Classes changes currently on the test server?

[Effe]

I know there was talk about changes to the current class archtype structure. In that Fighter, etc along with Summoner etc were being removed in favor of putting players directly into the advance classes from the very start to allow them to experience their classes a LOT earlier. Are these changes currently being tested on the test server?

[Calthine]

<DIV>I sincerely doubt it - they post the Test Server changes like they do the live updates.  Usually what we see on test goes in the next LU...  and they were talking more like the next expansion for the Class changes.</DIV>

[Effe]

I see. I thought that they were refering to it being added in January, didn't realize things were pointing to the next expansion. A shame, doubt I'll still be around by then. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Thanks.

[Magu]

Read the Test Update Notes forum, and you'd see this hasn't been mentioned anywhere. Plus, it's early in the morning on Jan 1. You didn't expect it to go live as of midnight, did you? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[cheerupbrian]

The changes I think he is refering to are in the producers letter for Dec. <div></div>

[Effe]

Yeah, those are the changes I was refering to, the ones that came in the newsletter.

[ilucife]

So are they going to make a major change with every expansion? DoF comes out and we get a combat revamp, Next expansion the archtype tree disaspears???? what the hell are they doing? you cant change a game every six months and expect everyone to be happy with it. i bet 5 copper we have some sort of large combat revamp to "balance" characters. im still waiting to get the money back from all the adept 1's i lost b/c of lu 13....... <div></div>

[klepp]

<DIV>lol i hadnt heard this yet... [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] would be the point of that?   Oh yea great idea take away the one thing that keeps this game unique from wow.... but hell makes it a bit easier for the "casuals" right?   Sheesh i think even the casual kiddies like to have some kind of progression with their class... not just poof your a ranger at lvl 1.  pathetic,  god bless  vanguarfd is soon.. can leavce this behind.</DIV>

[Calthine]

They implied it might be with the next expansion. I can't recall where I read it, but I do believe the teatative date for the next expansion was mid-to-end-Febrary.

[cheerupbrian]

These changes are going to test servers mid to late Jan read Producers letter in Developer Roundtable Forum <div></div>

[Cutan]

Oi Vey, it looks like none of you can read right... Its set for tentative mid to late Jan. It doesnt say if its expansion or just LU it just says in a coming update. And I quote... "In a coming update, tentatively set for mid to late January, people will be able to pick their final class right at character creation and begin earning appropriate abilities and spells right from the outset." taken from <a href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/news_ff.vm?FeatureName=prodletter_frostfell&section=development" target=_blank>here</a> <div></div>

[Thay]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Calthine wrote:<BR> <DIV>I sincerely doubt it - they post the Test Server changes like they do the live updates.  Usually what we see on test goes in the next LU...  and they were talking more like the next expansion for the Class changes.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>My understanding is there will be the option, at character creation, to choose your final class and that "all" 1-20 spells will be changed to reflect this change.</DIV>

[Zachatan]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Calthine wrote:<BR> <DIV>I sincerely doubt it - they post the Test Server changes like they do the live updates.  Usually what we see on test goes in the next LU...  and they were talking more like the next expansion for the Class changes.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Umm no in the producers notes they say they are being ride of archtypes on eitehr live update 19 or 20 if i remember

[far]

<DIV>Are they scrapping arch types to pave the way for easier addition of new classes down the road? If so thats a god awful decision...</DIV>

[Meleania]

it kinda seems like they are turning eq2 INTO eq1 <div></div>

[Aienaa]

<P>Hmmm...  I wonder if this is going to do away with the ability to do the Betrayal Quest.....   If so, are they going to allow all races to start in each of the cities??   As a Woodelf, I had to start in Qeynos....  As an Assassin, I had to move to Freeport....   </P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>Gwern - 60 Assassin</P>

[Aeroslin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Meleania wrote:<BR>it kinda seems like they are turning eq2 INTO eq1<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>if we could be so lucky. eq1 was a challenge, eq2 is a cakewalk and getting easier every day.</DIV>

[Magu]

<span><blockquote><hr>Aienaa wrote:<div></div> <p>Hmmm...  I wonder if this is going to do away with the ability to do the Betrayal Quest.....   If so, are they going to allow all races to start in each of the cities??   As a Woodelf, I had to start in Qeynos....  As an Assassin, I had to move to Freeport....   </p> <hr></blockquote><a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=testdev&message.id=6692#M6692" target=_blank>Betrayal will be alive and well.</a></span><div></div>

[Rijacki]

<span><blockquote><hr>farbe wrote:<div>Are they scrapping arch types to pave the way for easier addition of new classes down the road? If so thats a god awful decision...</div><hr></blockquote> No, it is to add re-play-ablity.  For example.  I currently play a wizard.  If I wanted to try out a warlock, I would have an -indentical- game play experience from level 1 to 20 and then the game play would shift dramatically to the warlock abilities.  If I then wanted to try a conjurer, I would have levels 1 to 10 identical to what I already did months ago and then again as the warlock before it would shift to radically different.  If at that point I wanted to try an illusionist.. 20 levels of identical to the conjuerer... etc New concept... each character class has differences from level 1.  I can go try out a new class and not have it be the same for 10 to 20 levels as one I have already been playing.  Thus, it makes it more appealing to try something new because it really is new, right from the beginning.</span><div></div>

[Bayler_x]

In most cases, the decision is made by level 10 anyway.  I suspect that most people know whether they plan to betray when the character is first created: at race and city choice.  And most subclasses are specific to one city or the other.  So really, levels 10-19 are largely about paying your dues, until you can be the subclass you wanted. I know that rangers don't really become ranged-weapon speciallists until their late 20's.  Before then, it's the same position- and stealth-oriented combat that predators and rogues do.  That's a long way to go before you get a taste of what the class is ultimately about. <div></div>

[Cynto]

<BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rijacki wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> farbe wrote:<BR> <DIV>Are they scrapping arch types to pave the way for easier addition of new classes down the road? If so thats a god awful decision...</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>No, it is to add re-play-ablity.  For example.  I currently play a wizard.  If I wanted to try out a warlock, I would have an -indentical- game play experience from level 1 to 20 and then the game play would shift dramatically to the warlock abilities.  If I then wanted to try a conjurer, I would have levels 1 to 10 identical to what I already did months ago and then again as the warlock before it would shift to radically different.  If at that point I wanted to try an illusionist.. 20 levels of identical to the conjuerer... etc<BR><BR>New concept... each character class has differences from level 1.  I can go try out a new class and not have it be the same for 10 to 20 levels as one I have already been playing.  Thus, it makes it more appealing to try something new because it really is new, right from the beginning.<BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>And to re do levels 1-10 takes what? 2 hours? 3? Maybe 4 if you're going slow the second, third, Xth time around? Yeah, i guess levels 10 to 20 can be kind of annoying, but I watched a guildie go from level 15 to 20 in about 3 seconds about a week ago because he used his main to buy/harvest a bunch of collect items and turn them all in at the same time. Once you've leveled one charachter up past 20 or so its infinately easier to do it again, expecially if you've got a lvl 50+ main to use to twink the new charachter.</P> <P>The reasoning behind this change, as stated in their own announcements, is because, and I quote:</P> <P>"<FONT color=#ff6600>When people start up an MMO, especially a fantasy RPG, many already have a picture of who they are and what they want to be playing. It's less of a profession exploration process for them and more of a barrier that's between them and where they're used to being on day one. "If I'm going to be rolling up my Shadowknight, I want to be playing one right away."</FONT> "</P> <P>Seems to me thats more of a "new guy" change, not a "hey, we know you don't want to play the same boring levels again" change, but I could be wrong.</P> <P>Their other reasoning is this:</P> <P>"<FONT color=#ff6600>To use the Shadowknight example again, from levels 1-19, we can't currently emphasize the Evil side for the person wanting to be that Shadowknight, since the path is shared with Paladins. Therefore, that path isn't quite as exciting as it really could be. Necromancers are another example here where the fictional progression doesn't quite hold. They are masters of the earth right alongside Conjurers, but only until level 19, at which point they suddenly grow into their Necromantic abilities. Instead, these two classes should both be getting pets early on and getting into using them right away.</FONT><FONT color=#ffffff>"</FONT></P> <P>Now, if you ask me, some of the BEST class defining things I ever did in this game were the class choice quests at level 10 and 20. As a warrior they had me go verbally strong arm city NPCs for the SK "flavor" quest, and I tell ya what, that alone almost made me roll an SK instead of the Berserker I had set my mind on before I even created my charachter. As for the Necromancer part of this same quote, I don't know about you, but last time I checked, if you wanted to do ANYTHING you had to start at a basic begining point. Necromancers are summoners, and if I had just been picked out of the ocean and brought to a strange island, I highly doubt my commoner self would just up and out of the blue summon a skeleton out of the earth with no prior training, pardon my disbeleif. It makes SENSE that a Conjuror and Necromancer would start at the same point and learn to summon some of the same things to begin with, they're SUMMONERS fer crying out loud! I would think that both classes, sharing the same root (read: summoning) would both start out summoning the same rock, or the same spoon over there, or heck, even the same basic elemental pet as their first attempt at any form of creature summon.</P> <P>And if we're gonna be doing this, then why as a crafter who wants to be an armorer do I have to spend 10 levels unable to make ANY plate armor at all? Heck, I can't even make plate armor until level 20, if they're going to be starting out adventure classes like that then I sure as heck don't want to have to deal with those pointless first ten to 20 levels of crafting before I can do what I "want".</P> <P>Basicly, you can glossy this change up however you want, but what it boils down to is that they've decided to try and immitate WoW as much as humanly possible in an attempt to get some of their player base. It just saddens me, because I chose this game over WoW because I liked the progressions and the way this played a LOT more than I liked WoW, and now its turning into a poor copy of a game I didn't like nearly as much. That is what my problem and I think a lot of other posters problem and questions about this sudden change. Its because they're "fixing" things that aren't broken, and in fact, quite often the most fun/entertaining quests in the game, if you sit down to read the text the NPCs say to you instead of just spamming through to get it done as fast as possible.</P> <P>Maybe it adds "re-play-ability" to the game, but honestly, it already had that for me. Heck, i've got all 10 charachter slots filled with charachters that are level 16+, two of them 50+, sounds pretty re-playable to me.</P></BLOCKQUOTE><p>Message Edited by Cynto on <span class=date_text>01-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:57 PM</span>

[skidmark]

<span><blockquote><hr>Cynto wrote: <blockquote>Now, if you ask me, some of the BEST class defining things I ever did in this game were the class choice quests at level 10 and 20. As a warrior they had me go verbally strong arm city NPCs for the SK "flavor" quest, and I tell ya what, that alone almost made me roll an SK instead of the Berserker I had set my mind on before I even created my charachter. As for the Necromancer part of this same quote, I don't know about you, but last time I checked, if you wanted to do ANYTHING you had to start at a basic begining point. Necromancers are summoners, and if I had just been picked out of the ocean and brought to a strange island, I highly doubt my commoner self would just up and out of the blue summon a skeleton out of the earth with no prior training, pardon my disbeleif. It makes SENSE that a Conjuror and Necromancer would start at the same point and learn to summon some of the same things to begin with, they're SUMMONERS fer crying out loud! I would think that both classes, sharing the same root (read: summoning) would both start out summoning the same rock, or the same spoon over there, or heck, even the same basic elemental pet as their first attempt at any form of creature summon. SNIP </blockquote><hr></blockquote> Not trying to b e jerk here, but the class quest at 8-9 that introduces you to the three sub-classes are jokes. I have done all 4 in freeport and the Mage and Scout in Qeynos. They all have the same theme, first go kill a bunch of stuff. Next go talk to some people, then kill some more stuff. There is little to no variation in them, they almost seem to be an afterthought. The following quest that actually gives you your class breastplate/robe and ring are interesting, most are way too easy though. You have a point that you have to have a basic beginning point, but I still don't see how summoning a huge centipede gives a Necro any insight into animating the dead. I don't know of any precedent in fantasy literature or gaming that points to that either. The "basic beginning point" could be a class quest at 8 or 9 that allows you to get your Animate Dead spell that would be usable at 10th or at whatever level you actually get the spell after the change. I hope they do something like this too. </span><span> I started a "Necro", but once I summoned that centipede, I shelved it, I only make food with him now. Once they make this change I will dust him off and play as a true Necromancer again. I grouped with a Necro last night that was 21st level. In order for him to have a "tank" pet, he had to trot out that ridiculous centipede (which is better than that beetle they had, but still) since his only undead pet was a caster. Felt bad for him, he worked all that way to get to 20th level and finally be a Necro, but since we didn't have a tank, he was still a conjurer.</span> <span> The archetype/class tree system was a good idea, but poorly implemented. It is too rigid. I feel that in most cases there is little to no choice afforded the player. If you could make a change somewhere down the line (10-20 range) it would be a lot better. The other part of the problem is the fact that only 1/3 of all classes are available in both cities.  This game shouldn't limit your choices, it should maximize them.  And I don't consider having to do a long tedious quest to "betray" a choice, it is more like self-inflicted wounds. </span><div></div>

[Cynto]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> skidmark wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cynto wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE>Now, if you ask me, some of the BEST class defining things I ever did in this game were the class choice quests at level 10 and 20. As a warrior they had me go verbally strong arm city NPCs for the SK "flavor" quest, and I tell ya what, that alone almost made me roll an SK instead of the Berserker I had set my mind on before I even created my charachter. As for the Necromancer part of this same quote, I don't know about you, but last time I checked, if you wanted to do ANYTHING you had to start at a basic begining point. Necromancers are summoners, and if I had just been picked out of the ocean and brought to a strange island, I highly doubt my commoner self would just up and out of the blue summon a skeleton out of the earth with no prior training, pardon my disbeleif. It makes SENSE that a Conjuror and Necromancer would start at the same point and learn to summon some of the same things to begin with, they're SUMMONERS fer crying out loud! I would think that both classes, sharing the same root (read: summoning) would both start out summoning the same rock, or the same spoon over there, or heck, even the same basic elemental pet as their first attempt at any form of creature summon.<BR><BR>SNIP<BR></BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Not trying to b e jerk here, but the class quest at 8-9 that introduces you to the three sub-classes are jokes. I have done all 4 in freeport and the Mage and Scout in Qeynos. They all have the same theme, first go kill a bunch of stuff. Next go talk to some people, then kill some more stuff. There is little to no variation in them, they almost seem to be an afterthought. The following quest that actually gives you your class breastplate/robe and ring are interesting, most are way too easy though.</P> <P><FONT color=#ff3300>Yes, all quests are going to relate back to the same thing, "Kill stuff, talk to this guy, harvest things, etc" because in the current build of the game those are really the only "tasks" npcs can give you as you can't build forts or destory them on the landscape, so we can't "Siege" anything. My point was not that the tasks themselves were all that awe inspiring, but that the "lore" behind them was REALLY well written. The NPCs don't tell you to go talk to timmy and come back, they give you a task that is fitting of the class, and if you read along with the story as you go it is rather engrossing. If you've done the level 10 quest for casters that is a very good example, for the enchanter portion you are sent to "charm" one NPC to lower his prices for an item, and I think it is done really well as you do not posess a charm spell and have to "Coerce" (hence the class for FP Coercer) the NPC into giving you a much lower price on the item. Compared to later quests where you get a piece of paper or find an item and get told "kill 10 orcs" I find that far and away the better quest, maybe i'm strange in that.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff3300>Also, I personally don't think at level 9 the quests should be "epic" they're just there to help you get the "feel" of a class, some are harder than others true, but the point is the lore, not the difficulty. I shouldn't be given a quest I fail 10 times at level 9 when its a quest that I have to complete or I can't even level up any further, that would be foolish.<BR></FONT><BR><BR>You have a point that you have to have a basic beginning point, but I still don't see how summoning a huge centipede gives a Necro any insight into animating the dead. I don't know of any precedent in fantasy literature or gaming that points to that either. The "basic beginning point" could be a class quest at 8 or 9 that allows you to get your Animate Dead spell that would be usable at 10th or at whatever level you actually get the spell after the change. I hope they do something like this too. </SPAN><SPAN>I started a "Necro", but once I summoned that centipede, I shelved it, I only make food with him now. Once they make this change I will dust him off and play as a true Necromancer again. I grouped with a Necro last night that was 21st level. In order for him to have a "tank" pet, he had to trot out that ridiculous centipede (which is better than that beetle they had, but still) since his only undead pet was a caster. Felt bad for him, he worked all that way to get to 20th level and finally be a Necro, but since we didn't have a tank, he was still a conjurer.</SPAN></P> <P><FONT color=#ff3300>I think that you are missing part of the point I was making. You're right, summoning a centipede does not teach a necromancer how to summon the undead, however, it teaches him the art of summoning, which is used in calling forth an undead minion. Necromancers at their base are summoners turned evil. They have learned summoning arts that are forsaken, etc, etc, that is what makes them necromancers, however, typically in any lore you find, they started out as a summoner/conjuror, its just that they turned down the "evil" path and studied in dark arts. So while your point that summoning centipedes will not teach them to summon their necro pets, it does teach them HOW to summon, which is the point of the progression. I still hold that it is far more awkward to just say at level 1 "Ok you're a Necromancer, go ahead and summon your skeleton pet and have him bash on things."</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff3300>Also, I would like to mention that although I know that this game is not D&D, it is based upon a lot of the concepts from that game and similar ones, and if i remember correctly, most undead pets had the chance to turn against their controler and kill him if he was not focused enough. Hence the need for them to be a semi accomplished summoner of OTHER types of minions, or else the undead pet would just immediately eat him or her. Again, I know this is a totally different game, I just wanted to point out another reason WHY they might need to know how to summon something else that wasn't nearly as "evil" or whatever.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff3300>As for the Necro you grouped with that had to summon his centipede pet, that does kinda suck, perhaps SoE could have made the first pet they got a tank pet instead of a caster, that would have fixed that problem. I just don't think that a complete and total revamp was required, and it speaks to me of them wanting to water down the game further to lure in more WoW players, etc. Its not so much for the current player base as it is a last ditch effort to try to win the "battle" with a game that is so easy players get multiple charachters to level 60 and then get bored and quit.</FONT><BR><SPAN><BR>The archetype/class tree system was a good idea, but poorly implemented. It is too rigid. I feel that in most cases there is little to no choice afforded the player. If you could make a change somewhere down the line (10-20 range) it would be a lot better. The other part of the problem is the fact that only 1/3 of all classes are available in both cities.  This game shouldn't limit your choices, it should maximize them.  And I don't consider having to do a long tedious quest to "betray" a choice, it is more like self-inflicted wounds. </SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff3300>I am not claiming that the archetype tree system was the best thing ever, but it gave your charachter a progression that added to the lore of the game, could let you get more into the charachter if you were a roleplayer etc. I'm just kinda annoyed that they are dumbing down the game further and totally throwing out something that while maybe not perfect, sure as hell wasn't broken enough to warrent this. And now, when people betray they just automatically change from assassin to ranger? I know that if I was a semi accomplished assassin I sure as hell wouldn't suddenly become a hippy, tree-huggin, natureboy out of nowhere. I can agree with you that perhaps they could have added in changes earlier along the way, maybe even made it so that at level 10 a freeportian summoner got an undead type pet or something, maybe a swarm of maggots or some other small evil type pet. </FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff3300>As for the betrayal part and "limiting your choices" I don't know of ANY other game that gives you nearly as much freedom in race/class combination than this game. Every other game only lets you be certian classes depending on your race. EQ1 had this, I remember wanting to be a DE bard and was so annoyed that I couldn't be one that when I finally got my mask of the Deciever I was never out of Dark Elf Illusion. WoW also has this, Horde races can't be paladins, Alliance can't be shaman, undead can't be this, trolls can't be that, etc. Sure, to be an Ogre paladin in this game you have to go through a long hard quest for your level, but it fits in the lore of the game, and at least you CAN be one if you want to be, you're not told flat out that you can't.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff3300>And really, it wouldn't make much sense for a Dark elf to start out in Qeynos or a High Elf to start out in Freeport. Who would trust either of them just right off the bat without proving themselves through a long hard quest? I know that if I was a Dark elf in Freeport and a High elf just walked off the boat from the island I would probably kill him on sight, as they are all goody goodies and probably are just there to spy on us, and I would expect the same from them as Dark elves on the whole are rather evil and ready to kill you for looking at them wrong, typically by poisioning your food or drink.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff3300>Again, i'm just disappointed that they're throwing out something thats not broken simply because its "too hard" to level up those first 20 levels, because its not, I can do it in less than a days worth of play time solo just about.</FONT><BR></SPAN></P> <P></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR><p>Message Edited by Cynto on <span class=date_text>01-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:32 PM</span>

[skidmark]

D&D Animate Dead spell sucked. A Wizard got it at 9th level, and was able to animate a 1HD Skeleton or 2HD Zombie (woohoo). In 3E they get Create Greater Undead later on, and it will definitely turn on them, so they have to Charm it. Just wanted to clarify that. Along those lines, and in regards to your "basic beginning point" I personally don't see any relation between Conjurer and Necro. I know they are related in this game and they both summon, but I always view them as one who summons and another that animates. I know they probably won't make that distinction, but they should. Then like I said, they could have some class defining quest to initiate the Necro into the world of animating/controlling undead. Back to the Lore of the class quests, I found it to be kind of thrown together for the most part, and lacking. Not just the actual tasks, but the lore behind it. Most of them struck me as poorly written. The summoner part of the freeport one had you run to three different places where the people described an event that was a summoning, but none of them knew what was summoned, they all three saw different things, and you had to figure out what it was that was summoned. And the answer is (caution spoiler warning) an Elephant? Is this a joke? If I saw someone create an elephant out of thin air, I am pretty sure I would remember that. Conversely, and ironically considering all of the summoner talk, the summoner quest in Freeport was the best of all that I have done. You have to summon an earth elemental by interacting with the enironment and then fight it. It was the only quest that actually seemed to deal with the sub-class that it was leading into, that I have done.

[Tau Nemes]

<div></div><hr><div></div>I know there was talk about changes to the current class archtype structure. In that Fighter, etc along with Summoner etc were being removed in favor of putting players directly into the advance classes from the very start to allow them to experience their classes a LOT earlier. Are these changes currently being tested on the test server?<hr><font color="#6666ff" face="Verdana" size="3">I hope they implement it ASAP.The current 'introductory" system is to take players by the hand, and force us to play a bunch of neutral levels with little interest and with little (or none) reference of what will be the final class.I want to check out 2 classes within one archetype... but I already played that twice. It feels horrible to do all that once again (don't go can be done fast... the objective is to play another class, not to try to survive the same content and gameplay over and over by rushing trough it)I applaud the developers's decision on this.</font><div></div>

[Jiha]

<div></div><div></div>Realized my question was more appropriate for another thread.<p>Message Edited by Jihana on <span class="date_text">01-10-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:31 AM</span></p>

[liveja]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>skidmark wrote:<span></span><span>The archetype/class tree system was a good idea, but poorly implemented.</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>Precisely. The archetype system was the thing I liked most about the game before I began playing it, but now, I've begun to dislike it more & more. I'm looking forward to being able to play an evil Wizard from the beginning, for example, without having to go through the quests from 9-10 & again from 10-20, just to FINALLY see my game experience as a Mage become considerably different than it was as a Summoner.