Change to housing upkeep in South Freeport house prices

[Haliken]

<DIV>I do understand the reasoning behind making this change, but there are TONS of people in this house (since it's obviously the 64g purchase/6g upkeep house that's taking the hit on cost), so this will cause a ton of commotion with people moving out of their houses and dealing with the 300 item capacity that suited the house so well, but will kill their own inventory space trying to move out into somewhere new because they cannot afford to keep up the house after it's changed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Unless there are plans to alter the change in payment plans on the currently existing house owners there, I think that people should be given, for instance, a week or two's notice (for after the patch is through) to move out if they cannot pay the new cost, but allow them to keep the house rented out while they temporarily simultaneously purchase a second house to move their belongings into without need of hiring 10 people just to help them move.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just my view on the matter... :smileyhappy:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>~Tirratye</DIV>

[Moorgard]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Haliken wrote:<BR> <DIV>Unless there are plans to alter the change in payment plans on the currently existing house owners there, I think that people should be given, for instance, a week or two's notice (for after the patch is through) to move out if they cannot pay the new cost, but allow them to keep the house rented out while they temporarily simultaneously purchase a second house to move their belongings into without need of hiring 10 people just to help them move. <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</DIV>

[HanktheDwarf]

Paying 60-odd gold to get the house seems like enough to not complain about.  Besides, the Qeynosians have been doing it for the longest time. <div></div>

[Sute]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Haliken wrote:<BR> <DIV>Unless there are plans to alter the change in payment plans on the currently existing house owners there, I think that people should be given, for instance, a week or two's notice (for after the patch is through) to move out if they cannot pay the new cost, but allow them to keep the house rented out while they temporarily simultaneously purchase a second house to move their belongings into without need of hiring 10 people just to help them move. <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>And some of us report all bugs no matter what it is. I reported this long ago, I petition'ed it also. I was told by a GM that the prices were infact the right prices and there was no problem. Please for the love of all things holy...hire some staff who know what the hell they are talking about.</P> <P> </P> <P>Dont blame the players for not reporting bugs sooner or not reporting them at all as it makes you look foolish. I reported it, i petition'ed was there something else i could do to make it known that there was a fault? Oh I know, maybe post it on the forums....but wait, some mod with more power than they need will tell me to not report those kind of bugs/exploits in the open forums....please.</P> <P> </P> <P>I DONT THINK SO. So stop trying to blame the players for YOUR mistakes just ONE time.</P> <P>I could list many a bug that i reported long ago that are still in game. I could also list many people who use 3rd party programs to tradeskill...but whats the point, they are 50 now and dont tradeskill now. BAH, act on your reports sooner and most of players complaints wont happen.</P> <P> </P> <P>ITS YOUR FAULT NOT THE PLAYERS.</P>

[UrkBloodA]

<P>Moorguard - please think about your comment here.  It's about as un-customer service oriented as you can be.  Assume for one moment that not everyone cheats, and someone honestly walked into SFP and picked a building to live in and it happened to be the cheapest place.  Why should they be given the honor of having all their stuff ganked when suddenly their rent changes?</P> <P>Maybe they never read the forums.  Changing their rent without warning will 'learn um good.</P> <P>[gah - 1 starred - lol - just fyi - I have never had a house with a rent higher than 5 silver coins and likely never will.]</P> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><p>Message Edited by UrkBloodAxe on <span class=date_text>04-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:23 PM</span>

[Pro]

<DIV>Pardon, but this must be one of the poorest replies ever from an official. You cannot possibly suggest that everyone checking their crystal ball trying to guess what the Dev team might consider a bug or intentional behaviour every other day.</DIV>

[Dazzler_Twodir]

<P>If you are worrying about 300 items to move just fire up 3 alts and use 3 100 item inn rooms to hold all your stuff.</P> <P>I'm from Qeynos and have to shell out the 62 gp a week for the 3 room house i got for my guild.</P> <P>This bug was reported time and again and even had posts on the housing board 2 months ago on it.</P> <P> </P> <P>They're allowing a month or so  rent longer at whatever the upkeep is if you use the escrow be glad they're not charging back payments on it.</P>

[Shunidar]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sutexi wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>And some of us report all bugs no matter what it is. I reported this long ago, I petition'ed it also. I was told by a GM that the prices were infact the right prices and there was no problem. Please for the love of all things holy...hire some staff who know what the hell they are talking about.</P> <P> </P> <P>Dont blame the players for not reporting bugs sooner or not reporting them at all as it makes you look foolish. I reported it, i petition'ed was there something else i could do to make it known that there was a fault? Oh I know, maybe post it on the forums....but wait, some mod with more power than they need will tell me to not report those kind of bugs/exploits in the open forums....please.</P> <P> </P> <P>I DONT THINK SO. So stop trying to blame the players for YOUR mistakes just ONE time.</P> <P>I could list many a bug that i reported long ago that are still in game. I could also list many people who use 3rd party programs to tradeskill...but whats the point, they are 50 now and dont tradeskill now. BAH, act on your reports sooner and most of players complaints wont happen.</P> <P> </P> <P>ITS YOUR FAULT NOT THE PLAYERS.</P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I distinctly remember (Kwong?) posting about this at least once or twice on the tester forum a good while ago.  No one really to blame here but yourself. <p>Message Edited by Shunidar on <span class=date_text>04-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>06:04 AM</span>

[Belgar Frostven]

<DIV> <DIV><EM>"Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress."</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV>I rent a 2 room house in S Qeynos, so I'm not affected by this change.  However, how in the world are players supposed to assume which price was the wrong price on the 3 room houses, the higher one, or the lower one?  If I had a character to move to one of these 3 room houses, I would have checked the door prices, likely never touring the more expensive house if it was out of my budget, never realizing they were the exact same floorplans, and never knowing there was even a house price bug in the first place.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I defended you on the froglock issue, but your reply in italics above is nothing more than a condescending slap in the players' faces.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV>

[machput]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> ...<BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now....</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>assuming ur talking about the 3room houses 60gp/6gp? .... if not ignor the rest <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <DIV>i have one of those houses for some time now and i NEVER realized it to be a bug and i also never read about it on the boards (mabye i read the wrong threads?)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i might be just stupid but i thought that the more expensive houses got better upgrade possibilities or locations... in sfp the 60gp 3room house is at the 2nd floor in the corner and the 6pp house is right at the street (better location for a store?)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>so im assuming the 2pp worth of upgradeds i put in that house are down the drain <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ill move out right away but accusing people of "not reporting it" and stating that "it should have been clear" is a very unfair imo</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>please consider putting up a ingame msg for all people who dont read the extensive patch notes completely or atleast put it in the headlines at top... i read the test server note and didnt see it at first</DIV>

[Sem]

<P>Moorgard - in that case i think you need to review the costs for upgrading walls, floors and trim in freeport and qeynos.  There's obviously a discrepancy when it costs 3g in Qeynos and 30g in Freeport to upgrade the same thing in the same room house.</P> <P>The fact that the quests and hunt zones and prices otehrwise in Qeynos are easier, give better rewards and more XP are just something we'll take as Freeporters choosing a harder life but if you're concerned about making things equal, by all means let them pay for their upgrades like we do or lower ours so we have some incentive to be in a house at all.</P> <P>Also you may wish to inform the support staff answering petitions that this was not intended - there were quite a number of us misled by their answers as earlier threads about 7 Freedom road will attest a few of us foudn out from GMs that the price was proper and intended PRIOR to moving in so your assertion that we were somehow knowingly getting away with something is not only offensive it is wrong.</P> <P>This change is an eviction notice for our household.  We're roleplayers.  We're not able to earn 61g unless you want to provide us a playhouse and let us sell tickets to shows.  The cost of 3 room housing should be lowered for all not raised for this one but this change is one more way in which you're just pushing small family groups out of the game just like you did in EQ1.  </P><p>Message Edited by Semma on <span class=date_text>04-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:45 AM</span>

[Mardda]

<DIV>I agree that all 3 room houses prices should be lowered.  Including the status houses.  Look at the bigger houses, the prices and upkeep are totally rediculous with the current situation.  Sure, maybe when the game was released they were ok, but with the never ending nerfs for ways to make money in the game, the prices of housing were never adjusted.  Ever look at the cost for 5 room houses?  They are absurd.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All housing costs and upkeep, need to be re-evaluated.  This one example of cheaper 3 room housing, is one of the few reasonable housing prices that currently exist.  It should be an example for updating other housing.  Not an addition to the never ending nerfs to making the game no fun.</DIV>

[Silversnow]

Anyone managed to get the new price for 7 Freedom Road yet? I dont have gigs of space to try and find out myself yet. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Shadowlo]

<DIV>Personally I am pretty unhappy with the situation.  I just moved in last week and will lose about 2p of hard fought for cash on the cost of the home, extra furnishings I bought, wall/trim/floor/ceiling options etc.</DIV>

[Niende]

<DIV>I hope you rethink this change or come to some sort of compromise. Moving this many items is a huge undertaking, and will probably force me to make at least 2 alt characters to hold items I can no longer display. I'm one of the top questers on my server, 1000+ quests many of which have one or more rewards for your house. If I have no furniture whatsoever I still wont be able to fit all my quest rewards in a 2 room house for very long, and I definately can't afford 60gold a week to keep my 3 room house in SFP.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Please rethink how housing works. I know you probably want to limit how many items each person can have for database and storage reasons, but with over 100 book quests, all the books and weapons for legends and lore and heritage quests, not to mention furniture from collection and other quests, paintings, pets, etc. It quickly FILLS a 2 room house which is all that most players can afford. And that isn't even talking player made furniture (I have a carpenter also and had some nice furniture also that I wont be able to keep in the same house as quest rewards anymore).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dont know what the answer is, I'd like to see Qeynos have a cheaper 3room + house also. I didn't know they didn't have a 60g purchase 6gold a week option like Freeport did. This whole thing is shocking. The amount of money spent on walls and furnishings and just pure time setting it all up and moving it soon or just banking it on alts forever or destroying all these rewards is quite frustrating. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I hope you can find an alternative solution, maybe one of these ideas: </DIV> <DIV>More than 100 items per room </DIV> <DIV>Cheaper 3+ room houses than 60gold a week which is ridiculous for most players</DIV> <DIV>Quest items not counting against the cap </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Meesh on Guk</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Grozmok]

I'vw owned this house for about 2 months. I reported it several times. I naturally assumed, since Qeynos had the upper hand in EVERYTHING, it was some karma kicking in. Like.. -Easier AQ quests -Access quest not needed for Stormhold / key not needed for deeper Blackburrow -1 000 times cheaper wall/floor upgrades (10 copper, compared to 1g 26s) -easier to get through tier 3 zone -not as many hostile monsters -a Heritage quest that is *impossible* to start unless you create a Qeynosian alt Anyway.. Moorguard, while you're at it, can you raise Qeynos wall/floor upgrade prices to match Freeport's? <div></div>

[Kokus]

<DIV>I am also very upset with these changes. I've moved my inn location several times since starting the game. The first time because of betrayal. I remember reading that devs say that the better location of the house, the more money it costs to purchase. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I was wandering around South Freeport checking the housing and saw all the 6 plat houses, I knew I could never pay the 64gp a week. That's just not petty cash. But as I ran up the back stairs to the last door and saw that it only costed 64gp to purchase, I realized what they had meant by location being everything. This one is far out of the way, and alot of players can't even ever find the house when I'm selling items. I know the upkeep is a good deal for a 3 bedroom house but it's just completely out of the way. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I still bought it though because I had alot of stuff. I was one, like many who had alot of rugs in their prior house. Unable to pickup all of the items I was resorted to make several trips out to sell my rugs so I could pick up everything else I had. It took over an hour but I was finally able to pick up all the things that were important to me and then sell my old inn and buy the new house.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Since purchasing the new house, I've spent alot of time in there decorating it how I wanted. Later I shelled out the 20gp for each floor, wall, and ceiling. I eventually ended up buying another 80 rugs to carpet a floor. So now, nearly 5 months later, I'm being told that my rent is going to be increased by 10 fold. Now, when there is offline selling, and the bank vault slots in the 3 room house is exactly the same as the other houses/inn rooms. Now when it means so little to have a decent house except for another way to customize my character, it is being taken away from me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I take my character customization and appearance seriously. In Live Update 7, my braid on my wood elf head now continually twitches. People laughed. I had to start wearing a helmet as I /bug'd and /feedback'd the problem. I've been finishing up every heritage quest and placing the items in my house just right. I care alot about these things. But to change this a half a year after the game has been released just really upsets me. The amount of time and effort it will take to move to a 2 bedroom inn is just more frustrating than I really want to deal with. Not to mention the fact that I've spent almost 2 plat customizing the inside rooms, paying it because I thought this would be the last place I would ever stay, but now finding out that isn't true.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>On my server alone we have alot of people staying in that room. Some even longer than I have. I was never aware that the price of this house was considered a bug. It was always the farthest out of the way. It seems unfair to punish us in such a way. I ask, instead that you maybe consider putting a 6gp 3 bedroom house in some far away corner in Qeynos like this is for us. Noone runs by this house. The only way you would run by it is if you were going there. Compared to the others below and before this door, it should definitely not have the same upkeep. Please reconsider these changes.</DIV>

[aeio]

<span><blockquote><hr>Pro wrote:<div>Pardon, but this must be one of the poorest replies ever from an official. You cannot possibly suggest that everyone checking their crystal ball trying to guess what the Dev team might consider a bug or intentional behaviour every other day.</div><hr></blockquote> Yeah but you could expect someone of even below average intelligence to realize when they go to a group of houses in the same area, with the same layout and everything else is the same and all of them are the same price except for one which is cheaper that the one that is different is likely a bug.  I mean expecting at least the most minimal amount of common sense does not seem an unreasonable hurdle to me. I am sure almost every person availing themselves of this bargain knew it was a mistake but choose to take advantage of it anyways.  Regardless of what a gm or guide said about it.  Common sense clearly informs one that it is a mistake. </span><div></div>

[einar4]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Haliken wrote:<BR> <DIV>Unless there are plans to alter the change in payment plans on the currently existing house owners there, I think that people should be given, for instance, a week or two's notice (for after the patch is through) to move out if they cannot pay the new cost, but allow them to keep the house rented out while they temporarily simultaneously purchase a second house to move their belongings into without need of hiring 10 people just to help them move. <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P> Very small percentages of the players report bugs at all, as they are here to play and not do your work for you. When a bug interferes with play, then they'll report it since it blocks their enjoyment. If the bug doesn't interfere with play, then its human nature to let it go.  (for instance, I'm sure many people don't bother with such things as a skullcap being named (slippers of the fleshripper).   Of course a negative spin can be put on anything if you really want to slam someone (but I digress). </P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P><BR> </P>

[Silversnow]

<blockquote><hr>aeiouy wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>Pro wrote:<div>Pardon, but this must be one of the poorest replies ever from an official. You cannot possibly suggest that everyone checking their crystal ball trying to guess what the Dev team might consider a bug or intentional behaviour every other day.</div><hr></blockquote> Yeah but you could expect someone of even below average intelligence to realize when they go to a group of houses in the same area, with the same layout and everything else is the same and all of them are the same price except for one which is cheaper that the one that is different is likely a bug.  I mean expecting at least the most minimal amount of common sense does not seem an unreasonable hurdle to me. I am sure almost every person availing themselves of this bargain knew it was a mistake but choose to take advantage of it anyways.  Regardless of what a gm or guide said about it.  Common sense clearly informs one that it is a mistake. </span><div></div><hr></blockquote>Have you even seen where this house is? Its in south freeport. No one ever goes here. It's in a cluster of houses in the middle of nowhere that you have to climb stairs to even get to the cluster. You then have to go stair climbing to even find it. Its possibly the worst location i've seen in the whole game with the fact of it being 3 rooms the only saving grace.Want to use broker? Well you need to run down two different sets of stairs and across a street to get to one unlike an Inn (2 room) where most are in the lobby or right outside the door. Or if your lucky and have safe fall you can jump down it all.If you want to use 'common sense' excuse to say we are wrong then common sense dictates that qeynos now needs 1000% increase in all upgrade costs and setting costs so as to match freeports. And while in the same vein of fairness freeports streets need to be flooded with guards to kick out the qeynos people that can sleepwalk through our city unlike the kickfest that happens whenever we try and go into theirs. Oh and given the qeynos guard ability to see through walls also.

[Jadr]

<span><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div></div> <div>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</div><hr></blockquote>If any of you had ever visited the housing forum, you would have know about this months ago, but i digress.</span><div></div>

[Vadja]

<P><FONT size=2>I saw this change in the test patch notes while looking for another subject, and immediately thought "good the other house prices are coming down to the 64g/6g price of my house" but I guess this proves I'm a hopeless optimist.</FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2>I mean what exactly is the point of having both NFP and SFP as deserted zones? So that in two years time a few guilds might want to move there? </FONT><FONT size=2>Our guild is the sixth richest on the server, we had a house hunting expedition in both SFP and NFP and concluded that the prices were too high for any possible benefit we could see.</FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2>Maybe there are changes coming to player housing and the developers don't want house owners at this point, it's the only reason i can think of.</FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2></FONT> </P> <P><FONT size=2></FONT> </P> <P><FONT size=2></FONT> </P>

[Elya]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Moorgard if I could I would be one starring you right now! Shame on you for your flippant comments! On these VERY forums is a compiled list of housing costs that was STICKIED and recently relocated. It clearly showed the lower price. (There have been many posts under the housing forum about this subject, usually to the tune of WAAA why does Freeport get cheaper housing than us WAAA to which they respond WAAAA we have a zillion other things worse than you =P)</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=5790" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=5790</A></P> <P>While I normally defend you, and the others at SOE, I think you owe the Freeportians an apology for this statement! By the way, I am a Qeynosian, and I think this is a poor decision on the part of the SOE staff to increase the cost for the Freeportians on this three room. For once, give them something nice, that Qeynos doesnt have! Better yet, lower one of OURS to match theirs =P</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Dazzler_Twodir]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Elyana wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Moorgard if I could I would be one starring you right now! Shame on you for your flippant comments! On these VERY forums is a compiled list of housing costs that was STICKIED and recently relocated. It clearly showed the lower price. (There have been many posts under the housing forum about this subject, usually to the tune of WAAA why does Freeport get cheaper housing than us WAAA to which they respond WAAAA we have a zillion other things worse than you =P)</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=5790" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=5790</A></P> <P>While I normally defend you, and the others at SOE, I think you owe the Freeportians an apology for this statement! By the way, I am a Qeynosian, and I think this is a poor decision on the part of the SOE staff to increase the cost for the Freeportians on this three room. For once, give them something nice, that Qeynos doesnt have! Better yet, lower one of OURS to match theirs =P</P> <P><BR> </P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>All that will do is make everyone flood that 1 house.</P> <P> </P> <P>On Mistmoore I think there is only 2 players actually using the 3 room housing at all.</P> <P>Would be nice if the devs could give a server by server breakdown of how many players have what house.</P>

[CherobylJ]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Jadrax wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>If any of you had ever visited the housing forum, you would have know about this months ago, but i digress.<BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I am a regular poster on that forum and was unaware of it.  I however do not rememeber you posting there regarding on this issue.</P> <P>Regardless of these ridiculous moral posturing "right/wrong" arguments this is going to hurt quite a few people (not myself as I have been too lazy to upgrade from 2 bedroom).  It is perfectly feasible for peeps to have expected the lower price because of location.  It is also feasibel that peeps may have seen this as a bargain. I dont think many peeps said "wow this is a bug" you know like npc books selling for5 silver and re-selling for 30 silevr or super jump or the spell descriptions being all screwed up; you know REAL BUGS.</P> <P>WHAT MATTERS is that people live there now and are going to get evicted (many of which have 300 items) who will not be able to re-afford a similar dwelling.  I would guess alot of these peeps are not cheaters but just normal players who are looking for a decent place to live where they can own their book and trophy quests AND STILL be able to have some furniture (as you are a "regular" poster on Housing surely you've read my posts on thats subject?).<BR></P> <P>So its a priority once again to punish players BUT NOT fix the game that actaully HELPS players? Its almost like you folks hate players somedays, you surely seem to enjoy adding as much weigtht as you can to their shoulders.  Want do something helpful???  Re-assess the room item limit and make it possible to ACTALLY DO 150+ book/heritage/etc all quests and STILL be able to afford a place to put them. </P>

[UrkBloodA]

<DIV>[edit - this message was in the wrong thread]</DIV><p>Message Edited by UrkBloodAxe on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:05 AM</span>

[Jadr]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>CherobylJoe wrote:<p>I am a regular poster on that forum and was unaware of it.  I however do not rememeber you posting there regarding on this issue.</p><p><span></span></p><blockquote><hr></blockquote><div></div></blockquote>Well though sticky posts are hard to see i suppose, as well as all the others.And no, i havent posted about it as i live in Qeynos, and was made awear of it through the 8 or 9 posts about it in the housing forum, so dident see the point in reposting it.The fact remains that this was the only resnobly prices 3 room house in the game and the others should have come down to match it.</span><div></div>

[Mezrin_Kort]

<DIV>The fix SHOULD be to lower the price of all other 3 room apartments DOWN to the cost of hte cheapo Freeport 3 room, NOT increase the Freeport one.  Why?  because 3 room apartments are stupidly expensive.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Going from one room to two rooms is one order of magnitude increase in rent.  Going from two to three rooms is TWO orders of magnitude increase in rent?  When one moves homes in RL yet doesnt change neighborhoods, you know what happens to price per sq ft?  It goes down!!!  In EQ2 price per sq ft goes up 100x when you add a room?  How in the world does that figure?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3 room apartments should be one order of magnitude higher than two rooms thus 6 gp for NQ or 12gp for SQ, with the appropriate costs changes assocaited with status homes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Having 3 room homes be 2 orders of magnitude higher than two room apartments defies logic.</DIV>

[BostonSail]

<P>If we aren't meant to enjoy shared houses and place our massive number of quested housing items in the house along with our friend's items, please change quest prizes to non-household items.</P> <P>We can not afford 61g per week.  We have nearly 300 items in that 6g per week house which my friends and I purchased for 61 gold after being assured through petition that there was no problem with that price.   We can't live together anymore because of this unless... oh wait... maybe this decision was made by the Sony Exchange team?  Maybe this high housing cost and "too many household items" is a way for Sony to ensure we'll want to buy platinum from farmers.</P> <P> </P>

[Shadowlo]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> UrkBloodAxe wrote:<BR> <P>with all the changes to the guild window did you guys fix the index problem with using a filter and guild remove / patron removal?  (it's in friend list too.)</P> <P>(see messages on last page on this thread) :</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=gld&message.id=15719&view=by_date_ascending&page=3" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=gld&message.id=15719&view=by_date_ascending&page=3</A></P> <P> </P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>What the heck does this have to do with housing upkeep in SFP?

[Tatali]

<span><blockquote><hr>BostonSailor wrote:<div></div> <p>We can not afford 61g per week.  We have nearly 300 items in that 6g per week house which my friends and I purchased for 61 gold after being assured through petition that there was no problem with that price. </p><hr></blockquote>That's something I've never understood about this game. A two room house rents for what, about 1g or so? Three room houses jump up to 60g. The two room can hold 200 items, 3 room 300 items. If SOE is really interested making it useful for people to share houses, why discourage them? If two people decide to split a 3-room house, not only are they paying WAY more than if each had a 2-room on their own, but they can't have as many items, roughly 150 each instead of 200 each. Yes bugs should be fixed, even ones that are benifical to the players. However, I think this puts a spotlight on the price of housing vs the value gained. Perhaps ALL house prices should be evaluated to determine if its really what SOE wants. Right now, the cost of housing goes up by a huge amount but the actual value only increases a tiny bit. Also, SOE should create a method for reclaiming items and built-in things from a house which has its rent expired. I never got the change to play with the housing in DAoC, but I recall Mythic adding an NPC in the housing districts who, after your house was removed due to lack of payment, would store your items until you claimed them. I would suggest SOE do something like that, when a house goes unpaid or is deleted, put a highlightable door somewhere in the city which is a "warehouse". Allow players to click that door to get a 'collect all' type button to get their house items back. Likewise, if a player spent 3-4pp to buy wall and floor upgrades, why should those always be lost? I think a player should be able to get at least part of their money back on those, if not be able to use them in their next house. </span><div></div>

[vTenebr]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Haliken wrote: <div>Unless there are plans to alter the change in payment plans on the currently existing house owners there, I think that people should be given, for instance, a week or two's notice (for after the patch is through) to move out if they cannot pay the new cost, but allow them to keep the house rented out while they temporarily simultaneously purchase a second house to move their belongings into without need of hiring 10 people just to help them move. <hr> </div></blockquote> <div>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</div> <div> </div> <div>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</div><hr></blockquote> I beg your pardon! You know, I've been so supportive of so many of the changes SoE has foisted upon us in the name of fairness that I've been called a fan boi.  I didn't blink when SK horses were nerfed, I was supportive.  I don't gripe that much that SK really are considered useless at the high end of the game.  I figured those were just things I had to deal with within in the game.  I didn't love them, but I was supportive.  I've sucked up the fact that Qeynos is a walk in the park, candyland compared to Freeport for 50 levels.  It's SO painfully obvious the deck is stacked toward Qeynos that FP citizens are outnumbered at LEAST 2:1 on most servers.  So fine, you favor Qeynos, I lived. I was under the impression that ONE thing was the *ONE* perk Freeport had.  Out of DOZENS of inequities it was nice to see one advantage.  One little thing that made Freeport, in ONE way a good place to live.  But, hell.. I petitioned anyway.  JUST to make sure, because it seemed too good to be true.  I figured I'd ASK before I invested any time or money. HOWEVER, now you're, essentially, slapping me in the face and calling me a cheat.  I had NO IDEA this was a bug, especially since I *ASKED 2 SEPERATE GMs ABOUT IT AND THEY SAID IT WAS WORKING AS INTENDED*. Do you think I *EVER* would have moved in there and dropped CONSIDERABLE coin on a place if I thought, for even a moment, that it was a bug and that someday.. I would lose that home because I couldn't afford it?  Are you out of your MIND?  I'm not one of those farmers who sits online all day collecting items/coin ad nauseum.  I have a couple of gold to rub together only.  If I had THOUGHT that, after even ASKING, that the GMs were LYING to me.. I would *NOT HAVE MOVED INTO THAT HOUSE*. I've been nothing but genteel and been a staunch supporter, even in the face of 1 star warrior morons who whined about everything you did.  I've defended against most actions.  I would even have defended against this.. despite how much it bothers me and how screwed up I think it is.  (You should REALLY let your GMs in on things like bugs if you're going to blame the PLAYERS for their answers) Your response however is insulting, degrading, and downright rude.. assuming all your players, who live in that house, are exploiting cheats is bad form.</span><div></div><p>Message Edited by vTenebrae on <span class=date_text>04-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:37 PM</span>

[CherobylJ]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Jadrax wrote:<BR> <SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Well though sticky posts are hard to see i suppose,</P> <P><FONT color=#ff00cc>You have no stickied posts on that forum, </FONT><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board?board.id=housing" target=_blank><STRONG><FONT color=#ffcc33 size=2>Homes and House Pets</FONT></STRONG></A><FONT color=#ffffff> </FONT><FONT color=#ff00cc>.  Are you are counting self-stickied? </FONT></P> <P>as well as <STRONG>all </STRONG>the others.</P> <P><FONT color=#ff00cc>In your last 120+ messages you post there 4 times (easy enough to validate by looking at message history). </FONT></P> <P><BR><STRONG>And no, i havent posted about it as i live in Qeynos,</STRONG> and was made awear of it through <STRONG>the 8 or 9 posts</STRONG> about it in the housing forum, so dident see the point in reposting it.</P> <P><FONT color=#ff00cc>You state yourself you didnt post on that board regarding this subject.  <STRONG>Yet</STRONG> you state that "<FONT color=#ff00cc>If any of you had ever visited the housing forum, you would have know about this months ago, but i digress.</FONT>"?</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff00cc>I also researched threads referencing the SFP 3 bedroom over the last 90 days; there are ZERO threads asking for "this bug to be corrected" in that forum or other (not 8 or 9).  There are plenty of references that state there is BUG in that guild level housing of the same TIER is OVERPRICED.  There are numerous requests to LOWER the guild housing to match...not vice versa.<BR></FONT><BR>The fact remains that this was the only resnobly prices 3 room house in the game and the others should have come down to match it.</P> <P><FONT color=#ff00cc>No argument there, something we agree on (/peace).  Its gonna be real rough on peeps who live there now with 300 items to relocate.</FONT><BR></P></SPAN></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P> </P> <P><BR> </P>

[Ningirsu]

<DIV>I rarely ever post on the forums, but this issue I defintely needed to speak up on.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Moorgard, you should be bloody fired for that comment...If I made a blanket statement about all my customers being theifs I'd be out of a job.</DIV> <DIV>I know you are all powerful in this world, being a dev and all, but try not to let the god like power go to your head.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It must seem horrible to let Freeport actually HAVE a benefit over Qeynos, but perhaps you should actually just let this one go eh? I too had no idea this was a big....but evidently, if you devs had read the housing forums, you would of known that many people DID in fact try to let you know...but i suppose its too much to ask for you to listen to your customers</DIV> <DIV>(after the horrible responses ive gotten from petitions, ive learned it IS  too much to ask )</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I know Freeport is supposed to be harder and more challenging compared to Qeynos, thats what I picked it, but I seriously didnt expect to have EVERYTHING harder...so we have a cheaper 3 bedroom house,.big deal? its not a balance issue...</DIV> <DIV>people in Qeynos will have to suffer with only a 2 bedroom house....but hey, there are a heck of a lot more of them...let them share a bigger house<img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> give us SOMETHING...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and try to keep your insults to a minimum ok?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Ningirsu, Shadow Baron for the Innorin Empire</DIV> <DIV>Antonia Bayle</DIV>

[Fizzlecast]

<P>Lets look at housing costs...</P> <P>1br inn costs 5 silver a week in upkeep</P> <P>2 br inn costs either 23 silver 60ish silver or 90ish silver, lets average that to 55 Silver a week.  55 Silver is roughly 10X the price of a one room, and holds double the stuff.</P> <P>3 br houses cost 30ish gold (3000 silver) up to 60ish gold (6000 Silver) thats a price JUMP of 50 to 100 X the 2 br cost, but we only get 1/2 more of the items of the last room, not double.  The exception of course is a single 3br in Freeport that is 6 gold (600 silver) a week, which is right at 10X the price upgrade.  This house is the more reasonable priced house, if you look at it logically.</P> <P>5br houses run at 2p or 4p a week (20000 or 40000 silver) Now, These houses are a little less than 10X the current 3br housing but closer to the 100X of the 6 gold a week house.  </P> <P>So, in a nutshell  housing should</P> <P>1br=5silver</P> <P>2br=5silver X 10= 50 silver (which the houses average that  price, some cheaper, some more expensive)</P> <P>3 br=50 silver X 10 = 500 silver (5 gold) which is what only one house comes close to costing.</P> <P>5br =500 silver X 10 X 10 (because of 2 br jump) =50000 (5 plat)</P> <P>Since 5br can only be bought with status, and status lowers monetary cost. 5br at bit below their cost. But the Current 3br dont fit even close into the above formula at 30 and 60 gold.</P> <P>So if there was a mistake on sony's part, it seems that they made the 3br houses 10X too expensive except for the one they got 'right' in freeport.</P> <P>I'm so upset I could cry... 4 days ago I finally saved up enough to buy the 3 br house for my carpenter, so that she would have enough room to show all the furniture items that she can craft.  I have been playing since release and it took me almost 5 months to be able to afford that house.  If they up the 3 br to the higher prices I will be back to stacking furniture on top of each other so that my customers will have a chance to See what their furniture looks like before ordering.  </P> <P>My funnest times in the game were my two moves... it took me a couple of months but when I first moved into that 2br suite I thought I had moved into a palace.  I change walls and floors, I moved furniture, made a fireplace. everyother day I was rearranging or adding to my place.  Then I noticed that I had almost filled my place up and that it was time to start looking for a new place.  I saved for a Month straight (no new spells, no rares for furniture, no scrying stones) so that I could save up enough for a 3 br... </P> <P>But I digress... </P> <P>Please don't take my dream home away Sony...</P>

[Xena]

<P>I live in a 5 s, 1 room apartment so this doesn't affect me, however it seems all wrong to change this rent at a later date.  </P> <P>If in the real word I rent a house or apartment for $x, after shopping for the best value, I don't expect the landlord to come back to me months later and say, "/Bah... you took advantage of me this house is much cheaper then the market rate"!  The rental price is the landlord's responsibility not the tenants.</P> <P>In my opinion, this increase is not the players fault and I live in the slums at Longstreet if you would lick to check!   It's not nice to blame your mistake on the players!  :smileysad:</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[vTenebr]

<div></div><div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Xena wrote:<p>I live in a 5 s, 1 room apartment so this doesn't affect me, however it seems all wrong to change this rent at a later date.  </p> <p>If in the real word I rent a house or apartment for $x, after shopping for the best value, I don't expect the landlord to come back to me months later and say, "/Bah... you took advantage of me this house is much cheaper then the market rate"!  The rental price is the landlord's responsibility not the tenants.</p> <p>In my opinion, this increase is not the players fault and I live in the slums at Longstreet if you would lick to check!   It's not nice to blame your mistake on the players!  :smileysad: </p> <div></div><hr></blockquote>No, we weren't blamed.  We were called cheats. You know, I could swallow this whole situation a lot better if I were at LEAST going to be reimbursed the 2.5pp(I changed a couple times to get a better look) I paid to upgrade the walls/floors/ceilings/trim..</span><div></div><p>Cause in Freeport.. I paid 20g and some silver EACH to upgrade floors, walls, ceilingsm and trim.. Yep.. MINIMUM 80gp per room.  (However, since I had made changes.. it ended up being more like 1-1.5pp per room) </p> <p>Qeynos upgrades are SILVERS. </p> <p>And you WONDER why we felt that the price on that room WASN'T a bug?  Hell.. we end up spending as much/more than Qeynos people to have a lovely home.  They pay it in rent.. we paid it in upgrades and living in a more difficult community.  It didn't HELP you *OWN* GMs TOLD US HOUSING WAS NOT BUGGED. </p> <p>Yes, I'm angry.  Rightfully so, I think. <span class="time_text"></span></p><p>Message Edited by vTenebrae on <span class=date_text>04-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:26 PM</span>

[Yirabeth]

<span><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div></div> <blockquote><div> </div></blockquote> <div>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</div> <div> </div> <div>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</div><hr></blockquote>Wow...just....wow. I find it hard to believe that it's considered okay to be that rude to paying customers...but I should have lost my ability to be surprised by SOE by now, I guess... This 'bug' was discussed MANY times in the housing forum. Many Freeportians petitioned it. Perhaps if your ingame help could say something besides 'working as intended' or 'ask your fellow player' perhaps this wouldn't be such a hardship to those who moved into those houses...These people did not believe it to be a bug. So, maybe you have to fix it (although that's another thing I dont quite understand) but to be so rude to those doing NOTHING WRONG is just...well...wrong... And, just as an FYI, no I'm not a Freeportian, I'm one of the Qeynosians that had hoped that affordable housing would come to Qeynos someday, at the same time they fixed Freeportian upgrade costs. It is, after all, a non-gamechanging aspect of this little world, and one that could be designed to keep people playing when hunting got to be too much of a grind.  Instead it's something that is only meant for the "uber" guild or someone who either has 18 hrs a day to devote to Norrath, OR has a heavy pocketbook in RL I guess..I'm neither. Thanks for making me feel like this is my world too...when my friends leave, I'm gone. (I'm not a gamer, I followed friends here because they're my 'online family', and housing has been my joy...) ~Yira</span><div></div>

[Sorvani]

<span><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote: <div>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</div> <div> </div> <div>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</div><hr></blockquote>While i agree 100% with Moorgard's response to the previous posts, i would like to point out that i've had the <a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=tips&message.id=890" target=_blank>Consolidated Housing Guide</a> posted on these boards since Dec 31, 2004. And that price has been listed on there with it's messed up cost ever since. I know i've personally sent in a /bug about it and it was discussed in numerous threads on this board. The sheer amount of time it has taken to get this changed astounds me.</span><div></div>

[Dastion]

<DIV>Wow Moorgaard, I expect a far better PR reply than that.  I don't live in the house, and don't need anything other than my 2 Slot House Vault  to make me happy.  But the fact is that you no doubt knew about the bug quite awhile ago, and still allowed people to go ahead purchasing it and paying the cheap rent.  I never saw any notification or warning prior to the change being put on test.  And no, a little comment on the boards doesn't count as that isn't exactly public.  If you can pop up a notification asking me what I think of Sony Exchange when I log in you can pop up something to notify those players ahead of time.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>SoE is the leaser, you told them the down payment and the weekly fee.  The least you can do, if you're going to do this, is offer to let the players petition for a refund of the initial price (after checking to be certain they have let go of hte house).  I understand changing hte price, but it's not fair for you to let the bug remain in game so long.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh, and you have a lot of nerve to speak of players not reporting "beneficial" bugs.  I've reported the bug with my Necro's house many times.  In order to change any of the textures in my 5silver a week STARTER house, it wants me to pay about 1-3g depending on what i get. Whereas in my Monk's Qeynosian starter home it costs a couple of silver to upgrade the walls/floors/ect.  Fix some of the blatantly silly and unbeneficial bugs (how about the fact that two necro's in a group/raid can't both use any of their dmg spells?) and maybe we'll be more grateful and not cling to the few perks we get.</DIV>

[machput]

<P>thing that is mostly unfair imo:</P> <P>even tho they now know about the "bug" and intend to change it, u still can buy those houses in sfp and waste ur money since u wont get a refund when they increase the costs</P> <P>the least that soe could do is to lock those houses from purchase since they "found out" about this "bug"</P>

[Kokus]

<DIV>Well i just spent 3 hours moving everything from my house to my bank and to my alt. I'm sitting in my empty house right now which I've spent over 160gp on the walls, floors, and ceilings inside. I'm going to keep selling there while I can, but I'm very upset about this whole situation. This was not anything new, and to have this house taken away from me in such a manner just sickens me. I could hope to somehow get a refund for what I paid for the inside of the house but apparently I've been a cheater for several months because a house that's far away from the others and a place that most people can't find had a less gold upkeep that actually made sense for its location. Well thanks for ruining some of the enjoyment I had in this game. When I told my girlfriend who helped me for hours decorating this house she was even more heartbroken than I was. I hope you enjoy punishing us cheaters with the rude post and the changes going through. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Ibis]

you know it would be nice if price scaled based on location and traffic as well as inner space.  then these houses would ALL have lower introductory costs and as people move in and the area becomes more populace, the price goes up.  if interest dies down again the prices and rents lower, etc.  could track the traffic and buying/selling activities within each housing instance and 17 Lucie Lane might cost more to purchase and rent than 13 Lucie Lane due to having 3 more residents and 1 of them being a very good spell vendor that gets frequent traffic. then the early adopters would get a bit of a benefit, as would houses that are out of the way. you could easily get 2 acres in the middle of siberia (if it gots no oil) for a nickel, try and get the same land in japan and you'll be paying an arm and a leg.  location can mean as much as space.  those are an extreme contrast of course <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. <div></div>

[Kwoung]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Shunidar wrote:<BR> <BR>I distinctly remember (Kwong?) posting about this at least once or twice on the tester forum a good while ago.  No one really to blame here but yourself. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Actually I don't think I posted about that particular homes rent... I was on about the lack of any Inn room's at all in East Freeport, which they did address by adding one in for us.<BR>

[Efour EQ2]

<DIV>oh dear,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I wouldnt have found out about this atall if i wasnt told by a couple fo people ingame.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ermm oook, well this is going to be a lot of fun moving all the items from SFP to a bank to EFP.... or another 2 room house. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why is there no period where u can own 2 houses for a while ? even just for 1 day to allow moving house.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I feel really bad knowing that have been Exploiting the game.... lol ? for so long and im lucky i have got away with it.... lol?  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>what a bunch of horse feathers.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Sem]

<DIV>I'm guessing they originally intended us to be able to play with friends and share houses with them and do quests together with them.  They also packed the game full of content and I imagine the individual dev teams like to hear when players take time by turning off XP to enjoy each zone delighting in the details and do most of the quests following the stories and immersing in the world.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That is how we were playing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2 people x 35 seasons of book quests + heritage quests + town quests resulting in furnishings + one of them is a carpenter = more than 200 individual items they'd like to share in a single home together</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2 people who play that way do not have :</DIV> <DIV><EM>(copied in from the handy pricing guide in the Housing forum a link to which IS sticked to the top of that forum)</EM></DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0000>a three room house, version 2</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc00>6, 8, and 10 Freedom Road</FONT> - <U><FONT color=#ff9900>3p 7g 20s 1024000 status to buy</FONT>, <FONT color=#ffff00>30g 72s 51200 status upkeep</FONT></U></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>or </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0000>a three room house, version 1 <FONT color=#66ffff size=1>***Housing for the unguilded or guilds who haven't unlocked this size yet.***</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc00>3 and 5 Freedom Road</FONT> - <U><FONT color=#ff9900>6p 14g 40s to buy</FONT>, <FONT color=#ffff00>61g 44s upkeep</FONT></U></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff00></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffffff>But we did have:</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0000>a three room house, version 1 <FONT color=#66ffff size=1>***Housing for the unguilded or guilds who haven't unlocked this size yet.***</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc00>7 Freedom Road</FONT> - <U><FONT color=#ff9900>61g 40s to buy</FONT>, <FONT color=#ffff00>6g 14s upkeep</FONT></U></DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>61 gold took a few weeks to save up and 6g a week means we are out there adventuring or harvesting weekly for saleables just to earn the rent (which does feel a bit more like a job) because neither of our tradeskill professions makes money at T4 (carpentry and weaponsmith)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Prices are simply unreasonable if you want people to be able to play the way we were playing.  The price structure as it is... for you to have a 3 room home you'd have to take hunting fairly seriously, play more hours,  and rolling on everything that drops in group whether you can use it or not just so you can sell it.  That's a way I have never played and have no interest in changing to suit this stupid, disappointing housing system.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Semma on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:13 AM</span>

[Ggiirr]

<DIV>this will probably get me into trouble, but... well, remind me to care later, if you would....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Moorgard, is your [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] bleeding? Cus you seem just a tad bit [Removed for Content] today. I dont have the time to play to go and get this "cheap" 3 bedroom apartment right now, but i look foward to the day when I do. Unfortunately, most of your players have real lives that include work at least 40 hours a week, and some, like me, work 9-6 6 days a week, and just dont have that much time to sacrifice to a GAME, one that we pay for ontop of that. Now, I dont put much stock into my house, only on the basis of if I did, right now, I'd freak out off of the basis of I dont have the time nor money to sink into it. Hell, I still havent even claimed my Collectors Edition furniture or dragon yet.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Basically, your response just saddened me, off of the basis that it showed me just HOW much you care about the people who are the reason you get the paycheck that you do/did (after that brilliant response). This kinda reminds me of the 911 operator, in a smaller city outside of Dallas, that handled a call remarkably well. A mother was calling to try and get some officers out to calm her kid down, who was freaking out and destroying stuff, when the 911 operator asked "So, what do you want us to do, come out there and shoot her?" What a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]. Oh, unfortunately, he didnt get fired, but he breathes wrong again and he will be.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Point - Dont treat your customers like crap. Calling everyone who went "sweet, cheap rent, i can afford to make my place look nice now" is not a cheater. People who BUY plat (oh ho ho, look, Sony Exchange), those are your cheaters. People who bot through all of their tradeskill levels? Cheaters. People who exploit a bug that makes their charecter hella better than everyone elses? Cheater. Now, you might be asking, well, arent the first and last the same? Well, once my house can /assist me, then complain, until then, shut the hell up.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Ashlian]

<DIV>I have a Qeynosian main, and she's just run out of room in her 2 room in QH, so I'm getting another 2 room for a guild hall and library, because I have at least 10 book quests stuck in my bank that I can't do. Note I did not say I'm getting a 3 room......what POSSIBLE benefit could a 3 room have when I can spend unbelievably less for two 2 rooms and get room for 100 more furnishings.....not to mention, the Qeynos 3 rooms are, in my opinion, much much uglier than the 2 rooms. No windows downstairs, a barren courtyard with not a hint of flowers or shrubs or trees in our future (the mushroom circle was a tiny baby step in the right direction.....I have the urge to steal the flower pots out of the halfling houses in EL and RV every time I pass through....we won't talk about the hanging baskets!) and tiny little windows in the attic upstairs....I can't call it a bedroom because it's a huge cavernous gaping space with inadequate lighting.  The devs need to take a few basic architecture classes before I would ever consider getting a 3 room for the looks. The 5 rooms are gorgeous, but I'll be old and grey in rl before I approach that much plat. So would my laid back, un-power leveling, anti-money making guild. I've dropped about 5pp on my 2-room and that's nearly the sum total of my EQ earnings. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The cost of housing is completely unrealistic unless you leveled three or four alts to 50 in tradeskills before the nerfs and shoveled in the money....and I certainly know people who did that. They still aren't close to considering the 5 rooms, though. I haven't exactly figured out the point of having such a steep rise in cost for housing....most of the power levelers I know are still in newbie rooms, since the majority of them couldn't care less about decoration. People like me who are constantly trolling for new items appearing on the boards (what a disappointment that quested Vale bookcase was).  Every npc in Norrath has access to better furniture than I do, but I would like room to at least display what I get. All rooms should have at least twice the current limits, or you should lower the cost of housing to something approaching reasonable levels. If I got 10 people together in rl, we could indeed afford a fancy five room house. EQ should be no different. Housing has no true benefit as it is, it's fluff.....so make it enjoyable fluff. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What you've done to the FP people who bought that apartment is sad, and ridiculous. I read those endless posts about the cost discrepancy, I've been aware of it for at least four months.....and the devs haven't? Give me a break. I usually support the devs until you're proven totally wrong but that's close to an unforgiveable statement considering the facts. I've played EQ for six years now, one and two, but I only have time and money for one game. I would like it to be this one, it's up to you at SOE to make it worth my while to continue with that decision.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ashlian Liadan</DIV> <DIV>31 Fury</DIV> <DIV>31 Tailor</DIV> <DIV>Gilde Zonder Naam, Mistmoore</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>PS - I have a couple of FP alts, and two friends and I were going to get one of those 3 rooms, funded by my main.....guess not. Oh, and note about the extra 2 room....I don't mean my main, I'll just have an alt get it....thank you for at least making it easy to transfer money! I do appreciate the effort devs make in so many cases, but you don't get a free ride when something is truly screwed up. Just my 2cp.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Ashlian on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:08 PM</span>

[bugbig]

<DIV>Feel free to look at all my posts ( <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/tracker?user.id=442&page=1" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/tracker?user.id=442&page=1</A>) and you will find I have not done one single WHINE or COMPLAINT on these boards but I gotta say...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>WHAT IS SOE THINKING?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I mean the housing is deserted enough with empty 5 room houses abound.  Now you plan on pushing out a little enclave of COMMUNITY that loves to:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Craft Furntiture</DIV> <DIV>-Design and Decorate</DIV> <DIV>-Gather and be social</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is not some sort of "uber" game balance that needs to be squashed.  This is a fun alternative to grinding that BUILDS community.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am a relatively successful adventurer of 50 seasons and a guild leader of approximately 70 active players.  I play, hunt, and harvest... alot (but albeit I do not craft.. just not my thing and I prefer to buy from others).  I am on hours every day.  And even with that there is no way I could sustain 60g a week?  So who are you targetting with this 3 room housing?  I could see 60g a week for a 5 room to target wealthy merchants and guilds.  But come on!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So the thougt of dismantling my house over this is very, very dissapointing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh and if anyone wants to see a bit of my personal history here is the 5 star post viewed 1,723 times (yes I am proud of my home) here:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=15578" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=housing&message.id=15578</A></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I guess I need to throw this in the Overlord's garbage cart as it backs up to my house and move BACKWARDS to the slums or perhaps a two bedroom Inn.  From a RP perspective it really, really STINKS!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff99> -- BOTTOM LINE - PLEASE FEEL FREE TO MAKE HOUSING AFFORDABLE TO ALL SO PERHAPS MORE WILL ENJOY THIS EXTREMELY FUN CONTENT OF THE GAME --</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff99></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff99>Respectfully Submitted,</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff99></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ffff99></FONT> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by bugbig on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:30 PM</span>

[wild_hei]

<div></div><div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</div><div> </div><div>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</div><hr></blockquote></span><p>I think most people on this thread need to learn how to read before posting.  Please highlight where exactly Moorgard called ANYONE a cheat, a thief or any other insult?  I mean seriously, y'all need to calm down.  He very rightfully said that people were reaping a benefit that was not intended.  He said that people took advantage of the error, which is true.   He DID NOT say that everyone living in that house is a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]er who cheats their way through the game and should be punished harshly.  He DID POINT OUT how you can keep the house for a little bit longer at the reduced rate, to help make the transisiton a little smoother.If they really wanted to screw you, they would make you backpay the actual cost of "purchasing" the house and all the weeks of lower rent that you were not supposed to have. I know you think the GMs told you the price was as intended, but it has already been pointed out time and time again that when you /petition, /bug, /report etc. in-game, that the responses are 99% canned and 98% of the time don't even pertain to what was originally reported.  So using this as an argument is foolish.  Instead of getting mad at Moorgard, you should be mad at the messed up help system.For those of you who insist on comparing a GAME to RL economics, sociological standing and whatever else RL has to offer, think about this:1 - If, in RL, you rent a house on a week by week basis with no contract or written agreement, and the owner of said house decides to raise the rent 10 fold, that is well within his right.  If you do not pay that increased rent he can evict you from the premises.2 - If, in RL, you put upgrades into your home and you are then unable to pay your mortgage, because the interest rate increased thereby increasing your monthly payment because you are stupid and got a really [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ty ARM/Interest Only/ negative Armortization mortgage, you do not get any of the upgrades back.  Sure if you are lucky you may be able to incorporate the upgrades into the selling price, but in reality very few upgrades affect the overall price of a "used" house.In regards to the crybabies that complain that Qeynos has it easier than Freeport:  Are you high? Or is complaining what you do when you are done decorating your house and don't feel like actually playing the game?  Both cities have a heritage that starts within their walls.  Yes, Qeynos doesn't require an access quest to get into their "Fallen Gate", but as the game progresses they will need to do the Freeport fallen gate access quest in order to even think about getting their prismatic weapons.  Freeport has an edge because we already did the access and won't have to waist our time doing an access quest that gets us no xp.  There is no real advantage to being from one city or the other. <span> </span></p><p>Stop whining about what others have that you don’t and go out and have fun, that’s what the game is for afterall.</p><p>Grayza</p><div></div><p>Message Edited by wild_heidi on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:34 PM</span>

[Ningirsu]

lol, not even gonna dignify that with a response, wild.oh crap...i just did.-Ningirsu<p>Message Edited by Ningirsu on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:09 PM</span>

[Phlesheal]

Well first of all it's has been 6 months playing eq2, and if this a bug i think its a bunch of cr ap.  Im guessing is to make this game harder for ppl to burn there time to make money off them by keeping them at the computer. this is it for me! you ph uck'S with my Rent i quit! or u can kick me i dont care. i play  eq1 for 6 years and still play on eq1 but im sick of  the Nurf's  do what you want but other will fallow keep nurfing S***  that you set the price on. thats no bug,  and for all the Cry babbies out there in Qeynos  can  ~*** o!!

[Silversnow]

<blockquote><hr>wild_heidi wrote:<div></div><div></div><span><p>I think most people on this thread need to learn how to read before posting.  Please highlight where exactly Moorgard called ANYONE a cheat, a thief or any other insult?  I mean seriously, y'all need to calm down.  He very rightfully said that people were reaping a benefit that was not intended.  He said that people took advantage of the error, which is true.   He DID NOT say that everyone living in that house is a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]er who cheats their way through the game and should be punished harshly.  He DID POINT OUT how you can keep the house for a little bit longer at the reduced rate, to help make the transisiton a little smoother.If they really wanted to screw you, they would make you backpay the actual cost of "purchasing" the house and all the weeks of lower rent that you were not supposed to have. I know you think the GMs told you the price was as intended, but it has already been pointed out time and time again that when you /petition, /bug, /report etc. in-game, that the responses are 99% canned and 98% of the time don't even pertain to what was originally reported.  So using this as an argument is foolish.  Instead of getting mad at Moorgard, you should be mad at the messed up help system.For those of you who insist on comparing a GAME to RL economics, sociological standing and whatever else RL has to offer, think about this:1 - If, in RL, you rent a house on a week by week basis with no contract or written agreement, and the owner of said house decides to raise the rent 10 fold, that is well within his right.  If you do not pay that increased rent he can evict you from the premises.2 - If, in RL, you put upgrades into your home and you are then unable to pay your mortgage, because the interest rate increased thereby increasing your monthly payment because you are stupid and got a really [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ty ARM/Interest Only/ negative Armortization mortgage, you do not get any of the upgrades back.  Sure if you are lucky you may be able to incorporate the upgrades into the selling price, but in reality very few upgrades affect the overall price of a "used" house.In regards to the crybabies that complain that Qeynos has it easier than Freeport:  Are you high? Or is complaining what you do when you are done decorating your house and don't feel like actually playing the game?  Both cities have a heritage that starts within their walls.  Yes, Qeynos doesn't require an access quest to get into their "Fallen Gate", but as the game progresses they will need to do the Freeport fallen gate access quest in order to even think about getting their prismatic weapons.  Freeport has an edge because we already did the access and won't have to waist our time doing an access quest that gets us no xp.  There is no real advantage to being from one city or the other. <span> </span></p><p> </p><p>Stop whining about what others have that you don’t and go out and have fun, that’s what the game is for afterall.</p><p> </p><p>Grayza</p><div></div><p>Message Edited by wild_heidi on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:34 PM</span><hr></blockquote>How about we back tax the qeynos people then for the room upgrades and tell them to 'suck it up' and 'it was a bug, now your free rides over' when they are brought in line with everyone in freeports cost for upgrades. That issue right there has been complained about and /bugged /feedbacked by numerous people even BEFORE this supposed wrong pricing of the house was posted. If they are going to fiddle with something on the houses this needs to be fixed at the same time. All the people who are being forced to move out and want to upgrade from plywood walls they are going to be paying bugged prices for upgrades again.And your selective real life economic references were sorta cute. In some places by law you can not raise prices of the house after the fact unless it's agreed upon by the housing athorities who either say yes or no. So its debatable as to what real life economics you can apply this too.I wish some of the dev's responsible for furnature would grow a set and give an 'or else' ultimatum to whoevers bright idea it was to change this. But i guess Owlchick and the rest of the dev responsible for quest don't need to fix any more of those bugged out quests now. Even if you want to do them you can't put the book rewards or whatever any place. Not like 12 people banding together to pay for a 3 room house can even fit their rewards in it for very long. Good going. Solved the complaints over broken furnature rewards in one stroke. Though i'm sure carpenters are absolutely thrilled that they wont be asked to make random pieces of furnature now due to people not wanting to waste their room cap space on player made things. Lets see. Quest reward you can't get again. Or player made item you can get made any time if bored. Gee. This is a hard choice to make. Idiots.

[vTenebr]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><span><blockquote><hr>wild_heidi wrote:<div></div><div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Moorgard wrote:<div>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. <i><b><font color="#ccff00">Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</font></b></i></div><div> </div><div>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</div><hr></blockquote></span><p>I think most people on this thread need to learn how to read before posting.  Please highlight where exactly Moorgard called ANYONE a cheat, a thief or any other insult?  I mean seriously, y'all need to calm down.  He very rightfully said that people were reaping a benefit that was not intended.  <span><font color="#6666ff"> </font></span></p> <p><span><font color="#6666ff"><i>Obviously, it is </i><i><b>you</b> who can't read as well as your postulating.  People were offended by the comment I highlighted above.  That comment infers that we knew it was a bug, never said anything about it, we were intentionally exploiting it.</i> </font></span></p> <p><span>He said that people took advantage of the error, which is true.   </span></p> <p><span></span><i><font color="#6666ff">You're only "taking advantage" if you were aware it was an error.  If informed that it's working as it's intended, how would we be "taking advantage" of something that wasn't stated to even BE an error.</font></i> </p> <p>I know you think the GMs told you the price was as intended, but it has already been pointed out time and time again that when you /petition, /bug, /report etc. in-game, that the responses are 99% canned and 98% of the time don't even pertain to what was originally reported.  So using this as an argument is foolish.  Instead of getting mad at Moorgard, you should be mad at the messed up help system.</p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">Some of us have actually had one on one conversations with GMs.  If this is a CANNED response to the issue then it's in their SCRIPT that our housing was working as it should.  If it were an error, that SHOULD have been inserted into their scripts and, while they took their sweet time to correct it.. at least people could have avoided wasting their money.</font></i> </p> <p>1 - If, in RL, you rent a house on a week by week basis with no contract or written agreement, and the owner of said house decides to raise the rent 10 fold, that is well within his right.  If you do not pay that increased rent he can evict you from the premises.</p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">You're stating something important and negating your own arguement with it.  We did have a "contract" of sorts.  It tells you when you click on the door "Cost and Upkeep".  We clicked on that thereby agreeing to pay the asked for cost and agreeing to pay the asked for upkeep.  If this was a *bug* it should have been noted, as I'd stated before.. not sprung on people out of nowhere.</font></i> </p> <p>2 - If, in RL, you put upgrades into your home and you are then unable to pay your mortgage, because the interest rate increased thereby increasing your monthly payment because you are stupid and got a really [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ty ARM/Interest Only/ negative Armortization mortgage, you do not get any of the upgrades back.  Sure if you are lucky you may be able to incorporate the upgrades into the selling price, but in reality very few upgrades affect the overall price of a "used" house.</p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">In RL if you're making improvements and paying your mortgage as it was initially contracted, you won't lose your upgrades.  You can later sell your home to another buyer and the costs of said upgrades will increase the value of said home.  Mortgages don't get raised out of nowhere and<b> landlords</b> pay to upgrade a RENTAL property.  If we're owners and have to pay to upgrade, fine.  If we're renters who can have our rents raised on a whim.. then yes, we should be reimbursed for the cost of upgrades.  Real Life... <b>Landlords</b> pay for upgrades.  Renters do not. </font></i></p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">We're not vacating voluntarily, we had no say in our rent being raised, and if it were up to me.. I for damned sure wouldn't have upgraded if I knew they were going to pull this stunt.</font></i> In regards to the crybabies that complain that Qeynos has it easier than Freeport:  Are you high? Or is complaining what you do when you are done decorating your house and don't feel like actually playing the game?  Both cities have a heritage that starts within their walls.  Yes, Qeynos doesn't require an access quest to get into their "Fallen Gate", but as the game progresses they will need to do the Freeport fallen gate access quest in order to even think about getting their prismatic weapons.  Freeport has an edge because we already did the access and won't have to waist our time doing an access quest that gets us no xp.  There is no real advantage to being from one city or the other.  <span> </span></p> <p><i><span><font color="#6666ff">Are YOU high?  For the Serrated Bone Dirk you have to go into Freeport but 1 time and you, yourself can sneak in and do it.  For Dusty Blue Stone/Ghoulbane, as an evil character, you can't even *GET* to the quest starter.  You have to have someone else get it FOR you.  THEN you have to make REPEATED trips into Qeynos. </font></span></i></p> <p><i><span><font color="#6666ff">As for the FG quest.  Do we play the same game? You don't need the bloody access quest to get your Prismatic.  I can BET that out of all the Qeynos people in my guild who now wield their prismatics.. not ALL have done the access </font></span><span><span><font color="#6666ff"> (I know many haven't, in fact).</font></span></span><span><font color="#6666ff">  All you need to get into FG is someone ELSE with access.  When you were level 20 and waltzing into SH for your armor quests, people in FP had to do an access quest first. </font></span></i></p> <p><i><span><font color="#6666ff">MOST Qeynos people recognize there are disparities between the cities.  You're turning a blind eye to it because it'd negate your arguement.  Nektulos vs Thundering Steppes.. FG vs SH.. Commonlands vs Antonica.   There are way more agro mobs and touchier places that are death traps for FP players as they level.  Post 20 it doesn't matter, but getting to 20 is a WHOLE different damned game for a Qeynosian vs a Freeporter.  I've played *both* cities and Qeynos is like playing EQ on easy.  Anyone who says it's the same has, obviously, not played an evil character for any length of time. </font></span></i></p> <p><i><span><font color="#6666ff">There *IS* a reason that Qeynos citizens now FAR outnumber their Freeport counterparts.  Ever notice that Antonica is ALWAYS instanced.. Commonlands USED to be early on, it's not now.  You're lucky to get 50 people in there.  All the newbie zones in Freeport are deserted, in Qeynos I can still get groups easily.  I walked through ALL the newbie zones in FP today and never saw more than 6 people.  Qeynos.. there were often 20-50. </font></span></i></p> <p><span><font color="#6666ff"><i>Why is that?  Oh yeah.. because everyone knows it's a hell of a lot easier to level in Qeynos so they start over there or betray to Qeynos.</i> </font></span></p> <p>Stop whining about what others have that you don’t and go out and have fun, that’s what the game is for afterall. </p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">I do have fun, don't assume because something bothers us and we're getting shafted, yet again.. that we're not having fun.  It's not whining when you're mislead, lied to, and then have the rug pulled out from under you.  It's not whining to have a legitimate gripe about a change that you never saw coming. </font></i></p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">I've been nerfed, play a [Removed for Content] class, and come from a city where it's pretty much a given that we're the red headed step children of SoE.. and I never griped before.   THIS is bloody ridiculous.  It's easy for YOU to get on a high horse because you're from Qeynos and have had this cakewalk for ages.  For Freeport this was the one "bone thrown" that made our city *not* totally crappy.  Now that's gone too.  Now what do we have going for us?</font>  </i> </p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">Qeynos still has cheaper upgrades for their rooms.. Qeynos still has the better layouts.  Qeynos still has the big windows.  Qeynos still has the bloody STAINED GLASS in their rooms.  Qeynos had easier/better quests with better loot rewards.  Qeynos has easier zones to play in with less agro mobs.  Qeynos has dungeons you can just waltz into without any kind of access.  Qeynos has a heritage quest that evil people *CAN'T* start without someone from Qeynos' assistance. </font></i></p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">All we had was *1* room that was cheap.. in a crappy location in the middle of nothing.   MOST Qeynos players I've spoken with found that to be the ONLY perk we have.  No one moves to Freeport because of that one room... but people flock to Qeynos for ALL the other advantages.</font><font color="#6666ff"> </font></i></p> <p><i><font color="#6666ff">Look at the server populations sometime.. then come here and tell me how everything's even and we were SO advantaged by this one thing.  Then explain how if it's so even.. why we're outnumbered at LEAST 2:1 game wide, on most servers.</font></i> </p> <i><font color="#6666ff">And for the record, my alts are all Qeynos citizens now.  I did it the hard way once, I kinda like getting to level 22 in 7 1/2 hours /played now cause yes.. it really is THAT easy in Qeynos.</font></i> <hr></blockquote></span><div></div><p>Message Edited by vTenebrae on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:42 PM</span>

[Taelr]

well I also own that house in south freeport, and frankly if they are going to raise it to 6 plat I want a GM to move my house to longshadow alley :smileymad:. This place is so out of the way it isn't funny. I mean if they are going to make it the same price as all the other houses the LEAST they can do is move everybody out into the middle of south freeport, and preferably to a place where there is an actual community. Currently the fastest way to get to my house is to run through the SEWERS. Then I have to pass the 4 identical houses right next to the sewer exit, climb 4 flights of stairs (including that big ol one from the first floor to the second floor), and round the corner to get to my house. I assumed it was location that was the reason for the cheapness, and if you plan to make it the same price I will most likely move back into a 2 room because frankly the only reason why I bought the 3 room was for space and slightly for cosmetics, because a 2-room is actually better then a 3-room in ALL other matters. Ultimately a 2 room has access to a lot more things (broker, bank, several stores, tradeskill area) then a 3 room, and besides space and cosmetics there is absolutely no reason to own anything above a 1-room. When a 1-room has more practical reasons then a 3-room why buy more? As a carpenter I felt it was my duty to own a good house to show other people (despite the fact that only 10% of my items I actually made since merchant bought items look better, but thats a whole nother rant) and even at 60g I am thinking of moving back to a 2 room since I have no access to a nearby broker or bank (I have to run boxes to my house several times a week and it takes about 10 mins per trip currently). To make it cost more then 60g is a joke, even if you don't factor in the fact we as freeportians spend over 20 times more for sheathing.<p>Message Edited by Taelren on <span class=date_text>04-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:48 PM</span>

[Shelani]

<DIV> <P>I also have one of these three-room houses. I have had it for quite some time. Like others have mentioned, I’m an avid quester and my collection of books and trophies alone is more than the entire item limit on a two-room. That’s not even counting the shelves to put them in…</P> <P>What really upsets me, though, is that, at level 50, I spend a lot of time in my apartment. We have a small community. We have dinner parties, regular parties, meetings… we have an art collection, a library… sometimes squatters, sometimes feuding neighbors… all sorts of things. It keeps the game interesting and fun. We, all of us, have worked very hard on our houses to make them look nice, to personalize them and make them something special. I’m not so much upset about the money put into it but the time and the community I’m going to lose when SOE takes this all away.</P> <P>I’m tired of walking to my house and seeing rows and rows of empty doors in South Freeport. If SOE goes through with this change, there’s going to be just one more empty door.</P> <P>Devs, why don’t you lower the housing costs? As so many have pointed out, they’re completely unreasonable, since none of us can afford them as they stand. The houses are there; why not let us use them? They take money from the economy. They support crafters. They help with player retention. (I know my house has definitely kept me interested.) Why else did you design them?</P> <P>What you’re doing just makes no sense. Please let me keep my house. Give the Qeynosians houses. What good is a ghost town?</P></DIV>

[Echar Elocin]

<P>Well,  i am sure this wont matter much.  i own the home in sfp, on my server there are very few people who own it.  In my personal guild there are two who own it my leader and myself.  I am a carpenter, a great part of the enjoyment i get from this game comes from creating a peice of furniture and placing it in my beautifully upgraded room.  When i want to relax from all the fighting i go to my room rearrange, jump on my funiture, or just sit and look at my room.</P> <P> </P> <P>I was very excited when i found a 3 bedroom that i could have the coin for.  apparently it was a bug that some used to thier advatage.  i personally was living at my means.  heh a bit off topic but its all in how u use bugs that gauges what kind of player u r.  i used the jumping bug to climb trees.</P> <P> </P> <P>when i do move out of my wonderful 3 room appartment i wont be upgrading any more walls, or decorating what little space i will have in my next apartment.  I won't leave by any strech of the imagination, but a little of the fun in my EQ2 world will be gone :smileysad:  </P> <P>this is my first post i am sure few will read it and the eyes of the developers who are taking my home won't either.   its just the first thing that i care about in this game thats been taken or "fixed" all other changes r usually par for the course in mmo's</P>

[Bodaciu]

<P>If SOE feels that this needs to be changed, then somehing must be done for those who mde a commitment to these 3 BR areas.  61g start-up+30g upgrades+6g+status lost on 2BR+10g upgrades in 2BR+6g+ status to go back to 2BR place.  Some of us have a lot to lose due to SOE's error that was not fixed over a 6 month+beta time period.</P> <DIV>Moorguard's response if frustrating.  This problem has been stated over and over on the boards for a long time.  It has been reported, and 6 months later they get changed???</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is not the way to keep commited players.</DIV>

[Bodaciu]

<P>12/31/04 is the first post stating the costs I could find (not great with the boards here..lol)</P> <P> </P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=tips&message.id=890&query.id=60043#M890" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=tips&message.id=890&query.id=60043#M890</A></P> <P> </P> <P>So, we are saying this took 5 months to adjust, even though Moorguard stated that no one reports bugs????</P> <P>Kinda %$^@ IMO.</P>

[nod]

<DIV>What gets me thru this whole things is that soe gives all the perks to Qeynos people and when a few of us on the freeport side. Lets make the game easier for the Qeynos people what they don't get enough breaks they out number us 2:1 and they pay less for the house upgrades by 7 times cheaper. They also get a qeynosian house which is huge u can fit 2 5 room houses from freeport in there so you tell me. who's getting the better end of the deal. maybe the dev can look into this instead of just taking taking away from the love of the game i spent over 15 hours for my time setting up the best possible house i could and spent alot of status points to get it the way it looks and now soe wants to say this was a bug that should have been fixed there are alot of other things the dev should be looking at with houses and after almost a year of eq2 being out there. They still haven't fixed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Nodin </DIV>

[Dazzler_Twodir]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Silversnow wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> wild_heidi wrote:<BR> <SPAN><BR> <P>I think most people on this thread need to learn how to read before posting.  Please highlight where exactly Moorgard called ANYONE a cheat, a thief or any other insult?  I mean seriously, y'all need to calm down.  He very rightfully said that people were reaping a benefit that was not intended.  He said that people took advantage of the error, which is true.   He DID NOT say that everyone living in that house is a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]er who cheats their way through the game and should be punished harshly.  He DID POINT OUT how you can keep the house for a little bit longer at the reduced rate, to help make the transisiton a little smoother.<BR><BR>If they really wanted to screw you, they would make you backpay the actual cost of "purchasing" the house and all the weeks of lower rent that you were not supposed to have.<BR><BR> I know you think the GMs told you the price was as intended, but it has already been pointed out time and time again that when you /petition, /bug, /report etc. in-game, that the responses are 99% canned and 98% of the time don't even pertain to what was originally reported.  So using this as an argument is foolish.  Instead of getting mad at Moorgard, you should be mad at the messed up help system.<BR><BR>For those of you who insist on comparing a GAME to RL economics, sociological standing and whatever else RL has to offer, think about this:<BR><BR>1 - If, in RL, you rent a house on a week by week basis with no contract or written agreement, and the owner of said house decides to raise the rent 10 fold, that is well within his right.  If you do not pay that increased rent he can evict you from the premises.<BR><BR>2 - If, in RL, you put upgrades into your home and you are then unable to pay your mortgage, because the interest rate increased thereby increasing your monthly payment because you are stupid and got a really [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ty ARM/Interest Only/ negative Armortization mortgage, you do not get any of the upgrades back.  Sure if you are lucky you may be able to incorporate the upgrades into the selling price, but in reality very few upgrades affect the overall price of a "used" house.<BR><BR><BR><BR>In regards to the crybabies that complain that Qeynos has it easier than Freeport:  Are you high? Or is complaining what you do when you are done decorating your house and don't feel like actually playing the game?  Both cities have a heritage that starts within their walls.  Yes, Qeynos doesn't require an access quest to get into their "Fallen Gate", but as the game progresses they will need to do the Freeport fallen gate access quest in order to even think about getting their prismatic weapons.  Freeport has an edge because we already did the access and won't have to waist our time doing an access quest that gets us no xp.  There is no real advantage to being from one city or the other. <SPAN> </SPAN></P> <P> </P> <P>Stop whining about what others have that you don’t and go out and have fun, that’s what the game is for afterall.</P> <P> </P> <P>Grayza</P> <P>Message Edited by wild_heidi on <SPAN class=date_text>04-30-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>05:34 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>How about we back tax the qeynos people then for the room upgrades and tell them to 'suck it up' and 'it was a bug, now your free rides over' when they are brought in line with everyone in freeports cost for upgrades. That issue right there has been complained about and /bugged /feedbacked by numerous people even BEFORE this supposed wrong pricing of the house was posted. If they are going to fiddle with something on the houses this needs to be fixed at the same time. All the people who are being forced to move out and want to upgrade from plywood walls they are going to be paying bugged prices for upgrades again.<BR><BR>And your selective real life economic references were sorta cute. In some places by law you can not raise prices of the house after the fact unless it's agreed upon by the housing athorities who either say yes or no. So its debatable as to what real life economics you can apply this too.<BR><BR>I wish some of the dev's responsible for furnature would grow a set and give an 'or else' ultimatum to whoevers bright idea it was to change this. But i guess Owlchick and the rest of the dev responsible for quest don't need to fix any more of those bugged out quests now. Even if you want to do them you can't put the book rewards or whatever any place. Not like 12 people banding together to pay for a 3 room house can even fit their rewards in it for very long. Good going. Solved the complaints over broken furnature rewards in one stroke. Though i'm sure carpenters are absolutely thrilled that they wont be asked to make random pieces of furnature now due to people not wanting to waste their room cap space on player made things. Lets see. Quest reward you can't get again. Or player made item you can get made any time if bored. Gee. This is a hard choice to make. Idiots.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR></SPAN>[Removed for Content] i have to laugh at this.</P> <P>OK i'll take a back tax hit on my interior. Wall / ceiling/ trim / floor that's about 40 gp per room x 2 that's 80 gold or so total give or take.</P> <P>YOU can take a back tax hit for your purchase and upkeep fees.</P> <P>Are you prepared to pony up 6 plat for the purchase and 61 gold for every week you've been at that location?</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>You guys are crying that Qeynos 3 BR is gonna be sooo much better now.</P> <P> </P> <P>You have the house locked in, they're even allowing you a month rent at 6 gold per week.</P> <P>They're not forcing you to pay the 6 plat you SHOULD have spent or the 56 gold more a week upkeep you SHOULD have paid.</P> <P>Even with the interior fully done up that house comes out WAY CHEAPER than the ones in Qeynos.</P> <P> </P> <P>Also nobody is going to have a 5 Bedroom house for a LONG time it also costs 4 million status and you must have a level 30 guild to unlock it.</P>

[Ningirsu]

<P>aside from the few qeynos players that have actually spoken up in support of the sout freeport plight...most qeynos kiddies can just whine their why into removing a benefit freeport has over them...*gasp* heaven forbid we get something you do not.</P> <P> </P> <P>clearly qeynos is sucking from the proverbial teet of SOE, and SOE loves them for it.</P> <P><BR>-Nin</P><p>Message Edited by Ningirsu on <span class=date_text>05-02-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:49 AM</span>

[BostonSail]

<P>Wall / ceiling/ trim / floor that's about 40 gp per room x 2 that's 80 gold or so total give or take.</P> <P></P> <HR> <P>It's more like 2pp per room if you want to see your options:</P> <P>the 10g wall, trim, floor - 30g to buy, 3g to set</P> <P>the 20g wall, trim, floor - 60g to buy, 6g to set</P> <P>the 30g wall, trim, floor - 90g to buy, 9g to set</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[vTenebr]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Ningirsu wrote:<div></div> <p>aside from the few qeynos players that have actually spoken up in support of the sout freeport plight...most qeynos kiddies can just whine their why into removing a benefit freeport has over them...*gasp* heaven forbid we get something you do not.</p><span><blockquote><hr></blockquote> Actually, if you look carefully.. it's usually the same Qeynos person 90% of the time.  Please take note that whenever the OTHER glaring disparities between the cities (all favoring Qeynos) are pointed out, said person is (not surprisingly) totally mute.</span> </blockquote></span><div></div><p>Message Edited by vTenebrae on <span class=date_text>05-02-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:17 AM</span>

[CherobylJ]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sorvani wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>While i agree 100% with Moorgard's response to the previous posts, i would like to point out that i've had the <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=tips&message.id=890" target=_blank>Consolidated Housing Guide</A> posted on these boards since Dec 31, 2004. And that price has been listed on there with it's messed up cost ever since. I know i've personally sent in a /bug about it and it was discussed in numerous threads on this board. The sheer amount of time it has taken to get this changed astounds me.<BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Back on 7 Feb you said "i won't argue the price is <STRONG>likely</STRONG> messed up on 7 Freedom Road. but it is also the farthest house form pretty much anywhere. "  Seemed at the time you werent too worked up about this bug (at least it didnt sound like a barn burner :smileyvery-happy:/ )...that is from the linked the thread you mentioned<BR> <p>Message Edited by CherobylJoe on <span class=date_text>05-02-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:52 PM</span>

[CherobylJ]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> wild_heidi wrote:<BR> <SPAN><BR></SPAN> <P>I think most people on this thread need to learn how to read before posting.  Please highlight where exactly Moorgard called ANYONE a cheat, a thief or any other insult? </P> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>"Those of you that took advantage of our error"</P> <P>Thats a gentlemanly way of saying cheating man.</P> <P>1. It wasnt documented clearly this was an error (which I have spent most of my responses to this thread illustrating)</P> <P>2. Many people who did buy this house didnt buy the house to "take advantage", they just wanted a house.</P> <P>3. There are a number of folks who will be hurt by this change who dont have a devious bone in their bodies</P> <P>Many people seem to have taken a measure of offense to him saying taht they were taking advantage of something they saw as business as usual.  Kinda akin to someone missing the fine print and then having an "Aha" finger pointed at them. </P> <P>I'm not saying Moorguard is wrong (there is a hella price difference) but its hardly that clear cut and that wording just plain stunk.</P> <P>Instead I woulda liked to hear something like this from SOE </P> <P>"hey we realize we are 5 months into production of EQ2 but we just found out that something basic like housing prices slipped by us (namely the SFP 6gp room).  We apologize to our customers for such a large functional blunder slipping through (given it as been linked on this board since early Dec), its inexcusible and we never intended for a 3 bedroom to be this cheap but unfortunately we HAVE to fix this to have on-going integrity in the game. </P> <P>As a measure of goodwill we are allowing you to pre-pay rent at that price untilm the fix is made, this shoudl allow existing homeowners some measure of respite".</P> <P>See same outcome, proper message?  Shared responsibility for the issue (players/SOE).</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Roaan]

<P>Devs, take this advice !</P> <P>If you want this game healty for long time, stop fouling around with ppl. Bring down the prices of the houses to something affordable and consider the location of the house in your price. Youll always be able to raise the prices as the game gets older (normal raises) and bring new type of houses in future expansion if prices doesnt fit the economie anymore. I love this game but damm stop screwing it up, i hate to see ppl leaving for other MMO w/o naming them.  Dont wait these other MMO to bring housing (already planned) and make another reason for your players to leave.</P> <DIV>Dont get me wrong, not all changes are bad, but try to make more positive one in your players perspective.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Roaan on <span class=date_text>05-02-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:18 AM</span>

[Ascillian]

<DIV>I dont think that things like housing prices should be increased even in the future...it would be one thing to alow people to 'buy' add-on's to their existing houses (if you had a house in freeport and you wished to add windows, you could do so for 60gp a window or if you were in qeynos and wanted higher ceilings you could pay to raise them) but charging people more for what they already have is removing their choice in the matter.  I chose to buy a bigger room twice now.  I shopped around to find the best deal (when I bought my 3br I didnt know there wasnt one in Qeynos for the same price...in fact I only knew about the one I got because a guildmate was in the same room and I was visiting her to see her room set up)  I thought about how much I was paying in rent and wether or not I wanted to go with pure money or money and status (picked pure money in the 2br even though I could have made the status cost nill for the simple fact that i liked the layout better and was willing to pay more for a floor plan i liked).  When I moved into my 2br I though I'd never move again...but many quests later, I found myself crowded and wanting more room so my stuff didnt look jumbled and I went looking for a place to move to.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dont want my rent changed, but I can understand how if it was unintended it needs to be adressed....i think a much better solution would be to readress the housing prices of ALL the houses to be something more in tune with the means of the player base.  Housing doesnt give you any in game benifits, it just allows people to have something of their own in game for others to see, something they can spend time working on and make the way they like it.  I love decorating and picking out furnature that I like to make my room fit my desires.  I agree that bigger rooms should cost more, but the cost right now I think for the 3br and 5br houses is prohibitive.  There are many locations for these rooms, and they are empty.  I would love to be able to aford a 5br and fix it up.  Housing and room items is something I will spend money on, and have spent more money on my house than I ever have on my gear or anything else because it brings me enjoyment to do so.  As it stands now (at lvl 50 playing some serious hours) if the price of my inn room changes I will be forced to move out and get rid of items to fit back into a 2br.</DIV>

[ScatteringCats]

<DIV><EM>it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV>There are a lot of things in this game that seem very <EM>clear</EM>.  Doesnt mean that anyone is doing or is gonna do somethin bout it.  It was pointed out many times by several people that this housing instance was a bargain, but were told its perfectly fine.  So in actuallity, it was very, very, very far from clear.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><EM>very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV>How many times does something need to be brought to your attention before it is addressed.  Think the community in general can attest to this.  It was reported on many occasions to you.  Just because you all decided to do nothing about it doesnt give you the right to <EM><STRONG>digress.</STRONG></EM></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Those who took advantage of our error</EM> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>First off, stop making an <STRONG>[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]</STRONG> out of <STRONG>u</STRONG> and <STRONG>me.  </STRONG>We did our research, and it was very clear based on responses by SOE that this house was kosher as is.  Therefore we were not taking advantage of anything.  If anything you are now taking advantage of us by raising our rent.  Both parties signed the lease already.  Tough sheet.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><EM>But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</EM></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Based on the responses givin to people that were making sure that this was indeed the correct price, the were inteded to have it.  I understand that it is going to be changed...fine...so be it....but you owe everyone who is already there somethin besides <EM>"They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer"</EM></DIV> <DIV>Many people have invested a lot of money/time into these homes.  You better [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] well come up with somethin better than that for yet another blatant SOE lie.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Vaxis Shadowmoon</DIV> <DIV>38 ShadowKnight</DIV> <DIV>Nektulos</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Kwoung]

I don't get why anyone would want to live in any part of Freeport except East Freeport anyways. Bells, brokers, etc... location, location, location!

[vTenebr]

<span><blockquote><hr>Kwoung wrote:I don't get why anyone would want to live in any part of Freeport except East Freeport anyways. Bells, brokers, etc... location, location, location! <div></div><hr></blockquote>There are Freeport citizens, on my server who own homes in Qeynos because they just LOOK better.  Even with an Call THAT inconvenient they'd rather be in Qeynos.. that speaks volumes.</span><div></div>

[Phlesheal]

<HR> <DIV>In regards to the crybabies that complain that Qeynos has it easier than Freeport:  Are you high? Or is complaining what you do when you are done decorating your house and don't feel like actually playing the game</DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I played Eq1 for 6 years and if i see the Same old Crap out of eq2 that eq1 has been through, and the only injoy i get out of this game right now is decorating my house then so be it. Just cuz others like my self dont play hard core like others, dont mean others like my self for the moment want to Decorate their homes... ect.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[bugbig]

<DIV> <P>Shelani wrote</P> <P><FONT size=4>I’m not so much upset about the money put into it but the time and the community I’m going to lose when SOE takes this all away.</FONT></P> <P>Exactly!</P> <P>Shelani Further writes:</P> <P><FONT size=4>Devs, why don’t you lower the housing costs? As so many have pointed out, they’re completely unreasonable, since none of us can afford them as they stand. The houses are there; why not let us use them? They take money from the economy. They support crafters. They help with player retention. (I know my house has definitely kept me interested.) Why else did you design them?</FONT></P> <P><FONT size=4>What you’re doing just makes no sense. Please let me keep my house. Give the Qeynosians houses. What good is a ghost town?</FONT></P> <P>Fantastic post and I agree with the solution.  Make houses accessible and affordable to both Freeport and Queynos!  To me its a key component of the "end game" and keeps many of us 50s interested.  Why the heck would you not want to do this?</P> <P>Yours in Service, </P> <P> </P> <P> </P></DIV>

[Grey Gho]

<DIV>I own a house in South Freeport as well. Prior to moving in I did a lot of research on the price of the house in question. I had a feeling that this day would come and I would be subject to a higher price. So be it. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>However, Moorgaurds tone in his post was moronic to say the least. This house has been BUGGED by several players including myself. I found it around the first month of play. At the time there was one person on my server living there. When I decided to move in some 5 months later I decided to /petition to make sure that this price was indeed as intended. I did this because I had asked many other players that had moved in there and they had done the same thing. We all had the SAME RESPONSE. The price of THAT SPECIFIC APARTMENT is correct. This came from SoE themselves. If they were wrong for telling us this then someone needs to be fired for an inability to communicate. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I like many others felt it was done in this manner as a simple perk to the Freeport folks that do not have the same playing field as the folks from Q. I chose Freeport of my own free will and I will continue to deal with the advantages they have over us. No big deal. I still have fun. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The thing that upsets me is that I moved to this 3 bedroom simply so I could display ALL MY STUFF. Hell, if I go back to a 2 bedroom the ONLY thing in my room will be book quests and legend and lore items for the most part. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I implore SOE and moorguard to come off their high horse and lower the prices of the three bedroom houses drastically. They should cost no more than 10 gold due to location, which sucks rocks by the way. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As to us as players taking advantage? Where are you Moorguard at the 100's and I mean HUNDREDS of reports I've filed on craft botters, presisitent farmers and 100's of other BUGS and exploits I've reported? I even reported a person that sold an account , provided you with a website that showed the transaction and where the person used the characters name and server. At the time the person was high level in both adventuring and crafting and was a specific race and job class. NOTHING AND I MEAN NOTHING WAS DONE in spite of it being a direct violation of EULA policy. These same people are still on my server, these same bugs are still there, and it appears you folks have more time to fix a simple pricing issue then you do addressing a lot more severe issues within the game. My god the pathing of mobs in tight areas locking up a group in combat after they have clipped through a wall is STILL AN ISSUE!!!!!! Instead of FIXING the foundation of a great game that has SEVERAL CRACKS in it you continue to pile more CRAP on top of it in the way of an expansion and the dumbing down of so many zones. Geez.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It would seem that prior to fixing this apartment pricing issue you would have addressed the issue with the major imbalance of costs to upgrading apartments in Q vs. Freeport. There is a heck of a lot more money that could be sunk OUT of the game economy with those upgrades then the few people that actually own one of the 3 bedrooms.  There are currently about 8 folks on Oasis that have the apratment.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Many people on my server have seen the work I've put into my place. I take pride in it. Even though in reality, due to it's silly location, the apartment has indeed cost me sells I'm sure of it. There is simply no other place that has the room for my stuff.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In closing I would suggest that SoE get their heads out of the mud and look at the real issue before making this change. Housing costs are way to high for what you get. I almost feel that they are having HUGE database issues and the more peep's that move into these apartments creates more problems for the DB admins. Otherwise I simply can not fathom why in the world a 3 bedroom apartment in South Freeport would cost so much. When most of us are simply using it to display the items from quests we've done and to have a bit better looking place. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Please fix the prices on these apartments, do not implement this change.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Best regards,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>    Grey Ghost</DIV> <DIV>    Oasis - The Ka Tet</DIV> <DIV>    </DIV>

[WuphonsReach]

Bottom line, you folks took advantage of a price disparity. Not only that, but it was extremely obvious that someone left off a decimal point which resulted in this price disparity. (The other houses are almost exactly 10x more expensive.)Now the bill comes due and you get to pay the piper.You should be glad that the landlord (SOE) doesn't lock you out of your inn room until you pay back all of the gold/plat that you really owe for staying in a 3-room house for months at the reduced rate.

[ScatteringCats]

<DIV><EM>Bottom line, you folks took advantage of a price disparity</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV>Wrong.  Bottom line we were lied to.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Not only that, but it was extremely obvious that someone left off a decimal point which resulted in this price disparity.</EM> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Duh....it was obvious.  That has been stated over and over.  May people bugged and petitioned to know if this was correct and were told it was fine as is.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Read the whole thread and the arguments presented before jumpin on yer high horse</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Vaxis Shadowmoon</DIV> <DIV>38 ShadowKnight</DIV> <DIV>Nektulos</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by ScatteringCats on <span class=date_text>05-03-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:26 PM</span>

[Zarevil]

<span><blockquote><hr>WuphonsReach wrote:Bottom line, you folks took advantage of a price disparity. Not only that, but it was extremely obvious that someone left off a decimal point which resulted in this price disparity. (The other houses are almost exactly 10x more expensive.)Now the bill comes due and you get to pay the piper.You should be glad that the landlord (SOE) doesn't lock you out of your inn room until you pay back all of the gold/plat that you really owe for staying in a 3-room house for months at the reduced rate.<hr></blockquote> You my friend are full of beans.   This was not a hidden *feature*, this pricing was even included in the housing price guides on the forums here.  It has been discussed, GMS have said it was OK, etc.  I am revolted by the charges that folks somehow were dishonest in choosing this home due to its pricing.  It was not a good location, but the price made it worthwhile.   I live in Qeynos and had no issues with *one* address being affordable in Freeport for folks to be able to move up to a three bedroom place.  I know I cannot afford more than a two room for some time to come, but I think it was still a fair deal for the folks living in Freeport. I think this could have been handled much better by SoE and frankly I think an apology is in order for even *hinting* that the players living in the house in question were cheating or dishonest. Regards, Qeynos Citizen Against Higher Housing Prices </span><div></div>

[Mezrin_Kort]

<P>Frankly, I find it disgusting that the statement was made above that people were cheating by having these lower price houses.  That is short sited, and just plain wrong considering this issue was pointed out on YOUR OWN FORUMS.   This was in addition to people petitioning to make sure the prices were right.  </P> <P>I'm sorry guys you messed up here and need to apologize to the people who have been insulted, by an obvious SOE error.  Alienating your player base through bugs and nerfs is one thing, but doing so through false accusations, patronizing and belittling will only lose you $, and that's what it's all about right?</P> <P> </P> <P>Sincerely,</P> <P>Mr. In search of the elusive one star reward.</P>

[vTenebr]

<span><blockquote><hr>WuphonsReach wrote:Bottom line, you folks took advantage of a price disparity. Not only that, but it was extremely obvious that someone left off a decimal point which resulted in this price disparity. (The other houses are almost exactly 10x more expensive.)Now the bill comes due and you get to pay the piper.You should be glad that the landlord (SOE) doesn't lock you out of your inn room until you pay back all of the gold/plat that you really owe for staying in a 3-room house for months at the reduced rate.<hr></blockquote>Yeah because being informed by several seperate GMs, having this posted on the forums, and specifically asking if this was right... and being told "Yes, this is correct".. We just bloody well *knew* it was a bug. I'm not an idiot, thank you.  If I felt it were a bug and had been informed of such by the *2* GMs I asked that it was a bug, I wouldn't have moved.  At the time I moved in, I didn't even know Qeynos didn't have a room of the same price.  I thought the price was as it was because of the terrible location.  It seemed logical to me.  When I'd heard whispers it was a bug.. I *ASKED* about it.. and was informed "No, everything is as it should be" TWICE. People really aren't reading around here and would rather ASSUME most people are dishonest than believe that.. *gasp* maybe SoE might be wrong on this one? I mean.. I know they have an impeccable track record of perfection and infallibility.. but MAYBE just once they may have been wrong? Whoa.  What an idea.</span><div></div>

[Phlesheal]

Well i dont know if any one has thought about how  much more gold was worth, well 4 months ago. i got my Home about that time and 61 gold was a hell of alot to dish out for me back then and i sure was not thinking i was taking (SoE) for a ride when i got my 3 room home. And 6 gold upkeep  was alot of cash for a lvl 36 inquisitor that just exp and Loot for cash to make dew.

[Ningirsu]

hmm..ya know, this is a pretty hot topic..not huge, but 4 pages of responses isnt exactly a dead topic...and ive seen no response from devs...probably hoping it will just quietly go away<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />-Ningirsu

[WuphonsReach]

Oh, I've read the responses in this thread. Most of it's not worth the storage space.This is not different then anything else in EQ2. It was a bug. It was bound to be fixed. Just because GMs said it was "working" is in no way a contract that says a bug won't be fixed down the road. If this were so, paladins and SKs would still be riding their speedy level 20 mounts.GMs are only able to help within the current ruleset. If the price says X, all they can do is confirm that the price does indeed say X. I would lay even money that they're not allowed to speculate as to whether something may or may not be a bug (for reference, observe the numerous other cases where GMs seem unaware of bugs in the game). That's a customer service issue and is seperate from the issue at hand.You knowingly (or unknowningly) were using a bugged price when you purchased this 3-room house in East Freeport. The more observent folks realized it was a bug, yet went ahead and chose to purchase it anyway. You took a chance that they wouldn't fix the issue and bet that they wouldn't raise the rent after-the-fact. A lot of you hoped that you'd win out, either by SOE ignoring the bug (as it seemed they were doing) or that by whining and crying and kicking and screaming SOE would leave your little loophole alone.<b>SOE has now decided to fix the bug.</b> That they chose to make the cost in line with other houses in the area is *their* decision (and within their rights to decide). They are allowing you to stay in the house without ponying up the additional plat that it would've original cost to purchase the home. Plus, you get 4 weeks of advance rent at the old bugged price.You have every right to complain that a fix is not to your liking. You do not have the right to personally attack other people who do not hold the same opinion as you do. Or to attack the developers/moderators on a personal basis because you don't like the news that they're relaying to you. In fact, the more I read of this thread, the less sympathy I have for anyone who is affected. You're biting the hand that carries player feedback to the developers. Which means that it's probably now less likely that those 3-BR house prices will ever be lowered.After all, why bend over backwards for people who read evil into everything that you post?

[vTenebr]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><span><blockquote><hr>WuphonsReach wrote:Oh, I've read the responses in this thread. Most of it's not worth the storage space.This is not different then anything else in EQ2. It was a bug. It was bound to be fixed. Just because GMs said it was "working" is in no way a contract that says a bug won't be fixed down the road. If this were so, paladins and SKs would still be riding their speedy level 20 mounts.....After all, why bend over backwards for people who read evil into everything that you post?<hr></blockquote></span>When insulted and berated, people will tend to respond defensively.  There's no need to get righteously indignant after being rude to people. I don't take umbrage to it being "fixed" as it were.  I take umbrage to being treated as though I was exploiting, intentionally.  I take umbrage to being treated as though I was deliberately cheating.  I am well aware that a GM may be clueless, but if I ask a question am informed everything is "Ok" why am I to then assume that it's really not OK and that if I believe the GM I'm a cheater. THAT is why I'm irritated.  The price change is an annoyance.  The snotty attitudes are repugnant. I'm intimately acquainted with the SK horse issue.. (which, by the way I supported.. and I am an SK).  There's 1 difference you're forgetting.  Moorgard <i><b>did state it was a bug</b></i>, early on.  They simply said they weren't going to fix it "at this time".  He, in no way, implied that the SK who were enjoying said bug were cheats.  They said it was a bug when the issue came up. In THIS case, in 6 months, NO ONE acknowledged it as a bug.  We were ALWAYS informed everything was "working as intended".  No one was <i><b>ever </b></i>told that, yes.. this was a bug.  People have petitioned, people have put in feedback.  The price was stickied, homes looked at BY devs, and everything was deemed kosher. I swallowed the horse change, because I knew it was a bug and should be corrected.  This is a bit harder to swallow because, it wasn't that it was ignored or glossed over, people were flat out told it <i><b>wasn't a bug. </b></i>I can guarantee that if, tomorrow, you were told that Harm Touch was bugged, now required a component and would, henceforth, only do 1/2 the damage it does now.. and ON TOP OF THAT were told that "You knew that high damage was a bug, or should have known because it doesn't scale with damage the rest of your spells do and you people took advantage of that bug by killing things that maybe you really shouldn't have.. but hey, we know people won't report beneficial bugs" ..you'd be pretty offended as well. <p><span class="date_text"></span><span class="time_text"> </span></p><p>Message Edited by vTenebrae on <span class=date_text>05-04-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:51 AM</span>

[Bleusong]

<div></div>sigh..i really had a good time making a home and have lotsa fond memories at our 3 room house..going to miss it alot.. personally..aside from moorgard's ridiculous statement..feel changes might have had to do with folks that couldn't be happy for others and pestered devs about it.. most pathetic change i've seen yet<img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.. btw<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> tenebres is awesome, lotsa <3 for ratonga sk<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div><p>Message Edited by Bleusong on <span class=date_text>05-03-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:55 PM</span>

[Grey Gho]

<DIV>Even though the GM's didn't have  a clue, which in my opinion is still not an excuse, the price change needs to happen to make it fair to the folks over in Q. The devs should of taken the time to fix all the other unbalanced issues between Q and Freeport at the same time, but, are simply to stupid to do so. They would rather [Removed for Content] a group of folks off and worry about the rest later if ever.  I digress. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> If any of you want to debate me on this we can start another thread. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The real issue at hand now is the pricing on 3 bedrooms. I do not know about the 3 room apartment's over in Q, but , all the one's in Freeport suck in relation to location of everything. I'd suggest lowering the cost of all three bedrooms to 10 gold and be done with it. Anything more than that and they simply are not worth it. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hell most the towns in freeport are empty and devoid of any player activity at all. The rooms in South Freeport cost merchants business big time. No one ever comes there to buy because the do not realize you can waypoint to the room and it's out of the way. That being said the only reason to have the room is to have more space for your housing items. 3 bedroom = 64 gold a week, 300 item space, and bad location. 2 bedroom = 64 silver a week, 200 item space and at least for me West Freeport was a lot better location and convienient. These 3 bedrooms are not worth 64 gold to anyone on the server. I'd say the are worth 10 gold a week at most. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'd suggest that it's time that the housing be looked at again in relation to all the quest items that can be placed in a home, as well as space, location and ease of use.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Best regards,</DIV> <DIV>   </DIV> <DIV>    Grey Ghost</DIV> <DIV>    Oasis - The Ka Tet</DIV>

[Birkenstocky]

<DIV>Well its going to be obvious I don't post much .. typically any feelings or concerns I have are handled by the community, however this upcoming change is one I do feel strongly about.  I know it affects a relatively small number of persons per server, but typically throughout my career or EQ1 and EQ2 I have seen SOE try to make some sort of concession or compromise on potententially huge changes, and I don't hear their voice now which is disconcerting.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Yes, while the number affected is small the change is huge for those persons.  I know that me and a guildie spent about 8 hours just doing a floor in one of these houses then yet another set of about 40 hours shopping, decorating and trying to build a 'home'.  I myself spent about 10 hours making numerous sconces to spell out the guild name in the 'disco/bar' meeting room we designed and it breaks my heart to think I am gonna have to move.  This may sound like whining but heck moving from a 2 room to a 3 room took about 4 hours just to dump the stuff on the floor, now there is more stuff and no easy way to transfer items from one house to the other.  ( a bit too much irl .. lol )</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We have a collect contents button (which is buggy at times), why not a transfer contents button?  That would benefit alot of players, make the incentive to dump more coin into the housing money sink, and alleviate some of the woe this change is going to cause.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Okay so that is a suggestion to help, but not the whole ball of wax as far as I am concerned.  What really 'bugs' me is this.  Yeah when I first moved in I thought well the price has to be wrong but [Removed for Content], let me rub noses with the rich and famous for a bit.  Then after time and comments it seemed this was a boon since no bank, bell etc in this district.  Great, I kept questing and decorating etc.  The fact of the matter is SOE created a great money sink, tradeskill support system in housing, but the costs for the purchaser are prohibitive.  This was the only reasonably priced 3 bedroom house. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wait a minute its not a 3 bedroom ...Actually it is 1 bedroom, 1 Grand Room and a upstairs porch with no ceiling.  Not one window in the whole joint, and they now think its worth 61 gold a week?  Last I checked a room meant it had a ceiling .. there aint no ceiling in the '3rd room'  Please its an divided efficiency.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Evilshade]

I must also Complain due to the fact that if this pricing was wrong in the begining they had plenty of ample time to change it.  My problem is they did not.  So I had purchased a house here and now have over 247 items in this house.  I cannot afford these new implimented prices and will not have room for all these items.  My idea shoulda been fixed before anyone knew and now that it has people in there prices should not change due to the fact is not fair to those who had purchased the house at the said price.  I know for a fact I wouldn't have bought on if it was 3 plat and 80+ gold upkeep a week not worth it for any house bottom line.

[Bleusong]

there was nothing wrong with pricing in the first place. <div></div>

[Mezrin_Kort]

<DIV>*waits for response from SOE*</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*hears only crickets*</DIV>

[Wasuna]

I have not seen a response by Moorguard on the GM's saying the price was correct. People went to the trouble of petitioning and checking that the price was correct and the SOE employee offical response was that it was correct. Now what?

[Grey Gho]

<P>They are not allowed to admit it. So you will not see it... and like so many hundreds and hundreds of other posts on these forums Moorguard will only snipe an answer out there and then fades away. He will not allow himself as a rep for SoE to be dragged into a good discussion. I do think they go back and read them... but he will not debate with us lowly subscribers. We are beneath all that. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <P>I hope that they take the time to look at housing costs and fix them. ASAP. If not then we as Freeport players need to start bugging every single day the unbalance between Freeport and Q. Continue to bug and feedback those issues until they are fixed. At least that way the playign field will be a little more even.</P> <P> </P> <P>The three bedroom houses should cost no more than 10 gold. The location is pitiful. The only reason to own it is for extra space to place your things. </P> <P> </P> <P>Best regards,</P> <P>   Grey Ghost</P> <P>    Oasis - The Ka Tet</P>

[AnimeBabe]

<P>The price jump from buying a 2roomer for 6g to a 3 roomer for 61g was fine because the rent reflected that jump in price and the 64s that was rent and 6g that was for rent respectively. With this 6p and 64g [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] it's too big of a jump NO ONE will live there unless they are in their high 40's, and 50's the casual player cannot afford this.</P> <P> </P> <P>IMHO they should have lowered the cost of the Qeynos houses.</P> <P> </P> <P>If you want to live in a 3 roomer you shouldn't have to take on roomates to keep the rent, it's ridiculous. Not to mention that those people who lived there now have to move 300 items out. I doubt there will be many living in that area now, as well as some guild houses no longer being available as well.</P> <P> </P> <P>Yeah.. thanks.... :smileymad:</P>

[Reevanthara]

<P>On Antonia Bayle there are a LOT of people using this room.  The Freeport RP community is very tight knit.  We all know each other.  I cannot count the number of chance meetings I have had with other guild leaders, rivals, allies and enemies because we all use this room.  A lot of great RP came about because of it.</P> <P>Ironically this room was a mark of status because it was expensive.  We bought ours way back in December and have spent the intervening months upgrading the place.  We have had countless RP events, parties, war councils, council meetings and membership ceremonies there.</P> <P>The fact that they are raising the rent 10 fold saddens me.  None of us knew this was a bug.  Why would we have scraped together this kind of coin if we knew that it was?  Because if  we did know it was a bug, then we'd also have known it was going to be fixed.  We simply did not know.</P> <P>This saddens a lot of us on Antonia Bayle, because the people who used these houses were roleplayers.  We were people who enjoyed nights of pure RP in our guild halls uninterupted by constant spam and ooc chatter.  One of the benefits that people have yet to mention about the three bedrooms was lag.  I don't know why but if you try to stuff 50 people in a 2 bedroom you'll crash the zone or at least lag it out.  Spread them out in a three bedroom and you don't have an issue.  THAT was the primary reason we chose the three bedroom.</P> <P>This is not game breaking for us in Whispers of the Damned, but it is saddening.  The RP community will suffer a blow from it.  Really, I have to ask why.  The people who buy and spend countless hours furnishing these places are not the same ones out there farming for endless hours to make obscene amounts of plat.  And even if we divide the cost of the three bedroom between our entire guild its not a financial burden we can afford to pay.</P> <P>The guilds that are large enough to do so have so many members that a three bedroom is useless.  Why get one when you have 100+ members and can't even use the place because it will crash?</P> <P>If they need to correct the bug so be it.  But for the love of god please don't insinuate that we were abusing a bug intentionally.  Further, consider this.  Your housing prices are [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot].  On Antonia Bayle after SEVEN MONTHS one guild is 26th level and one is 25th.  Both guilds raid regularly and neither will be able to support a five bedroom guild hall when they reach 30.  Even if they could, why should they?</P> <P>Housing provides no real benefit.  There is no functional difference between the 5 silver room in the starting zones and the 5 bedroom multiplat upkeep places.  The only possible advantage is location, and the best room in Freeport is East Freeport for less than a gold a week.  From there you have the broker, the fence and the bell plus most of the good shops in town.</P> <P>Contrast that to South Freeport.  7 Freedom Lane is in the middle of nowhere with nothing you can use in the zone.  It offers no tangible benefits.  So raise the cost if you need to, but no one is going to use that housing.  Why would they?  Money is hard to come by, and it just isn't worth doing.</P> <P>So congratulations SOE.  You end up with a feature of your game that is virtually unused because you have no grasp of the economy of your servers.  Seven months live...if people were going to buy these overpriced rooms they already would have.</P> <P>I know several people who are quitting over this.  Some are going to WoW because they felt the only advantage that EQ had was in housing, and that with the insane cost of 3-5 bedrooms they know they will never get one.  For others this was simply the last straw.</P> <P>SOE please remember.  This does not impact the high end raider.  This impacts the small family guilds and the roleplayers.  This is the last straw for many of them (though I am not leaving), and that saddens me.  I have to watch good friends leave a game because frankly they feel you are catering to the rich raiders just like you did in EQ1.  Are they wrong?  Not from what I can see...</P>

[Ashlian]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Reevanthara wrote:<BR> <P>SOE please remember.  This does not impact the high end raider.  This impacts the small family guilds and the roleplayers.  This is the last straw for many of them (though I am not leaving), and that saddens me.  I have to watch good friends leave a game because frankly they feel you are catering to the rich raiders just like you did in EQ1.  Are they wrong?  Not from what I can see...</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Truer words were never spoken. Fortunately, I'm in a small guild, and we'll fit into the two bedroom I just purchased in NQ (since the options for the two bedroom in SQ are exactly the same.....and the point of spending more would therefore be?) But like Reevanthara, most of my enjoyment in EQ 2 comes from furniture decoration. I've dropped at least 5pp on my own QH apt, the new "Guild Hall" in NQ, and friend's apartments. I don't purchase much armor or gear, I decorate! Since there's no benefit to housing other than to the community that enjoys this, what can it possibly hurt to allow more people to purchase larger homes. We'll still be a minority on most server populations. My heart truly goes out to those of you on Antonia Bayle, I've avidly read a lot of post by your excellent carpenters and designers.</P> <P>Please make this enjoyable part of the game something the average player can afford and aspire to, rather than something for only the richest.</P> <P>Ashlian Liadan, 31 Fury, 32 Tailor, Mistmoore<BR></P>

[Grey Gho]

<DIV>Well I applaud SoE for at least squeezing in the fix the Quyenos's upgrade changes to their rooms. However, they still have not addresed the root problem. That is the 3 bedroom houses cost to much. They need to cost a lot less so we can fit all our junk in there and make it look presentable. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Instead of addresing the housing cost, they nerfed the people over in Q's upgrade options to their homes. Please revamp the cost of housing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Best regards,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Grey Ghost</DIV> <DIV>Oasis - The Ka Tet</DIV>

[Morgan]

<DIV>Well I'm glad they made this change. Now I can save 14.99 a month. No sense in playing a game where you can loose all your hard earned item's just because SoE decides to just up and make Assinine change's. Should have know from 4 year's in EQ1 that these developers have no common sense. what was I thinking. I really think you guys come in every morning and say to each other, hmmm What can we do today to [Removed for Content] everyone off today. Should'nt really even have to discuss it  you guy's are pro's at it. Enjoy your life of patches and stupid daily changes everyone, I'm going to Guild War's.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Morganja  former 47 Necro Unrest server</DIV>

[Kokus]

Today there was a player on the traders channel asking how the hell his rent jumped to 61gp. Apparently noone informed him of the upcoming changes, and like most, he just skimmed over the patch notes. Pretty upsetting when you are locked out of your house and unable to pay your rent because the landlord decided to raise your rent by 10 without giving everyone IN GAME a notice that this was happening. If it was me.. I'd be disgusted and would probably consider leaving the game. With so much in your house, especially a 3 bedroom house, and offline selling with full house vaults, unable to access that all of a sudden is just a huge blow.

[Whissper]

<DIV>I am one of the evicted residents of 7 Freedom Road.. I am Not a Cheater.. Naive perhaps to think that a back alley house could possibly be affordable. but definitely not a cheater. I have spent my money to buy, make changes to floor/walls. and have now paid the 61g upkeep without realizing it till it was done. I purchased EQ2 because of carpentry and housing.. silly yes but those things stood out to me after playing EQ1 3 years or better, making several high lvl craftsppl. It has become quite obvious to me that many many players still own their starter apartments, only displaying the house items that have been won from quests. books sitting on the floor, and thier statue of Lucan or Antonia sitting proud and lonely on the starter table. so making housing that ppl who care can afford would certainly not make everyone or even the majority move. In fact ther is very little benefit to owning a larger apt or house. So why should  3rm and 5rm houses be so unattainable and so unworthwhile. Let those of us who enjoy questing for books, trophys and other household items display them, I will now need to move back down to a 2 rm apt, remove status cost reducing furniture in order to display my non status books and trophys etc. Also being a carpenter i look forward to displaying my "creations" and creativity each lvl as new recipes become available. Now what i want is my investment back, along with all of those who were affected. Also an Apology for the insult in the form of an in game email .. again for all the affected residents and ex residents of 7 Freedom (I can dream cant I?, or has the cost of that gone up too?) If my post does not seem complete or consice i apologize .. I was in a rush to finish it so that i dont time out again and lose the post. </DIV>

[Roger1111]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Haliken wrote:<BR> <DIV>Unless there are plans to alter the change in payment plans on the currently existing house owners there, I think that people should be given, for instance, a week or two's notice (for after the patch is through) to move out if they cannot pay the new cost, but allow them to keep the house rented out while they temporarily simultaneously purchase a second house to move their belongings into without need of hiring 10 people just to help them move. <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Since every other house of the same type in the area was a higher price, it should have been clear we'd catch it sooner or later. Of course, very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game, but I digress.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Those who took advantage of our error have been able to enjoy reduced rent for a while now. That's fine. If they want to keep their house, they just have to pay the actual rent going forward. They can even pay the maximum amount of rent they can repay if they want, effectively keeping the cheaper price for longer. But we aren't going to put off the change just to accomodate those who were reaping a benefit they weren't intended to have.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I must say that I am astounded at the tone Moorgard has chosen to use in his response to this issue.  While most have noticed the condescending and accusatory attitude present in the post, others have either overlooked it, or feel it is appropriate to the situation.  I would venture to suppose that this response is perhaps the most offensive and infuriating aspect of the change.</P> <P>Was it necessary to insult the intelligence of those protesting the change by claiming that it "should have been clear" you would catch the price discrepancy sooner or later?  Really?  Even for those that might have chanced upon that area first, or who heard about it from a friend and were not aware of the discrepancy?</P> <P>And then, practically comparing those affected to exploiters by making the spurious comment that "very few people report the beneficial bugs that exist in the game" only adds insult to injury.  I have never realized that it is good company policy to accuse a portion of my customers of cheating without proof to support that charge.  I wonder how long a business that consistently reacted in that manner would continue to serve any customers at all.  And, if the people renting the apartments in South Freeport were accused of exploiting a bug in the game, why were residents of Qeynos not accused of the same sort of exploitation when it came to redecorating their walls?</P> <P>Basically, the players affected (of which I am not one, I still have my 5s a week room in Longshadow Alley) should have been given the benefit of the doubt.  Would it be too much to ask for Moorgard to assume innocence (or heck, even ignorance) on behalf of the affected players?  Perhaps putting in an in-game email, or something in the MOTD, or even a popup when the player attempted to enter their room warning of the change would have been politic and would have gone a long way toward easing some of the tension that seems to be building at the moment.  Instead, those players get blindsided by insinuations and incriminations.  Bad play, as far as I'm concerned.</P> <P>Faelar-45 inquisitor of Retribution</P> <P>Oasis server</P>

[Whissper]

Now that i  have had a little time to calm down i will say i am still deeply offended by Moorgards comments, however i will also say that i understand what it is like to have worked in a profession that can warp a persons perspective and make them a bit jaded as to the intentions behind ppls actions (I have since retired from this career). Moorgard ...I think you need to take some time off.

[Grey Gho]

<DIV>I still feel they need to address the prices on these 3 bedroom houses. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, the same folks that defended the position that SoE took on these houses will be SCREAMING when they fix all those bags done via the collection quests. Like the Huge Collectors Pouch that is 30 slots but it has CLEARLY stated since day one that "This container can only be used for collectabe items."  Yet here we are 6 months later and it's still not fixed. Seems to me that this affects more people (tailorers) then this 3 bedroom issue. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I do not want the bags fixed myself. The point is there are so many other broke things in the game that affect a lot more people than the housing... It amazes me how they get around to correcting certain things. I swear the guys have a dart board up in their office with problems small and large on it and they just throw a dart to see what issue they are going to run with today. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What a deal. The Test server is more like a Alpha test center (and not very good at that) and the live servers are their beta testing platform. We as users are all along for the ride at our expense. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Seriously though. SoE. Take a look at the pricing, don't tell us the 3 bedrooms are made for guilds either... They have 300 item limits and I can almost fill that up with quest items alone. If you share it with three people then each person gets 100 spaces each??? lol Might as well stay in the small 5 silver a week rooms. Let us know if you plan on addressing the housing issue either way. 61 gold a week for any house in the game currently is really silly considering what you get for your money. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Best regards,</DIV> <DIV>   Grey Ghost</DIV> <DIV>   Oasis - The Ka Tet</DIV>

[Mezrin_Kort]

<DIV>*still sees no response from SOE*</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*knows better than to expect response to customer issues on assenine problems*</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*goes off into the sunset*</DIV>