Invest 1000s of hours work on a class to have the role rewritting afterwards..

[RobCardIV]

<div></div>I understand change. I understand restructure, tweeking, and correction. BUT YOU DONT SELL A PRODUCT TO SOMEONE, ALLOW THEN THEM SPEND *** HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS *** OF HOURS INVESTING THEMSELVES INTO A ROLE. AND THEN CHANGE THE FLUKIN ROLE. Forgive me, I RAGE AT STUPIDITY. JUST LIKE EQ1. MONKS WERE TANKS. I ENVESTED MONTHS APON MONTHS OF HARD WORK. Then 2 years later sony DECIDES , WELL, We didnt mean for Monks to be that good of tanks, so they are now nerfed, You are a half [Removed for Content] DPS, and a lesser half [Removed for Content] TANK. Welcome to the world of garbage. you tank like SHIZIGIT. you DPS likea weakling. Were very glad you pay us, were sorry we allowed you to invest your life into a role.. we personally dont care, this is how we have decided to chance our mind.. Please dont speak about WORLD OF WARCRAFT, we have alreasy lost 40 percent of our players, and the rest of the players are still here because they havent tried it yet..  The cloud of illusions about how much worse it is shields the truth. - - - - I understand that things get out of wack.. and a class becomes somthing better than what it was intended to be.. but if you allow someone to PAY and PLAY.. this isnt something people just CLICK and WIN. WE WORK OUR RASS'ES OFF to get there. - - - - Good luck keeping the company afloat, sony has the records of lost players, I love the game.. i wish em the best of luck.. Just wake up , play a few games made by a few of the competitors.. and take a few notes..  - - I would agree with change. If it didnt come at the cost of LIFEs Work. <div></div>

[Moontayle]

<P>9 months is not a 'Life's work'. You really need to lighten up. They're making these changes so that they can put people back into the roles they were meant to perform before things got out of hand. They're making sure the Archtype system gets back on track and they're also going to make the game more challenging as a result.</P> <P><STRONG>They're protecting the long term playability of the game.</STRONG></P> <P>Go chill dude. You are putting way too much on a mere video game.</P>

[Naginata]

I love constructive posts!

[Styk]

<div></div>No offense Moontayle but telling the OP to lighten up its just a game is way off base..... there are a bunch of people who have put a good amount of money ( i have spent total for this game about just over $1600.00 now that includes a whole new PC, collectors edition ,subscription fees, adventure packs ) and  have spent a good amount of time as well on their own character  development Now people like myself are  crossing our fingers hoping they dont "over balance"  it...... i know an adjustment was needed to be made with the class i chose but SoE has a track record with various games now of not "fixing " stuff but breaking stuff and takin forever to fix it to its previous operation...... So far the way they have handled this game is pretty mediocre ( i mean in all honesty i dont think EQ1 was meant to still be a more thriving game then eq2 but the latest research has shown that eq1 is back up to 500k+ active subscribers while eq2 cant even break 400k ) Now im about to spend more money on an expansion pack in a few weeks, in all due honesty it will be the only expansion pack i purchase for  this game if SoE doesnt start rethinking its strategy on who TRULY is their target market ( lets face it eq2 will NEVER be able to compete with the WoW market, they never intended to gun for the hardcores..... ) Many people like to say that the casual gamer is the lifeblood in this game... i would really like to see some research on that ( i mean as of July 05 ) in timeline because from what i have noticed these past several months is only the hardcores have survived in everquest 2 so far .... SoE what happen to makin this game revolutionary ? You have put in some new concepts so far like moving objects etc in instances ..... but really . I think your OVER utilization of instancing is what is making this game too artifitial... I dunno maybe it feels that way atm because their is a lack of physical zones oveall in the game ( expansions should solve that problem ) im hoping that is the case.... SOE you really need to find out WHAT IS YOUR TRUE MARKET BECAUSE I CAN TELL YOU THIS, COMPETING WITH WoW is gonna get you NO where because they created their own market..... NOW WHY DONT YOU CREATE YOURS   ...... <div></div><p>Message Edited by Styker on <span class=date_text>07-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:58 PM</span>

[DaenaeRavenso]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> RobCardIV wrote:<BR> I understand change.<BR>I understand restructure, tweeking, and correction.<BR><BR>BUT YOU DONT SELL A PRODUCT TO SOMEONE, ALLOW THEN THEM SPEND *** HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS ***<BR>OF HOURS INVESTING THEMSELVES INTO A ROLE.<BR>AND THEN CHANGE THE FLUKIN ROLE.<BR><BR>Forgive me, I RAGE AT STUPIDITY.<BR><BR>JUST LIKE EQ1.<BR>MONKS WERE TANKS. I ENVESTED MONTHS APON MONTHS OF HARD WORK.<BR><BR>Then 2 years later sony DECIDES , WELL, We didnt mean for Monks to be that good of tanks, so they are now nerfed, <BR>You are a half [Removed for Content] DPS, and a lesser half [Removed for Content] TANK.<BR>Welcome to the world of garbage. you tank like SHIZIGIT. you DPS likea weakling.<BR>Were very glad you pay us, were sorry we allowed you to invest your life into a role.. <BR>we personally dont care, this is how we have decided to chance our mind.. <BR><BR>Please dont speak about WORLD OF WARCRAFT, we have alreasy lost 40 percent of our players, and the rest of the players are still here because they havent tried it yet..  The cloud of illusions about how much worse it is shields the truth.<BR><BR>- - - - <BR><BR>I understand that things get out of wack.. and a class becomes somthing better than what it was intended to be.. <BR>but if you allow someone to PAY and PLAY.. this isnt something people just CLICK and WIN.<BR><BR>WE WORK OUR RASS'ES OFF to get there.<BR><BR>- - - - <BR>Good luck keeping the company afloat, sony has the records of lost players, I love the game.. i wish em the best of luck..<BR><BR>Just wake up , play a few games made by a few of the competitors.. and take a few notes.. <BR> - - I would agree with change. If it didnt come at the cost of LIFEs Work.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>/em Takes away the bottle of Jim Beam from RobCardlv and backs slowly away.......</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Dae</DIV>

[Ramsy02]

you guys are complaining about stuff you havnt even tested yet. Well unless your in beta for DoF .. but then you couldnt post about the revamps anyways. People need to relax and just see what happens when these combat changes go live. As for monks, from what i have read, they are going to improve your tanking ability and decrease your dps output.. so whats the big problem? <div></div>

[Cla]

You havent played anything yet until you have played a wizard. SOE nerfed our armor rating now we have paper armor. And after that we they screwed up our damage rating as well but i dont complain. Im just adjusting myself to the new changes when they comes along. So should you.

[Cuz]

<DIV><FONT color=#ffff00>"SOE you really need to find out WHAT IS YOUR TRUE MARKET BECAUSE I CAN TELL YOU THIS, COMPETING WITH WoW is gonna get you NO where because they created their own market..... NOW WHY DONT YOU CREATE YOURS   ...... "</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why is it that everyone sees MMOs as black and white? Why is there only hardcore (EQ1) and "casual" (WoW)? To me WoW is easy, not casual. I want to play a game with adults and kids a like, but not elitists or AOL brats. I think that the EQ2 target audience is me or rather people like me. People that want to <U>play</U> an MMO after work, or school or after the kids are in bed. Not a game that makes us <U>work</U> to get to do anything. There isn't just hardcore or easy, the grey inbetween I think is where EQ2 lies.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff00>"No offense Moontayle but telling the OP to lighten up its just a game is way off base..... there are a bunch of people who have put a good amount of money ( i have spent total for this game about just over $1600.00 now that includes a whole new PC, collectors edition ,subscription fees, adventure packs ) and  have spent a good amount of time as well on their own character  development"</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Don't forget your rent too. You need a place to put that computer that you bought solely for and use exclusively for EQ2. So we'll say 500$ a month. That's another 4 500$. So you're down 6 100$ for EQ2! Oh my.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff00>"So far the way they have handled this game is pretty mediocre ( i mean in all honesty i dont think EQ1 was meant to still be a more thriving game then eq2 but the latest research has shown that eq1 is back up to 500k+ active subscribers while eq2 cant even break 400k )"</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'd like to see how many actually loggin for more than 2 hours a week. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff00>"SoE what happen to makin this game revolutionary ?"</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I can agree with this. I don't find the game revolutionay per say. I think it's really pretty, I'm very pleased with the game play, I find most of the quests enjoyable, but there's no real part that makes me go "Now this is 3rd generation MMO!". Don't get me wrong I love the game, but it doesn't drop my jaw.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff00>"Good luck keeping the company afloat, sony has the records of lost players, I love the game.. i wish em the best of luck.."</FONT></DIV> <P><FONT color=#ffff00><FONT color=#ffffff>Hahaha! I think Sony will be fine. You do realise they make more than EQs right?</FONT></FONT></P> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <P>Message Edited by Jenoy on <SPAN class=date_text>07-31-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>04:31 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Jenoy on <span class=date_text>07-31-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:31 AM</span>

[Amise]

<span><blockquote><hr>RobCardIV wrote:<div></div> Forgive me, I RAGE AT STUPIDITY. <div></div><hr></blockquote>Since when does raging at something mean imitating it. </span><div></div>

[Airzi]

<P>This game really needs some balancing. It's a fact there is a huge issue right now, with tanks being so overpowered.</P> <P> </P> <P>It is a fact, wether you are in a group, or  in a raiding guild raid. a lot of the dps comes from tanks. You cant do anything without</P> <DIV>a tank and healer. Scouts are nice to have for little more dps... but not needed. Mages are greatly useless (unless for support tasks like buffing, feeding power, ...).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Things really need to be rebalanced in order to make every class as needed. the introduction of the scout main class makes it harder than in eq1... but seriously things are getting frustrating.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dont spend my life crying about it or posting on forums... but really a change is needed. And yes nerfing can be part of it for many of us... not because SOE is evil, but because balancing is a complex and long time process.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Unlike WoW which is as casual gamer game, EQ2 is much more complex, deeper, ... It's here to last years and years, with probably 10+ expansions to come. Right now, a balance is much needed. Do your best SoE.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you could improve customer relationship at the same time, and for example, answer people on forums... it would rock.</DIV>

[RedRockCandy!]

<div></div>Wow holy crap! In EQ1 monks are tanks too?! In EQOA Monks are the BEST Melee class in the game. <div></div>

[Ramsy02]

<span><blockquote><hr>Clash wrote:You havent played anything yet until you have played a wizard. SOE nerfed our armor rating now we have paper armor. And after that we they screwed up our damage rating as well but i dont complain. Im just adjusting myself to the new changes when they comes along. So should you. <div></div><hr></blockquote>I do have a high level wizard also. yes its rough at times.. but hell we can solo almost anything with unbreakable roots <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> just if mob hit us once, bam dead.. They screwed up your wizards damage rating? i can keep up with warlocks dps.. ? is that what u meant? or was it the 300% increase to some key spell damage the way they screwed up mages dps? </span><div></div>

[Noctismort]

Sounds like someone has gotten a taste of the combat revamp. Well this doesnt look good at all. Im used to playing my guardian the way he is now. Ive played him since release. You change the game so much after this long and expect me to just "like" my new class . 'Pizz off. Im gone never to purchase another SOE game period. I took this crap in EQ I with the wizard fiasco, not going through it again. Like is way to [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] short.

[Kittypoo]

Just wondering.....as far as subscription numbers go, do they just count number of accounts?  What about those of use that bought all access accounts.  Do they count those as EQ1 subscriptions, or are they counting the number of toons online at any given time?  I would imagine those numbers would go up in the summer when kids are out of school. <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>How about those of us that started with EQ1 and switched over to EQ2.  I never deleted my old toons because.....well, i spent 2+ years working on them.  They are part of me, I guess. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just wondering</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Naginata]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Noctismortis wrote:<BR> Sounds like someone has gotten a taste of the combat revamp. Well this doesnt look good at all. Im used to playing my guardian the way he is now. Ive played him since release. You change the game so much after this long and expect me to just "like" my new class . 'Pizz off. Im gone never to purchase another SOE game period. I took this crap in EQ I with the wizard fiasco, not going through it again. Like is way to [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] short.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Sounds like someone beleives any rant they read regardless of how made up and off base it is. Well this looks about the same as normal. I am used to posting the way I do now, I have since release. If the other posters stopped making crap up and ranting with no reason or information would they expect me to just "like" the new forums? 'Pizz off. I'm never gone to purchase another SOE game period! I took this crap in SWG with the hiring moderators to keep the trolling down fiasco, not going through it again! Like is way to [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] short.</P> <P> </P> <P>(insert a (sic) after every other word)</P>

[Solaran_X]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> RobCardIV wrote:<BR> I understand change.<BR>I understand restructure, tweeking, and correction.<BR><BR>BUT YOU DONT SELL A PRODUCT TO SOMEONE, ALLOW THEN THEM SPEND *** HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS ***<BR>OF HOURS INVESTING THEMSELVES INTO A ROLE.<BR>AND THEN CHANGE THE FLUKIN ROLE.<BR><BR>Forgive me, I RAGE AT STUPIDITY.<BR><BR>JUST LIKE EQ1.<BR>MONKS WERE TANKS. I ENVESTED MONTHS APON MONTHS OF HARD WORK.<BR><BR>Then 2 years later sony DECIDES , WELL, We didnt mean for Monks to be that good of tanks, so they are now nerfed, <BR>You are a half [Removed for Content] DPS, and a lesser half [Removed for Content] TANK.<BR>Welcome to the world of garbage. you tank like SHIZIGIT. you DPS likea weakling.<BR>Were very glad you pay us, were sorry we allowed you to invest your life into a role.. <BR>we personally dont care, this is how we have decided to chance our mind.. <BR><BR>Please dont speak about WORLD OF WARCRAFT, we have alreasy lost 40 percent of our players, and the rest of the players are still here because they havent tried it yet..  The cloud of illusions about how much worse it is shields the truth.<BR><BR>- - - - <BR><BR>I understand that things get out of wack.. and a class becomes somthing better than what it was intended to be.. <BR>but if you allow someone to PAY and PLAY.. this isnt something people just CLICK and WIN.<BR><BR>WE WORK OUR RASS'ES OFF to get there.<BR><BR>- - - - <BR>Good luck keeping the company afloat, sony has the records of lost players, I love the game.. i wish em the best of luck..<BR><BR>Just wake up , play a few games made by a few of the competitors.. and take a few notes.. <BR> - - I would agree with change. If it didnt come at the cost of LIFEs Work.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>First off, the classes are unbalanced and that is being addressed. The addressing has already begun with the "nerfing" (balancing) of the Robe of the Invoker and Golden Efreeti Boots. In regards to tha tanks...I got a news flash for you.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>YOU AREN'T MEANT TO BE DPS!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Guardians/Berserkers (and to a lesser role Paladins/Shadow Knights) are only there to keep the enemy's attention and get their head pounded while the true DPS classes (which are supposed to be Scouts and Mages) actually kill a mob. That is how it was in EQLive, and that is how it was SUPPOSED to be in EQ2. But the DPS ratings of the tanks was made too high, and is not being fixed. Just because you got used to playing the broken version of the class is your fault - not SOE's. They're doing their job and fixing the problem.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And furthermore...isn't it mentioned somewhere that "Gaming experience may change during online play"? Well guess what - you were warned that SOE can and will change the game to support it's longevity. And if you don't like it, then don't play.</DIV>

[Beghard]

I think the problem is that it had to be done in the first place and when it gets fixed ppl complain. No one even knows how its guna turn out and their crying. At least be thankfull they care about you anuff to fix it. <div></div>

[themysterious]

<span><blockquote><hr>RobCardIV wrote:<div></div><font color="#ffffcc">Please dont speak about WORLD OF WARCRAFT, we have alreasy lost 40 percent of our players, and the rest of the players are still here because they havent tried it yet..  The cloud of illusions about how much worse it is shields the truth.</font> <hr></blockquote>Don't bring it up if you don't want people to speak about it, especially when you make completely untrue statements. I played WoW, I could not stand it... that is why I am here. The same goes for pretty much everyone I know who play EQ2... As to the general topic of your post: Have you actually experienced the combat changes? I am guessing no. Did you really think SOE would change the game completely? Did you really think they are going to [Removed for Content] off every single on of their subscribers? The combat revamp is about balance, not about change. It is about fixing, for the best, spells that have been broken for a long time. It is about making upgrades to spells, actual upgrades. Yes the classes have changed, but they have changed for the best. There will be bugs for a while to come, but over all it will be for the best. If you are a brawler you will be no less, and no more desirable then any of the other tanking classes. If you are a fury, you will be no less, and no more desirable then any of the other healing classes. Your class, what ever you are, hasn't been nerfed. SOE is not dumb enough to make a class weaker... instead they have made the weaker classes stronger. Just wait until they come live, and if you don't like them... go play WoW or FFXI or one of the other games. EQ2 is just a game you know, if you are not enjoying yourself and you feel like your time is being invested instead of enjoyed, then perhaps it is time for you to move on to another game, or to perhaps re-evaluate wether you should be playing games like this.</span><div></div>

[Naginata]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> themysteriousne wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> RobCardIV wrote:<BR> <FONT color=#ffffcc>Please dont speak about WORLD OF WARCRAFT, we have alreasy lost 40 percent of our players, and the rest of the players are still here because they havent tried it yet..  The cloud of illusions about how much worse it is shields the truth.</FONT><BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Your class, what ever you are, hasn't been nerfed. SOE is not dumb enough to make a class weaker... instead they have made the weaker classes stronger.<BR><BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>No, there are nerfing. The problem they are fixing is the game is too easy for groups, raids, and certain classes, and too hard for a few classes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They are not raising everyone up to the highest level and making the game as hard as progressques (<A href="http://www.progressquest.com" target=_blank>www.progressquest.com</A>!!! Its free!!!)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Gardvo]

Don't break the NDA.All I can say is, if you think this guy is overreacting, You ain't seen nothing yet. Thank goodness I play a scout <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Larri]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>themysteriousne wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR><BR>As to the general topic of your post: Have you actually experienced the combat changes? I am guessing no. Did you really think SOE would change the game completely? Did you really think they are going to [Removed for Content] off every single on of their subscribers?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>Actually, based on past history of what SOE has done, then yes, they have a very high probably [Removed for Content] off a very large percentage of those who play the affected class/group of players.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>In EQII, a few months ago, there was heated discussion on whether quest items should be made nodrop (not attunable, but simply nodrop) so that crafters can sell their items.  At the same time, SOE conveniently ignored that most of the items flooding the market were not quest items but crafted items (a crafter who needs to do over 100 combines to do one level up can support over 50 non-crafter just in one level, hence the flooding).  Luckily, people posts actually convinced SOE to look at the effect of attuning before actually changing them to nodrop.  And SOE hasn't raised this issue again.  Without all these skeptic posts, do you think SOE will reconsider their design?  And more importantly, such suggestion should not come out in the first place because anybody who has vague knowledge on the crafting system, the levelling requirement and knowledge in the bazaar will know that making quest item nodrop will not solve anything.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN></SPAN><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>Another classic example that SOE doesn't really know about its game is the monk nerf in EQ1.  It took SOE over 3 years to realise and admit that monks were over-nerfed (and only recently did they reverse part of the nerf).</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>Do we want to see the outcome before making suggestions?  Yes we do.  But will it be too late to raise our concerns after they put the changes to test?  In a place where there has been history where changes were put in for 8 hours before being migrated to production servers?</FONT><BR><BR>The combat revamp is about balance, not about change. It is about fixing, for the best, spells that have been broken for a long time. It is about making upgrades to spells, actual upgrades. Yes the classes have changed, but they have changed for the best. There will be bugs for a while to come, but over all it will be for the best. If you are a brawler you will be no less, and no more desirable then any of the other tanking classes. If you are a fury, you will be no less, and no more desirable then any of the other healing classes.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>It is about change.  Change in order of DPS.  Change in methods of tanking.  Change in utility provided.  You have to be very very optimistic to say that the change will not affect your class' desirability.  Especially since SOE cannot get it right in the first place despite this being the original goal.  Especially since it takes SOE so many months of work without any concrete solution.  The longer it takes, the more likely the problem is more fundamental in nature, and the more likely that the changes are more drastic.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>Your class, what ever you are, hasn't been nerfed. SOE is not dumb enough to make a class weaker... instead they have made the weaker classes stronger.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>Just wait until they come live, and if you don't like them... go play WoW or FFXI or one of the other games. EQ2 is just a game you know, if you are not enjoying yourself and you feel like your time is being invested instead of enjoyed, then perhaps it is time for you to move on to another game, or to perhaps re-evaluate wether you should be playing games like this.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>Just imagine this.  You are in an amateur league of, say, baseball, and playing against other amateur teams and having fun.  You are having fun and adjusting your strategy and tactics against your opposition.  Then, in the middle of the season, the organiser decided to change the format from baseball to.... football!!!  How will you think?</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000>After all, both are amateur leagues, both are sports.  You shouldn't be so [Removed for Content], should you?</FONT><BR></P></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>

[themysterious]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr><p>themysteriousne wrote:<span><font color="#ccccff">As to the general topic of your post: Have you actually experienced the combat changes? I am guessing no. Did you really think SOE would change the game completely? Did you really think they are going to [Removed for Content] off every single on of their subscribers?</font>Larries wrote:</span><font color="#ffff99"><span>Actually, based on past history of what SOE has done, then yes, they have a very high probably [Removed for Content] off a very large percentage of those who play the affected class/group of players.</span></font></p><hr></blockquote>I would argue that they have a high probability of [Removed for Content] off a large percentage of players who spend alot of time on the forums, which is a low percentage in general; and hence the majority of players won't care.I agree that they don't have a perfect record, but I am still confident that this change will be for the best, and that after it goes live a few people will kick up a stink, but most of them will secretly keep playing in the background and enjoy the changes. Those who are truely outraged by the changes will simply move onto another game, in turn the changes will bring others back.<span><blockquote><hr><span><p><span>themysteriousne wrote:</span><span><font color="#ccccff">Just wait until they come live, and if you don't like them... go play WoW or FFXI or one of the other games. EQ2 is just a game you know, if you are not enjoying yourself and you feel like your time is being invested instead of enjoyed, then perhaps it is time for you to move on to another game, or to perhaps re-evaluate wether you should be playing games like this.</font></span></p></span><span><span>Larries wrote:</span></span><font color="#ffffcc"><span>Just imagine this.  You are in an amateur league of, say, baseball, and playing against other amateur teams and having fun.  You are having fun and adjusting your strategy and tactics against your opposition.  Then, in the middle of the season, the organiser decided to change the format from baseball to.... football!!!  How will you think?</span></font><font color="#ffffcc"><span><p><span>After all, both are amateur leagues, both are sports.  You shouldn't be so [Removed for Content], should you?</span></p></span></font><div></div><div></div><hr></blockquote>Darn right I would be annoyed, and if SOE turned EQ2 in to a First-Person-Shooter I would be as annoyed... but what SOE is doing is absolutely not on the scale of what you are suggesting. You will probably have to re-adjust your stratergies, ect, but they certainly aren't changing the format of the game.</span></span><div></div>

[ThePhoni]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Solaran_X wrote:<BR><BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Guardians/Berserkers (and to a lesser role Paladins/Shadow Knights) are only there to keep the enemy's attention and get their head pounded while the true DPS classes (which are supposed to be Scouts and Mages) actually kill a mob. That is how it was in EQLive, and that is how it was SUPPOSED to be in EQ2. But the DPS ratings of the tanks was made too high, and is not being fixed. <EM><U><STRONG>Just because you got used to playing the broken version of the class is your fault - not SOE's.</STRONG> </U></EM>They're doing their job and fixing the problem.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>OH MY GOD.  Your are saying that we, the player base, is WRONG for playing broken classes?  Classes, that were created, developed and put into production by SOE?  That these balance problems are caused by players playing the classes avaiable to them; and not the [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing people that MADE the game?</P> <P>How can you argue with people that could possibly believe that... *sigh* <BR></P>

[Cecil_Stri]

<DIV>Isn't this the same guy who made a post abit ago about being level 18 and dieing and goin down on kill death ratio?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I could be wrong it may not be him but his writing style is abit unique and it was same style.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>level 18 isn't exactly alot of work...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Yeah checked it was him... 18 bruiser (guess he ment brawler since he hasn't even made it to bruiser yet)</DIV> <P>Same wow is great crap too in the other post.... <P>  <P>Now take your Blizzard fanboi glasses off and realize that not everyone likes what you do.. get over yourself and yes i have played WoW IT SUCKS</P><p>Message Edited by Cecil_Strife on <span class=date_text>08-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:07 AM</span>

[DarkLegacy2005]

<DIV> <DIV>Oh no! SOE making changes! OMG, pull out the crosses children, we need to cleanse your souls before SOE gets to them! /sacasm off</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its amazing how so many people are all [Removed for Content] off when they dont even know exactly whats coming. Relax man, and if you get so uptight and so in to eq2 that a combat change is going to affect your life... step back, stop, think... breathe... look at the eq2 box... and think about what you are holding... the box... to a game... now breath out... glad we got the fact that its a game outta the way.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So... anyone here not up for a new challenge? Heck man, if you are SO set in your ways that you are not even open to what SOE might do... this game might not be for you with SOE's track record. I am all ready for a full shake up of what I am used to, interested in new challenges and looking at things differently. Am I upset that my platinum might have been spent in the wrong place after the combat revamp? NO!... why you ask? cuz its a game. Hence... its all about challenge. No need to be the uberest of the uber, its about having fun. And BTW, when you find your uber set of gear and get it all set up the way you want, know that SOE will be patching the next day to change another set to make it better or yours worse. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All about change... live with it. Accept it as a challenge, not a calling from God saying that the end of days is coming. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To Styker - From Common Sense</DIV> <DIV>   Dear Styker... I want you to know that computers can be used for more then playing EQ2. There is games, there is work... there is also 'play' =P, and I would like you to know that your $1000 will not be wasted if EQ2 goes to crap. With that in mind, I would also like to suggest you get medical help in dealing with your obsession with EQ2. Knowing full well that it is not a drug, I suggest the help over a drug addiction facility, although you might want to look into that as well because you never know what kind of advice they might have to offer. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just a thought - Common Sense</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh ya, the government says to remember your duct tape in case of a catastrophe. Never know, might work for if you think EQ2 has gone too far. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In closing, relax... and take my post in good humor.</DIV></DIV><p>Message Edited by DarkLegacy2005 on <span class=date_text>08-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:19 AM</span>

[Suraklin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> RedRockCandy! wrote:<BR> Wow holy crap! In EQ1 monks are tanks too?! In EQOA Monks are the BEST Melee class in the game. <BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Hehe. I played EQOA too was kinda [Removed for Content] that Monks were tanks in this game after coming from EQOA to EQ2. Also  disappointed that Shaman classes didn't get pets like in EQOA. But I'm staying around until combat revamp. If combat revamp sucks then I hopefully will be beta testing Vanguard or DDO by then and won't give a rats [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] about this game anymore.</DIV>

[FelixDomesticus]

<span><blockquote><hr>RobCardIV wrote:<div></div> Please dont speak about WORLD OF WARCRAFT, we have alreasy lost 40 percent of our players, and the rest of the players are still here because they havent tried it yet..  The cloud of illusions about how much worse it is shields the truth. <hr></blockquote>I tried it and I must say that it sucks.</span><div></div>

[Blissa2362]

<P> Hey this guy has a right to complain! I have been playing EQ sense june of 99 and let me tell you there has been a billion nerfs. Let me be the first to say a EQ2 necro has been so dumbed down, that the class is a joke. As it is right now 1 good wack and I am dead, if they are going to make it even worse than what it is now, they can keep my $15 a month.</P> <P> I just bought a new account and made a Guardian he is level 26 now and can tank like no tommrow. I plan on duoing him with the necro. But I just read some of the combat changes and they say that you will no longer be able to block atks. I guess that means they are taking a huge swing of the nerf bat and wacking Guardians all to heck. IF so thats another $15 a month they are going to loose.</P> <P> I am a Power Gamer I like to play at least 2 accounts at once and often have more than 2 accounts for any given game. I was playing 4 accounts on EQ1, I have 2 WOW accounts and 2 EQ2 accounts and was planing on making a 3rd EQ2 account once the Guardian reaches 50. If they want to loose $45 a month, then go ahead and break, nerf, I mean fix classes.</P> <P> Trust me on this one, if they make too many people mad and they leave the game. The servers will be ghost towns, and when people can't find people to play with they will stop playing their self. Why do you think so many EQ1 and EQ2 players left for WOW. They are all sick of sonys crap. (AKA nerf bat)</P> <P>P.S. Sony, great job on taking the nerf bat to split paw. I can not tell you how much I hated reciving coin every time I completed a quest. The first time I recived gold for completing a quest I was so mad I almost deleted my account. (GREAT JOB SONY THE WHOLE REASON I BOUGHT SPLIT PAW IS BECAUSE YOU RECIVED COIN FOR COMPLETING QUESTS. NOW ITS USELESS!)</P> <P>(Flame on you know you want to)</P>

[Solaran_X]

I just find it very funny. Everyone cries for balancing of classes and items and such. And when SOE begins to do the balancing, most of the people who cried for balancing begin screaming "Nerf! Nerf! They're nerfing us!"

[FelixDomesticus]

<span><blockquote><hr>Solaran_X wrote:I just find it very funny. Everyone cries for balancing of classes and items and such. And when SOE begins to do the balancing, most of the people who cried for balancing begin screaming "Nerf! Nerf! They're nerfing us!" <div></div><hr></blockquote>I am just waiting for that damned combat/healer patch to arrive. Playing a healer that has been broken since day 1 of Eq2 is getting frustrating. My class cannot be nerfed more, so I do not care what patch will do.</span><div></div>

[Ethelwo]

<P>My only Big Worry is SOE's track record for changes. They have a very poor one when it comes to combat balance. They screwed it up in EQ1 and they couldnt get it right 9 months ago when they released this game. What in anyones mind (given the track record) would make them think they will get it right this time. It's the track record that sings the song. They rushed this game out to compete with Wow even though many of us posted that their ideas were seriously flawed. What makes anyone think their ideas are any better now. Their concern is with the game and not the clients. The vast majority of folks who play this game simply don't have a voice. Were not invited into betas and when we post we're ignored. Only money matters to them. </P> <P>Maybe this game should fail. SOE has great developers. They can code just about anything. But they seem to lack any real vision and it shows in the mediocre art. They dont see it before they create it. They create it, and only then do they see what they have created. They come up with ideas to fit into what they created instead of creating around ideas in the first place. Thats why the game is flawed. They made a game with alot of great technology and the great technology dictated what they created. They never had a clue as to what they were creating. They let the new technology dictate the direction of the game. Now the game is off in the wrong direction and their struggling to keep it viable. Too many false assumptions were made at the outset to be corrected now with any combat change. They dictated class roles to fit a narrow view and hence we have remarks such as "tanks are supposed to stand there and get hit. Thats their role". Everyone has such a narrow view as to a classes role that the game is regressing to a level even less diverse then that of EQ1. The key to a 3rd or 4th generation MMORPG is not narrow roles but broad roles based on what a players choice is during game play. You really have only 4 classes. You are a meat shield, dps, healer or buffer. </P> <P>4 roles. This combat change is going to narrow those roles even more then they already are. They are regressing not progressing.</P>

[Styk]

<div></div>I see that people want to bag on me calling me an eq2 addict or worrying about my rent lol..... Well lets see , i choose what i like to do with my money and i decided to make a solid investment on a good PC to enjoy a hobbie i like alot, playing MMORPG's. If i needed a PC for home office software or internet usage then i would use the one i already have that is a year and a half old. I really dont see what postion you are in to judge what i do with my  money or my lifestyle You dont need to worry about my rent etc because it ALWAYS gets payed,  playing eq1 and now eq2 not only helped me save money, it helped me stop drinking alchohol , partying too much etc etc so if anything i should thank SoE for putting out a game that gave me that much interest that i decided to alter my lifestyle a little to have time to play ... ( also helped some friends too with their financial situation so um no complaints their ). The reason why i CARE about this game is because for the reasons i stated above... ITS MY HOBBIE one of the few that i get alot of enjoyment from, i pay for it as well, i as a customer not as a gamer have a right to complain about its direction.... I as a 5+ year customer to SoE also know their track record for getting things done the first time.... Want to take apart my post , go right ahead, i would like to see opinions on it, but please come up with something better then imposing your opinions on someones lifestyle because quite frankly YOU DON'T KNOW ME, you don't need to know me or how i choose to live it... <div></div><p>Message Edited by Styker on <span class=date_text>08-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:39 AM</span>

[CasombraHellstalk]

<DIV>Ok I do have a question in this... I play a defiler... where do we fit in on all these changes? I mean our dots are crappy, our healing is crappy, our wards are half [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] and our buffs basically suck.... tell me over genuine curiosity, where does defilers fit in anywhere? The Shaman in EQ1 were some of the best buffers and the best slower in the game.... we were very much needed and wanted in any raid or group... now we are just a percentage of usefullness. Basically a poorly designed back up healer. Very few times have I really gotten to be a defiler in any raid... all I am there is to chain heal... not dot, not slow, but heal. Is there any changes for us in the future to look forward to?</DIV>

[Kittypoo]

<P>I don't know where you are getting your information about the combat revamps, but they are not finished yet.  Don't freak out until you see the finished product.  You're just giving yourself unnecessary stress.  Okay? okay <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P>

[Roaan]

<P>[RAMSY02] I do have a high level wizard also. yes its rough at times.. but hell we can solo almost anything with unbreakable roots <IMG height=16 src="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif" width=16 border=0> just if mob hit us once, bam dead.. </P> <P>Im i missing something here, since when Wizzy have unbreakable roots that we can nuke on?</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Screamin' 1]

<span><blockquote><hr>ThePhoniex wrote: <blockquote> <hr> Solaran_X wrote: <div> </div> <div>Guardians/Berserkers (and to a lesser role Paladins/Shadow Knights) are only there to keep the enemy's attention and get their head pounded while the true DPS classes (which are supposed to be Scouts and Mages) actually kill a mob. That is how it was in EQLive, and that is how it was SUPPOSED to be in EQ2. But the DPS ratings of the tanks was made too high, and is not being fixed. <em><u><strong>Just because you got used to playing the broken version of the class is your fault - not SOE's.</strong> </u></em>They're doing their job and fixing the problem.</div> <div> </div> <div>.</div> <hr> </blockquote> <p>OH MY GOD.  Your are saying that we, the player base, is WRONG for playing broken classes?  Classes, that were created, developed and put into production by SOE?  That these balance problems are caused by players playing the classes avaiable to them; and not the [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing people that MADE the game?</p> <p>How can you argue with people that could possibly believe that... *sigh* </p> <div></div><hr></blockquote> Exactly. They are "doing their job" and "fixing" a problem they *think* is there. A problem *they* put there.  To blame the players is just the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.  I have seen several comments about how tank DPS is too useful in parties and raids. All I can say is, as a level 46 guardian, my dps is woeful in a group. Healers out dps me by a ton. If I am soloing, and I add a Warden, the mobs drop 4 times quicker. I don't mind this, my damage mitigation balances it  out. But if my damage was any less, it would become ridiculous. Now granted, I can solo some mobs other classes cannot. But, it takes me forever, the mob and I both run out of power, and I just wear the mob down. It can take 7 minutes sometimes to take one down, even w/ manastone and PGT power procs. But, I could have made the same exp killing 8 weaker mobs, so it seems to even out to me. Here's something else interesting (This is a live server account): My guardian soloed Sundered Splitpaw in his late 30's (this is the first splitpaw zone, to get to the chest and get the 2md shard) Since the zone scales to the level of the player,  It was close, I died once because I allowed an add and did not run in time. But, for the  most part, it was very balanced.  This zone has been advertised as a solo/small group zone. My level 22 Illusiionist, however, got totally spanked. It was not even close. He would run out of power before killing the first mob in a group of 4, and that was after I decided to try it w/o mezzing. I hope the new changes are addressing this, because it is way out of balance. I should be fair and point out I was a bit rusty playing my illusionist, but even if I had played perfectly, the result would have been the same. On a lighter note, this is one of the funniest things I have ever read: It is very relvent to the dicussion too! <a href="http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/7/13/02752/5668" target=_blank>Patch History of Blizzard Chess</a> </span><div></div>

[Naginata]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kittypoo wrote:<BR> <P>I don't know where you are getting your information about the combat revamps, but they are not finished yet.  Don't freak out until you see the finished product.  You're just giving yourself unnecessary stress.  Okay? okay <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>They get the information from the fumes of spray paint.

[lisasdarr]

<span><blockquote><hr>ThePhoniex wrote: OH MY GOD.  Your are saying that we, the player base, is WRONG for playing broken classes?  Classes, that were created, developed and put into production by SOE?  That these balance problems are caused by players playing the classes avaiable to them; and not the [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing people that MADE the game? <p>How can you argue with people that could possibly believe that... *sigh* </p> <div></div><hr></blockquote>Actually the problem here is perception, it is clear from both in and out of game information that all fighters are intended to be tanks and not DPS. As such playing a brawler with the expectation that the class is working as intended, when it clearly doesn't fit the stated description, and then complaining when it is fixed, is the players fault. If you had payed attention you would and should be aware that brawlers are intended to be tanks first and foremost, expecting it to remain any other way was wishful thinking, and clearly mistaken. The problem isn't playing the broken class, it is expecting it to stay broken when it is clear it shouldn't. </span><div></div>