incremental change has never ever been SOE's way of doing things.What disturbs me is that frequent fundamental changes give an impression of a company with no real vision of how they want the game to be. It's as if SOE is constantly flailing around, lurching from one radical change to another in a sort of random effort to make things right.<div></div>

[Murchik]

<div></div><p>so, let me get this straight, they are fixing things now that went live broken with the release of KOS?</p><p>beta, what's that?</p>

[Elephant]

<div></div><div>So, it's 23rd... is LU21 coming out today, or delayed again?</div><div>There are no announcements on servers downtime, so looks like it slips again :smileysad:</div><div> </div><div>Can't Sony already push whatever is done, and then hotfix the remaining parts?</div><div>I mean, there are so hundreds of changes that many people wait - and they all are getting delayed of one or two stupid problems that may only affect less than 1% of people?? I don't undertstand this...</div><p>Message Edited by Elephanton on <span class="date_text">03-23-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:38 AM</span></p>

[tariq0]

it really doesn't matter to me. I don't group with scouts ,unless there is no one else to group with anyways.Every other class can offer anything that scouts have and plus. So i will still rather have mage , fighters and priests in my group.Scouts only , if i really cannot find mages LFG .But that never happened so far <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Handleba]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>tariq071 wrote:it really doesn't matter to me. I don't group with scouts ,unless there is no one else to group with anyways.Every other class can offer anything that scouts have and plus. So i will still rather have mage , fighters and priests in my group.Scouts only , if i really cannot find mages LFG .But that never happened so far <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div><hr></blockquote>Wow, you really need to rethink your grouping strategy.  Why on earth would you group with mages only and not scouts?</span></div>

[Fennir]

maybe he doesnt like finding nameds outside of instances<div></div>

[Ultimatum]

Ummmm Brigands and Swashies have crazy short term debuffs that noone else has, Bards have great utility in group buffs, aggro transfer, and debuffs, Assassins have aggro transfers, Rangers still have the highest single target DPS in the game, all scouts have great DPS capabilities, and Scouts are the only class that can use poisons and disarm traps...."<span>Every other class can offer anything that scouts have and plus."  Sorry but I have to call BS on that one.</span><div></div>

[Corwinus]

<div></div><p>Good, stay that way buddy, Scouts hardly want to group with ignorant dismissive people.</p><p>Corwin Ranger 67 - Oasis</p><p> </p>

[tariq0]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Razerblaze wrote:Ummmm Brigands and Swashies have crazy short term debuffs that noone else has, Bards have great utility in group buffs, aggro transfer, and debuffs, Assassins have aggro transfers, Rangers still have the highest single target DPS in the game, all scouts have great DPS capabilities, and Scouts are the only class that can use poisons and disarm traps...."<span>Every other class can offer anything that scouts have and plus."  Sorry but I have to call BS on that one.</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>Other classes have aggro transfer , mages have DPS , group or single either way , disarm traps ..i agree on that one. Don't deny it ,just saying in a long run thats not as usefull to group that i'm in (i'm saying to me not to game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ) as having 2 diferent types of mage over mage and scout .Again , this is for groups that i'm in and it is not statement of overall scouts need in a game.My buddies and me found our groups more efficient that way for us .was just pointing out that it doesn't matter to me when and how they going to change them <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></div>

[Styk]

<div>You mean other classes have agro buffs ( like a coercer ) and an agro siphon ( like a paladin ) .... Yet classes like Warlocks have no real way in shedding agro ( since our major damage is based on AE's )  adding insult to injury we are losing our only deagro spell in LU 21 ( i guess SOE thinks that our INT line is sufficent deagro ROFLMAO, oh wait rank 8 for the 2nd to the last ability is only 10% agro reduction and the last ability [ concussive blasts ] is BROKEN atm )</div><div> </div><div>Yes SoE logical thinking indeed</div>

[Kraks_Aforty]

Awesome.  Fixed some solo stuff in Desert of Flames.  Man, that is exactly what this game needed.  Forget about fixing Ascent or putting in Halls of the Seeing.  That stuff is poppycock!<div></div>

[Handleba]

LU #21 is in and the notes are up.Oh yeah, and your mage hits about twice as hard after I debuff the mob.<div></div>

[Shiss]

<div></div>Dont See anything on site about LU #21 being in??  so it is on patch notes as you log in yes?

[Handleba]

Yes, and here it is:<span class="headline">Update Notes :<i> 3/23/2006 7:00 AM</i></span><p>*** Headlines ***- Expansion Reward: Receive bonus veteran reward time for owning Kingdom of Sky! - Norrathian merchants now carry a more specialized selection of goods! - See your zone reuse timers in a handy new window! - Ranged auto-attack now does more damage!*** Veteran Rewards ***- If you own Kingdom of Sky, you will receive 90 days added to your Account Age, which is used to determine which Veteran Rewards you are eligible for.- It's our way of saying thanks to those of you who are enjoying our expansion.*** Merchants ***- Norrath's merchants have decided to update their inventories in order to better appeal to their customers.- Merchants have been given more appropriate purpose tags with corresponding merchandise to match their tags.- Clutter in their inventories has been reduced. Merchants (except for spells, arts, and ammo) will now only show the items within your current 10 level range, as well as the range before (19 levels worth). For spells, arts, and ammo, you will not see the items until you hit that level, but will always see them thereafter.- New items have been created for merchants both pre-level 20 and post-level 50 and added to the merchants.*** Kingdom of Sky ***- Completing quests that are level 60 to 70 now provides greater XP.- Level 70 adventurers will now earn Achievement XP at an improved rate.- A number of creatures in Tenebrous Tangle have become aware of invaders and will be more intent on spotting hidden enemies. Some creatures have learned to help others in danger in order to increase their survivability.- Defeating contested epic mobs in KoS zones should now award appropriate status points.- Heroic and Epic named encounters now have a better chance to drop Master spells and rare tradeskill components.- Penny Dreadful should now let you know she is a merchant when mousing over her.- Many of the Heroic Boss and Named creatures in the Bonemire have received further specialized training.- The Trials of the Awakened now provide better XP, although significantly less than normal dungeon XP. These zones are meant for quest updates, not XP hunting.- Mystical and Planar orbs should now work properly.- Learn more about the Bonemire's ravasects with "Into the Hive."- If you evac or revive in Palace of the Awakened, you will now appear at the entrance to the zone.- Some modifications have been made to the Hurricanus encounter.- Frightlings in the Tenebrous Tangle should no longer drop Sky Essences.- The zone reuse timer for Nest of the Great Egg will now initiate when you kill the first named creature rather than when you first enter.- Portal Guard Graliz is now on full-time duty in the Sanctum of the Scaleborn; however, he doesn’t always carry something of value.- Green Hood Thorn continues the Infiltrating the Sanctum adventures with "Shadow Ordinance," and gives a bonus epilogue quest once you have finished the series.- Those who deleted the Disk of Bylze can now receive a new one if they completed the quest "Burglars Afoot."- Players who completed "An Appetite for Palace Knights" before completing stage 1 of "The Maidens' Reception" can now reexamine the Maiden of Theer statue to complete the first stage.- Those who have acquired the multiplicitome can now read it to begin a new quest.- Achievement experience is now awarded from collectible books in the Kingdom of Sky.*** Desert of Flames ***- Some of the solo encounters in Desert of Flames have been made slightly more challenging and will now provide bonus experience when defeated.- Additional power has been discovered and unlocked within the Scepter of Rahotep.- Items from the Poet's Palace that were previously labeled Fabled are now Legendary (though the items themselves have not changed).- The goblin diplomatic papers in Pillars of Flame will now respawn faster.- Undead creatures within the area will not respawn for a short period of time after the Godking dies.- The medallions needed to start the Ring of Fate quest are now dropped as corpse loot rather than in a treasure chest.- The knife boxes in the court clubhouse instances will no longer give the quest to change tower factions for level 65+ players.*** The Bloodline Chronicles ***- The power of traps found on the vases and coffins in the Bloodline Chronicles have weakened with age.*** Achievements ***- Cleric: Yaulp now also affects double attack and the ability no longer has a limited duration.- Druid: Shapeshift's Tiger Bite damage has been increased. The Fury version now follows the same stacking rules as the Warden- Druid: The Shapeshift achievement should now stack with the Warden wolf form line of spells.- Druid: Animal Charm now gives a visual warning when charm breaks, and 3 seconds of mesmerization on the target after the charm has broken.- Enchanter: Mana Flow can be cast on you or allies in a raid, no longer has the under 10% power requirement, had its reuse increased to 60 seconds, has a 30 second duration, causes the enchanter to sacrifice 10% health/power, it will give the enchanter and ally a 10% power gain upon expiration.- Enchanter: Hypnosis now gives a visual warning when charm breaks, and 3 seconds of mesmerization on the target after the charm has broken.- Mystic: Attendant Spells will properly update heal ticks every 3 seconds.- Paladin: The third ability in the paladin wisdom line now has the proper skill increase amount.- Predator: Bounty now has greater variances in the coin reward, had its reuse timer reduced to 3 minutes, and cannot be collected on green con or weaker opponents.- Predator: Perfectionist now has a 5% additional damage bonus for combat arts that qualify.- Predator: Point Blank Shot's duration is now affected by upgrades.- Rogue: Formation's health increase percentage has been corrected.- Rogue: Lunge Reversal is now a toggled ability that refreshes itself automatically.- Rogue: Pick Pocket now has greater variances in the coin reward, had its reuse timer reduced to 30 seconds, has an increased chance of success, will not attempt to cast on a target that has already been pick pocketed, and the taunt effect now scales with level.- Shaman: The Crippling Bash pet proc now works properly..- Shaman: The Spirit Wolf pet's attack speed has increased.- Sorcerer: Freehand Sorcery's duration has been increased.- Summoner: Wild Channeling's critical damage percentage has been corrected for what is appropriate for the class.version.- Warrior: The third ability in the warrior intelligence line has been renamed to Slayer's Speed.- Warrior: Buckler Reversal is now a toggled ability that refreshes itself automatically.- Wizard: Static Shield has been increased in damage and grants a small chance to block when a Symbol is equipped in the secondary slot.*** Player-versus-Player ***- You can now view the PvP and PvE effects of a spell in a similar manner to how item tooltips can be compared.- City PvP has been renamed to Carnage PvP to better describe its nature.- The viral effect of Carnage PvP will no longer restart its timer as you fight another player. Instead, it fades after 15 minutes as long as you aren't currently hated by another player.- You can now mentor only in instances on PvP servers.- Carnage PvP-flagged players will no longer have an immunity timer after zoning.- Inquisitor: Verdict will now work on players whose health is between 0 and 10%.- Defiler: Defile will now kill a character that is unconscious.*** Gameplay ***- You will be ejected from non-controllable mounts (griffons, carpets, clouds) if it doesn't begin to move within 10 seconds.- Group lotto now shows you the rolls you make vs. the rolls your groupmates make when distributing loot.- You now must wait until you are not flying in order to choose achievements and traits.- Camping using /camp [character name] should work more reliably.*** Items ***- Bows and projectile weapons should now do similar damage to melee weapons during auto-attack, making ranged auto-attack just as viable an alternative as melee auto-attack.- All thrown weapons and arrows can no longer be used from level 1. You must be within 3 levels of the level of the projectile to use it.- Kite shields at all levels now provide the same chance to block as tower shields (12%).- Round shields of all levels now provide a consistent chance to block (8%).- The Thulian Butcher Blade has an updated appearance.- Shimmering Wand of Glass is now categorized as a one-handed staff.- The proc on the Enspelled Vultak Eye should now work correctly.- The color of Xhaviz's Gown of Glory has been changed to differentiate it from the Skywatcher robe.- The amount of power returned by the proc on Xhaviz's Gown of Glory has been reduced.- Hoo'Loh's Illusory Hat's can now only be used by those level 67 and higher, the same as the other hats awarded from the quest.- The trim color of Hoo'Loh's Witchy Hat is now different from the Wizardly Hat.- Hoo'Loh's Witchy Hat & Hoo'Loh's Wizardly Hat now give +5 disruption and +3 subjugation.- The Blood of the Brood quest should now update more frequently when killing centurions & dreadknights.- The proc chance on the Mystical Orbs of the Healer/Invoker have been increased.- The Boots of Bashing have an updated appearance.- The use effect on the Antivenom Hypo Bracer and the Antivenom Hypo Wristband should now work correctly for all classes.- Wind-Etched Armguards are now usable by druids only.- Buckler of the Scholar is now only usable by priest classes.- Spaulders of the Combatant now give a bonus to defense instead of deflection. - Staff of Spectral Fury's proc has been changed to "Power of Hidden Refuge," which has a chance to heal its wielder.- Shroud of Darkness now provides a lower INT bonus to better match the challenge needed to obtain it.- Necklace of the Cascade no longer gives +1 to stamina. To compensate for this horrendous nerf, we have increased its power bonus.- The Twin Calamities proc should now work correctly.- The Acrid Mantle now has an appropriate appearance.- The proc on the Manacles of Dark Sky will now process less frequently and has a slightly shorter duration.*** Quests **- Leelee Brewbubble has returned to Zek, the Orcish Wastes to conclude any dealings that remained unfinished.- Dovan Farfall is once more in Everfrost, looking for those who once offered to share their knowledge with him.- The red, blue, green, and white shards needed for "An Eye For Power" have been made into harvestable objects that allow 6 harvests. Additionally, the respawn time on these shards has been reduced, and the likelihood of Master Webclaw and Bloodrage spawning has been slightly increased.- "Infiltrating the Sanctum: Emissary Kvikz" can now be completed without having inactive listening crystals for those who didn't receive them.- The book cover for Teachings of Master Wu can now be found on an interactive object within the Sanctum of the Scaleborn as well as the current chest drop.- "A Cured Gingus" now offers an item reward for Templars and Inquisitors.*** Zones and Population ***- The guards outside of the Oracle tower have been bought off! They should no longer attack Freeport-aligned players.- Some guards in Freeport have been assigned new posts or were replaced with less seasoned guards.- Vakiza Skinner has returned to Big Bend.- Brush constrictors in the Feerrott now have a greater chance to spawn.- The door to Everling's bedroom should now open if you have completed the Everling Lockets quest.- A new zone connection has been added between the Down Below and the Caves.- Nemar Gadgetglow will no longer give the "updates quest" icon before he will actually update your quest.- Placing the golem hearts in the tikis when inside the Sanctum of Fear will now only consume a single heart per tiki no matter how many you have in your inventory.- The Freeport Militia members have once again been reinforced with veteran troops.- Giants needed for bottle shards for the Bastion of Flames access quest should now give up those shards more frequently. Also, the amount of soulslaver essences needed to fill the bottle has been reduced.- Briarpaw cubs and grove badgers have been seen in greater numbers in the Enchanted Lands.*** Tradeskills ***- Level 60-70 fighter scroll recipes now provide Porous Loam when slagged.*** Combat ***- All Priests and Mages now do greater auto-attack damage when weapons are equipped.- All level 62 creature mastery abilities that were called "Draconian" have been renamed "Droag."- Fighter and scout classes will now turn on auto-attack when casting damage spells (in the same way this occurs when casting damage arts).- When you evac, creature hate will be wiped before you transport to the new location so they will no longer chase you after the evac.- Attempting to start a Heroic Opportunity while another one is active will give a message instead of triggering the HO starter's reuse timer.- All charm spells should now cancel automatically if the charmed entity dies.- Changes to multi-wave ring events:  * If you engage a multi-wave ring event, kill some of its members, and then let it reset by running away or wiping, you now have 5 minutes to defeat that encounter or it will reset--even if it is currently engaged.  * If you engage a multi-wave ring event and /yell for help or otherwise break the encounter before defeating it, the encounter will reset after 2 minutes to the same stage it was on before it was broken.  * Ring events should no longer spontaneously reset every two minutes after they have been broken and have fully reset.Assassin changes:- Slaughter had its range fixed to 5m instead of 50m.Berserker changes:- Juggernaut's penalties no longer increase as the art is upgraded.- Insolent Gibe will no longer initially cast onto other players in the area.- Reckless Aide will now expire if the ally it was cast on is no longer present. The target must now be another player.Brawler changes:- Bruiser and Monk primary offensive and combination stances each increase slashing and piercing skill.Brigand- Double Up now makes use of the quality tier of the duplicated spell. Upgrades to Double Up improve its overall effectiveness, and using upgraded versions of duplicated spells will allow abilities of the same line to be used.- Amazing Reflexes will not automatically remove itself when damage is received. Instead, the AOE avoidance effect is disabled for 30 seconds.Bruiser changes:- Crash's knockdown effect no longer affects epic creatures.- Staggering Stance will now expire if the ally it was cast on is no longer present. The target must now be another player.- Close Mind's duration is now determined by the quality tier of the spell. The Master I version is required to achieve the full duration.Coercer changes:- Reek of Terror now has no power cost, a 5 minute reuse timer instead of 15, is no longer a reactive spell, and casts a point blank AoE hate reduction and fear.- Charm spells now give a visual warning when charm breaks, and 3 seconds of mesmerization on the target after the charm has broken.Conjuror changes:- Stoneskin now has no power cost, a 5 minute reuse timer instead of 15, and fires a point blank AoE hate decrease.Defiler changes:- The damage and power cost has increased for the Greater Imprecation spell line.- The reuse timer for Aphotic Touch has been reduced.- Summon Spirit Companion now summons a creature with a different appearance than the Mystic version.Dirge changes:- Oration of Sacrifice can now be cast on raid members.Guardian changes:- Stand Firm will now expire if the ally it was cast on is no longer present. The target must now be another player.Illusionist changes:- Barrier of Intellect now has no power cost, a 5 minute reuse timer instead of 15, is no longer a reactive spell, and casts a point blank AoE hate reduction and mesmerize.- Prismatic Havoc can now be cast on raid members.Inquisitor changes:- The damage and power cost has increased for the Invocation spell line.- Writhe's damage has increased.- The reuse timer for Litany of Agony has been reduced.- Verdict's preparation time has been reduced from 2.5 to 1.5 seconds.Monk changes:- Martial Order will now expire if the ally it was cast on is no longer present. The target must now be another player.- Tsunami's duration is now determined by the quality tier of spell. The Master I version is required to achieve the full duration.Mystic changes:- The damage and power cost has increased for the Chilling Wind spell line.- The power cost for casting Fever has been reduced.- Bolster can now be cast on raid members.Necromancer changes:- Deathly Pallor now has no power cost and a 5 minute reuse timer instead of 15.- The Scout Pet will now use the proper combat arts more consistently and will correctly gain a new combat art at level 60.Paladin changes:- Reverent Sacrament now summons the correct devout essence item.- Ancient Pledge will now expire if the ally it was cast on is no longer present. The target must now be another player.- Demonstration of Faith can now be cast on raid members.Ranger changes:- Leg Shot had its damage increased and no longer has a double chance to dispel when taking damage.- Bleeding Cut's DoT damage has increased.- Steady Aim's reuse timer has been reduced, and it now increases ranged critical hit chances.- Trick Shot had its casting time reduced and damage increased.- Rip had its damage increased.- Miracle Shot had its damage increased.- Lunge was changed from a DoT to a combination melee attack + very short duration root.- Reclaimed Arrows has the makeshift arrows set to the correct level of 60.- Trick Shot's icon has been changed to differentiate it from Leg Shot.Shadowknight changes:- Sickening Circle will no longer heal the target for 1 hit point when it is critically applied.- Evasive Tactics will now expire if the ally it was cast on is no longer present. The target must now be another player.- Infernal Blessing can now be cast on raid members.Templar changes:- The damage and power cost has increased for the Smite spell line.- The damage and power cost has increased for the Light Strike spell line.- Combative Faith's damage has increased.- The reuse timer for Beams of Faith has been reduced.- Reverence can now be cast on raid members.- Sanctuary's duration is now determined by the quality tier of the spell. The Master I version is required to achieve the full duration.Troubador changes:- Bria's Infatuating Sonnet can no longer charm creatures that should not be charmed. The dismiss command now also works properly.- Jester's Cap can now be cast on raid members.Warden changes:- Tranquility can now be cast on raid members.Warlock changes:- Nullmail now toggles, has no power cost, a 5 minute reuse timer instead of 15, triggers when the caster drops below 30% health, applies a powerful resistance buff and dodge change, and no longer has a hate reduction or reactive lifetap.- Dark Nebula should now stack appropriately with the necromancer's Torrential Plague.- Multiple warlocks can now properly spawn Dark Infestation broodlings on a target.Wizard changes:- Mail of Frost now toggles, has no power cost, a 5 minute reuse timer instead of 15, triggers when the caster drops below 30% health, applies a more powerful ward than before, and no longer has a hate reduction or snare effect.*** Tradeskills ***- The following sets of crafted armor have had their stats adjusted to include resistances: Adamantine Vanguard, Xegonite Vanguard, Adamantine Devout, Xegonite Devout, Adamantine Plate, Xegonite Plate, Adamantine Melodic, Xegonite Melodic, Adamantine Chainmail, Xegonite Chainmail, Adamantine Brigandine, Xegonite Brigandine, Adamantine Reverent, Xegonite Reverent, Tailored Windcloth, Tailored Dragon's Breath, Tailored Horned Leather, Tailored Dragonhide.- The stats have been adjusted for Pristine Imbued Adamantine Chainmail Coats.- The stats have been adjusted for Pristine Forged Xegonite Devout Armor pierces.- The stats have been adjusted for Forged Xegonite Melodic Mantles.- The recipe for Iced Black-Eye Chai will now produce Iced Black Eye Chais correctly.- There is now a recipe for Spectral Ward.- There is now a recipe for Wards of Spirit.- There is now a recipe for Winds of Renewal.- There is now a recipe for Rune of Stalk.- Level 1-50 Culinary harvestables now stack to 50.- Level 1-50 Harvested Gems now stack to 50.- Level 60-70 poisons will now have the appropriate icons when they land on an NPC.- The recipe for making "Winter's Sting" spell scrolls will now make "Solar Flame," which is the spell that the old spell was replaced with.*** Art ***- Emotes will now play correctly while on a mount.*** User Interface ***- There is now a window that shows your current reuse timers on instanced zones. You can access the window with the /togglezonereuse command, or via a button in the Persona window.- The Details tab of the Persona window now has a row of buttons that open many of the windows containing useful character information, such as the Guild and Zone Reuse windows.- The Options menu now allows you to determine when you see item comparison tooltips. Under User Interface->Tooltips->Item Tooltips->Comparison Tooltips, you can select Never, Always, If ALT is pressed, or If CONTROL is pressed. Note: If you modified your eq2.ini file to disable comparision tooltips, the above options correspond to "cl_chain_tooltips 0|1|2|3".- The Guild window can now be set to allow or filter chat announcements when a member gains an Achievement level.- The Friends list and Community window no longer display a zone name when the friend is /anon or /role.- A display issue making it appear as if your attack rating would greatly increase when using bare fists has been corrected.- Broker window changes:  * The ATK filter was removed since it didn't do anything.  * The DEF filter now works correctly to show items that provide additional Defense.  * The Crush, Slash, and Pierce filters now return items that modify the Crushing, Slashing, and Piercing skills as well as items that give you resistances to those damage types.  * The Tradeskill item type filter will now return all crafted items marked with a maker's name.- Names for characters on griffons, carpets, or clouds will now draw at the correct location.- Bows and ranged combat arts now indicate a minimum range if applicable.- When spell effects are changed by Achievements (casting time, duration, effectiveness, etc), spell tooltips will update automatically.*** UI Files Updated ***eq2ui_gamedata.xmleq2ui_loginscene.xmleq2ui_mai nhud.xmleq2ui_mainhud_inspectplayer.xmleq2ui_mainh ud_map.xmleq2ui_mainhud_persona.xmleq2ui_mainhud_s kills.xmleq2ui_mainhud_zonereuse.xml</p><p>The EverQuest II Team</p><div></div>

[Elephant]

<div></div><strong>SWEEEEEEEET BABY :smileyhappy:</strong>

[coltla]

<div>No crafting changes, what happened to them now?</div>

[Elephant]

<div></div><div>They were not even announced in Test Update notes, why would you expect them live without testing...</div><div> </div><div>But if you ask me - I don't care... LU21 brings tons of improvements... and more is to come in next hotfixes and updates... you can't fix everything in a single update, you know...</div>

[rek6779]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Kraks_Aforty wrote:Awesome.  Fixed some solo stuff in Desert of Flames.  Man, that is exactly what this game needed.  Forget about fixing Ascent or putting in Halls of the Seeing.  That stuff is poppycock!<div></div><hr></blockquote>While I can truly sympathize with your frustration, for someone who just complained about regression bugs on the previous page, I for one woudl think you wouldn't want someone who's say a quest designer (most of the DoF changes) or item designer to go around tweeking combat in KoS or designing a raid zone. If you do, more power to ya, but I for one would rather have them change old content within their purvue rather than rush something out to live. But, eh, that's just me.