Changes are gonna force us to seek Groups, Soloers BEWARE

[Blabber]

<DIV>Go ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>SoE seems to think the game is too easy, and we won't stick around long enough, because we can gain XP too fast, gain XP soloing, so they are RE-MAKING the game more difficult so forming groups will be neccessary to advance at any efficient rate.  I will vote with my feet if that is to be the final result from what is in BETA now.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Idiocy, I have seen it for SOOOO long from EQ and now EQ2, amazing, simply amazing. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=testfeed&message.id=24241&a#M24241" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=testfeed&message.id=24241&a#M24241</A></DIV><p>Message Edited by Blabber on <span class=date_text>08-09-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:04 AM</span>

[EtoilePirate]

My experience so far has been that soloing a high-level Assassin is just about exactly the same as it always has been, with regards to difficulty, and that soloing a low-level fighter (11 Crusader) and priest (15 Druid) is easier than just about anything else I've ever done in this game.  Ever.  I'm a soloer by nature and by preference and I've been managing.  Really.  It's okay. <div></div>

[Chonrad]

<P>Actually, it seems much the same. The new CON system seems more (excuse the pun) consistent on what you can and cant pull when playing solo. I have found it to be quite good in determining what will be a challenge and what wont be. </P> <P>If you want to play it safe, the system lets you know what you can do ... or if you want a bit of risk ... or a lot of risk. </P> <P>The choices of what to fight may not be as large as before but soloing is about the same on the current TEST server. Also, the mixture of easy and hard mobs being close together (in some areas) is finally bringing back some risk (fun!) into the game.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <p>Message Edited by Chonrad on <span class=date_text>08-10-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:00 PM</span>

[Chate]

<FONT size=5></FONT> <DIV>ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>SoE seems to think the game is too easy, and we won't stick around long enough, because we can gain XP too fast, gain XP soloing, so they are RE-MAKING the game more difficult so forming groups will be neccessary to advance at any efficient rate.  I will vote with my feet if that is to be the final result from what is in BETA now.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Idiocy, I have seen it for SOOOO long from EQ and now EQ2, amazing, simply amazing. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I for one as well as my brother will quit the game for good if they make it that I can not solo .... there are many times i cannot group because I do not have the time for it, and times i just prefer to solo... remove the ability for me to solo and i am gone ... I wan't to solo when I choose to, and group when I choose too... Please do not make it harder for us to solo ..... the only reason I have not quit this game so far is the ability to solo or group if I so choose ... remove it, and alot of us soloer's will move on to other games... </DIV></DIV>

[Risedm]

Am I the only one that sees the irony in wanting to sign on to a MMORPG to solo.  If you want to solo why dont you just get a xbox or ps2 they have lots of solo RPGs there. 

[Ay]

<DIV>Well, me and my whole family will QUIT if the game doesnt stop making soloing better than grouping!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hah, so there!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why in the world should soloers get as much xp and loot as a group? Soloing should be an option BUT NOT THE BEST OPTION for loot and xp. I give YOU A CHALLENGE - Try to have a group between levels 10-20 go xp in the commonlands! Ya try to find some HEROIC mobs in the commonlands! Hahahahahaha. Theyr'e alllllll gone. the game used to be challenging. The soloers cried. SoE totally went off the deep end replacing close to ALL heroic mobs with solo mobs in ALL outside zones and many even in dungeons. This is rediculous. At least make the zones HALF AND HALF on heroic vs solo mobs!!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as solo xp is concerned it shoudl never be as good per encounter as it is in a group!</DIV>

[EtoilePirate]

<span><blockquote><hr>Risedm wrote:Am I the only one that sees the irony in wanting to sign on to a MMORPG to solo.  If you want to solo why dont you just get a xbox or ps2 they have lots of solo RPGs there.  <div></div><hr></blockquote> Now that's just being mean.  Honestly, when you think k of an assassin, do you think of someone who's all happy friendly and always works with others, or do you think of a loner waiting in the shadows to leap out on unwary victims?  And when you group, do you think of bringing people who can actually contribute group utility, or do you think of people whose arts are applied in more or less exactly the same way as when they solo? I mean honestly, I chose a class that, although it's not always easy, favors the soloplay-style.  I also prefer to do my writs and daily grind alone, and to join with friends and guildies for big taregets and complex quests.  That's a perfectly valid playstyle, and even if you don't realize it, at least SOE does.</span><div></div>

[Thelah]

Assassins rarely work alone in the real world, in fact, unless you are a hermit, you require others to get your work done.  The game should reflect that.

[Sorentio]

Well MarioKart is a multiplayer game yet I can still play and enjoy single player mode if I choose, or go into battle mode when I feel like having a few friends over.  Why *shouldn't* people be able to play by themselves sometimes in this game?

[LyricDawnhag]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Risedm wrote:<BR>Am I the only one that sees the irony in wanting to sign on to a MMORPG to solo.  If you want to solo why dont you just get a xbox or ps2 they have lots of solo RPGs there.  <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>No irony at all.  I play MMORPGs to interact with friends.  I actually have more time for interaction with my guildies while I solo because in non-guild groups, everyone is so intent to killing as fast as possible that you do not have time to be very social.</P> <P>MMORPG means I share the world with many people.  It does not mean I have to group with them.</P> <P> </P>

[Bjerde]

There is plenty to still solo on Test. I was in TS last night with my Templar soloing white cons at a fair rate. When I tried a yellow scarecrow, I ended up with no power at the end of the fight. I was over by the beach near the Antonica zone in. Yes, there were heroic groups around, but there were solo mobs stuck in there.....I just had to go pull them out. I couldn't keep up with the re-pop rate....there was plenty of solo stuff. I like to solo, and I like to group. There is a good mix of both, you may just actually have to look for camps. I hated it when everything in Ant was solo. It was boring, and I would have to try and find the very few heroic mobs to kill to get any xp in small grps....but I found some. I am very glad they are bringing more herioc content back, although it still seems that soloing is the trend out there. Very few ppl looking to grp, even when there are people in the zone, no one has lfg up. One reason is they are getting good enough xp solo... <div></div>

[AhjilaFire]

<div></div><p>As a 14th level Predator, I have no problems soloing.<span>  </span>I have taken down Orange 2 down arrows, and even an Orange 1 down arrow.<span>  </span>Good fights each one, had to use every trick in the book.</p><p>Went to WC last night, and was given a really good fight/near death experience with the Blue 1 up Orc Skeletons.<span>  </span>Over all, I would have to say that solo content is in the game, and is rewarding.</p><p><!-- [if !supportEmptyParas] --> <!-- [endif] --></p><p>Greytail – Test</p><span>Rodian Longblade - Innothule</span><div></div>

[Moorgard]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blabber wrote:<BR> <DIV>Go ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  </DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I'd like to address your points, but you don't give specifics as to what changes you are talking about. What class have you tested that is unable to solo anything but grey mobs? Where have you seen forced grouping implemented? What makes you think we are trying to eliminate soloing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you are referring to the combat changes, if anything they are meant to make soloing easier for classes that were challenged by it before.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you're talking about a scaling back of downtiered mobs, then please look at the specific areas where changes were made. The focused reversal was limited in scope, and intended to bring a bit more consistency to areas set aside for grouping.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you have experienced specific things on Test that makes you think some of your fears are well founded, please post the details. But if you are merely reacting to messages posted by other people who may or may not have valid observations, I urge you to respond to facts rather than speculation. Panic has a way of feeding upon itself, especially when facing something unknown. The community benefits by addressing facts and hard data, but reacting to rumors seldom helps anything.</DIV>

[raptorjb0]

<DIV>Personally I hope that the do give people a greater benifit for grouping, The game gets boring when everyone is to busy putzing around solo rather than grouping.</DIV> <DIV>Solo should be accomdated, but grouping should be greatly encouraged and rewarded.</DIV>

[Sandheaver]

<DIV>i could be wrong, BUT..  i find that those who have a hard time soloing either:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>a) aren't looking hard for solo mobs.  there are PLENTY, just freaking LOOK FOR THEM</DIV> <DIV>b) aren't good players.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I wouldn't worry too much moorgard.</DIV>

[Priestbane]

<P>It is.</P> <P>You don't see any soloers going about talking about the massive amount of fabled gear and master spells they get while doing so.</P> <P> </P> <P>I like the current balance of solo and group content.</P>

[LinkinL]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sandheaver wrote:<BR> <DIV>i could be wrong, BUT..  i find that those who have a hard time soloing either:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>a) aren't looking hard for solo mobs.  there are PLENTY, just freaking LOOK FOR THEM</DIV> <DIV>b) aren't good players.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I wouldn't worry too much moorgard.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Dead on.  The sky HAS to be falling for someone.  It's like an unwritten law of gaming.

[Star]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sandheaver wrote:<BR> <DIV>i could be wrong, BUT..  i find that those who have a hard time soloing either:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>a) aren't looking hard for solo mobs.  there are PLENTY, just freaking LOOK FOR THEM</DIV> <DIV>b) aren't good players.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I wouldn't worry too much moorgard.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I strongly disagree with this post. I can find plenty of solo mobs and I know how to play my class well. There *are* certain classes, such as rangers, that have a stiffer time soloing than other classes, such as paladins.</P> <P>The solo arena is a good example. It can be done by rangers, and anyone that says it can't just isn't doing it quite right, *but* it's more difficult and more costly for rangers than other classes. It's also a much bigger PITA, because you have to kite the mobs around the zone to survive. I personally think that I shouldn't have to run around the zone like a chicken with my head cut off if I want to solo. However, if I can take white or even yellow con mobs one on one without kiting then I might be able to kite and kill harder mobs that other classes can't possibly solo.</P> <P>I don't claim to know what the solution to that is, but I know there is a problem and I'm looking forward to the combat changes and hope that needing to kite mobs to solo will be a thing of the past. We'll see.</P> <P>As far as Blabber's post... Well as Moorgard said that sort of thing is not helpful. If you're going to be critical of something provide some basis for your complaint. Otherwise it's just pointless and unhelpful yammering.</P>

[Chronicle]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blabber wrote:<BR> <DIV>Go ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  </DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>If you are referring to the combat changes, if anything they are meant to make soloing easier for classes that were challenged by it before.</STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#ffcc00>IMHO, you succeeded. I have found it much easier to solo with these new combat changes (47 Guardian w/ average gear).</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffcc00>I dont know where Blabber is getting this idea that we are being forced to group.</FONT></P> <P><BR></P>

[TygerBlueEy]

<P>My 1st impresson from the combat changes is its a lot like what happen to SWG; and I'm not liking it. I have only tested a low level toon. If I could test my level 50 Fury I would and could get a full impact of the changes. I'll have to wait until it goes live for that I guess. Devs dont allow dupping to test...oh well.</P> <P> </P>

[wurtin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> AhjilaFire wrote:<BR> <P>As a 14th level Predator, I have no problems soloing.<SPAN>  </SPAN>I have taken down Orange 2 down arrows, and even an Orange 1 down arrow.<SPAN>  </SPAN>Good fights each one, had to use every trick in the book.</P> <P>Went to WC last night, and was given a really good fight/near death experience with the Blue 1 up Orc Skeletons.<SPAN>  </SPAN>Over all, I would have to say that solo content is in the game, and is rewarding.</P> <P><!-- [if !supportEmptyParas] --> <!-- [endif] --></P> <P>Greytail – Test</P><SPAN>Rodian Longblade - Innothule</SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Aye, but scouts and mages are basically finished.  Fighters and Priests are not.  My level 12 zerker can take a level 13 most of the time  but gets smashed by 14 and above. </P> <P>Has anyone heard when more Fighter and Priest changes will be moved in?  So far on the new Beta list stuff, the bulk of the changes are for mages or scouts.  I'm a little confused about that.</P> <P>Not only that but none of the trait stuff has been updated yet. We are 1 month and 2 days away from Combat revamp.  There's a lot left to be done.</P>

[Kyin]

<DIV>Personally I would like to see 2 instances of most zones (mostly the ones that have the most solo stuff in it,  A solo and a group instance.  I know this would be sorta broken IE taking dificulty out of travel so why not make it so there is a solo instace but you can not zone out into any other zone than the one you entered from.  For a short example, lets say Lavastorm was made with a solo instance so you can go around fight your way through, feel all wonderful inside, finsh quests and what not.  You would zone in from Nek docks and select solo instance but you could not then go to MG, or Sol E unless you zoned back into Nek and went to the Real Lavastorm.  Sounds like a pain but for the true soloer they might like it, and it would give us back our group mobs in antoinica and VS and DB and all the other places i used to group.</DIV>

[Nainitsuj]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blabber wrote:<BR> <DIV>Go ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  </DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I'd like to address your points, but you don't give specifics as to what changes you are talking about. What class have you tested that is unable to solo anything but grey mobs? Where have you seen forced grouping implemented? What makes you think we are trying to eliminate soloing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you are referring to the combat changes, if anything they are meant to make soloing easier for classes that were challenged by it before.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you're talking about a scaling back of downtiered mobs, then please look at the specific areas where changes were made. The focused reversal was limited in scope, and intended to bring a bit more consistency to areas set aside for grouping.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you have experienced specific things on Test that makes you think some of your fears are well founded, please post the details. But if you are merely reacting to messages posted by other people who may or may not have valid observations, I urge you to respond to facts rather than speculation. Panic has a way of feeding upon itself, especially when facing something unknown. The community benefits by addressing facts and hard data, but reacting to rumors seldom helps anything.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Why have you people taken all group functionality from the necromancer?  </P> <P>Pet = 1 conc.<BR>Offensive stance = 2 conc.<BR>Defensive stance = 2 conc.<BR>Magi's shileding = 3 conc.<BR>All group buffs = 1 conc.<BR>Invis = 1 conc.<BR>Unliving eyes = 1 conc.</P> <P> </P> <P>I have to make a choice now, do I buff my pet or my group?  Or do I buff my pet or myself?  If I buff my pet I have to prey to the number's god I don't take aggro. now.</P> <DIV>You better make it so all my pets have some outstanding group buffs attached to them if this is your idea of balanced.</DIV>

[Bjerde]

The solo arena is a good example. It can be done by rangers, and anyone that says it can't just isn't doing it quite right, *but* it's more difficult and more costly for rangers than other classes. It's also a much bigger PITA, because you have to kite the mobs around the zone to survive. I personally think that I shouldn't have to run around the zone like a chicken with my head cut off if I want to solo. However, if I can take white or even yellow con mobs one on one without kiting then I might be able to kite and kill harder mobs that other classes can't possibly solo. ------------------------------------------------------ This is a very specific example that cannot be correlated with the rest of the discussion on soloing. I, for one, am not sad to see some classes be able to beat this guy. It shows there is some differences in classes. I have a 50 Temp, that I barely beat this guy with...long fight. I have a 38 Assassin, I got the Champ to about 70%. I honestly did not except to do well with my assassin.....face to face, closed quarters. I will not beat him solo, and I am not too worried about it. Know your target, and your class. A ranger should have a VERY hard time in a confined area, makes sense to me. Now (as another specific example) go out to EF with a lvl 50 ranger, and let me know how you do against Tundra Jack. My guess is that you will win, wanna see what he does to my Templar solo at 50?? In Live I can barely solo normal grey heroics, never mind a Named. <div></div>

[Potterguy]

<P>I have spent the last couple of days soloing a sorcerer to 19 on test. I started with no cash and am using only quested and dropped equipment. Soloing has been very easy, and the levels have been going as fast or faster than my skills have risen. In my opinion, soloing with the changes is now easier.</P> <P> </P> <P>Bixle - 19 gnome sorcerer: Test</P>

[jordaann]

Yes please make clear.. are you talking about the combat update (i assume you are) and what class are you trying with and what mobs are you trying to kill. <div></div>

[Tuved2]

That's too bad. Soloing is what's killing this game.

[Hyru]

yeah and guess what... When they eliminate solo'ing and people cant find groups they will quit. Then there are less people on the server to find to group with. Solo should be a viable option that gives a reward, however we like groups..just dont force it on US! That means making it so the only way to obtain good items, or exp is grouping. You have been warned. Better look back at your launch and the mass exodus of people who left. Now look and I bet you see subscribers coming back? Right?

[Daffid011]

I solo just fine and have lots of broken skills at the moment. <div></div>

[merdo]

<P>I think your confused you wont beable to solo heroic mobs anymore and you should have never been able to at all.</P> <P>If you leave EQ2 because you want to solo group encounters more power to you its not fair yo peopel who actually group that some classes can solo a level 50++ (pallies) and not take much damage and end fights with 50% power and yes i know some of you will say but i cant do it.</P> <P>just because you dont dont mean you cant i see pallies solo 48-50 named group mobs in EF all teh time. </P>

[GilfalasElaandrin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blabber wrote:<BR> <DIV>Go ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  </DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I'd like to address your points, but you don't give specifics as to what changes you are talking about. What class have you tested that is unable to solo anything but grey mobs? Where have you seen forced grouping implemented? What makes you think we are trying to eliminate soloing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you are referring to the combat changes, if anything they are meant to make soloing easier for classes that were challenged by it before.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you're talking about a scaling back of downtiered mobs, then please look at the specific areas where changes were made. The focused reversal was limited in scope, and intended to bring a bit more consistency to areas set aside for grouping.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you have experienced specific things on Test that makes you think some of your fears are well founded, please post the details. But if you are merely reacting to messages posted by other people who may or may not have valid observations, I urge you to respond to facts rather than speculation. Panic has a way of feeding upon itself, especially when facing something unknown. The community benefits by addressing facts and hard data, but reacting to rumors seldom helps anything.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I was going to resopnd but Moorgard said it perfectly. Can I 5 star Moorgard?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Really folks, try the changes youself before panicing and read the test server forum. Most of the responses I have read there from TEST players are very positive. The only really negative ones are warrior based classes and the dev's have already said that the warrior classes are still very much in flux.</DIV>

[Palathas]

So far from only completing the Isle I almost started thinking the same thing as the OP. Then I realised that it wasn't that I couldn't solo, it was that I couldn't solo as many mobs as I used to be able to and that certainly isn't a bad thing. I know I have only done the Isle of Refuge and have only scratched the surface but what I've seen so far seems to make things make more sense in most ways. Although the instant casting times on the combat arts is a bit wonky to me at the moment. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I've managed to upgrade some skills and really like how that's handled now and the combat is definitely different but I can't seem to pin point the differences just yet. It just feels different. I think it's mainly to do with the Con of the mobs and how each level affects the player now, which is also very good. Or maybe it's just the timings of things. Don't know, will have to keep an eye on things as I go up levels. After getting over the initial shock of not being able to do what I used to, I think the changes are definitely for the better so far. There is going to be a need for tweaks made here and there but I think over all that once people get used to the combat changes that the game will have a better long term appeal. I'll have to spend a lot more time playing to get some more detailed comments, it'll only be for research purposes though.... <span>:smileytongue:</span> <div></div>

[KnightOfTheWo]

<span><blockquote><hr>Chatele wrote:<font size="5"></font> <div>ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  <div> </div> <div>SoE seems to think the game is too easy, and we won't stick around long enough, because we can gain XP too fast, gain XP soloing, so they are RE-MAKING the game more difficult so forming groups will be neccessary to advance at any efficient rate.  I will vote with my feet if that is to be the final result from what is in BETA now.  </div> <div> </div> <div>Idiocy, I have seen it for SOOOO long from EQ and now EQ2, amazing, simply amazing. </div> <div> </div> <div> </div> <div>I for one as well as my brother will quit the game for good if they make it that I can not solo .... there are many times i cannot group because I do not have the time for it, and times i just prefer to solo... remove the ability for me to solo and i am gone ... I wan't to solo when I choose to, and group when I choose too... Please do not make it harder for us to solo ..... the only reason I have not quit this game so far is the ability to solo or group if I so choose ... remove it, and alot of us soloer's will move on to other games... </div></div><hr></blockquote>You should probably stay FAR away from this game called "Vanguard" when it's released next year...just a tip. Please don't respond to the OPs post as if it's fact. Play on Test, or wait until these changes go live and you've been able to experience them for yourself. No everyone, I'm not a "fanboi" this is just logic I'm using here. Regardless, I'm NOT trying to attack anyone, just trying to get you to see this from another perspective. Good Luck!</span><div></div>

[MadTexan]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Godstalk wrote:<BR> <P>It is.</P> <P>You don't see any soloers going about talking about the massive amount of fabled gear and master spells they get while doing so.<BR></P> <HR> <P>Exactly! The 'uber' loot isn't dropping from solo mobs, people, and you can't drop Anguis, etc. as a solo player while the mob is still green. If you want the big rewards, you have to group and/or raid.</P></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>

[Tokmul]

Three words...<font color="#cc0000"><font size="5">I HATE GROUPING!<font size="3"> </font></font></font><div></div>

[CoquiDa]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ayun wrote:<BR> <DIV>Well, me and my whole family will QUIT if the game doesnt stop making soloing better than grouping!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hah, so there!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why in the world should soloers get as much xp and loot as a group?</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>ROFLOL...  Well, my whole family including those who have passed on, my friends, and my dog will quit the game if they don't make the content entirely solo!  LOL...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am primarily a soloist, and have never found there to be a problem with finding soloable beasties for either my Fury, my Illusionist, my Ranger, or my soon to be SK.  It's there if one wants to find it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That said, I agree wholeheartedly that soloists should not get the same exp, OR loot, as groups are able to.  There is simply not as much effort to soloing as there is to coordinating one's play, (as well as breaks to get a coke or use the bathroom, put the kid to bed, answer the phone, etc.,) when grouping.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for the people who don't understand why soloing is even an option, there are those of us who want to play even when the groups available are not to our liking.  I don't like exp. groups, as a rule.  Too frantic, too intent on non-stop killing, too impatient, etc, for my taste.  I prefer a slower play style that allows for actual socializing and, when grouped, planning how to take the next objective.  I should not be forced to group with you in order to play the game, nor should you be forced to group with me.  Grouping should be something that happens not because it is required to play the game, but because it is desired.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~</DIV>

[CoquiDa]

<P> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> KnightOfTheWord wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR>No everyone, I'm not a "fanboi" this is just logic I'm using here. <BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>"Fanboi"...  Isn't that the term that is applied to anyone who refuses to pay for a totally sucky product put out by a totally sucky company full of totally sucky devs that have some totally sucky secret agenda to make the game totally sucky because they, the company, and the product totally suck, but instead are happy with the product and feel that they are getting their money's worth from their subscription?  :smileyvery-happy:</P> <P>(Edited to add:  GOTTA love it!  Got one starred, apparently by one of the fanboi haters! :smileyvery-happy::smileyvery-happy::smileyvery-happy: )</P> <P>~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~</P> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><p>Message Edited by CoquiDave on <span class=date_text>08-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:12 PM</span>

[Isengrim]

<span><blockquote><hr>Tokmul wrote:Three words...<font color="#cc0000"><font size="5">I HATE GROUPING!<font size="3"> </font></font></font><div></div><hr></blockquote>I hate soloing.  I am having a very tough time leveling my Brigand because 1) the population sucks and 2) nobody seems to want to group at low levels.  This may be my server only, I don't know.  I will tell you this, Izzy would have never made it to lvl 50 the way the game is today.  I would have quit long ago.  Fortunately people group at higher levels so I can still enjoy the game.  Group chat and interaction take away the "grind" for me.  In a good group I level without even noticing it. This game feels VERY lonely when I play my lowbie toons.  I long for the days of 5 oakmyst forrest's and 4 antonica's with tons of people spamming LFG!  <span>:smileyhappy:</span></span><div></div>

[Styk]

Lol all of this talk of Vanguard being the dream game... they already are starting to look like a pipe dream with all of their plans for there game, Vanguard will have to be the game of dreams to be able to bury this game. But guess what ? That is highly unlikely so will have to sit and wait, till then EQ2 is the game for me... /applaud SoE for taking steps to un noobify EQ2 <div></div>

[Daffid011]

Just for perspective, I can still solo green heroic groups outside of triple up arrow (they just outlast your power supply and patience).  However now I can solo some blue con heroic groups, even a few ^^ with the new changes and most of my new goodies still don't work.  Whites con heroics I could not solo.  My gear is only so-so. <div></div>

[Meyle]

Soloing is starting to become more of an issue since there is not such a big population at the lower lvl's anymore.  Think about it, most players joined around release time, give or take a couple months.  So naturally most of the palyers are high lvls, and thus, easier to find groups at that lvl.  Soloing has to stay in the game and from what I've heard, has, for the simple fact that it is hard to find a group sometimes.  EQ1 players remeber the countless hours sitting around waiting for groups, doing next to nothing to advance their exp because their class wasn't as solo capable as others. I'm just waiting for the day when a group of gnolls come to raid my house.  I'm tired of looking for stuff to kill, I want to be a raid mob.  I want Flippy to get his friends together and get the "access to the Dwarf Necromancer Suite" quest done.  Then zerg thier pay past my Dreadsnout, Hellhound and Duck double up group mobs.  I'm waiting for you Flippy! <div></div>

[EtoilePirate]

<span><blockquote><hr>Meyle wrote:Soloing is starting to become more of an issue since there is not such a big population at the lower lvl's anymore.  Think about it, most players joined around release time, give or take a couple months.  So naturally most of the palyers are high lvls, and thus, easier to find groups at that lvl.  Soloing has to stay in the game and from what I've heard, has, for the simple fact that it is hard to find a group sometimes. <div></div><hr></blockquote> This is true -- on Test, until the combat changes rolled out, I watched the bulk of the population go from 20-30 then from 30-40 and now it's really skewing 30-50, except that of course there's been a massive influx of new placers at the lower levels, so it's balanced again that way. Of course, SOE doesn't just put out expansions whenever they feel like it.  They've carefully timed, in some department or other, that by now the game's going to be skewing high-level, so they'll put out an expansion -- which is just the sort of thing that gets the name EQ2 out there, gets written up on websites and in magazines, and indicates to people that after most of a year the game's still going strong.  In other words, it draws in new customers, and a new surge of low-level players.  Then sometime in mid-2006, rinse and repeat, I'm sure. That said, however, there's more to it than that.  At the low levels, you're either (1) new to the game and sorting yourself out so you don't look like a complete n00b (written that way intentionally) when you group, or you're (2) an alt, pretty familiar with all this already, and knowing that honestly even solo it'll take you zero time to reach 10 and only a little time to hit 20 thereafter.  With the exception of the orc, I've been in one IoR duo that was a pickup group and in two IoR duos that were me and my significant other.  The low-level game moves so quickly that there's no real reason to group except for the heavy-duty targets.  In fact to some degree I think that the <20 game and the >20 game are two completely different things.  And when you get to the higher levels, unless you're pretty much grinding writ mobs and simple quests (as I have been for the last week), there's not much to do without a group.  Which is, you know, kind of how I think it should be.  Grouping and interdependence are things you learn along the way, with the rest of your skills.  ::shrug::</span><div></div>

[Chate]

<DIV>Am I the only one that sees the irony in wanting to sign on to a MMORPG to solo.  If you want to solo why dont you just get a xbox or ps2 they have lots of solo RPGs there.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=4><FONT color=#ff0066>You are missing the point</FONT> .... I am so tired of those ignorant remarks!! We prefer to solo when we do not have the time to put into grouping .... Solo ability is a very important asset of any game. All the games, (and they are few) that did not allow solo play did not last long, or have a very small player base, cause people find later on that they don't always have the time to group , (due to work schedule, etc) or can't find one and wish THEN that they could solo a mob till they can group...  That's why SOE added solo content to begin with, cause the majority of the player base wanted it .... and some left the game because the lack there of. Only reason why I have stayed with this game, cause I was , as many other's ready to cancel our account for lack of soloability till they added the solo content and made it worth soloing. After all, the reason I bought this game was because they advertised it as "Solo Friendly" which it was far from ....</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=4>They finally got the solo part ALMOST to that point of "solo friendly" ... so why screw that part UP!!!!!!!!!!!!   just make grouping more rewarding, up the group experience , give them special drops you don't get when you solo, without nerfing us soloers ... to DO SO, would be a huge mistake  ... they will lose alot of customers... more then what they lost before they added the solo content .... that is MHO. :smileysad:  </FONT></DIV>

[Chate]

<DIV> <DIV>Well, me and my whole family will QUIT if the game doesnt stop making soloing better than grouping!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hah, so there!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why in the world should soloers get as much xp and loot as a group? Soloing should be an option BUT NOT THE BEST OPTION for loot and xp. I give YOU A CHALLENGE - Try to have a group between levels 10-20 go xp in the commonlands! Ya try to find some HEROIC mobs in the commonlands! Hahahahahaha. Theyr'e alllllll gone. the game used to be challenging. The soloers cried. SoE totally went off the deep end replacing close to ALL heroic mobs with solo mobs in ALL outside zones and many even in dungeons. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as solo xp is concerned it shoudl never be as good per encounter as it is in a group!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>where you playing lol .... I solo alot... but when the opportunity for grouping with my guild mates comes along... i jump at .. cause the experience is better and alot faster .... the problem is not with soloer's ..... it is with grouping, as far as give them more exp .... with out taking away from us soloer's ... and give groups better drops for grouping .... And that's why there Dungeon's.  EVERY one of them are loaded with heroic and raid mobs ... I MEAN LOADED.....  that's where all the groups prefer to go anyway's... more fun!!!!!!!!!!!   Just wish there was more solo content in the dungeons .... </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is rediculous. At least make the zones HALF AND HALF on heroic vs solo mobs!! <FONT color=#ff0033>Now that would be EXCELLENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</FONT></DIV></DIV>

[slx]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blabber wrote:<BR> <DIV>Go ahead, force us to form groups, decrease the XP we get off mobs, make it VERY DIFFICULT to solo anything other than Grey Mobs and I PROMISE you, I along with MANY other soloers will QUIT in droves!  This game is good, because you can play solo, force to do otherwise and it will no longer be ANY FUN!  </DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I'd like to address your points, but you don't give specifics as to what changes you are talking about. What class have you tested that is unable to solo anything but grey mobs? Where have you seen forced grouping implemented? What makes you think we are trying to eliminate soloing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you are referring to the combat changes, if anything they are meant to make soloing easier for classes that were challenged by it before.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you're talking about a scaling back of downtiered mobs, then please look at the specific areas where changes were made. The focused reversal was limited in scope, and intended to bring a bit more consistency to areas set aside for grouping.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you have experienced specific things on Test that makes you think some of your fears are well founded, please post the details. But if you are merely reacting to messages posted by other people who may or may not have valid observations, I urge you to respond to facts rather than speculation. Panic has a way of feeding upon itself, especially when facing something unknown. The community benefits by addressing facts and hard data, but reacting to rumors seldom helps anything.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Thank you for posting and you are correct. What you have to understand is that you have a lot of jumpy people and with good reason. You have baggage that follows you from EQ. This is perhaps, not by any fault of your own, but something you are going to have to contend with. </DIV> <DIV><BR>Towards the final days of my EQ experience, I would cringe at any possibility of an update. They weren’t exciting they were terrifying. How, was my class going to be whittled down now, what skill or ability were they going to nerf now all in the name of class balance? I cannot stress HOW much SoE paid for the emasculation of its classes. I cannot stress how much SoE paid for its rejection of 80% of its player base. I simply don’t want to see SoE making the same mistakes over and over and over again.</DIV> <DIV><BR>3.5 Million clients are making a statement with their wallets about soloing. SoE needs to be sure the listen to the message. I am glad to hear that SoE is not going back on its word and still sees soloing as an integral part of its design philosophy.</DIV> <DIV><BR>SoE once echoed this sentiment, and I keep hearing it made by others. So I would like to comment.</DIV> <DIV><BR> <HR> Am I the only one that sees the irony in wanting to sign on to a MMORPG to solo.  If you want to solo why dont you just get a xbox or ps2 they have lots of solo RPGs there.  <HR> </DIV> <DIV><BR>Unfortunately, no, and you’re wrong. </DIV> <DIV><BR>With the ROI that an MMO's bring in, they can afford to invest much more into game design than they can with a single user version. Consider that the game company collects about 15$ a person for a 45$ game. That same company can collect upwards of $200 a year per copy with an MMO. They can afford to make a much richer product for an MMO, and they have to, to keep up with the market. A lot of people are attracted to MMO’s simply because they are better games than what PS2 and Xbox have to offer.</DIV> <DIV><BR>Social also does not mean grouping. The first guild I belonged to had around 200 members, we rarely grouped together. We chatted, socialized and helped each other out when we could. Socialization did not come from group chat it came from the guild. Battles today are so involved and so quick, that now you don’t really have a lot of time to socialize. There is a large demographic in EQ(2) that play because they see it as a fantasy version of the SIM’s.</DIV> <DIV><BR>There are also the people who partially solo. Those are people that prefer to group with a small group of friends or a family that plays together. While they don’t technically solo, sometimes they don’t pick the optimum characters to group and sometimes, they can’t all get on at the same time. In my old guild there was a father and son team that would play, while the son was off in college. When they couldn’t meet up they would solo. </DIV> <DIV><BR>So there are a myriad of legitimate reasons to solo. Most of the people I have known, will solo, group and raid. Some have a favorite play style, but none are purest. To say that soloing and MMO's don't mix is to not fully understand all they have to offer.<BR></DIV><p>Message Edited by slxty on <span class=date_text>08-11-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:40 PM</span>