Concerns of information collected for Troubleshooting by the new file LP_Diagnostics.exe

[Humudc]

<DIV>I ran this file after updating my Test Account and noticed this file was added.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>LP_Diagnostics.exe</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am very concerned about some of the information it is collecting for Troubleshooting purposes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>After you run the program it creates a zip file and asks you to e-mail it to a Sony address.</DIV> <DIV>The file it creates is called</DIV> <DIV>lp_diag.zip</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Inside that zip file it is recording my Windows XP Registration Information. </DIV> <DIV>Registered UserName</DIV> <DIV>Registered CompanyName</DIV> <DIV>Windows Registration ID #</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Is not collecting this information an invasion of my privacy?  What possible use would this information be for troubleshooting connectivity issues? </DIV> <DIV>I am requesting that before this type of tool is released to the public that the above information is not collected as I can see no reason for collecting it.</DIV> <DIV>If it can not or will not be removed from this tool, then a Privacy Statement is clearly in order explaining that this program is going to collect personal information about your computer when you send this .zip file to Sony.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am also a bit alarmed to the fact that one of the files also records information about all the files in your EverQuest 2 folder and sub folders.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Can someone from Sony please confirm what the reason was for including this LP_Diagnostics.exe tool and why it is collecting my personal info like this?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks in advance.</DIV>

[fasht]

<span><blockquote><hr>HumudceT wrote:<div>I ran this file after updating my Test Account and noticed this file was added.</div> <div> </div> <div>LP_Diagnostics.exe</div> <div> </div><div>Can someone from Sony please confirm what the reason was for including this LP_Diagnostics.exe tool and why it is collecting my personal info like this? </div><hr></blockquote>Fairly obvious why they want that data, to Disgnose why your EQ2 isn't working when you contact them for support At the very least having a list of the files in the EQ2 will show them that the reason your EQ2 isn't working is you deleted an entire swathe of files in some dir or other Windows information is probably so they can see that you *ARE* actually running a supported OS, and not an unpatched windows 95 or something (the name, registration details are stuff thats kinda just given to any program that asks if you query Windows API for information like that... No one probably thought twice and just wrote out the entire structure to the file) Hell, most of the time you leave more of a info trail just browseing to any random web site</span><div></div>

[Daeanor]

It's only an invasion of your privacy if they send it without your consent or knowledge. They are asking you to e-mail it yourself, and obviously, you know what is in there, so it's your choice. <div></div>

[redoule]

They don't need a windows registration number for anything. The only possibility is that they are looking for pirated versions of windows, which has nothing to do with EQ2.I own two copies of xp professional and one 2000 professional. They don't need to know the registration #'s.They might also be using a catch all data collection method. Taking a hammer and nail approach to troubleshooting rather than a pneumatic nailer.

[DragonRoll]

<span><blockquote><hr>redoulent wrote:They don't need a windows registration number for anything. The only possibility is that they are looking for pirated versions of windows, which has nothing to do with EQ2. <hr></blockquote>It does have something to do with EQ2 if you are running a pirated copy of Windows that can not apply service packs/updates.  Granted the chances of SOE actually having a DB of illegal reg codes from MS seems very, very remote.  </span><div></div>

[Wasc]

<span><blockquote><hr>DragonRoll wrote:<span> <blockquote><hr>redoulent wrote:They don't need a windows registration number for anything. The only possibility is that they are looking for pirated versions of windows, which has nothing to do with EQ2. <hr></blockquote>It does have something to do with EQ2 if you are running a pirated copy of Windows that can not apply service packs/updates.  Granted the chances of SOE actually having a DB of illegal reg codes from MS seems very, very remote.  </span><hr></blockquote>First off, SOE is not Microsoft.  Windows is not their product.  SOE is not responsible for ensuring that I have a legal or pirated version of Windows.  Ever heard of the term "innocent until proven guilty?"  Knowing this kind of information has nothing to do with EQ2. An analogy: If you try on a new shirt in a department store, is that department store allowed to keep a video recording of you in the changing room just in case you were carrying a gun?  They might have a stated policy of "no guns allowed" at the door, but that doesn't give them the right to demand a strip-search or record you doing it <b>without your knowledge</b>.  That would be an invasion of privacy. SOE has absolutely NO right to record the registration key that was used in a completely different product, just because you have EQ2 installed on your computer.  If it is permissible for SOE to read your license key, then why not another key?  What is the difference between recording this registration key or any other keys stored in your registry, or the entire registry for that matter?  Windows stores its local password hashes in the registry, should they download those too?  Maybe they need a copy of my PGP private key, so they can decrypt my email, to make sure I'm not a terrorist.  They NEED to know that I'm not a terrorist, or they might be unwittingly giving me the ability to communicate online with other terrorists. I can take your argument to another level and explain, with the EXACT same reasoning you used, that SOE needs to check and make sure that you have the latest, completely patched version of Internet Explorer on your computer as well.  Why?  Because the patcher uses IE as its engine to display patch notes.  If IE isn't as secure as it can be, then by running EQ2 on your computer you're opening yourself up to all kinds of hostile vulnerabilities!  They have an OBLIGATION to download every bit of information about IE that they can, including your cookies, saved passwords, history, plugins, and so on. Then, of course, you have to wonder... here's a company who would have: </span> <ul> <li>Access to all of your online history, cookies, and saved passwords.  Decrypt a few URLs and look at a few cookies, and someone can practically replay your last online banking session.</li> <li>Knowledge of your password in EQ2.</li> <li>Knowledge of your computer's username & password hash.</li> <li>Access to a distributed network of computers (subscribers) whose software automatically downloads new content on a regular basis (patcher) and who spend a LOT of time running a binary application doing who knows what in the background.</li> </ul> Exactly how far-fetched is it to take this idea and run with it?  You might be a smart fellow, but "people" (the teeming masses) are stupid, ignorant sheep whose idea of a "secure password" is "123456" or "password."  If EQ2 is online on everyone's computer all the time, that's a LOT of zombie computers just sitting around with spare CPU cycles (especially if they are in AFK "merchant" mode in-game) that could easily be building hash tables and decrypting passwords, working out exactly how to login as the Administrator on every single user's computer. Do you REALLY think it's necessary for SOE to have VALID local Admin rights to your computer, a patcher that can download whatever it needs, and all the information about where you do your online banking... so they can make sure you don't have a pirated copy of Windows?  Yes, this is an extreme idea (adjusts his tinfoil hat) but you get my point.<div></div>

[batter_then]

didnt notice this file... im scared now.. SOE pelase remove this file

[Tradeskill_Addict]

<DIV>If somone doesn't like this file just delete it before you click *PLAY*</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I tried it and EQ2 worked without any problems. Of course it was downloaded again the next time I logged on but for those who have mixed feelings about this file the 30 seconds it takes prior to playing to delete it each time should be acceptable</DIV>

[DragonRoll]

<span><blockquote><hr>Wascen wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>DragonRoll wrote:<span> <blockquote><hr>redoulent wrote:They don't need a windows registration number for anything. The only possibility is that they are looking for pirated versions of windows, which has nothing to do with EQ2. <hr></blockquote>It does have something to do with EQ2 if you are running a pirated copy of Windows that can not apply service packs/updates.  Granted the chances of SOE actually having a DB of illegal reg codes from MS seems very, very remote.  </span><hr></blockquote>First off, SOE is not Microsoft.  Windows is not their product.  SOE is not responsible for ensuring that I have a legal or pirated version of Windows.  Ever heard of the term "innocent until proven guilty?"  Knowing this kind of information has nothing to do with EQ2. </span> <div></div><hr></blockquote> Wow, simmer down buddy.  My point, which you missed entirly, was that SOE may be expecting you to have an updated version of Windows with current fixes/DX.  If you have a known to Windows Update pirated version of Windows you can't get those (at least not easily - SP not at all, others you can if you download by hand).  Let me point out again that I find it highly unlikey that SOE would have said list of codes -- but they aren't hard to gather via web searching either.  Basically if you find a Windows code on a warez site Windows Update will be blocking it. I would certainly agree that SOE doesn't have the *right* to look at your Windows key, but I was just trying to give a reason that they might want to know it.  Truth is it was probably just lazy programming and the coder threw that in there b/c he/she could.  Really doubt EQ2 is an elborate scheme to steal our Windows codes.  The far more usefull information they would want to gather would be a dxdiag and System Information dump - but of course you gotta do that for 'em.</span><div></div>

[Alther]

My goodness.  Some of you seem to be very defensive about this.  Sounds like some software pirates are about to be caught with their pants down.  I'd say it's time Microsoft's legal department paid you a little visit.  Nothing major, just a small audit to make sure you are legit.  If they catch any software pirates, hopefully they get fined 10 million dollars each.  There is nothing worse than a thief.  If you really don't think you should have to pay for your OS, then use Linux.  Otherwise, pay up. Legal Windows owners don't need to worry about a thing.  Those of you who are suddenly defensive...  Well, let's just see what's on your hard drives... <div></div>

[Exibar]

<P>I don't take it that way at all...  I don't want any information gathered from my machine without me knowing each and every little thing that is gathered.</P> <P>  Of course, anything that is Everquest related, I'd happily send along if I'm asking them for help.</P> <P> </P> <P>  Perhaps a listing of everything that the program gathers placed in a readme would suffice.   I do agree that they shouldn't grab the reg key for Windows...</P> <P> </P> <P> Mike b</P>

[WAPCE]

<blockquote><hr>Altheris wrote:My goodness. Some of you seem to be very defensive about this. Sounds like some software pirates are about to be caught with their pants down. I'd say it's time Microsoft's legal department paid you a little visit. Nothing major, just a small audit to make sure you are legit. If they catch any software pirates, hopefully they get fined 10 million dollars each. There is nothing worse than a thief. If you really don't think you should have to pay for your OS, then use Linux. Otherwise, pay up. Legal Windows owners don't need to worry about a thing. Those of you who are suddenly defensive... Well, let's just see what's on your hard drives... <div></div><hr></blockquote>Is it difficult to breathe with your head in the ground? There are more reasons to want privacy than to hide wrong-doing. SOE has no reason or right to pick what they want from someone's hard drive, and just because they may have stuck some clause hidden away in the EULA somewhere, does not make it legal.

[Corval]

<P>You are incorrect when you say they have your WIndows Registration ID# in any of those files. Go look again. They do record what version of Windows you have as well as what version of IE you currently have. The product ID# you see in that file is not your windows registration ID#.</P> <P>The items that I wouldn't wish them to get ahold of is what Domain I belong to as well as who my ISP provider is. Major privacy issue there. (but then I wouldn't send them the files in the ZIP anyway no matter what they said to me unless I had edited it first)</P> <P> </P> <P>DX Diag gives almost the same info and people post that here all the time.</P>

[Eneg]

<blockquote><hr>Corvalis wrote:<P>The items that I wouldn't wish them to get ahold of is what Domain I belong to as well as who my ISP provider is. Major privacy issue there. </p> <DIV></div><hr></blockquote> Not to add more Black Helicopters to the thread, but they can trace the route of packets between the launchpad client and their servers to get that information anyway, if they wanted to.

[Corval]

<DIV>I want the lizard I could ride back. What happened to the ridable lizards?</DIV><p>Message Edited by Corvalis on <span class=date_text>03-25-2005</span> <span class=time_text>06:49 PM</span>

[zorbdan]

The minute money starts disappearing from my bank account the first person I'm calling is SOE !!! Hahaha .. seriously though things like this make me worried , I am one of those masses and I don't understand the details of how these things work but just the mention of them having access to personal information on my pc not related to the game in any way is very wrong and a very serious issue , indeed .

[Dyeana]

<DIV>Agree it is the product ID's.  SOE already records the IP address you log on with with every logon.  They use the information to get multiple users of an account and some of the "Yantis" seller types.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as someone mentioning they can't read client computer name and code, along with other processor codes, guess again.  They could if they chose.  IBM stated this week, they had figured how to do it several years ago.  They decided reciently, the legal ramifications would allow them to use the information in their anti-spam campaign which targets the actual spammers computers irregardless of the IP address.  </DIV>

[Humudc]

<DIV>It seems that everyone has completely missed my point of this post.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1.) If you are going to collect this information for what ever reasons, including the Registered Windows Owners Name, and Product Registration ID.  Just let me know that you are doing it, no where in the message generated after the Zip file is processed on your hard drive does it ever tell you what information that it collected.  I found this information because A.) I was curious what the program did, and B.) I was smart enought to unzip the file and look at every file that it contained, to see what type of information they were collecting.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All that I'm asking to be changed is in the Final Message that says please e-mail this to <A href="mailto:[email protected]" target=_blank>[email protected]</A> or what ever the address was, is that they warn the person sending the information that the file "May Contain some Personal Information that will only be used for Troubleshooting purposes".  Is it that much to ask them to do?  Come on I don't really care if they have every Registration Code of every program on all my computers, just dang it.. Ask first.</DIV>

[aeio]

Since you have to e-mail it to them for them to see it, it is not an invasion of your privacy. <div></div>

[DarcSchnid]

<DIV>Heh :smileyvery-happy: you are all pretty funny.  If you think the SOE's porgram is gathering things... you should run Spybot search and destroy program that will have you freaking out... The number of spyware/maleware virus and the likes that you can get just by visiting a webpage will blow you away.  Did you know that 80% of the sites you visit have data trackers/cookie trackers <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think Sony is the least of any of your issues... Muhahaha!! cough ... gag.. choke...:robotmad: </DIV>

[Jeridor]

I'd like to see some official response on this.  Silence will only feed conspiracy theories about SOE using spyware, etc. <div></div>