wyrmsteel changes why?

[Vas]

<DIV>I am a Member of Forged Souls a guild that worked very very hard to get to guild level 30.  Even now after all this time there are only a few guild at that level.  Now you are giving away one of the 2 items in the game that distiguishes a guild level 30 guild from level 25 guild. The truth of the matter is that it takes almost as much time and effort to get from 25-30 as it does to get from 1-25. If your basicly handing out rewards to guild level 25 guild then there had better be some really nice tangable benifits for being guild level 30. Because after this patch there is none short of a 60 plat horse/carpet that no one can afford.  This is a flat out slap in the face to all the level 30 guilds.  It seems that since some guild dont have the drive or desire to get to guild level 30 your giving them rewards for setteling. No guild will bother ever leveling beyond 25 now because there will be no point.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have to say that most people feel that Wyrmsteel is a useless guild level 30 reward due to the very mediocre stats. I was happy letting the general public believe this. The truth is that wyrmsteel weapons are huge DPS to the targets they affect.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have to express my concern that this element of the game is sorely lacking.  I feel that there should be more concideration for guild who have done the hard work for this level.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Vasel on <span class=date_text>06-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:59 PM</span>

[mymTwRa]

<P>i have to agree totally!</P> <P>I can't even express myself... i'm speechless....</P>

[Vathral]

<div></div>wait wait....you mean to tell me they going to change some of  the guild lvl 30 goodies to 25? That really sucks. The way it is now is the way it should. So many guilds can hit 25 soooo much easier than 30 and its gonna [Removed for Content] off those that worked so hard on getting 30. edit: wow, just saw LU11 notes and I agree, the wyrmsteel thing sucks. <div></div><p>Message Edited by Vathral on <span class=date_text>06-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:31 AM</span>

[Fairuza]

<DIV>This already hit the live servers.</DIV>

[Vathral]

<span><blockquote><hr>Fairuza wrote:<div>This already hit the live servers.</div><hr></blockquote>Dont see it anywhere. 8(</span><div></div>

[Draq]

<P>This change hit TC yesterday (thats why this thread is in testing feedback <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ) and I agree, I don't see the point why they should take this reward away from the lvl 30 guilds and leave them with a horse and a carpet that most people will never be able to afford.</P> <P>I want to see 1!! good point why this will be changed and if they push this to live, I really hope  we get something new for guild lvl 30.</P>

[Lodor]

<DIV>Like noted above this change is currently on live servers or atleast was a few days ago.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Guilds that were GL 25+ could buy the book off the tradeskill merchant on Befallen server.</DIV>

[Urglu]

<DIV>Yup this is (or was) live already, a lvl 26 guild on Najena has the book and has made WS.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm so glad I did writs for 2 months straight for a horse/carpet a can't afford.</DIV>

[Draq]

<P>Wait... so they anounce a change on wednesday 15th for a patch on the 28th but push that stuff live a few days before they anounce it? <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> :smileyindifferent: :smileymad:</P> <P>Are they trying to make EQ2 into SWG? is this the SWG forum? lol</P>

[WAPCE]

<blockquote><hr>Urglunt wrote:<DIV>Yup this is (or was) live already, a lvl 26 guild on Najena has the book and has made WS.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm so glad I did writs for 2 months straight for a horse/carpet a can't afford.</DIV><hr></blockquote>Same on Crushbone. Grats goes to Legends.

[Saeldar]

Why are people surprised about this? They've been doing this since day 1, they want to get WoW's number of subscribers so they will constantly be making change so that everything is attainable with little to effort. They see that very few guilds are level 30...so rather then introduce more incentive for players to work and get there...they remove it by giving the reward to lower level guilds. I'm a casual player but I like to have a challenge, my guild is level 21...with about only 8 active players...we work very hard to level it. I'm disapointed to see a move like this. <div></div>

[Urglu]

<DIV>LoL Val, that is almost word for word (except the WoW part) the prviate response given to one of my guild members for this change.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Personally I'm going with the explanation suggested by an old guildie: SOE is run by NASA space monkeys. :smileysurprised:</DIV>

[Vuron]

<P>I will start by saying that I understand your point about trying to reach 30 and then getting the rewards nerfed.  Yes, wyrmsteel was one of the only rewards left at 30 besides the carpet and spirit steed that was worthwhile.</P> <P>Having said that, I think the change makes perfect sense from a gameplay perspective, and the reward may even be better suited as a level 20 reward.  The entire point of wyrmsteel is to help with fire & ice and deception.  Guilds should strive to get their levels up so that they could get a good weapon to use against these raids.  Unfortunately, by the time most guilds got to lvl 30, they had already been farming the drakotas and Darathar for weeks or months using their prismatics which made wyrmsteel much less valuable.</P> <P>What sense does it make to get prismatics before wyrmsteel?</P> <P> </P>

[kaoriknigh]

<DIV>Well I am a little [Removed for Content] about this change as well... My guild is finally 30% from 30... we've flew through the past 3 levels lately and were actually looking forward to being Lv 30. Then last night someone starts linking Wyrmsteel in the trader channel-- I send some tells and find out its from a guild thats only Lv 26. After being given the run around and some lies I did some investigating to find that they stealth changed the Wyrmsteel recipe to Lv 25. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is simply rediculous-- for one there is literally NO reason to get to Lv 30 now except for the mounts and clothes, sorry thats just not good enough. The stealth change to Lv 25 also screwed anyone close to 30 who would have been the first on their server et c. All that work and sense of accomplishment down the drain.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I seriously hope they add something to Guild Lv 30 because its seriously lacking now.</DIV>

[Saeldar]

I think SoE probably realized that people are not leveling guilds all that much. Most of it is probably done as a side effect of doing "heritage" quest rather then a true effort to level the guild. Sadly, I think they are not looking at the real issues as to why this is happening. That move is a perfect example of this...there are very few reasons to actually level guilds. The rewards for doing so are for the most part...extremely poor. So rather then go about providing more incentive for people to level their guilds...they give the reward at lower level so more people can acheive them... Look at your guild system seriously. I was exciting when I heard about it before beta, like many other things it ended up being but a shadow of what it could have been. I think Splitpaw provides an interesting technology that should defintly be used for guilds...scalable instances... Right now...we get a "guild raid" every 5 levels...I'm not sure how it went for other guilds...but till now, all of them have been grey to us when we got them. One of the big reward of leveling the guild has proven to be useless. Use splitpaw technology, and scale the guild raids from 20 to 50...so that a level 50 guild has 10 guidl raids to do at level 50. You have different factions which mean nothing...have guilds make formal allegiance to 1 faction...provide different bonuses to that guild based on the faction they ally with. Make those bonuses scale up as the guild levels. Provide more special "recipes" for crafters at each 5 levels of guild progression. There's probably tons more you could do...but please do something...provide incentive to level a guild...rather then give away the rewards more easily because people are not leveling their guilds. <div></div>

[Handleba]

THis change is on live servers now, my guildie bought the book and has crafted some weapons already. <div></div>

[CoebyWu]

Wow...... what a slap in the face of guilds that worked hard to achieve level 30. Not only the fact that they changed it, but they went ahead and dropped it to live without telling anyone, effectively undermining any guild that was working hard to achieve wyrmsteel weapons, whether they were close to GL30 or already GL30. Why again did my friends and I push hard to GL30?  Oh, that's right, so we could drop 240p on special mounts that will probably get outdated in this Fall's expansion when everyone gets carpets. But now I'm wondering, because of this change, it probably means that we'll NEED wyrmsteel weapons now because they plan on making those epic encounters much harder. I'm just completely miffed..... <div></div>

[Kenazeer]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Vuron00 wrote:<BR> <P>I will start by saying that I understand your point about trying to reach 30 and then getting the rewards nerfed.  Yes, wyrmsteel was one of the only rewards left at 30 besides the carpet and spirit steed that was worthwhile.</P> <P>Having said that, I think the change makes perfect sense from a gameplay perspective, and the reward may even be better suited as a level 20 reward.  <FONT color=#ff0033>The entire point of wyrmsteel is to help with fire & ice and deception</FONT>.  Guilds should strive to get their levels up so that they could get a good weapon to use against these raids.  Unfortunately, by the time most guilds got to lvl 30, they had already been farming the drakotas and Darathar for weeks or months using their prismatics which made wyrmsteel much less valuable.</P> <P>What sense does it make to get prismatics before wyrmsteel?</P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Dunno...perhaps the evilly cunning SoE alrady had plans for the twin dragons in the expansion?......nah.....that would probably be giving them too much credit.</P> <P>I hate that they "trivialize" stuff that some people have worked so hard to get. Our guild is still just a smidgen shy of 24, so we had a long way to go, but it was something to works towards. Now, we look forward to.....?</P> <P><BR> </P>

[BdybldKris]

I'm sorry, I've parsed dps multiple times and Wyrmsteel sucks.....I have crap dps with it compared to my other weapons including my Prismatic.....I wish they'd make them more effective rather than dropping the guild level needed to make them.

[Eet]

Instead of making wyrmsteel weapons worth the work, SOE undercuts the 2+ extra months of work it takes to level a guild from 25 to 30? And implements it unannounced?

[MiscreantPy]

<DIV>This hit Antonia Bayle quite a while ago.</DIV>

[KimSukM]

"I think SoE probably realized that people are not leveling guilds all that much. Most of it is probably done as a side effect of doing "heritage" quest rather then a true effort to level the guild."Quoted from above and is absolutely true.Lots of folks do heritages cause they're cool and oyu get nice items / title etc... but I'm in a lvl 30 guild, let me tell you it takes about 70% of getting to 30 by doing writs writs writs. Heritages get you to... 25! actually about 23-24 heh, so basically you can get to the "golden level" by just doing quests you'd do anyways and not putting in the real grind to hit 30. This absolutely sucks to a guild who has hit lvl 30, such as myself. Interestingly enough I've had discussion with others in lower level guilds sayin "Oh, it's only fair because unless you're in a high lvl guild you can't get these items, so individual effort won't help" well... that's just terribly convienient then. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Please spoon feed us more and make the game even more trivial. Any real work is rewarded with making it worthless.Next thing you know, you'll be level 50 and they'll 2x the xp you get and make heroic mobs into solo mobs. That way you can hit lvl 50 by solo farming in 10 days.

[Met]

<P>Where are people buying this book on the qeynos side???</P>

[Jaffa Tamarin]

I think everyone complaining about this because it trivializes the efforts of those who have already achieved GL30 ought to be more concerned about the current stupid-easy 45+ writs where adventurers can get writs from two different factions for the same target mob. <div></div>

[Walnu]

More dumbing down....I just don't understand it. <div></div>

[Meela]

Guild level 30 was already unrewarding. This change really makes a mockery of it. <div></div>

[Merith]

<P>BS flag has been thrown in!!!!!</P> <P> </P> <P>[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] it.. My guild and I worked [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] hard to get there first... This is totatly lame...  </P>

[Chryo]

<div></div><span><span></span><span><blockquote><hr>Vasel wrote:<div></div>I have to say that most people feel that Wyrmsteel is a useless guild level 30 reward due to the very mediocre stats. I was happy letting the general public believe this. The truth is that wyrmsteel weapons are huge DPS to the targets they affect.  <hr></blockquote> Hm... better DPS than Prismatics and the better ones of the Fabled Weapons out there? Do you have logs to prove that? But even if that's the case - what is the point? There is no difficult dragon out there, since Darathar 2.0 was changed in difficulty. Even if Wyrmsteel weapons are better against dragons than all other weapons available, all they can possibly achieve is turning an easy encounter into a very easy encounter - killing a mob in 12 minutes instaed of 15 maybe? That's not really useful in my opinion, compared to the effort or time required to level a guild to 30 or even 25. Of course they could try and come up with an encounter in the expansion that requires Wyrmsteel. But I doubt that Wyrmsteel weapons were introduced for the expansion in the first place.</span> </span><div></div>

[Armill]

<P>I think, im not super sure but the reason i think they did this is because of the lack of them in the game. I mean im up there in levels but I've yet to see one on Antonia Bayle, I just assume no one could make them.  Maybe now they will be seen in the game, its another way for crafters to make money for ya.  But Im just positive that they did it so they would actualy become useful.  Another thing I mean how many of you have lots of strange black ore because they don't sell and there useless now it gives them a purpose. I just guess thats why they did it.</P>

[Ethelwo]

<P>For sake of argument, will wyrmsteel still be good at L60, I doubt it. In just a few months an expansion will be released and folks will be moving up past L50 to L60. Many of these folks play in guilds that may not reach L30 by the time the expansion comes out. This L30 guild reward will become next to worthless after the expansion comes out because newer and better items will be in the game. Why would SOE want to include a guild reward meant for players L50 when the top Level will change to 60 and the reward is meaningless at the level. </P> <P>Thats why it's being pushed down because the value of wyrmsteel will soon be nerfed do to the level increase included in the expansion that will be released soon.</P> <P>Many players will ding L60 long before their guilds ding L30.</P> <P> </P>

[Tasnus]

I honestly don't care that it was lowered to guild lvl 25 as long as, like people already suggested, they up the rewards for guild level 30.   1-25 is easy if you mass heritages, but not everyone will have the patience for writ madness that is required for 25+.  With this change the only motivation to grind the rediculous amount of xp from 25-30 are 60pp carpets/steeds (if you can afford it) and the Ritsar/Dame/Sir/Madam titles (I'd also include the lvl 30 casual wear armor but honestly, it's just for show and useless).  For starters, how about lowering the price on the lvl 30 mounts?  Even cutting it in half to say 30pp will still be WELL out of reach for most people but honestly, the work put in to get to guild lvl 30 is taxing enough.  As far as the effectiveness of the wyrmsteel weapons, only the scout swords and slow wand are employed by my guild when fighting drakota, everything else is useless.  THey don't make or break the encounter, but they certainly help when we are fighting with a max of 3 groups or less (most of the time that is all we could field).  Now obviously ub3r guilds who have already done the prismatic progression and are all twinked with fabled have no use for these weapons, but they are handy if you are a smaller guild and not as well off equipped as others.  Anyway, just my 2cp~ <div></div>

[Keldo]

<div></div><b>vs Niscanith (18 players) - Fight time: 3m26s Total Damage Delt: 447,522 (2,172 DPS)</b> Top Actors 1.  Rykilth (50 Brigand) - 55,694 <b>(291.59 DPS)</b> - Wyrmsteel Shortblade x2          <b> - Wyrmsteel 59.29 DPS, Slashing 57.28 DPS</b> 2.  Kheg (50 Assassin) - 49,296 <b>(266.46 DPS)</b> - Wyrmsteel Shortblade x2           <b>- Wyrmsteel 63.81 DPS, Slashing 74.77 DPS</b> 3. Rudra (50 Warlock) - 37,388 <b>(207.71 DPS)</b> Normal Spells, no Wyrmsteel (wands are worthless) 4. Edia (50 Dirge) - 36,104 <b>(183.48 DPS)</b> - Wyrmsteel Shortblade x2           <b>- Wyrmsteel 63.03 DPS, Slashing 65.73 DPS</b> <b> vs Trenda`loz the Caller (20 players) Fight time: 3m22s Total Damage Delt: 455,004 (2,241 DPS)</b> Top Actors 1.  Rykilth (50 Brigand) - 55,105 <b>(276.91 DPS)</b> - Wyrmsteel Shortblade x2           <b>- Wyrmsteel 55.32 DPS, Slashing 53.01 DPS</b> 2. Ollyve (50 Assassin) - 54,417 <b>(273.45 DPS)</b> - Wyrmsteel Shortblade x2           <b>- Wyrmsteel 61.23 DPS, Slashing 60.24 DPS</b> 3.  Kheg (50 Assassin) - 39,263 <b>(204.49 DPS)</b> - Wyrmsteel Shortblade x2           <b>- Wyrmsteel 56.96 DPS, Slashing 66.53 DPS</b> 4.  Rudra (50 Warlock - 30,094 <b>(177.61 DPS)</b> - normal spells <b> vs King Zalak the Ancient (16 players) Fight Time: 5m40s Total Damage Delt: 460,350 (1,353 DPS)</b> Top Actors 1.  Rykilth (50 Brigand) 69,012 <b>(206.62 DPS)</b> - Serrated Bone Dirk, Pristine Imbued Ebon Leafblade            <b>- Piercing 51.11 DPS</b> 2.  Ollyve (50 Assassin) 62,104 <b>(212.68 DPS)</b> - Serrated Bone Dirk, Pristine Imbued Ebon Leafblade           <b> - Piercing 80.09 DPS</b> 3.  Kheg (50 Assassin) 54,691 <b>(163.26 DPS)</b> - Serrated Bone Dirk, Ebon imbued something (forget)            <b>- Piercing 74.82 DPS</b> 4.  Vandalla (50 Wizard) 38,688<b> (120.15 DPS)</b> - ICE COMET !!!!! Our guild has been raiding for about 6 weeks, after getting level 30.  We are small, normally only fielding 12 to 20 players.  I'd like to think there are many guilds like ours in EQ2.  We all come from a raiding background, but came to EQ2 to get away from having to recruit 80 to 100 people to raid.  Wyrmsteel has been a great help for us, although we have yet to defeat Darathar.  In our 6 weeks of raiding, not a single fabled dual wield weapon has dropped, making Wyrmsteel weapons invaluable to our scouts vs the Dragonic enemies they effect.  Because of how the process on the weapons functions, its effect is greatly reduced for 2h and 1h users.  The caster wands with 3 minute reuse for 300ish damage are equally useless.  The priest wands are decent, except for the stun wand, which does nothing because epic mobs were made immune to stun from items, not that it was useful before (maybe it was, we never really used them).  As you can see, though, from those parses, the auto attack DPS from wyrmsteel makes them more than worthwhile to get for scouts at minimum.  Honestly, I would be suprised if even 2 fabled could outdamage them. I am glad more guilds will be getting access to them, as they are not really a good reward for guild level 30 to begin with.  Guild level 25 is more in line with where they should be.  Small guilds then have a goal to work towards which is obtainable, and helps them get a start on Epic x 4 raiding as it did us.  With the current experience curve, as we get farther and farther from release, most guilds who will reach it, will have already started raiding if their guild was going to do so, thus rendering these items essentially useless.   Therefore, I am pleased they were changed, as they will greatly help many guilds worked hard to obtain a realistic goal of guild level 25. As for guild level 30 rewards, they are very sad for the effort required to obtain them.  We obtained guild level 30 in March, and not a single member of our guild has been able to afford a steed or carpet.  Wyrmsteel was essentially all that we got, and I'm glad that we did get it, but hope that in the future, the work we put in will be paid off in a more worthy manner. Keldoth Guild BANE - Blackburrow Server<div></div>

[khelektasare]

Does anybody have a link to info on Wyrmsteel items? Thanks, <div></div>

[lavinia]

<DIV>so to recap...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>wyrmsteel, the best lvl 30 reward, given to lvl 25 guilds.  no word or explanation from SOE yet.  no new replacement reward offered for guilds at level 30.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>hey SOE why should anyone bother to level to 30 when the best rewards (pristine tradeskill stations, 9pp mounts for the considerable discount, wyrmsteel) are all at level 25?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>you can make a big deal out of the 'cool looking' mounts at 30 all you want, but when the vast majority of those who work to get 30 don't have anything to show for it except bragging rights, you can't deny your reward system is broken.  fix it.</DIV>

[Ddrak]

<blockquote><hr>Cthulhu522 wrote:Does anybody have a link to info on Wyrmsteel items?<hr></blockquote><a href='http://www.chase.net.au/eq2/gallery/sp_index.php?dir=./wyrmsteel' target=_blank>Here you go</a>I'd just like to echo Keldoth - Wyrmsteel has been great (40% slow + crazy extra dps is a nice thing) but it isn't something that makes or breaks the encouters. If more guilds see it then I have no problem with it, but I certainly hope Sony takes a look at their guild level rewards and gives something more useful, or perhaps access to a raid zone that actually drops interesting items from the Lv30 rewards.As it stands now, I'd love a carpet but 60pp is so far out of my league it's just not funny - especially with repair costs from raiding piling up.Dd

[FrankMullen]

<P>I just had to post when I read keldoth's post :p</P> <P> </P> <P>He shows the dps of scouts with wyrmsteel weps and without wyrmsteel weps... that's fine..</P> <P> </P> <P>Then he shows the dps of a wizard vs Zalak and he writes: Ice Comet..</P> <P> </P> <P>Well not a very good example since zalak is immune to all ice spells and that means ice comet too hence the low dps :p</P>

[Bi]

still cant find out where the book comes from (for the recipies) tbh although I appreciate the effort for a lvl 30 guild, I think that having weapons available to those who use them is a good thing. <div></div>

[Ashlian]

<P>I feel for the people who are at or near guild level 30. While it makes some sense from the posts I've read to have Wyrmsteel at 25, what, besides the mounts, did you have to look forward to? I have a post on this issue in the housing forum, because I don't think housing is a good choice for money and status sinks. Obviously, you raiders would like other stuff to spend your money and status on. It would be very interesting to me to get some feedback on what you would like to see as guild status rewards. I would love posts to this thread:</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=19278#M19278" target=_blank><FONT color=#ff9900>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=19278#M19278</FONT></A></P> <P>While I know the topic is mainly as it relates to the huge expense of housing, additional status rewards could only benefit us all. I still have hopes that a dev will take a look at what people would like to achieve with guild status and make some changes.</P> <P>Ashlian Liadan, 39 Fury, 32 Tailor of Mistmoore</P>

[Ddrak]

<blockquote><hr>FrankMullen wrote: <P>I just had to post when I read keldoth's post :p</P> <P> </P> <P>He shows the dps of scouts with wyrmsteel weps and without wyrmsteel weps... that's fine..</P> <P> </P> <P>Then he shows the dps of a wizard vs Zalak and he writes: Ice Comet..</P> <P> </P> <P>Well not a very good example since zalak is immune to all ice spells and that means ice comet too hence the low dps :p</P><hr></blockquote>That was actually an in joke about Vandalla.<a href='http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer_bio.vm?characterId=110533103' target=_blank>Check her Bio.</a>Dd

[Ramsy02]

<span><blockquote><hr>Vasel wrote:<div></div> <div>I am a Member of Forged Souls a guild that worked very very hard to get to guild level 30.  Even now after all this time there are only a few guild at that level.  Now you are giving away one of the 2 items in the game that distiguishes a guild level 30 guild from level 25 guild. The truth of the matter is that it takes almost as much time and effort to get from 25-30 as it does to get from 1-25. If your basicly handing out rewards to guild level 25 guild then there had better be some really nice tangable benifits for being guild level 30. Because after this patch there is none short of a 60 plat horse/carpet that no one can afford.  This is a flat out slap in the face to all the level 30 guilds.  It seems that since some guild dont have the drive or desire to get to guild level 30 your giving them rewards for setteling. No guild will bother ever leveling beyond 25 now because there will be no point.</div> <div> </div> <div> </div> <div>I have to say that most people feel that Wyrmsteel is a useless guild level 30 reward due to the very mediocre stats. I was happy letting the general public believe this. The truth is that wyrmsteel weapons are huge DPS to the targets they affect.  </div> <div> </div> <div>I have to express my concern that this element of the game is sorely lacking.  I feel that there should be more concideration for guild who have done the hard work for this level.</div><p>Message Edited by Vasel on <span class="date_text">06-15-2005</span> <span class="time_text">11:59 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>Maybe they are doing that because wyrmsteel was kinda meant to help with prismatics and sony feels like requiring guilds to be lvl 30 to make the raid for prismatics alittle easier is out of reach and was taking longer than they expected. all wyrmsteel does is make it so once guilds reach 25 they have a better shot at killing dragons? i dunno but it is very valuebale weapons when raiding dragons</span><div></div>

[Hazdrubel]

I'm in a Level 24 guild and when I 1st heard about this my first response was "Forged Souls is gonna flip the #@!$ out".  Anybody can see from a mile a way that when you take away something odds are people are not gonna be happy.  Even more when said item  implies any sort of status or prestige to it.  However, in light of how the game has progressed I think Wyrmsteel for level 30 guilds has a lot less use than it sounds at 1st.  If they lose the Wyrmsteel I'd like to see them get something exceptional that will carry them through the up and coming expansion.  I know its blind faith, but I seriously doubt they (the devs) would remove a reward and not replace it with another.  THAT would be insanely unfair.  So I say, let the masses have the Wyrmsteel now.  But give the level 30 guilds something awesome to carry their respective characters through the 50s. <div></div>

[EmeraldJay]

<P>IMO, the wyrmsteel recipe book should be available to all level 50 weaponsmiths. Being a guild-leveling reward forces guilds who have chosen a long time ago not to play that aspect of the game to now have to start from the bottom and start leveling their guild.  I think it's way more important to get the weapons into the hands of the level of players that can actually use and benefit by using them. Some raiding guilds have already stated that they beat these encounters without ever having to use wyrmsteel.  I think that with the revamp making epic encounters harder, that just may not be the case anymore...maybe...hopefully. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P>

[quamdar]

they aren't hard at all without wyrmsteel now, my guild just killed all three this last saturday for out first time ever with one death over all three drakotas.  these things are WAY underpowered and it is a rude awakening going from these things and taking them out with ease first try on all three to darathar who is a very tough encounter.  they really need to beef up these drakotas so there is more of a challenge, we had more trouble on dythra and articae than on any of the deception drakotas and they are higher level. i think what would be a cool idea for a thirty reward is being able to imbue the wyrmsteel weapons.  not just some proc give them some better stats so they are a decent weapon like atleast ebon quality.  you need guild level, tier 5 rare, group or so of people to fight off mobs as you craft and you get a sub ebon weapon, that seems like it should be looked at to me. <div></div>

[Smeegill]

Gee I wish I was a pathetic Elitist [Removed for Content].

[Styk]

I gotta agree thou, arti'cae is harder then all of the ^^^ in deception for prismatics ( Darathar makes up for some of that ) <div></div>

[IvIoritu]

<DIV>heh can't comment on the DW wyrmsteel but the 2hander i have is a complete joke.  i would prolly rather use a ebon 2hander than that pos, nevermind a half decent fabled or prismatic or RGF(rgf being best weapon in teh game...)  anyone who wants to argue best weapon can give me a PM once they start hitting 300-350 dps</DIV>