Yellow Server?

[Silverpaws]

Basically, this is my idea. (pulled from others as well, so I dont not take all of the credit)1- Character copies to the Yellow server as requested by the player with /yellowcopy Denuve (yellow could be named whatever, but it means a Test server of sorts)2- Your character is reproduced on a "test" server, where you can test out equipement, quests, zones, whatever.3-The server will be non-continuous server.  Meaning, at a pre-set time (once per week, once per day, once every 2 weeks) your character is erased from the server.4- You would have to /yellowcopy Denuve again to repopulate the server once notified by the devs that /yellowcopys are active again.  (This allows for changes)5- Your character would be the same as the prior copy, same lvl and such as your live character.I used to work with our software team at my current job, and we would have several "test" servers.  Named blue, yellow, red, whatever...  Each server had its own purpose.  I assume SOE does similar.  But we had a server where people could "play" with the software in a training environment, but the information was refreshed from a previous version every night.  So bascially people could pound the crap out of it, but never break it.Any thoughts?<div></div>

[DarkLegacy2005]

That'd be cool, but I dont get where you are going with this...? Letting people on live see the things in test?

[GurgGuardianLord]

<DIV>more people would be apt to play on test if they did things like this.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I know for a fact id have logged into test to try out LU 18..i was extremly excited about the pet changes, until i actually got to use them.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The feedback that I alone would have given SoE would have given them ample time  to repair the lich issue with necros, and the bugged pet colors and feedback on some of the changes that didn't actually take effect that were suppose to.</DIV>

[GurgGuardianLord]

<DIV>actually...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In shadowbane, the test server had double exp double money or something to that effect, triple money maybe..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Silverpaws]

The Devs stated they were unable to reproduce some of the issues prior to LU18.  This would allow you to test some aspects of the game previously unable to be tested because most of the test server characters are only level 7.  Not saying all, mind you, so dont get offended.  But most players that play live 99% of the time, might have tested some of the higher end stuff more often, if they didnt have to level twice.<div></div>

[Eris]

Looks nice on the paper. However, its an idea spawned form the presumption most bugs make it to live because testers miss them. Sorry mates, but just browse through a lots of post about LU18 and youll notice that most bugs that are game altering were in fact spotted by testers and reported. Its SOE, to follow the xmas schedule (too lazy to look for a more generic term for xmas you community guys), that obviously choose to launch the LU.

[JuJut]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Silverpaws wrote:<BR>The Devs stated they were unable to reproduce some of the issues prior to LU18.  This would allow you to test some aspects of the game previously unable to be tested because most of the test server characters are only level 7.  Not saying all, mind you, so dont get offended.  But most players that play live 99% of the time, might have tested some of the higher end stuff more often, if they didnt have to level twice.<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>No offense taken, but saying that most test server characters are only level 7 is, umm, <EM>counterfactual</EM>. Even when there is an influx of players from production servers before an update that generates a lot of interest, that's not the case. Heck, it only takes a couple of hours to get above 7...I play on test as my home server and even as an altoholic, my alts are well above that. There are enough characters of all levels to test any content [although I think they would like more of the higher levels to do raids].</P> <P>This is not to say that the idea of a temporary server with mass copies for a specific set of tasks would be a bad idea, stress tests can be useful.<BR></P>

[Rambling Diatri]

<P> ROFLMAO@ Average test player is level 7.</P> <P> Case in point, my active test toons. 57th Dirge, 45 Fury, 35 Coercer, 26 Berzerker.</P> <P> I am in a guild filled with players that have similar variety and level ranges.</P> <P> And wow, guess what. Test mans full 24 man raids that are almost straight 60's. Between the two largest test guilds every single subclass is represented in the late 50's. Except Coercers, seems everyones coercer was an alt, our gighest coercer was heading into his mid 40's last I saw.</P> <P> Best part about those two guilds, all home grown toons. </P> <P> LU18  was horrible. But had nothing to do with the testers themselves. All the proc and pet bugs were patched in about midnight eastern on friday. They had bug reports submitted on them by 10 am the following morning(when I discovered the proc line porblems with my coercer). Multiple classes and level ranges continued bugging it over the course of the weekend.</P> <P> Bugs making it live has little to do with the testers not finding, this example just kinda glaring displays that some bugs just get to go live. We on the test server did everything we could.</P> <P> Reminds of a patch back in eq1 where half the people in game lost video. Those of on test back then had reported amazing amounts of data to them. Video brands, drivers, work-arounds. But in the end they simply needed more data. Not saying that is the case this time.</P> <P> My honest guess is that at the end of the weekend they quickly snagged all Frostfell bug reports out of the cache and concentrated on fixing them. Probably didn't even get a chance to read the rest before preping the patch.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Silverpaws]

Guess you didnt read what I said.  I said that 99% of most live players are probably around level 7.You are a test server player, not live.  Like I said, no offense to the hard core Testers.   But the most I have ever seen online when I log in total on the server is very very low.  Hard to stress test a game with 1% the volume.<div></div>

[Evadne]

Please clarify what the difference is between testing and stress testing?If we report 200 bugs and they have time to fix 100, introducing another 20, and 1000 testers could report 1000 bugs they would somehow have time to fix more?  Doubt it. They would work on the same 100 and introduce the same new 20 in the fixing.  Just a reminder, this is not the forum used by testers to discuss bugs.  You cannot see what we do and do not report before a patch. Nor can you see the dev teams work with us to resolve the issues.  It is happening, quite furiously behind the scenes.  They work with several areas of the fan base to improve the game, fix issues, and look to the future. This forum is minor in the scheme of  things. You may see the population on test as small but it is a very powerful lot.  The folks that make test their home are a dedicated group.Any other kind of test server would be a waste of resources.<div></div>

[Silverpaws]

We already know that the devs pull raiding guilds from other servers to test raid content because there arent enough raiding guilds on test.  My idea would fix that problem because anyone that wanted to could step over to test new content.The test server would still be the final step prior to live.  This would be content before test.<div></div>

[StonyStratford]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Evadne wrote:<BR>You may see the population on test as small but it is a very powerful lot.  The folks that make test their home are a dedicated group.<BR><BR>Any other kind of test server would be a waste of resources.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You guys do a great job on test. I personally thank you for your own personal time you spend getting the problems highlighted to the devs.</P> <P>I doubt you stress test though - but that isnt your job. </P> <P>And on the subject of stress tests, beta tests and the test server. Please, oh pleasy please, please please make it at least continue to make it a 2 braincell skill to make a test character. Test does not need people to come in and flame and moan and cough up blood due to what Sony have done. It needs decent people who help *YOU* as well as *ME* for free, for fun, for enjoyment.</P> <P>Getting fifty thousand players on test is good? (this is a rhetorical question) Not really. Test needs dedicated players, not dedicated flamers. 50k people would ensure that every good and useful post would get lost in general whine spam.</P> <P><Meh so much hate - hate is wrong. </P> <P> </P> <p>Message Edited by StonyStratford on <span class=date_text>12-22-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:32 AM</span>

[JuJut]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Evadne wrote:<BR>Please clarify what the difference is between testing and stress testing?<BR><BR>If we report 200 bugs and they have time to fix 100, introducing another 20, and 1000 testers could report 1000 bugs they would somehow have time to fix more?  Doubt it. They would work on the same 100 and introduce the same new 20 in the fixing.  <BR><BR>Just a reminder, this is not the forum used by testers to discuss bugs.  You cannot see what we do and do not report before a patch. Nor can you see the dev teams work with us to resolve the issues.  It is happening, quite furiously behind the scenes.  They work with several areas of the fan base to improve the game, fix issues, and look to the future. This forum is minor in the scheme of  things. <BR><BR>You may see the population on test as small but it is a very powerful lot.  The folks that make test their home are a dedicated group.<BR><BR>Any other kind of test server would be a waste of resources.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I think what the OP is getting at is reflrcted in a post I'm putting in below. Keep in mind that, like you, Test is my home, I love it just as you do. If any other type of test server would be a waste of resources, why did the developers run a separate beta server for the DoF expansion? Were they just frittering away resources? I don't want mass copies of live characters to test for reasons that have been hashed over a tousand times. But a temporary server with copies may or may not be a bad idea. not my call.</P> <P>The difference between stress testing and testing is load. Afaik every game has development time towards the very end of beta testing devoted to stress testing<BR></P> <DIV><EM>The data is identical, but the difference between server load is immense. When you have 1 to a few dozen people on an internal server versus thousands on an external server, a lot of things break that we don't expect.<BR></EM> <P><BR><FONT color=#999999><EM>Ryan "Blackguard" Shwayder</EM></FONT> </P></DIV>

[Salmastryon]

Your comments about players with live server mains playing on test as being level 7 is still not factual.  Me and several of my guildies have a few alts each on test that we pull out ever once in awhile to see something new that comes onto test.  They are all high teens to mid twenties and they get played very infrequently.<div></div>

[Silverpaws]

Just so we are clear, this server would be by invitation or limited to those people that agree to participate in an evaluation of the quest/zone/raid that is being tested.  Not every Joe Blow would be able to get in, and flamers/complainers would not be tolerated.  They would have to pass some sort of a "test" test and will abide by NDA guidelines.The entire thing is basically an ongoing beta testing server, where stuff WILL break.  After logging off for the session, players would have to write a synopsis of the problems or issues found.  If anyone is found to break the NDA, they would have their live server character banned just as any beta testing player would.Test server is and always will be the end all server for testing.  This server would be an ongoing beta server where characters would be copied at SOE discretion after the player has agreed to their part of the contract.  I would sign up in a heartbeat to assist SOE on new content, because I love gaming, and I love EQ.  Not because I want l33t info and c00Lio strats (apologizies to the d00d speakers out there).  Would I spend a few hours a week zoning in and out of the Roost to fix the /player has logged out/in bug?  Would I attack random mobs in the zone over and over and over while a dev watched to see why they keep breaking encounters? Would I join a raid and get moved around from group to group to group till I break the new raid window?  Would I stand let some PvP encounter go on for awhile until they devs worked out resists and new PvP spells?  Yes, yes, and yes.  Because I love it all, and because it makes a difference to the guy on live that I did it.Test server people are great, and I would never take away what you do.  So I hope I didnt offend you, because it wasnt intentional.<div></div>

[Kendricke]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Silverpaws wrote:<BR>Just so we are clear, this server would be by invitation or limited to those people that agree to participate in an evaluation of the quest/zone/raid that is being tested.  Not every Joe Blow would be able to get in, and flamers/complainers would not be tolerated.  They would have to pass some sort of a "test" test and will abide by NDA guidelines. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You're assuming such servers don't already exist when needed.  By the very standards you've stated here, such a server could exist right now, but wouldn't be discussed due to the very NDA restrictions you're advocating.</P> <P>(Just a little Devil's Advocation there).</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Lintr]

<span><blockquote><hr>Kendricke wrote: <blockquote> <hr> Silverpaws wrote:Just so we are clear, this server would be by invitation or limited to those people that agree to participate in an evaluation of the quest/zone/raid that is being tested.  Not every Joe Blow would be able to get in, and flamers/complainers would not be tolerated.  They would have to pass some sort of a "test" test and will abide by NDA guidelines. <hr> </blockquote> <p>You're assuming such servers don't already exist when needed.  By the very standards you've stated here, such a server could exist right now, but wouldn't be discussed due to the very NDA restrictions you're advocating.</p> <p>(Just a little Devil's Advocation there).</p> <div></div><hr></blockquote>Why would they put a NDA on testing a patch?  </span><div></div>